Tropical Aquarium in a Pond?

[David]

I can already hear the howls of derision, and taste the flames of
scorn <g>.

Don't get me wrong -- I like koi. However, I also find the extremely
large variety of tropical freshwater fish fascinating. So I am
wondering whether it might be possible to bring the worlds of ponding,
water gardening, and tropical aquaria together in the same place? Has
anyone in the group ever attempted this, or know of anyone who has?

The first obvious (and reasonable) question would be, "why would you
want to do this, you couldn't see them? -- you can see koi." Well,
suppose one side of the pond was next to your living room, and had
windows into it. Like, well, the aquarium at your local zoo? (I'd
rather not get into all the practical issues of design and engineering
yet -- I'm only just starting to think at the very conceptual
top-level.)

The next obvious (and reasonable) question would be, "what happens
when all these tropical fish are subjected to freezing temperatures?"
Well, suppose this affair was to be installed in S.E. Asia, where it
never freezes. (Which if this thinking works out, will be the case.)

If you haven't lost interest by now, and already gone on the the next
post, we are now at the crux of the matter. It would appear to me
that this concept would have to deal with at least all of the same
issues that a koi ponder would have to address. Plus, the additional
untidy little detail of, "how do you keep all these cute little fish
from being sucked into and lost or chewed up in all of the ponding
apparatus?"

I have gone through many of the designs in rec.ponds, and in AWGS and
Koiphen, and this has been a very interesting and enlightening
experience for an (obvious) newcomer. I think some of this hardware
technology, and the bio-filtration systems are just wonderful! But is
it possible to apply it to little fishes? Is there a way to keep them
from all being sucked into a Savio skimmer, or a Spindrifter bottom
drain?

Is there any wishful hope that fishes generally tend to avoid things
that try to suck them in??? Or are completely different kinds of
filtration, (and a whole lot more manual effort) going to be
necessary?

(After, {if?}, I hear from anyone in this group, I will address
something like this to rec.aquaria.freshwater -- however, conversely,
they won't know anything about all of this wonderful ponding
technology that is available.)

Thank you for all your endurance if you have made it this far with me.
And most certainly, thank you for any thoughts.

Regards,
David

[ajames54]

Well with the exception of the window which will be expensive but not
too difficult technically, you do a good job of describing most
tropical fish breeding facilities.

However I would bet you are looking at more trouble than its worth.. a
250 gallon tank mounted into the wall can be protected from the
elements .. No huge temp swings, no falling leaves, no flooding the
fish out into the yard, no predetors... and no giant insurance premiums
to cover potential water damage to your house.

anything filter related in ponding is also available for aquaria check
the aquaria groups and check www.thekrib.com.
If you decide to do it have fun and post pics...

[Derek Broughton]

David wrote:

> I can already hear the howls of derision, and taste the flames of
> scorn <g>.

Oh, no. Many of us would _love_ to keep tropicals in a pond.
Unfortunately, with the majority of posters being in N. America and Europe,
this just isn't possible except for a very few of us.

> Don't get me wrong -- I like koi. However, I also find the extremely
> large variety of tropical freshwater fish fascinating. So I am
> wondering whether it might be possible to bring the worlds of ponding,
> water gardening, and tropical aquaria together in the same place? Has
> anyone in the group ever attempted this, or know of anyone who has?

I know there are people in Florida and California who have posted here with
Cichlid and Pleco successes.
>
> The next obvious (and reasonable) question would be, "what happens
> when all these tropical fish are subjected to freezing temperatures?"
> Well, suppose this affair was to be installed in S.E. Asia, where it
> never freezes. (Which if this thinking works out, will be the case.)

Huge numbers of the tropical fish that are sold in N. America have been
raised in ponds in SE Asia.

> If you haven't lost interest by now, and already gone on the the next
> post, we are now at the crux of the matter. It would appear to me
> that this concept would have to deal with at least all of the same
> issues that a koi ponder would have to address. Plus, the additional
> untidy little detail of, "how do you keep all these cute little fish
> from being sucked into and lost or chewed up in all of the ponding
> apparatus?"

Why? Fish _do_ get sucked up in the pumps, but the flow through your
average pond is far less than even a fairly slow moving stream, so it's
pretty infrequent. The fact that they're tropicals rather than koi is
pretty irrelevant.

