Where's my salt going?

[Samwyse]

OK, everything's been running steady for a couple of days now, but I
just looked at the hydrometer, and it says that my water is borderline
fresh (1.0200). Two days ago, it was in the lower half of the green
zone. Obviously, I'm not losing water, and I don't see huge reefs of
salt forming anywhere, so what's going on? And what's the best way to
add salt? Just pour a quarter-cup or so into the sump and let it get
stirred up there?

In other news, the water in the sump is crystal clear. It's harder to
judge the tank, because there's a lot of green algae growing on the
glass. Tomorrow, I'll have to run buy a scraper (because my wife won't
let me use the freshwater tank's). But I've noticed that the rocks that
I'm assuming are alive all seem to only have green fur that looks an
awful lot like the strings of algae on the glass and overflow box. Any
ideas?

Thanks!

[Cindy]

Samwyse wrote:
> OK, everything's been running steady for a couple of days now, but I
> just looked at the hydrometer, and it says that my water is borderline
> fresh (1.0200). Two days ago, it was in the lower half of the green
> zone. Obviously, I'm not losing water, and I don't see huge reefs of
> salt forming anywhere, so what's going on?

Temperature change?

>And what's the best way to
> add salt? Just pour a quarter-cup or so into the sump and let it get
> stirred up there?

NO!!!

Mix, heat and aerate the salt in a bucket/garbage can a few hours before you
add it to the tank. That way you can make sure the specific gravity and
temperature are correct.

>
> In other news, the water in the sump is crystal clear. It's harder to
> judge the tank, because there's a lot of green algae growing on the
> glass. Tomorrow, I'll have to run buy a scraper (because my wife
> won't let me use the freshwater tank's). But I've noticed that the
> rocks that I'm assuming are alive all seem to only have green fur
> that looks an awful lot like the strings of algae on the glass and
> overflow box. Any ideas?
>
> Thanks!

[GrimReaper]

"Samwyse" > wrote in message
. net...
> OK, everything's been running steady for a couple of days now, but I
> just looked at the hydrometer, and it says that my water is borderline
> fresh (1.0200). Two days ago, it was in the lower half of the green
> zone. Obviously, I'm not losing water, and I don't see huge reefs of
> salt forming anywhere, so what's going on? And what's the best way to
> add salt? Just pour a quarter-cup or so into the sump and let it get
> stirred up there?
>
> In other news, the water in the sump is crystal clear. It's harder to
> judge the tank, because there's a lot of green algae growing on the
> glass. Tomorrow, I'll have to run buy a scraper (because my wife won't
> let me use the freshwater tank's). But I've noticed that the rocks that
> I'm assuming are alive all seem to only have green fur that looks an
> awful lot like the strings of algae on the glass and overflow box. Any
> ideas?
>
> Thanks!

What SG do you want? 1.020 is approximately 28 parts per thousand (ppt)
salt. If you want an SG of say 1.025 ( 34 ppt) you will need to add 34 - 28
= 6 ppt salt. To work out how much salt to add multiply the water volume in
your tank + sump + skimmer + canister filters etc. by 6. This will equal
that amount of salt in grams to add. In shrimp larval systems I have added
salt straight into the skimmer with no ill effect on the very delicate
larvae but this may not work for you, it depends what is in your tank. Just
adding ready mixed salt water will take a long time to raise the salinity if
you have a large tank. Your salt may not be going anywhere. How long has
this tank been running? What is in it?

Grimreaper

[George Patterson]

Samwyse wrote:
> OK, everything's been running steady for a couple of days now, but I
> just looked at the hydrometer, and it says that my water is borderline
> fresh (1.0200). Two days ago, it was in the lower half of the green
> zone. Obviously, I'm not losing water, and I don't see huge reefs of
> salt forming anywhere, so what's going on?

Hydrometers are typically calibrated for a temperature of 60 degrees F. Raise
the temperature ten degrees, and the specific gravity will fall about 0.001. I
would add salt in my skimmer a bit at a time to bring the salinity up over a
period of 24 hours or so. Low salinity is less dangerous than high -- high
salinity actually dehydrates fish. I tend to shoot for 1.021 at 78 degrees in my
tank.

