Bettas that lose color

[Koi-Lo]

Although most of my bettas retain their color all their lives (about 4
years) there is that occasionally one that looses color over time. This one
was a deep red beautiful fish last fall but is now an ugly fleshy-red for
lack of a better term. Their heads will lose all color in time. All get
the same care and the same diet and all are lined up on the same windowsill.
Anyone know why this happens?
--
Koi-Lo.... frugal ponding since 1995...
Aquariums since 1952
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
Troll Information:
http://tinyurl.com/9zbh
http://tinyurl.com/d8e4
Note: There are two Koi-Lo's on the Aquaria groups.
~~~ }<((((o> ~~~ }<{{{{o> ~~~ }<(((((o>

[Klane]

I'm interested in the answeres myself. My new female betta is losing
the color on her fin tips. They were a deep burgandy but now the tips
are actually almost clear.

[Roy]

That betta lost allits color when it found out that someone may be
paying carol a visit.Its called scared white as a sheet disease....
--
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The original frugal ponder ! Koi-ahoi mates....

[Koi-Lo]

"Klane" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> I'm interested in the answeres myself. My new female betta is losing
> the color on her fin tips. They were a deep burgandy but now the tips
> are actually almost clear.
=============================
I don't think it's diet related. They get a good variety of food including
the fresh frozen kind. I suspect it may be genetic. If this one looses any
more color I'll be very disappointed. It's not very attractive now. I've
had a few over the years that were almost colorless by the time they died of
old age. I think this will be the last group of bettas I get anyway....
when these guys go that's it.
--
Koi-Lo.... frugal ponding since 1995...
Aquariums since 1952
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
Note: There are two Koi-Lo's on the Aquaria groups.
~~~ }<((((o> ~~~ }<{{{{o> ~~~ }<(((((o>

[NetMax]

"Klane" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> I'm interested in the answeres myself. My new female betta is losing
> the color on her fin tips. They were a deep burgandy but now the tips
> are actually almost clear.


Age, diet, disease, genetics & intent seem to be the predominantly suggested
causes. Some things to try : vitamins, foods with beta carotene, shrimp
meal and warmer water. Bettas might also respond to more interaction with
other Bettas (flare buddies?).
--
www.NetMax.tk

[IDzine01]

It's not unusual for bettas to change color over time.
This betta for instance...
http://www.nippyfish.net/Flashswimming2.jpg
is now a very deep reddish brown color with no blue or green at all.

At one year this betta was completely white and yellow. No blue at all.
Here he is at 2 years.
http://www.nippyfish.net/Boneexploring.jpg

If the color loss appears quickly it could be sign of a problem but
changing color over time can be expected. Also, it's a good idea to
test the water. Fish don't react the same to similar water conditions.
Some are more sensitive then others too toxins and they all metabolize
waste differently too. You can have two adult males in similar bowls
with the same amount of water and one could produce .5ppm ammonia in a
week while another produces 1ppm ammonia in a week.

That's the major reason I tell people that the only way to know how
often to change your water is to test. Generalizations like "clean once
a week" is too broad. There are too many contributing factors.

I hope it's just a natural change Koi-Lo. Let us know if you think it's
something health related.

[Koi-Lo]

"IDzine01" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> It's not unusual for bettas to change color over time.
> This betta for instance...
> http://www.nippyfish.net/Flashswimming2.jpg
> is now a very deep reddish brown color with no blue or green at all.
>
> At one year this betta was completely white and yellow. No blue at all.
> Here he is at 2 years.
> http://www.nippyfish.net/Boneexploring.jpg

That's quite a difference and what I'm talking about. Some become as drab
as female guppies long before old age. Most of mine kept their colors all
their lives or faded a bit shortly before they died around age 4. It's
these oddballs that come along and fade way before old age.

