Need help, advice, references

[Connie]

Hi Guys.. I am pretty excited. I found a deal, that I think is pretty
good... but I have 5 days to learn as much as I can (luckily I am a
quick study).

In your opinion, is this a good deal... a two year old well established
75 gal salt water tank, 7+ fish (dog-faced puffer, clown, black and
yellow striped tang, 4 Damsels, 4 choc chipped stars), filters (one
UGF, and on hanging), decor, wooden stand, food, chemicals, and water
levels tests... Gravel for the substrate... For $400

Ok - now that we have that out of the way - If it is a good deal, then
I pick it up on Tuesday. I need as much info as I can get... I am used
to freshwater, I was pretty proficient at it, with a well planted tank
and DIY lighting and CO2 stuff...

So here are my questions..What is the biggest differences in fresh
water and salt in maintenance? What do I NEED to know by Tuesday?

My biggest question is what is the best way to transport this tank and
reintroduce the fish without losing alot of the biological filter and
stressing out the fish.

Also - one more that I can think of right now... There were two fish
that I really wanted - I got the dog faced puffer, the other one is a
black lionfish. Would he fit into this tank at all??

And - can I get coral, and anemones with this tank? The substarte he is
using is gravel - should I add live sand, or is gravel ok (I guess it
is ok, he's been using it for 2 years).

Any advice, websites, or books you can offer is GREAT. I am very exited
to learn and get prepared for my new hobby.

[FordStyle]

"Connie" > wrote in message
ups.com...
> Hi Guys.. I am pretty excited. I found a deal, that I think is pretty
> good... but I have 5 days to learn as much as I can (luckily I am a
> quick study).
>
> In your opinion, is this a good deal... a two year old well established
> 75 gal salt water tank, 7+ fish (dog-faced puffer, clown, black and
> yellow striped tang, 4 Damsels, 4 choc chipped stars), filters (one
> UGF, and on hanging), decor, wooden stand, food, chemicals, and water
> levels tests... Gravel for the substrate... For $400
>
> Ok - now that we have that out of the way - If it is a good deal, then
> I pick it up on Tuesday. I need as much info as I can get... I am used
> to freshwater, I was pretty proficient at it, with a well planted tank
> and DIY lighting and CO2 stuff...
>
> So here are my questions..What is the biggest differences in fresh
> water and salt in maintenance? What do I NEED to know by Tuesday?
>
> My biggest question is what is the best way to transport this tank and
> reintroduce the fish without losing alot of the biological filter and
> stressing out the fish.
>
> Also - one more that I can think of right now... There were two fish
> that I really wanted - I got the dog faced puffer, the other one is a
> black lionfish. Would he fit into this tank at all??
>
> And - can I get coral, and anemones with this tank? The substarte he is
> using is gravel - should I add live sand, or is gravel ok (I guess it
> is ok, he's been using it for 2 years).
>
> Any advice, websites, or books you can offer is GREAT. I am very exited
> to learn and get prepared for my new hobby.
>

Spend a few days looking through all the posts and forums at
www.reefcentral.com and it will help some. Also register and ask any
questions you may have....

[CheezWiz]

I could not recommend that a newbie to sal****er take a plunge like this
without at least having a friend who knows what they are doing and could
help..

"Connie" > wrote in message
ups.com...
> Hi Guys.. I am pretty excited. I found a deal, that I think is pretty
> good... but I have 5 days to learn as much as I can (luckily I am a
> quick study).
>
> In your opinion, is this a good deal... a two year old well established
> 75 gal salt water tank, 7+ fish (dog-faced puffer, clown, black and
> yellow striped tang, 4 Damsels, 4 choc chipped stars), filters (one
> UGF, and on hanging), decor, wooden stand, food, chemicals, and water
> levels tests... Gravel for the substrate... For $400

If you are wanting a reef tank, then this is already a bad start and does
not appear to be a good deal to me.
The UGF has gotta go for corals and such..! As for the hang on, still most
likely no good for corals and a reef..
This is a fish only tank and with such things as puffers and choc-chip stars
that is all it can be..


>
> Ok - now that we have that out of the way - If it is a good deal, then
> I pick it up on Tuesday. I need as much info as I can get... I am used
> to freshwater, I was pretty proficient at it, with a well planted tank
> and DIY lighting and CO2 stuff...
>
> So here are my questions..What is the biggest differences in fresh
> water and salt in maintenance? What do I NEED to know by Tuesday?
>
> My biggest question is what is the best way to transport this tank and
> reintroduce the fish without losing alot of the biological filter and
> stressing out the fish.
>
> Also - one more that I can think of right now... There were two fish
> that I really wanted - I got the dog faced puffer, the other one is a
> black lionfish. Would he fit into this tank at all??