George Patterson
Coffee is only a way of stealing time that should by rights belong to
your slightly older self.

[Wayne Sallee]

But many aquarium hydrometers are calibrated around 75
degress. You can check the manufacture to see, often it
will tell on the packaging or even on the hydrometer.

Wayne Sallee
Wayne's Pets



George Patterson wrote on 12/17/2005 10:57 AM:
> Samwyse wrote:
>
>> OK, everything's been running steady for a couple of days now, but I
>> just looked at the hydrometer, and it says that my water is borderline
>> fresh (1.0200). Two days ago, it was in the lower half of the green
>> zone. Obviously, I'm not losing water, and I don't see huge reefs of
>> salt forming anywhere, so what's going on?
>
>
> Hydrometers are typically calibrated for a temperature of 60 degrees F.
> Raise the temperature ten degrees, and the specific gravity will fall
> about 0.001. I would add salt in my skimmer a bit at a time to bring the
> salinity up over a period of 24 hours or so. Low salinity is less
> dangerous than high -- high salinity actually dehydrates fish. I tend to
> shoot for 1.021 at 78 degrees in my tank.
>
> George Patterson
> Coffee is only a way of stealing time that should by rights belong to
> your slightly older self.

[George Patterson]

Wayne Sallee wrote:
> But many aquarium hydrometers are calibrated around 75 degress.

Regardless, a temperature increase in the tank will result in a lower reading,
and I would assume that's the cause of his decrease. Book ideal specific gravity
is 1.023 at 80 degrees. As I said, I prefer a bit lower in my tank. If you kept
a tank at 70 degrees, book ideal would be 1.024. The frequently mentioned ideal
of 1.025 assumes a temperature of 60 degrees.

George Patterson
Coffee is only a way of stealing time that should by rights belong to
your slightly older self.

[Wayne Sallee]

Yea it's true that the temperature will make a difference.

The swing arm hydrometers are temperature correcting, or
at least that's the idea :-) I put one in the fridge one
time to see what it would do. The needle droped all the
way to the bottom.

Wayne Sallee
Wayne's Pets



George Patterson wrote on 12/17/2005 12:05 PM:
> Wayne Sallee wrote:
>
>> But many aquarium hydrometers are calibrated around 75 degress.
>
>
> Regardless, a temperature increase in the tank will result in a lower
> reading, and I would assume that's the cause of his decrease. Book ideal
> specific gravity is 1.023 at 80 degrees. As I said, I prefer a bit lower
> in my tank. If you kept a tank at 70 degrees, book ideal would be 1.024.
> The frequently mentioned ideal of 1.025 assumes a temperature of 60
> degrees.
>
> George Patterson
> Coffee is only a way of stealing time that should by rights belong to
> your slightly older self.

[Cindy]

Wayne Sallee wrote:
> Yea it's true that the temperature will make a difference.
>
> The swing arm hydrometers are temperature correcting, or
> at least that's the idea :-) I put one in the fridge one
> time to see what it would do. The needle droped all the
> way to the bottom.
>
> Wayne Sallee

That's the kind I have.

[Cindy]

> Hydrometers are typically calibrated for a temperature of 60 degrees
> F. Raise the temperature ten degrees, and the specific gravity will
> fall about 0.001. I would add salt in my skimmer a bit at a time to
> bring the salinity up over a period of 24 hours or so. Low salinity
> is less dangerous than high -- high salinity actually dehydrates
> fish. I tend to shoot for 1.021 at 78 degrees in my tank.
>
> George Patterson
> Coffee is only a way of stealing time that should by rights
> belong to your slightly older self.

I don't have a skimmer for my bitty little tank. When I do a water change,
I make up the water ahead of time. I dump most of it in when I'm ready,
leave the tank for awhile for the old and new water to mix, then if the SG
isn't right I either add fresh water or add more salt to my water change
water.

