Cats

[Cecil]

We love cats and own a cat.....an INDOOR cat. Our neighbors (two
different neighbors) own more than one cat and they stay outdoors
all night and most of the day (the cats, not the neighbors). Problem
is, one cat loves to fish. She's the only cat I've caught in the act,
so I'm blaming her for all the torture that has befallen on our koi and
goldfish.

If anyone has any ideas as to how to keep these sweeties away
from our precious fish, please advise. We have tried speaking
to the neighbors. What a laugh!

Cecil

[Gail Futoran]

"Cecil" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> We love cats and own a cat.....an INDOOR cat. Our neighbors (two
> different neighbors) own more than one cat and they stay outdoors
> all night and most of the day (the cats, not the neighbors). Problem
> is, one cat loves to fish. She's the only cat I've caught in the act,
> so I'm blaming her for all the torture that has befallen on our koi and
> goldfish.
>
> If anyone has any ideas as to how to keep these sweeties away
> from our precious fish, please advise. We have tried speaking
> to the neighbors. What a laugh!
>
> Cecil

I've read cats hate the smell of citrus. What
about tossing orange rinds around the pond
for awhile (putting out fresh every couple
of days) and perhaps the cats will get the
idea and go elsewhere. There are products
like "cat away" in pet stores. I don't know
how well they'd work. I'd read the labels
carefully since a lot of things can be toxic
to aquatic life. There might be other organic
"barriers" you could research online, or
perhaps do a google search in rec.pets.cats.
http://groups.google.com/

On a benign cat-pond note, one of my cats
drank water from the pond today. She's never
done that before. I know that's not unusual, but
she has terminal cancer and anything that pleases
her pleases me. As far as her affecting the fish:
as a 5-lb cat with depressed appetite, she's not
interested in "fishing". (She only goes out under
strict supervision and because she wants to.)

Gail

[~ jan jjspond]

>We love cats and own a cat.....an INDOOR cat. Our neighbors (two
>different neighbors) own more than one cat and they stay outdoors
>all night and most of the day (the cats, not the neighbors). Problem
>is, one cat loves to fish. She's the only cat I've caught in the act,
>so I'm blaming her for all the torture that has befallen on our koi and
>goldfish.
>
>If anyone has any ideas as to how to keep these sweeties away
>from our precious fish, please advise. We have tried speaking
>to the neighbors. What a laugh!
>Cecil

Motion sprinkler called the Scarecrow ought to do it:
http://www.km01.com/gardeninghome.html ~ jan

[~Roy]

Havahart or live trap if speaking to the owners of the cat don't
work......Either keep it hostage for awhile or carry it to the local
shelter and tell em its a stray thats been hanging around and all your
attempts at finding its owner had failed! Odds are if they do not care
about their cats well being they wll not go looking for it at the
shelter either.
Cat problem solved......Or get a big old cat hater of a dog.

==============================================
Put some color in your cheeks...garden naked!
"The original frugal ponder"
~~~~ }<((((o> ~~~~~~ }<{{{{o> ~~~~~~~ }<(((((o>

[~Roy]

On Sat, 15 Oct 2005 17:37:39 GMT, "Gail Futoran"
> wrote:

snip
>===<>I've read cats hate the smell of citrus. What
>===<>about tossing orange rinds around the pond
>===<>for awhile (putting out fresh every couple
>===<>of days) and perhaps the cats will get the
>===<>idea and go elsewhere. There are products
>===<>like "cat away" in pet stores. I don't know
>===<>how well they'd work. I'd read the labels
>===<>carefully since a lot of things can be toxic
>===<>to aquatic life. There might be other organic
>===<>"barriers" you could research online, or
>===<>perhaps do a google search in rec.pets.cats.
>===<>http://groups.google.com/
>===<>
>===<>On a benign cat-pond note, one of my cats
>===<>drank water from the pond today. She's never
>===<>done that before. I know that's not unusual, but
>===<>she has terminal cancer and anything that pleases
>===<>her pleases me. As far as her affecting the fish:
>===<>as a 5-lb cat with depressed appetite, she's not
>===<>interested in "fishing". (She only goes out under
>===<>strict supervision and because she wants to.)
>===<>
>===<>Gail
>===<>

One should not have to pay $$$$ out of their pocket or spend time and
effort to keep another persons wayward pet under control or to
protect their investments (car, pond, fish etc etc). A wild animal
(racoons, herons etc) is one thing a domesticated animal (dog, cat
etc) is another story altogether. I would not hesitate to take that or
any other animal out by way of a humane live trap if words to the
owner failed, and if push come to shove, the triple S method would
certainly be used, but only as a last resort. I had problems when our
one neighbor down the road rented their house when they took on a out
of state job for 2 years. The renters left dogs and cats run
rampant.......No amount of talking to owners would resolve the
situation, with others besides myself.....Animal control here is
handled by the county sherriff and that means if they see it and they
can shoot it it gets shot.......they do not have traps nor personel
dedicated to catching or trapping the animals that are running loose
and are problems.......After 6 or 7 familys called in and complained
to the sherriff, they soon eliminated the problem along with a little
help from the other residents.

==============================================
Put some color in your cheeks...garden naked!
"The original frugal ponder"
~~~~ }<((((o> ~~~~~~ }<{{{{o> ~~~~~~~ }<(((((o>

[Cecil]

Thanks to all for the great suggestions. We did set traps
for a raccoon problem we had last month. We caught a
raccoon, but the neighbor set off the trap when we left
one set just in case there were more raccoons in the area.
So, they are probably on the lookout for traps. The
Scarecrow is pretty pricey, but may try that. It's worth it
when we think of the cost of replacing fish, even though
cost isn't the main factor. We're attached to our fish!
They are like any other pet. Meanwhile, I'll toss out some
orange peels. Calling in the top guns will be a last resort,
as we don't want to take away their pets, either. Has anyone
used the high-pitched sound devise?

Cecil

[Horai]

Cecil wrote:
> We love cats and own a cat.....an INDOOR cat. Our neighbors (two
> different neighbors) own more than one cat and they stay outdoors
> all night and most of the day (the cats, not the neighbors). Problem
> is, one cat loves to fish. She's the only cat I've caught in the act,
> so I'm blaming her for all the torture that has befallen on our koi and
> goldfish.
>
> If anyone has any ideas as to how to keep these sweeties away
> from our precious fish, please advise. We have tried speaking
> to the neighbors. What a laugh!
>
> Cecil
>

Well.. Kill it. It not your cat.

[~ jan jjspond]

On 15 Oct 2005 14:12:13 -0700, "Cecil" > wrote:

>Thanks to all for the great suggestions. The
>Scarecrow is pretty pricey, but may try that. It's worth it
>when we think of the cost of replacing fish, even though
>cost isn't the main factor. We're attached to our fish!
>They are like any other pet. Meanwhile, I'll toss out some
>orange peels. Calling in the top guns will be a last resort,
>as we don't want to take away their pets, either. Has anyone
>used the high-pitched sound devise?>Cecil

The nice thing about the motion sprinkler is it will take care of more than
just cats. The sound devices are iffy, and still cost.

After being hit by a raccoon I bit the bullet and got the ScareCrow, what I
didn't expect was the peace of mind it gave. Well worth the money, and they
were $80-90 at the time I purchased my first one. Since then I've put one
on my lily pond and purchased an extra. The first one had a bit of a leak,
so we put the new one in it's place and the leaky one will be the fall
back, if either of the other two fail. ~ jan

[Cyde Weys]

Cecil wrote:
> We love cats and own a cat.....an INDOOR cat. Our neighbors (two
> different neighbors) own more than one cat and they stay outdoors
> all night and most of the day (the cats, not the neighbors). Problem
> is, one cat loves to fish. She's the only cat I've caught in the act,
> so I'm blaming her for all the torture that has befallen on our koi and
> goldfish.
>
> If anyone has any ideas as to how to keep these sweeties away
> from our precious fish, please advise. We have tried speaking
> to the neighbors. What a laugh!

