Grow to their environment...

[Jon Pike]

I'm sure you've all heard this idea before, that fish of various kinds will
grow to fit their environment, and then stop growing.

Does anyone have good -reliable- information on the matter? I'm sure
everyone has opinions, and links to opinions, but I'd like to get a handle
on some facts if it were at all possible.
TIA :)

--
http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=moosespet

[Iain Miller]

"Jon Pike" > wrote in message
. 159...
> I'm sure you've all heard this idea before, that fish of various kinds
will
> grow to fit their environment, and then stop growing.
>
> Does anyone have good -reliable- information on the matter? I'm sure
> everyone has opinions, and links to opinions, but I'd like to get a handle
> on some facts if it were at all possible.
> TIA username=moosespet:)

AIUI fish release a hormone that in high concentrations stops them growing.
Therefore if you change lots of water you get rid of it from the water - if
you don't then it builds up over time and slows their growth. Big fish in a
small tank will release more of it hence why they might be observed to only
be growing to their environment.

I.

[Limnophile]

"Iain Miller" > wrote

> AIUI fish release a hormone that in high concentrations stops them
> growing.
> Therefore if you change lots of water you get rid of it from the water -
> if
> you don't then it builds up over time and slows their growth. Big fish in
> a
> small tank will release more of it hence why they might be observed to
> only
> be growing to their environment.
>

True, to a certain extent.

But that's not a good reason to crowd fish into a tank too small, or ignore
water quality either.

Would you be happy living in a bathroom that nobody ever cleaned ? You may
survive it, but that doesn't mean it's a great idea....

Limnophile

[Ian Smith]

On Wed, 08 Dec, Jon Pike > wrote:

> Does anyone have good -reliable- information on the matter? I'm sure
> everyone has opinions, and links to opinions, but I'd like to get a handle
> on some facts if it were at all possible.

Facts, not opinions? Newsgroups?

regards, Ian SMith
--
|\ /| no .sig
|o o|
|/ \|

[Amateur Cichlids]

"Jon Pike" > wrote in message
. 159...
> I'm sure you've all heard this idea before, that fish of various kinds
> will
> grow to fit their environment, and then stop growing.
>
> Does anyone have good -reliable- information on the matter? I'm sure
> everyone has opinions, and links to opinions, but I'd like to get a handle
> on some facts if it were at all possible.
> TIA :)
>
> --
> http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=moosespet

I've heard many of the various thoughts on this and read a lot of the
research done on this.
Related to cichlids, I asked my good friend Ad Konings about the release of
hormones to stunt fish growth. He proceeded to laugh at me and tell me how
stupid the thought of such a thing was. All the traits of the fish we keep
can be traced back to evolution through environmental impacts. What, in a
fish's environment would cause a fish to develop such hormones? Certainly
not in the case of our cichlids where there's a constant supply of fresh
water.
Most of the studies I've read use tests with fish getting water changes
while others don't. The ones that don't get water changes have some type of
plants or something to remove nitrates. This of course leaves any other
waste products that don't break down into ammonia and oxidize to nitrates in
the water to slowly poison the fish and stunt growth. I don't know of any
concrete research that's been done specifically with cichlids.
Tending to stick with the advice of biologists and ichthyologists, I don't
give a lot of thought to the release of any hormones that stunt fish growth.
Tim

http://www.fishaholics.org

[NetMax]

"Jon Pike" > wrote in message
. 159...
> I'm sure you've all heard this idea before, that fish of various kinds
> will
> grow to fit their environment, and then stop growing.
>
> Does anyone have good -reliable- information on the matter? I'm sure
> everyone has opinions, and links to opinions, but I'd like to get a
> handle
> on some facts if it were at all possible.
> TIA :)
>
> --
> http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=moosespet


There has been much discussion and research on the rate of fish growth.
There are several factors, which if I recall correctly, are in the
following priority : water quality, diet (total quantity, number of meals
and quality), temperature and genetics. The leading constraint is water
quality (the other factors will differ in priority based on types of fish
and opinions, but the number #1 is easily water quality). The next topic
is exactly what water parameters act to constrain growth. Here there is
still much discussion, from high nitrate levels and/or DOCs to growth
hormones released and read back by the fish. Regardless of the exact
cause, small tanks are all prone to all the suspected growth constraints,
so it does not really matter. The bottom line is that small tanks will
more obviously constrain fish growth, and the solution is to keep their
water fresh and upgrade their housing as required by their growth, imho
of course ;~).