[Jaime R-S]

The salt is there. You have to possible causes...
1. S% (in this case % means ppt, no easy simbol for it) was never evenly
distributed around the tank and what you are seeing is just a compensation
for fresh water spots, in my case was a lower S% inside the crushed shells,
I added freshwater to the landscape and then added salt after
dechlorination. Not a wise way to go but I found it interesting to watch
the compensation time.
2. Temperature variable, the hydrometer readings is in SG not in S%,
therefore, check a Temp. vs SG matrix to determine your S%.
"Samwyse" > wrote in message
. net...
> OK, everything's been running steady for a couple of days now, but I just
> looked at the hydrometer, and it says that my water is borderline fresh
> (1.0200). Two days ago, it was in the lower half of the green zone.
> Obviously, I'm not losing water, and I don't see huge reefs of salt
> forming anywhere, so what's going on? And what's the best way to add
> salt? Just pour a quarter-cup or so into the sump and let it get stirred
> up there?
>
> In other news, the water in the sump is crystal clear. It's harder to
> judge the tank, because there's a lot of green algae growing on the glass.
> Tomorrow, I'll have to run buy a scraper (because my wife won't let me use
> the freshwater tank's). But I've noticed that the rocks that I'm assuming
> are alive all seem to only have green fur that looks an awful lot like the
> strings of algae on the glass and overflow box. Any ideas?
>
> Thanks!

[Wayne Sallee]

Wach for bubles on the swing arm. It will cause it to read
wrong. I prefer to stick them in the water upside down,
and then turn them upright under water, and then bring
them up out of the aquarium. This prevents water from
gushing in, and creating bubbles that stick to the swing arm.

Wayne Sallee
Wayne's Pets



Cindy wrote on 12/17/2005 12:52 PM:
> Wayne Sallee wrote:
>
>>Yea it's true that the temperature will make a difference.
>>
>>The swing arm hydrometers are temperature correcting, or
>>at least that's the idea :-) I put one in the fridge one
>>time to see what it would do. The needle droped all the
>>way to the bottom.
>>
>>Wayne Sallee
>
>
> That's the kind I have.
>
>

[Samwyse]

GrimReaper wrote:
> What SG do you want? 1.020 is approximately 28 parts per thousand (ppt)
> salt. If you want an SG of say 1.025 ( 34 ppt) you will need to add 34 - 28
> = 6 ppt salt. To work out how much salt to add multiply the water volume in
> your tank + sump + skimmer + canister filters etc. by 6. This will equal
> that amount of salt in grams to add. In shrimp larval systems I have added
> salt straight into the skimmer with no ill effect on the very delicate
> larvae but this may not work for you, it depends what is in your tank. Just
> adding ready mixed salt water will take a long time to raise the salinity if
> you have a large tank. Your salt may not be going anywhere. How long has
> this tank been running? What is in it?

You haven't been following my other posts, have you? :-) The tank's
been running six days and contains nothing but seven chunks of "live"
rock (although I'm increasingly certain that at least three didn't
survive transport) and a mantis shrimp (yes, I know, but I like having
*something* other than algae that I'm sure is alive).

My hydrometer is of the floating thermometer type. I don't know where
it came from, but it looks a lot like this baby:
http://www.petco.com/Shop/Product.aspx?sku=732923

After filling the tank with freshly made sal****er, the SG was 1.025 and
the temp was 64 deg. Now the SG is 1.020 and the temp is 73. My
instructions were to try to keep things in the middle of the green
zones, which seems sensible. Unfortunately, that web page doesn't give
me a calibration temp, but I'd assume it would be the middle of the
green zone. So, as the water warms, the SG readings must be getting
more accurate, and my salt levels are probably borderline too-low.

Let's see, I originally filled the tank using 14 gallons of distilled
water from the grocery, then I got the RO running and added another 10
two-gallon buckets to the main tank, and either three or four buckets to
the sump and skimmer. 14 + 2*13 = 40 gallons, and that times 6 ppt
gives me 240 grams of salt, and Google's calculator says that's 0.5291
lbs. My big bag o' salt says 1/2 cup is 0.29 lbs, which works out to be
about 0.9 cups.

Thanks!

