Low light reef options.

[Mark Cooper]

What types of corals, mushrooms etc. can be kept with normal fluorescent
lighting?


Thanks,
Mark

[gbnw28178]

I would of thought your really going to have to get rid of the fluorescent
lighting to be totally honest with you. It's simply just not good enough
really

--
http://www.garybolton.co.uk


"Mark Cooper" > wrote in message
.. .
> What types of corals, mushrooms etc. can be kept with normal fluorescent
> lighting?
>
>
> Thanks,
> Mark

[Wayne Sallee]

It's easyer to provide the light, than it is to feed
corals that don't need light, but sun corals
(tubastria)will do well if you are willing to feed them
every other day.

Wayne Sallee
Wayne's Pets



Mark Cooper wrote on 11/24/2005 5:13 PM:
> What types of corals, mushrooms etc. can be kept with normal fluorescent
> lighting?
>
>
> Thanks,
> Mark

[RJAG]

sorry mate but I must disagree. I had a tank full of coralline algae and the
odd coral and lit only by florescent tubes. I made the switch to metal
halide and lost the lot. I persevered but only could manage a tank full of
green algae.
I dumped the 14,000 K MH and went back to Fluorescents and then tank has
finally got some regrowth.
I tried every sort of light schedule I could think of but without success
until I ditched the MH.
if you maintain your tubes correctly there should be no reason why you cant
keep a good variety of soft corals.

R

[Wayne Sallee]

When he said that the flourecents were not good enouph,
I'm sure he was refering to a single NO flourecent light.

As for your situation, you had nutrients building up in
your tank. With the lighting you had, the system was in
ballance. When you increased the lighting, the algae
started to grow. You just needed a more nutrient poor
environment. Also there is almost always an increase in
algae growth after a large increase in lighting, because
of this ballance change, but regular maintenance to reduce
nutrients will reduce that algae. When environmnetal
conditions change, everything sifts, and then ballances
out again.

Wayne Sallee
Wayne's Pets



RJAG wrote on 11/25/2005 10:38 AM:
> sorry mate but I must disagree. I had a tank full of coralline algae and the
> odd coral and lit only by florescent tubes. I made the switch to metal
> halide and lost the lot. I persevered but only could manage a tank full of
> green algae.
> I dumped the 14,000 K MH and went back to Fluorescents and then tank has
> finally got some regrowth.
> I tried every sort of light schedule I could think of but without success
> until I ditched the MH.
> if you maintain your tubes correctly there should be no reason why you cant
> keep a good variety of soft corals.
>
> R
>
>

[Billy]

"gbnw28178" > wrote in message
. ..
>I would of thought your really going to have to get rid of the
>fluorescent lighting to be totally honest with you. It's simply just
>not good enough really


Disagree. Plain florescent is just fine for fish-only or even fish
only with Live Rock. You won't get the same results from the LR that
you would with a pair of 300w rotating halide pendants, but you'll be
fine, and I have the fish tanks to prove it. <g>

billy

[Ray Martini]

Most mushrooms will do ok with plain lighting. Sun Polyps don't care for
light either. Not sure about softies but I have several softies in my system
with PC lighting which was reasonbly priced and works well. Stay away from
LPS corals with plain lighting.


"Mark Cooper" > wrote in message
.. .
> What types of corals, mushrooms etc. can be kept with normal fluorescent
> lighting?
>
>
> Thanks,
> Mark

[[email protected]]

On Fri, 25 Nov 2005 19:12:09 -0800, "Billy"
> wrote:

>
>"gbnw28178" > wrote in message
. ..
>>I would of thought your really going to have to get rid of the
>>fluorescent lighting to be totally honest with you. It's simply just
>>not good enough really
>
>
>Disagree. Plain florescent is just fine for fish-only or even fish
>only with Live Rock. You won't get the same results from the LR that
>you would with a pair of 300w rotating halide pendants, but you'll be
>fine, and I have the fish tanks to prove it. <g>
>
>billy
>
Billy, What is a "rotating" halide pendant ?

Curious, Fishnut.

