sick fish and euthanasia

[aj]

Does anyone has suggestions on "putting down" a sick fish. My little
girls fish is sick and hasn't eaten in a long time. Its dying a slow
death and I don't want it to suffer any longer.

I know a flush would do the trick, but she's old enough to know that it
"has to go somewhere"

Any advice would be helpful.

AJ

[Ionizer]

"aj" > wrote in message
...
> Does anyone has suggestions on "putting down" a sick fish. My little
> girls fish is sick and hasn't eaten in a long time. Its dying a slow
> death and I don't want it to suffer any longer.
>
> I know a flush would do the trick, but she's old enough to know that
> it "has to go somewhere"
>
> Any advice would be helpful.

Please do not use the "flush" option.

I posed this question in this group recently and was led to this option:
http://www.wisegeek.com/what-is-the-most-humane-way-to-euthanize-a-fish.htm

This site evaluates several options:
http://homepage.ntlworld.com/faustus/nicoldaquaria/euthanasia.htm
Regarding "flushing," the kindest quote may be: "This method should
never be employed- out of sight, out of mind does not equate to a
painless death." The bluntest quote is: " This is the method coveted
by the ignorant and cowardly." From the options presented on that site,
I used the "Alcohol" method, but I was disturbed by how long it took to
take effect on my sick Molly.

Regards,
Ian.

[Gill Passman]

"Ionizer" > wrote in message
...
> "aj" > wrote in message
> ...
> > Does anyone has suggestions on "putting down" a sick fish. My little
> > girls fish is sick and hasn't eaten in a long time. Its dying a slow
> > death and I don't want it to suffer any longer.
> >
> > I know a flush would do the trick, but she's old enough to know that
> > it "has to go somewhere"
> >
> > Any advice would be helpful.
>
> Please do not use the "flush" option.
>
> I posed this question in this group recently and was led to this option:
>
http://www.wisegeek.com/what-is-the-most-humane-way-to-euthanize-a-fish.htm
>
> This site evaluates several options:
> http://homepage.ntlworld.com/faustus/nicoldaquaria/euthanasia.htm
> Regarding "flushing," the kindest quote may be: "This method should
> never be employed- out of sight, out of mind does not equate to a
> painless death." The bluntest quote is: " This is the method coveted
> by the ignorant and cowardly." From the options presented on that site,
> I used the "Alcohol" method, but I was disturbed by how long it took to
> take effect on my sick Molly.
>
> Regards,
> Ian.
>
>
>
I always hope blindly my fish will get better.....maybe wrong but if I am
treating them - where there is life there is hope.....

Most humane way from my readings is clove oil

[Tom Randy]

On Thu, 05 May 2005 20:59:20 +0000, aj wrote:

> Does anyone has suggestions on "putting down" a sick fish. My little
> girls fish is sick and hasn't eaten in a long time. Its dying a slow
> death and I don't want it to suffer any longer.
>
> I know a flush would do the trick, but she's old enough to know that it
> "has to go somewhere"
>
> Any advice would be helpful.
>
> AJ


Putting fish down

Here's how *I* do it and it didn't seem to be in much if any pain based on his
movements or lack there of.

Get a small bowl or cup or a container that will hold enough water for your fish.
Remove enough tank water to fill the container at least 3/4 full.
Put several drops of CLOVE OIL (any pharmacy should have it) in the container and mix this
well. Mixing it in a container that can be sealed and shook well is best
in order to mix the oil in the water well. Place fish gently in, it may
swim around briefly or lie there depending on it's condition. Usually
within 10 seconds to one minute the fish will fall asleep. Add an ice
cube. Place in freezer overnight. You could also add more clove oil to
overdose but I prefer to freeze to be sure once it's asleep.

