Shy cories

[Bill]

Our cories are really shy. They were more sociable (although still
fairly skittish) when we first got them. As far as the water goes, it's
a steady 78 degrees F, 0 ammonia and nitrite, and very little nitrate
(we keep it as low as possible, between 5 and 15). As far as decoration
and cover, there are no live plants, two caves (one larger and one
smaller), and two plastic plants. The tank itself is 20 gallons, and we
use hard (about 17dH), buffered (about 7dH), dechlorinated (chlorine
only -- no chloramines), basic (pH about 8.2) tapwater. There is a
bubble wand along the back, and they used to play in the bubbles, but
they haven't lately very much. The particular species is C.
melanistius.

Any ideas on why they're hiding out? I suspect that they might want
more hiding places. Another possibility is that they feel nervous with
no other fish in the tank, but I don't know why they would wait until
now to express that. One of our land-dwelling cats is mildly interested
in the tank -- sometimes he will stand up with his front paws on the
stand and look into the tank. Might he be stressing them out? We are
feeding them one small Hikari algae wafer or two or three Omega shrimp
pellets once a day in the evening. There are six of them. Should we
feed different foods, more food, more servings, or do anything else
differently?

It's kind of frustrating -- I never have seen them much, and I've barely
seen them at all lately. They are so cute when they play and dart to
the surface.

Thanks for any ideas.

--
"Usenet is like a herd of performing elephants with diarrhea -- massive,
difficult to redirect, awe-inspiring, entertaining, and a source of mind -
boggling amounts of excrement when you least expect it." -- Gene Spafford, 1992

[Jim Anderson]

In article <rFUbe.34$PW1.4@fed1read05>,
says...
> Our cories are really shy. They were more sociable (although still
> fairly skittish) when we first got them. As far as the water goes, it's
> a steady 78 degrees F, 0 ammonia and nitrite, and very little nitrate
> (we keep it as low as possible, between 5 and 15). As far as decoration
> and cover, there are no live plants, two caves (one larger and one
> smaller), and two plastic plants. The tank itself is 20 gallons, and we
> use hard (about 17dH), buffered (about 7dH), dechlorinated (chlorine
> only -- no chloramines), basic (pH about 8.2) tapwater. There is a
> bubble wand along the back, and they used to play in the bubbles, but
> they haven't lately very much. The particular species is C.
> melanistius.
>
> Any ideas on why they're hiding out? I suspect that they might want
> more hiding places. Another possibility is that they feel nervous with
> no other fish in the tank, but I don't know why they would wait until
> now to express that. One of our land-dwelling cats is mildly interested
> in the tank -- sometimes he will stand up with his front paws on the
> stand and look into the tank. Might he be stressing them out? We are
> feeding them one small Hikari algae wafer or two or three Omega shrimp
> pellets once a day in the evening. There are six of them. Should we
> feed different foods, more food, more servings, or do anything else
> differently?
>
> It's kind of frustrating -- I never have seen them much, and I've barely
> seen them at all lately. They are so cute when they play and dart to
> the surface.
>
> Thanks for any ideas.
>
>

My cories don't hide but they do freeze, motionless when I first
approach the tank.

Lots of fish will hide if there are no other fish in the tank, that is
why alot of cichlids require dither fish. When they see the other fish
swimming around, they know it is safe to come out of hiding.
My electric yellow labs were hiding allot when I first got them, as soon
as I added some rainbow fish they came out and are all over the tank.

Just an idea.
--
Jim Anderson
( 8(|) To email me just pull my_finger

[MarAzul]

"Bill" > wrote in message
news:rFUbe.34$PW1.4@fed1read05...
> Our cories are really shy. They were more sociable (although still
> fairly skittish) when we first got them. As far as the water goes, it's
> a steady 78 degrees F, 0 ammonia and nitrite, and very little nitrate
> (we keep it as low as possible, between 5 and 15). As far as decoration
> and cover, there are no live plants, two caves (one larger and one
> smaller), and two plastic plants. The tank itself is 20 gallons, and we
> use hard (about 17dH), buffered (about 7dH), dechlorinated (chlorine
> only -- no chloramines), basic (pH about 8.2) tapwater. There is a
> bubble wand along the back, and they used to play in the bubbles, but
> they haven't lately very much. The particular species is C.
> melanistius.
>
> Any ideas on why they're hiding out? I suspect that they might want
> more hiding places. Another possibility is that they feel nervous with
> no other fish in the tank, but I don't know why they would wait until
> now to express that. One of our land-dwelling cats is mildly interested
> in the tank -- sometimes he will stand up with his front paws on the
> stand and look into the tank. Might he be stressing them out? We are
> feeding them one small Hikari algae wafer or two or three Omega shrimp
> pellets once a day in the evening. There are six of them. Should we
> feed different foods, more food, more servings, or do anything else
> differently?
>
> It's kind of frustrating -- I never have seen them much, and I've barely
> seen them at all lately. They are so cute when they play and dart to
> the surface.
>
> Thanks for any ideas.
>

