Sand as part of the substrate

[Gill Passman]

I was looking at the display tank at my LFS which is the same size as
the one I've got on order. They have set up the substrate in the
following way:-

A layer of sand and laterite (I think)
A 1 1/2 inch layer of very fine gravel
Then another inch of sand with some of the fine gravel intermingled

It is heavily planted. It looks great but I'm wondering about the
maintenance issues with using the sand having read some negatives and
wondered if anyone has any comments

TIA
Gill

[Marco Schwarz]

Hi..

> It is heavily planted. It looks great but I'm wondering
> about the maintenance issues with using the sand having
> read some negatives and wondered if anyone has any
> comments

I've sand, only. In every tank.
--
cu
Marco

[Steve]

Gill Passman wrote:
> I was looking at the display tank at my LFS which is the same size as
> the one I've got on order. They have set up the substrate in the
> following way:-
>
> A layer of sand and laterite (I think)
> A 1 1/2 inch layer of very fine gravel
> Then another inch of sand with some of the fine gravel intermingled
>
> It is heavily planted. It looks great but I'm wondering about the
> maintenance issues with using the sand having read some negatives and
> wondered if anyone has any comments
>
> TIA
> Gill
>

My experience has been that sand or sand mixtures are ok in a planted
aquarium.

I successfully used "pit run" sand and gravel mixture from a gravel pit
in my 90 gal planted community aquarium for many years. I mixed some
clayey garden soil into the bottom part of the substrate and pushed some
little compressed peat chunks and "pond tab" fertilizer pellets into
this substrate. Plants and fish did well for 3-4 years.

Problems began when I re-did this substrate using a lot of garden peat
moss in the bottom layer. The peat decomposed and badly clouded the
water within 6 months. Now I use Eco-Complete, but the problem was the
peat, not the sand-gravel mix.

In a giant aquarium like you're contmplating I'd consider using a
natural coarse sand/ fine gravel mixture to save costs. A local gravel
pit operator let me fill many buckets of the sand/ gravel mixture for
free. Contrast this to the Eco-Complete that cost > $200 Canadian for a
90 gal (48 inch long, 18 inch wide) aquarium.

One of my 15 gal goldfish aquariums has a "play sand" substrate, and the
Crypts and fish do ok.
Steve

[Larry Blanchard]

Gill Passman wrote:

> It is heavily planted. It looks great but I'm wondering about the
> maintenance issues with using the sand having read some negatives and
> wondered if anyone has any comments

I've got sand over EcoComplete in one tank. The plants like it fine and
so do the fish, but I've got one large female cory that delights in
plowing a groove through it so that the finer particles wind up on any
horizontal plant leaf. That's the only negative I know of.

--
It's turtles, all the way down

[Marco Schwarz]

> I've sand, only.
And water, fish and so on, too. *g*
--
cu
Marco

[Elaine T]

Gill Passman wrote:
> I was looking at the display tank at my LFS which is the same size as
> the one I've got on order. They have set up the substrate in the
> following way:-
>
> A layer of sand and laterite (I think)
> A 1 1/2 inch layer of very fine gravel
> Then another inch of sand with some of the fine gravel intermingled
>
> It is heavily planted. It looks great but I'm wondering about the
> maintenance issues with using the sand having read some negatives and
> wondered if anyone has any comments
>
> TIA
> Gill
>
Have a look at this stuff.
http://www.profileproducts.com/golf/ppc_sand/index.cfm
A lot of the people on the Aquatic Plants list use it and say it works
really well. I don't know whether it's available in the UK but perhaps
you could find something similar. It's relatively cheap since it's
designed to be used by the ton in golf courses.

--
Elaine T __
http://eethomp.com/fish.html <'__><
rec.aquaria.* FAQ http://faq.thekrib.com

[CanadianCray]

Yeah I have heard good things about that stuff aswell. Though most people
say it is really light & best to top it off with gravel or something to stop
it from getting kicked up.


"Elaine T" > wrote in message
m...
> Gill Passman wrote:
>> I was looking at the display tank at my LFS which is the same size as the
>> one I've got on order. They have set up the substrate in the following
>> way:-
>>
>> A layer of sand and laterite (I think)
>> A 1 1/2 inch layer of very fine gravel
>> Then another inch of sand with some of the fine gravel intermingled
>>
>> It is heavily planted. It looks great but I'm wondering about the
>> maintenance issues with using the sand having read some negatives and
>> wondered if anyone has any comments
>>
>> TIA
>> Gill
>>
> Have a look at this stuff.
> http://www.profileproducts.com/golf/ppc_sand/index.cfm
> A lot of the people on the Aquatic Plants list use it and say it works
> really well. I don't know whether it's available in the UK but perhaps
> you could find something similar. It's relatively cheap since it's
> designed to be used by the ton in golf courses.
>
> --
> Elaine T __
> http://eethomp.com/fish.html <'__><
> rec.aquaria.* FAQ http://faq.thekrib.com

