Strange behavior...

[SueAndHerZoo]

Hi. I'm in Connecticut and have been longingly looking at my pond through
the windows for months now. On the warmer days I'd see the fish swimming
around, and then there was that spell that the ice was so thick I thought
spring would never come! I don't know why, but the water seems more
green this year than it has in any previous years. But that's not my
problem: Yesterday when I was home for lunch I was, as usual, looking out
the window at the pond, and noticed my big platinum koi acting kind of
frisky. He was swimming fast around the perimeter, and even did a little
jump. I thought "spawning?" but no, it's too early. I looked away for a
few minutes and when I came back, I didn't see him, but I did see a lot of
splashing going on from a point where I keep some potted plants on a ledge.
I figured he was still playing and feeling frisky and was trying to knock
over a plant. This morning before work I did not see him, and at lunch
(now) I couldn't see him, either. I took a walk out there (not a wise idea
in office attire - there's so much mud from this horrible winter!) and
found that he was trapped behind the potted plant! Not only that, but
there were 4 five others trapped, too! (one dead)

What in heck possessed them to all go back there and get stuck all of a
sudden? That plant has been there in that same place for years, why this
year, and why all of them? I am totally stumped as to what caused them to
all of a sudden find that area so appealing that they got themselves stuck -
any thoughts?????
Thanks in advance.
Sue

[Lee B.]

Predators? Were they maybe all looking for some place safe to hide? Spring
has sprung and maybe the predator types are hungry after a long winter.

Regarding the "frisky" behavior, I would suspect parasites before I'd think
of spawning: I thing your water is probably still too cold. But the
creepy-crawlies are beginning to wake up, too.


Lee

"SueAndHerZoo" > wrote in message
news:V034c.59379$Ri6.2735@lakeread04...
> Hi. I'm in Connecticut and have been longingly looking at my pond through
> the windows for months now. On the warmer days I'd see the fish swimming
> around, and then there was that spell that the ice was so thick I thought
> spring would never come! I don't know why, but the water seems more
> green this year than it has in any previous years. But that's not my
> problem: Yesterday when I was home for lunch I was, as usual, looking
out
> the window at the pond, and noticed my big platinum koi acting kind of
> frisky. He was swimming fast around the perimeter, and even did a little
> jump. I thought "spawning?" but no, it's too early. I looked away for
a
> few minutes and when I came back, I didn't see him, but I did see a lot of
> splashing going on from a point where I keep some potted plants on a
ledge.
> I figured he was still playing and feeling frisky and was trying to knock
> over a plant. This morning before work I did not see him, and at lunch
> (now) I couldn't see him, either. I took a walk out there (not a wise
idea
> in office attire - there's so much mud from this horrible winter!) and
> found that he was trapped behind the potted plant! Not only that, but
> there were 4 five others trapped, too! (one dead)
>
> What in heck possessed them to all go back there and get stuck all of a
> sudden? That plant has been there in that same place for years, why this
> year, and why all of them? I am totally stumped as to what caused them
to
> all of a sudden find that area so appealing that they got themselves stuck
-
> any thoughts?????
> Thanks in advance.
> Sue
>
>

[Lee B.]

Predators? Were they maybe all looking for some place safe to hide? Spring
has sprung and maybe the predator types are hungry after a long winter.

Regarding the "frisky" behavior, I would suspect parasites before I'd think
of spawning: I thing your water is probably still too cold. But the
creepy-crawlies are beginning to wake up, too.


Lee

"SueAndHerZoo" > wrote in message
news:V034c.59379$Ri6.2735@lakeread04...
> Hi. I'm in Connecticut and have been longingly looking at my pond through
> the windows for months now. On the warmer days I'd see the fish swimming
> around, and then there was that spell that the ice was so thick I thought
> spring would never come! I don't know why, but the water seems more
> green this year than it has in any previous years. But that's not my
> problem: Yesterday when I was home for lunch I was, as usual, looking
out
> the window at the pond, and noticed my big platinum koi acting kind of
> frisky. He was swimming fast around the perimeter, and even did a little
> jump. I thought "spawning?" but no, it's too early. I looked away for
a
> few minutes and when I came back, I didn't see him, but I did see a lot of
> splashing going on from a point where I keep some potted plants on a
ledge.
> I figured he was still playing and feeling frisky and was trying to knock
> over a plant. This morning before work I did not see him, and at lunch
> (now) I couldn't see him, either. I took a walk out there (not a wise
idea
> in office attire - there's so much mud from this horrible winter!) and
> found that he was trapped behind the potted plant! Not only that, but
> there were 4 five others trapped, too! (one dead)
>
> What in heck possessed them to all go back there and get stuck all of a
> sudden? That plant has been there in that same place for years, why this
> year, and why all of them? I am totally stumped as to what caused them
to
> all of a sudden find that area so appealing that they got themselves stuck
-
> any thoughts?????
> Thanks in advance.
> Sue
>
>

[SueAndHerZoo]

Thank you, Lee, for taking the time to answer my post. I was beginning to
think my message was only showing up on my computer. :)

I don't know WHAT to think. The strangeness continues. I have since
removed that potted plant because they were all continually going back there
and getting stuck. Now they all seem to be hanging out near the edges of
the pond, on the surface. I noticed that my platinum koi has blood in his
tail, but don't know if that's a disease or part of being stuck behind the
plant. I'm hoping to spend all of my weekend out there trying to get the
pond cleaned up, opened, and running, and will hopefully get some clues as
to what's going on out there. I have been working 12 hours a day at the
office and it's dark and cold by the time I get home, so I'm cancelling all
weekend plans and devoting it to the fish. (Hoping the weather cooperates!)

Thanks again.
Sue
"Lee B." > wrote in message
...
> Predators? Were they maybe all looking for some place safe to hide? Spring
> has sprung and maybe the predator types are hungry after a long winter.
>
> Regarding the "frisky" behavior, I would suspect parasites before I'd
think
> of spawning: I thing your water is probably still too cold. But the
> creepy-crawlies are beginning to wake up, too.
>
>
> Lee
>
> "SueAndHerZoo" > wrote in message
> news:V034c.59379$Ri6.2735@lakeread04...
> > Hi. I'm in Connecticut and have been longingly looking at my pond
through
> > the windows for months now. On the warmer days I'd see the fish
swimming
> > around, and then there was that spell that the ice was so thick I
thought
> > spring would never come! I don't know why, but the water seems more
> > green this year than it has in any previous years. But that's not my
> > problem: Yesterday when I was home for lunch I was, as usual, looking
> out
> > the window at the pond, and noticed my big platinum koi acting kind of
> > frisky. He was swimming fast around the perimeter, and even did a
little
> > jump. I thought "spawning?" but no, it's too early. I looked away
for
> a
> > few minutes and when I came back, I didn't see him, but I did see a lot
of
> > splashing going on from a point where I keep some potted plants on a
> ledge.
> > I figured he was still playing and feeling frisky and was trying to
knock
> > over a plant. This morning before work I did not see him, and at lunch
> > (now) I couldn't see him, either. I took a walk out there (not a wise
> idea
> > in office attire - there's so much mud from this horrible winter!) and
> > found that he was trapped behind the potted plant! Not only that, but
> > there were 4 five others trapped, too! (one dead)
> >
> > What in heck possessed them to all go back there and get stuck all of a
> > sudden? That plant has been there in that same place for years, why
this
> > year, and why all of them? I am totally stumped as to what caused
them
> to
> > all of a sudden find that area so appealing that they got themselves
stuck
> -
> > any thoughts?????
> > Thanks in advance.
> > Sue
> >
> >
>
>

