Stocking for a 10g - does this sound OK?

[Liz]

All,

I have a 10g that's finishing cycling, so I'm planning for the future
while I wait and would appreciate advice from your experience.

For background, I started wrong (on the advice of a fish store person)
with 3 rasboras and a product that's supposed to jump start your cycle
(ha ha). Anywho, the rasboras are still with me and I've been
controlling things with water changes and recently learned about
Bio-Spira and am trying that out now. (Note: this is the same tank
with the three neons mentioned in my QT question - added them when I
thought the cycle was done - in reality it hadn't really started...).

Tanks specs: 10g; two HOB filters - one rated at 80gph, one at 100gph;
3" disc-shaped airstone in one corner (I like bubbles and the fishies
seem to like them too); all fake decorations. It's been running since
02 Oct 2005, the rasboras have been in since 05 Oct 2005 and the neons
since 10 October 2005. Temp is kept at ~76F. pH is 7.4 and totally
stable.

http://www.lizmcguireonline.com/tank.jpg

I know not to add _anything_ until the ammonia and nitrite hit 0 on
their own (rather than via water changes or such). But when that
finally happens, I'm thinking of doing the following and would like
your opinion of the plan:

1. Add 3 more neons (to keep the others company). After this I'll
continue to monitor ammonia and nitrite to watch for a mini-cycle
(anyone know how long to watch for this?).

2. Once they're adjusted and the mini-cycle (if any) is over, add 3
more rasboras (again, to keep the others company). Repeat the
mini-cycle watch.

3. Add some algae eaters. I'd like some otos (as they're so cute), but
have been advised that they could be a bit too sensitive and the tank a
bit to small for a proper group and should perhaps consider cory cats
instead. I haven't made a final decision on this.

I know this is definitely pushing some limits, but I'm thinking with
the extra air / filtration and regular water changes** it might be OK.
Your advice is appreciated though as I don't want to make any more
mistakes at the expense of poor helpless fishies...

**I got myself a Magnum 350 canister filter with all the add-ons and
use it to take old water out and put clean water in, and I gotta say,
water changes are _fast_ and _easy_ now - it also works beautifully for
gravel washing as I can spend as long as I want (the filtered output
just goes back in the tank - then after the gravel wash, I do a water
change). (What can I say, I like fast and easy more than money <g>)

Thanks,

Liz

[Carol-Ann]

"Liz" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> All,
>
> I have a 10g that's finishing cycling, so I'm planning for the future
> while I wait and would appreciate advice from your experience.
>
> Tanks specs: 10g; two HOB filters - one rated at 80gph, one at 100gph;
> 3" disc-shaped airstone in one corner (I like bubbles and the fishies
> seem to like them too); all fake decorations. It's been running since
> 02 Oct 2005, the rasboras have been in since 05 Oct 2005 and the neons
> since 10 October 2005. Temp is kept at ~76F. pH is 7.4 and totally
> stable.

## The 100gph alone should do the job on a 10 gallon tank.

> http://www.lizmcguireonline.com/tank.jpg
>
> I know not to add _anything_ until the ammonia and nitrite hit 0 on
> their own (rather than via water changes or such). But when that
> finally happens, I'm thinking of doing the following and would like
> your opinion of the plan:
>
> 1. Add 3 more neons (to keep the others company). After this I'll
> continue to monitor ammonia and nitrite to watch for a mini-cycle
> (anyone know how long to watch for this?).

## It sounds like the tank will be FULL at that point. :-)

> 2. Once they're adjusted and the mini-cycle (if any) is over, add 3
> more rasboras (again, to keep the others company). Repeat the
> mini-cycle watch.

## You don't want to overcrowd them. 10 gallons isn't a very large amount
of water.

> 3. Add some algae eaters. I'd like some otos (as they're so cute), but
> have been advised that they could be a bit too sensitive and the tank a
> bit to small for a proper group and should perhaps consider cory cats
> instead. I haven't made a final decision on this.
>
> I know this is definitely pushing some limits, but I'm thinking with
> the extra air / filtration and regular water changes** it might be OK.
> Your advice is appreciated though as I don't want to make any more
> mistakes at the expense of poor helpless fishies...

## There are other stresses caused by overcrowding that have little to do
with water quality. It's better to purchase a bigger tank, or a second tank
than overcrowd one you already have.