> Is there any wishful hope that fishes generally tend to avoid things
> that try to suck them in???

I'd say so. Fish may have very _small_ brains, but why would they want to
be sucked into a black hole, that leads to no known source of food or sex
(of course, if the finny object of their desires already got sucked in, all
bets are off :-))

Go for it!
--
derek

[Bob Koerber]

I see absolutly nothing wrong with it. I have a 3000 gallon pond that
is inside my heated greenhouse. Between my mechanical and veggie filter
I have maintained crystal clear water for over 4 years. Although I have
koi and goldfish you would be able to see any fish down to the bottom.
Dream and enjoy that's what it is all about.

Bob

[Bill Stock]

"David" > wrote in message
...
>I can already hear the howls of derision, and taste the flames of
> scorn <g>.
>
> Don't get me wrong -- I like koi. However, I also find the extremely
> large variety of tropical freshwater fish fascinating. So I am
> wondering whether it might be possible to bring the worlds of ponding,
> water gardening, and tropical aquaria together in the same place? Has
> anyone in the group ever attempted this, or know of anyone who has?
>
> The first obvious (and reasonable) question would be, "why would you
> want to do this, you couldn't see them? -- you can see koi." Well,
> suppose one side of the pond was next to your living room, and had
> windows into it. Like, well, the aquarium at your local zoo? (I'd
> rather not get into all the practical issues of design and engineering
> yet -- I'm only just starting to think at the very conceptual
> top-level.)
>
> The next obvious (and reasonable) question would be, "what happens
> when all these tropical fish are subjected to freezing temperatures?"
> Well, suppose this affair was to be installed in S.E. Asia, where it
> never freezes. (Which if this thinking works out, will be the case.)
>
> If you haven't lost interest by now, and already gone on the the next
> post, we are now at the crux of the matter. It would appear to me
> that this concept would have to deal with at least all of the same
> issues that a koi ponder would have to address. Plus, the additional
> untidy little detail of, "how do you keep all these cute little fish
> from being sucked into and lost or chewed up in all of the ponding
> apparatus?"
>
> I have gone through many of the designs in rec.ponds, and in AWGS and
> Koiphen, and this has been a very interesting and enlightening
> experience for an (obvious) newcomer. I think some of this hardware
> technology, and the bio-filtration systems are just wonderful! But is
> it possible to apply it to little fishes? Is there a way to keep them
> from all being sucked into a Savio skimmer, or a Spindrifter bottom
> drain?
>
> Is there any wishful hope that fishes generally tend to avoid things
> that try to suck them in??? Or are completely different kinds of
> filtration, (and a whole lot more manual effort) going to be
> necessary?
>
> (After, {if?}, I hear from anyone in this group, I will address
> something like this to rec.aquaria.freshwater -- however, conversely,
> they won't know anything about all of this wonderful ponding
> technology that is available.)
>
> Thank you for all your endurance if you have made it this far with me.
> And most certainly, thank you for any thoughts.
>
> Regards,
> David

Sounds like a good project.

I always thought it would be cool to have an indoor/outdoor pond. So the
fish could come and go between the house and outside. But living in the
Frozen North, this would be a seasonal project. Of course, I would stock it
with KOI! :)

[John Hines]

David > wrote:

>The next obvious (and reasonable) question would be, "what happens
>when all these tropical fish are subjected to freezing temperatures?"
>Well, suppose this affair was to be installed in S.E. Asia, where it
>never freezes. (Which if this thinking works out, will be the case.)

They die. That is why they (tropicals) live where it don't freeze.

Temperate fish live where it freezes.

You could stock something like sunfish, or bass, catfish, pike, muskies,
etc, in addition to your koi, assuming they (koi) are big enough not to
be eaten.

[George]

"ajames54" > wrote in message
ups.com...
> Well with the exception of the window which will be expensive but not
> too difficult technically, you do a good job of describing most
> tropical fish breeding facilities.
>
> However I would bet you are looking at more trouble than its worth.. a
> 250 gallon tank mounted into the wall can be protected from the
> elements .. No huge temp swings, no falling leaves, no flooding the
> fish out into the yard, no predetors... and no giant insurance premiums
> to cover potential water damage to your house.
>
> anything filter related in ponding is also available for aquaria check
> the aquaria groups and check www.thekrib.com.
> If you decide to do it have fun and post pics...