Not good in my opinion..

>
> And - can I get coral, and anemones with this tank? The substarte he is
> using is gravel - should I add live sand, or is gravel ok (I guess it
> is ok, he's been using it for 2 years).

No this is a fish only setup. If you want a reef, this is 180 degrees out of
phase..

>
> Any advice, websites, or books you can offer is GREAT. I am very exited
> to learn and get prepared for my new hobby.
>

If you want a reef tank, keep your money and buy "The Natural Reef Aquarium"
by John Tullock.
Read all of it twice. Then decide if you are ready to make the jump to
marine tanks.

If you do, you can follow one of his examples and go slow. This is not
something to rush into on a whim. This tank is all wrong for a reef. Your
money would be better spent towards a real reef ready tank that has been
drilled with overflows like the all-glass models or Oceanic...

Opinions will vary with mileage....
CW

[George Patterson]

Connie wrote:

>
> In your opinion, is this a good deal... a two year old well established
> 75 gal salt water tank, 7+ fish (dog-faced puffer, clown, black and
> yellow striped tang, 4 Damsels, 4 choc chipped stars), filters (one
> UGF, and on hanging), decor, wooden stand, food, chemicals, and water
> levels tests... Gravel for the substrate... For $400


In my opinion, that's a good starter. Not too bad a deal, but I would count the
filters as being junk. While a UGF *will* work (after all, until the mid-70s,
that's the best we had), it doesn't work as well as many other things on the
market today.

> My biggest question is what is the best way to transport this tank and
> reintroduce the fish without losing alot of the biological filter and
> stressing out the fish.


Ok. Pick up a lot of 5 gallon buckets with lids. Bakery shops are good sources
(they buy filling in these). Get some friends - you want 6 people total. Line up
a truck. The idea is to drain as much of the water as possible into the buckets,
putting the fish in the buckets as well. If the tank is *not* on the ground
floor, or if your place is *not* on the ground floor, you will also have to
remove all of the gravel; if this isn't the case, you can leave the gravel in
the tank.

Now pick the tank up and get it into the back of the truck. With the UGF,
gravel, and the 5 to 10 gallons of undrainable water, it won't be light. Then
get the stand loaded. Move the buckets with the fish last to minimize exposure
to cold temperatures - in fact, if you can take them inside a car or van, do so.

Reverse the procedure at the other end.

If you can't get enough containers to take all of the water, mix up some fresh
marine water (you'll have to learn to do this sometime anyway) and keep it at
your house. The 75 probably has as much as 60 gallons of water in it -- you can
replace as much as 20 gallons without bothering the fish too much. Mix it up
three days before the move and keep a circulation pump going in it until the
move (I use an old powerhead dropped to the bottom).

If for some reason you can't move at least 40 gallons of the old water, or the
move might take over half a day, you might check into having the fish boarded
while the tank equilibrates. Ask if your LFS can keep the fish for you for a few
days. If so, you won't have to try to move the water.

I have moved my tank twice with these methods; once by moving most of the water
along and once by boarding my fish for a week. I had no casualties either time.
You might also ask your LFS if you can hire some of their employees to help do
the move.

> Also - one more that I can think of right now... There were two fish
> that I really wanted - I got the dog faced puffer, the other one is a
> black lionfish. Would he fit into this tank at all??


Depends on the size of the other fish -- a lion will eat fish nearly as big
around as he is. There *are* some big damsels and clownfish, but a volitans will
get big enough to eat a percula clown in no time. Most damsels are about that
size too. If you've ever seen a mounted largemouth bass, that'll give you some
idea of how big the mouth on a lion is when he's hungry. One of my lions got to
be over 11" in length, and I've seen several at the Boston aquarium that are bigger.

> And - can I get coral, and anemones with this tank?

Not with the filtration it has. Anemones will survive (I've kept one with a
UGF), but I don't know about corals. I'd also bet that the lighting isn't good
enough for corals, but there are people here more expert than I on that.

> The substarte he is
> using is gravel - should I add live sand, or is gravel ok (I guess it
> is ok, he's been using it for 2 years).


There's a reason they call it an "under*gravel* filter", and that's because
small particles (such as sand) get pulled through the holes in the filter plate
and clog the thing up. You will not be able to use sand with that filter.

> Any advice, websites, or books you can offer is GREAT. I am very exited
> to learn and get prepared for my new hobby.