> If the color loss appears quickly it could be sign of a problem but
> changing color over time can be expected. Also, it's a good idea to
> test the water. Fish don't react the same to similar water conditions.
> Some are more sensitive then others too toxins and they all metabolize
> waste differently too. You can have two adult males in similar bowls
> with the same amount of water and one could produce .5ppm ammonia in a
> week while another produces 1ppm ammonia in a week.
>
> That's the major reason I tell people that the only way to know how
> often to change your water is to test. Generalizations like "clean once
> a week" is too broad. There are too many contributing factors.
>
> I hope it's just a natural change Koi-Lo. Let us know if you think it's
> something health related.

Thanks for the information. He sure acts healthy enough (as did others who
faded) and they do get those betta color flakes. I think because of the
water lettuce and gravel I don't see ammonia in their bowls/tanks or
whatever you call these things from the Goodwill store. ;-) The more I'm
reading on the net the more I think this loss of color is genetic in some
way. What's also making me lean in that direction is the number of
faded-out looking males I'm seeing in the LFSs. I was very disappointed in
the last shipment I saw at PetsMart and SuperPets. Even though I don't buy
them, I always spend time looking at them and discussing them with the girl
who works days there. I wonder what's going on with the breeders in Asia?
If these fish already look slightly faded what will they look like 6 months
from now.......
--
Koi-Lo.... frugal ponding since 1995...
Aquariums since 1952
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
Note: There are two Koi-Lo's on the Aquaria groups.
~~~ }<((((o> ~~~ }<{{{{o> ~~~ }<(((((o>

[IDzine01]

I wouldn't say that mine were fading, they just changed color. My
yellow and white one, for example, turned bright white and brilliant
teal blue. If they are loosing color so that they are gray or ashen, it
might be environmental. You could try a new can of food too. When you
buy fish flakes you want to buy the smallest container available. After
about 3 weeks (after seal is broken) most of the vitamins have lost
their affect and the can should be replaced with a fresh one. Switching
to live or frozen may be a better option for you.

[Koi-Lo]

"IDzine01" > wrote in message
oups.com...
>I wouldn't say that mine were fading, they just changed color. My
> yellow and white one, for example, turned bright white and brilliant
> teal blue. If they are loosing color so that they are gray or ashen, it
> might be environmental. You could try a new can of food too. When you
> buy fish flakes you want to buy the smallest container available. After
> about 3 weeks (after seal is broken) most of the vitamins have lost
> their affect and the can should be replaced with a fresh one. Switching
> to live or frozen may be a better option for you.
=======================
That's a good idea concerning can size,... that hadn't occurred to me. I do
feed them the frozen foods from the pet shop - brine shrimp, tubafex worms,
glassworms, whatever I can get. I also buy the one with the mixture called
San Francisco multi-pack with added vitamins etc. One cube lasts 2 days
since the smaller fancy GF also get some.

As for *changing* color. I had a white betta whose tail and other fins
turned color. The other whites stayed white. My only yellow betta stayed
yellow all his life. What a beauty he was! :-) I haven't see another
clear yellow since and it's been a few years.
--

Koi-Lo.... frugal ponding since 1995...
Aquariums since 1952
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
Note: There are two Koi-Lo's on the Aquaria groups.
~~~ }<((((o> ~~~ }<{{{{o> ~~~ }<(((((o>

[Richard Sexton]

In article . com>,
IDzine01 > wrote:
>I wouldn't say that mine were fading, they just changed color. My
>yellow and white one, for example, turned bright white and brilliant
>teal blue. If they are loosing color so that they are gray or ashen, it
>might be environmental. You could try a new can of food too. When you
>buy fish flakes you want to buy the smallest container available. After
>about 3 weeks (after seal is broken) most of the vitamins have lost
>their affect and the can should be replaced with a fresh one. Switching
>to live or frozen may be a better option for you.
>

Modern bettas are so damn inbred the phenotype is no longer stable. The fancier
the betta the less stable it is. Similarly so with spawn sizes, a run of the
mill blue unfancy betta may give you 300 fry. A black crowntail, maybe 12.

Any betta with yellor or clear or some black can be expected, more or less
to change as it grows older. Sometimes a bit, sometimes a lot depedning on
genetics.