An additional concern is for these fish to 'inadvertantly' enter the local
ecosystem, where, as is the case in Florida and other "warm" states, has had
devastating results for the local fauna.

[San Diego Joe]

"David" wrote:

> I can already hear the howls of derision, and taste the flames of
> scorn <g>.
>
> snip
>
> The next obvious (and reasonable) question would be, "what happens
> when all these tropical fish are subjected to freezing temperatures?"
> Well, suppose this affair was to be installed in S.E. Asia, where it
> never freezes. (Which if this thinking works out, will be the case.)

I live in San Diego, with no frost. I kept an Oscar in my pond from May thru
October then bring him inside. I placed some platties in the pond in June to
see how they would do. There are a couple left. My water - at it's coldest
point - hits about 50 F. That's way too cold for the Oscar. I lost a lot of
platties when that temperature went over a few weeks.

It's not if it never freezes, it's, "what will the minimum water temp be.
>
> If you haven't lost interest by now, and already gone on the the next
> post, we are now at the crux of the matter. It would appear to me
> that this concept would have to deal with at least all of the same
> issues that a koi ponder would have to address. Plus, the additional
> untidy little detail of, "how do you keep all these cute little fish
> from being sucked into and lost or chewed up in all of the ponding
> apparatus?"

I have a net in my skimmer to stop that. There were very few that I found in
the net. So I think they figure it out. Most skimmers I have seen on the
market today have such a net built in.
>
> I have gone through many of the designs in rec.ponds, and in AWGS and
> Koiphen, and this has been a very interesting and enlightening
> experience for an (obvious) newcomer. I think some of this hardware
> technology, and the bio-filtration systems are just wonderful! But is
> it possible to apply it to little fishes? Is there a way to keep them
> from all being sucked into a Savio skimmer, or a Spindrifter bottom
> drain?
See net, above.
>
> Is there any wishful hope that fishes generally tend to avoid things
> that try to suck them in??? Or are completely different kinds of
> filtration, (and a whole lot more manual effort) going to be
> necessary?
Ditto
>
> (After, {if?}, I hear from anyone in this group, I will address
> something like this to rec.aquaria.freshwater -- however, conversely,
> they won't know anything about all of this wonderful ponding
> technology that is available.)
>
> Thank you for all your endurance if you have made it this far with me.
> And most certainly, thank you for any thoughts.
>
> Regards,
> David
>
>


San Diego Joe
4,000 - 5,000 Gallons.
Goldfish, a RES named Colombo and an Oscar.



----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==----
http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! >100,000 Newsgroups
---= East/West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =---

[John Hines]

"George" > wrote:

>
>"ajames54" > wrote in message
ups.com...
>> Well with the exception of the window which will be expensive but not
>> too difficult technically, you do a good job of describing most
>> tropical fish breeding facilities.
>>
>> However I would bet you are looking at more trouble than its worth.. a
>> 250 gallon tank mounted into the wall can be protected from the
>> elements .. No huge temp swings, no falling leaves, no flooding the
>> fish out into the yard, no predetors... and no giant insurance premiums
>> to cover potential water damage to your house.
>>
>> anything filter related in ponding is also available for aquaria check
>> the aquaria groups and check www.thekrib.com.
>> If you decide to do it have fun and post pics...
>
>An additional concern is for these fish to 'inadvertantly' enter the local
>ecosystem, where, as is the case in Florida and other "warm" states, has had
>devastating results for the local fauna.

Oh, yeah I forgot about snakeheads, They would be great in a pond.
(NOT!)

[John Hines]

David > wrote:

>The first obvious (and reasonable) question would be, "why would you
>want to do this, you couldn't see them? -- you can see koi." Well,
>suppose one side of the pond was next to your living room, and had
>windows into it. Like, well, the aquarium at your local zoo?

How about a cheap LCD camera, placed in a Plexiglas enclosure, that is
submersed in the pond? Run this to an RF modulator, and put it on you
TV on an unused channel, to your existing TV's.

>(I'd
>rather not get into all the practical issues of design and engineering
>yet -- I'm only just starting to think at the very conceptual
>top-level.)