As far as I know, cories aren't usually affected by a lack of top-dwelling
fish around them. Personally, I have at least one "regular" fish in each
cory tank, but I know several very successful cory breeders who keep them in
a species only tank and they're perfectly content.

Since cories are a shoaling fish, they'll generally be more active if
there's more of them. Six or more are usually recomended for a good shoal to
form, so you should be okay, but, since you have a 20 gallon (and you don't
say whether it's tall or long) you can always add more.

Another thing to consider is that some species are more 'sociable' than
others. My bronze, panda and metae are out and about all the time, but any
of my spotted species are usually fairly calm and sedate. If do go the route
of adding more, maybe some bronze or pepper cories would be a nice addition.

As for your feeding, are you sure they're eating the shrimp pellets? If they
are, great, but I never got mine to eat them. And cories are scavengers, not
algae eaters so the algae disk you feed them won't do much for them in the
long run. It's better to get a general Bottom Feeder disk instead (it
usually has a pic of a cory on the front). Mine get a few disks once or
twice a week but their main diet consists of frozen bloodworms or brine
shrimp.

Mar

[Bill]

On 2005-04-27, Jim Anderson > wrote:
> My cories don't hide but they do freeze, motionless when I first
> approach the tank.

I've noticed that I have to sneak up on the tank and not get too close
if I want to observe them. :-)

> Lots of fish will hide if there are no other fish in the tank, that is
> why alot of cichlids require dither fish. When they see the other fish
> swimming around, they know it is safe to come out of hiding.
> My electric yellow labs were hiding allot when I first got them, as soon
> as I added some rainbow fish they came out and are all over the tank.

It occurred to me that this might be partly a lack-of-dither-fish
effect. We're going to have other fish with them soon, but we need to
get our mid-sized 80 first, and then this 20 will be a quarantine tank
in the short term.

--
"Usenet is like a herd of performing elephants with diarrhea -- massive,
difficult to redirect, awe-inspiring, entertaining, and a source of mind -
boggling amounts of excrement when you least expect it." -- Gene Spafford, 1992

[Bill]

On 2005-04-28, MarAzul > wrote:
> As far as I know, cories aren't usually affected by a lack of top-dwelling
> fish around them. Personally, I have at least one "regular" fish in each
> cory tank, but I know several very successful cory breeders who keep them in
> a species only tank and they're perfectly content.

Well, this is good to know.

> Since cories are a shoaling fish, they'll generally be more active if
> there's more of them. Six or more are usually recomended for a good shoal to
> form, so you should be okay, but, since you have a 20 gallon (and you don't
> say whether it's tall or long) you can always add more.

I did leave that out, even though I was trying to include all the
information I could. :-) It's tall.

> Another thing to consider is that some species are more 'sociable' than
> others. My bronze, panda and metae are out and about all the time, but any
> of my spotted species are usually fairly calm and sedate. If do go the route
> of adding more, maybe some bronze or pepper cories would be a nice addition.

I'm not sure what the common name is, but they are spotted. There are a
couple pictures of the species (not of mine in particular) at
<http://www.planetcatfish.com/catelog/callicht/corydora/311_f.php>. Do
different species of cory all get along well? Should they also be kept
in groups of 4-6 or more by species, or are they okay in smaller species
groups as long as there are at least 6 as a genus?

> As for your feeding, are you sure they're eating the shrimp pellets? If they
> are, great, but I never got mine to eat them. And cories are scavengers, not
> algae eaters so the algae disk you feed them won't do much for them in the
> long run. It's better to get a general Bottom Feeder disk instead (it
> usually has a pic of a cory on the front). Mine get a few disks once or
> twice a week but their main diet consists of frozen bloodworms or brine
> shrimp.