Tom

[Elaine T]

Gill Passman wrote:
> "Ionizer" > wrote in message
> ...
>
>>"aj" > wrote in message
...
>>
>>>Does anyone has suggestions on "putting down" a sick fish. My little
>>>girls fish is sick and hasn't eaten in a long time. Its dying a slow
>>>death and I don't want it to suffer any longer.
>>>
>>>I know a flush would do the trick, but she's old enough to know that
>>>it "has to go somewhere"
>>>
>>>Any advice would be helpful.
>>
>>Please do not use the "flush" option.
>>
>>I posed this question in this group recently and was led to this option:
>>
>
> http://www.wisegeek.com/what-is-the-most-humane-way-to-euthanize-a-fish.htm
>
>>This site evaluates several options:
>>http://homepage.ntlworld.com/faustus/nicoldaquaria/euthanasia.htm
>>Regarding "flushing," the kindest quote may be: "This method should
>>never be employed- out of sight, out of mind does not equate to a
>>painless death." The bluntest quote is: " This is the method coveted
>>by the ignorant and cowardly." From the options presented on that site,
>>I used the "Alcohol" method, but I was disturbed by how long it took to
>>take effect on my sick Molly.
>>
>>Regards,
>>Ian.
>>
>>
>>
>
> I always hope blindly my fish will get better.....maybe wrong but if I am
> treating them - where there is life there is hope.....
>
> Most humane way from my readings is clove oil
>
The last time I had to euthanize a fish, I decapitated it quickly with a
very sharp knife. This was before I knew about clove oil and I would
still use that method if I didn't have clove oil around.

--
Elaine T __
http://eethomp.com/fish.html <'__><
rec.aquaria.* FAQ http://faq.thekrib.com

[bassett]

Put fish in a brown Paper bag, hold on the exhust pipe of a car, It's almost
instant death.
bassett


"Tom Randy" > wrote in message
. ..
> On Thu, 05 May 2005 20:59:20 +0000, aj wrote:
>
>> Does anyone has suggestions on "putting down" a sick fish. My little
>> girls fish is sick and hasn't eaten in a long time. Its dying a slow
>> death and I don't want it to suffer any longer.
>>
>> I know a flush would do the trick, but she's old enough to know that it
>> "has to go somewhere"
>>
>> Any advice would be helpful.
>>
>> AJ
>
>
> Putting fish down
>
> Here's how *I* do it and it didn't seem to be in much if any pain based on
> his
> movements or lack there of.
>
> Get a small bowl or cup or a container that will hold enough water for
> your fish.
> Remove enough tank water to fill the container at least 3/4 full.
> Put several drops of CLOVE OIL (any pharmacy should have it) in the
> container and mix this
> well. Mixing it in a container that can be sealed and shook well is best
> in order to mix the oil in the water well. Place fish gently in, it may
> swim around briefly or lie there depending on it's condition. Usually
> within 10 seconds to one minute the fish will fall asleep. Add an ice
> cube. Place in freezer overnight. You could also add more clove oil to
> overdose but I prefer to freeze to be sure once it's asleep.
>
> Tom
>

[Dick]

On Thu, 05 May 2005 20:59:20 GMT, aj > wrote:

>Does anyone has suggestions on "putting down" a sick fish. My little
>girls fish is sick and hasn't eaten in a long time. Its dying a slow
>death and I don't want it to suffer any longer.
>
>I know a flush would do the trick, but she's old enough to know that it
>"has to go somewhere"
>
>Any advice would be helpful.
>
>AJ

My measure of "when" to kill a fish largely depends on the fish. If I
think it is time, but the fish aggressively evades the net, I give in
to the fish's will to live.

As to how, you really complicate the question by noting your girl is
old enough to know "it has to go somewhere."

I suppose this is one of the times a parent must handle some time or
another. Regardless of what method you use, you will still face a
problem I have no experience with, no children!

As for how, I take what is simplest for me. I smash the fish against
the toilet bowel and flush. If the crushing against the bowel doesn't
do it, I doubt the fish will survive long in the toxic sewers.
Consider how often we lose fish in our carefully managed tanks.

Even under worst scenarios of a lingering death in the sewer line, I
am sure the fish would be unaware due to "shock" of the environmental
change. Adding new fish to a healthy tank often requires hours for
the fish to become alert often times. For an already weakened fish, I
suspect the stress kills the fish quickly.

