Help with entire system!

[Ray Martini]

All but two fish have died off in the last 10 days. Tank is about 3 months
old. 72 gallon bow front, 90 lbs LR. Decent sized clean up crew. Water
parameters look ok

NH3=0
NO2=0
NO3=0.

I only have my Clarkii clownfish and my Yellow Tang left. All the inverts
are fine. Yellow Tang still doing great, Clown is doing so so.

Lost are 1 beautiful Vagabond Butterfly, 1 Arrow Crab, 1 Lawnmower Blenny, 1
BiColor Psuedo, 1 Yellow Clown Goby

I have been treating the tank with Ich*Attach by Kordon because of and Ich
outbreak which seemed to do nothing more than make the water brown and
cloudy. I have also removed any chemical filtration. Can anyone help out
with some advise on how to get this tank back on track. It was going so well
and everything crashed all at once! Very bummed!!

Tonight's game plan is to return the chemical filtration and do a 20-25%
water change. Also considering a UV Sterilizer. Would that help keep the
tank more stable? I also plan to discontinue meds and just let it happen as
it will.

Any help or suggestions are REALLY appreciated.

Thanks ...
Ray Martini (soon to trash the whole thing and have a big ass freshwater
tank!!)

[George Patterson]

Ray Martini wrote:
>
> Also considering a UV Sterilizer. Would that help keep the
> tank more stable?

I kept two 8 watt units on my 125 for years -- I've recently downsized to one.
As far as ick and white spot is concerned, a sterilizer will slow the spread of
the diseases down. This will give more time for detection and treatment. It only
attacks the dinosphores in their free-swimming stage and will not, in my
experience, kill all of them.

The only effective treatment I've found is copper, and this will kill some of
the inhabitants of a typical reef tank. I use "CopperSafe", which I've been told
is a chelated copper sulfate solution. If you use copper in any form, buy an
excellent test kit and monitor the levels at least daily.

Discontinuing meds will result in cyclical infestations of the remaining fish
until they all die. For the next six months after that, adding any fish will
probably result in a new infestation.

George Patterson
I prefer Heaven for climate but Hell for company.

[Ray Martini]

What are "acceptable" levels of copper in the tank.
It's FOWLR tank. There are alot of snails, crabs, and a fire shrimp in the
tank. I'd hate to lose the shrimp.

CopperSafe instructions says it maintains a 1.5 - 2.0 ppm of copper for a
month.

"George Patterson" > wrote in message
...
>
>
> Ray Martini wrote:
>>
>> Also considering a UV Sterilizer. Would that help keep the
>> tank more stable?
>
> I kept two 8 watt units on my 125 for years -- I've recently downsized to
> one.
> As far as ick and white spot is concerned, a sterilizer will slow the
> spread of
> the diseases down. This will give more time for detection and treatment.
> It only
> attacks the dinosphores in their free-swimming stage and will not, in my
> experience, kill all of them.
>
> The only effective treatment I've found is copper, and this will kill some
> of
> the inhabitants of a typical reef tank. I use "CopperSafe", which I've
> been told
> is a chelated copper sulfate solution. If you use copper in any form, buy
> an
> excellent test kit and monitor the levels at least daily.
>
> Discontinuing meds will result in cyclical infestations of the remaining
> fish
> until they all die. For the next six months after that, adding any fish
> will
> probably result in a new infestation.
>
> George Patterson
> I prefer Heaven for climate but Hell for company.

[George Patterson]

Ray Martini wrote:
>
> What are "acceptable" levels of copper in the tank.

That'll depend on the animal, and I can't tell you. I've been FO for years. I
remember from long ago that feather dusters can't take much copper at all.

> CopperSafe instructions says it maintains a 1.5 - 2.0 ppm of copper for a
> month.

Yep. I will put in half what the directions call for, wait a few hours, and test
the level (actually, I usually have to run out and buy a new test kit, since I
rarely need it). I will take about 24 hours to bring the level up to 1.5. I'll
then test for several days, adding copper as necessary to keep the level
correct. The last two times I needed to dose my tank, the level stayed pretty
constant, so I quit testing after a week.

George Patterson
I prefer Heaven for climate but Hell for company.

[George]

"Ray Martini" > wrote in message
...
> What are "acceptable" levels of copper in the tank.
> It's FOWLR tank. There are alot of snails, crabs, and a fire shrimp in the
> tank. I'd hate to lose the shrimp.
>
> CopperSafe instructions says it maintains a 1.5 - 2.0 ppm of copper for a
> month.

I've been lucky enough not to have too many disease/parsite problems with my
fish. However, what I have done in the past was to remove the fish from the
reef tank, and isolate them in order to better treat them. Then I left the fish
isolated for at least two months to three months. The reason is that if there
are parasites in your reef tank, and you remove the fish, you will break their
reproductive cycle, and any parasites in the reef tank will die out. Then you
can reintroduce the fish back into the tank. I hope this helps.

> "George Patterson" > wrote in message
> ...
>>
>>
>> Ray Martini wrote:
>>>
>>> Also considering a UV Sterilizer. Would that help keep the
>>> tank more stable?
>>
>> I kept two 8 watt units on my 125 for years -- I've recently downsized to
>> one.
>> As far as ick and white spot is concerned, a sterilizer will slow the spread
>> of
>> the diseases down. This will give more time for detection and treatment. It
>> only
>> attacks the dinosphores in their free-swimming stage and will not, in my
>> experience, kill all of them.
>>
>> The only effective treatment I've found is copper, and this will kill some of
>> the inhabitants of a typical reef tank. I use "CopperSafe", which I've been
>> told
>> is a chelated copper sulfate solution. If you use copper in any form, buy an
>> excellent test kit and monitor the levels at least daily.
>>
>> Discontinuing meds will result in cyclical infestations of the remaining fish
>> until they all die. For the next six months after that, adding any fish will
>> probably result in a new infestation.
>>
>> George Patterson
>> I prefer Heaven for climate but Hell for company.
>
>

[George Patterson]

Ray Martini wrote:
>
> Any help or suggestions are REALLY appreciated.