[Don Geddis]

Wayne Sallee > wrote on Sat, 17 Dec 2005:
> Wach for bubles on the swing arm. It will cause it to read
> wrong. I prefer to stick them in the water upside down,
> and then turn them upright under water, and then bring
> them up out of the aquarium. This prevents water from
> gushing in, and creating bubbles that stick to the swing arm.

You're talking about something like one of these, right?
http://www.marinedepot.com/aquarium_thermometers_refractometers_hydrometers_c oralife_deep_six_hydrometer.asp?CartId=

Amusingly, your approach totally defeats the design of these things. They're
generally built to take water from 6" below the surface, because the salinity
there is more consistent than the surface water. But if you turn them upside
down, you're likely to get primarily surface water!

-- Don
__________________________________________________ _____________________________
Don Geddis http://reef.geddis.org/

[Cindy]

Wayne Sallee wrote:
> Wach for bubles on the swing arm. It will cause it to read
> wrong. I prefer to stick them in the water upside down,
> and then turn them upright under water, and then bring
> them up out of the aquarium. This prevents water from
> gushing in, and creating bubbles that stick to the swing arm.

I just fill and dump them a couple times, then the bubbles don't stick so
much. Just gotta check it.

[George Patterson]

Samwyse wrote:

> Unfortunately, that web page doesn't give
> me a calibration temp, but I'd assume it would be the middle of the
> green zone.

The calibration temps are unimportant for your purposes; all that means is that
your particular hydrometer will be most accurate at its calibration temperature.
What's important is the combination of temperature and specific gravity. The
correct specific gravity is 1.023 when the temperature is 80 degrees, 1.024 when
it's 70, and 1.025 when it's 60. This is true for any hydrometer.

Keeping the specific gravity a little low is perfectly OK for most fish. Keeping
it high is hazardous to your fish.

George Patterson
Coffee is only a way of stealing time that should by rights belong to
your slightly older self.

[Wayne Sallee]

LOL your so silly.

Wayne Sallee
Wayne's Pets



Don Geddis wrote on 12/17/2005 10:41 PM:
> Wayne Sallee > wrote on Sat, 17 Dec 2005:
>
>>Wach for bubles on the swing arm. It will cause it to read
>>wrong. I prefer to stick them in the water upside down,
>>and then turn them upright under water, and then bring
>>them up out of the aquarium. This prevents water from
>>gushing in, and creating bubbles that stick to the swing arm.
>
>
> You're talking about something like one of these, right?
> http://www.marinedepot.com/aquarium_thermometers_refractometers_hydrometers_c oralife_deep_six_hydrometer.asp?CartId=
>
> Amusingly, your approach totally defeats the design of these things. They're
> generally built to take water from 6" below the surface, because the salinity
> there is more consistent than the surface water. But if you turn them upside
> down, you're likely to get primarily surface water!
>
> -- Don
> __________________________________________________ _____________________________
> Don Geddis http://reef.geddis.org/

[Wayne Sallee]

Yep cold water is heavyer, so therefor the specific
gravity (weight of water) is higher, but many hydrometers
are hot very accurate, so dont' be suprised if your
dydromer does not give the same results.

Wayne Sallee
Wayne's Pets



George Patterson wrote on 12/18/2005 12:47 PM:
> Samwyse wrote:
>
>> Unfortunately, that web page doesn't give me a calibration temp, but
>> I'd assume it would be the middle of the green zone.
>
>
> The calibration temps are unimportant for your purposes; all that means
> is that your particular hydrometer will be most accurate at its
> calibration temperature. What's important is the combination of
> temperature and specific gravity. The correct specific gravity is 1.023
> when the temperature is 80 degrees, 1.024 when it's 70, and 1.025 when
> it's 60. This is true for any hydrometer.
>
> Keeping the specific gravity a little low is perfectly OK for most fish.
> Keeping it high is hazardous to your fish.
>
> George Patterson
> Coffee is only a way of stealing time that should by rights belong to
> your slightly older self.

