Saying it

[Mr. Gardener]

Does anyone know where I might find a web resource that tells me how
to pronounce the scientific names of fishes and plants? Or is there
anybody here that knows all this stuff? Yes? Then lets begin with the
two corydoras - aeneus and paleatus. I think I must have been sleeping
at the back of the room on the day the high school teacher talked
about pronunciation rules of scientific names.

-- Mr Gardener

[NetMax]

"Mr. Gardener" > wrote in message
...
> Does anyone know where I might find a web resource that tells me how
> to pronounce the scientific names of fishes and plants? Or is there
> anybody here that knows all this stuff? Yes? Then lets begin with the
> two corydoras - aeneus and paleatus. I think I must have been sleeping
> at the back of the room on the day the high school teacher talked
> about pronunciation rules of scientific names.
>
> -- Mr Gardener


ask and you shall receive
http://www.aquaria.info/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&file=article&sid=27&mode=thread&order=0&thold=0
you might need to wrap that around
hth
--
www.NetMax.tk

[Mr. Gardener]

On Sat, 25 Feb 2006 10:21:41 -0500, "NetMax"
> wrote:

>"Mr. Gardener" > wrote in message
...
>> Does anyone know where I might find a web resource that tells me how
>> to pronounce the scientific names of fishes and plants? Or is there
>> anybody here that knows all this stuff? Yes? Then lets begin with the
>> two corydoras - aeneus and paleatus. I think I must have been sleeping
>> at the back of the room on the day the high school teacher talked
>> about pronunciation rules of scientific names.
>>
>> -- Mr Gardener
>
>
>ask and you shall receive
>http://www.aquaria.info/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&file=article&sid=27&mode=thread&order=0&thold=0
>you might need to wrap that around
>hth

Very cool. Thanks.

-- Mr Gardener

[Richard Sexton]

In article >,
Mr. Gardener > wrote:
>Does anyone know where I might find a web resource that tells me how
>to pronounce the scientific names of fishes and plants? Or is there
>anybody here that knows all this stuff? Yes? Then lets begin with the
>two corydoras - aeneus and paleatus. I think I must have been sleeping
>at the back of the room on the day the high school teacher talked
>about pronunciation rules of scientific names.

Get a copy of Innes' Exotic Aquarium Fishes. I think every library
on the planet has one.

--
Need Mercedes parts ? - http://parts.mbz.org
Richard Sexton | Mercedes stuff: http://mbz.org
1970 280SE, 72 280SE | Home page: http://rs79.vrx.net
633CSi 250SE/C 300SD | http://aquaria.net http://killi.net

[Marco Schwarz]

Hi..

[Nomenclature]

Hope, this site might help you:

http://www.palaeos.com/Systematics/Linnean/Linnean.htm

[Pronunciation]

The very useful pronunciation guide of scientific names
NetMax gave to you follow I think the understanding of
pronunciation English Native Speakers have.
--
cu
Marco

[Mr. Gardener]

On Sat, 25 Feb 2006 17:55:12 +0100, Marco Schwarz
> wrote:

>Hi..
>
>[Nomenclature]
>
>Hope, this site might help you:
>
>http://www.palaeos.com/Systematics/Linnean/Linnean.htm
>
>[Pronunciation]
>
>The very useful pronunciation guide of scientific names
>NetMax gave to you follow I think the understanding of
>pronunciation English Native Speakers have.

Yes, I was pretty certain this path would take me back to Linneus -
the guy who started all this big word stuff - in a highly organized
manner, of course - but big words nonetheless. I wonder if he was the
original O-C. Thanks.

-- Mr Gardener

[Mr. Gardener]

On Sat, 25 Feb 2006 16:54:45 +0000 (UTC),
(Richard Sexton) wrote:

>In article >,
>Mr. Gardener > wrote:
>>Does anyone know where I might find a web resource that tells me how
>>to pronounce the scientific names of fishes and plants? Or is there
>>anybody here that knows all this stuff? Yes? Then lets begin with the
>>two corydoras - aeneus and paleatus. I think I must have been sleeping
>>at the back of the room on the day the high school teacher talked
>>about pronunciation rules of scientific names.
>
>Get a copy of Innes' Exotic Aquarium Fishes. I think every library
>on the planet has one.