You will find (to your sorrow) that there are many schools of marine aquaria,
and many of the proponents are militantly religious in support of their
methodology. I recommend that you discuss this with your LFS and adopt *one*
school of thought (preferably that of the owner). Buy the "Bible" for that one
and stick with it for a while. If it doesn't work very well, you can always
blame it on your local fish store.

George Patterson
There's plenty of room for all of God's creatures. Right next to the
mashed potatoes.

--
George Patterson
There's plenty of room for all of God's creatures. Right next to the
mashed potatoes.

[Marc Levenson]

Hi Connie, in addition to the advice you've been given,
please take a moment to read this page to get an idea of
what you are getting yourself into:
http://www.melevsreef.com/overview.htm

If you feel that is something you can do, then take a little
more time to peruse my site. There is tons of information,
so be sure to click on Hidden Treasure as that is the page
that lists all my webpages. The Seach engine at the top of
the page should help you as well

http://www.melevsreef.com

Marc


Connie wrote:
> Hi Guys.. I am pretty excited. I found a deal, that I think is pretty
> good... but I have 5 days to learn as much as I can (luckily I am a
> quick study).
>
> In your opinion, is this a good deal... a two year old well established
> 75 gal salt water tank, 7+ fish (dog-faced puffer, clown, black and
> yellow striped tang, 4 Damsels, 4 choc chipped stars), filters (one
> UGF, and on hanging), decor, wooden stand, food, chemicals, and water
> levels tests... Gravel for the substrate... For $400
>
> Ok - now that we have that out of the way - If it is a good deal, then
> I pick it up on Tuesday. I need as much info as I can get... I am used
> to freshwater, I was pretty proficient at it, with a well planted tank
> and DIY lighting and CO2 stuff...
>
> So here are my questions..What is the biggest differences in fresh
> water and salt in maintenance? What do I NEED to know by Tuesday?
>
> My biggest question is what is the best way to transport this tank and
> reintroduce the fish without losing alot of the biological filter and
> stressing out the fish.
>
> Also - one more that I can think of right now... There were two fish
> that I really wanted - I got the dog faced puffer, the other one is a
> black lionfish. Would he fit into this tank at all??
>
> And - can I get coral, and anemones with this tank? The substarte he is
> using is gravel - should I add live sand, or is gravel ok (I guess it
> is ok, he's been using it for 2 years).
>
> Any advice, websites, or books you can offer is GREAT. I am very exited
> to learn and get prepared for my new hobby.
>

--
Personal Page:
http://www.sparklingfloorservice.com/oanda/index.html
Business Page: http://www.sparklingfloorservice.com
Marine Hobbyist: http://www.melevsreef.com

[CheezWiz]

I could not recommend that a newbie to sal****er take a plunge like this
without at least having a friend who knows what they are doing and could
help..

"Connie" > wrote in message
ups.com...
> Hi Guys.. I am pretty excited. I found a deal, that I think is pretty
> good... but I have 5 days to learn as much as I can (luckily I am a
> quick study).
>
> In your opinion, is this a good deal... a two year old well established
> 75 gal salt water tank, 7+ fish (dog-faced puffer, clown, black and
> yellow striped tang, 4 Damsels, 4 choc chipped stars), filters (one
> UGF, and on hanging), decor, wooden stand, food, chemicals, and water
> levels tests... Gravel for the substrate... For $400

If you are wanting a reef tank, then this is already a bad start and does
not appear to be a good deal to me.
The UGF has gotta go for corals and such..! As for the hang on, still most
likely no good for corals and a reef..
This is a fish only tank and with such things as puffers and choc-chip stars
that is all it can be..


>
> Ok - now that we have that out of the way - If it is a good deal, then
> I pick it up on Tuesday. I need as much info as I can get... I am used
> to freshwater, I was pretty proficient at it, with a well planted tank
> and DIY lighting and CO2 stuff...
>
> So here are my questions..What is the biggest differences in fresh
> water and salt in maintenance? What do I NEED to know by Tuesday?
>
> My biggest question is what is the best way to transport this tank and
> reintroduce the fish without losing alot of the biological filter and
> stressing out the fish.
>
> Also - one more that I can think of right now... There were two fish
> that I really wanted - I got the dog faced puffer, the other one is a
> black lionfish. Would he fit into this tank at all??

Not good in my opinion..

>
> And - can I get coral, and anemones with this tank? The substarte he is
> using is gravel - should I add live sand, or is gravel ok (I guess it
> is ok, he's been using it for 2 years).

