Oops, new tank filled with fish before I learned about cycling

[Ralston88]

I have a 55-gal running for just over a week now. After letting the
water circulate for a couple of days, I put in 4 or 5 gouramis.
Everything looked fine, so I put in a bunch more over the weekend.
The only advice I received from the store was to change 20% of the
water per week for the first 2 months.

Now that I've spent some time reading the postings and a few dedicated
sites, I know learned about the nitrogen issue, growing new bacteria,
etc. I really hope I can manage this cycle and not lose the fish in
the meantime. There are around 16 small gourami variants, plus a
small blue lobster.

Should I mainly focus on water changing or try one of the accelerant
products I've seen mentioned?

The tank has 2 powerflo pumps feeding an under-gravel tray, plus an
Aquacleer 300 carbon filter running continuously. The plants are
fake, and the gravel was purchased new. The tank came with large
corals that had been used by the previous owner, though they had been
sitting dry in the garage for several years.

Thank you for any advice.

[Dan White]

"Ralston88" > wrote in message
om...
>
> The tank has 2 powerflo pumps feeding an under-gravel tray, plus an
> Aquacleer 300 carbon filter running continuously. The plants are
> fake, and the gravel was purchased new. The tank came with large
> corals that had been used by the previous owner, though they had been
> sitting dry in the garage for several years.
>

I just started a new tank, too, and I put Cycle in to condition the water.
This is a concentrated solution of bacteria that consume the nitrites. It
sounds to me from reading the advice in here that you should get a nitrite
and ammonia tester and be sure to change water frequently enough to keep the
levels down, plus maybe use some extra Cycle. I'm sure others will give
good (ie better) advice.

I just wanted to mention one thing, though. It is my understanding that you
should not mix coral with tropical fish. I thought that it can rip the
scales off of them. Maybe a wives' tale? I have a box of coral from when
this was a salt water tank years ago (also 55 gal), but I wouldn't use it
for tropical fish for that reason, plus it isn't native to their habitat, so
it looks kind of strange to me.

dwhite

[Justin Boucher]

If you know someone who has an established tank, see if you can borrow or
have a cup of their gravel. Take it home and dump it in to your tank. The
gravel will have the nitrifying bacteria your tank needs to get the cycling
going in a hurry. Another option would be if someone could let you have
some of their filter media. Use their old filter media in your filter to
kick start that cycling. Keep it wet and don't rinse it. Same with the
gravel if you go that route. Also, if you don't have them already, get an
ammonia, nitrite and pH test kits. The added old gravel or filter will help
speed up the cycling process but you may still see a spike depending on the
amount of media you get and the fish load of the tank it came from, you
might even get the joy of "instant cycling"!. Partial water changes will
help control the toxic levels down. Using something like ammo-lock or other
chemicals that remove ammonia may only postpone the cycling so I wouldn't
recomment using them to remove the ammonia or nitrite completely. You may
consider using a small dose to reduce the amount of ammonia or nitrite if
the levels get to high. The key is to leave a little so the bacteria has
something to eat and your tank cycles quickly with minimal stress on the
fish more naturally.

The artifical corals would harden the water and raise the pH of the tank.
If your fish prefer soft water, I would not recommend using the corals as
decorations. I had a 5 gal bucket of crushed coral that I use to buffer my
freshwater tanks. I just added a couple ounces when needed since our tap
water is extremely soft. I've even seen ads for aragonite for use in
African Chiclid tanks.

Justin


"Ralston88" > wrote in message
om...
> I have a 55-gal running for just over a week now. After letting the
> water circulate for a couple of days, I put in 4 or 5 gouramis.
> Everything looked fine, so I put in a bunch more over the weekend.
> The only advice I received from the store was to change 20% of the
> water per week for the first 2 months.
>
> Now that I've spent some time reading the postings and a few dedicated
> sites, I know learned about the nitrogen issue, growing new bacteria,
> etc. I really hope I can manage this cycle and not lose the fish in
> the meantime. There are around 16 small gourami variants, plus a
> small blue lobster.
>
> Should I mainly focus on water changing or try one of the accelerant
> products I've seen mentioned?
>
> The tank has 2 powerflo pumps feeding an under-gravel tray, plus an
> Aquacleer 300 carbon filter running continuously. The plants are
> fake, and the gravel was purchased new. The tank came with large
> corals that had been used by the previous owner, though they had been
> sitting dry in the garage for several years.
>
> Thank you for any advice.