--
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1970 280SE, 72 280SE | Home page: http://rs79.vrx.net
633CSi 250SE/C 300SD | http://aquaria.net http://killi.net

[Beano]

Wow, I like the change, he's pretty!

[Tynk]

Koi-Lo wrote:
> Although most of my bettas retain their color all their lives (about 4
> years) there is that occasionally one that looses color over time. This one
> was a deep red beautiful fish last fall but is now an ugly fleshy-red for
> lack of a better term. Their heads will lose all color in time. All get
> the same care and the same diet and all are lined up on the same windowsill.
> Anyone know why this happens?
> --
> Koi-Lo.... frugal ponding since 1995...
> Aquariums since 1952
> My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
> http://tinyurl.com/9do58
> Troll Information:
> http://tinyurl.com/9zbh
> http://tinyurl.com/d8e4
> Note: There are two Koi-Lo's on the Aquaria groups.
> ~~~ }<((((o> ~~~ }<{{{{o> ~~~ }<(((((o>

Koi-Lo....
The color change you are talking about that you are seeing in your
older Bettas sounds more to me like simple old age.
Some Bettas don't fade, some do when they get to be old farts.
I have a vivid piebald - extented red cross that is either 4 or older
now and is bright as ever. However, I have an older black male who has
faded out. He looks terrible and ill, but he's not. He colors up a
little at feeding time, but other than that he's ugly now.
I don't have too many dark bodied males, as I have mostly Cambodian
mixes which are whilte bodied.
I did just have an old Crowntail female die on me. She was a darker
fire red..fully like an extended red, but not the right color. She
faded several months before she slowed down and then later died.
Her color wasn't as obvious as my black males. She looked like a red
cotten T-shirt that faded a little in the wash.
Also look for other old age symptoms such as:
Fins getting shorter, or raggady. Not torn or damaged and in no way
infected...just shorter or tattered ends.
Body gets thinner.
This is the point I refer to as "out living their bodies".
My 5+ yr old male is so darn skinny that he looks like a head with a
tail.
If looking down at him from above, he look like a large, white sperm.
Poor thing looks so pittiful, but he's happy as a clam.
His fins are a quarter of what they should be. He flares with his buddy
(the ugly faded black male) at feeding time and then like the old men
that they are, they toss up a fin and say Ah forget it and go take a
nap in their caves. ; )
I just this weekend lost a different old white male. He wasn't as old
as the other one, but was outliving his body for sure.
I knew that was coming though.
He had been resting on the gravel or plants a little too much in the
last few days.
At feeding time he grabbed a chunk of food and then went back to his
resting spot.
I knew right there the end was very near.
I love having them around so long, but I not when they out live their
bodies.
They look so sad.
Somebody else had posted about ther Betta's fins changing clear at the
ends...that is something completely different.
That is a normal, genetic color morph.
Most likey it is now showing a *butterfly* pattern.
That's when there's a different color at the ends of the fins. It's
usually seen as white, but can be any other color or lack of like the
poster is seeing....which is really called cellophane (if I spelled
that right).

[Koi-Lo]

"Tynk" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> Koi-Lo....
> The color change you are talking about that you are seeing in your
> older Bettas sounds more to me like simple old age.

It's not old age as it's happened to new purchases who went on to live for
another 3 to 4 years.

> Some Bettas don't fade, some do when they get to be old farts.
> I have a vivid piebald - extented red cross that is either 4 or older
> now and is bright as ever. However, I have an older black male who has
> faded out. He looks terrible and ill, but he's not. He colors up a
> little at feeding time, but other than that he's ugly now.

I have one that also looks awful. :-( His color has faded considerably
since last fall. Other than that he's active, fit and fine.

> I don't have too many dark bodied males, as I have mostly Cambodian
> mixes which are whilte bodied.
> I did just have an old Crowntail female die on me. She was a darker
> fire red..fully like an extended red, but not the right color. She
> faded several months before she slowed down and then later died.
> Her color wasn't as obvious as my black males. She looked like a red
> cotten T-shirt that faded a little in the wash.

