Nitrite spike and an unwell Molly

[Ionizer]

Well, it's perhaps beginning to happen- the "worst case scenario" that
Steve referred to. In our new (one week) 25 gallon tank with almost 40
small fish, I've just measured what I assume is the nitrite spike.
Ammonia levels have dropped to almost zero, and the nitrite level is
pretty much 1.6. I've immediately done a 20% (5 gallon) water change; the
second such water change in two days. This replacement water was treated
to eliminate ammonia, and a double dose of Nutrafin "Cycle" was added,
according to the guidelines I've been attempting to follow.

One of our balloon mollies is suddenly very lethargic. The other fish are
trying to encourage her, but she is obviously in some distress- sitting
near a corner at the bottom of the tank but moving around when urged to do
so. Aside from the (treated) water change I've just done, are there any
other procedures I should be following right now? I don't want to lose
this molly, but I also don't want her to adversely affect the other fish
in the tank.

Many thanks,
Ian.

[NetMax]

"Ionizer" > wrote in message
...
> Well, it's perhaps beginning to happen- the "worst case scenario" that
> Steve referred to. In our new (one week) 25 gallon tank with almost 40
> small fish, I've just measured what I assume is the nitrite spike.
> Ammonia levels have dropped to almost zero, and the nitrite level is
> pretty much 1.6. I've immediately done a 20% (5 gallon) water change;
> the second such water change in two days. This replacement water was
> treated to eliminate ammonia, and a double dose of Nutrafin "Cycle" was
> added, according to the guidelines I've been attempting to follow.
>
> One of our balloon mollies is suddenly very lethargic. The other fish
> are trying to encourage her, but she is obviously in some distress-
> sitting near a corner at the bottom of the tank but moving around when
> urged to do so. Aside from the (treated) water change I've just done,
> are there any other procedures I should be following right now? I
> don't want to lose this molly, but I also don't want her to adversely
> affect the other fish in the tank.
>
> Many thanks,
> Ian.


If all your fish are salt-tolerant (like your Molly), then salt
counteracts the effects of nitrites, in between your water changes.
However with 40 fish, you best bet is daily water changes and some
Bio-spira or aged filter media.
--
www.NetMax.tk

[Elaine T]

NetMax wrote:
> "Ionizer" > wrote in message
> ...
>
>>Well, it's perhaps beginning to happen- the "worst case scenario" that
>>Steve referred to. In our new (one week) 25 gallon tank with almost 40
>>small fish, I've just measured what I assume is the nitrite spike.
>>Ammonia levels have dropped to almost zero, and the nitrite level is
>>pretty much 1.6. I've immediately done a 20% (5 gallon) water change;
>>the second such water change in two days. This replacement water was
>>treated to eliminate ammonia, and a double dose of Nutrafin "Cycle" was
>>added, according to the guidelines I've been attempting to follow.
>>
>>One of our balloon mollies is suddenly very lethargic. The other fish
>>are trying to encourage her, but she is obviously in some distress-
>>sitting near a corner at the bottom of the tank but moving around when
>>urged to do so. Aside from the (treated) water change I've just done,
>>are there any other procedures I should be following right now? I
>>don't want to lose this molly, but I also don't want her to adversely
>>affect the other fish in the tank.
>>
>>Many thanks,
>>Ian.
>
>
>
> If all your fish are salt-tolerant (like your Molly), then salt
> counteracts the effects of nitrites, in between your water changes.
> However with 40 fish, you best bet is daily water changes and some
> Bio-spira or aged filter media.

Extra aeration is also very helpful. Nitrite interferes with the
ability of blood to carry oxygen. Rummy nose and penguin tetras don't
like salt very well. I think you could add 1 tsp per 5 gallons, but I
wouldn't try more. When you change water, add the same amount of salt
to the water you put back until the cycle is over.

--
__ Elaine T __
><__'> http://eethomp.com/fish.html <'__><
rec.aquaria.* FAQ http://faq.thekrib.com

[steve]

Ionizer wrote:

>snip.
> One of our balloon mollies is suddenly very lethargic. The other
fish are
> trying to encourage her, but she is obviously in some distress-
sitting
> near a corner at the bottom of the tank but moving around when urged
to do
> so. Aside from the (treated) water change I've just done, are there
any
> other procedures I should be following right now? I don't want to
lose
> this molly, but I also don't want her to adversely affect the other
fish
> in the tank.
>
> Many thanks,
> Ian.

Aiy, this is the part of fish keeping that none of us look forward to;
when our pets succomb to illness. While seemingly cold hearted to
others, I take a direct approach when I discover a sick fish. When I
see one floating around helplessly or bouncing along the bottom in
obvious distress, I remove them from the tank and end their suffering.
Only once have I medicated a group of fish, when my tank had an ich
outbreak.

