Tank Doing Great...Snails totally out of control

[Larry Blanchard]

Jeff wrote:

> One thing I didnt listen to was about the snails. I let the
> one I saw hang around and now I have at least dozens of them. In
> order to get them all it looks like I would have to start all over
> and after 5 weeks of getting it right I dont want to do that. I was
> going to put in 2 Clown Loaches but was told by Pet Smart I couldnt
> do that because they are semi aggressive and would kill all the fish
> in my Community Tank.

Yet another example of a pet store employee who desn't know what he (or
she) is talking about.

I have 4 clown loaches in with corys, otos, platys, and a betta.
Everybody is getting along fine.

Well, one platy and the betta do chase each other - they take turns.
But it seems to be a game with them.

[Larry Blanchard]

In article <qUOaf.106750$ir4.49023@edtnps90>, says...
> I have 2 clown loaches in my comunity tank. I will slightly agree that
> they are slightly agressive. When I feed the tank frozen blood worms
> the loaches will muscule there way around to get the food.
>
Hey, my platys even do that - are there any fish that don't?

--
It's turtles, all the way down.

[Jeff]

Thanks to a lot of people on this group my tank is doing great. Havent lost
a fish since I started following EVERY recomendation from the group. Water
is crystal clear and all levels are darn near perfect. One thing I didnt
listen to was about the snails. I let the one I saw hang around and now I
have at least dozens of them. In order to get them all it looks like I would
have to start all over and after 5 weeks of getting it right I dont want to
do that. I was going to put in 2 Clown Loaches but was told by Pet Smart I
couldnt do that because they are semi aggressive and would kill all the fish
in my Community Tank. The snails are on the glass, in the rocks, on the
plants (Live and artificial), they are everywhere. The fish look to be real
happy and content and healthy (If fish can be happy) and I really dont want
to go through 5 more weeks of cycling and setup and in all probability kill
all the fish. Any suggestions?

[Rocco Moretti]

Jeff wrote:
> The snails are on the glass, in the rocks, on the
> plants (Live and artificial), they are everywhere. The fish look to be real
> happy and content and healthy (If fish can be happy) and I really dont want
> to go through 5 more weeks of cycling and setup and in all probability kill
> all the fish. Any suggestions?

Short of being an intermediate host for pathogens (unlikely in a
fishtank) snails won't probably harm fish. They may (depending on
species) harm plants, and they may (depending on you) harm asthetics.

If you have a "snail bloom" the most likely cause is overfeeding -
snails have to eat, and more food means that there can be more snails.
Be fastidous about feeding only the recommended amount, and coordinate
with spouses/roomates/children so that you aren't double dosing the food
accidentally. If you remove the food source, the snails should stabilize
to a managable population level.

In the mean time, try physically removing as many snails as possible.
(Leaving a piece of green vegatable in the tank overnight will draw
snails to it - remove it and the snails in the morning.)

[asdf]

i've also had experience with a younger guy. seems like they hire
idiots on purpose, when trying to catch the fish he just threw heavy
rocks around and waved the net around, a very very poor attempt to
catch anything. he basically turned the tank into a whirlpool instead
of using half his brain to catch the 3 of 4 puffers in the tank. he
also kept them out of the water after catching them, so not only does
he not know how to catch fish but i would bet he knows nothing about
their care either. good store, bad people.

On Sat, 05 Nov 2005 03:10:45 GMT, "Jeff" >
wrote:

> Petsmarts
>Fish section. Lesson learned.

[NetMax]

"Jeff" > wrote in message
...
> Thanks to a lot of people on this group my tank is doing great. Havent
> lost
> a fish since I started following EVERY recomendation from the group. Water
> is crystal clear and all levels are darn near perfect. One thing I didnt
> listen to was about the snails. I let the one I saw hang around and now I
> have at least dozens of them. In order to get them all it looks like I
> would
> have to start all over and after 5 weeks of getting it right I dont want
> to
> do that. I was going to put in 2 Clown Loaches but was told by Pet Smart I
> couldnt do that because they are semi aggressive and would kill all the
> fish
> in my Community Tank. The snails are on the glass, in the rocks, on the
> plants (Live and artificial), they are everywhere. The fish look to be
> real
> happy and content and healthy (If fish can be happy) and I really dont
> want
> to go through 5 more weeks of cycling and setup and in all probability
> kill
> all the fish. Any suggestions?