[Ann R]

Just an observation. Doesn't the depth of the tank, and the the wattage of
the fixture have something to do with what can and can't be grown in a tank?
Take a 50 watt bulb and put it over a 30" tall tank and the tank will be
dark. Put that same 50 watts over a 12" tall tank and you have a bright
tank.
--
Ann R
"Ray Martini" > wrote in message
. ..
> Most mushrooms will do ok with plain lighting. Sun Polyps don't care for
> light either. Not sure about softies but I have several softies in my
> system with PC lighting which was reasonbly priced and works well. Stay
> away from LPS corals with plain lighting.
>
>
> "Mark Cooper" > wrote in message
> .. .
>> What types of corals, mushrooms etc. can be kept with normal fluorescent
>> lighting?
>>
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Mark
>
>

[exotec]

We have a 15-gal and a 120-gal, both lighted with PC daylight and
actinic bulbs. We have a fairly good variety of mushrooms, tree
corals, lots of Xenia, Zoos, some polyps, and a few other sorts I
don't even know what they are. No acros or anything. Despite
subsequent recommendations to the contrary, all our critters love our
moderate lighting and water movement. But then, we've got your basic
"damsel tank", too, and they all get along just fine (even with the
firefish) (who NEVER hide, I may add!), so our experience may be out
of the ordinary. We never knew any better until it was "too late", and
equipment and livestock was already installed, so maybe ignorance
turned out to be bliss after all for us. Our tank is very happy,
nevertheless.

On 24 Nov 2005 22:13:07 GMT, Mark Cooper > wrote:

>What types of corals, mushrooms etc. can be kept with normal fluorescent
>lighting?
>
>
>Thanks,
>Mark

=^..^=
.... the problem with people these days is that
they've forgotten we're really just animals.

[[email protected]]

Yes, what works for one, does not necessarily work for someonelse.
Your tanks sound great. Best wishes.

Regards, Fishnut.

On Sun, 27 Nov 2005 03:37:34 GMT, exotec >
wrote:

>We have a 15-gal and a 120-gal, both lighted with PC daylight and
>actinic bulbs. We have a fairly good variety of mushrooms, tree
>corals, lots of Xenia, Zoos, some polyps, and a few other sorts I
>don't even know what they are. No acros or anything. Despite
>subsequent recommendations to the contrary, all our critters love our
>moderate lighting and water movement. But then, we've got your basic
>"damsel tank", too, and they all get along just fine (even with the
>firefish) (who NEVER hide, I may add!), so our experience may be out
>of the ordinary. We never knew any better until it was "too late", and
>equipment and livestock was already installed, so maybe ignorance
>turned out to be bliss after all for us. Our tank is very happy,
>nevertheless.
>
>On 24 Nov 2005 22:13:07 GMT, Mark Cooper > wrote:
>
>>What types of corals, mushrooms etc. can be kept with normal fluorescent
>>lighting?
>>
>>
>>Thanks,
>>Mark
>
>=^..^=
>... the problem with people these days is that
>they've forgotten we're really just animals.

[[email protected]]

On Sat, 26 Nov 2005 22:56:41 GMT, "Ann R" > wrote:

>Just an observation. Doesn't the depth of the tank, and the the wattage of
>the fixture have something to do with what can and can't be grown in a tank?
>Take a 50 watt bulb and put it over a 30" tall tank and the tank will be
>dark. Put that same 50 watts over a 12" tall tank and you have a bright
>tank.

Ann,

Yes the depth matters tremendously. After 2' (60 cms) deep, the light
penetration reduces dramatically. Scientifically, I think it works on
the inverse square principle, in that the light at double the distance
is only a quarter of the light intensity, not half as you may expect,
and so on. If you read expensive aquarium books, where optimum light
is accurately measured at different depths (the Modern Coral Reef
Aquarium etc.), light penetration drops off significantly after about
5 metres.

Regards, Fishnut.

[Bob Hoffman]

Just to set the record straight here, you can keep ANY type of coral
using normal (NO)fluorescent lighting provided you have enough of them
and you place the corals in the correct part of the water column. I
have a 90 gal reef that is lighted with 6-40 watt bulbs (1- 50/50,
2-20k, 3-actinic). The key is the IceCap ballast. The NO bulb produce
approximately the same intensity as VHO with these ballasts. However
the electrical consumption is about 50% greater per bulb (i.e., 60 watts
consumed for each NO bulb).

I have a variety of corals including various SPC (small polyped corals)
such as Porites and numerous Acroporas. However, those high light
requiring species need to be located in the upper third of the water
column to get sufficient light. They may not grow quite as fast as
under metal halides but they do just fine. In fact, some of my Porites
actually are much lighter in color on surface of the coral piece versus
the sides, which suggests they are actually getting more light than they
can handle.

So much for the theory that NO bulbs will not work in a diverse coral
reef aquarium.

If you want to respond to me directly, remove the nospam from the address.