[Dan White]

"Justin Boucher" > wrote in message
...

>Using something like ammo-lock or other
> chemicals that remove ammonia may only postpone the cycling so I wouldn't
> recomment using them to remove the ammonia or nitrite completely. You may
> consider using a small dose to reduce the amount of ammonia or nitrite if
> the levels get to high. The key is to leave a little so the bacteria has
> something to eat and your tank cycles quickly with minimal stress on the
> fish more naturally.

But why not use something like Cycle, which contains the bacteria you need
in a concentrated form? Does it not really work? I'm curious because I've
been using it and I'm more or less trusting that it is working.

thanks,
dwhite

[luminos]

The only product many are willing to support is that from Marineland called
Bio-Spira. It is hard to find, since it is perishible (must be kept
refrigerated). Cycle et al. are not the same....different bacteria.

"Dan White" > wrote in message
et...
>
> "Justin Boucher" > wrote in message
> ...
>
>>Using something like ammo-lock or other
>> chemicals that remove ammonia may only postpone the cycling so I wouldn't
>> recomment using them to remove the ammonia or nitrite completely. You
>> may
>> consider using a small dose to reduce the amount of ammonia or nitrite if
>> the levels get to high. The key is to leave a little so the bacteria has
>> something to eat and your tank cycles quickly with minimal stress on the
>> fish more naturally.
>
> But why not use something like Cycle, which contains the bacteria you need
> in a concentrated form? Does it not really work? I'm curious because
> I've
> been using it and I'm more or less trusting that it is working.
>
> thanks,
> dwhite
>
>

[Justin Boucher]

Personally, I've never had any real luck with over the counter cycle
starters or enhancers. Perhaps I just managed to get the container that has
been sitting on the shelf for 3 years and most if not all of the bacteria
inside have lost their effective lifespans or something. Others I've heard
have had no problem using them, so in the end it's one of those "Your
results may vary" type things.

Besides, now that I have 1 well established freshwater and 1 marine tank
running, should I need or want to start another, I can easily get that
"instant cycle" situation by taking some media from either tank.

Justin

"Dan White" > wrote in message
et...
>
> "Justin Boucher" > wrote in message
> ...
>
> >Using something like ammo-lock or other
> > chemicals that remove ammonia may only postpone the cycling so I
wouldn't
> > recomment using them to remove the ammonia or nitrite completely. You
may
> > consider using a small dose to reduce the amount of ammonia or nitrite
if
> > the levels get to high. The key is to leave a little so the bacteria
has
> > something to eat and your tank cycles quickly with minimal stress on the
> > fish more naturally.
>
> But why not use something like Cycle, which contains the bacteria you need
> in a concentrated form? Does it not really work? I'm curious because
I've
> been using it and I'm more or less trusting that it is working.
>
> thanks,
> dwhite
>
>

[Peter S]

On 16 Aug 2004 13:18:05 -0700, Ralston88 wrote:

> I have a 55-gal running for just over a week now. After letting the
> water circulate for a couple of days, I put in 4 or 5 gouramis.
> Everything looked fine, so I put in a bunch more over the weekend.
> The only advice I received from the store was to change 20% of the
> water per week for the first 2 months.
>
> Now that I've spent some time reading the postings and a few dedicated
> sites, I know learned about the nitrogen issue, growing new bacteria,
> etc. I really hope I can manage this cycle and not lose the fish in
> the meantime. There are around 16 small gourami variants, plus a
> small blue lobster.
>
> Should I mainly focus on water changing or try one of the accelerant
> products I've seen mentioned?
>
> The tank has 2 powerflo pumps feeding an under-gravel tray, plus an
> Aquacleer 300 carbon filter running continuously. The plants are
> fake, and the gravel was purchased new. The tank came with large
> corals that had been used by the previous owner, though they had been
> sitting dry in the garage for several years.
>
> Thank you for any advice.

I made the same mistake with the tank I started this summer, but it worked
out fine with Nitrivec wich I added for the first 10 days.