I know how much this approach bothers some, but I don't like killing
fish in any case. I wonder most every day about the "kindness" I show
to a 3 inch female swordtail living in my hospital tank. Her spine is
twisted, she is mostly blind and finding food takes agonizing patience
on her part. But, she continues to fight to survive, my number one
measure. When the time comes and she is close to lifeless I will
lovingly net her and throw her as hard as I can against the toilet
bowel, flush and get on with my life. I have a hundred other fish to
feed and care for.

dick

[IDzine01]

>If I think it is time, but the fish aggressively evades the net, I
give in
>to the fish's will to live.

I completely agree with you Dick. If a fish lets you pick him up out of
the water then he's so far gone he can't even save himself.

With that said, however, my betta was laying on his side gasping for
air waiting to die. I had aggressively treated him with antibiotics. He
was surely a candidate for euthania but I held hope. He made a full
recovery.

sometimes you just don't know.

Bottom line: If she wants to live, let her live.

[lgb]

In article >, "Gill Passman"
<gillspamattaylorpassmanspam.co.uk> says...
>
>
> Most humane way from my readings is clove oil
>
I only had to do this once, and after reading the various methods I went
with net the fish and shop off the head with a single-edge razor blade
or Xacto knife. A couple seconds and it's over.

Of course, I also maintain that for people, the guillotine (sp?) was
humane, especially considering the alternatives in its heyday :-).

--
BNSF = Build Now, Seep Forever

[Gill Passman]

"lgb" > wrote in message
...
> In article >, "Gill Passman"
> <gillspamattaylorpassmanspam.co.uk> says...
> >
> >
> > Most humane way from my readings is clove oil
> >
> I only had to do this once, and after reading the various methods I went
> with net the fish and shop off the head with a single-edge razor blade
> or Xacto knife. A couple seconds and it's over.
>
> Of course, I also maintain that for people, the guillotine (sp?) was
> humane, especially considering the alternatives in its heyday :-).
>
> --
> BNSF = Build Now, Seep Forever

Hey, I'll get my knitting needles out right now

[aj]

Ionizer wrote:
> "aj" > wrote in message
> ...
>
>>Does anyone has suggestions on "putting down" a sick fish. My little
>>girls fish is sick and hasn't eaten in a long time. Its dying a slow
>>death and I don't want it to suffer any longer.
>>
>>I know a flush would do the trick, but she's old enough to know that
>>it "has to go somewhere"
>>
>>Any advice would be helpful.
>
>
> Please do not use the "flush" option.
>
> I posed this question in this group recently and was led to this option:
> http://www.wisegeek.com/what-is-the-most-humane-way-to-euthanize-a-fish.htm
>
> This site evaluates several options:
> http://homepage.ntlworld.com/faustus/nicoldaquaria/euthanasia.htm
> Regarding "flushing," the kindest quote may be: "This method should
> never be employed- out of sight, out of mind does not equate to a
> painless death." The bluntest quote is: " This is the method coveted
> by the ignorant and cowardly." From the options presented on that site,
> I used the "Alcohol" method, but I was disturbed by how long it took to
> take effect on my sick Molly.
>
> Regards,
> Ian.
>
>
>

Thanks very much, this is the information I was looking for.

AJ

[sophiefishstuff]

In message >, Gill Passman
> writes
>
>"lgb" > wrote in message
...
>> In article >, "Gill Passman"
>> <gillspamattaylorpassmanspam.co.uk> says...
>> >
>> >
>> > Most humane way from my readings is clove oil
>> >
>> I only had to do this once, and after reading the various methods I went
>> with net the fish and shop off the head with a single-edge razor blade
>> or Xacto knife. A couple seconds and it's over.
>>
>> Of course, I also maintain that for people, the guillotine (sp?) was
>> humane, especially considering the alternatives in its heyday :-).
>>
>> --
>> BNSF = Build Now, Seep Forever
>
>Hey, I'll get my knitting needles out right now

And I shall follow the tumbrils...
--
sophie

www.freewebs.com/fishstuff
(under construction. ish.)

[Lisa]

I agree. My policy, now that I am fairly comfortable with aquaria
culture, is to move the sick fish to my quarantine tank and hope for
the best. (I did euthanize a few fish before I settled on this plan,
so YMMV.) If the fish recovers and lives - great! - back to the
community tank. If it expires, then the fish expires in its own time.
At least it's not eaten by a predator, and it doesn't die while in fear
of its life. A sick fish is the only fish in a 5-gallon tank. So,
death happens much like in a hospice - calmly and naturally. No
euthanasia. I lost my favorite female Dwarf Gourami in this manner, and
I am glad that it happened this way. But, I can understand why
euthanasia is necessary in other situations than mine. My sympathies.

