gouramis, female bettas

[Danya]

ok, first of all, are female bettas okay in a tank with livebearers?
i'm thinking about trading my 6 tetras for a couple female bettas and
perhaps some dwarf gouramis. do these types of fish all get along
well? i have 3 corydoras also. the reason i want to trade my tetras
is because they are all mean. they chase everyone around and i'm
assuming they are the ones that ruined poor sonny jr.'s tail, not to
mention hal's, and then took bites out of victor's and darien's.

okay, so right now i have 2 male swordtails, 3 male guppies, 6 tetras
all together, and 3 corys. so if i traded in the tetras (gold skirt
and long finned serpae--3 of each) how many bettas/gouramis could i
fit in my 32 gallon aquarium?

Thanks everyone in advance...
Danya

[Dan White]

"Danya" > wrote in message
om...
> ok, first of all, are female bettas okay in a tank with livebearers?
> i'm thinking about trading my 6 tetras for a couple female bettas and
> perhaps some dwarf gouramis. do these types of fish all get along
> well? i have 3 corydoras also. the reason i want to trade my tetras
> is because they are all mean. they chase everyone around and i'm
> assuming they are the ones that ruined poor sonny jr.'s tail, not to
> mention hal's, and then took bites out of victor's and darien's.
>

I don't know but I just put a betta in my tank that had a dwarf gourami
already in it. The gourami keeps chasing after the betta and after 2 days
his tail is a bit shredded. See my other post on pics of my tank and a
bunch of questions I have as a newbie.

dwhite

[Danya]

"Dan White" > wrote in message >...
> I don't know but I just put a betta in my tank that had a dwarf gourami
> already in it. The gourami keeps chasing after the betta and after 2 days
> his tail is a bit shredded. See my other post on pics of my tank and a
> bunch of questions I have as a newbie.
>
> dwhite

really? how mean!! my stupid tetras are already mean enough.... all
they do is chase everyone around. it's annoying. all i want is a
beautiful and peaceful aquarium!

thanks, i will check out your other posts

[Dan White]

"Danya" > wrote in message
om...
> "Dan White" > wrote in message
>...
> > I don't know but I just put a betta in my tank that had a dwarf gourami
> > already in it. The gourami keeps chasing after the betta and after 2
days
> > his tail is a bit shredded. See my other post on pics of my tank and a
> > bunch of questions I have as a newbie.
> >
> > dwhite
>
> really? how mean!! my stupid tetras are already mean enough.... all
> they do is chase everyone around. it's annoying. all i want is a
> beautiful and peaceful aquarium!
>
> thanks, i will check out your other posts

Thanks Danya. For the record my black neon and cardinal tetras are very
peaceful. They keep to themselves. I just put a little angel fish in
today, and was curious to see the reaction of the gourami, who is larger
than the angel. They came face to face a few times, and the gourami either
just ignored the angel, or actually backed up and went the other
way...amazing.

dwhite

[Danya]

"Dan White" > wrote in message >...
> Thanks Danya. For the record my black neon and cardinal tetras are very
> peaceful. They keep to themselves. I just put a little angel fish in
> today, and was curious to see the reaction of the gourami, who is larger
> than the angel. They came face to face a few times, and the gourami either
> just ignored the angel, or actually backed up and went the other
> way...amazing.
>
> dwhite

well, dan, i read through your posts and it sounds as if i get a
gourami, i should get a female if i want to have a female betta.
would just 1 of each do, or is it possible to get 1 gourami and 2
female bettas. in other words, are 2 female bettas as risky as 2
female gouramis together? and hopefully some day down the road i
would like to get a bosemani rainbowfish. :)

[Dan White]

"Danya" > wrote in message
om...

>
> well, dan, i read through your posts and it sounds as if i get a
> gourami, i should get a female if i want to have a female betta.
> would just 1 of each do, or is it possible to get 1 gourami and 2
> female bettas. in other words, are 2 female bettas as risky as 2
> female gouramis together? and hopefully some day down the road i
> would like to get a bosemani rainbowfish. :)

I can't really answer your questions because I'm about as lost as you are on
this! lol. The guy at the fish store told me that gouramis and bettas are
in the same family of fish, and that's why the gourami can be aggressive
toward him. He said that all I have to do is get more plants and
rocks/places to hide and it should be fine. He also said that sometimes
just adding more fish, even if they are peaceful fish that don't challenge
the gourami, can change his behavior. Also, have you seen the dwarf neon
rainbow? These are pretty cool fish. The pics don't do them 100% justice
because of the irridescent colors that flash as they move around.