I would be suspicious of something that you just add once since there is
nothing that the bacteria can feed on in a freshly started tank.

The best would be if you could get some filtermedia from a running tank
with the same kind of water you have (pH).

Regards,
/PeterS

[Geezer From The Freezer]

Get the test kits and monitor regularly. If the Ammonia, Nitrites and Nitrates
go high do a water change....simple.

Bio Spira is the best bottled bacteria to use.

Ralston88 wrote:
>
> I have a 55-gal running for just over a week now. After letting the
> water circulate for a couple of days, I put in 4 or 5 gouramis.
> Everything looked fine, so I put in a bunch more over the weekend.
> The only advice I received from the store was to change 20% of the
> water per week for the first 2 months.
>
> Now that I've spent some time reading the postings and a few dedicated
> sites, I know learned about the nitrogen issue, growing new bacteria,
> etc. I really hope I can manage this cycle and not lose the fish in
> the meantime. There are around 16 small gourami variants, plus a
> small blue lobster.
>
> Should I mainly focus on water changing or try one of the accelerant
> products I've seen mentioned?
>
> The tank has 2 powerflo pumps feeding an under-gravel tray, plus an
> Aquacleer 300 carbon filter running continuously. The plants are
> fake, and the gravel was purchased new. The tank came with large
> corals that had been used by the previous owner, though they had been
> sitting dry in the garage for several years.
>
> Thank you for any advice.

[Ralston88]

Thanks for all the replies. I don't know anyone with a tank to share
their bacteria, so i guess I'll focus on water changes.

There seems to be alot of disagreement about the additives.

[RedForeman ©®]

|| Thanks for all the replies. I don't know anyone with a tank to share
|| their bacteria, so i guess I'll focus on water changes.
||
|| There seems to be alot of disagreement about the additives.

Last resort, ask your LFS, but try and get some from a planted tank....

--
| RedForeman ©® fabricator and creator of the ratbike streetfighter!!!
| ==========================
| 2003 TRX450ES
| 1992 TRX-350 XX (For Sale)
| '98 Tacoma Ext Cab 4X4 Lifted....
| ==========================
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| ><((((º>`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸.·´¯`·.¸. ><((((º> ·´¯`·. , .·´¯`·.. ><((((º>
| for any questions you may have....
| www.gmail.com

[Danya]

oh, i forgot to mention that i did put in 2 gallons of water from the
10 gallon tank into the 32 gallon tank before adding the fish, hoping
that would help... i hate to jump in on someone else's post but i had
only gotten 1 reply in my post last week....

ok that's all.
thanks :)

[Danya]

(Ralston88) wrote in message >...
> Thanks for all the replies. I don't know anyone with a tank to share
> their bacteria, so i guess I'll focus on water changes.
>
> There seems to be alot of disagreement about the additives.

now i'm afraid for my fish! i bought a 32 gal. from a lady i work
with, had it running for a week, put the fake plants/decorations from
my 10 gal. in the 32 gal. 1 day before adding the fish... 4 of the
fish came from my 10 gal. and i had bought 8 more fish to go along
with them. the day after purchasing them, 1 swordtail died but he was
acting a bit funny to begin with. so, should i be concerned about the
levels? will they suddenly sky-rocket if i don't keep my eye on them?
i bought the new fish on Saturday, and the rest seem do be doing
fine... should i also do weekly water changes or what? gosh, i hate
being a newbie to this. haha

thanks

[RedForeman ©®]

|| oh, i forgot to mention that i did put in 2 gallons of water from the
|| 10 gallon tank into the 32 gallon tank before adding the fish, hoping
|| that would help... i hate to jump in on someone else's post but i
|| had only gotten 1 reply in my post last week....
||
|| ok that's all.
|| thanks :)

Danya, you could always start a new post... that does simplify things for
you...

Ok, realize that water is just water... there isnt' bacteria in the water...
the cycle isn't FOR the water to stabilize, it's for the filter... the
filter has the bacteria, as does the surfaces... the gravel, glass, etc...
what you need is gravel, or filter media from another established tank, to
help seed the new tank....water doesn't do much for a new tank except be
pre-dechlorinated....

