Antibiotics and fish

[Carl Beyer]

Someone suggested that I should refrain from antibiotics due to the
addition of new strains of viruses... I try avoid to antibiotics in my
personal life as well so it got me thinking.

When a human takes antibiotics, unless it is a shot, there is a regiment
(6 to 10 pills) of medication that have to be taken (according to the
doctor). Stopping the intake of the antibiotic can lead to stronger
viruses and some other stuff I really don't understand (and maybe this
whole theory is wrong as well?).

So, do you have to keep giving fish Antibiotics if you start?

Carl

--
--
http://www.cobaltbluefilms.com

[ajames54]

There is usually a regimen involved in fish meds as well.. a number of
doses over a certain interval followed by or including a water change
or two, prepackaged meds are pretty specific and I assume that any vet
prescribing them would also include the regimen. The cost of medicating
an entire pond is one of the better arguments for keeping a
quarantine/hospital tank.

[~ Windsong ~]

"Carl Beyer" > wrote in message
...
> Someone suggested that I should refrain from antibiotics due to the
> addition of new strains of viruses... I try avoid to antibiotics in my
> personal life as well so it got me thinking.

## Bacteria Carl. Antibiotics have no effect in viruses.

> When a human takes antibiotics, unless it is a shot, there is a regiment
> (6 to 10 pills) of medication that have to be taken (according to the
> doctor). Stopping the intake of the antibiotic can lead to stronger
> viruses and some other stuff I really don't understand (and maybe this
> whole theory is wrong as well?).
>
> So, do you have to keep giving fish Antibiotics if you start?

## I'll let an expert in the field answer that one. Meanwhile, why not
follow the directions that came with the fish medication?