Jeff, many of the well-intentioned clerks giving advice in pet shops do not
even own now, or ever, an aquarium. Try to keep that in mind.

I don't know the size of your aquarium, but you can count on your Clowns
getting to 5" or 6" long, and they like to be in shoals (ie: 3 or 4 fish).
They would probably not cause any particular problems with your fish, but
they are quite susceptible to external parasites such as Ich, so ideally you
would quarantine them for several weeks before mixing them with your fish.
Alternately, make sure the store has had them for several weeks and they are
all looking healthy (no white spots, good colours and their stomach is
straight or extended slightly outwards). Nothing is better than your own
quarantine though, especially with scaleless fish such as Botia.
--
www.NetMax.tk

[Justice]

Jeff wrote:
> Thanks to a lot of people on this group my tank is doing great. Havent lost
> a fish since I started following EVERY recomendation from the group. Water
> is crystal clear and all levels are darn near perfect. One thing I didnt
> listen to was about the snails. I let the one I saw hang around and now I
> have at least dozens of them. In order to get them all it looks like I would
> have to start all over and after 5 weeks of getting it right I dont want to
> do that. I was going to put in 2 Clown Loaches but was told by Pet Smart I
> couldnt do that because they are semi aggressive and would kill all the fish
> in my Community Tank. The snails are on the glass, in the rocks, on the
> plants (Live and artificial), they are everywhere. The fish look to be real
> happy and content and healthy (If fish can be happy) and I really dont want
> to go through 5 more weeks of cycling and setup and in all probability kill
> all the fish. Any suggestions?
>
>
I have 2 clown loaches in my comunity tank. I will slightly agree that
they are slightly agressive. When I feed the tank frozen blood worms
the loaches will muscule there way around to get the food. They mainly
just bump the other fish no bitting. thats the most agresive that i've
seen them. Oh yah sometimes they do the whose the alpha today fight but
even then they don't leave any marks on each other.

[Daniel Morrow]

Bottom posted.


"Jeff" > wrote in message
...
> Thanks to a lot of people on this group my tank is doing great. Havent
lost
> a fish since I started following EVERY recomendation from the group. Water
> is crystal clear and all levels are darn near perfect. One thing I didnt
> listen to was about the snails. I let the one I saw hang around and now I
> have at least dozens of them. In order to get them all it looks like I
would
> have to start all over and after 5 weeks of getting it right I dont want
to
> do that. I was going to put in 2 Clown Loaches but was told by Pet Smart I
> couldnt do that because they are semi aggressive and would kill all the
fish
> in my Community Tank. The snails are on the glass, in the rocks, on the
> plants (Live and artificial), they are everywhere. The fish look to be
real
> happy and content and healthy (If fish can be happy) and I really dont
want
> to go through 5 more weeks of cycling and setup and in all probability
kill
> all the fish. Any suggestions?
>
>

You can either tolerate/live with the snails or get some clown loaches,
which if you arrange it right with the right pet store/lfs, can be a
temporary thing. You should almost always be able to return fish you bought
previously. Listen to what others have said here too (especially netmax the
macgyver-like knowledge <big grin to you netmax>), you should be able to
return the clown loaches after they have finished their job, I am not
totally sure if the clown loaches will eat every single snail/snail's eggs
but I hope they would so the clown's could be especially helpful, especially
with snails. Other than that you might try the veggy on a small plate in the
tank overnight but I doubt it would be totally successful at removing snails
as there are always eggs somewhere at this point. I used to take in many
bags into my lfs for donation, of fancy guppies which are descendants of
some chain store's fancy guppies, and they took them all, admittedly though
I had to change from a chain store to a lfs because the chain store soon
changed their policy to only taking pets that have been officially shipped
to the chain store from an authorized shipment, so that chain store no
longer will take any fish in from hobbyists. Good luck and later!