It is a lot easier to keep a camera alive, and not all that hard to
remote. <G> Many of them will work with IR lights, so as to not disturb
the fishies as they sleep. IR LEDS could provide cheap illumination.

[Crashj]

On or about Tue, 25 Jan 2005 09:59:06 -0700, David
> wrote something like:

>I can already hear the howls of derision, and taste the flames of
>scorn <g>.
>
>Don't get me wrong -- I like koi. However, I also find the extremely
>large variety of tropical freshwater fish fascinating. So I am
>wondering whether it might be possible to bring the worlds of ponding,
>water gardening, and tropical aquaria together in the same place? <>

My ideal for this large outdoor aquarium would be a house on the Great
Barrier Reef with a glass window in the basement.
"World's Largest"
--
Crashj

[George]

"John Hines" > wrote in message
...
> "George" > wrote:
>
>>
>>"ajames54" > wrote in message
ups.com...
>>> Well with the exception of the window which will be expensive but not
>>> too difficult technically, you do a good job of describing most
>>> tropical fish breeding facilities.
>>>
>>> However I would bet you are looking at more trouble than its worth.. a
>>> 250 gallon tank mounted into the wall can be protected from the
>>> elements .. No huge temp swings, no falling leaves, no flooding the
>>> fish out into the yard, no predetors... and no giant insurance premiums
>>> to cover potential water damage to your house.
>>>
>>> anything filter related in ponding is also available for aquaria check
>>> the aquaria groups and check www.thekrib.com.
>>> If you decide to do it have fun and post pics...
>>
>>An additional concern is for these fish to 'inadvertantly' enter the local
>>ecosystem, where, as is the case in Florida and other "warm" states, has had
>>devastating results for the local fauna.
>
> Oh, yeah I forgot about snakeheads, They would be great in a pond.
> (NOT!)

I thought of that too, but I was really thinking about fish like Tilapia, which
have caused a lot of problems in Florida.

[George]

"John Hines" > wrote in message
...
> David > wrote:
>
>>The first obvious (and reasonable) question would be, "why would you
>>want to do this, you couldn't see them? -- you can see koi." Well,
>>suppose one side of the pond was next to your living room, and had
>>windows into it. Like, well, the aquarium at your local zoo?
>
> How about a cheap LCD camera, placed in a Plexiglas enclosure, that is
> submersed in the pond? Run this to an RF modulator, and put it on you
> TV on an unused channel, to your existing TV's.

Interesting Idea. Or you could use an old digital web camera, and broadcast it
over the internet.

>>(I'd
>>rather not get into all the practical issues of design and engineering
>>yet -- I'm only just starting to think at the very conceptual
>>top-level.)
>
> It is a lot easier to keep a camera alive, and not all that hard to
> remote. <G> Many of them will work with IR lights, so as to not disturb
> the fishies as they sleep. IR LEDS could provide cheap illumination.

[ajames54]

Mine is going to be in either Costa Rica or the Keys...

[Derek Broughton]

George wrote:

> An additional concern is for these fish to 'inadvertantly' enter the local
> ecosystem, where, as is the case in Florida and other "warm" states, has
> had devastating results for the local fauna.

Hardly. Tropical fish don't survive long even in Florida. Temperate &
sub-tropical fish are the real problem. Koi are far more of a threat than
tropicals.
--
derek

[George]

"Derek Broughton" > wrote in message
...
> George wrote:
>
>> An additional concern is for these fish to 'inadvertantly' enter the local
>> ecosystem, where, as is the case in Florida and other "warm" states, has
>> had devastating results for the local fauna.
>
> Hardly. Tropical fish don't survive long even in Florida. Temperate &
> sub-tropical fish are the real problem. Koi are far more of a threat than
> tropicals.
> --
> derek

It is a well known fact that tilapia have create a huge problem in South
Florida. They are surviving in the wild there, and have been displacing native
species of both fish and vegetation.

[Tom L. La Bron]

So are a number of the Cichlid species which now are Game fish in Florida.

