any advice appreciated

[dennistillis]

just set up a new 55 gal sal****er tank about 2 days ago, put in about three
inches of crushed coral about "O" this size on top of an undergravel filter,
running a large back flow filter with 2 wells and just the two sets of
carbon filters in each well, 2 power heads one on each end, one being a
marineland 802, currently just a few plants and one decoration. currently
running 2 48" standard shop lights on coral life VHO lighting. I know this
really isn't the best set-up and any advice would be appreciated.

working towards putting about 40 to 60lbs of live rock in it, with anemones
amongst other things

currently having a problem with one of the 2 damsels I put in to help cycle
the tank, it appears to have grains of sand all over it's body, don't know
if it's ich or not, seems to be active still.

any advice on how to treat this and if it will affect the other damsels or
the future of tank?

thanks

[Chris Taylor]

The Damsel has probably got ich as a result of the stress associated with
living in a poisonous environment. If your tank is still cycling there is
probably huge amounts of Ammonia and Nitrate present in the water, this is
poisonous to the fish you've used to create these chemicals.

If the disease is indeed ich, it will likely pass onto the other fish in the
tank.

Any chemicals you throw into the tank will be harmfull to the tank's future
success, best you either let it see the course, remove the fish, or try
buying an ultraviolet filter (don't look directly at the lamp, it will blind
you) to kill off the disease while it's in its waterborne state. This could
take 1 to 2 weeks and is not a cheap option.

Chris

"dennistillis" > wrote in message
news:SNJgc.25278$ru4.23584@attbi_s52...
> just set up a new 55 gal sal****er tank about 2 days ago, put in about
three
> inches of crushed coral about "O" this size on top of an undergravel
filter,
> running a large back flow filter with 2 wells and just the two sets of
> carbon filters in each well, 2 power heads one on each end, one being a
> marineland 802, currently just a few plants and one decoration. currently
> running 2 48" standard shop lights on coral life VHO lighting. I know
this
> really isn't the best set-up and any advice would be appreciated.
>
> working towards putting about 40 to 60lbs of live rock in it, with
anemones
> amongst other things
>
> currently having a problem with one of the 2 damsels I put in to help
cycle
> the tank, it appears to have grains of sand all over it's body, don't know
> if it's ich or not, seems to be active still.
>
> any advice on how to treat this and if it will affect the other damsels or
> the future of tank?
>
> thanks
>
>

[Simon O'Keeffe]

UV will not be effective against ich.
Damsels are pretty tough, id be surprised if ich killed yours.
Your tank is not ideal by a long shot though.
Honestly that is the first time I've heard of a new tank being set up
with an undergravel filter.
This type of filtration is not thourough enough so LR etc is much better.
Take the damsel back to the shop along with the undergravel filter and CC.
Get some decent LR and some nice live sand and stick this in your tank
for about 2 months.
After you see some serious life on the LR then start to add fish at the
rate of 1 per month until you have 1" of fish per 10 gal of water.

Good luck, and don;t buy any more stuff until you have asked here.

Simon

Chris Taylor wrote:

>The Damsel has probably got ich as a result of the stress associated with
>living in a poisonous environment. If your tank is still cycling there is
>probably huge amounts of Ammonia and Nitrate present in the water, this is
>poisonous to the fish you've used to create these chemicals.
>
>If the disease is indeed ich, it will likely pass onto the other fish in the
>tank.
>
>Any chemicals you throw into the tank will be harmfull to the tank's future
>success, best you either let it see the course, remove the fish, or try
>buying an ultraviolet filter (don't look directly at the lamp, it will blind
>you) to kill off the disease while it's in its waterborne state. This could
>take 1 to 2 weeks and is not a cheap option.
>
>Chris
>
>"dennistillis" > wrote in message
>news:SNJgc.25278$ru4.23584@attbi_s52...
>
>
>>just set up a new 55 gal sal****er tank about 2 days ago, put in about
>>
>>
>three
>
>
>>inches of crushed coral about "O" this size on top of an undergravel
>>
>>
>filter,
>
>
>>running a large back flow filter with 2 wells and just the two sets of
>>carbon filters in each well, 2 power heads one on each end, one being a
>>marineland 802, currently just a few plants and one decoration. currently
>>running 2 48" standard shop lights on coral life VHO lighting. I know
>>
>>
>this
>
>
>>really isn't the best set-up and any advice would be appreciated.
>>
>>working towards putting about 40 to 60lbs of live rock in it, with
>>
>>
>anemones
>
>
>>amongst other things
>>
>>currently having a problem with one of the 2 damsels I put in to help
>>
>>
>cycle
>
>
>>the tank, it appears to have grains of sand all over it's body, don't know
>>if it's ich or not, seems to be active still.
>>
>>any advice on how to treat this and if it will affect the other damsels or
>>the future of tank?
>>
>>thanks
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>

