Brackish water aquarium

[[email protected]]

Hi
Im thinking of setting up a brackish water tank.. So, just wondering if
anyone has any experience with them or is currently keeping one.. Or
any advice and tips.

[Gail Futoran]

> wrote in message
oups.com...
> Hi
> Im thinking of setting up a brackish water tank.. So, just wondering if
> anyone has any experience with them or is currently keeping one.. Or
> any advice and tips.

I got my first brackish water fish (2 puffers) maybe
6 months ago. Set up a spare 10 gallon. Added
marine salt using a hydrometer to estimate levels.
I tried plants but most died. Even plants that are
supposed to work in brackish water didn't
thrive. I finally got some java moss and hoping
that will work. (I think I had the salt level too
high - I've since reduced it.) But the fish don't seem
to care. As long as they get snails occasionally
(culled from other tanks), frozen brine shrimp, dry
baby shrimp, frozen bloodworms, they seem fine.
Growing, fat and happy.

From what I've read they can be pretty aggressive
toward each other. My two were babies together
and so far seem to get along. What will happen
when they reach full size (assuming I still have
them then) might be another matter. I have
Green Spotted puffers. (Sold as "dwarf" which
they're not. LOL)

Some links:
http://badmanstropicalfish.com/brackish/brackish.html
http://home.earthlink.net/~snebluemoon/fridge.html
http://www.myfishtank.net/forum/archive/index.php/f-10.html

Gail

[coolchinchilla]

Gail Futoran wrote:
> > wrote in message
> oups.com...
>
>>Hi
>>Im thinking of setting up a brackish water tank.. So, just wondering if
>>anyone has any experience with them or is currently keeping one.. Or
>>any advice and tips.
>
>
> I got my first brackish water fish (2 puffers) maybe
> 6 months ago. Set up a spare 10 gallon. Added
> marine salt using a hydrometer to estimate levels.
>

I think I read somewhere that tanks are supposed to have have
freshwater salt, not marine salt but I don't really know myself.
Doesn't the marine salt have minerals that are toxic to freshwaters?

Just a thought.
coolchinchilla

[Alpha]

"coolchinchilla" > wrote in message
...
> Gail Futoran wrote:
>> > wrote in message
>> oups.com...
>>
>>>Hi
>>>Im thinking of setting up a brackish water tank.. So, just wondering if
>>>anyone has any experience with them or is currently keeping one.. Or
>>>any advice and tips.
>>
>>
>> I got my first brackish water fish (2 puffers) maybe
>> 6 months ago. Set up a spare 10 gallon. Added
>> marine salt using a hydrometer to estimate levels.
>>
>
> I think I read somewhere that tanks are supposed to have have freshwater
> salt, not marine salt but I don't really know myself. Doesn't the marine
> salt have minerals that are toxic to freshwaters?
>
> Just a thought.
> coolchinchilla

Ummm....freshwater salt. That is a new one on me. How does freshwater gain
salt?

You might mean using Kosher salt added to freshwater?

[Gail Futoran]

"coolchinchilla" > wrote in message
...
> Gail Futoran wrote:
>> > wrote in message
>> oups.com...
>>
>>>Hi
>>>Im thinking of setting up a brackish water tank.. So, just wondering if
>>>anyone has any experience with them or is currently keeping one.. Or
>>>any advice and tips.
>>
>>
>> I got my first brackish water fish (2 puffers) maybe
>> 6 months ago. Set up a spare 10 gallon. Added
>> marine salt using a hydrometer to estimate levels.
>>
>
> I think I read somewhere that tanks are supposed to have have freshwater
> salt, not marine salt but I don't really know myself. Doesn't the marine
> salt have minerals that are toxic to freshwaters?
>
> Just a thought.
> coolchinchilla

Brackish is where the sea (marine) meets the river.
Hence, sea (marine) salt is what one adds. As
another posted noted, "freshwater" means no
salt!!

The links I gave the OP are pretty good and have
more details on how to set up a brackish tank. No
need to take my word for it.