[SueAndHerZoo]

Thank you, Lee, for taking the time to answer my post. I was beginning to
think my message was only showing up on my computer. :)

I don't know WHAT to think. The strangeness continues. I have since
removed that potted plant because they were all continually going back there
and getting stuck. Now they all seem to be hanging out near the edges of
the pond, on the surface. I noticed that my platinum koi has blood in his
tail, but don't know if that's a disease or part of being stuck behind the
plant. I'm hoping to spend all of my weekend out there trying to get the
pond cleaned up, opened, and running, and will hopefully get some clues as
to what's going on out there. I have been working 12 hours a day at the
office and it's dark and cold by the time I get home, so I'm cancelling all
weekend plans and devoting it to the fish. (Hoping the weather cooperates!)

Thanks again.
Sue
"Lee B." > wrote in message
...
> Predators? Were they maybe all looking for some place safe to hide? Spring
> has sprung and maybe the predator types are hungry after a long winter.
>
> Regarding the "frisky" behavior, I would suspect parasites before I'd
think
> of spawning: I thing your water is probably still too cold. But the
> creepy-crawlies are beginning to wake up, too.
>
>
> Lee
>
> "SueAndHerZoo" > wrote in message
> news:V034c.59379$Ri6.2735@lakeread04...
> > Hi. I'm in Connecticut and have been longingly looking at my pond
through
> > the windows for months now. On the warmer days I'd see the fish
swimming
> > around, and then there was that spell that the ice was so thick I
thought
> > spring would never come! I don't know why, but the water seems more
> > green this year than it has in any previous years. But that's not my
> > problem: Yesterday when I was home for lunch I was, as usual, looking
> out
> > the window at the pond, and noticed my big platinum koi acting kind of
> > frisky. He was swimming fast around the perimeter, and even did a
little
> > jump. I thought "spawning?" but no, it's too early. I looked away
for
> a
> > few minutes and when I came back, I didn't see him, but I did see a lot
of
> > splashing going on from a point where I keep some potted plants on a
> ledge.
> > I figured he was still playing and feeling frisky and was trying to
knock
> > over a plant. This morning before work I did not see him, and at lunch
> > (now) I couldn't see him, either. I took a walk out there (not a wise
> idea
> > in office attire - there's so much mud from this horrible winter!) and
> > found that he was trapped behind the potted plant! Not only that, but
> > there were 4 five others trapped, too! (one dead)
> >
> > What in heck possessed them to all go back there and get stuck all of a
> > sudden? That plant has been there in that same place for years, why
this
> > year, and why all of them? I am totally stumped as to what caused
them
> to
> > all of a sudden find that area so appealing that they got themselves
stuck
> -
> > any thoughts?????
> > Thanks in advance.
> > Sue
> >
> >
>
>

[Just Me \Koi\]

Could they be trying to scratch parasites off their body?



--
_______________________________________
"The difference between 'involvement' and 'commitment' is
like an eggs-and-ham breakfast:
The chicken was 'involved' - the pig was 'committed'."

http://community.webshots.com/user/godwino

"SueAndHerZoo" > wrote in message
news:V034c.59379$Ri6.2735@lakeread04...
> Hi. I'm in Connecticut and have been longingly looking at my pond through
> the windows for months now. On the warmer days I'd see the fish swimming
> around, and then there was that spell that the ice was so thick I thought
> spring would never come! I don't know why, but the water seems more
> green this year than it has in any previous years. But that's not my
> problem: Yesterday when I was home for lunch I was, as usual, looking
out
> the window at the pond, and noticed my big platinum koi acting kind of
> frisky. He was swimming fast around the perimeter, and even did a little
> jump. I thought "spawning?" but no, it's too early. I looked away for
a
> few minutes and when I came back, I didn't see him, but I did see a lot of
> splashing going on from a point where I keep some potted plants on a
ledge.
> I figured he was still playing and feeling frisky and was trying to knock
> over a plant. This morning before work I did not see him, and at lunch
> (now) I couldn't see him, either. I took a walk out there (not a wise
idea
> in office attire - there's so much mud from this horrible winter!) and
> found that he was trapped behind the potted plant! Not only that, but
> there were 4 five others trapped, too! (one dead)
>
> What in heck possessed them to all go back there and get stuck all of a
> sudden? That plant has been there in that same place for years, why this
> year, and why all of them? I am totally stumped as to what caused them
to
> all of a sudden find that area so appealing that they got themselves
stuck -
> any thoughts?????
> Thanks in advance.
> Sue
>
>

[Just Me \Koi\]

Could they be trying to scratch parasites off their body?



--
_______________________________________
"The difference between 'involvement' and 'commitment' is
like an eggs-and-ham breakfast:
The chicken was 'involved' - the pig was 'committed'."

http://community.webshots.com/user/godwino

"SueAndHerZoo" > wrote in message
news:V034c.59379$Ri6.2735@lakeread04...
> Hi. I'm in Connecticut and have been longingly looking at my pond through
> the windows for months now. On the warmer days I'd see the fish swimming
> around, and then there was that spell that the ice was so thick I thought
> spring would never come! I don't know why, but the water seems more
> green this year than it has in any previous years. But that's not my
> problem: Yesterday when I was home for lunch I was, as usual, looking
out
> the window at the pond, and noticed my big platinum koi acting kind of
> frisky. He was swimming fast around the perimeter, and even did a little
> jump. I thought "spawning?" but no, it's too early. I looked away for
a
> few minutes and when I came back, I didn't see him, but I did see a lot of
> splashing going on from a point where I keep some potted plants on a
ledge.
> I figured he was still playing and feeling frisky and was trying to knock
> over a plant. This morning before work I did not see him, and at lunch
> (now) I couldn't see him, either. I took a walk out there (not a wise
idea
> in office attire - there's so much mud from this horrible winter!) and
> found that he was trapped behind the potted plant! Not only that, but
> there were 4 five others trapped, too! (one dead)
>
> What in heck possessed them to all go back there and get stuck all of a
> sudden? That plant has been there in that same place for years, why this
> year, and why all of them? I am totally stumped as to what caused them
to
> all of a sudden find that area so appealing that they got themselves
stuck -
> any thoughts?????
> Thanks in advance.
> Sue
>
>

[Zookeeper]

Hi Sue. Have you checked your water quality? Sometimes the water
parameters (pH, KH, ammonia, nitrite, etc. levels) change so quickly in
the spring, that the water becomes slightly toxic and the fish react by
zipping around and jumping. You might want to do a 20-30% water change
just in case.

