Need green water help

[Elaine T]

Betcha you've heard that question before...but I did read the FAQ.
Unfortunately, I still have green water and I thought I'd done
everything natural to cure it. I've finally got 75% of the surface of
my 3 barrels shaded with water hyacinth, water lettuce, and duckweed.
The WH has almost doubled in 2 weeks. Oxygenators are growing well,
with about 4 bunches in each barrel. I've got marginals in each barrel
too now - some are just getting started but the Acorus, fiber optic
grass, umbrella palm and canna lily are growing well. I also started
some watercress and it seems to be taking hold. My newly planted Iris
are breaking the surface now, and pickerel is getting close. I can't
see the water lily in the green water so no idea whether it's growing or
not.

I've tested the water and there's no ammonia, nitrite, or even nitrate.
pH is 7.4. I don't have a phosphate test. It seems I have enough
biofiltration. I have two of these 4" strainers
http://www.calpump.com/productsub.asp?modelno=CFS170T&category=10 on my
pump intake covered with their thick foam prefilters and filled with
bioballs. Actually one is half Chemi Pure and half bioballs at the
moment. I have about 65 gallons of water housing 3 2" shubunkins, 3
white clouds, 2 gambusia, and some ramshorn snails. The smaller fish
have been in the pond for a total of 10 weeks with the first shubie
added a little over a month ago.

The plants have apparantly finally sucked all the nitrates out of the
water, according to plan. The nitrate has dropped from about 5-7 ppm to
zero since I added the WH and duckweed. I've also been fertilizing
regularly with iron, trace elements, and potash the way I do fishtanks
to help the plants out. Even the green fuzz has slowed down to the
point that the fish and snails are keeping it lawnmowed. Bu the green
water keeps right on going.

So, I have shaded water, no nitrates, a TON of now nitrogen-starved
plantlife, hopefully adequte filtration and the water is still so green
and murky I can't see deeper than about 6". Fish? What fish?

I'm at a loss. Chemicals are not an option as I intend to eat my
watercress, and the cost of a UV unit is currently prohibitive. Do I
need more filtration, even though there's no ammonia or nitrite? Do I
leave things alone and wait now that nitrates are zero? Do I add
nitrate in case the plants are starved for it and can't outcompete the
algae? Should I try a flocculating agent? Help!

--
Elaine T __
http://eethomp.com/fish.html <'__><
rec.aquaria.* FAQ http://faq.thekrib.com

[~Roy~]

I have seen good and bad come out of useing a floculate. Some require
light for so many hours and so many ours of continuous filtration and
lots of filter cleaning. I know you said your not wanting to use
chemicals, but aluminum sulphate is not harmfull. I am a a true
believer in it, in the form of Baraclear-80.....If it can turn my
natural pond into a very good looking and nice water quality like it
did I am sure it would work for a liner or barrel setup as well. I had
thought my water was nice and clear late last year, but this year its
just never been like this before and absolutely great.........

On Thu, 21 Apr 2005 21:02:56 GMT, Elaine T >
wrote:

>===<>Betcha you've heard that question before...but I did read the FAQ.
>===<>Unfortunately, I still have green water and I thought I'd done
>===<>everything natural to cure it. I've finally got 75% of the surface of
>===<>my 3 barrels shaded with water hyacinth, water lettuce, and duckweed.
>===<>The WH has almost doubled in 2 weeks. Oxygenators are growing well,
>===<>with about 4 bunches in each barrel. I've got marginals in each barrel
>===<>too now - some are just getting started but the Acorus, fiber optic
>===<>grass, umbrella palm and canna lily are growing well. I also started
>===<>some watercress and it seems to be taking hold. My newly planted Iris
>===<>are breaking the surface now, and pickerel is getting close. I can't
>===<>see the water lily in the green water so no idea whether it's growing or
>===<>not.
>===<>
>===<>I've tested the water and there's no ammonia, nitrite, or even nitrate.
>===<> pH is 7.4. I don't have a phosphate test. It seems I have enough
>===<>biofiltration. I have two of these 4" strainers
>===<>http://www.calpump.com/productsub.asp?modelno=CFS170T&category=10 on my
>===<>pump intake covered with their thick foam prefilters and filled with
>===<>bioballs. Actually one is half Chemi Pure and half bioballs at the
>===<>moment. I have about 65 gallons of water housing 3 2" shubunkins, 3
>===<>white clouds, 2 gambusia, and some ramshorn snails. The smaller fish
>===<>have been in the pond for a total of 10 weeks with the first shubie
>===<>added a little over a month ago.
>===<>
>===<>The plants have apparantly finally sucked all the nitrates out of the
>===<>water, according to plan. The nitrate has dropped from about 5-7 ppm to
>===<>zero since I added the WH and duckweed. I've also been fertilizing
>===<>regularly with iron, trace elements, and potash the way I do fishtanks
>===<>to help the plants out. Even the green fuzz has slowed down to the
>===<>point that the fish and snails are keeping it lawnmowed. Bu the green
>===<>water keeps right on going.
>===<>
>===<>So, I have shaded water, no nitrates, a TON of now nitrogen-starved
>===<>plantlife, hopefully adequte filtration and the water is still so green
>===<>and murky I can't see deeper than about 6". Fish? What fish?
>===<>
>===<>I'm at a loss. Chemicals are not an option as I intend to eat my
>===<>watercress, and the cost of a UV unit is currently prohibitive. Do I
>===<>need more filtration, even though there's no ammonia or nitrite? Do I
>===<>leave things alone and wait now that nitrates are zero? Do I add
>===<>nitrate in case the plants are starved for it and can't outcompete the
>===<>algae? Should I try a flocculating agent? Help!


==============================================
Put some color in your cheeks...garden naked!

[Gale Pearce]

"Elaine T" > wrote in message
m...
> Betcha you've heard that question before...but I did read the FAQ.
> Unfortunately, I still have green water and I thought I'd done
> everything natural to cure it. I've finally got 75% of the surface of
> my 3 barrels shaded with water hyacinth, water lettuce, and duckweed.

IMHO - you have done what needs to be done for clear water and only need to
wait for the "algae bloom" to die off from starvation (sounds good, but I
know it is difficult!) A bacteria additive also helps as it boosts the level
of bacteria in your pond - I use it on a regular basis as it also eats up
the mulm (sludge) and dead plant material in the bottom of my pond - my pond
goes clear within 3 days of firing up my 45 gal bio filter with no surface
coverage yet (open water)
Gale :~)

[RichToyBox]

Patience, Patience, Patience. That is the one sure ingredient in any system
that works, and it sounds like you have the rest of the system in place.
--
RichToyBox
http://www.geocities.com/richtoybox/pondintro.html

"Elaine T" > wrote in message
m...
> Betcha you've heard that question before...but I did read the FAQ.
> Unfortunately, I still have green water and I thought I'd done everything
> natural to cure it. I've finally got 75% of the surface of my 3 barrels
> shaded with water hyacinth, water lettuce, and duckweed. The WH has almost
> doubled in 2 weeks. Oxygenators are growing well, with about 4 bunches in
> each barrel. I've got marginals in each barrel too now - some are just
> getting started but the Acorus, fiber optic grass, umbrella palm and canna
> lily are growing well. I also started some watercress and it seems to be
> taking hold. My newly planted Iris are breaking the surface now, and
> pickerel is getting close. I can't see the water lily in the green water
> so no idea whether it's growing or not.
>
> I've tested the water and there's no ammonia, nitrite, or even nitrate. pH
> is 7.4. I don't have a phosphate test. It seems I have enough
> biofiltration. I have two of these 4" strainers
> http://www.calpump.com/productsub.asp?modelno=CFS170T&category=10 on my
> pump intake covered with their thick foam prefilters and filled with
> bioballs. Actually one is half Chemi Pure and half bioballs at the
> moment. I have about 65 gallons of water housing 3 2" shubunkins, 3 white
> clouds, 2 gambusia, and some ramshorn snails. The smaller fish have been
> in the pond for a total of 10 weeks with the first shubie added a little
> over a month ago.
>
> The plants have apparantly finally sucked all the nitrates out of the
> water, according to plan. The nitrate has dropped from about 5-7 ppm to
> zero since I added the WH and duckweed. I've also been fertilizing
> regularly with iron, trace elements, and potash the way I do fishtanks to
> help the plants out. Even the green fuzz has slowed down to the point
> that the fish and snails are keeping it lawnmowed. Bu the green water
> keeps right on going.
>
> So, I have shaded water, no nitrates, a TON of now nitrogen-starved
> plantlife, hopefully adequte filtration and the water is still so green
> and murky I can't see deeper than about 6". Fish? What fish?
>
> I'm at a loss. Chemicals are not an option as I intend to eat my
> watercress, and the cost of a UV unit is currently prohibitive. Do I need
> more filtration, even though there's no ammonia or nitrite? Do I leave
> things alone and wait now that nitrates are zero? Do I add nitrate in
> case the plants are starved for it and can't outcompete the algae? Should
> I try a flocculating agent? Help!
>
> --
> Elaine T __
> http://eethomp.com/fish.html <'__><
> rec.aquaria.* FAQ http://faq.thekrib.com

