agressive behavior

[tigrane]

We have a 20 Gallon fresh water tank with:
3 african cichlids (about 2 inches each, one slightly bigger)
1 small sucker mouth (1.5 inches long, thin body)

We introduced another cichlid (2 inches big), and the poor guy was
chased for 2 days. We changed the layout of the aqurium, hoping they
would not be too teritorial. When we saw how bad his fins looked, we
seperated him, but it was too late, the new fish died within a day.

The bigger of the cichlids turns out to be quite agressive, chasing
the other cichlids and the suckermouth which fins don't look so good
now.
Since I built a plexiglass separator, I isoltaed the aggressive one
from the others.

My questions are:
1- Should I get rid of the 'apparently' aggressive one?
1- Should we keep him(her?) isolated and make sure the other 2 leave
the suckermouth be?

We would like to have 4 cichlids in our tank, any good advice on how
to introduce 1 (or 2 if we get rid of the big one) fish as peacefully
as possible.

Thanks all for your advices

Cheers

[Amateur Cichlids]

Here's an article to take a look at. ;-)
Tim
http://www.fishaholics.org/articles.php?ArtId=1


"tigrane" > wrote in message
om...
> We have a 20 Gallon fresh water tank with:
> 3 african cichlids (about 2 inches each, one slightly bigger)
> 1 small sucker mouth (1.5 inches long, thin body)
>
> We introduced another cichlid (2 inches big), and the poor guy was
> chased for 2 days. We changed the layout of the aqurium, hoping they
> would not be too teritorial. When we saw how bad his fins looked, we
> seperated him, but it was too late, the new fish died within a day.
>
> The bigger of the cichlids turns out to be quite agressive, chasing
> the other cichlids and the suckermouth which fins don't look so good
> now.
> Since I built a plexiglass separator, I isoltaed the aggressive one
> from the others.
>
> My questions are:
> 1- Should I get rid of the 'apparently' aggressive one?
> 1- Should we keep him(her?) isolated and make sure the other 2 leave
> the suckermouth be?
>
> We would like to have 4 cichlids in our tank, any good advice on how
> to introduce 1 (or 2 if we get rid of the big one) fish as peacefully
> as possible.
>
> Thanks all for your advices
>
> Cheers

[Brian Saghy]

I think that 3 cichlids is about all you're going to get into a 20
gallon tank happily. The 1" of fish per gallon rule doesn't really apply
to cichlids, because they are so aggressive, territorial, and need their
space. I have two cichlids and a snail in my 10 gallon tank, and I
don't think that is enough space for the three of them.

I suggest getting a bigger tank, if you want more fish.

I have also heard that it is best to introduce fish in groups of two. I
don't think it matters if they are the same species or not. This is
simply to prevent all of the current inhabitants from ganging up on the
new one. Also, changing the layout of the aquarium is a good idea, but
should probably be done right when the new fish are introduced, so they
all have the same starting point. Perhaps it would be wise to introduce
two new fish with the very aggressive one separated. Once they claim
their territory and get along well with the other less-aggressive fish,
let the aggressive one back into the mix. With luck, all the cichlids
will be on the offense against the most aggressive one, rather than
being submissive to it.

Hope this helps.

-Brian

tigrane wrote:
> We have a 20 Gallon fresh water tank with:
> 3 african cichlids (about 2 inches each, one slightly bigger)
> 1 small sucker mouth (1.5 inches long, thin body)
>
> We introduced another cichlid (2 inches big), and the poor guy was
> chased for 2 days. We changed the layout of the aqurium, hoping they
> would not be too teritorial. When we saw how bad his fins looked, we
> seperated him, but it was too late, the new fish died within a day.
>
> The bigger of the cichlids turns out to be quite agressive, chasing
> the other cichlids and the suckermouth which fins don't look so good
> now.
> Since I built a plexiglass separator, I isoltaed the aggressive one
> from the others.
>
> My questions are:
> 1- Should I get rid of the 'apparently' aggressive one?
> 1- Should we keep him(her?) isolated and make sure the other 2 leave
> the suckermouth be?
>
> We would like to have 4 cichlids in our tank, any good advice on how
> to introduce 1 (or 2 if we get rid of the big one) fish as peacefully
> as possible.
>
> Thanks all for your advices
>
> Cheers

[chummley]

I have kept six 4-5" adults in a 29gallon for 5 years. It has the same
footprint as a 20L, but I think the extra height is a benefit with
africans. These guys use the whole tank and move up and down a lot. I
keep the tank brightly lit with 55W, run a Fluval canister & Emperor
400 and try to do a 5 gallon water change weekly. With proper care
these fish seem to be disease free; and I think good water quality
improves their behavior also. It ca'nt hurt. If a fish is taking an
obvious beating you should separate it until you can change the living
arrangements.
I have pairs of zebra, socolofi and 2 male(I think?) g. moorii, and
usually a few to 15 offspring up to about 1". The crowding keeps down
the anger but some fish just do not mix, and I have had to remove some
incorrigibles. Decide what your tank and filtration can handle, add
all the fish at once,keep the water clean and your fingers crossed.
Provide a bunch of hiding places, including some near the surface if
possible(the Emperor makes good cover).
I noticed that the group calmed down considerably after two of
three pairs had bred a few times. The kids in the tank must provide a
distraction. Of course, after 5 years they may have decided to just
get along.
I would not keep anything else in the same tank as these things as
they are relentless if they get after you. Why risk the health of an
innocent bystander.

Once you get the right mix of fish this as is good as it gets in
freshwater; and the maintenance is minimal.

I use a 20L to hold the dinks before they go to the pet store, but
I've never kept adults in it. It seems to really miss the height of
the 29g, but... Clean water is the key. It can work. Good luck

[Frankster]

Some of the other responses address size of tank verses number/size of fish.
But I want to mention compatibility of fish. There is a pretty good website
that helps you determine which fish are typically compatible. I say
typically, because there are no guarantees. Anyhow, it's a good site...
address is here: http://www.cichlidrecipe.com/cichlidchart/flashchartd.html.

Also, one thing that has worked for me very well is this. Never buy two of
the same kind of fish. I have one of each of my species. Most (well, a
hell of a lot) of infighting comes from fish of the same kind fighting with
each other. Eliminate duplicate fish and you'll eliminate a lot of
fighting. Of course, this wouldn't work for breeders :) LOL.

-Frank

"tigrane" > wrote in message
om...
> We have a 20 Gallon fresh water tank with:
> 3 african cichlids (about 2 inches each, one slightly bigger)
> 1 small sucker mouth (1.5 inches long, thin body)
>
> We introduced another cichlid (2 inches big), and the poor guy was
> chased for 2 days. We changed the layout of the aqurium, hoping they
> would not be too teritorial. When we saw how bad his fins looked, we
> seperated him, but it was too late, the new fish died within a day.
>
> The bigger of the cichlids turns out to be quite agressive, chasing
> the other cichlids and the suckermouth which fins don't look so good
> now.
> Since I built a plexiglass separator, I isoltaed the aggressive one
> from the others.
>
> My questions are:
> 1- Should I get rid of the 'apparently' aggressive one?
> 1- Should we keep him(her?) isolated and make sure the other 2 leave
> the suckermouth be?
>
> We would like to have 4 cichlids in our tank, any good advice on how
> to introduce 1 (or 2 if we get rid of the big one) fish as peacefully
> as possible.
>
> Thanks all for your advices
>
> Cheers