P.S. What other critters do you have in your "Zoo"? I'm "zookeeper"
because of our three dogs, one cat, one rabbit, and 13 koi, two teenage
boys and one teenage (51 yo) husband, but in the past our zoo has
included another cat, goldfish and a gecko ;-)
--
Zk, aka Kathy
3500gal pond, 13 pond piggies
Oregon, USDA Zone 7

SueAndHerZoo wrote:
> ... I don't know why, but the water seems more
> green this year than it has in any previous years ... I
> ... noticed my big platinum koi acting kind of frisky.
> He was swimming fast around the perimeter, and even did
> a little jump ... I took a walk out there ... and found
> that he was trapped behind the potted plant! Not only that,
> but there were 4 five others trapped, too! (one dead)
>
> What in heck possessed them to all go back there and get
> stuck all of a sudden? ... why this
> year, and why all of them? ...

[Zookeeper]

Hi Sue. Have you checked your water quality? Sometimes the water
parameters (pH, KH, ammonia, nitrite, etc. levels) change so quickly in
the spring, that the water becomes slightly toxic and the fish react by
zipping around and jumping. You might want to do a 20-30% water change
just in case.

P.S. What other critters do you have in your "Zoo"? I'm "zookeeper"
because of our three dogs, one cat, one rabbit, and 13 koi, two teenage
boys and one teenage (51 yo) husband, but in the past our zoo has
included another cat, goldfish and a gecko ;-)
--
Zk, aka Kathy
3500gal pond, 13 pond piggies
Oregon, USDA Zone 7

SueAndHerZoo wrote:
> ... I don't know why, but the water seems more
> green this year than it has in any previous years ... I
> ... noticed my big platinum koi acting kind of frisky.
> He was swimming fast around the perimeter, and even did
> a little jump ... I took a walk out there ... and found
> that he was trapped behind the potted plant! Not only that,
> but there were 4 five others trapped, too! (one dead)
>
> What in heck possessed them to all go back there and get
> stuck all of a sudden? ... why this
> year, and why all of them? ...

[SueAndHerZoo]

That's a real good thought . . . I was wondering about that, too. I have
never had a parasite problem in my 4-year old pond, and I haven't introduced
anything new, and it's been frozen for the past few months, so where would
parasites come from all of a sudden? Still not ruling that out as a
possibility, but not sure why it would happen. Thanks for the suggestion -
their behavior does seem like they're trying to get something off of them.
Sue

"Just Me "Koi"" > wrote in message
...
> Could they be trying to scratch parasites off their body?
>
>
>
> --
> _______________________________________
> "The difference between 'involvement' and 'commitment' is
> like an eggs-and-ham breakfast:
> The chicken was 'involved' - the pig was 'committed'."
>
> http://community.webshots.com/user/godwino
>
> "SueAndHerZoo" > wrote in message
> news:V034c.59379$Ri6.2735@lakeread04...
> > Hi. I'm in Connecticut and have been longingly looking at my pond
through
> > the windows for months now. On the warmer days I'd see the fish
swimming
> > around, and then there was that spell that the ice was so thick I
thought
> > spring would never come! I don't know why, but the water seems more
> > green this year than it has in any previous years. But that's not my
> > problem: Yesterday when I was home for lunch I was, as usual, looking
> out
> > the window at the pond, and noticed my big platinum koi acting kind of
> > frisky. He was swimming fast around the perimeter, and even did a
little
> > jump. I thought "spawning?" but no, it's too early. I looked away
for
> a
> > few minutes and when I came back, I didn't see him, but I did see a lot
of
> > splashing going on from a point where I keep some potted plants on a
> ledge.
> > I figured he was still playing and feeling frisky and was trying to
knock
> > over a plant. This morning before work I did not see him, and at lunch
> > (now) I couldn't see him, either. I took a walk out there (not a wise
> idea
> > in office attire - there's so much mud from this horrible winter!) and
> > found that he was trapped behind the potted plant! Not only that, but
> > there were 4 five others trapped, too! (one dead)
> >
> > What in heck possessed them to all go back there and get stuck all of a
> > sudden? That plant has been there in that same place for years, why
this
> > year, and why all of them? I am totally stumped as to what caused
them
> to
> > all of a sudden find that area so appealing that they got themselves
> stuck -
> > any thoughts?????
> > Thanks in advance.
> > Sue
> >
> >
>
>

[SueAndHerZoo]

That's a real good thought . . . I was wondering about that, too. I have
never had a parasite problem in my 4-year old pond, and I haven't introduced
anything new, and it's been frozen for the past few months, so where would
parasites come from all of a sudden? Still not ruling that out as a
possibility, but not sure why it would happen. Thanks for the suggestion -
their behavior does seem like they're trying to get something off of them.
Sue

"Just Me "Koi"" > wrote in message
...
> Could they be trying to scratch parasites off their body?
>
>
>
> --
> _______________________________________
> "The difference between 'involvement' and 'commitment' is
> like an eggs-and-ham breakfast:
> The chicken was 'involved' - the pig was 'committed'."
>
> http://community.webshots.com/user/godwino
>
> "SueAndHerZoo" > wrote in message
> news:V034c.59379$Ri6.2735@lakeread04...
> > Hi. I'm in Connecticut and have been longingly looking at my pond
through
> > the windows for months now. On the warmer days I'd see the fish
swimming
> > around, and then there was that spell that the ice was so thick I
thought
> > spring would never come! I don't know why, but the water seems more
> > green this year than it has in any previous years. But that's not my
> > problem: Yesterday when I was home for lunch I was, as usual, looking
> out
> > the window at the pond, and noticed my big platinum koi acting kind of
> > frisky. He was swimming fast around the perimeter, and even did a
little
> > jump. I thought "spawning?" but no, it's too early. I looked away
for
> a
> > few minutes and when I came back, I didn't see him, but I did see a lot
of
> > splashing going on from a point where I keep some potted plants on a
> ledge.
> > I figured he was still playing and feeling frisky and was trying to
knock
> > over a plant. This morning before work I did not see him, and at lunch
> > (now) I couldn't see him, either. I took a walk out there (not a wise
> idea
> > in office attire - there's so much mud from this horrible winter!) and
> > found that he was trapped behind the potted plant! Not only that, but
> > there were 4 five others trapped, too! (one dead)
> >
> > What in heck possessed them to all go back there and get stuck all of a
> > sudden? That plant has been there in that same place for years, why
this
> > year, and why all of them? I am totally stumped as to what caused
them
> to
> > all of a sudden find that area so appealing that they got themselves
> stuck -
> > any thoughts?????
> > Thanks in advance.
> > Sue
> >
> >
>
>

[SueAndHerZoo]

HI, Kathy:
I am absolutely going to bundle up and go test the water shortly. It's only
30 degrees here today! I am, as I type this, doing a partial water
change. Then I hope the temperature will climb at least a few degrees so I
can put my filter back together, get the UV filter out there, and get the
pond up and running. I normally wouldn't consider it while it's still so
cold, but if I'm going to save my critters I have to do something. Yes, it
makes sense that the water parameters could have changed quickly - heck, the
weather here keeps changing quickly! I went to lunch the other day without
a coat on, and today I'm talking about bundling up!