Are you really so opposed to putting up a fence?

I'm more of a cat person than a fish person, really, but it's
unacceptable for one person's pet to be eating another person's pet.
You may want to try laying out a trap for the cat.

[Daniel Morrow]

Mid posted.


"Gail Futoran" > wrote in message
...
> "Cecil" > wrote in message
> oups.com...
> > We love cats and own a cat.....an INDOOR cat. Our neighbors (two
> > different neighbors) own more than one cat and they stay outdoors
> > all night and most of the day (the cats, not the neighbors). Problem
> > is, one cat loves to fish. She's the only cat I've caught in the act,
> > so I'm blaming her for all the torture that has befallen on our koi and
> > goldfish.
> >
> > If anyone has any ideas as to how to keep these sweeties away
> > from our precious fish, please advise. We have tried speaking
> > to the neighbors. What a laugh!
> >
> > Cecil
>
> I've read cats hate the smell of citrus. What
> about tossing orange rinds around the pond
> for awhile (putting out fresh every couple
> of days) and perhaps the cats will get the
> idea and go elsewhere. There are products
> like "cat away" in pet stores. I don't know
> how well they'd work. I'd read the labels
> carefully since a lot of things can be toxic
> to aquatic life. There might be other organic
> "barriers" you could research online, or
> perhaps do a google search in rec.pets.cats.
> http://groups.google.com/
>
> On a benign cat-pond note, one of my cats
> drank water from the pond today. She's never
> done that before. I know that's not unusual, but
> she has terminal cancer

I am sorry to hear your cat has terminal cancer. 2 years ago I had to
euthanize our beloved russian grey looking cat because he had throat cancer
and towards the end we had no choice but to euthanize him for his sake.
Damned cancer! A few months ago I had to euthanize his sister blackie
because she was showing major sings of old age (18 1/2 years old) and had
organ failure (possibly multiple organ failure), anemia, wasn't
eating/drinking and towards the end she weighed 4 pounds and was howling the
last day or 2 before being euthanized. It was very moving for us - I hope
the best for your cat and yourself no matter what happens, and it will still
be trying for you I am sure as pets have powerful effects on there
caregivers. Good luck and later!

and anything that pleases
> her pleases me. As far as her affecting the fish:
> as a 5-lb cat with depressed appetite, she's not
> interested in "fishing". (She only goes out under
> strict supervision and because she wants to.)
>
> Gail
>
>

[Cecil]

Do you know any cats who can be stopped by a fence? The
outdoor cat owners should put one up if anybody.

Cecil

[Cecil]

I wondered if the sound devise would have a bad affect on the fish.
I'll probably go ahead and buy the Scarecrow. Looks like it's on
sale. Our closest dealer wants over $70 for it!

Cecil

[DW]

> Cecil wrote:
> > We love cats and own a cat.....an INDOOR cat. Our neighbors (two
> > different neighbors) own more than one cat and they stay outdoors
> > all night and most of the day (the cats, not the neighbors). Problem
> > is, one cat loves to fish. She's the only cat I've caught in the act,
> > so I'm blaming her for all the torture that has befallen on our koi and
> > goldfish.
> >
> > If anyone has any ideas as to how to keep these sweeties away
> > from our precious fish, please advise. We have tried speaking
> > to the neighbors. What a laugh!
I never saw the original post. Where are the fish?

I had the perfect solution a few years ago. My fish were in a fish
tank,
one of my cats would get on top of the fish tank thinking dinner is
served. The problem was, she could never figure out how to get into
the
fish tank, she was standing on the access door.

Do you perchance have the fish in a tank with no cover?

[DW]

[note on this post: removed some of
the groups this posts to......my server
doesn't carrry the group named.]

****alt.religion.jehovahs-witns*****

That folks is one of the hazards of cross posting.

[Cecil]

The fish are in a backyard pond.
LOL!! No access door there.

Cecil

[No More Retail]

****ing troll <plonk>

[DW]

Cecil wrote:
> The fish are in a backyard pond.
> LOL!! No access door there.
Then you really can't complain about the cat trying to get them.
The cat was hard wired at birth to be interested in fish.

Maybe relocating the fish to an aquirium whould be in order?

[No More Retail]

Actually cats are originally desert creatures Fish is not a natural food
source

[DW]

No More Retail wrote:
> Actually cats are originally desert creatures Fish is not a natural food
> source
Ooops....someone forgot to tell that to my cats.

[No More Retail]

Did not say they did not like it just that is not a natural food source

[Upscale]

"DW" > wrote in message >
> Cecil wrote:
> > The fish are in a backyard pond.
> Then you really can't complain about the cat trying to get them.
> The cat was hard wired at birth to be interested in fish.

Bull****! Using the same reasoning you could say that's it's natural for all
the dogs in the neighbourhood to **** on your lawn since they're hardwired
to ****. In a case like that maybe a 6' fence all around your house would be
in order.

A pet is its owner's responsibility. And any damage done to someone's
property is the direct responsibility of that owner.

[rpl]

Horai wrote:
> Cecil wrote:
>> We love cats and own a cat.....an INDOOR cat. Our neighbors (two
>> different neighbors) own more than one cat and they stay outdoors
>> all night and most of the day (the cats, not the neighbors). Problem
>> is, one cat loves to fish. She's the only cat I've caught in the act,
>> so I'm blaming her for all the torture that has befallen on our koi and
>> goldfish.
>>
>> If anyone has any ideas as to how to keep these sweeties away
>> from our precious fish, please advise. We have tried speaking
>> to the neighbors. What a laugh!
>>

3 solutions:

a) do nothing, replace fish as needed

b) build the wall of the pond up so the cat(s) can't reach into the
pond... replace cats as needed (falls in and drowns)

c) put a vertical wire mesh underwater a foot in from the edge so the
fish can't swim within range of the cat. The mesh should be too fine for
the fish to swim through and get eaten or the cat to put a paw through
and get tangled.

e-mail me if this doesn't make sense to you.


Pat
JW's newsgroup elided.

[Horai]

Upscale wrote:
> "DW" > wrote in message >
>
>>Cecil wrote:
>>
>>>The fish are in a backyard pond.
>>
>>Then you really can't complain about the cat trying to get them.
>>The cat was hard wired at birth to be interested in fish.
>
>
> Bull****! Using the same reasoning you could say that's it's natural for all
> the dogs in the neighbourhood to **** on your lawn since they're hardwired
> to ****. In a case like that maybe a 6' fence all around your house would be
> in order.
>
> A pet is its owner's responsibility. And any damage done to someone's
> property is the direct responsibility of that owner.
>
>

Cats don't have owners. They own people.

[jdc1]

Horai wrote:
> Cecil wrote:
>
>> We love cats and own a cat.....an INDOOR cat. Our neighbors (two
>> different neighbors) own more than one cat and they stay outdoors
>> all night and most of the day (the cats, not the neighbors). Problem
>> is, one cat loves to fish. She's the only cat I've caught in the act,
>> so I'm blaming her for all the torture that has befallen on our koi and
>> goldfish.
>>
>> If anyone has any ideas as to how to keep these sweeties away
>> from our precious fish, please advise. We have tried speaking
>> to the neighbors. What a laugh!
>>
>> Cecil
>>
>
> Well.. Kill it. It not your cat.

Rube Goldberg up some wiring mesh with low voltage current around edge of pond. You can
use AC to DC transformer.

[rpl]

Cecil wrote:
> We love cats and own a cat.....an INDOOR cat. Our neighbors (two
> different neighbors) own more than one cat and they stay outdoors
> all night and most of the day (the cats, not the neighbors). Problem
> is, one cat loves to fish. She's the only cat I've caught in the act,
> so I'm blaming her for all the torture that has befallen on our koi and
> goldfish.
>
> If anyone has any ideas as to how to keep these sweeties away
> from our precious fish, please advise. We have tried speaking
> to the neighbors. What a laugh!
>
> Cecil
>

If you were next door to me your pond would have 4 cats around the edge
a good portion of the time (cat TV) and at least one of them would try
her hand at fishing (the other three would settle for just watching).