I've watched them go after the shrimp pellets (second from the bottom on
<http://www.omegasea.net/products2.html>) with gusto. Also, I misspoke
-- they're getting "Sinking Wafers"
(<http://www.hikari.info/tropical/t_03.html>, complete with cory picture
on the packaging), not algae wafers. Thanks for the suggestions for
other foods. Do you think that freeze-dried bloodworms would be okay?
(I already have some for the bettas.)

--
"Usenet is like a herd of performing elephants with diarrhea -- massive,
difficult to redirect, awe-inspiring, entertaining, and a source of mind -
boggling amounts of excrement when you least expect it." -- Gene Spafford, 1992

[MarAzul]

"Bill" > wrote in message
news:2Sfce.191$%o.170@fed1read05...
> On 2005-04-28, MarAzul > wrote:
>> Another thing to consider is that some species are more 'sociable' than
>> others. My bronze, panda and metae are out and about all the time, but
>> any
>> of my spotted species are usually fairly calm and sedate. If do go the
>> route
>> of adding more, maybe some bronze or pepper cories would be a nice
>> addition.
>
> I'm not sure what the common name is, but they are spotted. There are a
> couple pictures of the species (not of mine in particular) at
> <http://www.planetcatfish.com/catelog/callicht/corydora/311_f.php>. Do
> different species of cory all get along well? Should they also be kept
> in groups of 4-6 or more by species, or are they okay in smaller species
> groups as long as there are at least 6 as a genus?
>

I think that all depends on what species you're talking about, and who
you're talking to. :o) In general, cories get along with each other, no
matter what the species. From what I've observered though, some species tend
to school more redily than others. My spotted cories schooled with each
other and with the other cats in the tank with no problems, and I know they
weren't all the same.
Some people will tell you that it doesn't matter if you have 6 cories of
different species, and it probably doesn't negativly affect them, but I'm
not a fan. In a large group setting (say15-30 cories), I prefer to have at
least 4 of the same species. I think it looks nice, and I think it make them
a bit more secure in their environment. If you're interested in breeding,
it's better to have more as well, as cories don't (as a general rule)
hybridize. With the cat's you have, it may not be easy to properly identify
what you have, but like I said, these are general guidelines. :o)

>> As for your feeding, are you sure they're eating the shrimp pellets? If
>> they
>> are, great, but I never got mine to eat them. And cories are scavengers,
>> not
>> algae eaters so the algae disk you feed them won't do much for them in
>> the
>> long run. It's better to get a general Bottom Feeder disk instead (it
>> usually has a pic of a cory on the front). Mine get a few disks once or
>> twice a week but their main diet consists of frozen bloodworms or brine
>> shrimp.
>
> I've watched them go after the shrimp pellets (second from the bottom on
> <http://www.omegasea.net/products2.html>) with gusto. Also, I misspoke
> -- they're getting "Sinking Wafers"
> (<http://www.hikari.info/tropical/t_03.html>, complete with cory picture
> on the packaging), not algae wafers. Thanks for the suggestions for
> other foods. Do you think that freeze-dried bloodworms would be okay?
> (I already have some for the bettas.)
>

Those are the disks I used. My cories love 'em (and I've had a bala shark or
two munch down on them). I've never had much luck with freeze dried. They
don't sink well and I've heard rumors that freeze-dried isn't the best
nutritionally for fish. I feed my bettas the frozen bloodworms (once they've
thawed) and they LOVE them! They didn't care about the dried worms. It's a
case of YMMV. If it works for you, go for it!

Have you thought about adding one of your bettas to the tank to see if that
helps stimulate the cories? It may not work with all bettas because some are
natural bullies, but I have a betta in with a hoard of cories and they get
along just fine..