Gail

[coolchinchilla]

Alpha wrote:
> "coolchinchilla" > wrote in message
> ...
>
>>Gail Futoran wrote:
>>
> wrote in message
oups.com...
>>>
>>>
>>>>Hi
>>>>Im thinking of setting up a brackish water tank.. So, just wondering if
>>>>anyone has any experience with them or is currently keeping one.. Or
>>>>any advice and tips.
>>>
>>>
>>>I got my first brackish water fish (2 puffers) maybe
>>>6 months ago. Set up a spare 10 gallon. Added
>>>marine salt using a hydrometer to estimate levels.
>>>
>>
>>I think I read somewhere that tanks are supposed to have have freshwater
>>salt, not marine salt but I don't really know myself. Doesn't the marine
>>salt have minerals that are toxic to freshwaters?
>>
>>Just a thought.
>>coolchinchilla
>
>
> Ummm....freshwater salt. That is a new one on me. How does freshwater gain
> salt?
>
> You might mean using Kosher salt added to freshwater?

There is a product put out by Aquarium Pharmaceuticals called
Freshwater Aquarium Salt sold in a carton.

The following description is from Drs Foster & Smith
(http://tinyurl.com/cnkf4)

Freshwater Aquarium Salt
* All natural aquarium salt made from evaporated sea water
* General tonic and stress reducer for freshwater aquariums
* Adds natural electrolytes and improves gill function

All natural Aquarium Salt serves as a general tonic and stress
reducer for freshwater fish. During disease and stress, healthy gill
function of fish is disturbed. This can lead to the loss of
electrolytes through the gills (sometimes called osmotic shock),
reducing the intake of oxygen and release of carbon dioxide.
Freshwater Aquarium Salt replenishes natural electrolytes and
promotes healthy gill function. Aquarium Salt also temporarily
blocks the toxic effects of nitrite to freshwater fish until water
quality improves. Made from evaporated sea water - contains no
artificial additives, sugar, or artificial color and will not change
pH. Use Aquarium Salt with tropical fish, goldfish and koi but
should not be used as a substitute for marine aquarium salt.



So adding salt to freshwater isn't that freakish. It can be a good
thing for your FW fish.

coolchinchilla

[coolchinchilla]

Gail Futoran wrote:
> "coolchinchilla" > wrote in message
> ...
>
>>Gail Futoran wrote:
>>
> wrote in message
oups.com...
>>>
>>>
>>>>Hi
>>>>Im thinking of setting up a brackish water tank.. So, just wondering if
>>>>anyone has any experience with them or is currently keeping one.. Or
>>>>any advice and tips.
>>>
>>>
>>>I got my first brackish water fish (2 puffers) maybe
>>>6 months ago. Set up a spare 10 gallon. Added
>>>marine salt using a hydrometer to estimate levels.
>>>
>>
>>I think I read somewhere that tanks are supposed to have have freshwater
>>salt, not marine salt but I don't really know myself. Doesn't the marine
>>salt have minerals that are toxic to freshwaters?
>>
>>Just a thought.
>>coolchinchilla
>
>
> Brackish is where the sea (marine) meets the river.
> Hence, sea (marine) salt is what one adds.

Yep. Didn't think of that. :) Marine salt would be the proper
thing for a brackish tank. I was mistaken.

> As
> another posted noted, "freshwater" means no
> salt!!

There is a product called Freshwater Aquarium Salt put out by
Aquarium Phamaceuticals. Some add such salt to their FW tanks with
every water change to add electrolytes. The addition of salt is a
common recomendation to kill ich in a FW tank. So salt and
freshwater aren't always mutually exclusive.

coolchinchilla

[Eric]

On Sun, 21 Aug 2005 03:55:51 -0500, coolchinchilla wrote
(in article >):


> I think I read somewhere that tanks are supposed to have have
> freshwater salt, not marine salt but I don't really know myself.
> Doesn't the marine salt have minerals that are toxic to freshwaters?


I think that using any commercial sal****er mix would be fine for salting a
freshwater tank. There are salt mixes marketed to freshwater customers, Doc
Wellfish's Pond Salt, for example. I suspect that you might have things a
little backward here. It's probably products like Doc Wellfish that could
hurt a sal****er tank.

-E

[Logic316]

coolchinchilla wrote:

> I think I read somewhere that tanks are supposed to have have freshwater
> salt, not marine salt but I don't really know myself. Doesn't the marine
> salt have minerals that are toxic to freshwaters?