P.s. I never needed to even wait to bring the fish in I just called the lfs
an hour or two before bringing them in and they took them.

[Justice]

Larry Blanchard wrote:
> In article <qUOaf.106750$ir4.49023@edtnps90>, says...
>
>>I have 2 clown loaches in my comunity tank. I will slightly agree that
>>they are slightly agressive. When I feed the tank frozen blood worms
>>the loaches will muscule there way around to get the food.
>>
>
> Hey, my platys even do that - are there any fish that don't?
>
My glowlights don't they all swim nicely no fighting, At leat not yet
anyway.

[NetMax]

"Daniel Morrow" > wrote in message
...
> Bottom posted.
>
>
> "Jeff" > wrote in message
> ...
>> Thanks to a lot of people on this group my tank is doing great. Havent
> lost
>> a fish since I started following EVERY recomendation from the group.
>> Water
>> is crystal clear and all levels are darn near perfect. One thing I
>> didnt
>> listen to was about the snails. I let the one I saw hang around and
>> now I
>> have at least dozens of them. In order to get them all it looks like I
> would
>> have to start all over and after 5 weeks of getting it right I dont
>> want
> to
>> do that. I was going to put in 2 Clown Loaches but was told by Pet
>> Smart I
>> couldnt do that because they are semi aggressive and would kill all
>> the
> fish
>> in my Community Tank. The snails are on the glass, in the rocks, on
>> the
>> plants (Live and artificial), they are everywhere. The fish look to be
> real
>> happy and content and healthy (If fish can be happy) and I really dont
> want
>> to go through 5 more weeks of cycling and setup and in all probability
> kill
>> all the fish. Any suggestions?
>>
>>
>
> You can either tolerate/live with the snails or get some clown loaches,
> which if you arrange it right with the right pet store/lfs, can be a
> temporary thing. You should almost always be able to return fish you
> bought
> previously. Listen to what others have said here too (especially netmax
> the
> macgyver-like knowledge <big grin to you netmax>), you should be able
> to
> return the clown loaches after they have finished their job, I am not
> totally sure if the clown loaches will eat every single snail/snail's
> eggs
> but I hope they would so the clown's could be especially helpful,
> especially
> with snails. Other than that you might try the veggy on a small plate
> in the
> tank overnight but I doubt it would be totally successful at removing
> snails
> as there are always eggs somewhere at this point. I used to take in
> many
> bags into my lfs for donation, of fancy guppies which are descendants
> of
> some chain store's fancy guppies, and they took them all, admittedly
> though
> I had to change from a chain store to a lfs because the chain store
> soon
> changed their policy to only taking pets that have been officially
> shipped
> to the chain store from an authorized shipment, so that chain store no
> longer will take any fish in from hobbyists. Good luck and later!
>
> P.s. I never needed to even wait to bring the fish in I just called the
> lfs
> an hour or two before bringing them in and they took them.


I recommended Clown loaches to a customer with a snail problem, but he
was sceptical of pet shop advice (very wise), so he only bought one Clown
loach to see if it ate any snails at all. He was back the next day with
a very fat dead Clown in a ziplock bag. Apparently the fish had eaten
itself to death, but in the process it had eaten every snail in his tank.
While we were both saddened by the fish dying, the customer was quite
pleased his snail problem was completely and so quickly solved, and I
imagine the loach had a smile on its face at some point in that meal.