*But* you mention "torture" and that's not really in line with what a
cat that doesn't want to get wet can accomplish with one paw.

Are there raccoons in Tennessee(?) ? Nocturnal, love to fish, love the
water. I've seen raccoons taking baths in my pool.



Pat
(dropped in from a.cats to say hi)

[Bri6791]

You could buy pond netting and put it over the pond when your not
there. Or if its a skittish cat, put a motion sensor light out, though
the scarecrow coud probably do a better job than a light.

[No More Retail]

he is something you might consider instead of wiring up a fire hazard go to
the pet store and buy a SCAT it is a device that emits an ultra high
frequency designed to scare animal life away it is safe cheap and humane

[rpl]

Bri6791 wrote:
> You could buy pond netting and put it over the pond when your not
> there. Or if its a skittish cat, put a motion sensor light out, though
> the scarecrow coud probably do a better job than a light.

I imagine the fish wouldn't be too thrilled by netting. Netting will
either have no effect or will potentially kill the cat that gets caught
in it.

[Cecil]

This doesn't make sense. Doing nothing won't solve the problem.
Building a higher wall would take away from our enjoyment of
getting down close to the water to hand-feed the koi and goldfish
and it would be an eyesore. The underwater wire would be
horrid for the newborns - imagine them getting caught in the mesh
and dying! I'm still going to try the Scarecrow.

Cecil

[Gabrielle]

Sorry to hear about your little cat but I'm glad she gets some pleasure
sipping from the pond. Two of my cats are allowed outside under
supervision and they both like a lap or two of pond water. Neither is
interested in fishing.
Gabrielle

Gail Futoran wrote:

> On a benign cat-pond note, one of my cats
> drank water from the pond today. She's never
> done that before. I know that's not unusual, but
> she has terminal cancer and anything that pleases
> her pleases me. As far as her affecting the fish:
> as a 5-lb cat with depressed appetite, she's not
> interested in "fishing". (She only goes out under
> strict supervision and because she wants to.)
>
> Gail

[alt4]

I had fish, but with a cover. The cats could easily open it if they wanted
to. They also knew how angry I was when they just climbed on there. A
solution; what about a short fence? Not the kind that keeps you from seeing
the fish, but it would hinder the cats if they would go to pull one out,
something I'm skeptical about, but I'm not there to see it.

--
"Other than telling us how to live, think,
marry, pray, vote, invest, educate our
children and now, die, I think the
Republicans have done a fine job of
getting government out of our personal
lives."
"Horai" > wrote in message
...
> Cecil wrote:
>> We love cats and own a cat.....an INDOOR cat. Our neighbors (two
>> different neighbors) own more than one cat and they stay outdoors
>> all night and most of the day (the cats, not the neighbors). Problem
>> is, one cat loves to fish. She's the only cat I've caught in the act,
>> so I'm blaming her for all the torture that has befallen on our koi and
>> goldfish.
>>
>> If anyone has any ideas as to how to keep these sweeties away
>> from our precious fish, please advise. We have tried speaking
>> to the neighbors. What a laugh!
>>
>> Cecil
>>
>
> Well.. Kill it. It not your cat.

[Brigitte]

"Cecil" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> This doesn't make sense. Doing nothing won't solve the problem.
> Building a higher wall would take away from our enjoyment of
> getting down close to the water to hand-feed the koi and goldfish
> and it would be an eyesore.

The wall wouldn't need to be that tall, really. Just tall enough that the
cat wouldn't be able to sit on it and catch fish. The cat certainly isn't
going to jump into the pond. I would think 12 inches would be tall enough.

The wall doesn't need to be ugly, either. You could make the wall from
those concrete things you find in the garden center, used for creating
flower beds. Just stack them 4 or 5 high and you've got an attractive
"wall" that will keep the cats from "fishing" in your ponds.

HTH,
Brigitte

[Derek Broughton]

rpl wrote:

> Cecil wrote:
>> We love cats and own a cat.....an INDOOR cat. Our neighbors (two
>> different neighbors) own more than one cat and they stay outdoors
>> all night and most of the day (the cats, not the neighbors). Problem
>> is, one cat loves to fish. She's the only cat I've caught in the act,
>> so I'm blaming her for all the torture that has befallen on our koi and
>> goldfish.
>>
>> If anyone has any ideas as to how to keep these sweeties away
>> from our precious fish, please advise. We have tried speaking
>> to the neighbors. What a laugh!
>>
> If you were next door to me your pond would have 4 cats around the edge
> a good portion of the time (cat TV) and at least one of them would try
> her hand at fishing (the other three would settle for just watching).

A pretty irresponsible attitude...
>
> *But* you mention "torture" and that's not really in line with what a
> cat that doesn't want to get wet can accomplish with one paw.

No? You don't think continually spiking a koi with cat-claws couldn't be
considered torture? Well, since you wouldn't object to your cat fishing in
the neighbor's pond, I guess not.
>
> Are there raccoons in Tennessee(?) ? Nocturnal, love to fish, love the
> water. I've seen raccoons taking baths in my pool.

Of course there are. However, since Cecil has _caught_ the cat in the act,
it's still fair to blame the cat.
--
derek

[Derek Broughton]

rpl wrote:

> Bri6791 wrote:
>> You could buy pond netting and put it over the pond when your not
>> there. Or if its a skittish cat, put a motion sensor light out, though
>> the scarecrow coud probably do a better job than a light.
>
> I imagine the fish wouldn't be too thrilled by netting.

The fish would never know. Pond netting goes _over_ the pond.

> Netting will
> either have no effect or will potentially kill the cat that gets caught
> in it.

Another good reason to keep cats indoors.
--
derek

[rpl]

Brigitte wrote:
> "Cecil" > wrote in message
> oups.com...
>> This doesn't make sense. Doing nothing won't solve the problem.
>> Building a higher wall would take away from our enjoyment of
>> getting down close to the water to hand-feed the koi and goldfish
>> and it would be an eyesore.
>
> The wall wouldn't need to be that tall, really. Just tall enough that the
> cat wouldn't be able to sit on it and catch fish. The cat certainly isn't
> going to jump into the pond. I would think 12 inches would be tall enough.
>
> The wall doesn't need to be ugly, either. You could make the wall from
> those concrete things you find in the garden center, used for creating
> flower beds. Just stack them 4 or 5 high and you've got an attractive
> "wall" that will keep the cats from "fishing" in your ponds.

ah... got it (I think); what about putting water vegetation around the
edge?... the cat can't see through to nail the fish.

Or get some of those fishes that spit water.

[rpl]

Derek Broughton wrote:
> rpl wrote:
>
>> Cecil wrote:
>>> We love cats and own a cat.....an INDOOR cat. Our neighbors (two
>>> different neighbors) own more than one cat and they stay outdoors
>>> all night and most of the day (the cats, not the neighbors). Problem
>>> is, one cat loves to fish. She's the only cat I've caught in the act,
>>> so I'm blaming her for all the torture that has befallen on our koi and
>>> goldfish.
>>>
>>> If anyone has any ideas as to how to keep these sweeties away
>>> from our precious fish, please advise. We have tried speaking
>>> to the neighbors. What a laugh!
>>>
>> If you were next door to me your pond would have 4 cats around the edge
>> a good portion of the time (cat TV) and at least one of them would try
>> her hand at fishing (the other three would settle for just watching).
>
> A pretty irresponsible attitude...
>> *But* you mention "torture" and that's not really in line with what a
>> cat that doesn't want to get wet can accomplish with one paw.
>
> No? You don't think continually spiking a koi with cat-claws couldn't be
> considered torture? Well, since you wouldn't object to your cat fishing in
> the neighbor's pond, I guess not.
>> Are there raccoons in Tennessee(?) ? Nocturnal, love to fish, love the
>> water. I've seen raccoons taking baths in my pool.
>
> Of course there are. However, since Cecil has _caught_ the cat in the act,
> it's still fair to blame the cat.

