Finaly------No Ammonia!

[Richard Holub]

For anyone who was following my topic on "lots of ammonia" here are my
results and time table:

12/22/04---------------New 160 gal. pond.
DATE TEMP pH Ammonia Nitrite Nitrate
12/22/04----68 F----7.5-----0.00-------0.00----0.00
12/24/04----70 F----7.2-----0.25-------0.00----5.00
12/26/04----68 F----7.2-----1.00-------0.00----5.00
12/29/04----68 F----7.2-----1.00-------0.00----2.50
12/30/04----68 F----7.2-----2.00-------0.00----5.00
12/30/04----68 F----7.2-----2.00-------0.00----2.50
01/02/05----66 F----7.4-----2.00-------0.00----0.00

added AMMOLOCK and 88% water change

01/05/05----70 F----7.2-----0.50-------0.00----0.00
01/18/05----72 F----7.2-----2.00-------0.00----0.00

88% water change

01/21/05----70 F----7.4-----0.50-------0.00----0.00
01/24/05----74 F----7.2-----2.00-------0.00----0.00

added CYCLE to increase nitrite. No more water changes.

01/29/05----72 F----7.2-----1.00-------0.00----0.00
02/03/05----72 F----7.2-----4.00-------0.00----0.00
02/07/05----72 F----7.2-----4.00-------0.00----5.00
02/09/05----72 F----7.2-----8.00-------0.00----10.0
02/11/05----74 F----7.2-----4.00-------0.00----10.0
02/16/05----74 F----6.0-----2.00-------2.00----20.0
02/17/05----74 F----6.8-----1.00-------2.00----5.00
02/23/05----70 F----6.4-----0.25-------0.50----40.0
02/27/05----70 F----7.2-----0.00-------0.00----40.0

NOTES: Time frame = 9 -10 week period.
Notice no nitrite readings till 02/16/05.
Nitrate readings before nitrite readings.
Nitrite levels from start to finish = ~11 days.

Hope this helps incase someone is going through a new setup.

Rich

[humBill]

"Richard Holub" > wrote in message
...
> For anyone who was following my topic on "lots of ammonia" here are my
> results and time table:
>
> 12/22/04---------------New 160 gal. pond.
> DATE TEMP pH Ammonia Nitrite Nitrate
> 12/22/04----68 F----7.5-----0.00-------0.00----0.00
> 12/24/04----70 F----7.2-----0.25-------0.00----5.00
> 12/26/04----68 F----7.2-----1.00-------0.00----5.00
> 12/29/04----68 F----7.2-----1.00-------0.00----2.50
> 12/30/04----68 F----7.2-----2.00-------0.00----5.00
> 12/30/04----68 F----7.2-----2.00-------0.00----2.50
> 01/02/05----66 F----7.4-----2.00-------0.00----0.00
>
> added AMMOLOCK and 88% water change
>
> 01/05/05----70 F----7.2-----0.50-------0.00----0.00
> 01/18/05----72 F----7.2-----2.00-------0.00----0.00
>
> 88% water change
>
> 01/21/05----70 F----7.4-----0.50-------0.00----0.00
> 01/24/05----74 F----7.2-----2.00-------0.00----0.00
>
> added CYCLE to increase nitrite. No more water changes.
>
> 01/29/05----72 F----7.2-----1.00-------0.00----0.00
> 02/03/05----72 F----7.2-----4.00-------0.00----0.00
> 02/07/05----72 F----7.2-----4.00-------0.00----5.00
> 02/09/05----72 F----7.2-----8.00-------0.00----10.0
> 02/11/05----74 F----7.2-----4.00-------0.00----10.0
> 02/16/05----74 F----6.0-----2.00-------2.00----20.0
> 02/17/05----74 F----6.8-----1.00-------2.00----5.00
> 02/23/05----70 F----6.4-----0.25-------0.50----40.0
> 02/27/05----70 F----7.2-----0.00-------0.00----40.0
>
> NOTES: Time frame = 9 -10 week period.
> Notice no nitrite readings till 02/16/05.
> Nitrate readings before nitrite readings.
> Nitrite levels from start to finish = ~11 days.
>
> Hope this helps incase someone is going through a new setup.
>
> Rich
>
I am definitely no expert, but IMHO those are some goofy numbers Rich. I
would make sure your test kits are not old and you are not contaminating
them. Even if they are correct I think you still have some work to do. You
dont give a kH or gH reading. It would seem they are not very high or your
pH would not be bouncing around like that. Rapid changes in pH and going
from 5-40 nitrates in 6 days could definitely be problematic/stressful/fatal
for your unmentioned fish. Not trying to be a downer, just wanted to make
sure you know 0 Am and Nitrites is not the only goal. HTH
Bill

[Richard Holub]

I only tested for GH & KH on 01/24/05. Readings = 89.5-GH & 71.5-KH. My
test kit is only a couple of months old and I use it to test my 55 gal. fish
tank which contain mollies. The pond is 160 gal. and contains four 10" koi.
Both tests for the pond and the aquarium are totaly different so I know that
the tests are "true". The aquarium used to house the koi for about one
month when they were 4" long. They outgrew the tank quickly so I built the
pond in the cellar.