Now oddly enough, the females haven't faded at all - but then I never had as
many as I had males.

> Also look for other old age symptoms such as:
> Fins getting shorter, or raggady. Not torn or damaged and in no way
> infected...just shorter or tattered ends.
> Body gets thinner.

Thanks, I used to raise them back in NY years ago. It's quite easy to tell
the young ones from the "old geezers." :-)

> This is the point I refer to as "out living their bodies".
> My 5+ yr old male is so darn skinny that he looks like a head with a
> tail.
> If looking down at him from above, he look like a large, white sperm.
> Poor thing looks so pittiful, but he's happy as a clam.

My old pensioner in the sun room also seems happy but looks like death
warmed over. Every time I clean his little tank I think this will be the
last time,.... but 2 weeks later he's still with us.

> His fins are a quarter of what they should be. He flares with his buddy
> (the ugly faded black male) at feeding time and then like the old men
> that they are, they toss up a fin and say Ah forget it and go take a
> nap in their caves. ; )
> I just this weekend lost a different old white male. He wasn't as old
> as the other one, but was outliving his body for sure.
> I knew that was coming though.
> He had been resting on the gravel or plants a little too much in the
> last few days.
> At feeding time he grabbed a chunk of food and then went back to his
> resting spot.
> I knew right there the end was very near.
> I love having them around so long, but I not when they out live their
> bodies.
> They look so sad.

This is true. But some old folks also look pretty bad but are quite happy
and content. :-) That's why I move the "old gents" no longer attractive to
the sunroom where they're not on display as they are in the kitchen. The
one losing color will be moved there the next time I clean their tanks.
When these bettas go in a few years I don't think I'll replace them. If I
find I can't live with just flowers on that windowsill I'll just keep 2
rather than 6 or 7.

> Somebody else had posted about ther Betta's fins changing clear at the
> ends...that is something completely different.
> That is a normal, genetic color morph.
> Most likey it is now showing a *butterfly* pattern.
> That's when there's a different color at the ends of the fins. It's
> usually seen as white, but can be any other color or lack of like the
> poster is seeing....which is really called cellophane (if I spelled
> that right).

--
Koi-Lo.... frugal ponding since 1995...
Aquariums since 1952
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~ }<((((o> ~~~ }<{{{{o> ~~~ }<(((((o>

[Tynk]