No this is a fish only setup. If you want a reef, this is 180 degrees out of
phase..

>
> Any advice, websites, or books you can offer is GREAT. I am very exited
> to learn and get prepared for my new hobby.
>

If you want a reef tank, keep your money and buy "The Natural Reef Aquarium"
by John Tullock.
Read all of it twice. Then decide if you are ready to make the jump to
marine tanks.

If you do, you can follow one of his examples and go slow. This is not
something to rush into on a whim. This tank is all wrong for a reef. Your
money would be better spent towards a real reef ready tank that has been
drilled with overflows like the all-glass models or Oceanic...

Opinions will vary with mileage....
CW

[Sang Kang]

The tank doesn't appear to be a reef tank but fish only.
If your going to convert this to a reef tank then you need to remove certain
fish.
You can search for reef safe fish on google and take out those fish and
keep the rest. For one thing sure, the dog faced puffer need to go.
I have two tank, one with gravel and other with sand. Read the posts or do
some search on the net for pro and con of gravel and sand.
Personally, I don't have any problem with either gravel or sand bed for
reef.
If you go with sand, make sure it's aragonite. Gravel should be crush coral
if not aragonite gravel.

Different corals have different light requirement so ask the fish store guy
for light advice on coral you want to add before you buy.
Important thing here is you need to change the water frequently initially
then when the tank settles you can span the frequency down.

I would recommend you change the water each day at 10% for the first week.
Then do it every other day, then every three day then ever four day.. Get
the idea?

Finally, the normal water change should be 10 to 20% per month.
It's important to keep the fish stress free.
Assuming you have a sump, the water can be added in the sump and take out
from the sump.

Unless your giving fish food, do not add or remove water/chemical directly
to the main tank.

Finally, go buy a good reef test kit and good hydrometer.


"CheezWiz" > wrote in message
...
>I could not recommend that a newbie to sal****er take a plunge like this
>without at least having a friend who knows what they are doing and could
>help..
>
> "Connie" > wrote in message
> ups.com...
>> Hi Guys.. I am pretty excited. I found a deal, that I think is pretty
>> good... but I have 5 days to learn as much as I can (luckily I am a
>> quick study).
>>
>> In your opinion, is this a good deal... a two year old well established
>> 75 gal salt water tank, 7+ fish (dog-faced puffer, clown, black and
>> yellow striped tang, 4 Damsels, 4 choc chipped stars), filters (one
>> UGF, and on hanging), decor, wooden stand, food, chemicals, and water
>> levels tests... Gravel for the substrate... For $400
>
> If you are wanting a reef tank, then this is already a bad start and does
> not appear to be a good deal to me.
> The UGF has gotta go for corals and such..! As for the hang on, still most
> likely no good for corals and a reef..
> This is a fish only tank and with such things as puffers and choc-chip
> stars that is all it can be..
>
>
>>
>> Ok - now that we have that out of the way - If it is a good deal, then
>> I pick it up on Tuesday. I need as much info as I can get... I am used
>> to freshwater, I was pretty proficient at it, with a well planted tank
>> and DIY lighting and CO2 stuff...
>>
>> So here are my questions..What is the biggest differences in fresh
>> water and salt in maintenance? What do I NEED to know by Tuesday?
>>
>> My biggest question is what is the best way to transport this tank and
>> reintroduce the fish without losing alot of the biological filter and
>> stressing out the fish.
>>
>> Also - one more that I can think of right now... There were two fish
>> that I really wanted - I got the dog faced puffer, the other one is a
>> black lionfish. Would he fit into this tank at all??
>
> Not good in my opinion..
>
>>
>> And - can I get coral, and anemones with this tank? The substarte he is
>> using is gravel - should I add live sand, or is gravel ok (I guess it
>> is ok, he's been using it for 2 years).
>
> No this is a fish only setup. If you want a reef, this is 180 degrees out
> of phase..
>
>>
>> Any advice, websites, or books you can offer is GREAT. I am very exited
>> to learn and get prepared for my new hobby.
>>
>
> If you want a reef tank, keep your money and buy "The Natural Reef
> Aquarium" by John Tullock.
> Read all of it twice. Then decide if you are ready to make the jump to
> marine tanks.
>
> If you do, you can follow one of his examples and go slow. This is not
> something to rush into on a whim. This tank is all wrong for a reef. Your
> money would be better spent towards a real reef ready tank that has been
> drilled with overflows like the all-glass models or Oceanic...
>
> Opinions will vary with mileage....
> CW
>
>
>