Typically, loaches take 2 or 3 weeks to completely eradicate a tank of
snails, and sometimes they even have to be shown that there is something
yummy inside the shell, and some snails just cannot be completely
destroyed (Malaysian trumpets sometimes), so ymmv.
--
www.NetMax.tk ... like MacGyver, jack of all trades, master of none ;~)

[Jeff]

"NetMax" > wrote in message
...
>
> Jeff, many of the well-intentioned clerks giving advice in pet shops do
not
> even own now, or ever, an aquarium. Try to keep that in mind.
>

Good example was tonight, we have two Petsmarts in our town and I went to
the one I normally dont go to. The girl asked me what I wanted and I said
"Two Neon Tetras, one female black molly, one male orange molly, two clown
loaches". She got the two Tetras out and went for the Black Molly. When she
got it out she asked me if it were male or female. She said she didnt know
how to tell the difference. And instead of getting out one species, bagging
them and getting the next, she started putting them all in the same bag. I
told her to go ahead and put the fish back, I didnt want them. There was
also a dead Orange Molly floating around in the Molly tank. (People here
told me not to buy fish from a tank with dead fish floating around in it).
The lady didnt know anything about fish AT ALL and was working Petsmarts
Fish section. Lesson learned.

[Elaine T]

Jeff wrote:
> "NetMax" > wrote in message
> ...
>
>>Jeff, many of the well-intentioned clerks giving advice in pet shops do
>
> not
>
>>even own now, or ever, an aquarium. Try to keep that in mind.
>>
>
>
> Good example was tonight, we have two Petsmarts in our town and I went to
> the one I normally dont go to. The girl asked me what I wanted and I said
> "Two Neon Tetras, one female black molly, one male orange molly, two clown
> loaches". She got the two Tetras out and went for the Black Molly. When she
> got it out she asked me if it were male or female. She said she didnt know
> how to tell the difference. And instead of getting out one species, bagging
> them and getting the next, she started putting them all in the same bag. I
> told her to go ahead and put the fish back, I didnt want them. There was
> also a dead Orange Molly floating around in the Molly tank. (People here
> told me not to buy fish from a tank with dead fish floating around in it).
> The lady didnt know anything about fish AT ALL and was working Petsmarts
> Fish section. Lesson learned.
>
>
One PetSmart near where I work has a surprisingly good fish section.
The manager understands how to run a commercial fish system and there
are a few competent aqarists working there. The rest are dog and cat
people, but they can net a fish if you point at the one you want.

I wouldn't go there for advice, but I don't mind going there for fish
and cheap supplies. YMMV - I guess I'm just saying don't rule out all
PetSmart stores (PSMV?).

--
Elaine T __
http://eethomp.com/fish.html <'__><
rec.aquaria.* FAQ http://faq.thekrib.com

[Alpha]

The same is true of PetCo. Although the selection is minimal, I have had
excellent livestock from one *particular* store.

[Dr Engelbert Buxbaum]

Jeff wrote:

> I was going to put in 2 Clown Loaches but was told by Pet Smart I
> couldnt do that because they are semi aggressive and would kill all the fish
> in my Community Tank. The snails are on the glass, in the rocks, on the
> plants (Live and artificial), they are everywhere.

Snails in the tank are actually a good thing, as they turn over the sand
and eat left-overs. However, if there are too many left-overs (i.e., if
you are overfeeding) they multyply and can get unsightly. Feeding less
is often the only measure required, but it takes a while until numbers
get down. If you don't want to wait, you can collect the snails by hand
and remove them. If crushed, they are readily eaten by many fishes.

Loaches are very social animals and should be kept in groups of at least
6 (although I have seen them showing typical behaviour also in a group
of 4). Clown loaches, which can grow up to abeut 30 cm (1 ft) thus
require a tank of 200 l (50 gal) or more. However, there are _Botia_
species which stay much smaller, eat snails and show behaviour similar
to clown loaches (_B. macracanthus_): _B. lohachatu_, _B. kubotai_ and
_B. striata_ all stay smaller than 12 cm (5"), so decent group sizes can
be achieved even in relatively small tanks. Especially _B. striata_
seems to have quite a few friends in this newsgroup.

I have never seen loaches kill other fish, although they may (like most
other fishes except the pure vegans) feed on cadavers.