Bob

Mark Cooper wrote:
> What types of corals, mushrooms etc. can be kept with normal fluorescent
> lighting?
>
>
> Thanks,
> Mark

[[email protected]]

On Sun, 27 Nov 2005 03:37:34 GMT, exotec >
wrote:

>We have a 15-gal and a 120-gal, both lighted with PC daylight and
>actinic bulbs. We have a fairly good variety of mushrooms, tree
>corals, lots of Xenia, Zoos, some polyps, and a few other sorts I
>don't even know what they are. No acros or anything. Despite
>subsequent recommendations to the contrary, all our critters love our
>moderate lighting and water movement. But then, we've got your basic
>"damsel tank", too, and they all get along just fine (even with the
>firefish) (who NEVER hide, I may add!), so our experience may be out
>of the ordinary. We never knew any better until it was "too late", and
>equipment and livestock was already installed, so maybe ignorance
>turned out to be bliss after all for us. Our tank is very happy,
>nevertheless.
>
Exotec,
Just for the record, will you detail the damsels ? I.e. do you have
single fish of several species, or several fish of 1 species. and did
you introduce them all at the same time, or over a period ? Are they
in the large tank or small one ?

Regards, Fishnut.

[Cindy]

<much snipped>
>
> So much for the theory that NO bulbs will not work in a diverse coral
> reef aquarium.
>

What do NO and PC stand for in regard to lighting?
Thanks,
Cindy

[exotec]

On Mon, 28 Nov 2005 19:04:26 GMT, wrote:

>Just for the record, will you detail the damsels ? I.e. do you have
>single fish of several species, or several fish of 1 species. and did
>you introduce them all at the same time, or over a period ? Are they
>in the large tank or small one ?
>
We got most of our damsels all at the same time, and mostly out of the
same display tank at the LFS. I tried to get everybody the same size,
the smallest ones I could find. They may have come from 2 stores, but
they were all added very close to the same time and at the same size.

We got them in pairs:
blue-bodied-with yellow tail;
all-over yellow;
blue with a black dot on the tail (but this one killed his "mate");
pale blue with a yellow face
pale yellow with a pink face
and the last pair were bright yellow with horizontal black stripes
when we bought them, but have turned dusky/muddy grey with yellow fins
and tail now.
This last set have become the biggest fish in the tank, and they're
sort of obnoxious. I'd like to ditch them, if I could catch them.
They're just bullies, they're not really hurting anybody (yet).

We've also got a pair of clarkii clowns, if you want to include them
as "damsels".
I'm sort of wondering about them - the larger fish is dark-bodied and
looks heavier. The smaller one is brighter golden with very little
black or brown, and seems to be lighter-bodied. I wonder if they're
from different parts of the world, or if this is normal, or what? They
weren't at all sure they were the same species of fish when I first
put them together. But they snuggle down together in the anemone now,
so I guess the point is moot after all. I'm just curious.

Other than the dusky ones, everybody seems copacetic with each other.
:)
~v~

=^..^=
.... the problem with people these days is that
they've forgotten we're really just animals.

[miskairal]

I assumed it was Normal Output and Power Compact but I may be wrong.

Cindy wrote:
> <much snipped>
>
>>So much for the theory that NO bulbs will not work in a diverse coral
>>reef aquarium.
>>
>
>
> What do NO and PC stand for in regard to lighting?
> Thanks,
> Cindy
>
>

[[email protected]]

On Tue, 29 Nov 2005 16:24:08 +1000, miskairal <mehiding@Oz> wrote:

>I assumed it was Normal Output and Power Compact but I may be wrong.
>
No, you are correct !

>Cindy wrote:
>> <much snipped>
>>
>>>So much for the theory that NO bulbs will not work in a diverse coral
>>>reef aquarium.
>>>
>>
>>
>> What do NO and PC stand for in regard to lighting?
>> Thanks,
>> Cindy
>>
>>

[[email protected]]

On Tue, 29 Nov 2005 06:00:43 GMT, exotec >
wrote:

>On Mon, 28 Nov 2005 19:04:26 GMT, wrote:
>
>>Just for the record, will you detail the damsels ? I.e. do you have
>>single fish of several species, or several fish of 1 species. and did
>>you introduce them all at the same time, or over a period ? Are they
>>in the large tank or small one ?
>>
>We got most of our damsels all at the same time, and mostly out of the
>same display tank at the LFS. I tried to get everybody the same size,
>the smallest ones I could find. They may have come from 2 stores, but
>they were all added very close to the same time and at the same size.
>
>We got them in pairs:
>blue-bodied-with yellow tail;
>all-over yellow;
>blue with a black dot on the tail (but this one killed his "mate");
>pale blue with a yellow face
>pale yellow with a pink face
>and the last pair were bright yellow with horizontal black stripes
>when we bought them, but have turned dusky/muddy grey with yellow fins
>and tail now.
>This last set have become the biggest fish in the tank, and they're
>sort of obnoxious. I'd like to ditch them, if I could catch them.
>They're just bullies, they're not really hurting anybody (yet).
>
>We've also got a pair of clarkii clowns, if you want to include them
>as "damsels".
>I'm sort of wondering about them - the larger fish is dark-bodied and
>looks heavier. The smaller one is brighter golden with very little
>black or brown, and seems to be lighter-bodied. I wonder if they're
>from different parts of the world, or if this is normal, or what? They
>weren't at all sure they were the same species of fish when I first
>put them together. But they snuggle down together in the anemone now,
>so I guess the point is moot after all. I'm just curious.
>
They will now be a pair. The larger one will be the female, and
obviously the smaller one will be the male. Clownfishes and chromis,
although they are damsels, do not normally show the aggression of the
remaining damsels. The exception is the female maroon clownfish
(Premnas biaculeatus), which takes delight in biting the aquarist's
hand, where it hurts most e.g. between the fingers. It regularly draws
blood, I understand. Beautiful fish, but I have always given them a
wide berth.