Mar

[NetMax]

"MarAzul" > wrote in message
news:TVjce.5132$_o.3830@fed1read03...
> "Bill" > wrote in message
> news:2Sfce.191$%o.170@fed1read05...
>> On 2005-04-28, MarAzul > wrote:
>>> Another thing to consider is that some species are more 'sociable'
>>> than
>>> others. My bronze, panda and metae are out and about all the time,
>>> but any
>>> of my spotted species are usually fairly calm and sedate. If do go
>>> the route
>>> of adding more, maybe some bronze or pepper cories would be a nice
>>> addition.
>>
>> I'm not sure what the common name is, but they are spotted. There are
>> a
>> couple pictures of the species (not of mine in particular) at
>> <http://www.planetcatfish.com/catelog/callicht/corydora/311_f.php>.
>> Do
>> different species of cory all get along well? Should they also be
>> kept
>> in groups of 4-6 or more by species, or are they okay in smaller
>> species
>> groups as long as there are at least 6 as a genus?
>>
>
> I think that all depends on what species you're talking about, and who
> you're talking to. :o) In general, cories get along with each other, no
> matter what the species. From what I've observered though, some species
> tend to school more redily than others. My spotted cories schooled with
> each other and with the other cats in the tank with no problems, and I
> know they weren't all the same.
> Some people will tell you that it doesn't matter if you have 6 cories
> of different species, and it probably doesn't negativly affect them,
> but I'm not a fan. In a large group setting (say15-30 cories), I prefer
> to have at least 4 of the same species. I think it looks nice, and I
> think it make them a bit more secure in their environment. If you're
> interested in breeding, it's better to have more as well, as cories
> don't (as a general rule) hybridize. With the cat's you have, it may
> not be easy to properly identify what you have, but like I said, these
> are general guidelines. :o)
>
>>> As for your feeding, are you sure they're eating the shrimp pellets?
>>> If they
>>> are, great, but I never got mine to eat them. And cories are
>>> scavengers, not
>>> algae eaters so the algae disk you feed them won't do much for them
>>> in the
>>> long run. It's better to get a general Bottom Feeder disk instead (it
>>> usually has a pic of a cory on the front). Mine get a few disks once
>>> or
>>> twice a week but their main diet consists of frozen bloodworms or
>>> brine
>>> shrimp.
>>
>> I've watched them go after the shrimp pellets (second from the bottom
>> on
>> <http://www.omegasea.net/products2.html>) with gusto. Also, I
>> misspoke
>> -- they're getting "Sinking Wafers"
>> (<http://www.hikari.info/tropical/t_03.html>, complete with cory
>> picture
>> on the packaging), not algae wafers. Thanks for the suggestions for
>> other foods. Do you think that freeze-dried bloodworms would be okay?
>> (I already have some for the bettas.)
>>
>
> Those are the disks I used. My cories love 'em (and I've had a bala
> shark or two munch down on them). I've never had much luck with freeze
> dried. They don't sink well and I've heard rumors that freeze-dried
> isn't the best nutritionally for fish. I feed my bettas the frozen
> bloodworms (once they've thawed) and they LOVE them! They didn't care
> about the dried worms. It's a case of YMMV. If it works for you, go for
> it!
>
> Have you thought about adding one of your bettas to the tank to see if
> that helps stimulate the cories? It may not work with all bettas
> because some are natural bullies, but I have a betta in with a hoard of
> cories and they get along just fine..
>
> Mar


I've had Bettas with Corys, worked great. The substrate can also affect
Cory's browsing behaviour (sand and small rounded gravel is best) as can
the color (natural & darker as opposed to very bright or high contrast).
Light levels (more comfortable in subdued lighting and heavy ground cover
(throw in some leaf litter, low plants and driftwood they can go under).
I used to throw Terbang leaves in (they could play hide & seek). Tough
to predict how they will socialize between species. Might have more to
do with their age and tank-mates as they were growing up. I once brought
in a large shipment of wild-caught from the Amazon, about 10 species,
similar sizes. They seemed to show a loose favouritism in who they would
hang out with, but not enough to make any predictions. In general,
except for the obvious different 'size classes' such as Pygmy, Panda,
Bronze etc, they make their own choices.
--
www.NetMax.tk

[NetMax]