dwhite

[RedForeman ©®]

|| "Danya" > wrote in message
|||
||| well, dan, i read through your posts and it sounds as if i get a
||| gourami, i should get a female if i want to have a female betta.
||| would just 1 of each do, or is it possible to get 1 gourami and 2
||| female bettas. in other words, are 2 female bettas as risky as 2
||| female gouramis together? and hopefully some day down the road i
||| would like to get a bosemani rainbowfish. :)
||
|| I can't really answer your questions because I'm about as lost as
|| you are on this! lol. The guy at the fish store told me that
|| gouramis and bettas are in the same family of fish, and that's why
|| the gourami can be aggressive toward him. He said that all I have
|| to do is get more plants and rocks/places to hide and it should be
|| fine. He also said that sometimes just adding more fish, even if
|| they are peaceful fish that don't challenge the gourami, can change
|| his behavior. Also, have you seen the dwarf neon rainbow? These
|| are pretty cool fish. The pics don't do them 100% justice because
|| of the irridescent colors that flash as they move around.
||
|| dwhite

It is true, that gouramis and betta should NOT be kept together... if you
do, you are simply risking it... it's not rocket science, just facts...
they're in the same family, thus, cannot tolerate each other.. YMMV, so if
you get lucky and it works, then great... if not, wouldn't you feel a tad
guilty for ignoring what 90 people say isn't a good idea?? I would...
therefore, I usually take someone's advice and try not to get all worked up
about it...

--
| RedForeman ©® fabricator and creator of the ratbike streetfighter!!!
| ==========================
| 2003 TRX450ES
| 1992 TRX-350 XX (For Sale)
| '98 Tacoma Ext Cab 4X4 Lifted....
| ==========================
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| ><((((º>`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸.·´¯`·.¸. ><((((º> ·´¯`·. , .·´¯`·.. ><((((º>
| for any questions you may have....
| www.gmail.com

[Dan White]

"RedForeman ©®" > wrote in message
...
>
> It is true, that gouramis and betta should NOT be kept together... if you
> do, you are simply risking it... it's not rocket science, just facts...
> they're in the same family, thus, cannot tolerate each other.. YMMV, so
if
> you get lucky and it works, then great... if not, wouldn't you feel a tad
> guilty for ignoring what 90 people say isn't a good idea?? I would...
> therefore, I usually take someone's advice and try not to get all worked
up
> about it...

Thanks. Before I bought the betta I checked around, including here, to see
whether a betta would be OK in a community tank. I didn't think to see if
the gourami would! I just always assumed they were peaceful fish. The LFS
guy said he doesn't take fish back, but if that one keeps causing problems
that he would take him.

dwhite

>
> --
> | RedForeman ©® fabricator and creator of the ratbike streetfighter!!!
> | ==========================
> | 2003 TRX450ES
> | 1992 TRX-350 XX (For Sale)
> | '98 Tacoma Ext Cab 4X4 Lifted....
> | ==========================
> | ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸¸,ø¤° `°¤ø,¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø
> | ><((((º>`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸.·´¯`·.¸. ><((((º> ·´¯`·. , .·´¯`·.. ><((((º>
> | for any questions you may have....
> | www.gmail.com
>
>

[RedForeman ©®]

|| Thanks. Before I bought the betta I checked around, including here,
|| to see whether a betta would be OK in a community tank. I didn't
|| think to see if the gourami would! I just always assumed they were
|| peaceful fish. The LFS guy said he doesn't take fish back, but if
|| that one keeps causing problems that he would take him.
||
|| dwhite

I've had gouramis in a community tank and had NO problems...

I've had 1, single betta in a community tank and had no problems...

I've heard of male bettas and dwarf gouramis in a tank, and it was not a
good thing.

--
| RedForeman ©® fabricator and creator of the ratbike streetfighter!!!
| ==========================
| 2003 TRX450ES
| 1992 TRX-350 XX (For Sale)
| '98 Tacoma Ext Cab 4X4 Lifted....
| ==========================
| ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸¸,ø¤° `°¤ø,¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø
| ><((((º>`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸.·´¯`·.¸. ><((((º> ·´¯`·. , .·´¯`·.. ><((((º>
| for any questions you may have....
| www.gmail.com

[Dan White]

"RedForeman ©®" > wrote in message
...
>
> I've heard of male bettas and dwarf gouramis in a tank, and it was not a
> good thing.
>

I think I'm going to wait it out and see. It isn't so bad that it is like
cruelty to the betta. The tank is big enough (55g) that they are often not
in sight of each other, and most of the time when they do interact, the
betta scoots away before the gourami tries to take a bite. The angel seems
to be distracting the gourami some, and I am going to be adding more fish
soon, so we'll see how things shape up over the next week or so.