- Lisa


IDzine01 wrote:
> >If I think it is time, but the fish aggressively evades the net, I
> give in
> >to the fish's will to live.
>
> I completely agree with you Dick. If a fish lets you pick him up out
of
> the water then he's so far gone he can't even save himself.
>
> With that said, however, my betta was laying on his side gasping for
> air waiting to die. I had aggressively treated him with antibiotics.
He
> was surely a candidate for euthania but I held hope. He made a full
> recovery.
>
> sometimes you just don't know.
>
> Bottom line: If she wants to live, let her live.

[Dick]

On 7 May 2005 19:21:08 -0700, "Lisa" > wrote:

>I agree. My policy, now that I am fairly comfortable with aquaria
>culture, is to move the sick fish to my quarantine tank and hope for
>the best. (I did euthanize a few fish before I settled on this plan,
>so YMMV.) If the fish recovers and lives - great! - back to the
>community tank. If it expires, then the fish expires in its own time.
>At least it's not eaten by a predator, and it doesn't die while in fear
>of its life. A sick fish is the only fish in a 5-gallon tank. So,
>death happens much like in a hospice - calmly and naturally. No
>euthanasia. I lost my favorite female Dwarf Gourami in this manner, and
>I am glad that it happened this way. But, I can understand why
>euthanasia is necessary in other situations than mine. My sympathies.
>
>- Lisa

One condition I think of, Dropsy. As the fish swells, it no longer
eats, and does not truly swim. There is no treatment. I have seen 3
cases, 2 in black mollies. No opposition to netting. After throwing
the 2 mollies against the toilet bowel, I noticed black stuff on my
hand, I guess it was skin.

Funny, 2/3 of my fish are egg layers, but 90% of the deaths are live
bearers and most of those are black mollies. In close to 2 1/2 years
I have lost only 1 egg layer, a Siamese Algae Eater died of unknown
cause, just puttered around for a couple of days, then died one
morning.

I am not counting the largest loss of fish which happened within
minutes. I had adjusted the pH and did something wrong. About 6 fish
died, including a 7" Pleco, before I recognized there was a problem.
Others were injured, but with a quick water change, they survived. I
quit adjusting water with chemicals from then on.

dick
>
>
>IDzine01 wrote:
>> >If I think it is time, but the fish aggressively evades the net, I
>> give in
>> >to the fish's will to live.
>>
>> I completely agree with you Dick. If a fish lets you pick him up out
>of
>> the water then he's so far gone he can't even save himself.
>>
>> With that said, however, my betta was laying on his side gasping for
>> air waiting to die. I had aggressively treated him with antibiotics.
>He
>> was surely a candidate for euthania but I held hope. He made a full
>> recovery.
>>
>> sometimes you just don't know.
>>
>> Bottom line: If she wants to live, let her live.

[Elaine T]

Dick wrote:
> On 7 May 2005 19:21:08 -0700, "Lisa" > wrote:
>
>
>>I agree. My policy, now that I am fairly comfortable with aquaria
>>culture, is to move the sick fish to my quarantine tank and hope for
>>the best. (I did euthanize a few fish before I settled on this plan,
>>so YMMV.) If the fish recovers and lives - great! - back to the
>>community tank. If it expires, then the fish expires in its own time.
>>At least it's not eaten by a predator, and it doesn't die while in fear
>>of its life. A sick fish is the only fish in a 5-gallon tank. So,
>>death happens much like in a hospice - calmly and naturally. No
>>euthanasia. I lost my favorite female Dwarf Gourami in this manner, and
>>I am glad that it happened this way. But, I can understand why
>>euthanasia is necessary in other situations than mine. My sympathies.
>>
>>- Lisa
>
>
> One condition I think of, Dropsy. As the fish swells, it no longer
> eats, and does not truly swim. There is no treatment. I have seen 3
> cases, 2 in black mollies. No opposition to netting. After throwing
> the 2 mollies against the toilet bowel, I noticed black stuff on my
> hand, I guess it was skin.
>
> Funny, 2/3 of my fish are egg layers, but 90% of the deaths are live
> bearers and most of those are black mollies. In close to 2 1/2 years
> I have lost only 1 egg layer, a Siamese Algae Eater died of unknown
> cause, just puttered around for a couple of days, then died one
> morning.
>
IME mollies are quite difficult to keep in 100% freshwater, especially
if it's soft. The mollies are experiencing kidney failure (dropsy)
because they cannot keep all the water out of their bodies without some
salt or at least high GH and KH. Swordtails and guppies also like high
KH or salt. Black mollies actually do best in about 0.3% salt to
brackish and sailfin mollies are a coastal species that lives in
anything from light brackish to full sal****er.