What are you, the group's "designated asshole" ? I came over here to
try and resolve an issue with a fellow pet owner, not be abused by some
idiot.

[MaryL]

"Cecil" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> The fish are in a backyard pond.
> LOL!! No access door there.
>
> Cecil
>

My brother and sister-in-law have an outdoor fish pool, and there are also
neighborhood cats that like the area. They solved your problem by raising
the rock boundaries (interplanted with some interesting plants to avoid a
"sterile" look) so the cats can no longer reach into the pool.

Incidentally, are you sure that all of the damage is done by cats? My
brother says they lose most of theirs to a great blue heron that fishes
there, and once in a while they will pot a kingfisher.

MaryL

[Reel Mckoi]

"rpl" > wrote in message
...
> Bri6791 wrote:
>> You could buy pond netting and put it over the pond when your not
>> there. Or if its a skittish cat, put a motion sensor light out, though
>> the scarecrow coud probably do a better job than a light.
>
> I imagine the fish wouldn't be too thrilled by netting.

## My ponds are netted 24/7 because of predators (herons, snakes etc). So
far cats haven't been a real problem although my nearest neighbor had
several.

Netting will
> either have no effect or will potentially kill the cat that gets caught in
> it.

## If the net is hung correctly (snugly and well pinned down) there is no
way a cat can get caught in it. We've found by experience that animals
don't care to tangle with a net or try to get through it. A cat by instinct
is unlikely to try and walk on something OVER WATER that is as unsteady as a
net.
--
McKoi.... frugal ponding since 1995...
My Pond Page http://tinyurl.com/cuq5b
~~~ }<((((o> ~~~ }<{{{{o> ~~~ }<(((((o>

[San Diego Joe]

"Cecil" wrote:

> We love cats and own a cat.....an INDOOR cat. Our neighbors (two
> different neighbors) own more than one cat and they stay outdoors
> all night and most of the day (the cats, not the neighbors). Problem
> is, one cat loves to fish. She's the only cat I've caught in the act,
> so I'm blaming her for all the torture that has befallen on our koi and
> goldfish.
>
> If anyone has any ideas as to how to keep these sweeties away
> from our precious fish, please advise. We have tried speaking
> to the neighbors. What a laugh!
>
> Cecil
>
Try a scarecrow. It's a motion activated sprinkler that will emit a five
second spray of water. Works well for herons too.

San Diego Joe
4,000 - 5,000 Gallons.
Koi, Goldfish, and RES named Colombo.

[rpl]

Reel Mckoi wrote:
>
> "rpl" > wrote in message
> ...
>> Bri6791 wrote:
>>> You could buy pond netting and put it over the pond when your not
>>> there. Or if its a skittish cat, put a motion sensor light out, though
>>> the scarecrow coud probably do a better job than a light.
>>
>> I imagine the fish wouldn't be too thrilled by netting.
>
> ## My ponds are netted 24/7 because of predators (herons, snakes etc).
> So far cats haven't been a real problem although my nearest neighbor had
> several.
>
> Netting will
>> either have no effect or will potentially kill the cat that gets
>> caught in it.
>
> ## If the net is hung correctly (snugly and well pinned down) there is
> no way a cat can get caught in it. We've found by experience that
> animals don't care to tangle with a net or try to get through it. A cat
> by instinct is unlikely to try and walk on something OVER WATER that is
> as unsteady as a net.

no argument here re: adult cats; just a kneejerk reaction to having had
to cut unconscious kittens out of hockey nets.

pat

[Derek Broughton]

rpl wrote:

> Derek Broughton wrote:
>>
>> No? You don't think continually spiking a koi with cat-claws couldn't be
>> considered torture? Well, since you wouldn't object to your cat fishing
>> in the neighbor's pond, I guess not.
>>> Are there raccoons in Tennessee(?) ? Nocturnal, love to fish, love the
>>> water. I've seen raccoons taking baths in my pool.
>>
>> Of course there are. However, since Cecil has _caught_ the cat in the
>> act, it's still fair to blame the cat.
>
> What are you, the group's "designated asshole" ? I came over here to
> try and resolve an issue with a fellow pet owner, not be abused by some
> idiot.

We have other people for that function. However, if you drop in on a group
you don't usually read, giving advice that is sure to _at the very least_
anger the regulars, you can pretty much expect to be flamed. (and I'll
point out that this is pretty mild for flaming - it's a long, long, way
from abuse).

Letting pets roam loose is irresponsible. Telling the "fellow pet owner"
that if he lived next door to you, your cat _would_ be fishing in his pond
is not merely irresponsible, it's nasty. You gave Cedric no advice on what
to _do_ about his problem, you simply pretended that he was confused about
the problem - suggesting that his real problem was raccoons.

In future, if you're going to be dismissive of the value of our "pets" (I
don't keep fish as pets, but some - like Cedric - do), then stick to cat
groups where you'll no doubt find many of like mind.
--
derek

[No More Retail]

Everyone here forgot one important thing Have you actually seen the cat
attack the fish if not remember there is other predators scavengers out
there called raccoons who are not afraid of the water and will go fishing

And I offered the most easiest solution go get an animal repeller they are
about $50 and plug in to the outlet it releases a high pitch frequency that
scares off all animals

[No More Retail]

I know she has seen one cat do it only

[Shadow Walker]

I have a house cat that has gotten out and jumped a 7 foot wooden fence
without pausing, she never touched the fence. Your fence is not going to
stop a cat, because then there are trees to consider. You could build a
gazebo around your pond depending on how big it is. That would also cut down
on leaves and mosquito larva, and dragon flies. Were do you live? Most
states have leash laws for all pets. If not you could trap them and tell the
pound who's cat it is and have them written up for it.. That might help, or
you could have the pound come and get them.
Gina
"Upscale" > wrote in message
...
> "DW" > wrote in message >
>> Cecil wrote:
>> > The fish are in a backyard pond.
>> Then you really can't complain about the cat trying to get them.
>> The cat was hard wired at birth to be interested in fish.
>
> Bull****! Using the same reasoning you could say that's it's natural for
> all
> the dogs in the neighbourhood to **** on your lawn since they're hardwired
> to ****. In a case like that maybe a 6' fence all around your house would
> be
> in order.
>
> A pet is its owner's responsibility. And any damage done to someone's
> property is the direct responsibility of that owner.
>
>

[~Roy]

On Mon, 17 Oct 2005 13:33:24 -0300, Derek Broughton
> wrote:

Not a dam thing worth reading.

First off you folks need to understand Derek and his cronies..they
have to be the only ones with the correct method or answer, or its not
plausible......if argued with they get sulled up like a little kid and
go pout for a few days....

So y'all cut that asshole and his cronies a bit of slack........

==============================================
Put some color in your cheeks...garden naked!
"The original frugal ponder"
~~~~ }<((((o> ~~~~~~ }<{{{{o> ~~~~~~~ }<(((((o>

[~Roy]

Yea, a 22 rifle or a bow fishing rig will do it all the time!

