gold barb can't close mouth!

[Jason]

I have a 30g tank with 13 gold barbs, 1 tiger barb, & 3 zebra danios.

Two of my gold barbs are having problems:

1) one can not close its mouth. Its mouth is wide open, it looks like
it is 'flexing' its lips (or maybe that's just it trying to breathe),
and there looks like a solid, or at least completely opaque, white
object stuck in its mouth. The LFS employee, who only glanced at it,
said it was white fungus, and sold me PimaFix. He said if it were a
piece of gravel (and my medium is full of white stones), the fish would
have spat it out. My only concern is that whatever is in its mouth
doesn't look cottony or stringy; it looks like a completely solid
object. Maybe that's just its innards? (but there's not even a hint of
pink to it)

2) another has faded into a light-yellow (from orange) color, and can
close its mouth, but is always "panting" (opening & closing its mouth,
like it's out of breath). The LFS employee said it looked like it had
some sort of parasite, and recommended Rid-Ich+.

The other 11 gold barbs, and the tiger barb & danios, all look
perfectly healthy. The tank has had two bouts with columnaris before,
that ate away at three different fish, but was treated quickly enough,
and the fish recovered.

Naturally, having never lost any of my fish, I want to do whatever I
can to save them.

By the way, pH is about 7.5 (stable), nitrates regularly run up rather
quickly from about 20ppm after a water change, to around 100ppm after 3
weeks. There are very few plants, because the fish constantly eat them.

Thank you in advance for your advice.

[Daniel Morrow]

"Jason" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> I have a 30g tank with 13 gold barbs, 1 tiger barb, & 3 zebra danios.
>
> Two of my gold barbs are having problems:
>
> 1) one can not close its mouth. Its mouth is wide open, it looks like
> it is 'flexing' its lips (or maybe that's just it trying to breathe),
> and there looks like a solid, or at least completely opaque, white
> object stuck in its mouth. The LFS employee, who only glanced at it,
> said it was white fungus, and sold me PimaFix. He said if it were a
> piece of gravel (and my medium is full of white stones), the fish would
> have spat it out.

Try doing a search on this forum for another case of gravel getting stuck in
a fish's mouth - it has happened in this forum before. The person I am
referring to used something like a toothpick to pry the rock out of the
fish's mouth and the process worked. His fish looked awkward and traumatized
afterward but from what remember it recovered quickly and lived fine
afterward. It may be your only option besides ignoring it. Your other fish
you mention later here might have the same problem, maybe the color changed
because of loose fish fluids - i.e. some internal bleeding not otherwise
observable. Good luck - HTH!

My only concern is that whatever is in its mouth
> doesn't look cottony or stringy; it looks like a completely solid
> object. Maybe that's just its innards? (but there's not even a hint of
> pink to it)
>
> 2) another has faded into a light-yellow (from orange) color, and can
> close its mouth, but is always "panting" (opening & closing its mouth,
> like it's out of breath). The LFS employee said it looked like it had
> some sort of parasite, and recommended Rid-Ich+.
>
> The other 11 gold barbs, and the tiger barb & danios, all look
> perfectly healthy. The tank has had two bouts with columnaris before,
> that ate away at three different fish, but was treated quickly enough,
> and the fish recovered.
>
> Naturally, having never lost any of my fish, I want to do whatever I
> can to save them.
>
> By the way, pH is about 7.5 (stable), nitrates regularly run up rather
> quickly from about 20ppm after a water change, to around 100ppm after 3
> weeks. There are very few plants, because the fish constantly eat them.
>
> Thank you in advance for your advice.
>

[NetMax]