Yes, I have an ancient edition. And yes, I do recall now that he
includes pronunciations with his fish descriptions.

-- Mr Gardener

[~Roy~]

The Dr. Innes book is a pretty good book to have. I do not know the
last edition of it they put out or if its even still available, but it
had just about everyhting youy needed to know in it. But processes
and equipment listed in the old editions are sure out of
date......but neat to look through just the same.

On Sat, 25 Feb 2006 13:09:21 -0500, Mr. Gardener
> wrote:
>><>On Sat, 25 Feb 2006 16:54:45 +0000 (UTC),
>><>(Richard Sexton) wrote:
>><>
>><>>In article >,
>><>>Mr. Gardener > wrote:
>><>>>Does anyone know where I might find a web resource that tells me how
>><>>>to pronounce the scientific names of fishes and plants? Or is there
>><>>>anybody here that knows all this stuff? Yes? Then lets begin with the
>><>>>two corydoras - aeneus and paleatus. I think I must have been sleeping
>><>>>at the back of the room on the day the high school teacher talked
>><>>>about pronunciation rules of scientific names.
>><>>
>><>>Get a copy of Innes' Exotic Aquarium Fishes. I think every library
>><>>on the planet has one.
>><>
>><>Yes, I have an ancient edition. And yes, I do recall now that he
>><>includes pronunciations with his fish descriptions.
>><>
>><>-- Mr Gardener

--
\\\|///
( @ @ )
-----------oOOo(_)oOOo---------------


oooO
---------( )----Oooo----------------
\ ( ( )
\_) ) /
(_/
The original frugal ponder ! Koi-ahoi mates....

[NetMax]

If you want to talk about old books (Innes 1966 & reprint 1971) does
anyone else have the 1969 Axelrod/Schultz Handbook of Tropical Aquarium
Fishes? Dr.Schultz was curator of fishes at the Smithsonian Institute.
Unless it's a breeding question (then I go to a 1967 Axelrod/Shaw), the
69 Handbook is the first thing I reach for. Over 700 pages and I haven't
seen the cover since the early 70s (this one got hole-punched into a
binder, but most of my fish books just get their spines replaced with
duct tape ;~).
--
www.NetMax.tk

"~Roy~" > wrote in message
...
> The Dr. Innes book is a pretty good book to have. I do not know the
> last edition of it they put out or if its even still available, but it
> had just about everyhting youy needed to know in it. But processes
> and equipment listed in the old editions are sure out of
> date......but neat to look through just the same.
>
> On Sat, 25 Feb 2006 13:09:21 -0500, Mr. Gardener
> > wrote:
>>><>On Sat, 25 Feb 2006 16:54:45 +0000 (UTC),
>>><>(Richard Sexton) wrote:
>>><>
>>><>>In article >,
>>><>>Mr. Gardener > wrote:
>>><>>>Does anyone know where I might find a web resource that tells me
>>>how
>>><>>>to pronounce the scientific names of fishes and plants? Or is
>>>there
>>><>>>anybody here that knows all this stuff? Yes? Then lets begin with
>>>the
>>><>>>two corydoras - aeneus and paleatus. I think I must have been
>>>sleeping
>>><>>>at the back of the room on the day the high school teacher talked
>>><>>>about pronunciation rules of scientific names.
>>><>>
>>><>>Get a copy of Innes' Exotic Aquarium Fishes. I think every library
>>><>>on the planet has one.
>>><>
>>><>Yes, I have an ancient edition. And yes, I do recall now that he
>>><>includes pronunciations with his fish descriptions.
>>><>
>>><>-- Mr Gardener
>
> --
> \\\|///
> ( @ @ )
> -----------oOOo(_)oOOo---------------
>
>
> oooO
> ---------( )----Oooo----------------
> \ ( ( )
> \_) ) /
> (_/
> The original frugal ponder ! Koi-ahoi mates....

[~Roy~]

So is 1971 the last date of a reprint for the Innes book then?
I know it used to be "The Bible " of fish keepers back in the late
60's.