[NetMax]

"Elaine T" > wrote in message
m...
> Gill Passman wrote:
>> I was looking at the display tank at my LFS which is the same size as
>> the one I've got on order. They have set up the substrate in the
>> following way:-
>>
>> A layer of sand and laterite (I think)
>> A 1 1/2 inch layer of very fine gravel
>> Then another inch of sand with some of the fine gravel intermingled
>>
>> It is heavily planted. It looks great but I'm wondering about the
>> maintenance issues with using the sand having read some negatives and
>> wondered if anyone has any comments
>>
>> TIA
>> Gill
>>
> Have a look at this stuff.
> http://www.profileproducts.com/golf/ppc_sand/index.cfm
> A lot of the people on the Aquatic Plants list use it and say it works
> really well. I don't know whether it's available in the UK but perhaps
> you could find something similar. It's relatively cheap since it's
> designed to be used by the ton in golf courses.
>
> --
> Elaine T __
> http://eethomp.com/fish.html <'__><
> rec.aquaria.* FAQ http://faq.thekrib.com

I mentioned Profile to a buddy, who presented me with a 50 lb bag. It
costs as much as aquarium gravel (about $1 / lb) at a commercial retail
level (golf course). It has a very nice diameter (medium sand grain) and
colour (reddish-brown). It absorbed quite a bit of water (increasing its
volume by 5 -10%). It's rather light in the water, but not excessively
(I suspect the biofilm will weigh it down nicely). It made the water
muddy but not quite as bad as Flourite (imo). The specs were as follows:
porosity 74%, 39% capillary, 35% non-capillary
pore size .1 to >50 micron
pH 6-6.5
chemical analysis
SiO2 74%
Al2O3 11%
Fe2O3 5%
and the following, each under 5%, CaO, MgO, K2), TiO2

I don't know what all the symbols mean ;~) but someone here might find
some importance in them.

Seems to have some interesting possibilities.
--
www.NetMax.tk

[Daniel Morrow]

Mid posted.
NetMax wrote:
> "Elaine T" > wrote in message
> m...
>> Gill Passman wrote:
>>> I was looking at the display tank at my LFS which is the same size
>>> as the one I've got on order. They have set up the substrate in the
>>> following way:-
>>>
>>> A layer of sand and laterite (I think)
>>> A 1 1/2 inch layer of very fine gravel
>>> Then another inch of sand with some of the fine gravel intermingled
>>>
>>> It is heavily planted. It looks great but I'm wondering about the
>>> maintenance issues with using the sand having read some negatives
>>> and wondered if anyone has any comments
>>>
>>> TIA
>>> Gill
>>>
>> Have a look at this stuff.
>> http://www.profileproducts.com/golf/ppc_sand/index.cfm
>> A lot of the people on the Aquatic Plants list use it and say it
>> works really well. I don't know whether it's available in the UK
>> but perhaps you could find something similar. It's relatively cheap
>> since it's designed to be used by the ton in golf courses.
>>
>> --
>> Elaine T __
>> http://eethomp.com/fish.html <'__><
>> rec.aquaria.* FAQ http://faq.thekrib.com
>
> I mentioned Profile to a buddy, who presented me with a 50 lb bag. It
> costs as much as aquarium gravel (about $1 / lb) at a commercial
> retail level (golf course). It has a very nice diameter (medium sand
> grain) and colour (reddish-brown). It absorbed quite a bit of water
> (increasing its volume by 5 -10%). It's rather light in the water,
> but not excessively (I suspect the biofilm will weigh it down
> nicely). It made the water muddy but not quite as bad as Flourite
> (imo). The specs were as follows: porosity 74%, 39% capillary, 35%
> non-capillary
> pore size .1 to >50 micron
> pH 6-6.5

Does this ph labeling mean this substrate "buffers" to 6-6.5 ph? Does it
mean that this substrate keeps the ph at 6-6.5? That would be good news to
discus owners I would think. Thanks and later!


> chemical analysis
> SiO2 74%
> Al2O3 11%
> Fe2O3 5%
> and the following, each under 5%, CaO, MgO, K2), TiO2
>
> I don't know what all the symbols mean ;~) but someone here might find
> some importance in them.
>
> Seems to have some interesting possibilities.

