Culling out the deformed

[winddancir]

My very first batch of guppie babies had one deformed one. The girl in question didn't seem to be in pain, but it was kinda gross.
I couldn't get rid of her. She did die recently, from a fungus that attacked most of my fish. (2 others died as well)

How does anyone get rid of fish with deformities? I don't have larger fish that will eat them. I just can't bring myself to flush them or just toss them out of the tank. I just kept her and made sure she had a good life. Isn't that what most of us would do?

Moral questions. I really hate them. So why do I ask? Because I need to know how other people have solved them so that I can work on solving mine.

[Gill Passman]

"winddancir" > wrote in message
. ..
>
> My very first batch of guppie babies had one deformed one. The girl in
> question didn't seem to be in pain, but it was kinda gross.
> I couldn't get rid of her. She did die recently, from a fungus that
> attacked most of my fish. (2 others died as well)
>
> How does anyone get rid of fish with deformities? I don't have larger
> fish that will eat them. I just can't bring myself to flush them or
> just toss them out of the tank. I just kept her and made sure she had a
> good life. Isn't that what most of us would do?
>
> Moral questions. I really hate them. So why do I ask? Because I need to
> know how other people have solved them so that I can work on solving
> mine.
>
>
> --
> winddancir

Hi,
I actually think the answer here is do what you are comfortable with. In
this case it sounds like she was more vunerable to infection and nature took
it's course as it would have done if she had been in a tank with larger
fish. If she had survived I don't think I would have let her breed - but if
she was happy and not in pain I think I would have done the same as you.

You obviously care deeply about your fish :-)

Gill

[IDzine01]

Honestly, I think I would buy bigger fish. I know that sounds crazy,
but it's the only way I can cull. I also can't flush. I'm just not
thick skinned enough.

[NetMax]

"Gill Passman" <gillspamattaylorpassmanspam.co.uk> wrote in message
.. .
>
> "winddancir" > wrote in
> message
> . ..
>>
>> My very first batch of guppie babies had one deformed one. The girl in
>> question didn't seem to be in pain, but it was kinda gross.
>> I couldn't get rid of her. She did die recently, from a fungus that
>> attacked most of my fish. (2 others died as well)
>>
>> How does anyone get rid of fish with deformities? I don't have larger
>> fish that will eat them. I just can't bring myself to flush them or
>> just toss them out of the tank. I just kept her and made sure she had
>> a
>> good life. Isn't that what most of us would do?
>>
>> Moral questions. I really hate them. So why do I ask? Because I need
>> to
>> know how other people have solved them so that I can work on solving
>> mine.
>>
>>
>> --
>> winddancir
>
> Hi,
> I actually think the answer here is do what you are comfortable with.
> In
> this case it sounds like she was more vunerable to infection and nature
> took
> it's course as it would have done if she had been in a tank with larger
> fish. If she had survived I don't think I would have let her breed -
> but if
> she was happy and not in pain I think I would have done the same as
> you.
>
> You obviously care deeply about your fish :-)
>
> Gill


Like Gill said, the technique varies by the individual's preferences. I
do separate defects so they don't contribute unwanted characteristics (in
case they are genetic traits). A mix of Eugenol and water is a pretty
easy method of euthanising them. Larger fish will sometimes do the deed
for you (depending on the fish, they are not all neat eaters). There is
also mechanical methods of dispatching them. The last Guppy (hunchback)
that I separated went into a tank of cichlids (Julies) and he looks like
he might outlive all his brothers.
--
www.NetMax.tk

[Angrie.Woman]

"winddancir" > wrote in message
. ..
>
>
> How does anyone get rid of fish with deformities? I don't have larger
> fish that will eat them. I just can't bring myself to flush them or
> just toss them out of the tank. I just kept her and made sure she had a
> good life. Isn't that what most of us would do?
>

I had one once. A Molly, I think. I just hand-fed her, and gave her own tank
for a while. She died, but it wasn't because I didn't take care of her.

A

[Angrie.Woman]

"NetMax" > wrote in message
...
> Like Gill said, the technique varies by the individual's preferences. I
> do separate defects so they don't contribute unwanted characteristics (in
> case they are genetic traits).