On Sat, 25 Feb 2006 13:58:47 -0500, "NetMax"
> wrote:
>><>If you want to talk about old books (Innes 1966 & reprint 1971) does
>><>anyone else have the 1969 Axelrod/Schultz Handbook of Tropical Aquarium
>><>Fishes? Dr.Schultz was curator of fishes at the Smithsonian Institute.
>><>Unless it's a breeding question (then I go to a 1967 Axelrod/Shaw), the
>><>69 Handbook is the first thing I reach for. Over 700 pages and I haven't
>><>seen the cover since the early 70s (this one got hole-punched into a
>><>binder, but most of my fish books just get their spines replaced with
>><>duct tape ;~).

--
\\\|///
( @ @ )
-----------oOOo(_)oOOo---------------


oooO
---------( )----Oooo----------------
\ ( ( )
\_) ) /
(_/
The original frugal ponder ! Koi-ahoi mates....

[Richard Sexton]

In article >,
~Roy~ > wrote:
>The Dr. Innes book is a pretty good book to have. I do not know the
>last edition of it they put out or if its even still available, but it
>had just about everyhting youy needed to know in it. But processes
>and equipment listed in the old editions are sure out of
>date......but neat to look through just the same.

And what have you got against coal gas heaters, mastic and
rotary piston pumps? :-)


--
Need Mercedes parts ? - http://parts.mbz.org
Richard Sexton | Mercedes stuff: http://mbz.org
1970 280SE, 72 280SE | Home page: http://rs79.vrx.net
633CSi 250SE/C 300SD | http://aquaria.net http://killi.net

[Richard Sexton]

In article >,
NetMax > wrote:
>If you want to talk about old books (Innes 1966 & reprint 1971) does
>anyone else have the 1969 Axelrod/Schultz Handbook of Tropical Aquarium
>Fishes? Dr.Schultz was curator of fishes at the Smithsonian Institute.
>Unless it's a breeding question (then I go to a 1967 Axelrod/Shaw), the
>69 Handbook is the first thing I reach for. Over 700 pages and I haven't
>seen the cover since the early 70s (this one got hole-punched into a
>binder, but most of my fish books just get their spines replaced with
>duct tape ;~).

Yeah, I've got that one (same spine) and most old books. I think that
was Herbs first book; he used to clean cages and fish tanks in
grad school. It's a grear book though.

Other that are good for instructions onhow to breed almost anything
is the Derek McInerny and Geofery Gerrard "All about tropical
fish" book (although many many names are wrong) and for ID
the Sterba "Freshwater fishes of the world" is quite good.

That's what we used before the Baensch (?) atlas books were around, kids.


--
Need Mercedes parts ? - http://parts.mbz.org
Richard Sexton | Mercedes stuff: http://mbz.org
1970 280SE, 72 280SE | Home page: http://rs79.vrx.net
633CSi 250SE/C 300SD | http://aquaria.net http://killi.net

[Richard Sexton]

In article >,
~Roy~ > wrote:
>So is 1971 the last date of a reprint for the Innes book then?
>I know it used to be "The Bible " of fish keepers back in the late
>60's.

Nah, I think there's later versions. Keep in mind both TFH press
and Metaframe (the company that bought Innes' Aquarium Magazine)
publshed versions of it.

That book is one he wrote and some would argue an extension of
his earlier book on goldfish and ponds. That one was first
published... are you siting down... in 1899. yes, EIGHTEEN
ninety nine.

While some of the facts are a litle obsolete (of course) the
writing stpe is just something you don't see any more. That
guy really had a way with words.

--
Need Mercedes parts ? - http://parts.mbz.org
Richard Sexton | Mercedes stuff: http://mbz.org
1970 280SE, 72 280SE | Home page: http://rs79.vrx.net
633CSi 250SE/C 300SD | http://aquaria.net http://killi.net

[NetMax]

I only mentioned 66 & 71 because I have those two. Here is an auction
link for what appears to be the 19th edition (which I think originated in
56), and I don't see any other editions, just reprints.
http://auctions.yahoo.com/auction/96365887

Googling, I found reference http://www.alibris.com/home.cfm to
1935 (2nd ed), 1944, 1945, 1946 (7th ed), 1948 (9th ed) 1949 (10th ed),
1950, 1951(13th ed), 1952 (14th ed and 15th ed), 1953 (16th ed), 1954
(17th ed), 1955 (18th ed), 1956 (19th ed), 1964, 1966, 1968, 1971, 1979.

