Help Please!

[captain039-recponds]

Hi Folks,

I'm new to the group, and we've had our pond for 2 seasons now. Last
year, everything worked out very well after the initial break-in
period. This year, we have a very bad case of string algae (I think),
and I've drained the pond. Now that the pond is drained, what is the
best bet to get rid of the algae, so I don't have it in the spring. I
don't mind filling the pond, treating it, and draining it again, but it
will drain into a garden area, so we must be careful not to kill plants
in the process. We have 25 goldfish, 700 gallon pond (should be
enough), plenty of water movement, and a homemade bio filter. We had a
few plants to begin the season (no algae problem), but they rapidly
grew to quite a few. Any words of wisdom? Our pond is one with a rubber
liner. Any input will be greatly appreciated.

[Derek Broughton]

captain039-recponds wrote:

> I'm new to the group, and we've had our pond for 2 seasons now. Last
> year, everything worked out very well after the initial break-in
> period. This year, we have a very bad case of string algae (I think),
> and I've drained the pond. Now that the pond is drained, what is the
> best bet to get rid of the algae, so I don't have it in the spring.

Just scrub it down (_without_ soap). But it will still come back in the
spring. imo, draining a pond to deal with algae is a bad idea. Algae
grows in the presence of sunlight and nitrates. The best solution then is
to grow enough other plants to shade the subsurface water and use up all

Meanwhile, string algae is fairly easily controlled with a stick - twirl
around, pull out, dump in compost...
--
derek

[~ jan jjspond]

>On 27 Sep 2005 06:00:27 -0700, "captain039-recponds" wrote:

>I'm new to the group, and we've had our pond for 2 seasons now. Last
>year, everything worked out very well after the initial break-in
>period. This year, we have a very bad case of string algae (I think),
>and I've drained the pond. Now that the pond is drained, what is the
>best bet to get rid of the algae, so I don't have it in the spring. I
>don't mind filling the pond, treating it, and draining it again, but it
>will drain into a garden area, so we must be careful not to kill plants
>in the process. We have 25 goldfish, 700 gallon pond (should be
>enough), plenty of water movement, and a homemade bio filter. We had a
>few plants to begin the season (no algae problem), but they rapidly
>grew to quite a few. Any words of wisdom? Our pond is one with a rubber
>liner. Any input will be greatly appreciated.

Draining isn't the answer, unless you have a lot of muck build up at the
bottom and don't have a shop vac to suck it out. Why koi ponders recommend
frequent partial water changes (10%/week) over big changes, so as not to
upset the balance.

Don't want string algae? Get rid of 15 goldfish (maybe more), they're the
main reason you have it. All that rich fishy poo. Or build a bigger
out-of-the-pond filter. ~ jan

See my ponds and filter design:
www.jjspond.us

~Keep 'em Wet!~
Tri-Cities WA Zone 7a
To e-mail see website

[captain039-recponds]

Thank you very much for the replies. I should have added that our pond
is in our shade garden, which gets very little time with direct
sunlight (maybe 2 hours or so per day). The only difference between
last year and this year is that we have more fish this year. Maybe that
*is* the cause. Thanks again.

[Koitoy]

I would suggest you do not drain the pond totally again. This is a
quick fix but a temporary one as you will have wiped out a lot of the
biological filtration that was in the pond. Those great heterotrophic
bacteria are not limited to just our filters, they grow on the surface
of the liner, the rocks, ect.

You could get a UV sterilizer or clarifier for free floating algae.
Many people use barley pellets, or straw or hydrogen peroxide to
control string algae. It is also recommended that the pond has a 70%
surface coverage of plants, but I did read a research article that
showed in one study that there was very little difference in the rate
of algae growth in the shade and direct sunlight. Very interesting.
This article also stated that the nitrifying bacteria in an established
pond secretes an enzyme that interferes with the growth of algae.
Another reason to do partial water changes vs draining a pond.

Since I have been using barley hay the last two years I have not had
any string algae. When it breaks down it releases hydrogen peroxide.


Hope this helps- I am sure others will chime in with their
recommendations as well. Happy ponding.