I will mention, that I was on vacation last week and with the absense of our
beloved NetMax, I didn't get a chance to read or follow up for you... I'll
be here, not that it's a great relief, but I try and help when I can.....

--
| RedForeman ©® fabricator and creator of the ratbike streetfighter!!!
| ==========================
| 2003 TRX450ES
| 1992 TRX-350 XX (For Sale)
| '98 Tacoma Ext Cab 4X4 Lifted....
| ==========================
| ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸¸,ø¤° `°¤ø,¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø
| ><((((º>`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸.·´¯`·.¸. ><((((º> ·´¯`·. , .·´¯`·.. ><((((º>
| for any questions you may have....
| www.gmail.com

[Danya]

"RedForeman ©®" > wrote in message >...
> Danya, you could always start a new post... that does simplify things for
> you...

:-P
!!!! :)

> Ok, realize that water is just water... there isnt' bacteria in the water...
> the cycle isn't FOR the water to stabilize, it's for the filter... the
> filter has the bacteria, as does the surfaces... the gravel, glass, etc...
> what you need is gravel, or filter media from another established tank, to
> help seed the new tank....water doesn't do much for a new tank except be
> pre-dechlorinated....
>
> I will mention, that I was on vacation last week and with the absense of our
> beloved NetMax, I didn't get a chance to read or follow up for you... I'll
> be here, not that it's a great relief, but I try and help when I can.....
>
> --
> | RedForeman ©® fabricator and creator of the ratbike streetfighter!!!
> | ==========================
> | 2003 TRX450ES
> | 1992 TRX-350 XX (For Sale)
> | '98 Tacoma Ext Cab 4X4 Lifted....
> | ==========================
> | ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸¸,ø¤° `°¤ø,¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø
> | ><((((º>`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸.·´¯`·.¸. ><((((º> ·´¯`·. , .·´¯`·.. ><((((º>
> | for any questions you may have....
> | www.gmail.com

ok, so i'm guessing you are quite regular around here?
anyway, my fish seem to be doing just fine. i sure hope i don't lose
them all...

why does my 1st post from last night happen to be below my 2nd and
yours?! strange... haha

[RedForeman ©®]

||
|| ok, so i'm guessing you are quite regular around here?
|| anyway, my fish seem to be doing just fine. i sure hope i don't lose
|| them all...
||
|| why does my 1st post from last night happen to be below my 2nd and
|| yours?! strange... haha

Regular?? I'm a fixture... the kind that you'd like to replace, but it'd be
less trouble just to keep for old times sake....

News servers are getting weird nowadays... a few storms and posts
vanish...go figure...

--
| RedForeman ©® fabricator and creator of the ratbike streetfighter!!!
| ==========================
| 2003 TRX450ES
| 1992 TRX-350 XX (For Sale)
| '98 Tacoma Ext Cab 4X4 Lifted....
| ==========================
| ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸¸,ø¤° `°¤ø,¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø
| ><((((º>`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸.·´¯`·.¸. ><((((º> ·´¯`·. , .·´¯`·.. ><((((º>
| for any questions you may have....
| www.gmail.com

[Robert Flory]

Try throwing in a bunch of cheap plants ..... plants use ammonia directly.

or ..... http://www.seachem.com/products/product_pages/Prime.html at
higher doses it is supposed to help with nitrites.

Bob
"Ralston88" > wrote in message
om...
> Thanks for all the replies. I don't know anyone with a tank to share
> their bacteria, so i guess I'll focus on water changes.
>
> There seems to be alot of disagreement about the additives.

[Dr Engelbert Buxbaum]

Ralston88 wrote:


> Now that I've spent some time reading the postings and a few dedicated
> sites, I know learned about the nitrogen issue, growing new bacteria,
> etc. I really hope I can manage this cycle and not lose the fish in
> the meantime. There are around 16 small gourami variants, plus a
> small blue lobster.

I would add life plants to the tank. They use the ammonia produced by
the fishes as fertiliser, thus act in a similar way as a biological
filter. Also, plants add to the optics of the tank, create hiding places
for fishes, produce oxygen, and are required by many fishes for
breading.

Again it would have been better to have the plants 2 weeks before
putting fishes in, so they can root properly. But since you are there
already...