My happy story about floating

[Günther Ritter]

Hallo

I will tell you my story about floating, but my English is not very good.
Sorry.

In the moment I have ~30 Ryukin, Fantail and a lot of young fantail, ryukin,
veiltais.

From april to oktober ~20 ryukin and fantail live in one of my ponds, eating
the whole day algue like this:

http://www.shubunkin.de/upload/detail.asp?id=611

The whole year there was never a floating fish, they grow up very fine in
wonderful colours.
So, I take some of theses fish on 1.oktober to my tanks. All was very fine,
wonderful fishes :)

But after 10-14 days the first fish starts floating in the evening, after
some weeks the 2., 3. and the 4.

But I thought that my fishes are not ill, the whole year in my ponds they
don't float.

I tested 5-6 foods, give 0,5%-1% of fishweight per day... if there was more
protein in the food the fish was more floting.

So I went to my pond and, take some algue and give them *additional* to the
granualate...
Dear friends! suddenly the fishes never float. It works.
I tested these some weeks, if i use only sticks or granulate or flakes with
high protein the fish begin floating.
Now, I tested what I can use additional to my fishfood if there are no
algue, daphnia...
As best result I find rice.

Now, each time i give my fishes granulate, additional I give them some
sticks of *cooked* natural rice. First I give rice, after the granulate with
higher protein.

It's not a joke!
Since I do so over weeks, there is no fish floating, air in the fish can
better go out of the fish and the fish grow up like elefants.

I told it some goldfish-friends in Germany and Canada.
The ranchus from friends in Germany don't float longer if they eat some
cooked rice sticks additional to the food.
Also the fantail from Canadian friends don't float longer if thy eat some
rice additional to granulate or flakes

What do you think about these?

Regards
Günther
http://www.shubunkin.de

[[email protected]]

yes. actually. Al Foster (Philly veils) told me (a few years ago) about using one
or two grains of cooked white rice to help control floatiness. The major problems
with high protein foods is people usually overfeed. Overfeeding is the most common
cause of floatiness, altho most floatiness is in fancy GF with big wide and deep
bodies. Temperature is also a factor, heat helps.
The other thing many people use is half a cooked and shelled pea (w or w/o a crystal
of epsom salts) to help with floatiness. the idea is to feed something soft but
indigestible which causes a bit of diarrhea or provides "bulk". in the pond fish eat
tiny tiny amounts all day long. they have no stomach, so a big wad of any food is
going to plug up the works. then bacteria get going on the food and make gas..
resulting in floating. that is one theory.
Ingrid

"Günther Ritter" > wrote:

>Hallo
>
>I will tell you my story about floating, but my English is not very good.
>Sorry.
>
>In the moment I have ~30 Ryukin, Fantail and a lot of young fantail, ryukin,
>veiltais.
>
>From april to oktober ~20 ryukin and fantail live in one of my ponds, eating
>the whole day algue like this:
>
>http://www.shubunkin.de/upload/detail.asp?id=611
>
>The whole year there was never a floating fish, they grow up very fine in
>wonderful colours.
>So, I take some of theses fish on 1.oktober to my tanks. All was very fine,
>wonderful fishes :)
>
>But after 10-14 days the first fish starts floating in the evening, after
>some weeks the 2., 3. and the 4.
>
>But I thought that my fishes are not ill, the whole year in my ponds they
>don't float.
>
>I tested 5-6 foods, give 0,5%-1% of fishweight per day... if there was more
>protein in the food the fish was more floting.
>
>So I went to my pond and, take some algue and give them *additional* to the
>granualate...
>Dear friends! suddenly the fishes never float. It works.
>I tested these some weeks, if i use only sticks or granulate or flakes with
>high protein the fish begin floating.
>Now, I tested what I can use additional to my fishfood if there are no
>algue, daphnia...
>As best result I find rice.
>
>Now, each time i give my fishes granulate, additional I give them some
>sticks of *cooked* natural rice. First I give rice, after the granulate with
>higher protein.
>
>It's not a joke!
>Since I do so over weeks, there is no fish floating, air in the fish can
>better go out of the fish and the fish grow up like elefants.
>
>I told it some goldfish-friends in Germany and Canada.
>The ranchus from friends in Germany don't float longer if they eat some
>cooked rice sticks additional to the food.
>Also the fantail from Canadian friends don't float longer if thy eat some
>rice additional to granulate or flakes
>
>What do you think about these?
>
>Regards
>Günther
>http://www.shubunkin.de
>
>
>



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
List Manager: Puregold Goldfish List
http://puregold.aquaria.net/
www.drsolo.com
Solve the problem, dont waste energy finding who's to blame
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Unfortunately, I receive no money, gifts, discounts or other
compensation for all the damn work I do, nor for any of the
endorsements or recommendations I make.

[Günther Ritter]

Dear Ingrid

> ...The major problems
> with high protein foods is people usually overfeed. Overfeeding is the
most common
> cause of floatiness, altho most floatiness is in fancy GF with big wide
and deep
> bodies.