Netmax,

Do you cull out the breeder that produced the deformity too?

A

[[email protected]]

I just would say about myself that I keep mine and even let them breed
because the problem could be fixed down the road at least. I have the
same issue (very minor one for me though) with my fancy guppies - every
once in a while a deformed fancy guppy appears. Usually it's a spinal
deformity but I have one male that is sexually well endowed and he
probably is too well endowed if you know what I mean but it doesn't
keep him from trying and seems happy. The only time I would ever cull
(this is for me) is if the fish or pet had an actual disease (not
genetic) and I had no way to treat or cure it. I think genetic
disorders can fix itself via the mini-nature rules in these small tanks
after a few generations. I am no genetic expert but I suspect I am
right about this. I don't think these genetic disorders happen in the
wild nearly as much as in this hobby and I think these genetic
disorders are a side effect of selective breeding in captivity and
therefore are not established traits (at least not as well established
as any of the other genetic information). I have noticed over the
course of this year my deformities have almost totally disappeared. The
only 2 significant complaints I have read or heard about with fancy
guppies is that they are so selectively bred that they are not as
vigoris in strength (including immunity to disease) and I remember
reading 10 or so years ago in a popular aquarium magazine or 2 that
there was/is a fancy guppy disease going around (white spots on the
spine and crooked spine?). Anyways - I just let them live and try and
mostly succeed in it's life. Later!

[NetMax]

"Angrie.Woman" > wrote in message
...
>
> "NetMax" > wrote in message
> ...
>> Like Gill said, the technique varies by the individual's preferences.
>> I do separate defects so they don't contribute unwanted
>> characteristics (in case they are genetic traits).
>
> Netmax,
>
> Do you cull out the breeder that produced the deformity too?
>
> A

No, a small level of incidence seems normal to me, and a higher level of
incidence will first point me towards investigating environmental
problems, which I think livebearers are quick to react to. For example,
an acquaintance attributed an increasing incidence of Guppy hunchbacks to
a vitamin deficiency, which he corrected by providing more natural light
to the tank. However sceptical I might have been, this fellow was an MD
who took his Guppies seriously.
--
www.NetMax.tk

[sophie]

In message >, NetMax
> writes
>"Angrie.Woman" > wrote in message
...
>>
>> "NetMax" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>> Like Gill said, the technique varies by the individual's preferences.
>>> I do separate defects so they don't contribute unwanted
>>> characteristics (in case they are genetic traits).
>>
>> Netmax,
>>
>> Do you cull out the breeder that produced the deformity too?
>>
>> A
>
>No, a small level of incidence seems normal to me, and a higher level of
>incidence will first point me towards investigating environmental
>problems, which I think livebearers are quick to react to. For example,
>an acquaintance attributed an increasing incidence of Guppy hunchbacks to
>a vitamin deficiency, which he corrected by providing more natural light
>to the tank. However sceptical I might have been, this fellow was an MD
>who took his Guppies seriously.

Vitamin D - humans need sunlight on their skin to make it; a deficiency
results in rickets in children, amongst other things. Didn't know fish
produced it in the same way/ needed it for the same reason, though.
Actually, cod liver oil is one of the few natural sources of vitamin D,
which may or may not be relevant.

I think I'm waffling and should stop now, before I start rabbiting about
birth defects and external factors...

--
sophie

[Tom Randy]

On Fri, 04 Mar 2005 13:09:10 -0800, IDzine01 wrote:

> Honestly, I think I would buy bigger fish. I know that sounds crazy, but
> it's the only way I can cull. I also can't flush. I'm just not thick
> skinned enough.


Clove oil with some tank water...it's how I do it.

[winddancir]

Thanks everybody!
Her problem was something I seriously doubt was genetic. I didn't get her into the "females only" tank soon enough, and she did have two litters. The offspring were perfectly normal.
Strange things happen for no apparent reason. She was cared for until the end.
Gill, I think you are right in that she was more suceptable to the fungus. But she kept going even with more of it on her than what killed the other two! Who knows why it took more to take her out?