Tom L.L.
-----------------------------------
"George" > wrote in message
news:GfSJd.22151$yY6.20422@attbi_s02...
>
> "Derek Broughton" > wrote in message
> ...
>> George wrote:
>>
>>> An additional concern is for these fish to 'inadvertantly' enter the
>>> local
>>> ecosystem, where, as is the case in Florida and other "warm" states, has
>>> had devastating results for the local fauna.
>>
>> Hardly. Tropical fish don't survive long even in Florida. Temperate &
>> sub-tropical fish are the real problem. Koi are far more of a threat
>> than
>> tropicals.
>> --
>> derek
>
> It is a well known fact that tilapia have create a huge problem in South
> Florida. They are surviving in the wild there, and have been displacing
> native species of both fish and vegetation.
>

[Tom L. La Bron]

David,

This is not hat hard to realize. I sometimes put my Clown loaches outside
in the Summer, but you have to make sure that it is at a time when the
temperatures are suitable for the fish you are putting in the pond. When I
put the clowns outside the water has to be at least a stable 75 degrees all
the time. You can do this with any species, but the problem is getting them
back out of the pond when the temperatures start falling again. Clowns are
extremely hard to catch especially after the freedom of a good quantity of
water. I usually have to virtually drain the pond to get them out.

The advantage of KOI and Goldfish for the pond culture is that they can be
enjoyed from looking down on them from above, while tropicals kind of
disappear into the pond. I had six Clowns in the pond and virtually didn't
know if they all had made it until the early fall when I drained the pond to
get them out.

Tom L.L.
---------------------------------------
"David" > wrote in message
...
>I can already hear the howls of derision, and taste the flames of
> scorn <g>.
>
> Don't get me wrong -- I like koi. However, I also find the extremely
> large variety of tropical freshwater fish fascinating. So I am
> wondering whether it might be possible to bring the worlds of ponding,
> water gardening, and tropical aquaria together in the same place? Has
> anyone in the group ever attempted this, or know of anyone who has?
>
> The first obvious (and reasonable) question would be, "why would you
> want to do this, you couldn't see them? -- you can see koi." Well,
> suppose one side of the pond was next to your living room, and had
> windows into it. Like, well, the aquarium at your local zoo? (I'd
> rather not get into all the practical issues of design and engineering
> yet -- I'm only just starting to think at the very conceptual
> top-level.)
>
> The next obvious (and reasonable) question would be, "what happens
> when all these tropical fish are subjected to freezing temperatures?"
> Well, suppose this affair was to be installed in S.E. Asia, where it
> never freezes. (Which if this thinking works out, will be the case.)
>
> If you haven't lost interest by now, and already gone on the the next
> post, we are now at the crux of the matter. It would appear to me
> that this concept would have to deal with at least all of the same
> issues that a koi ponder would have to address. Plus, the additional
> untidy little detail of, "how do you keep all these cute little fish
> from being sucked into and lost or chewed up in all of the ponding
> apparatus?"
>
> I have gone through many of the designs in rec.ponds, and in AWGS and
> Koiphen, and this has been a very interesting and enlightening
> experience for an (obvious) newcomer. I think some of this hardware
> technology, and the bio-filtration systems are just wonderful! But is
> it possible to apply it to little fishes? Is there a way to keep them
> from all being sucked into a Savio skimmer, or a Spindrifter bottom
> drain?
>
> Is there any wishful hope that fishes generally tend to avoid things
> that try to suck them in??? Or are completely different kinds of
> filtration, (and a whole lot more manual effort) going to be
> necessary?
>
> (After, {if?}, I hear from anyone in this group, I will address
> something like this to rec.aquaria.freshwater -- however, conversely,
> they won't know anything about all of this wonderful ponding
> technology that is available.)
>
> Thank you for all your endurance if you have made it this far with me.
> And most certainly, thank you for any thoughts.
>
> Regards,
> David
>
>

[Derek Broughton]

George wrote:

> "Derek Broughton" > wrote in message
> ...
>> George wrote:
>>
>>> An additional concern is for these fish to 'inadvertantly' enter the
>>> local ecosystem, where, as is the case in Florida and other "warm"
>>> states, has had devastating results for the local fauna.
>>
>> Hardly. Tropical fish don't survive long even in Florida. Temperate &
>> sub-tropical fish are the real problem. Koi are far more of a threat
>> than tropicals.
>
> It is a well known fact that tilapia have create a huge problem in South
> Florida. They are surviving in the wild there, and have been displacing
> native species of both fish and vegetation.