Gotta love the internet. Anyone have a 1st edition.. pre-1935?
--
www.NetMax.tk

"~Roy~" > wrote in message
...
> So is 1971 the last date of a reprint for the Innes book then?
> I know it used to be "The Bible " of fish keepers back in the late
> 60's.
>
>
> On Sat, 25 Feb 2006 13:58:47 -0500, "NetMax"
> > wrote:
>>><>If you want to talk about old books (Innes 1966 & reprint 1971) does
>>><>anyone else have the 1969 Axelrod/Schultz Handbook of Tropical
>>>Aquarium
>>><>Fishes? Dr.Schultz was curator of fishes at the Smithsonian
>>>Institute.
>>><>Unless it's a breeding question (then I go to a 1967 Axelrod/Shaw),
>>>the
>>><>69 Handbook is the first thing I reach for. Over 700 pages and I
>>>haven't
>>><>seen the cover since the early 70s (this one got hole-punched into a
>>><>binder, but most of my fish books just get their spines replaced
>>>with
>>><>duct tape ;~).
>
> --
> \\\|///
> ( @ @ )
> -----------oOOo(_)oOOo---------------
>
>
> oooO
> ---------( )----Oooo----------------
> \ ( ( )
> \_) ) /
> (_/
> The original frugal ponder ! Koi-ahoi mates....

[~Roy~]

Well I have nothing against them, but I have to be very thankfull for
living on the grid and the advent of electric heaters, and the
invention of silicone...just those two items revolutionized the
aquarium world. I often wonder what an old timer such a Innes and
others would think or how they would view todays equipment etc.



On Sat, 25 Feb 2006 19:46:08 +0000 (UTC),
(Richard Sexton) wrote:
>><>In article >,
>><>~Roy~ > wrote:
>><>>The Dr. Innes book is a pretty good book to have. I do not know the
>><>>last edition of it they put out or if its even still available, but it
>><>>had just about everyhting youy needed to know in it. But processes
>><>>and equipment listed in the old editions are sure out of
>><>>date......but neat to look through just the same.
>><>
>><>And what have you got against coal gas heaters, mastic and
>><>rotary piston pumps? :-)

--
\\\|///
( @ @ )
-----------oOOo(_)oOOo---------------


oooO
---------( )----Oooo----------------
\ ( ( )
\_) ) /
(_/
The original frugal ponder ! Koi-ahoi mates....

[NetMax]

I can't remember what was before electric heaters in their glass tubes,
and I only vaguely remember slate bottom tanks, so what I appreciate is a
bit more modern : the magnetic coupled impeller. I sure don't mind
getting rid of incandescent lighting though. Innes would remark on how
easy we have it today.
--
www.NetMax.tk

"~Roy~" > wrote in message
...
> Well I have nothing against them, but I have to be very thankfull for
> living on the grid and the advent of electric heaters, and the
> invention of silicone...just those two items revolutionized the
> aquarium world. I often wonder what an old timer such a Innes and
> others would think or how they would view todays equipment etc.
>
>
>
> On Sat, 25 Feb 2006 19:46:08 +0000 (UTC),
> (Richard Sexton) wrote:
>>><>In article >,
>>><>~Roy~ > wrote:
>>><>>The Dr. Innes book is a pretty good book to have. I do not know the
>>><>>last edition of it they put out or if its even still available, but
>>>it
>>><>>had just about everyhting youy needed to know in it. But processes
>>><>>and equipment listed in the old editions are sure out of
>>><>>date......but neat to look through just the same.
>>><>
>>><>And what have you got against coal gas heaters, mastic and
>>><>rotary piston pumps? :-)
>
> --
> \\\|///
> ( @ @ )
> -----------oOOo(_)oOOo---------------
>
>
> oooO
> ---------( )----Oooo----------------
> \ ( ( )
> \_) ) /
> (_/
> The original frugal ponder ! Koi-ahoi mates....