[RicSeyler]

Ditch the UG filter
Ditch the crush coral
Ditch the external filters

And Get a skimmer
And replace the crushed coral with
a deep sand bed. Google some info about deep sand beds....

Do some reading on modern reef tanks.
Put any ich meds (copper) in the tank
and kiss you expensive live rock goodbye
for the next 100 or so years. :-)

It's just about the "worst" setup you could put together.

dennistillis wrote:

>just set up a new 55 gal sal****er tank about 2 days ago, put in about three
>inches of crushed coral about "O" this size on top of an undergravel filter,
>running a large back flow filter with 2 wells and just the two sets of
>carbon filters in each well, 2 power heads one on each end, one being a
>marineland 802, currently just a few plants and one decoration. currently
>running 2 48" standard shop lights on coral life VHO lighting. I know this
>really isn't the best set-up and any advice would be appreciated.
>
>working towards putting about 40 to 60lbs of live rock in it, with anemones
>amongst other things
>
>currently having a problem with one of the 2 damsels I put in to help cycle
>the tank, it appears to have grains of sand all over it's body, don't know
>if it's ich or not, seems to be active still.
>
>any advice on how to treat this and if it will affect the other damsels or
>the future of tank?
>
>thanks
>
>
>
>

--
Ric Seyler

[Marco Qualizza]

On Mon, 19 Apr 2004 05:51:46 +0000, dennistillis wrote:

> currently having a problem with one of the 2 damsels I put in to help
> cycle the tank, it appears to have grains of sand all over it's body,
> don't know if it's ich or not, seems to be active still.

Since others have spoken about the filtering, I'll mention that using
damsels to cycle your tank is pretty silly.

1. It's unconscionably cruel to the damsel fish, especially since there
are other alternatives. You're forcing it to do the equivalent of
breathing acid. Some of the alternatives are adding household ammonia
(after all, that's what you're trying to get your damsel to do -- add
ammonia to the system to get the cycle going), or adding some raw deli
shrimp (as it decomposes it'll add ammonia).

2. Live rock, by it's nature of hosting life, will have some die-off when
you put it in your tank. This die-off will be enough to get the cycle
going.

3. Damsels are mean, nasty fish, and will be very difficult to catch when
you do want to pull 'em out.

[Chris Taylor]

"""UV will not be effective against ich."""

Most treatments against Ich are only effective in the free swimming stage.

http://www.marineandreef.com/shoppro/sterilizers.html (and related links)

Stress Factors
Stress is another factor that can bring on an outbreak of Ich. By keeping
your aquarium in top shape with water quality control, using proper
filtration, and not putting your fish under any unnecessary stress causing
situations, this can help prevent outbreaks. New fish can go through quite
an ordeal during the collection and shipping process that relates to stress.
Using a QT to isolate new arrivals is always the best thing to do.

What is UV Sterilization?
What exactly is UV Sterilization? It's actually a very simple process for
removing (or filtering) unwanted free floating bacteria and parasitic
organisms, like ich, out of your water by passing the water through Ultra
Violet (UV) light. The UV Sterilizer light affects the living cells by
altering the structure of the cell's nuclear material. The end result is
the organisms die, erradicating your aquarium water of these unwanted
nuisances.

What can I kill with a UV sterilizer?
-UV sterilizers will destroy protozoan parasites such as Ich during the new
born, free swimming life cycle stage of the parasites. NOTE: They do not
kill or remove the Ich parasites once attached to the fish. UV Sterilizers
can be used with other methods to treat Ich.