You are right, my pH does change rapidly and I am still trying to figure
this out. If you notice...the pH was pretty steady at first. The changes
started once the nitrite started to increase. At that point the nitrate
also changed (up) and the ammonia (down). I increased the pH from 6.0 to
6.8on 02.23.05 with sodium bicarbonate. I did it again on 02/23/05 from 6.4
to 7.2. I have been using "BULLSEYE 7.0" to maintain my pH but it is too
early to try, I think. I will keep an eye on my pH for now and see.

Rich
"humBill" > wrote in message
om...
>
> "Richard Holub" > wrote in message
> ...
>> For anyone who was following my topic on "lots of ammonia" here are my
>> results and time table:
>>
>> 12/22/04---------------New 160 gal. pond.
>> DATE TEMP pH Ammonia Nitrite Nitrate
>> 12/22/04----68 F----7.5-----0.00-------0.00----0.00
>> 12/24/04----70 F----7.2-----0.25-------0.00----5.00
>> 12/26/04----68 F----7.2-----1.00-------0.00----5.00
>> 12/29/04----68 F----7.2-----1.00-------0.00----2.50
>> 12/30/04----68 F----7.2-----2.00-------0.00----5.00
>> 12/30/04----68 F----7.2-----2.00-------0.00----2.50
>> 01/02/05----66 F----7.4-----2.00-------0.00----0.00
>>
>> added AMMOLOCK and 88% water change
>>
>> 01/05/05----70 F----7.2-----0.50-------0.00----0.00
>> 01/18/05----72 F----7.2-----2.00-------0.00----0.00
>>
>> 88% water change
>>
>> 01/21/05----70 F----7.4-----0.50-------0.00----0.00
>> 01/24/05----74 F----7.2-----2.00-------0.00----0.00
>>
>> added CYCLE to increase nitrite. No more water changes.
>>
>> 01/29/05----72 F----7.2-----1.00-------0.00----0.00
>> 02/03/05----72 F----7.2-----4.00-------0.00----0.00
>> 02/07/05----72 F----7.2-----4.00-------0.00----5.00
>> 02/09/05----72 F----7.2-----8.00-------0.00----10.0
>> 02/11/05----74 F----7.2-----4.00-------0.00----10.0
>> 02/16/05----74 F----6.0-----2.00-------2.00----20.0
>> 02/17/05----74 F----6.8-----1.00-------2.00----5.00
>> 02/23/05----70 F----6.4-----0.25-------0.50----40.0
>> 02/27/05----70 F----7.2-----0.00-------0.00----40.0
>>
>> NOTES: Time frame = 9 -10 week period.
>> Notice no nitrite readings till 02/16/05.
>> Nitrate readings before nitrite readings.
>> Nitrite levels from start to finish = ~11 days.
>>
>> Hope this helps incase someone is going through a new setup.
>>
>> Rich
>>
> I am definitely no expert, but IMHO those are some goofy numbers Rich. I
> would make sure your test kits are not old and you are not contaminating
> them. Even if they are correct I think you still have some work to do.
> You dont give a kH or gH reading. It would seem they are not very high or
> your pH would not be bouncing around like that. Rapid changes in pH and
> going from 5-40 nitrates in 6 days could definitely be
> problematic/stressful/fatal for your unmentioned fish. Not trying to be a
> downer, just wanted to make sure you know 0 Am and Nitrites is not the
> only goal. HTH
> Bill
>

[~ jan JJsPond.us]

On Tue, 1 Mar 2005 07:55:49 -0500, "Richard Holub" >
wrote:

>I only tested for GH & KH on 01/24/05. Readings = 89.5-GH & 71.5-KH. My
>test kit is only a couple of months old and I use it to test my 55 gal. fish
>tank which contain mollies. The pond is 160 gal. and contains four 10" koi.
>Both tests for the pond and the aquarium are totaly different so I know that
>the tests are "true". The aquarium used to house the koi for about one
>month when they were 4" long. They outgrew the tank quickly so I built the
>pond in the cellar.
>
>You are right, my pH does change rapidly and I am still trying to figure
>this out. If you notice...the pH was pretty steady at first. The changes
>started once the nitrite started to increase. At that point the nitrate
>also changed (up) and the ammonia (down). I increased the pH from 6.0 to
>6.8on 02.23.05 with sodium bicarbonate. I did it again on 02/23/05 from 6.4
>to 7.2. I have been using "BULLSEYE 7.0" to maintain my pH but it is too
>early to try, I think. I will keep an eye on my pH for now and see.
>
>Rich

The nitrogen cycle uses up the buffer, once it is established *no ammonia
showing* one has to use frequent partial water changes (20-25%/week) to
maintain it. That's IF your new water has good KH. If not, after each water
change you'll have to add sodium bicarb. Cheaper than Bullseye, I would
assume? Koi prefer a more alkaline environment anyway. (Okay,
I've never asked the koi I've just been told that 7.5-7.8 is their happy
place.) ;) ~ jan


See my ponds and filter design:
http://users.owt.com/jjspond/

~Keep 'em Wet!~
Tri-Cities WA Zone 7a
To e-mail see website

[Reel McKoi]

"Richard Holub" > wrote in message
...
> You are right, my pH does change rapidly and I am still trying to figure
> this out. If you notice...the pH was pretty steady at first. The changes
> started once the nitrite started to increase.
=============================
To help buffer and keep PH more steady I use cheap oyster shells from the
freed store meant for chickens. I also have limestone rocks in some of the
pools. Rinse the dust off the shells, bag them in a mesh bag and put them
in the filter or near an outflow from your pump.
--
McKoi.... the frugal ponder...
"WORK HARDER, millions in Welfare depend on you."
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

[Richard Holub]

I'll try it!

Rich
"Reel McKoi" > wrote in message
...
>
> "Richard Holub" > wrote in message
> ...
>> You are right, my pH does change rapidly and I am still trying to figure
>> this out. If you notice...the pH was pretty steady at first. The
>> changes
>> started once the nitrite started to increase.
> =============================
> To help buffer and keep PH more steady I use cheap oyster shells from the
> freed store meant for chickens. I also have limestone rocks in some of
> the
> pools. Rinse the dust off the shells, bag them in a mesh bag and put them
> in the filter or near an outflow from your pump.
> --
> McKoi.... the frugal ponder...
> "WORK HARDER, millions in Welfare depend on you."
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>

[Richard Holub]

You are right about the price. I've just gotten the system started in the
right track so I am going to keep an eye on the tests and see if the sodium
bicarbonate will maintain the pH...I'm sure it will.

Rich
"~ jan JJsPond.us" > wrote in message
...
> On Tue, 1 Mar 2005 07:55:49 -0500, "Richard Holub" >
> wrote:
>
>>I only tested for GH & KH on 01/24/05. Readings = 89.5-GH & 71.5-KH. My
>>test kit is only a couple of months old and I use it to test my 55 gal.
>>fish
>>tank which contain mollies. The pond is 160 gal. and contains four 10"
>>koi.
>>Both tests for the pond and the aquarium are totaly different so I know
>>that
>>the tests are "true". The aquarium used to house the koi for about one
>>month when they were 4" long. They outgrew the tank quickly so I built
>>the
>>pond in the cellar.
>>
>>You are right, my pH does change rapidly and I am still trying to figure
>>this out. If you notice...the pH was pretty steady at first. The changes
>>started once the nitrite started to increase. At that point the nitrate
>>also changed (up) and the ammonia (down). I increased the pH from 6.0 to
>>6.8on 02.23.05 with sodium bicarbonate. I did it again on 02/23/05 from
>>6.4
>>to 7.2. I have been using "BULLSEYE 7.0" to maintain my pH but it is too
>>early to try, I think. I will keep an eye on my pH for now and see.
>>
>>Rich
>
> The nitrogen cycle uses up the buffer, once it is established *no ammonia
> showing* one has to use frequent partial water changes (20-25%/week) to
> maintain it. That's IF your new water has good KH. If not, after each
> water
> change you'll have to add sodium bicarb. Cheaper than Bullseye, I would
> assume? Koi prefer a more alkaline environment anyway. (Okay,
> I've never asked the koi I've just been told that 7.5-7.8 is their happy
> place.) ;) ~ jan
>
>
> See my ponds and filter design:
> http://users.owt.com/jjspond/
>
> ~Keep 'em Wet!~
> Tri-Cities WA Zone 7a
> To e-mail see website