On Mon, 17 Oct 2005 20:00:02 +0100, Aidan Karley
. group> wrote:

>===<>In article . com>,
>===<>Cecil wrote:
>===<>> If anyone has any ideas as to how to keep these sweeties away
>===<>> from our precious fish, please advise.
>===<>>
>===<> Taking an alternative tack to other people ... the Amazon houses
>===<>a number of species of "archer fish", which will knock an insect into
>===<>the stream with a well-aimed spit. Now, a little bit of constructive
>===<>breeding might lead to an archer fish that's big enough to take out a
>===<>cat. Problem solved.
>===<> Now, once such archer fish have been bred, they'd need to be
>===<>advertised for sale. How would your neighbours react to the flyer
>===<>leaflet for these fish landing on their doorstep? Perhaps with adverts
>===<>for octopi that can take out an over-inquisitive human?
>===<>


==============================================
Put some color in your cheeks...garden naked!
"The original frugal ponder"
~~~~ }<((((o> ~~~~~~ }<{{{{o> ~~~~~~~ }<(((((o>

[~Roy]

On Mon, 17 Oct 2005 20:33:03 GMT, "Shadow Walker"
> wrote:

>===<>I have a house cat that has gotten out and jumped a 7 foot wooden fence
>===<>without pausing, she never touched the fence. Your fence is not going to
>===<>stop a cat, because then there are trees to consider

snip

Yep and those idiots that suggested building a fence to keep out cats
probably belive a screendoor on a submarine is a much needed item as
well......Probably do all their shopping on late night TV shopping
clubs and take all those wonder drug ads as the gospil....but look I
got three for the price of one and then it was discounted yet again by
50%........... so all of them only cost me $2.00 .and it only cost me
$157.92 S & H

==============================================
Put some color in your cheeks...garden naked!
"The original frugal ponder"
~~~~ }<((((o> ~~~~~~ }<{{{{o> ~~~~~~~ }<(((((o>

[rpl]

Cecil wrote:
> I wondered if the sound devise would have a bad affect on the fish.

hook it up to a motion detector and it will just go off when necessary.

> I'll probably go ahead and buy the Scarecrow. Looks like it's on
> sale. Our closest dealer wants over $70 for it!

what is that?

[rpl]

~Roy wrote:

>..they
> have to be the only ones with the correct method or answer, or its not
> plausible......if argued with they get sulled up like a little kid and
> go pout for a few days....
>
> So y'all cut that asshole and his cronies a bit of slack........

I don't "live" here so it's no skin off my ass really; seems to me you
could add animal awareness elements to pond design.

[Reel Mckoi]

"rpl" > wrote in message
.. .
> Cecil wrote:
>> I wondered if the sound devise would have a bad affect on the fish.
>
> hook it up to a motion detector and it will just go off when necessary.
>
>> I'll probably go ahead and buy the Scarecrow. Looks like it's on
>> sale. Our closest dealer wants over $70 for it!
>
> what is that?
========================
It's a harmless water sprayer. It shoots a stream of water at anything that
moves past it's "eye." Cats and other animals are not harmed, but hate
being sprayed.
--
McKoi.... frugal ponding since 1995...
My Pond Page http://tinyurl.com/cuq5b
~~~ }<((((o> ~~~ }<{{{{o> ~~~ }<(((((o>

[Reel Mckoi]

"rpl" > wrote in message
...
> ~Roy wrote:
>
>>..they
>> have to be the only ones with the correct method or answer, or its not
>> plausible......if argued with they get sulled up like a little kid and
>> go pout for a few days....
>>
>> So y'all cut that asshole and his cronies a bit of slack........
>
> I don't "live" here so it's no skin off my ass really; seems to me you
> could add animal awareness elements to pond design.
=====================================
This is an excellent suggestion. I think the books and websites on ponds and
pond building should better cover "animal awareness." They barely touch on
predators such as snakes, bullfrogs, herons etc. Much more information
should be given as to how to prevent loss of valued fish pets due to these
other critters in the environment. Our answer was the strong, thin, fine,
black plastic or nylon bird nets. Other people are successful with the
water sprayers. To kill people's pets is unthinkable. If they can't be
kept away there are traps, law suits, whatever.......
--
McKoi.... frugal ponding since 1995...
My Pond Page http://tinyurl.com/cuq5b
~~~ }<((((o> ~~~ }<{{{{o> ~~~ }<(((((o>
http://www.hyphenologist.co.uk/killfile/anti_troll_faq.htm

[Greg Cooper]

jdc1 wrote:
> Horai wrote:
>
> Rube Goldberg up some wiring mesh with low voltage current around edge
> of pond. You can use AC to DC transformer.
>

You can buy a product called "Fido Fencce" - basically it is a scaled
down version of a electric cattle fence. Works for Raccoons Dogs and I
am sure cats. The water scare crow as already mentioned should work
really well for cats as well - they hate getting wet and hate surprises.

[Greg Cooper]

rpl wrote:

> Bri6791 wrote:
>
>> You could buy pond netting and put it over the pond when your not
>> there. Or if its a skittish cat, put a motion sensor light out, though
>> the scarecrow coud probably do a better job than a light.
>
>
> I imagine the fish wouldn't be too thrilled by netting. Netting will
> either have no effect or will potentially kill the cat that gets caught
> in it.
I am using black plastic fruit tree netting across my pond - it is the
only thing I have found fully effective against the Raccoon problem I
have (tried electric fence and water scarecrow). Streached across the
pond above the water it is fairly invisible and not a hazard to the
fish. I dont see a big risk in a animal getting caught in it and not
being able to pull free.

[Greg Cooper]

Reel Mckoi wrote:


>> I don't "live" here so it's no skin off my ass really; seems to me you
>> could add animal awareness elements to pond design.
>
> =====================================
> This is an excellent suggestion. I think the books and websites on ponds
> and pond building should better cover "animal awareness." They barely
> touch on predators such as snakes, bullfrogs, herons etc. Much more
> information should be given as to how to prevent loss of valued fish
> pets due to these other critters in the environment. Our answer was the
> strong, thin, fine, black plastic or nylon bird nets. Other people are
> successful with the water sprayers. To kill people's pets is
> unthinkable. If they can't be kept away there are traps, law suits,
> whatever.......

I particularly have trouble with the way the Aquascape people trivialize
the issue of predetors around ponds - as if it is a well solved problem
if you use there design & equipment for your pond. I am sure there
reassurances attact a lot of people into ponds who then are really upset
when there pets get snatched.

As for cats - its clear (just from reading these posts even) that there
are many people with inflamatory points of view. Our cats were outside
cats until they got quite aged. Even if the owner is concerned if their
cats go out it is pretty hard to control where they go. Also hard to
reform a cat who is used to going out. Rather then feuding its easyer
to deal with the problem at the pond end (net, sprinker)

[Reel Mckoi]

"Greg Cooper" > wrote in message
news:1K15f.32379$Io.5942@clgrps13...
> I am using black plastic fruit tree netting across my pond - it is the
> only thing I have found fully effective against the Raccoon problem I have
> (tried electric fence and water scarecrow). Streached across the pond
> above the water it is fairly invisible and not a hazard to the fish. I
> dont see a big risk in a animal getting caught in it and not being able to
> pull free.
=====================
I've been using them for about 5 years now and never had an animal get
tangled in the nets. I buy those very strong fine nets from ACE Hardware.
They last at least 2 years if in the sun. Longer in partial shade. The only
deaths we've had were two water snakes that snared themselves and a few
frogs. But we have no other choice where we live because of the amount of
predators we have to deal with.
--
McKoi.... frugal ponding since 1995...
My Pond Page http://tinyurl.com/cuq5b
~~~ }<((((o> ~~~ }<{{{{o> ~~~ }<(((((o>

[Reel Mckoi]

"Greg Cooper" > wrote in message
news:WU15f.32386$Io.20994@clgrps13...
> Reel Mckoi wrote:
>
>
>>> I don't "live" here so it's no skin off my ass really; seems to me you
>>> could add animal awareness elements to pond design.
>>
>> =====================================
>> This is an excellent suggestion. I think the books and websites on ponds
>> and pond building should better cover "animal awareness." They barely
>> touch on predators such as snakes, bullfrogs, herons etc. Much more
>> information should be given as to how to prevent loss of valued fish pets
>> due to these other critters in the environment. Our answer was the
>> strong, thin, fine, black plastic or nylon bird nets. Other people are
>> successful with the water sprayers. To kill people's pets is
>> unthinkable. If they can't be kept away there are traps, law suits,
>> whatever.......
=========
> I particularly have trouble with the way the Aquascape people trivialize
> the issue of predetors around ponds

## That's because they're looking to make money and not scare people off, or
discourage them. It's dishonest in my opinion. I've stressed the
importance of predator-prevention to everyone who has ever come to look at
our ponds or talked to me about putting in a pond. Ponds are very popular
in my area. The push them like crazy at the Home & Garden shows.

- as if it is a well solved problem
> if you use there design & equipment for your pond. I am sure there
> reassurances attact a lot of people into ponds who then are really upset
> when there pets get snatched.

## You are 100% correct because that's what happened to us! All questions
about predators or people's pets were simply brushed off as near
non-existent. Well, SURPRISE!!!! I was sick over the constant loss of all
my fancy goldfish, then my beautiful koi.......

> As for cats - its clear (just from reading these posts even) that there
> are many people with inflamatory points of view. Our cats were outside
> cats until they got quite aged. Even if the owner is concerned if their
> cats go out it is pretty hard to control where they go. Also hard to
> reform a cat who is used to going out. Rather then feuding its easyer to
> deal with the problem at the pond end (net, sprinker)

## I can see both sides of this issue. The pond owners feel the cat owners
are inconsiderate and uncaring - the cat owners feel the pond people should
be more into protecting their fish from predators. The pond owners feel
they shouldn't have to spend a bundle to keep the cats out of their yards
and ponds or resort to nets. The cat people can't retrain their cats
although maybe they would like to do that very thing. How is some
compromise made between the two sides?
As for myself. I feel since the cat is trespassing on *my property* I have
the right to trap it (not harm it) and remove it to the nearest animal
shelter - if it's causing me a problem! The cat owner is free to pick up
his/her pet unharmed. If the problem continued (you can't trap cats twice)
then something more drastic would have to be considered.......
--
McKoi.... frugal ponding since 1995...
My Pond Page http://tinyurl.com/cuq5b
~~~ }<((((o> ~~~ }<{{{{o> ~~~ }<(((((o>