NetMax wrote:
> "Koi-Lo" > wrote in message
> ...
> >
> > "Tynk" > wrote in message
> > oups.com...
> >> Koi-Lo....
> >> The color change you are talking about that you are seeing in your
> >> older Bettas sounds more to me like simple old age.
> >
> > It's not old age as it's happened to new purchases who went on to live
> > for another 3 to 4 years.
> >
> >> Some Bettas don't fade, some do when they get to be old farts.
> >> I have a vivid piebald - extented red cross that is either 4 or older
> >> now and is bright as ever. However, I have an older black male who has
> >> faded out. He looks terrible and ill, but he's not. He colors up a
> >> little at feeding time, but other than that he's ugly now.
> >
> > I have one that also looks awful. :-( His color has faded
> > considerably since last fall. Other than that he's active, fit and
> > fine.
> >
> >> I don't have too many dark bodied males, as I have mostly Cambodian
> >> mixes which are whilte bodied.
> >> I did just have an old Crowntail female die on me. She was a darker
> >> fire red..fully like an extended red, but not the right color. She
> >> faded several months before she slowed down and then later died.
> >> Her color wasn't as obvious as my black males. She looked like a red
> >> cotten T-shirt that faded a little in the wash.
> >
> > Now oddly enough, the females haven't faded at all - but then I never
> > had as many as I had males.
> >
> >> Also look for other old age symptoms such as:
> >> Fins getting shorter, or raggady. Not torn or damaged and in no way
> >> infected...just shorter or tattered ends.
> >> Body gets thinner.
> >
> > Thanks, I used to raise them back in NY years ago. It's quite easy to
> > tell the young ones from the "old geezers." :-)
> >
> >> This is the point I refer to as "out living their bodies".
> >> My 5+ yr old male is so darn skinny that he looks like a head with a
> >> tail.
> >> If looking down at him from above, he look like a large, white sperm.
> >> Poor thing looks so pittiful, but he's happy as a clam.
> >
> > My old pensioner in the sun room also seems happy but looks like death
> > warmed over. Every time I clean his little tank I think this will be
> > the last time,.... but 2 weeks later he's still with us.
> >
> >> His fins are a quarter of what they should be. He flares with his
> >> buddy
> >> (the ugly faded black male) at feeding time and then like the old men
> >> that they are, they toss up a fin and say Ah forget it and go take a
> >> nap in their caves. ; )
> >> I just this weekend lost a different old white male. He wasn't as old
> >> as the other one, but was outliving his body for sure.
> >> I knew that was coming though.
> >> He had been resting on the gravel or plants a little too much in the
> >> last few days.
> >> At feeding time he grabbed a chunk of food and then went back to his
> >> resting spot.
> >> I knew right there the end was very near.
> >> I love having them around so long, but I not when they out live their
> >> bodies.
> >> They look so sad.
> >
> > This is true. But some old folks also look pretty bad but are quite
> > happy and content. :-) That's why I move the "old gents" no longer
> > attractive to the sunroom where they're not on display as they are in
> > the kitchen. The one losing color will be moved there the next time I
> > clean their tanks. When these bettas go in a few years I don't think
> > I'll replace them. If I find I can't live with just flowers on that
> > windowsill I'll just keep 2 rather than 6 or 7.
> >
> >> Somebody else had posted about ther Betta's fins changing clear at the
> >> ends...that is something completely different.
> >> That is a normal, genetic color morph.
> >> Most likey it is now showing a *butterfly* pattern.
> >> That's when there's a different color at the ends of the fins. It's
> >> usually seen as white, but can be any other color or lack of like the
> >> poster is seeing....which is really called cellophane (if I spelled
> >> that right).
> >
> > --
> > Koi-Lo.... frugal ponding since 1995...
> > Aquariums since 1952
> > My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
>
>
> Where have you two been hiding, that you can both pick up a thread at the
> same time after a week? ;~) Welcome back ladies. Getting back to the
> point, did you see the post from Charles about Guppy Color? Koi-lo was
> having trouble loading the pictures (me too, took a long time). It was
> quite technical, but if you're inclined, it was a real eye-opener in the
> mechanisms responsible for fish turning on colors, and what colors they
> could produce.
> --
> www.NetMax.tk
Thanks for the welcome back, NetMax. = )
I wasn't aware until just the other day that Koi-Lo had been away too.
I've just been way too busy, or too tired from being too busy to get
online.
I had heard that it got a little nuts with the weirdos posting
nonsense, and as I saw when I got back here....oh my = o so many.
I will have to look for the post from Charles regarding color. Thanks
for the heads up, as I wasn't going to even try to read everything that
was posted from the last time I was here.
It was a bit over whelming.
Thanks again. = )

[NetMax]