My "zoo" has become SO much smaller since I went back to work full-time.
:( It now only consists of a mastiff, a pug, a Blue and Gold Macaw, an
African Grey, 2 horses, 5 turtles, 3 frogs, and 50 or so fish. Not too
long ago I also had a Shih-tzu and a cat, but they both died of old age
within a month of each other. And I've also had three monkeys in my
life, which is something I would love to do again, but can't possibly do
while working. They require a LOT of time and attention. Being a
zookeeper yourself, you probably subscribe to my philosophy: "The more I
know people, the more I love my pets". (People on this board are excluded,
of course) :)
Thanks for writing about my water parameters, I'll bet that's what's going
on, BUT..... why would that cause them to all huddle behind the potted
plant?????
Sue
"Zookeeper" > wrote in message
...
> Hi Sue. Have you checked your water quality? Sometimes the water
> parameters (pH, KH, ammonia, nitrite, etc. levels) change so quickly in
> the spring, that the water becomes slightly toxic and the fish react by
> zipping around and jumping. You might want to do a 20-30% water change
> just in case.
>
> P.S. What other critters do you have in your "Zoo"? I'm "zookeeper"
> because of our three dogs, one cat, one rabbit, and 13 koi, two teenage
> boys and one teenage (51 yo) husband, but in the past our zoo has
> included another cat, goldfish and a gecko ;-)
> --
> Zk, aka Kathy
> 3500gal pond, 13 pond piggies
> Oregon, USDA Zone 7
>
> SueAndHerZoo wrote:
> > ... I don't know why, but the water seems more
> > green this year than it has in any previous years ... I
> > ... noticed my big platinum koi acting kind of frisky.
> > He was swimming fast around the perimeter, and even did
> > a little jump ... I took a walk out there ... and found
> > that he was trapped behind the potted plant! Not only that,
> > but there were 4 five others trapped, too! (one dead)
> >
> > What in heck possessed them to all go back there and get
> > stuck all of a sudden? ... why this
> > year, and why all of them? ...
>

[SueAndHerZoo]

HI, Kathy:
I am absolutely going to bundle up and go test the water shortly. It's only
30 degrees here today! I am, as I type this, doing a partial water
change. Then I hope the temperature will climb at least a few degrees so I
can put my filter back together, get the UV filter out there, and get the
pond up and running. I normally wouldn't consider it while it's still so
cold, but if I'm going to save my critters I have to do something. Yes, it
makes sense that the water parameters could have changed quickly - heck, the
weather here keeps changing quickly! I went to lunch the other day without
a coat on, and today I'm talking about bundling up!

My "zoo" has become SO much smaller since I went back to work full-time.
:( It now only consists of a mastiff, a pug, a Blue and Gold Macaw, an
African Grey, 2 horses, 5 turtles, 3 frogs, and 50 or so fish. Not too
long ago I also had a Shih-tzu and a cat, but they both died of old age
within a month of each other. And I've also had three monkeys in my
life, which is something I would love to do again, but can't possibly do
while working. They require a LOT of time and attention. Being a
zookeeper yourself, you probably subscribe to my philosophy: "The more I
know people, the more I love my pets". (People on this board are excluded,
of course) :)
Thanks for writing about my water parameters, I'll bet that's what's going
on, BUT..... why would that cause them to all huddle behind the potted
plant?????
Sue
"Zookeeper" > wrote in message
...
> Hi Sue. Have you checked your water quality? Sometimes the water
> parameters (pH, KH, ammonia, nitrite, etc. levels) change so quickly in
> the spring, that the water becomes slightly toxic and the fish react by
> zipping around and jumping. You might want to do a 20-30% water change
> just in case.
>
> P.S. What other critters do you have in your "Zoo"? I'm "zookeeper"
> because of our three dogs, one cat, one rabbit, and 13 koi, two teenage
> boys and one teenage (51 yo) husband, but in the past our zoo has
> included another cat, goldfish and a gecko ;-)
> --
> Zk, aka Kathy
> 3500gal pond, 13 pond piggies
> Oregon, USDA Zone 7
>
> SueAndHerZoo wrote:
> > ... I don't know why, but the water seems more
> > green this year than it has in any previous years ... I
> > ... noticed my big platinum koi acting kind of frisky.
> > He was swimming fast around the perimeter, and even did
> > a little jump ... I took a walk out there ... and found
> > that he was trapped behind the potted plant! Not only that,
> > but there were 4 five others trapped, too! (one dead)
> >
> > What in heck possessed them to all go back there and get
> > stuck all of a sudden? ... why this
> > year, and why all of them? ...
>

[[email protected]]

yes!! also, get aeration in the pond and what are your salt levels? Ingrid

Zookeeper > wrote:
>Hi Sue. Have you checked your water quality? Sometimes the water
>parameters (pH, KH, ammonia, nitrite, etc. levels) change so quickly in
>the spring, that the water becomes slightly toxic and the fish react by
>zipping around and jumping. You might want to do a 20-30% water change
>just in case.


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
List Manager: Puregold Goldfish List
http://puregold.aquaria.net/
www.drsolo.com
Solve the problem, dont waste energy finding who's to blame
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Unfortunately, I receive no money, gifts, discounts or other
compensation for all the damn work I do, nor for any of the
endorsements or recommendations I make.

[[email protected]]

yes!! also, get aeration in the pond and what are your salt levels? Ingrid

Zookeeper > wrote:
>Hi Sue. Have you checked your water quality? Sometimes the water
>parameters (pH, KH, ammonia, nitrite, etc. levels) change so quickly in
>the spring, that the water becomes slightly toxic and the fish react by
>zipping around and jumping. You might want to do a 20-30% water change
>just in case.


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
List Manager: Puregold Goldfish List
http://puregold.aquaria.net/
www.drsolo.com
Solve the problem, dont waste energy finding who's to blame
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Unfortunately, I receive no money, gifts, discounts or other
compensation for all the damn work I do, nor for any of the
endorsements or recommendations I make.

[Offbreed]

SueAndHerZoo wrote:
BUT.... the fish are still
> acting weird. I've removed the plant they were trying to hide behind, so
> now they are all trying to squeeze behind the rock border (the parts that
> hang down into the water) and they are all trying to cram themselves into
> the skimmer - I have to keep getting them out of there. What are they
> hiding or running from??????

Just in case...

Do you have any big plant pots that would sink on their own you could
toss in the pond for them to hide in/under/behind? Some short sections
of black plastic pipe would work well (you could probably get a lumber
yard to chop one up for you), and might blend in on the bottem well
enough to just leave there.

You have mud, do you have otter tracks? Kid tracks? Any osprey or
heron in the area?

[Offbreed]

SueAndHerZoo wrote:
BUT.... the fish are still
> acting weird. I've removed the plant they were trying to hide behind, so
> now they are all trying to squeeze behind the rock border (the parts that
> hang down into the water) and they are all trying to cram themselves into
> the skimmer - I have to keep getting them out of there. What are they
> hiding or running from??????

Just in case...

Do you have any big plant pots that would sink on their own you could
toss in the pond for them to hide in/under/behind? Some short sections
of black plastic pipe would work well (you could probably get a lumber
yard to chop one up for you), and might blend in on the bottem well
enough to just leave there.

You have mud, do you have otter tracks? Kid tracks? Any osprey or
heron in the area?

[SueAndHerZoo]

Thanks, everyone. Yes, the nitrites tested high, but of course I have to
wonder why, since I've never had this problem before, especially not when
it's still below freezing at night.