[Elaine T]

Gale Pearce wrote:
> "Elaine T" > wrote in message
> m...
>
>>Betcha you've heard that question before...but I did read the FAQ.
>>Unfortunately, I still have green water and I thought I'd done
>>everything natural to cure it. I've finally got 75% of the surface of
>>my 3 barrels shaded with water hyacinth, water lettuce, and duckweed.
>
>
> IMHO - you have done what needs to be done for clear water and only need to
> wait for the "algae bloom" to die off from starvation (sounds good, but I
> know it is difficult!) A bacteria additive also helps as it boosts the level
> of bacteria in your pond - I use it on a regular basis as it also eats up
> the mulm (sludge) and dead plant material in the bottom of my pond - my pond
> goes clear within 3 days of firing up my 45 gal bio filter with no surface
> coverage yet (open water)
> Gale :~)
>
>
I was afraid I'd have to wait. LOL!

Is EcoFix the kind of bacteria you're talking about? I picked some up a
while ago by mistake thinking it was nitrifying bacteria. If that's the
stuff, I'll go add some.

--
Elaine T __
http://eethomp.com/fish.html <'__><
rec.aquaria.* FAQ http://faq.thekrib.com

[kathy]

I'd add time to your mixture of solutions.
Time and patience.
Lots of patience ;-)

kathy
www.blogfromthebog.com

[kathy]

I'm going to add time, patience,
more time, extra patience. ;-)

kathy
www.blogfromthebog.com

[kathy]

ak!
I didn't mean to post it twice but google, the internet
or my computer have been a bit odd today...!

k

[[email protected]]

here's my mixture of solutions:

uv sterilizer
barley straw
lots of aquatic plants

i think that plants and straw alone should control the algae. a uv
sterlizer is harmless to plants and fish. chemicals are the wrong
route, unless it's barley extract, but whatever works for you.

[Elaine T]

wrote:
> here's my mixture of solutions:
>
> uv sterilizer
> barley straw
> lots of aquatic plants
>
> i think that plants and straw alone should control the algae. a uv
> sterlizer is harmless to plants and fish. chemicals are the wrong
> route, unless it's barley extract, but whatever works for you.
>
Thanks. Forgot to mention in my first post that I've had some barley
straw going for a month now, so I don't have any blanketweed. (Thank
heavens) Really no troublesome algae other than the green water.

When you say aquatic plants, do you mean true aquatics like anacharis or
anything that takes nutrients from the water including marginals in
baskets and floaters? I'm probably light on the true aquatics - I have
8 bunches of different plants plus a flat of valisneria that's just
getting started.

I wish I could afford UV, but not at the moment. Besides, UV oxidizes
all the nice iron and trace elements I'm adding for the plants so I
wouldn't want to have to run it all the time anyway.