"Tynk" > wrote in message
oups.com...
>
> NetMax wrote:
>> "Koi-Lo" > wrote in message
>> ...
>> >
>> > "Tynk" > wrote in message
>> > oups.com...
>> >> Koi-Lo....
>> >> The color change you are talking about that you are seeing in your
>> >> older Bettas sounds more to me like simple old age.
>> >
>> > It's not old age as it's happened to new purchases who went on to
>> > live
>> > for another 3 to 4 years.
>> >
>> >> Some Bettas don't fade, some do when they get to be old farts.
>> >> I have a vivid piebald - extented red cross that is either 4 or
>> >> older
>> >> now and is bright as ever. However, I have an older black male who
>> >> has
>> >> faded out. He looks terrible and ill, but he's not. He colors up a
>> >> little at feeding time, but other than that he's ugly now.
>> >
>> > I have one that also looks awful. :-( His color has faded
>> > considerably since last fall. Other than that he's active, fit and
>> > fine.
>> >
>> >> I don't have too many dark bodied males, as I have mostly Cambodian
>> >> mixes which are whilte bodied.
>> >> I did just have an old Crowntail female die on me. She was a darker
>> >> fire red..fully like an extended red, but not the right color. She
>> >> faded several months before she slowed down and then later died.
>> >> Her color wasn't as obvious as my black males. She looked like a
>> >> red
>> >> cotten T-shirt that faded a little in the wash.
>> >
>> > Now oddly enough, the females haven't faded at all - but then I
>> > never
>> > had as many as I had males.
>> >
>> >> Also look for other old age symptoms such as:
>> >> Fins getting shorter, or raggady. Not torn or damaged and in no way
>> >> infected...just shorter or tattered ends.
>> >> Body gets thinner.
>> >
>> > Thanks, I used to raise them back in NY years ago. It's quite easy
>> > to
>> > tell the young ones from the "old geezers." :-)
>> >
>> >> This is the point I refer to as "out living their bodies".
>> >> My 5+ yr old male is so darn skinny that he looks like a head with
>> >> a
>> >> tail.
>> >> If looking down at him from above, he look like a large, white
>> >> sperm.
>> >> Poor thing looks so pittiful, but he's happy as a clam.
>> >
>> > My old pensioner in the sun room also seems happy but looks like
>> > death
>> > warmed over. Every time I clean his little tank I think this will
>> > be
>> > the last time,.... but 2 weeks later he's still with us.
>> >
>> >> His fins are a quarter of what they should be. He flares with his
>> >> buddy
>> >> (the ugly faded black male) at feeding time and then like the old
>> >> men
>> >> that they are, they toss up a fin and say Ah forget it and go take
>> >> a
>> >> nap in their caves. ; )
>> >> I just this weekend lost a different old white male. He wasn't as
>> >> old
>> >> as the other one, but was outliving his body for sure.
>> >> I knew that was coming though.
>> >> He had been resting on the gravel or plants a little too much in
>> >> the
>> >> last few days.
>> >> At feeding time he grabbed a chunk of food and then went back to
>> >> his
>> >> resting spot.
>> >> I knew right there the end was very near.
>> >> I love having them around so long, but I not when they out live
>> >> their
>> >> bodies.
>> >> They look so sad.
>> >
>> > This is true. But some old folks also look pretty bad but are quite
>> > happy and content. :-) That's why I move the "old gents" no longer
>> > attractive to the sunroom where they're not on display as they are
>> > in
>> > the kitchen. The one losing color will be moved there the next time
>> > I
>> > clean their tanks. When these bettas go in a few years I don't think
>> > I'll replace them. If I find I can't live with just flowers on that
>> > windowsill I'll just keep 2 rather than 6 or 7.
>> >
>> >> Somebody else had posted about ther Betta's fins changing clear at
>> >> the
>> >> ends...that is something completely different.
>> >> That is a normal, genetic color morph.
>> >> Most likey it is now showing a *butterfly* pattern.
>> >> That's when there's a different color at the ends of the fins. It's
>> >> usually seen as white, but can be any other color or lack of like
>> >> the
>> >> poster is seeing....which is really called cellophane (if I spelled
>> >> that right).
>> >
>> > --
>> > Koi-Lo.... frugal ponding since 1995...
>> > Aquariums since 1952
>> > My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
>>
>>
>> Where have you two been hiding, that you can both pick up a thread at
>> the
>> same time after a week? ;~) Welcome back ladies. Getting back to
>> the
>> point, did you see the post from Charles about Guppy Color? Koi-lo
>> was
>> having trouble loading the pictures (me too, took a long time). It
>> was
>> quite technical, but if you're inclined, it was a real eye-opener in
>> the
>> mechanisms responsible for fish turning on colors, and what colors
>> they
>> could produce.
>> --
>> www.NetMax.tk