Thanks for your comments,
dwhite

[Danya]

well guys, i got a female dwarf gourami, but they didn't have any
female bettas. so do female bettas and female dwarf gouramis do okay
together?? i also got 5 neons, 2 julii corydoras (the other ones i
had are bronze corys, i was misled), and a rainbow shark that is
smaller than my guppies (now anyway...)

oh, so i traded my mean long finned serpae tetras and my gold skirt
tetras and got $4 store credit at the LFS :D

[NetMax]

"Danya" > wrote in message
om...
> well guys, i got a female dwarf gourami, but they didn't have any
> female bettas. so do female bettas and female dwarf gouramis do okay
> together?? i also got 5 neons, 2 julii corydoras (the other ones i
> had are bronze corys, i was misled), and a rainbow shark that is
> smaller than my guppies (now anyway...)
>
> oh, so i traded my mean long finned serpae tetras and my gold skirt
> tetras and got $4 store credit at the LFS :D

There isn't a compatibility matrix which says what you can and cannot
mix. Well, I'm wrong, actually there is here:
http://www.geocities.com/gletiecq/fishcompat.html but the point is that
the fish have never read it ;~)

It's easy to make generalizations (don't put two male Bettas together),
but in many other cases, it's ymmv, depending on tank size, fish size,
order of introduction, age & sex of fish, other tankmates, amount of
shelter, individual personality etc etc.

Folks with a lot of practical experience can make educated predictions
sometimes, but there are always exceptions out there living in perfect
harmony (or vice-versa).

I can tell you that the female Betta and female Gourami are natural
competitors, coming from the same family, sharing the same surface for
feeding, bubble-nests and courting rituals. Whether they choose to
exercise that competitiveness depends on many variables. From my
experience, the female Gourami is less than likely to exercise any
aggressive tendencies, while many female Bettas are more likely to exert
territorial pressures on other Anabantidaes. Note that from behavioural
predictability, I think Bettas are probably unique in being the least
predictable of commonly available fish, able to span the widest range of
reactions.

If you wanted to level the playing field between these two fish, then the
female Gourami would have to be in the tank first (her home base), she
would hold the female alpha position (not be a submissive fish in
hiding), she would need to be larger healthy and well-fed (well
acclimated) before a smaller juvenile female Betta was added. The tank
would be of a reasonable size (not a 10g) and have lots of shelter and
floating plants on both sides of the tank. There would ideally be a male
Betta (to keep the female on her heals), or more female Bettas (to keep
each other busy) and enough dither fish so the two ladies would not
fixate on each other. Not doing any of these things does not mean it
wouldn't work, any more than doing all these things would guarantee that
it would work ;~)

ps: If you wanted a predictable hobby, jigsaw puzzles always come to the
same conclusion, but fish-keeping almost always guarantees everyone gets
a slightly different result :o)
--
www.NetMax.tk

[Danya]

"NetMax" > wrote in message >...
> There isn't a compatibility matrix which says what you can and cannot
> mix. Well, I'm wrong, actually there is here:
> http://www.geocities.com/gletiecq/fishcompat.html but the point is that
> the fish have never read it ;~)
>
> It's easy to make generalizations (don't put two male Bettas together),
> but in many other cases, it's ymmv, depending on tank size, fish size,
> order of introduction, age & sex of fish, other tankmates, amount of
> shelter, individual personality etc etc.
>
> Folks with a lot of practical experience can make educated predictions
> sometimes, but there are always exceptions out there living in perfect
> harmony (or vice-versa).
>
> I can tell you that the female Betta and female Gourami are natural
> competitors, coming from the same family, sharing the same surface for
> feeding, bubble-nests and courting rituals. Whether they choose to
> exercise that competitiveness depends on many variables. From my
> experience, the female Gourami is less than likely to exercise any
> aggressive tendencies, while many female Bettas are more likely to exert
> territorial pressures on other Anabantidaes. Note that from behavioural
> predictability, I think Bettas are probably unique in being the least
> predictable of commonly available fish, able to span the widest range of
> reactions.
>
> If you wanted to level the playing field between these two fish, then the
> female Gourami would have to be in the tank first (her home base), she
> would hold the female alpha position (not be a submissive fish in
> hiding), she would need to be larger healthy and well-fed (well
> acclimated) before a smaller juvenile female Betta was added. The tank
> would be of a reasonable size (not a 10g) and have lots of shelter and
> floating plants on both sides of the tank. There would ideally be a male
> Betta (to keep the female on her heals), or more female Bettas (to keep
> each other busy) and enough dither fish so the two ladies would not
> fixate on each other. Not doing any of these things does not mean it
> wouldn't work, any more than doing all these things would guarantee that
> it would work ;~)
>
> ps: If you wanted a predictable hobby, jigsaw puzzles always come to the
> same conclusion, but fish-keeping almost always guarantees everyone gets
> a slightly different result :o)

thanks netmax, that's some good info. well, the female gourami has
been in my 32 gal. tank since thursday...the LFS said they would order
some female bettas for me and that they would probably be in this
coming thursday (09/09). so now this is what i have to think
about...should i buy just 1 female betta, or 2, or 3, or what!
idealy, i just wanted 1... perhaps i should start out with 1 and if
that doesn't work, get another?? this is all too confusing.. hehe.
plus i don't want to have to set up my 10 gallon again just to put in
the fish that doesn't get along with everyone else, ya know? i'm sure
i would blow a fuse if i did that anyway. :)