UV & Ozone Sterilization Units
Many people choose to run UV (Ultra Violet) or Ozone Sterilization units.
These units only destroy the Ich during the new born, free swimming life
cycle stage of the parasites. They do not kill or remove the Ich parasites
once attached to the fish. UV & Ozone sterilization units can assist in
controlling an Ich bloom from getting out of hand, and possibly eliminating
the problem all together.

Chris

"Simon O'Keeffe" > wrote in message
...
> UV will not be effective against ich.
> Damsels are pretty tough, id be surprised if ich killed yours.
> Your tank is not ideal by a long shot though.
> Honestly that is the first time I've heard of a new tank being set up
> with an undergravel filter.
> This type of filtration is not thourough enough so LR etc is much better.
> Take the damsel back to the shop along with the undergravel filter and CC.
> Get some decent LR and some nice live sand and stick this in your tank
> for about 2 months.
> After you see some serious life on the LR then start to add fish at the
> rate of 1 per month until you have 1" of fish per 10 gal of water.
>
> Good luck, and don;t buy any more stuff until you have asked here.
>
> Simon
>
> Chris Taylor wrote:
>
> >The Damsel has probably got ich as a result of the stress associated with
> >living in a poisonous environment. If your tank is still cycling there is
> >probably huge amounts of Ammonia and Nitrate present in the water, this
is
> >poisonous to the fish you've used to create these chemicals.
> >
> >If the disease is indeed ich, it will likely pass onto the other fish in
the
> >tank.
> >
> >Any chemicals you throw into the tank will be harmfull to the tank's
future
> >success, best you either let it see the course, remove the fish, or try
> >buying an ultraviolet filter (don't look directly at the lamp, it will
blind
> >you) to kill off the disease while it's in its waterborne state. This
could
> >take 1 to 2 weeks and is not a cheap option.
> >
> >Chris
> >
> >"dennistillis" > wrote in message
> >news:SNJgc.25278$ru4.23584@attbi_s52...
> >
> >
> >>just set up a new 55 gal sal****er tank about 2 days ago, put in about
> >>
> >>
> >three
> >
> >
> >>inches of crushed coral about "O" this size on top of an undergravel
> >>
> >>
> >filter,
> >
> >
> >>running a large back flow filter with 2 wells and just the two sets of
> >>carbon filters in each well, 2 power heads one on each end, one being a
> >>marineland 802, currently just a few plants and one decoration.
currently
> >>running 2 48" standard shop lights on coral life VHO lighting. I know
> >>
> >>
> >this
> >
> >
> >>really isn't the best set-up and any advice would be appreciated.
> >>
> >>working towards putting about 40 to 60lbs of live rock in it, with
> >>
> >>
> >anemones
> >
> >
> >>amongst other things
> >>
> >>currently having a problem with one of the 2 damsels I put in to help
> >>
> >>
> >cycle
> >
> >
> >>the tank, it appears to have grains of sand all over it's body, don't
know
> >>if it's ich or not, seems to be active still.
> >>
> >>any advice on how to treat this and if it will affect the other damsels
or
> >>the future of tank?
> >>
> >>thanks
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
>

[fishgills]

Hi, good luck with your new tank, i think if you read this link it will
give you some insight about salt water then you can discern what's best
for you, http://www.reefcorner.com/reef%20keeping_101.htm
---------'My Lagoon' (community.webtv.net/swt1968/MyLittleOceanReef)


--
fishgills

http://community.webtv.net/swt1968/MyLittleOceanReef
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[Richard Reynolds]

> 1. It's unconscionably cruel to the damsel fish, especially since there
> are other alternatives.

yea, but it keeps the cost of damsels down and that makes my trigger/puffer/ray even my
lunar wrase and hermits and starfish happy :D

> 2. Live rock, by it's nature of hosting life, will have some die-off when
> you put it in your tank. This die-off will be enough to get the cycle
> going.

my fav option. besides shrimp

> 3. Damsels are mean, nasty fish, and will be very difficult to catch when
> you do want to pull 'em out.

pull em out??? why would you want more than 1 fish in your tank anyways???


hehehe



--
Richard Reynolds