--
Elaine T __
http://eethomp.com/fish.html <'__><
rec.aquaria.* FAQ http://faq.thekrib.com

[Gale Pearce]

> Is EcoFix the kind of bacteria you're talking about? I picked some up a
> while ago by mistake thinking it was nitrifying bacteria. If that's the
> stuff, I'll go add some.
>
Hi Elaine - I don't know "EcoFix" - if it is a bacteria additive , it should
help. I use "Bacta Pur" myself. The bottle will tell you if it is bacteria.
I don't use floctulants (sp?) or anything else in my pond - only the
bacteria additive
Gale :~)

[~ jan JJsPond.us]

>On Thu, 21 Apr 2005 21:02:56 GMT, Elaine T > wrote:

>Betcha you've heard that question before...but I did read the FAQ.
>Unfortunately, I still have green water and I thought I'd done
>everything natural to cure it.

Stop any fertilizer and do water changes of 10% every 5-7 days, no more, no
less. More can cause green water in some places, less just isn't enough.
There will be enough traces elements in the fresh water to feed the plants.
Anything in baskets/pots with soil, feed with rose stakes buried into their
soil.

Some fertilizer mixtures add more stuff than what it is listed. Especially
if using something not listed for aquatic use. ~ jan


See my ponds and filter design:
www.jjspond.us

~Keep 'em Wet!~
Tri-Cities WA Zone 7a
To e-mail see website

[Elaine T]

~ jan JJsPond.us wrote:
>>On Thu, 21 Apr 2005 21:02:56 GMT, Elaine T > wrote:
>
>
>>Betcha you've heard that question before...but I did read the FAQ.
>>Unfortunately, I still have green water and I thought I'd done
>>everything natural to cure it.
>
>
> Stop any fertilizer and do water changes of 10% every 5-7 days, no more, no
> less. More can cause green water in some places, less just isn't enough.
> There will be enough traces elements in the fresh water to feed the plants.
> Anything in baskets/pots with soil, feed with rose stakes buried into their
> soil.
>
> Some fertilizer mixtures add more stuff than what it is listed. Especially
> if using something not listed for aquatic use. ~ jan
>
>
> See my ponds and filter design:
> www.jjspond.us
>
> ~Keep 'em Wet!~
> Tri-Cities WA Zone 7a
> To e-mail see website

I use fabric lined baskets or pots with Fluorite or Schultz Aquatic
Soil. They are loose, porous media and I don't understand how the
nitrate and phosphate from rose spikes wouldn't get out into the water
with as many plants and as small a volume of water as I have. Don't I
need the plants to be living on nutrients in the water?

--
Elaine T __
http://eethomp.com/fish.html <'__><
rec.aquaria.* FAQ http://faq.thekrib.com

[~ jan JJsPond.us]

>
>I use fabric lined baskets or pots with Fluorite or Schultz Aquatic
>Soil. They are loose, porous media and I don't understand how the
>nitrate and phosphate from rose spikes wouldn't get out into the water
>with as many plants and as small a volume of water as I have. Don't I
>need the plants to be living on nutrients in the water?

Fertilizers, especially phosphate bind with the soil, especially clays, so
they don't leach. Many of us feed our plants thus, and have no green water.
~ jan

~Power to the Porg, Flow On!~

[Elaine T]

~ jan JJsPond.us wrote:
>>I use fabric lined baskets or pots with Fluorite or Schultz Aquatic
>>Soil. They are loose, porous media and I don't understand how the
>>nitrate and phosphate from rose spikes wouldn't get out into the water
>>with as many plants and as small a volume of water as I have. Don't I
>>need the plants to be living on nutrients in the water?
>
>
> Fertilizers, especially phosphate bind with the soil, especially clays, so
> they don't leach. Many of us feed our plants thus, and have no green water.
> ~ jan
>
> ~Power to the Porg, Flow On!~

Gotcha! Thanks so much for the explanation. I really like to
understand what I'm doing and how it works.

--
Elaine T __
http://eethomp.com/fish.html <'__><
rec.aquaria.* FAQ http://faq.thekrib.com