Did a big water change, got the filter/waterfall going, threw in two more
air stones (now there are four) and added some salt. (This is the first
time I've ever added salt to the pond). Tested for nitrites again a day
later and they are now "0", thank goodness, BUT.... the fish are still
acting weird. I've removed the plant they were trying to hide behind, so
now they are all trying to squeeze behind the rock border (the parts that
hang down into the water) and they are all trying to cram themselves into
the skimmer - I have to keep getting them out of there. What are they
hiding or running from??????
Sue
> wrote in message
...
> yes!! also, get aeration in the pond and what are your salt levels?
Ingrid
>
> Zookeeper > wrote:
> >Hi Sue. Have you checked your water quality? Sometimes the water
> >parameters (pH, KH, ammonia, nitrite, etc. levels) change so quickly in
> >the spring, that the water becomes slightly toxic and the fish react by
> >zipping around and jumping. You might want to do a 20-30% water change
> >just in case.
>
>
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> List Manager: Puregold Goldfish List
> http://puregold.aquaria.net/
> www.drsolo.com
> Solve the problem, dont waste energy finding who's to blame
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> Unfortunately, I receive no money, gifts, discounts or other
> compensation for all the damn work I do, nor for any of the
> endorsements or recommendations I make.

[SueAndHerZoo]

Thanks, everyone. Yes, the nitrites tested high, but of course I have to
wonder why, since I've never had this problem before, especially not when
it's still below freezing at night.

Did a big water change, got the filter/waterfall going, threw in two more
air stones (now there are four) and added some salt. (This is the first
time I've ever added salt to the pond). Tested for nitrites again a day
later and they are now "0", thank goodness, BUT.... the fish are still
acting weird. I've removed the plant they were trying to hide behind, so
now they are all trying to squeeze behind the rock border (the parts that
hang down into the water) and they are all trying to cram themselves into
the skimmer - I have to keep getting them out of there. What are they
hiding or running from??????
Sue
> wrote in message
...
> yes!! also, get aeration in the pond and what are your salt levels?
Ingrid
>
> Zookeeper > wrote:
> >Hi Sue. Have you checked your water quality? Sometimes the water
> >parameters (pH, KH, ammonia, nitrite, etc. levels) change so quickly in
> >the spring, that the water becomes slightly toxic and the fish react by
> >zipping around and jumping. You might want to do a 20-30% water change
> >just in case.
>
>
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> List Manager: Puregold Goldfish List
> http://puregold.aquaria.net/
> www.drsolo.com
> Solve the problem, dont waste energy finding who's to blame
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> Unfortunately, I receive no money, gifts, discounts or other
> compensation for all the damn work I do, nor for any of the
> endorsements or recommendations I make.

[SueAndHerZoo]

No obvious animal tracks, and the kids in the neighborhood have pretty much
left the pond alone for the past two years - luckily the novelty wore off
for them.

Yes, I had a problem with a heron last year, BEFORE I bought the scarecrow.
And yes, there ARE submerged hiding places for them on the bottom of the
pond.... I sunk some in the fall for the frogs/fish to hide in if they chose
to. They seem to want to be at the top, near an edge, cramming themselves
into tight quarters. If I wasn't so worried about them it would almost be
funny, 5 huge koi all cramming into one tiny spot. :(
Sue
"Offbreed" > wrote in message
...
> SueAndHerZoo wrote:
> BUT.... the fish are still
> > acting weird. I've removed the plant they were trying to hide behind,
so
> > now they are all trying to squeeze behind the rock border (the parts
that
> > hang down into the water) and they are all trying to cram themselves
into
> > the skimmer - I have to keep getting them out of there. What are they
> > hiding or running from??????
>
> Just in case...
>
> Do you have any big plant pots that would sink on their own you could
> toss in the pond for them to hide in/under/behind? Some short sections
> of black plastic pipe would work well (you could probably get a lumber
> yard to chop one up for you), and might blend in on the bottem well
> enough to just leave there.
>
> You have mud, do you have otter tracks? Kid tracks? Any osprey or
> heron in the area?
>

[SueAndHerZoo]

No obvious animal tracks, and the kids in the neighborhood have pretty much
left the pond alone for the past two years - luckily the novelty wore off
for them.

Yes, I had a problem with a heron last year, BEFORE I bought the scarecrow.
And yes, there ARE submerged hiding places for them on the bottom of the
pond.... I sunk some in the fall for the frogs/fish to hide in if they chose
to. They seem to want to be at the top, near an edge, cramming themselves
into tight quarters. If I wasn't so worried about them it would almost be
funny, 5 huge koi all cramming into one tiny spot. :(
Sue
"Offbreed" > wrote in message
...
> SueAndHerZoo wrote:
> BUT.... the fish are still
> > acting weird. I've removed the plant they were trying to hide behind,
so
> > now they are all trying to squeeze behind the rock border (the parts
that
> > hang down into the water) and they are all trying to cram themselves
into
> > the skimmer - I have to keep getting them out of there. What are they
> > hiding or running from??????
>
> Just in case...
>
> Do you have any big plant pots that would sink on their own you could
> toss in the pond for them to hide in/under/behind? Some short sections
> of black plastic pipe would work well (you could probably get a lumber
> yard to chop one up for you), and might blend in on the bottem well
> enough to just leave there.
>
> You have mud, do you have otter tracks? Kid tracks? Any osprey or
> heron in the area?
>

[Cichlidiot]

SueAndHerZoo > wrote:
> Thanks, everyone. Yes, the nitrites tested high, but of course I have to
> wonder why, since I've never had this problem before, especially not when
> it's still below freezing at night.

> Did a big water change, got the filter/waterfall going, threw in two more
> air stones (now there are four) and added some salt. (This is the first
> time I've ever added salt to the pond). Tested for nitrites again a day
> later and they are now "0", thank goodness, BUT.... the fish are still
> acting weird. I've removed the plant they were trying to hide behind, so
> now they are all trying to squeeze behind the rock border (the parts that
> hang down into the water) and they are all trying to cram themselves into
> the skimmer - I have to keep getting them out of there. What are they
> hiding or running from??????

Just idle musing, but perhaps they aren't hiding from anything. Are these
items they are attempting to wedge themselves behind near the surface
and/or in an area with low current? Nitrite poisoning converts hemoglobin
into a form unable to transport oxygen. This effectively lowers the amount
of oxygen that the blood can carry to the organs. When nitrite gets too
high, it can even literally suffocate the fish from the inside by
converting too much hemoglobin. I have to wonder if their behavior is in
response to nitrite poisoning. They may be trying to wedge themselves to
conserve energy (no having to swim against current) because of the loss of
oxygen transport in their bloodstream due to the nitrites. This may be the
cause of the behavior, especially if their respiration appears to be
extreme too (gasping behaviors). You probably didn't observe it when temps
dropped to freezing at night because of the lower metabolism (less oxygen
demand) that accompanies lower temps.

Good news is you've done the right steps to mitigate nitrite poisoing
(water changes and adding salt) so if this is the cause, it should resolve
shortly. That is of course assuming there wasn't an ammonia spike before
the nitrite spike that damaged the gills. Some of the other behaviors you
described (darting across the surface of the water and jumping out) are
also consistent with ammonia poisoning. At this point though, you've done
the best you can in terms of remeding the water quality. Now is time to
monitor (both behavior and water parameters) and see.