If you have more interest in the topic, mine the newsgroup archives for
discussions. There was one in particular about 2 years ago in r.a.f.m.
which included biologists, scientists and a couple of fish-farm employees
which was quite instructive.
--
www.NetMax.tk

[Interfecus]

All species of fish have a normal size which they will grow to be around,
but when confined in small tanks their growth is slowed and stunted. In
proper sized tanks, fish should grow to their full potential size which
should not be dependent on tank size.

If their growth is stunted, they will also become more prone to disease and
may die earlier than they otherwise would.

"Jon Pike" > wrote in message
. 159...
> I'm sure you've all heard this idea before, that fish of various kinds
will
> grow to fit their environment, and then stop growing.
>
> Does anyone have good -reliable- information on the matter? I'm sure
> everyone has opinions, and links to opinions, but I'd like to get a handle
> on some facts if it were at all possible.
> TIA :)
>
> --
> http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=moosespet

[Vicki PS]

"Jon Pike" > wrote in message
. 159...
> I'm sure you've all heard this idea before, that fish of various kinds
will
> grow to fit their environment, and then stop growing.
>
> Does anyone have good -reliable- information on the matter? I'm sure
> everyone has opinions, and links to opinions, but I'd like to get a handle
> on some facts if it were at all possible.
> TIA :)

You could have a look here:
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/FWSubWebIndex/GrwLmtChems.htm
and see where it takes you.

Vicki PS

[default]

"Interfecus" > wrote in message
...
> All species of fish have a normal size which they will grow to be around,
> but when confined in small tanks their growth is slowed and stunted. In
> proper sized tanks, fish should grow to their full potential size which
> should not be dependent on tank size.
>
> If their growth is stunted, they will also become more prone to disease and
> may die earlier than they otherwise would.


Seems to me, you could reword this as such:

"Poor living conditions and water quality will make fish more prone to disease,
attribute to stunted growth, and possibly an early death.

steve

[IDzine01]

Has an actual study been done on this hormone? I've recently read a lot
of posts leaving the "fish will grow to the size of the tank" up to
myth. I was ready to dismiss it completely too. I'd like to read about
the other side of the story. Can you post a link or the name of the
hormone?

Thanks Iain.

[www.Fish-ForumS.com]

Well the fish will be stunted with its growth but it will still grow.
For instance if you put an oscar in a 1 gal bowl , fed him everyday
changed the water kept great water quality he WOULD outgor that i gal
tank but be stunted in his growth.


Marc
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On Wed, 08 Dec 2004 16:13:42 GMT, Jon Pike
> wrote:

>I'm sure you've all heard this idea before, that fish of various kinds will
>grow to fit their environment, and then stop growing.
>
>Does anyone have good -reliable- information on the matter? I'm sure
>everyone has opinions, and links to opinions, but I'd like to get a handle
>on some facts if it were at all possible.
>TIA :)

[Jon Pike]

"IDzine01" > wrote in news:1102604785.835399.78580
@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com:

> Has an actual study been done on this hormone? I've recently read a lot
> of posts leaving the "fish will grow to the size of the tank" up to
> myth. I was ready to dismiss it completely too. I'd like to read about
> the other side of the story. Can you post a link or the name of the
> hormone?

Yeah, I'm still looking for solid evidence of any phenomenon :/

--
http://www.neopets.com/refer.phtml?username=moosespet

[[email protected]]

it isnt healthy. thing sticking a child in a closet to limit their size. what runts
fish (other than genetics) is poor water quality, and that takes out their immune
system. Ingrid

Jon Pike > wrote:

>I'm sure you've all heard this idea before, that fish of various kinds will
>grow to fit their environment, and then stop growing.
>
>Does anyone have good -reliable- information on the matter? I'm sure
>everyone has opinions, and links to opinions, but I'd like to get a handle
>on some facts if it were at all possible.
>TIA :)



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[smiithjones]

All species of fish have a normal size, they will grow to about, however, when kept in small tanks, their growth is slow, stunted growth. In appropriate size of the tank, the fish should grow to the size of their full potential should not depend on the size of the tank.