Cycling question

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Hi there,

I have a question about cycling. About 3 weeksago I set up a 70g new
tank, using gravel and media from and established tank. I seeded with
ammonia(to 5ppm), and within 7 days my ammonia and nitrites were at 0.
No plants in the tank. I seeded again to 2 ppm and nitites and ammonia
were at 0 the next day. So I waited 2 days, did a 25% water change
(nitrates were about 20ppm), and added my fish from the other tank. 2
angels, 2 danios, 4 neons, a pleco (small). and 2 black mollies.

that was 2 weeks ago. last week, I checked ammonia and it was at .25.
I waited a couple days and checked again, still .125 - .25. So I did a
30% water change for every other day for a week or so, and added an
ammonia remover insert to the aquaclear 300 filter (it had 3 sponges
only in it, no carbon).

Now the ammonia is at 0, but the nitrites are at .25. a couple days
ago I did rinse off one of the filter inserts in tap water (bad, I
know, I didn't realize it would kill bacteria.)

So my question is:

1) should I leave in the ammoniaremover insert?
2) should I do any more water changes? The fish seems fine, they are
eating and the angels even have laid eggs.

my current thinking is wait a day and test the nitrites, then when they
go to 0, remove the ammonia removal insert to avoid starving the
ammonia eating bacteria. But I'm not sure why the ammonia did a
mini-spike to begin with, since I thought the tank was fully cycled.

Am I micro-managing? should I just leave it for a few days? I am also
worried about the affect of the nitrites on the angel eggs. They just
laid them yesterday and they seem OK, but I'd like them to hatch. They
are on the side of the tank (in a corner), so I don't know if I cans
safely remove them to another tank.

thoughts?

[Victor Martinez]

wrote:
> 1) should I leave in the ammoniaremover insert?

Is it an adsorbent resin? If so, remove it.

> 2) should I do any more water changes? The fish seems fine, they are
> eating and the angels even have laid eggs.

I would do only small weekly water changes. Also use something like
Prime to condition your water.

> ammonia eating bacteria. But I'm not sure why the ammonia did a
> mini-spike to begin with, since I thought the tank was fully cycled.

You didn't wait long enough, it usually takes at least 4 weeks to fully
cycle a tank.

> Am I micro-managing? should I just leave it for a few days? I am also

Probably. But we all do it at the beginning. :)

> worried about the affect of the nitrites on the angel eggs. They just
> laid them yesterday and they seem OK, but I'd like them to hatch. They
> are on the side of the tank (in a corner), so I don't know if I cans
> safely remove them to another tank.

I wouldn't worry aboug the eggs, a breeding pair will produce many more
batches. I'm surprised they didn't eat these.

Cheers.

Victor


--
Victor M. Martinez
Owned and operated by the Fantastic Seven (TM)
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[NetMax]

> wrote in message
oups.com...
> Hi there,

Victor has already answered you questions, so I'm just making some
comments.

> I have a question about cycling. About 3 weeksago I set up a 70g new
> tank, using gravel and media from and established tank. I seeded with
> ammonia(to 5ppm), and within 7 days my ammonia and nitrites were at 0.
> No plants in the tank. I seeded again to 2 ppm and nitites and ammonia
> were at 0 the next day. So I waited 2 days, did a 25% water change
> (nitrates were about 20ppm), and added my fish from the other tank. 2
> angels, 2 danios, 4 neons, a pleco (small). and 2 black mollies.

Before adding the fish, I'd have to agree that the tank was cycled to at
least a 2ppm load, assuming you did not mess with the filter, water
temperature was not radically changed etc, and assuming there was no
significant losses in bacteria in the ensuing 2 day delay.

I would have transferred the fish, filter and a bit of gravel (optional)
and not gone through the ammonia priming myself. The volume of water is
not really a factor. The filter's bacteria load is balanced to the
fish-load, whether it's in a 30 or a 90g. The extra water just adds some
delay in seeing readings on test kits. Then I monitor and feed sparingly
for a while, to compensate for the loss of bacteria left in the old tank
(glass sides, upper layer of gravel, on heaters, ornaments etc).

> that was 2 weeks ago. last week, I checked ammonia and it was at .25.
> I waited a couple days and checked again, still .125 - .25. So I did a
> 30% water change for every other day for a week or so, and added an
> ammonia remover insert to the aquaclear 300 filter (it had 3 sponges
> only in it, no carbon).

I wouldn't have added the ammonia insert as I find it always messes with
my ability to monitor the progression of the nitrogen cycle. Otherwise,
what you did is completely correct. The tank's cycle was below the
bio-load introduced, so you had a mini-cycle. Your fish might also be
fairly large on average, larger than what is typically introduced into a
new tank.

> Now the ammonia is at 0, but the nitrites are at .25. a couple days
> ago I did rinse off one of the filter inserts in tap water (bad, I
> know, I didn't realize it would kill bacteria.)
>
> So my question is:
>
> 1) should I leave in the ammoniaremover insert?
> 2) should I do any more water changes? The fish seems fine, they are
> eating and the angels even have laid eggs.

As already stated, remove the zeolite (ammonia absorber) and continue the
water changes (imo too).

> my current thinking is wait a day and test the nitrites, then when they
> go to 0, remove the ammonia removal insert to avoid starving the
> ammonia eating bacteria. But I'm not sure why the ammonia did a
> mini-spike to begin with, since I thought the tank was fully cycled.

I've used >=5ppm to start, and then stocked after the tank can consume a
5ppm ammonia dose in 24 hours. The variables in your case might have
been going down to 2ppm, the delay, and the size of your fish (amount if
food being added). It sounds like your tank *was* cycled but to a lower
bio-load, so you got a mini-cycle.

> Am I micro-managing? should I just leave it for a few days? I am also
> worried about the affect of the nitrites on the angel eggs. They just
> laid them yesterday and they seem OK, but I'd like them to hatch. They
> are on the side of the tank (in a corner), so I don't know if I cans
> safely remove them to another tank.

First batch of eggs are for entertainment purposes only ;~). Think of it
as their practice run. I suspect that the fry from the first batch are
not the best anyways (older genetic material), and it was triggered more
by the change in water & tank, than any other reason. They are a
breeding pair and will likely produce many more now, in progressively
better conditions.

If you think you will be removing the eggs in future spawns, give them a
better removable surface such as a piece of slate standing up in that
corner.
--
www.NetMax.tk

> thoughts?

[[email protected]]

Ok,thanks for your tips. I will remove the zeolite and monitor daily,
with occasional water changes. Most of the fish seem OK except one
redtailed shark getting completely abused by the other redtailed shark
in the tank. He's damn hard to catch to put in my 10 gallon, too...