--
Koitoy

[captain039-recponds]

I should have asked if below zero weather will kill the algae we now
have, or if it would be wise to use an algaecide or something else?

[Reel Mckoi]

"captain039-recponds" > wrote in message
ups.com...
>
> I should have asked if below zero weather will kill the algae we now
> have, or if it would be wise to use an algaecide or something else?
===============================
No, freezing wont kill it. It will come back in the spring if conditions are
the same. You may want to get rid of some of your goldfish. How about
overfeeding? No one's just tossing fish food in your pond an walking off I
hope (a mistake a friend of mine was making). All uneaten food will decay
and feed the algae. Water lettuce competes well with algae and thrives in
partial shade. It simply starves it out. Water lilies will shade it out
algae and live in partial shade although most wont bloom in such conditions.
Adding some hornwart and elodia will also help starve it out.
--
McKoi.... frugal ponding since 1995...
My Pond Page http://tinyurl.com/cuq5b
~~~ }<((((o> ~~~ }<{{{{o> ~~~ }<(((((o>

[Derek Broughton]

captain039-recponds wrote:

> I should have asked if below zero weather will kill the algae we now
> have, or if it would be wise to use an algaecide or something else?

Yes, it will - for the most part. It's _never_ wise to use an algaecide in
a fish pond. You aren't doing anything to solve the main problem -
nitrates - and you can only hurt the fish.
--
derek

[captain039-recponds]

Thank you very much for all the replies. It has been a real learning
experience. Now my only question is: What do I do with the algae I
still have on the liner? Should I refill the pond, and leave it as is
for spring, or refill and use a treatment of some kind, then drain and
refill one last time?

[Reel Mckoi]

"captain039-recponds" > wrote in message
ups.com...
>
> Thank you very much for all the replies. It has been a real learning
> experience. Now my only question is: What do I do with the algae I
> still have on the liner? Should I refill the pond, and leave it as is
> for spring, or refill and use a treatment of some kind, then drain and
> refill one last time?
========================
If it's hair algae use a toilet or bottle brush to remove it as best you can
and add as many pond plants as possible including Hornwart and Elodea. In
the spring add water lettuce and water hyacinth, don't overfeed and maybe
cut back on the number of fish in your pond. More partial water changes
should be considered. All these things should help get rid of it.
--
McKoi.... frugal ponding since 1995...
My Pond Page http://tinyurl.com/cuq5b
~~~ }<((((o> ~~~ }<{{{{o> ~~~ }<(((((o>
http://www.hyphenologist.co.uk/killfile/anti_troll_faq.htm

[~ jan jjspond]

On 27 Sep 2005 15:05:44 -0700, "captain039-recponds"
> wrote:

>What do I do with the algae I still have on the liner?

Leave it there. that's the good stuff that keeps suspend algae away.

>Should I refill the pond, and leave it as is
>for spring, or refill and use a treatment of some kind, then drain and
>refill one last time?

Refill. Put shade cloth over the pond to keep leaves and sun out over
winter, you will find the string algae all gone by spring. ~ jan

[~Roy]

This is the first year ever that I have not had a coating of algae in
any of my half barrels or preforms......I just cleaned out the wifes
triple tier half barrel setup yesterday, and it was
spotless.........same for the other liner type containers here and
there. I was just getting things ready for the cooler months so if it
got really cold (fat chance of it really) there would be no mulm etc
decaying on the bottom to give problems later on.

I have at least one Pleco in each container some have 2 or more, as
well as 1 or 2 large snails........and some flying foxes. And each
and every outside preform has a couple of DOJO loaches, which do
remarkably well at cleaning up bottom junk.......All the roots on my
marginals that have poked through pots were spotless.......In my
opinion if you have a small preform or any pond in which you remove
your fish from in the winter and bring them indoors its worthwhile to
have a good clean up crew in them. You can't expect a ot out of a
clean up crew to do a fine job on an already infested with algae etc
pond, but if the crew is put in there at the start or after cleaning
it, then they can usually keep up with it....Previous years I was
inundated with algae, but this year it eas just about non-existent.