[GrimReaper]

"Samwyse" > wrote in message
om...
> GrimReaper wrote:
> > What SG do you want? 1.020 is approximately 28 parts per thousand (ppt)
> > salt. If you want an SG of say 1.025 ( 34 ppt) you will need to add 34 -
28
> > = 6 ppt salt. To work out how much salt to add multiply the water volume
in
> > your tank + sump + skimmer + canister filters etc. by 6. This will
equal
> > that amount of salt in grams to add. In shrimp larval systems I have
added
> > salt straight into the skimmer with no ill effect on the very delicate
> > larvae but this may not work for you, it depends what is in your tank.
Just
> > adding ready mixed salt water will take a long time to raise the
salinity if
> > you have a large tank. Your salt may not be going anywhere. How long has
> > this tank been running? What is in it?
>
> You haven't been following my other posts, have you? :-) The tank's
> been running six days and contains nothing but seven chunks of "live"
> rock (although I'm increasingly certain that at least three didn't
> survive transport) and a mantis shrimp (yes, I know, but I like having
> *something* other than algae that I'm sure is alive).
>
> My hydrometer is of the floating thermometer type. I don't know where
> it came from, but it looks a lot like this baby:
> http://www.petco.com/Shop/Product.aspx?sku=732923
>
> After filling the tank with freshly made sal****er, the SG was 1.025 and
> the temp was 64 deg. Now the SG is 1.020 and the temp is 73. My
> instructions were to try to keep things in the middle of the green
> zones, which seems sensible. Unfortunately, that web page doesn't give
> me a calibration temp, but I'd assume it would be the middle of the
> green zone. So, as the water warms, the SG readings must be getting
> more accurate, and my salt levels are probably borderline too-low.
>
> Let's see, I originally filled the tank using 14 gallons of distilled
> water from the grocery, then I got the RO running and added another 10
> two-gallon buckets to the main tank, and either three or four buckets to
> the sump and skimmer. 14 + 2*13 = 40 gallons, and that times 6 ppt
> gives me 240 grams of salt, and Google's calculator says that's 0.5291
> lbs. My big bag o' salt says 1/2 cup is 0.29 lbs, which works out to be
> about 0.9 cups.
>
> Thanks!

Sorry I did not realise you had posted info about your tank. I have been
away for some time so I just looked at recent posts.
If it were me I would dissolve the 240 gms of salt in a container using the
existing tank water and gently pour it into the path of a powerhead. Leave
it a couple of days and check the SG again



Grimreaper

[JUNE SANDERSON]

Rowa phos in the filter will cure the green alga problem. Its to much
phosphate in the water that causes it.

June
"GrimReaper" > wrote in message
...
> "Samwyse" > wrote in message
> . net...
>> OK, everything's been running steady for a couple of days now, but I
>> just looked at the hydrometer, and it says that my water is borderline
>> fresh (1.0200). Two days ago, it was in the lower half of the green
>> zone. Obviously, I'm not losing water, and I don't see huge reefs of
>> salt forming anywhere, so what's going on? And what's the best way to
>> add salt? Just pour a quarter-cup or so into the sump and let it get
>> stirred up there?
>>
>> In other news, the water in the sump is crystal clear. It's harder to
>> judge the tank, because there's a lot of green algae growing on the
>> glass. Tomorrow, I'll have to run buy a scraper (because my wife won't
>> let me use the freshwater tank's). But I've noticed that the rocks that
>> I'm assuming are alive all seem to only have green fur that looks an
>> awful lot like the strings of algae on the glass and overflow box. Any
>> ideas?
>>
>> Thanks!
>
> What SG do you want? 1.020 is approximately 28 parts per thousand (ppt)
> salt. If you want an SG of say 1.025 ( 34 ppt) you will need to add 34 -
> 28
> = 6 ppt salt. To work out how much salt to add multiply the water volume
> in
> your tank + sump + skimmer + canister filters etc. by 6. This will equal
> that amount of salt in grams to add. In shrimp larval systems I have added
> salt straight into the skimmer with no ill effect on the very delicate
> larvae but this may not work for you, it depends what is in your tank.
> Just
> adding ready mixed salt water will take a long time to raise the salinity
> if
> you have a large tank. Your salt may not be going anywhere. How long has
> this tank been running? What is in it?
>
> Grimreaper
>