>Other than the dusky ones, everybody seems copacetic with each other.
>:)
>~v~
>
>=^..^=
>... the problem with people these days is that
>they've forgotten we're really just animals.

That is quite a mix of species. Judging by the colours you describe,
most are still juveniles. Please report again when the fishes are
bigger, and sexually mature.

Regards, Fishnut.

[Cindy]

miskairal wrote:
> I assumed it was Normal Output and Power Compact but I may be wrong.

Thank you!

[unclenorm]

Hi Bob,
I'm afraid your first paragraph is very hard to believe, you
are claiming to keep all types of coral under NO fluorescent tubes at
less than 3 watts per gallon!! impossible!, you may sustain a few of
the low light varitys but thats all. your claims for NO tubes run of
Ice Cap ballasts is also a lot of nonsence!
regards,
unclenorm.


Bob Hoffman wrote:
> Just to set the record straight here, you can keep ANY type of coral
> using normal (NO)fluorescent lighting provided you have enough of them
> and you place the corals in the correct part of the water column. I
> have a 90 gal reef that is lighted with 6-40 watt bulbs (1- 50/50,
> 2-20k, 3-actinic). The key is the IceCap ballast. The NO bulb produce
> approximately the same intensity as VHO with these ballasts. However
> the electrical consumption is about 50% greater per bulb (i.e., 60 watts
> consumed for each NO bulb).
>
> I have a variety of corals including various SPC (small polyped corals)
> such as Porites and numerous Acroporas. However, those high light
> requiring species need to be located in the upper third of the water
> column to get sufficient light. They may not grow quite as fast as
> under metal halides but they do just fine. In fact, some of my Porites
> actually are much lighter in color on surface of the coral piece versus
> the sides, which suggests they are actually getting more light than they
> can handle.
>
> So much for the theory that NO bulbs will not work in a diverse coral
> reef aquarium.
>
> If you want to respond to me directly, remove the nospam from the address.
>
> Bob
>
> Mark Cooper wrote:
> > What types of corals, mushrooms etc. can be kept with normal fluorescent
> > lighting?
> >
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Mark

[Wayne Sallee]

NO lights can be overdriven (more light, and more watts)
with ice cap balasts.

Wayne Sallee
Wayne's Pets



unclenorm wrote on 12/1/2005 12:41 AM:
> Hi Bob,
> I'm afraid your first paragraph is very hard to believe, you
> are claiming to keep all types of coral under NO fluorescent tubes at
> less than 3 watts per gallon!! impossible!, you may sustain a few of
> the low light varitys but thats all. your claims for NO tubes run of
> Ice Cap ballasts is also a lot of nonsence!
> regards,
> unclenorm.
>
>
> Bob Hoffman wrote:
>
>>Just to set the record straight here, you can keep ANY type of coral
>>using normal (NO)fluorescent lighting provided you have enough of them
>>and you place the corals in the correct part of the water column. I
>>have a 90 gal reef that is lighted with 6-40 watt bulbs (1- 50/50,
>>2-20k, 3-actinic). The key is the IceCap ballast. The NO bulb produce
>>approximately the same intensity as VHO with these ballasts. However
>>the electrical consumption is about 50% greater per bulb (i.e., 60 watts
>>consumed for each NO bulb).
>>
>>I have a variety of corals including various SPC (small polyped corals)
>>such as Porites and numerous Acroporas. However, those high light
>>requiring species need to be located in the upper third of the water
>>column to get sufficient light. They may not grow quite as fast as
>>under metal halides but they do just fine. In fact, some of my Porites
>>actually are much lighter in color on surface of the coral piece versus
>>the sides, which suggests they are actually getting more light than they
>>can handle.
>>
>>So much for the theory that NO bulbs will not work in a diverse coral
>>reef aquarium.
>>
>>If you want to respond to me directly, remove the nospam from the address.
>>
>>Bob
>>
>>Mark Cooper wrote:
>>
>>>What types of corals, mushrooms etc. can be kept with normal fluorescent
>>>lighting?
>>>
>>>
>>>Thanks,
>>>Mark
>
>