> Thanks for the welcome back, NetMax. = )
> I wasn't aware until just the other day that Koi-Lo had been away too.
> I've just been way too busy, or too tired from being too busy to get
> online.
> I had heard that it got a little nuts with the weirdos posting
> nonsense, and as I saw when I got back here....oh my = o so many.
> I will have to look for the post from Charles regarding color. Thanks
> for the heads up, as I wasn't going to even try to read everything that
> was posted from the last time I was here.
> It was a bit over whelming.
> Thanks again. = )

That article I mentioned is quite technical so you might be cursing me
;~). As far as I can figure, there are two people in Usenet which are
*quite* upset with each other and have decided to take it public, through
rec.ponds and now alt.aquaria. They haven't really started into rafm
yet, and I don't really see how this will not be inevitable. Practically
speaking, we can't do anything about it, so minding our business and not
getting involved tends to be the best solution for these things. Now if
I could only follow my own advice ;~).
--
www.NetMax.tk

[Mr. Gardener]

On Sun, 19 Feb 2006 13:40:12 -0500, "NetMax"
> wrote:

>"Tynk" > wrote in message
oups.com...
>>
>> NetMax wrote:
>>> "Koi-Lo" > wrote in message
>>> ...
>>> >
>>> > "Tynk" > wrote in message
>>> > oups.com...
>>> >> Koi-Lo....
>>> >> The color change you are talking about that you are seeing in your
>>> >> older Bettas sounds more to me like simple old age.
>>> >
>>> > It's not old age as it's happened to new purchases who went on to
>>> > live
>>> > for another 3 to 4 years.
>>> >
>>> >> Some Bettas don't fade, some do when they get to be old farts.
>>> >> I have a vivid piebald - extented red cross that is either 4 or
>>> >> older
>>> >> now and is bright as ever. However, I have an older black male who
>>> >> has
>>> >> faded out. He looks terrible and ill, but he's not. He colors up a
>>> >> little at feeding time, but other than that he's ugly now.
>>> >
>>> > I have one that also looks awful. :-( His color has faded
>>> > considerably since last fall. Other than that he's active, fit and
>>> > fine.
>>> >
>>> >> I don't have too many dark bodied males, as I have mostly Cambodian
>>> >> mixes which are whilte bodied.
>>> >> I did just have an old Crowntail female die on me. She was a darker
>>> >> fire red..fully like an extended red, but not the right color. She
>>> >> faded several months before she slowed down and then later died.
>>> >> Her color wasn't as obvious as my black males. She looked like a
>>> >> red
>>> >> cotten T-shirt that faded a little in the wash.
>>> >
>>> > Now oddly enough, the females haven't faded at all - but then I
>>> > never
>>> > had as many as I had males.
>>> >
>>> >> Also look for other old age symptoms such as:
>>> >> Fins getting shorter, or raggady. Not torn or damaged and in no way
>>> >> infected...just shorter or tattered ends.
>>> >> Body gets thinner.
>>> >
>>> > Thanks, I used to raise them back in NY years ago. It's quite easy
>>> > to
>>> > tell the young ones from the "old geezers." :-)
>>> >
>>> >> This is the point I refer to as "out living their bodies".
>>> >> My 5+ yr old male is so darn skinny that he looks like a head with
>>> >> a
>>> >> tail.
>>> >> If looking down at him from above, he look like a large, white
>>> >> sperm.
>>> >> Poor thing looks so pittiful, but he's happy as a clam.
>>> >
>>> > My old pensioner in the sun room also seems happy but looks like
>>> > death
>>> > warmed over. Every time I clean his little tank I think this will
>>> > be
>>> > the last time,.... but 2 weeks later he's still with us.
>>> >
>>> >> His fins are a quarter of what they should be. He flares with his
>>> >> buddy
>>> >> (the ugly faded black male) at feeding time and then like the old
>>> >> men
>>> >> that they are, they toss up a fin and say Ah forget it and go take
>>> >> a
>>> >> nap in their caves. ; )
>>> >> I just this weekend lost a different old white male. He wasn't as
>>> >> old
>>> >> as the other one, but was outliving his body for sure.
>>> >> I knew that was coming though.