[rpl]

Reel Mckoi wrote:
>
> "Greg Cooper" > wrote in message
> news:WU15f.32386$Io.20994@clgrps13...
>> Reel Mckoi wrote:
>>
>>
>>>> I don't "live" here so it's no skin off my ass really; seems to me
>>>> you could add animal awareness elements to pond design.
>>>
>>> =====================================
>>> This is an excellent suggestion. I think the books and websites on
>>> ponds and pond building should better cover "animal awareness." They
>>> barely touch on predators such as snakes, bullfrogs, herons etc.
>>> Much more information should be given as to how to prevent loss of
>>> valued fish pets due to these other critters in the environment. Our
>>> answer was the strong, thin, fine, black plastic or nylon bird nets.
>>> Other people are successful with the water sprayers. To kill
>>> people's pets is unthinkable. If they can't be kept away there are
>>> traps, law suits, whatever.......
> =========
>> I particularly have trouble with the way the Aquascape people
>> trivialize the issue of predetors around ponds
>
> ## That's because they're looking to make money and not scare people
> off, or discourage them. It's dishonest in my opinion. I've stressed
> the importance of predator-prevention to everyone who has ever come to
> look at our ponds or talked to me about putting in a pond. Ponds are
> very popular in my area. The push them like crazy at the Home & Garden
> shows.
>
> - as if it is a well solved problem
>> if you use there design & equipment for your pond. I am sure there
>> reassurances attact a lot of people into ponds who then are really
>> upset when there pets get snatched.
>
> ## You are 100% correct because that's what happened to us! All
> questions about predators or people's pets were simply brushed off as
> near non-existent. Well, SURPRISE!!!! I was sick over the constant
> loss of all my fancy goldfish, then my beautiful koi.......
>
>> As for cats - its clear (just from reading these posts even) that
>> there are many people with inflamatory points of view. Our cats were
>> outside cats until they got quite aged. Even if the owner is
>> concerned if their cats go out it is pretty hard to control where they
>> go. Also hard to reform a cat who is used to going out. Rather then
>> feuding its easyer to deal with the problem at the pond end (net,
>> sprinker)
>
> ## I can see both sides of this issue. The pond owners feel the cat
> owners are inconsiderate and uncaring

some of us are. I'm not inconsiderate so much as... well... the thing
about cats is they're mostly reasonable pets right out of the box, so to
speak.

> - the cat owners feel the pond
> people should be more into protecting their fish from predators. The
> pond owners feel they shouldn't have to spend a bundle to keep the cats
> out of their yards and ponds or resort to nets. The cat people can't
> retrain their cats although maybe they would like to do that very
> thing. How is some compromise made between the two sides?

You might think this is just me protecting my pets from insult but I
really think you'd have more problems with 'coons. I mean face it, even
though all of them are disturbingly competent mousers (one of them has a
catch and release policy which I think is cute except she releases them
in the house), I feed my pets, they aren't hungry, don't swim, hate to
get wet, and domestic cats aren't fishers.

And as I said, out of the four "little darlins" I have, only one might
be tempted to do more than watch the pretty fish. She could reach 7"
into the water and *might* be able to land a small goldfish (let me know
and I'll buy you a new one); I doubt she'd try hooking a koi... batting
it maybe (no clawing) if it poked up out of the water.

> As for myself. I feel since the cat is trespassing on *my property* I
> have the right to trap it (not harm it) and remove it to the nearest
> animal shelter - if it's causing me a problem!

That's your call of course, but courtesy would say that you inform the
pet owner. There aren't any stocked ponds in my neighbourhood (so few
fish learn to skate well) but there are a few gardens; haven't heard any
complaints yet, though.

Of course you could always escalate and buy a dog... or a cat*fish*.

Other (cat deterrent) options as I see them and as I've noted before are
to either spray lemon concentrate around the pond (no clue if that
actually works), build a (barely) underwater ledge jutting in a few
inches from the rim, put water vegetation near the edge, or try one of
the motion sensor things.

Most of those won't work against hungry wild predators.

rpl

[Aidan Karley]

In article >, Reel Mckoi wrote:
> It's a harmless water sprayer. It shoots a stream of water at anything that
> moves past it's "eye." Cats and other animals are not harmed, but hate
> being sprayed.
>
If it's connected to clean mains water, yes.
Would it be possible to hook the inlet up to (say) a bottle of
citrus-cinnamon water, which is a common mix for "discouraging" the attentions
of male mammals on (pet) female mammals in heat?
(Just vaguely pondering [sorry] - I could see some people putting the
device to other uses than pond patrol.)

--
Aidan Karley,
Aberdeen, Scotland,
Location: +57°10' , -02°09' (sub-tropical Aberdeen), 0.021233
Written at Tue, 18 Oct 2005 21:17 +0100

[San Diego Joe]

"Aidan Karley" wrote:

> In article >, Reel Mckoi wrote:
>> It's a harmless water sprayer. It shoots a stream of water at anything that
>> moves past it's "eye." Cats and other animals are not harmed, but hate
>> being sprayed.
>>
> If it's connected to clean mains water, yes.
> Would it be possible to hook the inlet up to (say) a bottle of
> citrus-cinnamon water, which is a common mix for "discouraging" the attentions
> of male mammals on (pet) female mammals in heat?

It has to be under pressure, like a watering hose.



San Diego Joe
4,000 - 5,000 Gallons.
Koi, Goldfish, and RES named Colombo.

[Reel Mckoi]

Greg Cooper wrote:

> You can buy a product called "Fido Fencce" - basically it is a scaled
> down version of a electric cattle fence. Works for Raccoons Dogs and I
> am sure cats. The water scare crow as already mentioned should work
> really well for cats as well - they hate getting wet and hate surprises.


Youre are a real dummy. If cats did not want to get wet, they wouldn't
try getting into the freaking pond. Where are your brains man?!!!!