[Cichlidiot]

SueAndHerZoo > wrote:
> Thanks, everyone. Yes, the nitrites tested high, but of course I have to
> wonder why, since I've never had this problem before, especially not when
> it's still below freezing at night.

> Did a big water change, got the filter/waterfall going, threw in two more
> air stones (now there are four) and added some salt. (This is the first
> time I've ever added salt to the pond). Tested for nitrites again a day
> later and they are now "0", thank goodness, BUT.... the fish are still
> acting weird. I've removed the plant they were trying to hide behind, so
> now they are all trying to squeeze behind the rock border (the parts that
> hang down into the water) and they are all trying to cram themselves into
> the skimmer - I have to keep getting them out of there. What are they
> hiding or running from??????

Just idle musing, but perhaps they aren't hiding from anything. Are these
items they are attempting to wedge themselves behind near the surface
and/or in an area with low current? Nitrite poisoning converts hemoglobin
into a form unable to transport oxygen. This effectively lowers the amount
of oxygen that the blood can carry to the organs. When nitrite gets too
high, it can even literally suffocate the fish from the inside by
converting too much hemoglobin. I have to wonder if their behavior is in
response to nitrite poisoning. They may be trying to wedge themselves to
conserve energy (no having to swim against current) because of the loss of
oxygen transport in their bloodstream due to the nitrites. This may be the
cause of the behavior, especially if their respiration appears to be
extreme too (gasping behaviors). You probably didn't observe it when temps
dropped to freezing at night because of the lower metabolism (less oxygen
demand) that accompanies lower temps.

Good news is you've done the right steps to mitigate nitrite poisoing
(water changes and adding salt) so if this is the cause, it should resolve
shortly. That is of course assuming there wasn't an ammonia spike before
the nitrite spike that damaged the gills. Some of the other behaviors you
described (darting across the surface of the water and jumping out) are
also consistent with ammonia poisoning. At this point though, you've done
the best you can in terms of remeding the water quality. Now is time to
monitor (both behavior and water parameters) and see.

[SueAndHerZoo]

Oh, Thank you! That makes SO much sense, and I have no doubt that is what
the poor things are trying to do. Now I feel so badly for taking away the
plant that was keeping them motionless, and for continually trying to move
them away from the rocks they're hovering behind.

At this point I'm thinking I should give them back some things on the plant
ledge that will help them rest and stay immobile. Thank you again for
explaining WHY they are doing this - I have learned so much from this
experience, though unfortunately at the cost of my poor koi's health. I can
only hope I get the chance to make it up to them. (I've been growing a huge
container of red worms for them all winter in the garage - hope the fish
live long enough to enjoy them when the water finally warms up. It's
supposed to snow here today in Connecticut!
Sue
"Cichlidiot" > wrote in message
...
> SueAndHerZoo > wrote:
> > Thanks, everyone. Yes, the nitrites tested high, but of course I have
to
> > wonder why, since I've never had this problem before, especially not
when
> > it's still below freezing at night.
>
> > Did a big water change, got the filter/waterfall going, threw in two
more
> > air stones (now there are four) and added some salt. (This is the
first
> > time I've ever added salt to the pond). Tested for nitrites again a
day
> > later and they are now "0", thank goodness, BUT.... the fish are still
> > acting weird. I've removed the plant they were trying to hide behind,
so
> > now they are all trying to squeeze behind the rock border (the parts
that
> > hang down into the water) and they are all trying to cram themselves
into
> > the skimmer - I have to keep getting them out of there. What are they
> > hiding or running from??????
>
> Just idle musing, but perhaps they aren't hiding from anything. Are these
> items they are attempting to wedge themselves behind near the surface
> and/or in an area with low current? Nitrite poisoning converts hemoglobin
> into a form unable to transport oxygen. This effectively lowers the amount
> of oxygen that the blood can carry to the organs. When nitrite gets too
> high, it can even literally suffocate the fish from the inside by
> converting too much hemoglobin. I have to wonder if their behavior is in
> response to nitrite poisoning. They may be trying to wedge themselves to
> conserve energy (no having to swim against current) because of the loss of
> oxygen transport in their bloodstream due to the nitrites. This may be the
> cause of the behavior, especially if their respiration appears to be
> extreme too (gasping behaviors). You probably didn't observe it when temps
> dropped to freezing at night because of the lower metabolism (less oxygen
> demand) that accompanies lower temps.
>
> Good news is you've done the right steps to mitigate nitrite poisoing
> (water changes and adding salt) so if this is the cause, it should resolve
> shortly. That is of course assuming there wasn't an ammonia spike before
> the nitrite spike that damaged the gills. Some of the other behaviors you
> described (darting across the surface of the water and jumping out) are
> also consistent with ammonia poisoning. At this point though, you've done
> the best you can in terms of remeding the water quality. Now is time to
> monitor (both behavior and water parameters) and see.

[SueAndHerZoo]

Oh, Thank you! That makes SO much sense, and I have no doubt that is what
the poor things are trying to do. Now I feel so badly for taking away the
plant that was keeping them motionless, and for continually trying to move
them away from the rocks they're hovering behind.

At this point I'm thinking I should give them back some things on the plant
ledge that will help them rest and stay immobile. Thank you again for
explaining WHY they are doing this - I have learned so much from this
experience, though unfortunately at the cost of my poor koi's health. I can
only hope I get the chance to make it up to them. (I've been growing a huge
container of red worms for them all winter in the garage - hope the fish
live long enough to enjoy them when the water finally warms up. It's
supposed to snow here today in Connecticut!
Sue
"Cichlidiot" > wrote in message
...
> SueAndHerZoo > wrote:
> > Thanks, everyone. Yes, the nitrites tested high, but of course I have
to
> > wonder why, since I've never had this problem before, especially not
when
> > it's still below freezing at night.
>
> > Did a big water change, got the filter/waterfall going, threw in two
more
> > air stones (now there are four) and added some salt. (This is the
first
> > time I've ever added salt to the pond). Tested for nitrites again a
day
> > later and they are now "0", thank goodness, BUT.... the fish are still
> > acting weird. I've removed the plant they were trying to hide behind,
so
> > now they are all trying to squeeze behind the rock border (the parts
that
> > hang down into the water) and they are all trying to cram themselves
into
> > the skimmer - I have to keep getting them out of there. What are they
> > hiding or running from??????
>
> Just idle musing, but perhaps they aren't hiding from anything. Are these
> items they are attempting to wedge themselves behind near the surface
> and/or in an area with low current? Nitrite poisoning converts hemoglobin
> into a form unable to transport oxygen. This effectively lowers the amount
> of oxygen that the blood can carry to the organs. When nitrite gets too
> high, it can even literally suffocate the fish from the inside by
> converting too much hemoglobin. I have to wonder if their behavior is in
> response to nitrite poisoning. They may be trying to wedge themselves to
> conserve energy (no having to swim against current) because of the loss of
> oxygen transport in their bloodstream due to the nitrites. This may be the
> cause of the behavior, especially if their respiration appears to be
> extreme too (gasping behaviors). You probably didn't observe it when temps
> dropped to freezing at night because of the lower metabolism (less oxygen
> demand) that accompanies lower temps.
>
> Good news is you've done the right steps to mitigate nitrite poisoing
> (water changes and adding salt) so if this is the cause, it should resolve
> shortly. That is of course assuming there wasn't an ammonia spike before
> the nitrite spike that damaged the gills. Some of the other behaviors you
> described (darting across the surface of the water and jumping out) are
> also consistent with ammonia poisoning. At this point though, you've done
> the best you can in terms of remeding the water quality. Now is time to
> monitor (both behavior and water parameters) and see.