"NetMax" > wrote in message
. ..
> "MarAzul" > wrote in message
> news:TVjce.5132$_o.3830@fed1read03...
>> "Bill" > wrote in message
>> news:2Sfce.191$%o.170@fed1read05...
>>> On 2005-04-28, MarAzul > wrote:
>>>> Another thing to consider is that some species are more 'sociable'
>>>> than
>>>> others. My bronze, panda and metae are out and about all the time,
>>>> but any
>>>> of my spotted species are usually fairly calm and sedate. If do go
>>>> the route
>>>> of adding more, maybe some bronze or pepper cories would be a nice
>>>> addition.
>>>
>>> I'm not sure what the common name is, but they are spotted. There
>>> are a
>>> couple pictures of the species (not of mine in particular) at
>>> <http://www.planetcatfish.com/catelog/callicht/corydora/311_f.php>.
>>> Do
>>> different species of cory all get along well? Should they also be
>>> kept
>>> in groups of 4-6 or more by species, or are they okay in smaller
>>> species
>>> groups as long as there are at least 6 as a genus?
>>>
>>
>> I think that all depends on what species you're talking about, and who
>> you're talking to. :o) In general, cories get along with each other,
>> no matter what the species. From what I've observered though, some
>> species tend to school more redily than others. My spotted cories
>> schooled with each other and with the other cats in the tank with no
>> problems, and I know they weren't all the same.
>> Some people will tell you that it doesn't matter if you have 6 cories
>> of different species, and it probably doesn't negativly affect them,
>> but I'm not a fan. In a large group setting (say15-30 cories), I
>> prefer to have at least 4 of the same species. I think it looks nice,
>> and I think it make them a bit more secure in their environment. If
>> you're interested in breeding, it's better to have more as well, as
>> cories don't (as a general rule) hybridize. With the cat's you have,
>> it may not be easy to properly identify what you have, but like I
>> said, these are general guidelines. :o)
>>
>>>> As for your feeding, are you sure they're eating the shrimp pellets?
>>>> If they
>>>> are, great, but I never got mine to eat them. And cories are
>>>> scavengers, not
>>>> algae eaters so the algae disk you feed them won't do much for them
>>>> in the
>>>> long run. It's better to get a general Bottom Feeder disk instead
>>>> (it
>>>> usually has a pic of a cory on the front). Mine get a few disks once
>>>> or
>>>> twice a week but their main diet consists of frozen bloodworms or
>>>> brine
>>>> shrimp.
>>>
>>> I've watched them go after the shrimp pellets (second from the bottom
>>> on
>>> <http://www.omegasea.net/products2.html>) with gusto. Also, I
>>> misspoke
>>> -- they're getting "Sinking Wafers"
>>> (<http://www.hikari.info/tropical/t_03.html>, complete with cory
>>> picture
>>> on the packaging), not algae wafers. Thanks for the suggestions for
>>> other foods. Do you think that freeze-dried bloodworms would be
>>> okay?
>>> (I already have some for the bettas.)
>>>
>>
>> Those are the disks I used. My cories love 'em (and I've had a bala
>> shark or two munch down on them). I've never had much luck with freeze
>> dried. They don't sink well and I've heard rumors that freeze-dried
>> isn't the best nutritionally for fish. I feed my bettas the frozen
>> bloodworms (once they've thawed) and they LOVE them! They didn't care
>> about the dried worms. It's a case of YMMV. If it works for you, go
>> for it!
>>
>> Have you thought about adding one of your bettas to the tank to see if
>> that helps stimulate the cories? It may not work with all bettas
>> because some are natural bullies, but I have a betta in with a hoard
>> of cories and they get along just fine..
>>
>> Mar
>
>
> I've had Bettas with Corys, worked great. The substrate can also
> affect Cory's browsing behaviour (sand and small rounded gravel is
> best) as can the color (natural & darker as opposed to very bright or
> high contrast). Light levels (more comfortable in subdued lighting and
> heavy ground cover (throw in some leaf litter, low plants and driftwood
> they can go under). I used to throw Terbang leaves in (they could play
> hide & seek). Tough to predict how they will socialize between
> species. Might have more to do with their age and tank-mates as they
> were growing up. I once brought in a large shipment of wild-caught
> from the Amazon, about 10 species, similar sizes. They seemed to show
> a loose favouritism in who they would hang out with, but not enough to
> make any predictions. In general, except for the obvious different
> 'size classes' such as Pygmy, Panda, Bronze etc, they make their own
> choices.
> --
> www.NetMax.tk


Also I've never had corys in 8.2pH, so I do not know if this would affect
them as you're seeing. hth
--
www.NetMax.tk

[Bill]

On 2005-04-29, MarAzul > wrote:
> not a fan. In a large group setting (say15-30 cories), I prefer to have at
> least 4 of the same species. I think it looks nice, and I think it make them
> a bit more secure in their environment. If you're interested in breeding,
> it's better to have more as well, as cories don't (as a general rule)

I'm not interested in breeding fish, at least not now. I agree that it
would look nicer, and it makes sense that they would feel more
comfortable/secure with number of their own particular species.