[Velvet]

RedForeman ©® wrote:
>
> It is true, that gouramis and betta should NOT be kept together... if you
> do, you are simply risking it... it's not rocket science, just facts...
> they're in the same family, thus, cannot tolerate each other.. YMMV, so if
> you get lucky and it works, then great... if not, wouldn't you feel a tad
> guilty for ignoring what 90 people say isn't a good idea?? I would...
> therefore, I usually take someone's advice and try not to get all worked up
> about it...
>

I dunno... I kept gourami and a male betta together, and had no probs at
all. But then I have a very heavily planted tank, with plants that come
right up to the surface (not like the planteds I see so many photos of,
with loads of space above the tops of the plants) - so many hiding
places for fish.

They all got on fine, but a lot of the time personalities of fish vary a
lot - one gourami might be a terror, while another of the same type will
be fine - and the same goes for bettas too.

I had a spare smaller tank I could set up for the betta if it hadn't
worked out, but my gut feeling is the success was down to the sheer
amount of plants in the tank - everyone had somewhere to hide if things
got too scary, and if a fish can't see the one that annoys it, then
everything seems to stay calm.

--


Velvet

[Danya]

ok, but how about a FEMALE gourami and a FEMALE betta???
wait, did i already post this..

anyhoo, the LFS ordered me some female bettas that should be in on
thursday. i thought maybe if i rearranged the tank a bit before i
introduced the female betta, things would work out better? i also
bought a silk plant that i am going to use as a floating plant and i
thought about putting that in when i introduce the female betta so
there will be a bit more space to hide and what not.

[TYNK 7]

>Subject: Re: gouramis, female bettas
>From: "Dan White"
>Date: 8/31/2004 7:59 PM Central Daylight Time
>Message-id: >
>
>"Danya" > wrote in message
om...
>> ok, first of all, are female bettas okay in a tank with livebearers?
>> i'm thinking about trading my 6 tetras for a couple female bettas and
>> perhaps some dwarf gouramis. do these types of fish all get along
>> well? i have 3 corydoras also. the reason i want to trade my tetras
>> is because they are all mean. they chase everyone around and i'm
>> assuming they are the ones that ruined poor sonny jr.'s tail, not to
>> mention hal's, and then took bites out of victor's and darien's.
>>
>
>I don't know but I just put a betta in my tank that had a dwarf gourami
>already in it. The gourami keeps chasing after the betta and after 2 days
>his tail is a bit shredded. See my other post on pics of my tank and a
>bunch of questions I have as a newbie.
>
>dwhite
>

Bettas and Gouramis are from the labyrinth group of fishes, and are often too
closely related to house together.
However, I have Pearl Gouramis and they ignore each other. (I have both a male
and females in this tank and neither sex pays any attention to the Pearls and
vice versa).

[TYNK 7]

>Subject: Re: gouramis, female bettas
>From: "Dan White"
>Date: 9/2/2004 5:20 PM Central Daylight Time
>Message-id: >

Snipped......
Dan,
What type of Gourami do you have?

[Dan White]

"TYNK 7" > wrote in message
...
> Bettas and Gouramis are from the labyrinth group of fishes, and are often
too
> closely related to house together.
> However, I have Pearl Gouramis and they ignore each other. (I have both a
male
> and females in this tank and neither sex pays any attention to the Pearls
and
> vice versa).

Thanks. I think things have settled down enough that it isn't a problem.
The gourami seems to be hanging out with the new angelfish. Those two get
along fine, and the betta just gets chased once in a great while. He also
has a cave to loiter around in when needed.

dwhite

[Dan White]

"TYNK 7" > wrote in message
...
> >Subject: Re: gouramis, female bettas
> >From: "Dan White"
> >Date: 9/2/2004 5:20 PM Central Daylight Time
> >Message-id: >
>
> Snipped......
> Dan,
> What type of Gourami do you have?

It is a dwarf red. For a week or so after I got him, he was timid and
listless, probably adjusting to the new tank. He was just starting to come
out of it when I picked up the betta. Immediately after adding the betta,
the gourami became the life of the party. He was all over the betta for
awhile, but that slowed down, and he became a voracious eater. He is with a
quarter sized angel (smaller than him) and they get along just fine, bumping
into each other and not fighting at all. I have to get about another 20 or
30 fish, so we'll see how things go.

dwhite