That's because Tilapia are a sub-tropical species, and Florida is just like
home for them. _Tropicals_ wouldn't be a problem in Florida. However, you
didn't bother to read what the OP said - he's in SE Asia, where it _is_
tropical, so it's still an issue, but no more so than escaped koi in
temperate climes.
--
derek

[George]

"Derek Broughton" > wrote in message
...
> George wrote:
>
>> "Derek Broughton" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>> George wrote:
>>>
>>>> An additional concern is for these fish to 'inadvertantly' enter the
>>>> local ecosystem, where, as is the case in Florida and other "warm"
>>>> states, has had devastating results for the local fauna.
>>>
>>> Hardly. Tropical fish don't survive long even in Florida. Temperate &
>>> sub-tropical fish are the real problem. Koi are far more of a threat
>>> than tropicals.
>>
>> It is a well known fact that tilapia have create a huge problem in South
>> Florida. They are surviving in the wild there, and have been displacing
>> native species of both fish and vegetation.
>
> That's because Tilapia are a sub-tropical species, and Florida is just like
> home for them. _Tropicals_ wouldn't be a problem in Florida. However, you
> didn't bother to read what the OP said - he's in SE Asia, where it _is_
> tropical, so it's still an issue, but no more so than escaped koi in
> temperate climes.
> --
> derek

Oh I agree. I was just pointing out that it is an issue that should be
considered.

[David]

On Wed, 26 Jan 2005 22:22:24 -0600, "Tom L. La Bron"
> wrote:

>David,
>
>This is not hat hard to realize. I sometimes put my Clown loaches outside
>in the Summer, but you have to make sure that it is at a time when the
>temperatures are suitable for the fish you are putting in the pond. When I
>put the clowns outside the water has to be at least a stable 75 degrees all
>the time. You can do this with any species, but the problem is getting them
>back out of the pond when the temperatures start falling again. Clowns are
>extremely hard to catch especially after the freedom of a good quantity of
>water. I usually have to virtually drain the pond to get them out.
>
>The advantage of KOI and Goldfish for the pond culture is that they can be
>enjoyed from looking down on them from above, while tropicals kind of
>disappear into the pond.
You have hit the nail precisely on the head there Tom. That indeed
is the reason for my thinking about this concept..
And the fact that we are talking S.E. Asia means, at least
temperature-wise, that I *shouldn't have to* catch them...

> I had six Clowns in the pond and virtually didn't
>know if they all had made it until the early fall when I drained the pond to
>get them out.
>
>Tom L.L.
>---------------------------------------
>"David" > wrote in message
...
>>I can already hear the howls of derision, and taste the flames of
>> scorn <g>.
>>
>> Don't get me wrong -- I like koi. However, I also find the extremely
>> large variety of tropical freshwater fish fascinating. So I am
>> wondering whether it might be possible to bring the worlds of ponding,
>> water gardening, and tropical aquaria together in the same place? Has
>> anyone in the group ever attempted this, or know of anyone who has?
>>
>> The first obvious (and reasonable) question would be, "why would you
>> want to do this, you couldn't see them? -- you can see koi." Well,
>> suppose one side of the pond was next to your living room, and had
>> windows into it. Like, well, the aquarium at your local zoo? (I'd
>> rather not get into all the practical issues of design and engineering
>> yet -- I'm only just starting to think at the very conceptual
>> top-level.)
>>
>> The next obvious (and reasonable) question would be, "what happens
>> when all these tropical fish are subjected to freezing temperatures?"
>> Well, suppose this affair was to be installed in S.E. Asia, where it
>> never freezes. (Which if this thinking works out, will be the case.)
>>
>> If you haven't lost interest by now, and already gone on the the next
>> post, we are now at the crux of the matter. It would appear to me
>> that this concept would have to deal with at least all of the same
>> issues that a koi ponder would have to address. Plus, the additional
>> untidy little detail of, "how do you keep all these cute little fish
>> from being sucked into and lost or chewed up in all of the ponding
>> apparatus?"
>>
>> I have gone through many of the designs in rec.ponds, and in AWGS and
>> Koiphen, and this has been a very interesting and enlightening
>> experience for an (obvious) newcomer. I think some of this hardware
>> technology, and the bio-filtration systems are just wonderful! But is
>> it possible to apply it to little fishes? Is there a way to keep them
>> from all being sucked into a Savio skimmer, or a Spindrifter bottom
>> drain?
>>
>> Is there any wishful hope that fishes generally tend to avoid things
>> that try to suck them in??? Or are completely different kinds of
>> filtration, (and a whole lot more manual effort) going to be
>> necessary?
>>
>> (After, {if?}, I hear from anyone in this group, I will address
>> something like this to rec.aquaria.freshwater -- however, conversely,
>> they won't know anything about all of this wonderful ponding
>> technology that is available.)
>>
>> Thank you for all your endurance if you have made it this far with me.
>> And most certainly, thank you for any thoughts.
>>
>> Regards,
>> David
>>
>>
>

