Sick silver fantail (listless, fluttering fins)

[Edward Haworth]

Hi I'd be grateful for any help you could give me with an ailing fish.

He is a silver fantail about 3 inches long and has been with me for
about 2 months, fit and well untill the last few days. He has been
very listless, preferring to lay on or near the bottom and has started
to clamp (not as tightly as I have in very sick fish in the past) his
pectoral fins. Yesterday he took some food but today has totally
ignored it, he has started hiding behind a plastic plant in a way I
have never seen before and is also 'convulsing' in what looks to me
like a piscine version of an epileptic event.

Basic water parameters are all fine (ammonia and oxygen not tested but
oxygen is seemingly fine), his tank mate an oranda is well. I try and
mix up their diet with a combination of chopped earthworms, daphnia,
skinned peas and regular flakes.

I'm fond of him and on the off chance there is anything I can do to
increase his chances I'd be very happy to know it!
Many thanks,
Ed

[Geezer From The Freezer]

Even if water parameters say they are fine, I'd do a 30% water change anyway.
Add a 0.3% solution of aquarium salt.

[[email protected]]

EMERGENCY
1. check the water parameters: pH, ammonia, nitrite, nitrates
2. do the fish physical
3. change some or all of the water, add 1 teaspoon salt per 5 gallons water
4. from the water parameters and physical decide on a course of action
5. if there is nothing specific, do the tub to tub method
start changing the water immediately. regular salt works in a pinch. only 1
teaspoon per 5 gallons tho.
forget all the live food. they can contain pathogens. feed high quality fish food,
high protein, high fat, low carb and feed very little. Ingrid

Edward Haworth > wrote:

>Hi I'd be grateful for any help you could give me with an ailing fish.
>
>He is a silver fantail about 3 inches long and has been with me for
>about 2 months, fit and well untill the last few days. He has been
>very listless, preferring to lay on or near the bottom and has started
>to clamp (not as tightly as I have in very sick fish in the past) his
>pectoral fins. Yesterday he took some food but today has totally
>ignored it, he has started hiding behind a plastic plant in a way I
>have never seen before and is also 'convulsing' in what looks to me
>like a piscine version of an epileptic event.
>
>Basic water parameters are all fine (ammonia and oxygen not tested but
>oxygen is seemingly fine), his tank mate an oranda is well. I try and
>mix up their diet with a combination of chopped earthworms, daphnia,
>skinned peas and regular flakes.
>
>I'm fond of him and on the off chance there is anything I can do to
>increase his chances I'd be very happy to know it!
>Many thanks,
>Ed



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
List Manager: Puregold Goldfish List
http://puregold.aquaria.net/
www.drsolo.com
Solve the problem, dont waste energy finding who's to blame
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Unfortunately, I receive no money, gifts, discounts or other
compensation for all the damn work I do, nor for any of the
endorsements or recommendations I make.

[Edward Haworth]

On Tue, 27 Apr 2004 09:49:23 +0100, Geezer From The Freezer
> wrote:

>Even if water parameters say they are fine, I'd do a 30% water change anyway.
>Add a 0.3% solution of aquarium salt.


I'm not sure what passes for an aquarium shop near me will have any
and I can't wait for mail order. Is it okay to use non-iodised table
salt? My only concern is the anti-caking agent which is magnesium
carbonate or something similar.

Cheers!

[Geezer From The Freezer]

Edward Haworth wrote:
>
> On Tue, 27 Apr 2004 09:49:23 +0100, Geezer From The Freezer
> > wrote:
>
> >Even if water parameters say they are fine, I'd do a 30% water change anyway.
> >Add a 0.3% solution of aquarium salt.
>
> I'm not sure what passes for an aquarium shop near me will have any
> and I can't wait for mail order. Is it okay to use non-iodised table
> salt? My only concern is the anti-caking agent which is magnesium
> carbonate or something similar.
>
> Cheers!

Edwards,

It needs to be pure salt. If it has anti-caking agents or iodine then don't use
it.

Hope that helps!

[Edward Haworth]

I'm going to try your physical but i'm really dreading have to do it
as I suspect it's going to stress the fish out even more.
Thanks for your help, I won't feed live foods again either, as much as
they seemed to like them. Cooked peas are presumably still okay?


On Tue, 27 Apr 2004 12:39:54 GMT, wrote:

>EMERGENCY
>1. check the water parameters: pH, ammonia, nitrite, nitrates
>2. do the fish physical
>3. change some or all of the water, add 1 teaspoon salt per 5 gallons water
>4. from the water parameters and physical decide on a course of action
>5. if there is nothing specific, do the tub to tub method
>start changing the water immediately. regular salt works in a pinch. only 1
>teaspoon per 5 gallons tho.
>forget all the live food. they can contain pathogens. feed high quality fish food,
>high protein, high fat, low carb and feed very little. Ingrid
>
>Edward Haworth > wrote:
>
>>Hi I'd be grateful for any help you could give me with an ailing fish.
>>
>>He is a silver fantail about 3 inches long and has been with me for
>>about 2 months, fit and well untill the last few days. He has been
>>very listless, preferring to lay on or near the bottom and has started
>>to clamp (not as tightly as I have in very sick fish in the past) his
>>pectoral fins. Yesterday he took some food but today has totally
>>ignored it, he has started hiding behind a plastic plant in a way I
>>have never seen before and is also 'convulsing' in what looks to me
>>like a piscine version of an epileptic event.
>>
>>Basic water parameters are all fine (ammonia and oxygen not tested but
>>oxygen is seemingly fine), his tank mate an oranda is well. I try and
>>mix up their diet with a combination of chopped earthworms, daphnia,
>>skinned peas and regular flakes.
>>
>>I'm fond of him and on the off chance there is anything I can do to
>>increase his chances I'd be very happy to know it!
>>Many thanks,
>>Ed
>
>
>
>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>List Manager: Puregold Goldfish List
>http://puregold.aquaria.net/
>www.drsolo.com
>Solve the problem, dont waste energy finding who's to blame
>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>Unfortunately, I receive no money, gifts, discounts or other
>compensation for all the damn work I do, nor for any of the
>endorsements or recommendations I make.