In the large pond I have still been aerating and usuing Baraclear and
it too has maintained a very good clarity and no string or other algae
blooms that interferred with water conditions. I do have a heap of
lilys and tons of floating plants, mainly sensitive vine/fern which
does a super job at pulling excessive nutrients from the water. My
parrots feather (what little I have left) does not do well once it
gets hot out here, but during the winter months when the other stuff
goes dormant the PF takes off and continues on with the nutrient
removal process, so come spring, until the other plants get going
again they are not inundated........Plants and aeration are important
in reducing algae, and of course excess feeding also does it part in
promooting algae growths.........I can't do much in regards to
sunlight / shade but I think I have the right balances in both the
natural ponds and the preforms etc. I'll do the same next year and see
what my reuslts are then and hopefully I have the combination of whats
needed to keep it right.

On Tue, 27 Sep 2005 18:50:44 -0700, ~ jan jjspond
> wrote:

>===<>On 27 Sep 2005 15:05:44 -0700, "captain039-recponds"
> wrote:
>===<>
>===<>>What do I do with the algae I still have on the liner?
>===<>
>===<>Leave it there. that's the good stuff that keeps suspend algae away.
>===<>
>===<>>Should I refill the pond, and leave it as is
>===<>>for spring, or refill and use a treatment of some kind, then drain and
>===<>>refill one last time?
>===<>
>===<>Refill. Put shade cloth over the pond to keep leaves and sun out over
>===<>winter, you will find the string algae all gone by spring. ~ jan


==============================================
Put some color in your cheeks...garden naked!
"The original frugal ponder"
~~~~ }<((((o> ~~~~~~ }<{{{{o> ~~~~~~~ }<(((((o>

[[email protected]]

new ponds go thru "succession" (scroll to the bottom to see a synopsis of sand dune
succession)
http://weloveteaching.com/spring2005/ecology/L-green_revolution.html

when the pond is first filled most water is going to be full of nutrients. It is
also going to be cold. as the sun warms it up algae bits float in or are brought in
on insect and bird feet. this part can be speeded up by seeding with a LOT of algae.
as the algae grows there are 3 main types (with good aeration), algae on the side of
the liner, algae free in the water and string algae. if there is no aeration there
is also bubble algae. ponders like the algae on the sides we call it sweater algae.
with no fish or nutrient run off eventually the free algae (pea soup) and string
algae die off for the most part (some hangs around) leaving the algae on the sides of
the pond. the pond is now "balanced". even if iced over the algae keeps growing.
somewhere during this first phase the filter of our choice is added. it takes about
a month for a filter to mature. I use a veggie filter
http://weloveteaching.com/mypond/mypond.htm
in the shade, shade loving plants will be needed. I hear some people use hostas.
Once the pond is clear, temp of the water is warmed up is the time to add fish. Fish
need to be added a few at a time, the smaller the pond the fewer the fish. it takes
a mature pond a mere couple weeks to adjust to the new load of fertilizers. The
reappearance of pea soup (free algae) usually means too many fish have been added.
pea soup is an indicator of excess nutrients in the water. Actually, I have seen pea
soup clear in a couple days when the water was moved in the shade. algae likes the
sun so it is important to use test kits if shade prevents algae blooms due to excess
nutrients.
In fall I remove my plants, the tender ones go into the house under lights. In
spring I start running the veggie filter empty and string algae quickly shows up and
grows removing nutrients. during the year when the plants are in the filter I never
see string algae. String algae is seen in clear creeks as the snow and ice melts.
freezing does not kill algae, algae continues to grow under clear ice.
A UV filter can be used to kill the pea soup algae. I dont start using it until I
see my veggie filter is really up and running. I would rather have the excess
nutrients used up by the algae than toxing out my fish. please dont use algaecides,
they are toxic to some degree and getting to the cause of the algae is better for the
pond. Ingrid

"captain039-recponds" > wrote:
>I should have asked if below zero weather will kill the algae we now
>have, or if it would be wise to use an algaecide or something else?



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[captain039-recponds]

This has been a very informative and educational thread. Thank you all
very much for sharing your expertise.