There should be no essential differences between marine salt and salt
that's intended as an additive for freshwater aquariums. I've been using
"Instant Ocean" marine salt for hatching and keeping brine shrimp, and
it's labelled as "synthetic sea salt". I also use a few teaspoons of
"Doc Wellfish's Aquarium Salt" in my freshwater tank, and it's labelled
as "all natural, made from evaporated sea water". One brand of salt is
natural, the other is artificially mixed, and they're sold and
advertised for different purposes but they appear to be chemically
identical and it should be possible to use them interchangeably. My Doc
Wellfish's Aquarium Salt container also states that it can be used for
hatching brine shrimp, so that pretty much indicates it's suitable for
marine life. Perhaps it's possible that other brands of freshwater
aquarium salt add unique minerals not found in regular sea salt, but I
think the concept of "freshwater" aquarium salt is just a marketing ploy
to get people to buy more brands of salt. The only difference I noticed
is that the aquarium salt has larger granules and dissolves in water
much more slowly, which might make it inconvenient if you're mixing up a
batch of marine sal****er for a tank. Also, I've used the Instant Ocean
marine salt in my freshwater tank from time to time, and never noticed
anything go wrong.

- Logic316



"Private property began the instant somebody had a mind of his own."
-- E. E. Cummings

[Elaine T]

Logic316 wrote:
> coolchinchilla wrote:
>
>> I think I read somewhere that tanks are supposed to have have
>> freshwater salt, not marine salt but I don't really know myself.
>> Doesn't the marine salt have minerals that are toxic to freshwaters?
>
>
> There should be no essential differences between marine salt and salt
> that's intended as an additive for freshwater aquariums. I've been using
> "Instant Ocean" marine salt for hatching and keeping brine shrimp, and
> it's labelled as "synthetic sea salt". I also use a few teaspoons of
> "Doc Wellfish's Aquarium Salt" in my freshwater tank, and it's labelled
> as "all natural, made from evaporated sea water". One brand of salt is
> natural, the other is artificially mixed, and they're sold and
> advertised for different purposes but they appear to be chemically
> identical and it should be possible to use them interchangeably. My Doc
> Wellfish's Aquarium Salt container also states that it can be used for
> hatching brine shrimp, so that pretty much indicates it's suitable for
> marine life. Perhaps it's possible that other brands of freshwater
> aquarium salt add unique minerals not found in regular sea salt, but I
> think the concept of "freshwater" aquarium salt is just a marketing ploy
> to get people to buy more brands of salt. The only difference I noticed
> is that the aquarium salt has larger granules and dissolves in water
> much more slowly, which might make it inconvenient if you're mixing up a
> batch of marine sal****er for a tank. Also, I've used the Instant Ocean
> marine salt in my freshwater tank from time to time, and never noticed
> anything go wrong.
>
> - Logic316

I've always wondered whether the Instant Ocean style salts have more
calcium and carbonate buffers than natural sea salt. IME They're a bit
harder to dissolve.

--
Elaine T __
http://eethomp.com/fish.html <'__><
rec.aquaria.* FAQ http://faq.thekrib.com

[Logic316]

Elaine T wrote:

> I've always wondered whether the Instant Ocean style salts have more
> calcium and carbonate buffers than natural sea salt. IME They're a bit
> harder to dissolve.

Yeah actually, I've also noticed with Instant Ocean that it leaves this
strange white dust at the bottom of the container that seems to take
forever to dissolve. Perhaps when they add the calcium at the plant,
they don't grind it finely enough.

- Logic316




"A wise and frugal Government, which shall restrain men from injuring
one another, shall leave them otherwise free to regulate their
own pursuits of industry and improvement."
-- Thomas Jefferson, First Inaugural address - 1801

[Alpha]

It's a sham on the consumer. Just add some inexpensive New Zealand coarse
salt, or even Diamond Kosher...available cheaply at any Whole Foods Market
for a pittence.

[Gail Futoran]

"coolchinchilla" > wrote in message
...

[big snip]
> There is a product called Freshwater Aquarium Salt put out by Aquarium
> Phamaceuticals. Some add such salt to their FW tanks with every water
> change to add electrolytes. The addition of salt is a common
> recomendation to kill ich in a FW tank. So salt and freshwater aren't
> always mutually exclusive.
>
> coolchinchilla

Aquarium Salt can be useful (I've had some around
for years) but one has to be careful using it. Some
freshwater fish don't tolerate it well.

Using salt in freshwater (tropical as well as
cold water fish) has been discussed frequently
in the aquaria newsgroups. Anyone who is
contemplating using aquarium salt might want to
search google groups on the topic and at least
give the experiences of hobbyists a look, rather
than simply relying on the labeled claims of
a commercial product.
http://groups.google.com/

For brackish tanks (to get back to the topic), I
think the marine salt is better because it
dissolves faster. You can mix up quantity
and concentration needed ahead of time and
be fairly confident you are managing the
water well. The marine salt is expensive but
for a small tank (like my 10G) it lacks a long time.