[Gunnar]

where in Ct. are you I am in RI.
"SueAndHerZoo" > wrote in message
news:PpC5c.6596$rQ.2806@lakeread04...
> Oh, Thank you! That makes SO much sense, and I have no doubt that is
what
> the poor things are trying to do. Now I feel so badly for taking away
the
> plant that was keeping them motionless, and for continually trying to move
> them away from the rocks they're hovering behind.
>
> At this point I'm thinking I should give them back some things on the
plant
> ledge that will help them rest and stay immobile. Thank you again for
> explaining WHY they are doing this - I have learned so much from this
> experience, though unfortunately at the cost of my poor koi's health. I
can
> only hope I get the chance to make it up to them. (I've been growing a
huge
> container of red worms for them all winter in the garage - hope the fish
> live long enough to enjoy them when the water finally warms up. It's
> supposed to snow here today in Connecticut!
> Sue
> "Cichlidiot" > wrote in message
> ...
> > SueAndHerZoo > wrote:
> > > Thanks, everyone. Yes, the nitrites tested high, but of course I
have
> to
> > > wonder why, since I've never had this problem before, especially not
> when
> > > it's still below freezing at night.
> >
> > > Did a big water change, got the filter/waterfall going, threw in two
> more
> > > air stones (now there are four) and added some salt. (This is the
> first
> > > time I've ever added salt to the pond). Tested for nitrites again a
> day
> > > later and they are now "0", thank goodness, BUT.... the fish are still
> > > acting weird. I've removed the plant they were trying to hide
behind,
> so
> > > now they are all trying to squeeze behind the rock border (the parts
> that
> > > hang down into the water) and they are all trying to cram themselves
> into
> > > the skimmer - I have to keep getting them out of there. What are they
> > > hiding or running from??????
> >
> > Just idle musing, but perhaps they aren't hiding from anything. Are
these
> > items they are attempting to wedge themselves behind near the surface
> > and/or in an area with low current? Nitrite poisoning converts
hemoglobin
> > into a form unable to transport oxygen. This effectively lowers the
amount
> > of oxygen that the blood can carry to the organs. When nitrite gets too
> > high, it can even literally suffocate the fish from the inside by
> > converting too much hemoglobin. I have to wonder if their behavior is in
> > response to nitrite poisoning. They may be trying to wedge themselves to
> > conserve energy (no having to swim against current) because of the loss
of
> > oxygen transport in their bloodstream due to the nitrites. This may be
the
> > cause of the behavior, especially if their respiration appears to be
> > extreme too (gasping behaviors). You probably didn't observe it when
temps
> > dropped to freezing at night because of the lower metabolism (less
oxygen
> > demand) that accompanies lower temps.
> >
> > Good news is you've done the right steps to mitigate nitrite poisoing
> > (water changes and adding salt) so if this is the cause, it should
resolve
> > shortly. That is of course assuming there wasn't an ammonia spike before
> > the nitrite spike that damaged the gills. Some of the other behaviors
you
> > described (darting across the surface of the water and jumping out) are
> > also consistent with ammonia poisoning. At this point though, you've
done
> > the best you can in terms of remeding the water quality. Now is time to
> > monitor (both behavior and water parameters) and see.
>
>

[Gunnar]

where in Ct. are you I am in RI.
"SueAndHerZoo" > wrote in message
news:PpC5c.6596$rQ.2806@lakeread04...
> Oh, Thank you! That makes SO much sense, and I have no doubt that is
what
> the poor things are trying to do. Now I feel so badly for taking away
the
> plant that was keeping them motionless, and for continually trying to move
> them away from the rocks they're hovering behind.
>
> At this point I'm thinking I should give them back some things on the
plant
> ledge that will help them rest and stay immobile. Thank you again for
> explaining WHY they are doing this - I have learned so much from this
> experience, though unfortunately at the cost of my poor koi's health. I
can
> only hope I get the chance to make it up to them. (I've been growing a
huge
> container of red worms for them all winter in the garage - hope the fish
> live long enough to enjoy them when the water finally warms up. It's
> supposed to snow here today in Connecticut!
> Sue
> "Cichlidiot" > wrote in message
> ...
> > SueAndHerZoo > wrote:
> > > Thanks, everyone. Yes, the nitrites tested high, but of course I
have
> to
> > > wonder why, since I've never had this problem before, especially not
> when
> > > it's still below freezing at night.
> >
> > > Did a big water change, got the filter/waterfall going, threw in two
> more
> > > air stones (now there are four) and added some salt. (This is the
> first
> > > time I've ever added salt to the pond). Tested for nitrites again a
> day
> > > later and they are now "0", thank goodness, BUT.... the fish are still
> > > acting weird. I've removed the plant they were trying to hide
behind,
> so
> > > now they are all trying to squeeze behind the rock border (the parts
> that
> > > hang down into the water) and they are all trying to cram themselves
> into
> > > the skimmer - I have to keep getting them out of there. What are they
> > > hiding or running from??????
> >
> > Just idle musing, but perhaps they aren't hiding from anything. Are
these
> > items they are attempting to wedge themselves behind near the surface
> > and/or in an area with low current? Nitrite poisoning converts
hemoglobin
> > into a form unable to transport oxygen. This effectively lowers the
amount
> > of oxygen that the blood can carry to the organs. When nitrite gets too
> > high, it can even literally suffocate the fish from the inside by
> > converting too much hemoglobin. I have to wonder if their behavior is in
> > response to nitrite poisoning. They may be trying to wedge themselves to
> > conserve energy (no having to swim against current) because of the loss
of
> > oxygen transport in their bloodstream due to the nitrites. This may be
the
> > cause of the behavior, especially if their respiration appears to be
> > extreme too (gasping behaviors). You probably didn't observe it when
temps
> > dropped to freezing at night because of the lower metabolism (less
oxygen
> > demand) that accompanies lower temps.
> >
> > Good news is you've done the right steps to mitigate nitrite poisoing
> > (water changes and adding salt) so if this is the cause, it should
resolve
> > shortly. That is of course assuming there wasn't an ammonia spike before
> > the nitrite spike that damaged the gills. Some of the other behaviors
you
> > described (darting across the surface of the water and jumping out) are
> > also consistent with ammonia poisoning. At this point though, you've
done
> > the best you can in terms of remeding the water quality. Now is time to
> > monitor (both behavior and water parameters) and see.
>
>

[~ jan JJsPond.us]

This is a good time to mention that everyone should be checking their water
quality about now. Especially if the fish are acting strange.

Water tests should be done at room temperature, and I don't mean you do
them inside, you bring the water in and let it warm up to room temperature.
If you're showing ammonia, DO NOT do a water change, first treat the
ammonia with Amquell or similar product, to de-tox the ammonia, then you
can do a water change. Otherwise, if you do the change and your pH is
higher than in the pond, you could make the ammonia poisoning even worst.
If one has nitrite showing, they probably had an ammonia problem prior to.
Check your pH and your Kh, both affect the toxicity of ammonia. Ammonia
treat with a de-toxer (i.e., Amquell, ChloramX) and Nitrite treat with
salt as mentioned earlier in this thread.
~ jan (How's your water quality today?)