I just did some reading to refresh my memory of things. There are two similar
parasitical diseases, one of which is oodinium and the other cryptocaryon.
Either may be called "ick" by some people, but crypto is usually what is called
by that name. Oodinium is usually called "velvet."

Oodinium shows up as a hazy coating on the fish -- the parasites are pinpoint
size and hard to see. The usual symptom is that the fish dashes its gill covers
against decorations, trying to scratch the itch.

Crypto is also called "white spot" -- the parasites are pinhead size.

Both parasites respond to copper treatment, but crypto also responds to
treatment with sodium sulphathiazole, which will not hurt invertebrates.
Oodinium will not respond to this treatment, but, if all you have is white spot
disease, you might try this.

Caveat -- My book is a 30 year old copy of "The Marine Aquarium in Theory and
Practice." The medicine may no longer be available.

George Patterson
I prefer Heaven for climate but Hell for company.

[lg]

"Ray Martini" > wrote in message
...
> All but two fish have died off in the last 10 days. Tank is about 3 months
> old. 72 gallon bow front, 90 lbs LR. Decent sized clean up crew. Water
> parameters look ok
>
> NH3=0
> NO2=0
> NO3=0.
>
> I only have my Clarkii clownfish and my Yellow Tang left. All the inverts
> are fine. Yellow Tang still doing great, Clown is doing so so.
>
> Lost are 1 beautiful Vagabond Butterfly, 1 Arrow Crab, 1 Lawnmower Blenny,
1
> BiColor Psuedo, 1 Yellow Clown Goby
>
> I have been treating the tank with Ich*Attach by Kordon because of and Ich
> outbreak which seemed to do nothing more than make the water brown and
> cloudy. I have also removed any chemical filtration. Can anyone help out
> with some advise on how to get this tank back on track. It was going so
well
> and everything crashed all at once! Very bummed!!
>
> Tonight's game plan is to return the chemical filtration and do a 20-25%
> water change. Also considering a UV Sterilizer. Would that help keep the
> tank more stable? I also plan to discontinue meds and just let it happen
as
> it will.
>
> Any help or suggestions are REALLY appreciated.
>
> Thanks ...
> Ray Martini (soon to trash the whole thing and have a big ass freshwater
> tank!!)
>
>

Hang in there!!!! You will be glad like me you did.

I had a big crash in my tank when it was 10 weeks old.
It is 4 months old now and I can see everything I put in it now go 100%
fine. ( the tank even 'looks' different now)

There has been a big diffference in the last 5-6 weeks in the appearance of
my tanks.

I think it is an issue with new tanks.

You are almost there.

[Ray Martini]

Thanks for the encouragement! I'll hang in there a couple more months. Just
added a 15w UV Sterilizer and things are looking a little better. I only
have my Yellow Tang left and he was looking really bleak last night. This
morning after a night of massage from the cleaner shrimp and the UV helping
to kill off free swimming parasites, he actually looks better. Fins up,
appetite strong. He's the only fish left. I would really love to see him
pull through!

Thanks everyone for the kind words and advice.


"lg" > wrote in message
...
>
> "Ray Martini" > wrote in message
> ...
>> All but two fish have died off in the last 10 days. Tank is about 3
>> months
>> old. 72 gallon bow front, 90 lbs LR. Decent sized clean up crew. Water
>> parameters look ok
>>
>> NH3=0
>> NO2=0
>> NO3=0.
>>
>> I only have my Clarkii clownfish and my Yellow Tang left. All the inverts
>> are fine. Yellow Tang still doing great, Clown is doing so so.
>>
>> Lost are 1 beautiful Vagabond Butterfly, 1 Arrow Crab, 1 Lawnmower
>> Blenny,
> 1
>> BiColor Psuedo, 1 Yellow Clown Goby
>>
>> I have been treating the tank with Ich*Attach by Kordon because of and
>> Ich
>> outbreak which seemed to do nothing more than make the water brown and
>> cloudy. I have also removed any chemical filtration. Can anyone help out
>> with some advise on how to get this tank back on track. It was going so
> well
>> and everything crashed all at once! Very bummed!!
>>
>> Tonight's game plan is to return the chemical filtration and do a 20-25%
>> water change. Also considering a UV Sterilizer. Would that help keep the
>> tank more stable? I also plan to discontinue meds and just let it happen
> as
>> it will.
>>
>> Any help or suggestions are REALLY appreciated.
>>
>> Thanks ...
>> Ray Martini (soon to trash the whole thing and have a big ass freshwater
>> tank!!)
>>
>>
>
> Hang in there!!!! You will be glad like me you did.
>
> I had a big crash in my tank when it was 10 weeks old.
> It is 4 months old now and I can see everything I put in it now go 100%
> fine. ( the tank even 'looks' different now)
>
> There has been a big diffference in the last 5-6 weeks in the appearance
> of
> my tanks.
>
> I think it is an issue with new tanks.
>
> You are almost there.
>
>
>