I've never understood why mollies are sold for FW, and why livebearers
are sold as beginner fish. Think of all the posts we've had about dying
guppies and platies.

--
Elaine T __
http://eethomp.com/fish.html <'__><
rec.aquaria.* FAQ http://faq.thekrib.com

[Dick]

On Sun, 08 May 2005 17:23:39 GMT, Elaine T >
wrote:

>Dick wrote:
>> On 7 May 2005 19:21:08 -0700, "Lisa" > wrote:
>>
>>
>>>I agree. My policy, now that I am fairly comfortable with aquaria
>>>culture, is to move the sick fish to my quarantine tank and hope for
>>>the best. (I did euthanize a few fish before I settled on this plan,
>>>so YMMV.) If the fish recovers and lives - great! - back to the
>>>community tank. If it expires, then the fish expires in its own time.
>>>At least it's not eaten by a predator, and it doesn't die while in fear
>>>of its life. A sick fish is the only fish in a 5-gallon tank. So,
>>>death happens much like in a hospice - calmly and naturally. No
>>>euthanasia. I lost my favorite female Dwarf Gourami in this manner, and
>>>I am glad that it happened this way. But, I can understand why
>>>euthanasia is necessary in other situations than mine. My sympathies.
>>>
>>>- Lisa
>>
>>
>> One condition I think of, Dropsy. As the fish swells, it no longer
>> eats, and does not truly swim. There is no treatment. I have seen 3
>> cases, 2 in black mollies. No opposition to netting. After throwing
>> the 2 mollies against the toilet bowel, I noticed black stuff on my
>> hand, I guess it was skin.
>>
>> Funny, 2/3 of my fish are egg layers, but 90% of the deaths are live
>> bearers and most of those are black mollies. In close to 2 1/2 years
>> I have lost only 1 egg layer, a Siamese Algae Eater died of unknown
>> cause, just puttered around for a couple of days, then died one
>> morning.
>>
>IME mollies are quite difficult to keep in 100% freshwater, especially
>if it's soft. The mollies are experiencing kidney failure (dropsy)
>because they cannot keep all the water out of their bodies without some
>salt or at least high GH and KH. Swordtails and guppies also like high
>KH or salt. Black mollies actually do best in about 0.3% salt to
>brackish and sailfin mollies are a coastal species that lives in
>anything from light brackish to full sal****er.
>
>I've never understood why mollies are sold for FW, and why livebearers
>are sold as beginner fish. Think of all the posts we've had about dying
>guppies and platies.

I would suggest Tetras for beginners except those noted as over
aggressive. I have Serpaes and Bleeding Hearts, after 2 years one of
the 20 in my tanks shows signs of problems. I have tried to move it
to a hospital tank, but it evades and gets into the plant growth. It
sure isn't ready to be helped.

dick

[Ionizer]

"Dick" > wrote in message
...
> I have Serpaes and Bleeding Hearts, after 2 years one of
> the 20 in my tanks shows signs of problems. I have tried to move it
> to a hospital tank, but it evades and gets into the plant growth. It
> sure isn't ready to be helped.

Earlier, you said: "I smash the fish against the toilet bowel and
flush."

Does that particular tank have a view of your bathroom perhaps? That
might explain the evasiveness of this particular sick fish.

By the way, can this "toilet bowel" of yours also be used for bowl
movements?

Regards,
Ian.
(Now Playing: Don't Do Me Like That - Tom Petty)