>On Tue, 16 Mar 2004 07:26:32 -0500, "SueAndHerZoo" > wrote:

>Oh, Thank you! That makes SO much sense, and I have no doubt that is what
>the poor things are trying to do. Now I feel so badly for taking away the
>plant that was keeping them motionless, and for continually trying to move
>them away from the rocks they're hovering behind.
>
>At this point I'm thinking I should give them back some things on the plant
>ledge that will help them rest and stay immobile. Thank you again for
>explaining WHY they are doing this - I have learned so much from this
>experience, though unfortunately at the cost of my poor koi's health. I can
>only hope I get the chance to make it up to them. (I've been growing a huge
>container of red worms for them all winter in the garage - hope the fish
>live long enough to enjoy them when the water finally warms up. It's
>supposed to snow here today in Connecticut!
>Sue
>"Cichlidiot" > wrote in message
...
>> SueAndHerZoo > wrote:
>> > Thanks, everyone. Yes, the nitrites tested high, but of course I have
>to
>> > wonder why, since I've never had this problem before, especially not
>when
>> > it's still below freezing at night.
>>
>> > Did a big water change, got the filter/waterfall going, threw in two
>more
>> > air stones (now there are four) and added some salt. (This is the
>first
>> > time I've ever added salt to the pond). Tested for nitrites again a
>day
>> > later and they are now "0", thank goodness, BUT.... the fish are still
>> > acting weird. I've removed the plant they were trying to hide behind,
>so
>> > now they are all trying to squeeze behind the rock border (the parts
>that
>> > hang down into the water) and they are all trying to cram themselves
>into
>> > the skimmer - I have to keep getting them out of there. What are they
>> > hiding or running from??????
>>
>> Just idle musing, but perhaps they aren't hiding from anything. Are these
>> items they are attempting to wedge themselves behind near the surface
>> and/or in an area with low current? Nitrite poisoning converts hemoglobin
>> into a form unable to transport oxygen. This effectively lowers the amount
>> of oxygen that the blood can carry to the organs. When nitrite gets too
>> high, it can even literally suffocate the fish from the inside by
>> converting too much hemoglobin. I have to wonder if their behavior is in
>> response to nitrite poisoning. They may be trying to wedge themselves to
>> conserve energy (no having to swim against current) because of the loss of
>> oxygen transport in their bloodstream due to the nitrites. This may be the
>> cause of the behavior, especially if their respiration appears to be
>> extreme too (gasping behaviors). You probably didn't observe it when temps
>> dropped to freezing at night because of the lower metabolism (less oxygen
>> demand) that accompanies lower temps.
>>
>> Good news is you've done the right steps to mitigate nitrite poisoing
>> (water changes and adding salt) so if this is the cause, it should resolve
>> shortly. That is of course assuming there wasn't an ammonia spike before
>> the nitrite spike that damaged the gills. Some of the other behaviors you
>> described (darting across the surface of the water and jumping out) are
>> also consistent with ammonia poisoning. At this point though, you've done
>> the best you can in terms of remeding the water quality. Now is time to
>> monitor (both behavior and water parameters) and see.
>

[~ jan JJsPond.us]

This is a good time to mention that everyone should be checking their water
quality about now. Especially if the fish are acting strange.

Water tests should be done at room temperature, and I don't mean you do
them inside, you bring the water in and let it warm up to room temperature.
If you're showing ammonia, DO NOT do a water change, first treat the
ammonia with Amquell or similar product, to de-tox the ammonia, then you
can do a water change. Otherwise, if you do the change and your pH is
higher than in the pond, you could make the ammonia poisoning even worst.
If one has nitrite showing, they probably had an ammonia problem prior to.
Check your pH and your Kh, both affect the toxicity of ammonia. Ammonia
treat with a de-toxer (i.e., Amquell, ChloramX) and Nitrite treat with
salt as mentioned earlier in this thread.
~ jan (How's your water quality today?)

>On Tue, 16 Mar 2004 07:26:32 -0500, "SueAndHerZoo" > wrote:

>Oh, Thank you! That makes SO much sense, and I have no doubt that is what
>the poor things are trying to do. Now I feel so badly for taking away the
>plant that was keeping them motionless, and for continually trying to move
>them away from the rocks they're hovering behind.
>
>At this point I'm thinking I should give them back some things on the plant
>ledge that will help them rest and stay immobile. Thank you again for
>explaining WHY they are doing this - I have learned so much from this
>experience, though unfortunately at the cost of my poor koi's health. I can
>only hope I get the chance to make it up to them. (I've been growing a huge
>container of red worms for them all winter in the garage - hope the fish
>live long enough to enjoy them when the water finally warms up. It's
>supposed to snow here today in Connecticut!
>Sue
>"Cichlidiot" > wrote in message
...
>> SueAndHerZoo > wrote:
>> > Thanks, everyone. Yes, the nitrites tested high, but of course I have
>to
>> > wonder why, since I've never had this problem before, especially not
>when
>> > it's still below freezing at night.
>>
>> > Did a big water change, got the filter/waterfall going, threw in two
>more
>> > air stones (now there are four) and added some salt. (This is the
>first
>> > time I've ever added salt to the pond). Tested for nitrites again a
>day
>> > later and they are now "0", thank goodness, BUT.... the fish are still
>> > acting weird. I've removed the plant they were trying to hide behind,
>so
>> > now they are all trying to squeeze behind the rock border (the parts
>that
>> > hang down into the water) and they are all trying to cram themselves
>into
>> > the skimmer - I have to keep getting them out of there. What are they
>> > hiding or running from??????
>>
>> Just idle musing, but perhaps they aren't hiding from anything. Are these
>> items they are attempting to wedge themselves behind near the surface
>> and/or in an area with low current? Nitrite poisoning converts hemoglobin
>> into a form unable to transport oxygen. This effectively lowers the amount
>> of oxygen that the blood can carry to the organs. When nitrite gets too
>> high, it can even literally suffocate the fish from the inside by
>> converting too much hemoglobin. I have to wonder if their behavior is in
>> response to nitrite poisoning. They may be trying to wedge themselves to
>> conserve energy (no having to swim against current) because of the loss of
>> oxygen transport in their bloodstream due to the nitrites. This may be the
>> cause of the behavior, especially if their respiration appears to be
>> extreme too (gasping behaviors). You probably didn't observe it when temps
>> dropped to freezing at night because of the lower metabolism (less oxygen
>> demand) that accompanies lower temps.
>>
>> Good news is you've done the right steps to mitigate nitrite poisoing
>> (water changes and adding salt) so if this is the cause, it should resolve
>> shortly. That is of course assuming there wasn't an ammonia spike before
>> the nitrite spike that damaged the gills. Some of the other behaviors you
>> described (darting across the surface of the water and jumping out) are
>> also consistent with ammonia poisoning. At this point though, you've done
>> the best you can in terms of remeding the water quality. Now is time to
>> monitor (both behavior and water parameters) and see.
>