Gail

[Elaine T]

Alpha wrote:
> It's a sham on the consumer. Just add some inexpensive New Zealand coarse
> salt, or even Diamond Kosher...available cheaply at any Whole Foods Market
> for a pittence.
>
>
>
I like pickling salt best. It has no toxic anti-caking agents.

--
Elaine T __
http://eethomp.com/fish.html <'__><
rec.aquaria.* FAQ http://faq.thekrib.com

[Logic316]

Elaine T wrote:
> Alpha wrote:
>
>> It's a sham on the consumer. Just add some inexpensive New Zealand
>> coarse salt, or even Diamond Kosher...available cheaply at any Whole
>> Foods Market for a pittence.
>>
>>
>>
> I like pickling salt best. It has no toxic anti-caking agents.

I also sometimes use Kosher salt when hatching brine shrimp - it has no
anti-caking agents which you can tell by taking a pinch of the salt in
your fingers and seeing if it clumps together. It has no iodine added
either, though I'm not sure if a little iodine is really detrimental to
fish or invertebrates like some people claim it is.

- Logic316




"Government is the people's business and every man, woman and child
becomes a shareholder with the first penny of tax paid."
-- Ronald Reagan

[Alpha]

Neither do these.

Please get some data before responding with authority.

[Elaine T]

Alpha wrote:
> Neither do these.
>
> Please get some data before responding with authority.
>
>
Learn to read, flame bait. Also learn to use attributions and quotes
properly so people can see what you are responding to so glibly. I said
only that pickling salt does not contain anti-caking agents so it's what
I like.

--
Elaine T __
http://eethomp.com/fish.html <'__><
rec.aquaria.* FAQ http://faq.thekrib.com

[Alpha]

"Elaine T" > wrote in message
m...
> Alpha wrote:
>> Neither do these.
>>
>> Please get some data before responding with authority.
>>
>>
> Learn to read, flame bait. Also learn to use attributions and quotes
> properly so people can see what you are responding to so glibly. I said
> only that pickling salt does not contain anti-caking agents so it's what I
> like.

Then figure out how to say it without dismissing, even by implication, other
posts.

[Elaine T]

Alpha wrote:
> "Elaine T" > wrote in message
> m...
>
>>Alpha wrote:
>>
>>>Neither do these.
>>>
>>>Please get some data before responding with authority.
>>>
>>>
>>
>>Learn to read, flame bait. Also learn to use attributions and quotes
>>properly so people can see what you are responding to so glibly. I said
>>only that pickling salt does not contain anti-caking agents so it's what I
>>like.
>
>
> Then figure out how to say it without dismissing, even by implication, other
> posts.
>
>
For anyone still reading this thread, pickling salt never contains
anti-caking agents because they precipitate out and form a whitish
slurry on the bottom of the pickle jars. That means it's always safe to
grab any brand of pickling salt for FW fish.

I assume the Diamond Kosher and New Zealand coarse are fine as well.
Avoid Morton Kosher salt, because it contains an anti-caking agent.

--
Elaine T __
http://eethomp.com/fish.html <'__><
rec.aquaria.* FAQ http://faq.thekrib.com

[Logic316]

Alpha wrote:
> "Elaine T" > wrote in message
> m...

>>Learn to read, flame bait. Also learn to use attributions and quotes
>>properly so people can see what you are responding to so glibly. I said
>>only that pickling salt does not contain anti-caking agents so it's what I
>>like.
>
>
> Then figure out how to say it without dismissing, even by implication, other
> posts.


She didn't contradict or dismiss your post. Perhaps you just looked at
it a bit negatively.

- Logic316



"I don't mind what Congress does, as long as they don't
do it in the streets and frighten the horses."
-- Victor Hugo

[Gail Futoran]

"Elaine T" > wrote in message
. ..
[snip]
> For anyone still reading this thread, pickling salt never contains
> anti-caking agents because they precipitate out and form a whitish slurry
> on the bottom of the pickle jars. That means it's always safe to grab any
> brand of pickling salt for FW fish.
>
> I assume the Diamond Kosher and New Zealand coarse are fine as well. Avoid
> Morton Kosher salt, because it contains an anti-caking agent.
>
> --
> Elaine T __
> http://eethomp.com/fish.html <'__><
> rec.aquaria.* FAQ http://faq.thekrib.com

Thanks for the information, Elaine. :)

Gail