[Gill Passman]

NetMax wrote:
> "Elaine T" > wrote in message
> m...
>
>>Gill Passman wrote:
>>
>>>I was looking at the display tank at my LFS which is the same size as
>>>the one I've got on order. They have set up the substrate in the
>>>following way:-
>>>
>>>A layer of sand and laterite (I think)
>>>A 1 1/2 inch layer of very fine gravel
>>>Then another inch of sand with some of the fine gravel intermingled
>>>
>>>It is heavily planted. It looks great but I'm wondering about the
>>>maintenance issues with using the sand having read some negatives and
>>>wondered if anyone has any comments
>>>
>>>TIA
>>>Gill
>>>
>>
>>Have a look at this stuff.
>>http://www.profileproducts.com/golf/ppc_sand/index.cfm
>>A lot of the people on the Aquatic Plants list use it and say it works
>>really well. I don't know whether it's available in the UK but perhaps
>>you could find something similar. It's relatively cheap since it's
>>designed to be used by the ton in golf courses.
>>
>>--
>>Elaine T __
>>http://eethomp.com/fish.html <'__><
>>rec.aquaria.* FAQ http://faq.thekrib.com
>
>
> I mentioned Profile to a buddy, who presented me with a 50 lb bag. It
> costs as much as aquarium gravel (about $1 / lb) at a commercial retail
> level (golf course). It has a very nice diameter (medium sand grain) and
> colour (reddish-brown). It absorbed quite a bit of water (increasing its
> volume by 5 -10%). It's rather light in the water, but not excessively
> (I suspect the biofilm will weigh it down nicely). It made the water
> muddy but not quite as bad as Flourite (imo). The specs were as follows:
> porosity 74%, 39% capillary, 35% non-capillary
> pore size .1 to >50 micron
> pH 6-6.5
> chemical analysis
> SiO2 74%
> Al2O3 11%
> Fe2O3 5%
> and the following, each under 5%, CaO, MgO, K2), TiO2
>
> I don't know what all the symbols mean ;~) but someone here might find
> some importance in them.
>
> Seems to have some interesting possibilities.

Been searching on google and can't find a supplier in the UK :-(

Nice idea though....

Thanks
Gill

[NetMax]

"Daniel Morrow" > wrote in message
...
> Mid posted.
> NetMax wrote:
>> "Elaine T" > wrote in message
>> m...
>>> Gill Passman wrote:
>>>> I was looking at the display tank at my LFS which is the same size
>>>> as the one I've got on order. They have set up the substrate in the
>>>> following way:-
>>>>
>>>> A layer of sand and laterite (I think)
>>>> A 1 1/2 inch layer of very fine gravel
>>>> Then another inch of sand with some of the fine gravel intermingled
>>>>
>>>> It is heavily planted. It looks great but I'm wondering about the
>>>> maintenance issues with using the sand having read some negatives
>>>> and wondered if anyone has any comments
>>>>
>>>> TIA
>>>> Gill
>>>>
>>> Have a look at this stuff.
>>> http://www.profileproducts.com/golf/ppc_sand/index.cfm
>>> A lot of the people on the Aquatic Plants list use it and say it
>>> works really well. I don't know whether it's available in the UK
>>> but perhaps you could find something similar. It's relatively cheap
>>> since it's designed to be used by the ton in golf courses.
>>>
>>> --
>>> Elaine T __
>>> http://eethomp.com/fish.html <'__><
>>> rec.aquaria.* FAQ http://faq.thekrib.com
>>
>> I mentioned Profile to a buddy, who presented me with a 50 lb bag. It
>> costs as much as aquarium gravel (about $1 / lb) at a commercial
>> retail level (golf course). It has a very nice diameter (medium sand
>> grain) and colour (reddish-brown). It absorbed quite a bit of water
>> (increasing its volume by 5 -10%). It's rather light in the water,
>> but not excessively (I suspect the biofilm will weigh it down
>> nicely). It made the water muddy but not quite as bad as Flourite
>> (imo). The specs were as follows: porosity 74%, 39% capillary, 35%
>> non-capillary
>> pore size .1 to >50 micron
>> pH 6-6.5
>
> Does this ph labeling mean this substrate "buffers" to 6-6.5 ph? Does
> it
> mean that this substrate keeps the ph at 6-6.5? That would be good news
> to
> discus owners I would think. Thanks and later!


I'll let you know if it lowers the pH, but in my water (16dkH), don't
hold your breath ;~) I doubt it'll have any effect.
--
www.NetMax.tk

[Gail Futoran]

"NetMax" > wrote in message
. ..
> "Daniel Morrow" > wrote in message
> ...
[snip]
>> Does this ph labeling mean this substrate "buffers" to 6-6.5 ph? Does it
>> mean that this substrate keeps the ph at 6-6.5? That would be good news
>> to
>> discus owners I would think. Thanks and later!
>
>
> I'll let you know if it lowers the pH, but in my water (16dkH), don't hold
> your breath ;~) I doubt it'll have any effect.
> --
> www.NetMax.tk

I've used Schultz Aquatic Plant Soil aka Profile in
three planted tanks for over a year. It doesn't
affect the pH as far as I can tell. The tanks are
not large - two 20 longs and a 10 - so that might
make a difference. I'm in the midst of changing
my 30G long over to a Profile substrate.

Gail