"Daniel Morrow" > wrote in message
...
>
> "Jason" > wrote in message
> oups.com...
>> I have a 30g tank with 13 gold barbs, 1 tiger barb, & 3 zebra danios.
>>
>> Two of my gold barbs are having problems:
>>
>> 1) one can not close its mouth. Its mouth is wide open, it looks like
>> it is 'flexing' its lips (or maybe that's just it trying to breathe),
>> and there looks like a solid, or at least completely opaque, white
>> object stuck in its mouth. The LFS employee, who only glanced at it,
>> said it was white fungus, and sold me PimaFix. He said if it were a
>> piece of gravel (and my medium is full of white stones), the fish
>> would
>> have spat it out.
>
> Try doing a search on this forum for another case of gravel getting
> stuck in
> a fish's mouth - it has happened in this forum before. The person I am
> referring to used something like a toothpick to pry the rock out of the
> fish's mouth and the process worked. His fish looked awkward and
> traumatized
> afterward but from what remember it recovered quickly and lived fine
> afterward. It may be your only option besides ignoring it. Your other
> fish
> you mention later here might have the same problem, maybe the color
> changed
> because of loose fish fluids - i.e. some internal bleeding not
> otherwise
> observable. Good luck - HTH!
>
> My only concern is that whatever is in its mouth
>> doesn't look cottony or stringy; it looks like a completely solid
>> object. Maybe that's just its innards? (but there's not even a hint of
>> pink to it)
>>
>> 2) another has faded into a light-yellow (from orange) color, and can
>> close its mouth, but is always "panting" (opening & closing its mouth,
>> like it's out of breath). The LFS employee said it looked like it had
>> some sort of parasite, and recommended Rid-Ich+.
>>
>> The other 11 gold barbs, and the tiger barb & danios, all look
>> perfectly healthy. The tank has had two bouts with columnaris before,
>> that ate away at three different fish, but was treated quickly enough,
>> and the fish recovered.
>>
>> Naturally, having never lost any of my fish, I want to do whatever I
>> can to save them.
>>
>> By the way, pH is about 7.5 (stable), nitrates regularly run up rather
>> quickly from about 20ppm after a water change, to around 100ppm after
>> 3
>> weeks. There are very few plants, because the fish constantly eat
>> them.
>>
>> Thank you in advance for your advice.


Gaining 80ppm NO3 in 3 weeks is not normal and is a problem. Locate &
remove the source (excess food, excess feeding, excess organic matter
rotting in the gravel, canister filters etc). The fish are in an organic
soup. You will need to lower the NO3 gradually and then aggressively do
water changes to keep it low. Casualties would not be unexpected if
their NO3 went from 100 to 20ppm in one water change. This is a source
of stress across their gills (respiratory distress). jmo
--
www.NetMax.tk

[Jason]

I have pictures of both (albeit bad ones--my digital camera is about 5
yrs old) at:
http://www.kodakgallery.com/I.jsp?c=q0b5uc1.534sfbil&x=0&y=z2hlnj

We might have to take apart the filter and see if there isn't a bunch
of muck rotting away and increasing the NO3--it does seem excessive.
The fish eat all the food we give them, so it's not rotting food.

At any rate, I found that article about the piece of gravel, and tried
to pry whatever it was out of the fish, but it didn't feel like a piece
of gravel. I got worried that it was just a swollen part of the fish's
insides and gave up.

The next day, whatever was in there was white...and blue.
Today...bright green. I'm trying to decide if it's a piece of the
artificial plant, or real plant, both of which are in the tank, or it's
because the Rid-Ich+, which is turquoise colored, just dyed whatever
was white and porous in there.

But....the fish is able to close its mouth now. The green/blue/white
thing seems to be either smaller, or it's moving deeper into it. It's
still "panting" and stressed--it doesn't eat anything.

The other light-colored one is still very, very bloated/distended, and
still a light yellow color--I'm surprised it's still alive. Does anyone
know what it could be? It's "panting" very rapidly, even more than the
other fish with the thing stuck in its mouth, but there is nothing in
its mouth (i can only see pink, and it can close its mouth). It is just
very bloated looking, and extremely pale looking.

Can anyone ID what's wrong with the bloated/pale one?

We're using Rid-Ich+ (formalin & malachite green) and PimaFix. It's
been about 4 days since we discovered both their problems.