>>> >> He had been resting on the gravel or plants a little too much in
>>> >> the
>>> >> last few days.
>>> >> At feeding time he grabbed a chunk of food and then went back to
>>> >> his
>>> >> resting spot.
>>> >> I knew right there the end was very near.
>>> >> I love having them around so long, but I not when they out live
>>> >> their
>>> >> bodies.
>>> >> They look so sad.
>>> >
>>> > This is true. But some old folks also look pretty bad but are quite
>>> > happy and content. :-) That's why I move the "old gents" no longer
>>> > attractive to the sunroom where they're not on display as they are
>>> > in
>>> > the kitchen. The one losing color will be moved there the next time
>>> > I
>>> > clean their tanks. When these bettas go in a few years I don't think
>>> > I'll replace them. If I find I can't live with just flowers on that
>>> > windowsill I'll just keep 2 rather than 6 or 7.
>>> >
>>> >> Somebody else had posted about ther Betta's fins changing clear at
>>> >> the
>>> >> ends...that is something completely different.
>>> >> That is a normal, genetic color morph.
>>> >> Most likey it is now showing a *butterfly* pattern.
>>> >> That's when there's a different color at the ends of the fins. It's
>>> >> usually seen as white, but can be any other color or lack of like
>>> >> the
>>> >> poster is seeing....which is really called cellophane (if I spelled
>>> >> that right).
>>> >
>>> > --
>>> > Koi-Lo.... frugal ponding since 1995...
>>> > Aquariums since 1952
>>> > My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
>>>
>>>
>>> Where have you two been hiding, that you can both pick up a thread at
>>> the
>>> same time after a week? ;~) Welcome back ladies. Getting back to
>>> the
>>> point, did you see the post from Charles about Guppy Color? Koi-lo
>>> was
>>> having trouble loading the pictures (me too, took a long time). It
>>> was
>>> quite technical, but if you're inclined, it was a real eye-opener in
>>> the
>>> mechanisms responsible for fish turning on colors, and what colors
>>> they
>>> could produce.
>>> --
>>> www.NetMax.tk
>
>> Thanks for the welcome back, NetMax. = )
>> I wasn't aware until just the other day that Koi-Lo had been away too.
>> I've just been way too busy, or too tired from being too busy to get
>> online.
>> I had heard that it got a little nuts with the weirdos posting
>> nonsense, and as I saw when I got back here....oh my = o so many.
>> I will have to look for the post from Charles regarding color. Thanks
>> for the heads up, as I wasn't going to even try to read everything that
>> was posted from the last time I was here.
>> It was a bit over whelming.
>> Thanks again. = )
>
>That article I mentioned is quite technical so you might be cursing me
>;~). As far as I can figure, there are two people in Usenet which are
>*quite* upset with each other and have decided to take it public, through
>rec.ponds and now alt.aquaria. They haven't really started into rafm
>yet, and I don't really see how this will not be inevitable. Practically
>speaking, we can't do anything about it, so minding our business and not
>getting involved tends to be the best solution for these things. Now if
>I could only follow my own advice ;~).

My March 2006 Tropical Fish Hobbyist magazine arrived in the mail
yesterday and The Skeptical Fishkeeper column this month explores the
topic of "The Aging Process In Fish" The glossy glitzy photo (for
which TFH is famous) is of a rather worn Betta. The caption under the
photo reads "By the time a Betta Splendens male is purchased it may
have already passed the midpoint of his life." Well, that's enough to
make me want to read the entire article. It doesn't appear they have
chosen this article to feature on their website. I'm unable to
purchase TFH magazine anywhere around here, not even Borders. So I
sent them an email requesting a free trial copy, and with the copy
they mailed me an offer of $19.99 for 12 issues. I couldn't refuse.
I've skimmed through recent editions of FAMA and AFM, boy those two
mags are hanging on by their teeth. Not worth the cover price. At
least TFH has pretty pictures.

-- Mr Gardener