McKoi.... frugal ponding since 1995...
My Pond Page http://tinyurl.com/cuq5b
~~~ }<((((o> ~~~ }<{{{{o> ~~~ }<(((((o>

[Derek Broughton]

San Diego Joe wrote:

> "Aidan Karley" wrote:
>
>> In article >, Reel Mckoi wrote:
>>> It's a harmless water sprayer. It shoots a stream of water at anything
>>> that
>>> moves past it's "eye." Cats and other animals are not harmed, but hate
>>> being sprayed.
>>>
>> If it's connected to clean mains water, yes.
>> Would it be possible to hook the inlet up to (say) a bottle of
>> citrus-cinnamon water, which is a common mix for "discouraging" the
>> attentions of male mammals on (pet) female mammals in heat?
>
> It has to be under pressure, like a watering hose.
>
You could probably jury-rig it in combination with a standard hose-end
sprayed (usually used for applying chemicals in orchards), so that it
supplied the citrus-cinnamon (or any other deterrent) in diluted form.
Whether a diluted form would be any use at all, though, I have no idea.
--
derek

[Reel Mckoi]

"Aidan Karley" . group>
wrote in message
s.group...
> In article >, Reel Mckoi wrote:
>> It's a harmless water sprayer. It shoots a stream of water at anything
>> that
>> moves past it's "eye." Cats and other animals are not harmed, but hate
>> being sprayed.
>====
> If it's connected to clean mains water, yes.
> Would it be possible to hook the inlet up to (say) a bottle of
> citrus-cinnamon water, which is a common mix for "discouraging" the
> attentions
> of male mammals on (pet) female mammals in heat?
============
No, because it needs the mains water-pressure to squirt the water at the
animal.

McKoi.... frugal ponding since 1995...
My Pond Page http://tinyurl.com/cuq5b
~~~ }<((((o> ~~~ }<{{{{o> ~~~ }<(((((o>

[Reel Mckoi]

"rpl" > wrote in message
...
> Reel Mckoi wrote:
>>
>> ## I can see both sides of this issue. The pond owners feel the cat
>> owners are inconsiderate and uncaring
>
> some of us are. I'm not inconsiderate so much as... well... the thing
> about cats is they're mostly reasonable pets right out of the box, so to
> speak.

## Reasonable pets? Sorry, I don't understand what that means.

>> ## How is some compromise made between the two sides?

> You might think this is just me protecting my pets from insult but I
> really think you'd have more problems with 'coons.

## There is no doubt 'coons can be a problem but we're discussing people who
have SEEN the cats catch or harass or claw their fish.

I mean face it, even
> though all of them are disturbingly competent mousers (one of them has a
> catch and release policy which I think is cute except she releases them in
> the house), I feed my pets, they aren't hungry, don't swim, hate to get
> wet, and domestic cats aren't fishers.

## I don't think anyone is blaming cats unless they SAW the cats in the
act, and some cats do fish from the banks of small ponds.

> And as I said, out of the four "little darlins" I have, only one might be
> tempted to do more than watch the pretty fish. She could reach 7" into
> the water and *might* be able to land a small goldfish (let me know and
> I'll buy you a new one); I doubt she'd try hooking a koi... batting it
> maybe (no clawing) if it poked up out of the water.

## But you can't speak for all cats - and that goldfish may have cost it's
owner over $100.00. Not everyone keeps 10¢ goldfish from the dime store.
Even then people get attached to their fish.

>> As for myself. I feel since the cat is trespassing on *my property* I
>> have the right to trap it (not harm it) and remove it to the nearest
>> animal shelter - if it's causing me a problem!

> That's your call of course, but courtesy would say that you inform the pet
> owner. There aren't any stocked ponds in my neighbourhood (so few fish
> learn to skate well) but there are a few gardens; haven't heard any
> complaints yet, though.

## I would always try taking to the pets owner first. It's just common
courtesy. I have found though that most pet owners who allow their
dogs/cats to run loose continue to do so. These are the inconsiderate
ones....... and the ones whose pets end up at Animal Control.

you could always escalate and buy a dog... or a cat*fish*.
>
> Other (cat deterrent) options as I see them and as I've noted before are
> to either spray lemon concentrate around the pond (no clue if that
> actually works),
build a (barely) underwater ledge jutting in a few
> inches from the rim, put water vegetation near the edge, or try one of the
> motion sensor things.

## Why should the pond owner have to endure the expense so an inconsiderate
neighbor's cat (or water loving dog) can have free run of the neighborhood?
There are few places that don't have some form of leash-law, or animal
control law in effect.

> Most of those won't work against hungry wild predators.