> hybridize. With the cat's you have, it may not be easy to properly identify
> what you have, but like I said, these are general guidelines. :o)

Ah, okay. :-) I thought I'd mentioned that they're C. melanistius, but
I might have missed it.

> Have you thought about adding one of your bettas to the tank to see if that
> helps stimulate the cories? It may not work with all bettas because some are
> natural bullies, but I have a betta in with a hoard of cories and they get
> along just fine..

I'd rather keep my betta on my desk so that he's with me when I'm
messing with the computer. :-) (He's in a filtered and heated MiniBow
5.) Since I started this thread, though, we've seen them out swimming
around and playing; they just hide really quickly once they notice us.
Another possibility is that they don't like the substrate we have in the
tank; it's an epoxy-coated gravel that's probably too large for them.
We're planning on switching to sand, so maybe they'll feel more
comfortable after that. We also have new tankmates for them in
quarantine.

Thanks for your advice.

--
"Usenet is like a herd of performing elephants with diarrhea -- massive,
difficult to redirect, awe-inspiring, entertaining, and a source of mind -
boggling amounts of excrement when you least expect it." -- Gene Spafford, 1992

[Bill]

On 2005-04-30, NetMax > wrote:
> I've had Bettas with Corys, worked great. The substrate can also affect
> Cory's browsing behaviour (sand and small rounded gravel is best) as can
> the color (natural & darker as opposed to very bright or high contrast).

The substrate is small, natural-colored, epoxy-coated gravel. We're
going to change it to sand at some point soon. These cories are on the
smaller end of the spectrum, and the individual grains are probably not
quite as big as their heads, on average.

> Light levels (more comfortable in subdued lighting and heavy ground cover
> (throw in some leaf litter, low plants and driftwood they can go under).
> I used to throw Terbang leaves in (they could play hide & seek). Tough

It's very possible that they want more cover. We currently have two
caves and two plastic plants (the smaller of which is in a decorative
planter shaped like a stump). I don't know the wattage; we got the
fixture and bulb in a boxed bundle. The bulb is an Eclipse and is
labeled F15T8 (the size and not related to the brightness, yes?), and
the starter is 22W (it's actually labeled "4...22W"). I presume this
means that my lighting is 22W?

Perhaps a few floating plants are in order.

Regarding the pH, the store from which we've bought all our fish so far
keeps their stock in the same (municipality's) tapwater that we use, for
what that's worth.

--
"Usenet is like a herd of performing elephants with diarrhea -- massive,
difficult to redirect, awe-inspiring, entertaining, and a source of mind -
boggling amounts of excrement when you least expect it." -- Gene Spafford, 1992

[Bill]

Well, we've noticed the cories swimming and playing several times now;
the most recent was last night when I entered the room with both the
tank and room lights on. I saw them (presumably) eating in the front
corner, all gathered there. It took them several seconds to notice me,
but a few did and swam off, and then the rest did.

We plan to get some floating plants. Once we've got the substrate
changed from the present gravel (slightly smaller than their heads,
maybe a quarter-inch to half an inch) to sand, we'll probably plant a
few more.

We also bought a 10-gallon tank Friday night for quarantine, and we got
two bushynose and a piece of driftwood on Saturday. In a few weeks,
the cories will have new tankmates and more cover, so we'll see if that
helps as well. Incidentally, the water parameters in the new tank were
great after 24 hours -- just a trace of ammonia -- so the seeding method
I used apparently worked well. (I took some gravel out of the
established tank from the surface in a couple areas, including places
where the cories like to congregate, and put it in the new one
underneath the filter. Then I gently squeezed and vigorously rinsed the
filter pad in the new tank just before acclimating the bushynoses.)

Thanks for all the advice.

--
"Usenet is like a herd of performing elephants with diarrhea -- massive,
difficult to redirect, awe-inspiring, entertaining, and a source of mind -
boggling amounts of excrement when you least expect it." -- Gene Spafford, 1992