--
Carol.... the frugal ponder...
"Eat Right, Exercise, Die Anyway."
~~~~~~~ }<((((((o>
Completely FREE software:
http://www.pricelessware.org/thelist/index.htm
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

[RichToyBox]

Antibiotics work on bacteria, until resistance builds in. Many of the
antibiotics in use are of no use. The use of antibiotics in the pond is
really a poor investment. They will kill your filter which will cause
deterioration of the water quality, and poor water causes the fish to be
more susceptible to the bacteria than if they were left to their own
defenses. Antibiotic food has some marginal benefits, depending on the
antibiotic incorporated, if the fish will eat. Sick fish typically go off
their feed and you couldn't get them to eat shrimp, so the antibiotic food
doesn't do any good for them. Injectable antibiotics are really the best,
when antibiotics are needed. There are some new dips, which incorporate
some antibiotic with an activating agent that seem to work. Getting
injectibles usually entails having a very cooperative vet, since they are
not allowed to dispense without seeing the patient.
--
RichToyBox
http://www.geocities.com/richtoybox/pondintro.html

"Carl Beyer" > wrote in message
...
> Someone suggested that I should refrain from antibiotics due to the
> addition of new strains of viruses... I try avoid to antibiotics in my
> personal life as well so it got me thinking.
>
> When a human takes antibiotics, unless it is a shot, there is a regiment
> (6 to 10 pills) of medication that have to be taken (according to the
> doctor). Stopping the intake of the antibiotic can lead to stronger
> viruses and some other stuff I really don't understand (and maybe this
> whole theory is wrong as well?).
>
> So, do you have to keep giving fish Antibiotics if you start?
>
> Carl
>
> --
> --
> http://www.cobaltbluefilms.com

[~ jan JJsPond.us]

ajames,

Have you tested your water, and what did the test show? Inparticular I'd
like to know ammonia, nitrite, ph, KH & the temperature. ~ jan


See my ponds and filter design:
http://users.owt.com/jjspond/

~Keep 'em Wet!~
Tri-Cities WA Zone 7a
To e-mail see website

[~ jan JJsPond.us]

Oops, sorry ajames, I guess it was Carl with the problem, so:
>ajames,
>
Carl,
>Have you tested your water, and what did the test show? Inparticular I'd
>like to know ammonia, nitrite, ph, KH & the temperature. ~ jan
>
>
>See my ponds and filter design:
>http://users.owt.com/jjspond/
>
> ~Keep 'em Wet!~
> Tri-Cities WA Zone 7a
> To e-mail see website

~Power to the Porg, Flow On!~

[George]

"Carl Beyer" > wrote in message
...
> Someone suggested that I should refrain from antibiotics due to the
> addition of new strains of viruses... I try avoid to antibiotics in my
> personal life as well so it got me thinking.
>
> When a human takes antibiotics, unless it is a shot, there is a regiment
> (6 to 10 pills) of medication that have to be taken (according to the
> doctor). Stopping the intake of the antibiotic can lead to stronger
> viruses and some other stuff I really don't understand (and maybe this
> whole theory is wrong as well?).
>
> So, do you have to keep giving fish Antibiotics if you start?
>
> Carl
>
> --
> --
> http://www.cobaltbluefilms.com

First of all, antibiotics don't work on viruses, they work on bacteria.
Secondly, when you are administering antibiotics to fish, you should always
continue the treatment until completion. That is, if the instructions say to
give x amount over 7 days, that is what you should do. Always follow the
instructions on the package.

[Crashj]

On or about Thu, 13 Jan 2005 08:22:25 -0800, Carl Beyer
> wrote something like:

>Someone suggested that I should refrain from antibiotics due to the
>addition of new strains of viruses.
<>
>Stopping the intake of the antibiotic can lead to stronger
>viruses and some other stuff I really don't understand (and maybe this
>whole theory is wrong as well?).

Antibiotics are not aimed at virial targets, they are, well,
"anti-bacterial."
Antibiotics do not cause new strains of bacteria or virii.
So what was your question, again?
--
Crashj

[Lilly]

They DO create resistant strains of bacteria, aka "SuperBugs". More and
more antibiotics are becoming less and less capable of fixing what ails
us when it comes to bacterial infections. Just as alarming is the fact
that there are fewer and fewer "drugs of last resort".

Lilly

Crashj wrote:

> Antibiotics are not aimed at virial targets, they are, well,
> "anti-bacterial."
> Antibiotics do not cause new strains of bacteria or virii.
> So what was your question, again?
> --

[Cichlidiot]

Lilly > wrote:
> They DO create resistant strains of bacteria, aka "SuperBugs". More and
> more antibiotics are becoming less and less capable of fixing what ails
> us when it comes to bacterial infections. Just as alarming is the fact
> that there are fewer and fewer "drugs of last resort".

> Crashj wrote:

>> Antibiotics are not aimed at virial targets, they are, well,
>> "anti-bacterial."
>> Antibiotics do not cause new strains of bacteria or virii.
>> So what was your question, again?

Semantics issue. Antibiotics do not in and of themselves "create"
superbugs. What does happen is when someone does not take a course of
antibiotics correctly, the antibiotics will kill the most suspectible
bacteria in the doses they do take, but potentially won't kill the less
suspectible bacteria unless the full course is taken. Thus you are left
with the less suspectible bacteria that reproduce and, more often than
not, pass that tolerance to the antibiotics down to their offspring. So
over many generations of people not completing their antibiotic courses,
you get more and more specialized colonies of bacteria that can resist the
antibiotic. It's really just a selective pressure with a negative
consequence to humans.

To put it in pond terms, think of a pond with pond snails and ramshorn
snails. Say snail killer is added and kills off all the ramshorn snails,
but not all the pond snails. Now you have a pond full of pond snails. The
snail killer did not create the pond snails, that's just all that was left
behind after the treatment.

Of course the bacterial picture is more complex than this, particularly
when you consider that some bacteria can share genetic snippets with each
other. This is of course a random process, but there's the chance the
snippet relates to the drug resistance. Thus one little colony of
penicillin resistant bacteria might share the drug resistance snippet with
other neighboring colonies, creating more penicillin resistant colonies.
It's really all a matter of numbers. The more people that complete their
antibiotics course completely or don't needlessly use antibiotics, the
less likely this whole process is to happen due to a smaller potential
bacterial population exposed to these human-caused selective pressures.

[Lilly]

OK. You got me, a little. To use a different example, "guns don't kill
people, people kill people." The only difference here is the "weapon".
The end result is the same, harm to living beings. ;-)

Still, the idea that antibiotics are involved in creating superbugs is
valid IMO.

Lilly

Cichlidiot wrote:

> Semantics issue. Antibiotics do not in and of themselves "create"
> superbugs. What does happen is when someone does not take a course of
> antibiotics correctly, the antibiotics will kill the most suspectible
> bacteria in the doses they do take, but potentially won't kill the
less
> suspectible bacteria unless the full course is taken. Thus you are
left
> with the less suspectible bacteria that reproduce and, more often
than
> not, pass that tolerance to the antibiotics down to their offspring.
So
> over many generations of people not completing their antibiotic
courses,
> you get more and more specialized colonies of bacteria that can
resist the
> antibiotic. It's really just a selective pressure with a negative
> consequence to humans.

[Benign Vanilla]

"Lilly" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> OK. You got me, a little. To use a different example, "guns don't kill
> people, people kill people." The only difference here is the "weapon".
> The end result is the same, harm to living beings. ;-)
<snip>

Actually, not to nit pick, but it's the bullets. :)


--
BV
Webporgmaster of iheartmypond.com
http://www.iheartmypond.com
I'll be leaning on the bus stop post.

[2pods]

"Benign Vanilla" > wrote in message
...
>
> "Lilly" > wrote in message
> oups.com...
>> OK. You got me, a little. To use a different example, "guns don't kill
>> people, people kill people." The only difference here is the "weapon".
>> The end result is the same, harm to living beings. ;-)
> <snip>
>
> Actually, not to nit pick, but it's the bullets. :)


To quote Alex Harvey
"Don't make any bullets, dont buy any bullets, don't shoot any bullets, and
when you get your freedom, don't p**s in the water supply "

Peter