> **I got myself a Magnum 350 canister filter with all the add-ons and
> use it to take old water out and put clean water in, and I gotta say,
> water changes are _fast_ and _easy_ now - it also works beautifully for
> gravel washing as I can spend as long as I want (the filtered output
> just goes back in the tank - then after the gravel wash, I do a water
> change). (What can I say, I like fast and easy more than money <g>)

## It reminds me of my Vortex Diatom filter....... :-)
--
..... frugal ponding since 1995...
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://bellsouthpwp.net/s/h/shastadaisy
~~~ }<((((o> ~~~ }<{{{{o> ~~~ }<(((((o>

[NetMax]

"Liz" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> All,
>
> I have a 10g that's finishing cycling, so I'm planning for the future
> while I wait and would appreciate advice from your experience.
>
> For background, I started wrong (on the advice of a fish store person)
> with 3 rasboras and a product that's supposed to jump start your cycle
> (ha ha). Anywho, the rasboras are still with me and I've been
> controlling things with water changes and recently learned about
> Bio-Spira and am trying that out now. (Note: this is the same tank
> with the three neons mentioned in my QT question - added them when I
> thought the cycle was done - in reality it hadn't really started...).
>
> Tanks specs: 10g; two HOB filters - one rated at 80gph, one at 100gph;
> 3" disc-shaped airstone in one corner (I like bubbles and the fishies
> seem to like them too); all fake decorations. It's been running since
> 02 Oct 2005, the rasboras have been in since 05 Oct 2005 and the neons
> since 10 October 2005. Temp is kept at ~76F. pH is 7.4 and totally
> stable.
>
> http://www.lizmcguireonline.com/tank.jpg
>
> I know not to add _anything_ until the ammonia and nitrite hit 0 on
> their own (rather than via water changes or such). But when that
> finally happens, I'm thinking of doing the following and would like
> your opinion of the plan:
>
> 1. Add 3 more neons (to keep the others company). After this I'll
> continue to monitor ammonia and nitrite to watch for a mini-cycle
> (anyone know how long to watch for this?).

If your tank has cycled to the load of 6 fish and you are adding 3 more,
then I don't think you will see much, if any of a mini-cycle. In theory,
at your pH and temperature, the nitrifying bacteria would take 18 hours
to establish itself (one reproductive cycle can, in theory, double their
numbers, and you are increasing by 50%. I would check NH3 and NO2 on the
3rd, 4th and 5th day (smaller tanks=sooner, larger tanks=later).

> 2. Once they're adjusted and the mini-cycle (if any) is over, add 3
> more rasboras (again, to keep the others company). Repeat the
> mini-cycle watch.

Assuming operating filters which are not messed with, adding 3 to a group
of 9 should not be detectable (imo), however some random testing (every
2nd day for a week?) might alleviate your worries.

> 3. Add some algae eaters. I'd like some otos (as they're so cute), but
> have been advised that they could be a bit too sensitive and the tank a
> bit to small for a proper group and should perhaps consider cory cats
> instead. I haven't made a final decision on this.

If no significant algae, then get corys, which are more carnivorous
(eating fish food). You really are helped by having natural algae when
acclimating and keeping Otos.

> I know this is definitely pushing some limits, but I'm thinking with
> the extra air / filtration and regular water changes** it might be OK.
> Your advice is appreciated though as I don't want to make any more
> mistakes at the expense of poor helpless fishies...

Your bioload is (imo) fine. The inches per gallon was just a guideline.
The mass, energy level and consumption rates are all as important as
well, and Neons & Rasboras are at the low end on all those
characteristics. I think I have a page on my site about fish loading
which seemed mildly informative when I wrote it :o).

> **I got myself a Magnum 350 canister filter with all the add-ons and
> use it to take old water out and put clean water in, and I gotta say,
> water changes are _fast_ and _easy_ now - it also works beautifully for
> gravel washing as I can spend as long as I want (the filtered output
> just goes back in the tank - then after the gravel wash, I do a water
> change). (What can I say, I like fast and easy more than money <g>)

Always been my philosophy too. Minimize maintainance by spending the
time on the set-up, and money on the equipment. Maybe not to the extreme
of "Spend too much, and you'll regret it once, spend too little and
you'll regret it forever.", but spend enough to find the right balance.
--
www.NetMax.tk

> Thanks,
>
> Liz

[Liz]

Thank you NetMax!

I appreciate your advice - esp. about the cycling as new fish are added
- I've been worried about that due to the mistakes I've made up front -
the good news is, the Bio-Spira appears to be working - the next few
days should tell me if it's real or my imagination :-)

I'll check out your stocking article - I'm sure it will be informative
for me.

Thanks,

Liz