## Not everyone has other predators to contend with.
--
McKoi.... frugal ponding since 1995...
EVERYONE: "Please check people's headers for forgeries
before flushing." NAMES ARE BEING FORGED.
My Pond Page http://tinyurl.com/cuq5b
~~~ }<((((o> ~~~ }<{{{{o> ~~~ }<(((((o>

[rpl]

Reel Mckoi wrote:
>
> "rpl" > wrote in message
> ...
>> Reel Mckoi wrote:

>> some of us are. I'm not inconsiderate so much as... well... the thing
>> about cats is they're mostly reasonable pets right out of the box, so
>> to speak.
>
> ## Reasonable pets? Sorry, I don't understand what that means.

very little/no training required, expense/time invested in further
training doesn't reap much, relatively speaking.

>>> ## How is some compromise made between the two sides?
>
>> You might think this is just me protecting my pets from insult but I
>> really think you'd have more problems with 'coons.
>
> ## There is no doubt 'coons can be a problem but we're discussing people
> who have SEEN the cats catch or harass or claw their fish.

well no, *you're* discussing a person (singular not plural) who has
"caught" a cat "in the act"; whether the fish was dangling from a claw
or the cat was just staring into the pond hasn't been mentioned.

Since they aren't my cats I only have general advice.

>> I doubt she'd try hooking a koi...
>> batting it maybe (no clawing) if it poked up out of the water.
>
> ## But you can't speak for all cats -

yes, I sortof mentioned that; weren't you listening ?

> and that goldfish may have cost
> it's owner over $100.00.

YGBFK, a *fish* ?

(mind you there are people who buy $500 cats, too... my opinion of them
is the same)

> Not everyone keeps 10¢ goldfish from the dime
> store. Even then people get attached to their fish.

Then why are you holding it in an enclosure too small to let it
run(/swim) away from predators ? What kind of sick, perverted *******
are you?

You just want an ornament, get a solar-powered robot fish.

> I have found though that most pet owners who allow their
> dogs/cats to run loose continue to do so. These are the inconsiderate
> ones.......

That would probably be me. Guess I'm lucky nobody has open fish cages
in the area.

> you could always escalate and buy a dog... or a cat*fish*.
>>
>> Other (cat deterrent) options as I see them and as I've noted before
>> are to either spray lemon concentrate around the pond (no clue if that
>> actually works),
>> build a (barely) underwater ledge jutting in a few
>> inches from the rim, put water vegetation near the edge, or try one of
>> the motion sensor things.
>
> ## Why should the pond owner have to endure the expense so an
> inconsiderate neighbor's cat (or water loving dog) can have free run of
> the neighborhood?

<shrug> I already offered to pay for the imaginary dead fish and might
even help "cat/predator proof" a pond.

And an FYI if a cat considers your backyard part of it's territory, it
will defend it against other animals.

> There are few places that don't have some form of
> leash-law, or animal control law in effect.

I'm sorry, is that pertinent in any way or do you just like to whine.

>> Most of those won't work against hungry wild predators.
>
> ## Not everyone has other predators to contend with.

Well, good then the suggestions I and other people have mentioned might
be the only thing "everyone" needs then.

Ta.

[Aidan Karley]

In article >, San Diego Joe wrote:
> > If it's connected to clean mains water, yes.
> > Would it be possible to hook the inlet up to (say) a bottle of
> > citrus-cinnamon water, which is a common mix for "discouraging" the attentions
> > of male mammals on (pet) female mammals in heat?
>
> It has to be under pressure, like a watering hose.
>
I would assume that this would be a trivial problem to regular pond-life
(is that an appropriate nickname in this group?). I haven't devoted more than a
minute's thought to the problem, and I'm already at the "have I got one of those
in my toolbox, or would I have to go to the hardware store?" level of design.

--
Aidan Karley,
Aberdeen, Scotland,
Location: +57d10' , -02d09' (sub-tropical Aberdeen), 0.021233
Written at Wed, 19 Oct 2005 10:23 +0100

[Cracklin']

"rpl" > wrote in message
...
> Reel Mckoi wrote:
>>
>> "rpl" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>> Reel Mckoi wrote:
>
>>> some of us are. I'm not inconsiderate so much as... well... the thing
>>> about cats is they're mostly reasonable pets right out of the box, so to
>>> speak.
>>
>> ## Reasonable pets? Sorry, I don't understand what that means.
>
> very little/no training required, expense/time invested in further
> training doesn't reap much, relatively speaking.

## This is true. I understand now.

>>>> ## How is some compromise made between the two sides?
>>
>>> You might think this is just me protecting my pets from insult but I
>>> really think you'd have more problems with 'coons.
>>
>> ## There is no doubt 'coons can be a problem but we're discussing people
>> who have SEEN the cats catch or harass or claw their fish.

> well no, *you're* discussing a person (singular not plural) who has
> "caught" a cat "in the act"; whether the fish was dangling from a claw or
> the cat was just staring into the pond hasn't been mentioned.

## Whoops, *I* was referring more or less to all those who have mentioned
cat problems here over the years - not just one case. The problem with
cats comes up here occasionally.

> Since they aren't my cats I only have general advice.
>
>>> I doubt she'd try hooking a koi... batting it maybe (no clawing) if it
>>> poked up out of the water.
>>
>> ## But you can't speak for all cats -
>
> yes, I *sortof* mentioned that; weren't you listening ?

## Sort of....... :-)))

>> and that goldfish may have cost it's owner over $100.00.
>
> YGBFK, a *fish* ?

## Some cost several hundred dollars and MORE!

> (mind you there are people who buy $500 cats, too... my opinion of them is
> the same)

## I agree. All my cats were strays or came from the local shelter. It was
$35 and they neutered them for that donation.

>> Not everyone keeps 10¢ goldfish from the dime store. Even then people get
>> attached to their fish.

> Then why are you holding it in an enclosure too small to let it run(/swim)
> away from predators ? What kind of sick, perverted ******* are you?

## The same sort of sick perverted ******* who gets a cat, then lets it run
loose to get shot, run over, attacked by dogs or sadistic children or
drowned in someone's pond.

> You just want an ornament, get a solar-powered robot fish.

## If you just want an ornament cat you can get one of those stuffed ones
at Wally-World. You wont even need a litter pan to clean. :-)

>> I have found though that most pet owners who allow their dogs/cats to run
>> loose continue to do so. These are the inconsiderate ones.......

> That would probably be me. Guess I'm lucky nobody has open fish cages in
> the area.

## I don't have open fish cages but do have an open Have-A-Heart trap.

>> you could always escalate and buy a dog... or a cat*fish*.
>>>
>>> Other (cat deterrent) options as I see them and as I've noted before are
>>> to either spray lemon concentrate around the pond (no clue if that
>>> actually works),
>>> build a (barely) underwater ledge jutting in a few
>>> inches from the rim, put water vegetation near the edge, or try one of
>>> the motion sensor things.
>>
>> ## Why should the pond owner have to endure the expense so an
>> inconsiderate neighbor's cat (or water loving dog) can have free run of
>> the neighborhood?

> <shrug> I already offered to pay for the imaginary dead fish and might
> even help "cat/predator proof" a pond.

## No everyone offers to pay for the damages their animals do so must be
taken to court - that usually works.

> And an FYI if a cat considers your backyard part of it's territory, it
> will defend it against other animals.
>
>> There are few places that don't have some form of leash-law, or animal
>> control law in effect.
>
> I'm sorry, is that pertinent in any way or do you just like to whine.

## The law is a whine? That makes no sense.......... Are speed limits
also a whine?

>>> Most of those won't work against hungry wild predators.

>> ## Not everyone has other predators to contend with.

> Well, good then the suggestions I and other people have mentioned might be
> the only thing "everyone" needs then.

## If the cat owner wants to PAY for the things you suggested, I'm sure the
pond owner would be willing to try them.
--
McKoi.... frugal ponding since 1995...
My Pond Page http://tinyurl.com/cuq5b
~~~ }<((((o> ~~~ }<{{{{o> ~~~ }<(((((o>

[carola]

"Cecil" > schrieb im Newsbeitrag
oups.com...
: The fish are in a backyard pond.
: LOL!! No access door there.
:
: Cecil


There are nice and inexpensive fences available ...

We had a grill in our pond about 15 cm under the surface of the water.
It worked very well, no young ones could get caught, but the big fish had to
stay underneath.
You can't see it from a distance.

carola

[rpl]

I've never had anybody with a fish pond in my immediate neighbourhood,
but now that I think of it, if you *don't" have 'coons or skunks
visiting your yard I should be charging you part of my catfood bills.

My "gang" managed to oust the skunks from a couple doors down without
incident (surprisingly), but the 'coons under the shed in the property
behind us put me back a couple hundred in vet bills for 'cat repair'
(and one of the boyz dislocated a hip), before they went elsewhere
(usually cats aren't big enough to kill raccoons).


rpl

[rpl]

Elroy Willis wrote:

> How about one of those motion-activated barking dog statues?

I set one up just to see what the cats would do... then I forgot about
it... so at 2 am when I'm wandering into the bathroom....

[~^Johnny^~]

On Mon, 17 Oct 2005 10:36:40 -0500, "MaryL"
-OUT-THE-LITTER> wrote:

>
>"Cecil" > wrote in message
oups.com...
>> The fish are in a backyard pond.
>> LOL!! No access door there.
>>
>> Cecil
>>
>
>My brother and sister-in-law have an outdoor fish pool, and there are also
>neighborhood cats that like the area. They solved your problem by raising
>the rock boundaries (interplanted with some interesting plants to avoid a
>"sterile" look) so the cats can no longer reach into the pool.
>
>Incidentally, are you sure that all of the damage is done by cats? My
>brother says they lose most of theirs to a great blue heron that fishes
>there, and once in a while they will pot a kingfisher.

IF you have garter snakes in your area, you will lose a lot of small
fish from your pond!

And the only two places I know of, that DON'T have garter snakes, are:
Ireland and Alaska!




--
-john
wide-open at throttle dot info

[Clurrie]

Cecil wrote:
> We love cats and own a cat.....an INDOOR cat. Our neighbors (two
> different neighbors) own more than one cat and they stay outdoors
> all night and most of the day (the cats, not the neighbors). Problem
> is, one cat loves to fish. She's the only cat I've caught in the act,
> so I'm blaming her for all the torture that has befallen on our koi and
> goldfish.
>
> If anyone has any ideas as to how to keep these sweeties away
> from our precious fish, please advise. We have tried speaking
> to the neighbors. What a laugh!
>
> Cecil
>
One thing that works, I find, for any animal is electric fencers like
those sold for farmers. They put out about 5000 VDC pulses (about the
same as a car spark plug receives) through wire impregnated
polypropylene string mounted via plastic insulators on 2x2 inch posts.
I bought mine for about $100 Canadian from a farm supply outfit. It
runs on 115 VAC current but they are available solar powered if no AC
current is available. Mine will electrify about 10 miles of wire, so
you can circle the pond many times... Put the wire cat intercepting
height and I can almost guarantee that your fish will be safe. Won't
harm the cat but will make it jump about 6 feet high when it touches the
wire (ever accidently touch a leaky spark plug wire)?

Don't forget to unplug the unit before working close to the wire or
you'll jump too! Also, it's better to keep the grass clipped (I use the
power trimmer) so as not to short the pulse to ground...

It definetly works for cats, racoons, mink, anything that isn't an
electric eel!

Good luck!


Clurrie
"Fish are like any other pet, except they're a bit more slimy."