I know.
But I did not overfeed my fantails.
Every day they get max. 0,5-1% of fishweight

Now, if I use 3-4 grains of cooked rice additional to the food, I can use 2
oder 3% of fishweight every day.
I tested it some weeks
The last 20 days my fantails grow up from 150 Gramm to 175 Gramm with 31
Gramm of Granulate.

please look here ;-)

http://www.shubunkin.de/upload/detail.asp?id=735

> Temperature is also a factor, heat helps

hmmmm, I think the factor is not a great factor

> The other thing many people use is half a cooked and shelled pea (w or w/o
a crystal

yes, I tested rice, peas, algue!!, corn flakes (no sugar :)), daphnia all
additinal to normal granulate (39P/8F)
Today I think algue, daphnia and rice is the best

> of epsom salts) to help with floatiness. the idea is to feed something
soft but
> indigestible which causes a bit of diarrhea or provides "bulk". in the
pond fish eat
> tiny tiny amounts all day long. they have no stomach, so a big wad of
any food is
> going to plug up the works. then bacteria get going on the food and make
gas..
> resulting in floating. that is one theory.

I think, there are too much protein in some food for goldfisch who is coming
from ponds, dealers dont't give food to the fishes, importfishes from ponds
and so there is a problem with high concentrate food.

Now I use your words:
then bacteria get going on the food and make gas..

(I don't no the word for Metaboliten in English) I say Metaboliten

Regards
Günther
http://www.shubunkin.de

[[email protected]]

Jo Ann would feed her large fancy GF (6-7 inches I think) 4-5 flakes of aquadine per
feeding, 2x per day. http://www.aquadine.com/duraflake.html
now these flakes are like a couple wheaties stuck together. not a lot of food.
so is 4-5 flakes 0.5-1% of the fishes weight?
if this is spread out over whole day in smaller amounts, yes, it is good for fish.
but a lot of food at one time is just in the fish and out the other end of the fish.
they have short digestive tracts compared to other animals. Ingrid

"Günther Ritter" > wrote:
>I know.
>But I did not overfeed my fantails.
>Every day they get max. 0,5-1% of fishweight
>
>Now, if I use 3-4 grains of cooked rice additional to the food, I can use 2
>oder 3% of fishweight every day.
>I tested it some weeks
>The last 20 days my fantails grow up from 150 Gramm to 175 Gramm with 31
>Gramm of Granulate.
>
>please look here ;-)
>
>http://www.shubunkin.de/upload/detail.asp?id=735
>
>> Temperature is also a factor, heat helps
>
>hmmmm, I think the factor is not a great factor
>
>> The other thing many people use is half a cooked and shelled pea (w or w/o
>a crystal
>
>yes, I tested rice, peas, algue!!, corn flakes (no sugar :)), daphnia all
>additinal to normal granulate (39P/8F)
>Today I think algue, daphnia and rice is the best
>
>> of epsom salts) to help with floatiness. the idea is to feed something
>soft but
>> indigestible which causes a bit of diarrhea or provides "bulk". in the
>pond fish eat
>> tiny tiny amounts all day long. they have no stomach, so a big wad of
>any food is
>> going to plug up the works. then bacteria get going on the food and make
>gas..
>> resulting in floating. that is one theory.
>
>I think, there are too much protein in some food for goldfisch who is coming
>from ponds, dealers dont't give food to the fishes, importfishes from ponds
>and so there is a problem with high concentrate food.
>
>Now I use your words:
>then bacteria get going on the food and make gas..
>
>(I don't no the word for Metaboliten in English) I say Metaboliten
>
>Regards
>Günther
>http://www.shubunkin.de
>



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
List Manager: Puregold Goldfish List
http://puregold.aquaria.net/
www.drsolo.com
Solve the problem, dont waste energy finding who's to blame
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Unfortunately, I receive no money, gifts, discounts or other
compensation for all the damn work I do, nor for any of the
endorsements or recommendations I make.

[Günther Ritter]

Good morning Ingrid

> Jo Ann would feed her large fancy GF (6-7 inches I think) 4-5 flakes of
aquadine per
> feeding, 2x per day. http://www.aquadine.com/duraflake.html

we don't know aquadine here in Germany

> now these flakes are like a couple wheaties stuck together. not a lot of
food.
> so is 4-5 flakes 0.5-1% of the fishes weight?

I don't know the weight from your fish, only the lenght ;)... but I think:
NO
One of the Ryukin here is ~18 cm (~7 inch) and his weight today, I checked
it, is 71 Gramm ;)
(in the moment he is a little bit angry... I will give him some rice... he
is coming into my hand

0,5% of fishweight for this fish is 0,35 Gramm of food
Look here, this is 0,4 Gramm:

http://www.shubunkin.de/temp/futtermenge04.jpg

so, you can understand the effect of rice when I told you that it is no
problem for my fantail fishes to eat 2% or 3% a day of granulat with
39%protein and 8,2% fat *+ rice*
My granulat is SERA KOI JUNIOR within 20% spirulina, the same as SERA KOI
SPIRULINA but very fine smaller granulat

But only for testing some weeks to find the best food for my fishes I give
this volume up to 3%.
Now, 1 year I am interesting in food for my fishes!

Regards
Günther
http://www.shubunkin.de