[[email protected]]

cooked peas gives them diarrhea. it has no little to no nutritive value. give em
human quality chopped cooked shrimp or even fake crab meat instead. small amounts. of
course. Ingrid

Edward Haworth > wrote:

>I'm going to try your physical but i'm really dreading have to do it
>as I suspect it's going to stress the fish out even more.
>Thanks for your help, I won't feed live foods again either, as much as
>they seemed to like them. Cooked peas are presumably still okay?


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
List Manager: Puregold Goldfish List
http://puregold.aquaria.net/
www.drsolo.com
Solve the problem, dont waste energy finding who's to blame
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Unfortunately, I receive no money, gifts, discounts or other
compensation for all the damn work I do, nor for any of the
endorsements or recommendations I make.

[Edward Haworth]

Niirtes and amonia are nil, ph is about 7.5 (it alwsy is), nitrates
are about 25 mg/l (again they alwyas hover around there).

Not much to report from the physical, gills look normal, abdomen feels
normal no redness around mouth or anus. His condition has detoriated
overnight to the point where I have almost no hope left. I'm going to
try a salt dip and then your tub to tub method (using whatever I can
get to hand, my only other tank is home to tadpoles at the moment) if
he lives long enough. Would you advise any empircal treatment for
either him or the main tank (I'll do a 30% water change in that later
today).

Many thanks again,
Ed

On Tue, 27 Apr 2004 12:39:54 GMT, wrote:

>EMERGENCY
>1. check the water parameters: pH, ammonia, nitrite, nitrates
>2. do the fish physical
>3. change some or all of the water, add 1 teaspoon salt per 5 gallons water
>4. from the water parameters and physical decide on a course of action
>5. if there is nothing specific, do the tub to tub method
>start changing the water immediately. regular salt works in a pinch. only 1
>teaspoon per 5 gallons tho.
>forget all the live food. they can contain pathogens. feed high quality fish food,
>high protein, high fat, low carb and feed very little. Ingrid
>
>Edward Haworth > wrote:
>
>>Hi I'd be grateful for any help you could give me with an ailing fish.
>>
>>He is a silver fantail about 3 inches long and has been with me for
>>about 2 months, fit and well untill the last few days. He has been
>>very listless, preferring to lay on or near the bottom and has started
>>to clamp (not as tightly as I have in very sick fish in the past) his
>>pectoral fins. Yesterday he took some food but today has totally
>>ignored it, he has started hiding behind a plastic plant in a way I
>>have never seen before and is also 'convulsing' in what looks to me
>>like a piscine version of an epileptic event.
>>
>>Basic water parameters are all fine (ammonia and oxygen not tested but
>>oxygen is seemingly fine), his tank mate an oranda is well. I try and
>>mix up their diet with a combination of chopped earthworms, daphnia,
>>skinned peas and regular flakes.
>>
>>I'm fond of him and on the off chance there is anything I can do to
>>increase his chances I'd be very happy to know it!
>>Many thanks,
>>Ed
>
>
>
>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>List Manager: Puregold Goldfish List
>http://puregold.aquaria.net/
>www.drsolo.com
>Solve the problem, dont waste energy finding who's to blame
>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>Unfortunately, I receive no money, gifts, discounts or other
>compensation for all the damn work I do, nor for any of the
>endorsements or recommendations I make.

[Edward Haworth]

Sad to report he died this evening :(.

On Tue, 27 Apr 2004 00:43:35 +0100, Edward Haworth
> wrote:

>Hi I'd be grateful for any help you could give me with an ailing fish.
>
>He is a silver fantail about 3 inches long and has been with me for
>about 2 months, fit and well untill the last few days. He has been
>very listless, preferring to lay on or near the bottom and has started
>to clamp (not as tightly as I have in very sick fish in the past) his
>pectoral fins. Yesterday he took some food but today has totally
>ignored it, he has started hiding behind a plastic plant in a way I
>have never seen before and is also 'convulsing' in what looks to me
>like a piscine version of an epileptic event.
>
>Basic water parameters are all fine (ammonia and oxygen not tested but
>oxygen is seemingly fine), his tank mate an oranda is well. I try and
>mix up their diet with a combination of chopped earthworms, daphnia,
>skinned peas and regular flakes.
>
>I'm fond of him and on the off chance there is anything I can do to
>increase his chances I'd be very happy to know it!
>Many thanks,
>Ed

[Geezer From The Freezer]

Edward Haworth wrote:
>
> Sad to report he died this evening :(.
>

:( you tried your best!