[David]

On 25 Jan 2005 09:15:40 -0800, "ajames54" >
wrote:

>Well with the exception of the window which will be expensive but not
>too difficult technically, you do a good job of describing most
>tropical fish breeding facilities.
I hadn't even thought about that, Ajames!! So, clearly I need to
visit some of them.
>
>However I would bet you are looking at more trouble than its worth.. a
>250 gallon tank mounted into the wall can be protected from the
>elements .. No huge temp swings, no falling leaves, no flooding the
>fish out into the yard, no predetors... and no giant insurance premiums
>to cover potential water damage to your house.
See, you are much more practical than I!!
I guess it's kind of like the question, "why do people climb
mountains" isn't it? IMHO, there are certainly more practical, (and
prudent) ways to spend one's time! (And I've climbed a few <g>)
>
>anything filter related in ponding is also available for aquaria check
>the aquaria groups and check www.thekrib.com.
I am, thanks!
>If you decide to do it have fun and post pics...
I shall.
~~David

[David]

On Tue, 25 Jan 2005 22:35:33 GMT, "George"
> wrote:

>
>An additional concern is for these fish to 'inadvertantly' enter the local
>ecosystem, where, as is the case in Florida and other "warm" states, has had
>devastating results for the local fauna.
>
Your point is well-taken George, *and applauded*!!
I am sure that it becomes a very difficult decision for aquarists --
"how do I properly dispose of these pets that have accumulated under
my watch?"
But protecting the local ecology has to come first!!

[David]

On Tue, 25 Jan 2005 13:52:00 -0400, Derek Broughton
> wrote:

>
>Huge numbers of the tropical fish that are sold in N. America have been
>raised in ponds in SE Asia.
>
When you visit the street markets over there (somewhat comparable to
our "flea" markets), you find literally hundreds of vendors selling
tropical fish, aquariums, and supplies. You can buy individual fish,
selected from tanks; however the "economy paks" are bags of one or two
dozen or so, of the same species, inflated with oxygen I assume, and
sealed. I counted well over a hundred different varieties of fish in
such bags at one vendor's stand. A bagful is maybe $2-3, depending on
the species.

[David]

On Wed, 26 Jan 2005 00:22:58 GMT, Crashj
> wrote:

>On or about Tue, 25 Jan 2005 09:59:06 -0700, David
> wrote something like:
>
>>I can already hear the howls of derision, and taste the flames of
>>scorn <g>.
>>
>>Don't get me wrong -- I like koi. However, I also find the extremely
>>large variety of tropical freshwater fish fascinating. So I am
>>wondering whether it might be possible to bring the worlds of ponding,
>>water gardening, and tropical aquaria together in the same place? <>
>
>My ideal for this large outdoor aquarium would be a house on the Great
>Barrier Reef with a glass window in the basement.
>"World's Largest"

I like the idea. I have skippered, and anchored overnight a few times
out there; but I don't think the Aussie gov't will be permitting house
construction anytime soon... With mask and fins though, it's next
best.

[Crashj]

On or about Fri, 28 Jan 2005 07:18:29 -0700, David
> wrote something like:

>On Tue, 25 Jan 2005 22:35:33 GMT, "George"
> wrote:
>
>>
>>An additional concern is for these fish to 'inadvertantly' enter the local
>>ecosystem
<>
>"how do I properly dispose of these pets that have accumulated under
>my watch?"

Remove your watch and scrub carefully.
--
Crashj