With a full tank load like we're dealing with here, your worst fear is
disease spreading from the one to more fish. If you have an isolation
tank, of course, remove the sick one to there. If not, then I'm afraid
you'll have to make the commanders decision, the life of one for the
lives of many. I really discourage trying to treat illness in this
instance. You're already battling ammonia and nitrites, and maybe soon
pH. Adding some medicines and trying to control all those variables
may be unmanagable and create a real sad situation.

steve

[Ionizer]

"steve" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> Aiy, this is the part of fish keeping that none of us look forward to;
> when our pets succomb to illness. While seemingly cold hearted to
> others, I take a direct approach when I discover a sick fish. When I
> see one floating around helplessly or bouncing along the bottom in
> obvious distress, I remove them from the tank and end their suffering.
> Only once have I medicated a group of fish, when my tank had an ich
> outbreak.
>
> With a full tank load like we're dealing with here, your worst fear is
> disease spreading from the one to more fish. If you have an isolation
> tank, of course, remove the sick one to there. If not, then I'm afraid
> you'll have to make the commanders decision, the life of one for the
> lives of many. I really discourage trying to treat illness in this
> instance. You're already battling ammonia and nitrites, and maybe soon
> pH. Adding some medicines and trying to control all those variables
> may be unmanagable and create a real sad situation.

Thanks, Steve. The morning after my post that molly had died, saving me
from making a "commander's decision." Since then, on two consecutive days
as of an hour ago, we've done two 20% (10 gallon) water changes. This has
reduced the nitrite levels somewhat- they are currently sitting closer to
0.8.

What a nightmare this is turning out to be, though. I've just noticed a
few white spots (much larger than a grain of salt) on the tail fins of a
couple of mollies.

So far, we have only lost three fish. All the fish in the tank seem happy
and active still, but I find myself feeling tense and worried when I look
at this tank. Is there a point at which staring at a fish tank becomes a
relaxing pastime?

--
Ian.

[Elaine T]

Ionizer wrote:
> "steve" > wrote in message
> oups.com...
>
>>Aiy, this is the part of fish keeping that none of us look forward to;
>>when our pets succomb to illness. While seemingly cold hearted to
>>others, I take a direct approach when I discover a sick fish. When I
>>see one floating around helplessly or bouncing along the bottom in
>>obvious distress, I remove them from the tank and end their suffering.
>>Only once have I medicated a group of fish, when my tank had an ich
>>outbreak.
>>
>>With a full tank load like we're dealing with here, your worst fear is
>>disease spreading from the one to more fish. If you have an isolation
>>tank, of course, remove the sick one to there. If not, then I'm afraid
>>you'll have to make the commanders decision, the life of one for the
>>lives of many. I really discourage trying to treat illness in this
>>instance. You're already battling ammonia and nitrites, and maybe soon
>>pH. Adding some medicines and trying to control all those variables
>>may be unmanagable and create a real sad situation.
>
>
> Thanks, Steve. The morning after my post that molly had died, saving me
> from making a "commander's decision." Since then, on two consecutive days
> as of an hour ago, we've done two 20% (10 gallon) water changes. This has
> reduced the nitrite levels somewhat- they are currently sitting closer to
> 0.8.
>
> What a nightmare this is turning out to be, though. I've just noticed a
> few white spots (much larger than a grain of salt) on the tail fins of a
> couple of mollies.
>
> So far, we have only lost three fish. All the fish in the tank seem happy
> and active still, but I find myself feeling tense and worried when I look
> at this tank. Is there a point at which staring at a fish tank becomes a
> relaxing pastime?
>
Usually about 2-3 months after you buy your first tank. Then the tank
is cycled and aged a bit and has become a great home for fish. Then
your fish are healthy and they come swimming up to the front of the tank
for food whenever you come by. You count noses and everyone is there
except maybe the catfish or loaches and you know exactly where they hang
out during the day.

Worrying does you no good, of course. You are taking the single most
constructive action you can, which is changing lots of water. You have
also found the best advice you can, and are following it to the best of
your ability. There is no better way of managing the situation. Maybe
when you look at the tank you can tell yourself that.

If you can find it, freshwater Fritzyme is very good to seed bacteria
and bring nitrites down. It sucks for ammonia, but it's magic for
nitrite. I've brought nitrite spikes down to near-zero in 24 hours with
that stuff and the bacteria seem to actually colonize and stay.

The spots on your mollies' tails are likely ich from the stress. Vacuum
gravel as you change the water to suck out some of the parasites.
You'll also be removing freeswimming parasites from the tank with the
frequent water changes, which is good. Stay focused on water quality
and don't worry about the spots unless they start spreading to a lot of
fish, or your mollies start getting spots all over.

--
__ Elaine T __
><__'> http://eethomp.com/fish.html <'__><
rec.aquaria.* FAQ http://faq.thekrib.com