[Mr. Gardener]

On Sat, 25 Feb 2006 13:58:47 -0500, "NetMax"
> wrote:

>If you want to talk about old books (Innes 1966 & reprint 1971) does
>anyone else have the 1969 Axelrod/Schultz Handbook of Tropical Aquarium
>Fishes? Dr.Schultz was curator of fishes at the Smithsonian Institute.
>Unless it's a breeding question (then I go to a 1967 Axelrod/Shaw), the
>69 Handbook is the first thing I reach for. Over 700 pages and I haven't
>seen the cover since the early 70s (this one got hole-punched into a
>binder, but most of my fish books just get their spines replaced with
>duct tape ;~).

I have the 66 Innes, but I bought it to replace a much older edition.
It's around here somewhere, the cover is gone and so are the first
several pages. It had a bright yellow cover, not glossy like the 66.
It was given to me by my first supervisor during my introduction to
the pet store trade - his name was Mr Loiselle. A stern fellow who was
quickly losing his hair. Small world. Truthfully, I have no idea of
his first name, superiors were Mister back in those days. One of these
days I'll get around to doing a background check on Paul L, just in
case.

-- Mr Gardener

[Mr. Gardener]

On Sat, 25 Feb 2006 19:53:52 +0000 (UTC),
(Richard Sexton) wrote:

>In article >,
>~Roy~ > wrote:
>>So is 1971 the last date of a reprint for the Innes book then?
>>I know it used to be "The Bible " of fish keepers back in the late
>>60's.
>
>Nah, I think there's later versions. Keep in mind both TFH press
>and Metaframe (the company that bought Innes' Aquarium Magazine)
>publshed versions of it.
>
>That book is one he wrote and some would argue an extension of
>his earlier book on goldfish and ponds. That one was first
>published... are you siting down... in 1899. yes, EIGHTEEN
>ninety nine.
>
>While some of the facts are a litle obsolete (of course) the
>writing stpe is just something you don't see any more. That
>guy really had a way with words.

Funny. Just a week ago we were all discussing this book and no one had
a good word to say about it.

-- Mr Gardener

[Mr. Gardener]

On Sat, 25 Feb 2006 14:55:39 -0500, "NetMax"
> wrote:

>I only mentioned 66 & 71 because I have those two. Here is an auction
>link for what appears to be the 19th edition (which I think originated in
>56), and I don't see any other editions, just reprints.
>http://auctions.yahoo.com/auction/96365887
>
>Googling, I found reference http://www.alibris.com/home.cfm to
>1935 (2nd ed), 1944, 1945, 1946 (7th ed), 1948 (9th ed) 1949 (10th ed),
>1950, 1951(13th ed), 1952 (14th ed and 15th ed), 1953 (16th ed), 1954
>(17th ed), 1955 (18th ed), 1956 (19th ed), 1964, 1966, 1968, 1971, 1979.
>
>Gotta love the internet. Anyone have a 1st edition.. pre-1935?

That's the one. The one at the auction site. That's my old falling
apart version. After that, the book changed a lot. In quality, not
information. I see at Amazon that they are up to a 21st edition. 1994.
I wonder how much editing was really done, or would it be more
correctly called the 21st printing.
-- Mr Gardener

[Mr. Gardener]

On Sat, 25 Feb 2006 19:50:25 +0000 (UTC),
(Richard Sexton) wrote:

>In article >,
>NetMax > wrote:
>>If you want to talk about old books (Innes 1966 & reprint 1971) does
>>anyone else have the 1969 Axelrod/Schultz Handbook of Tropical Aquarium
>>Fishes? Dr.Schultz was curator of fishes at the Smithsonian Institute.
>>Unless it's a breeding question (then I go to a 1967 Axelrod/Shaw), the
>>69 Handbook is the first thing I reach for. Over 700 pages and I haven't
>>seen the cover since the early 70s (this one got hole-punched into a
>>binder, but most of my fish books just get their spines replaced with
>>duct tape ;~).
>
>Yeah, I've got that one (same spine) and most old books. I think that
>was Herbs first book; he used to clean cages and fish tanks in
>grad school. It's a grear book though.
>
>Other that are good for instructions onhow to breed almost anything
>is the Derek McInerny and Geofery Gerrard "All about tropical
>fish" book (although many many names are wrong) and for ID
>the Sterba "Freshwater fishes of the world" is quite good.
>
>That's what we used before the Baensch (?) atlas books were around, kids.

And that's what some of us still use who aren't ready to cough up the
$40 - $70 per volume of Baensch.

-- Mr Gardener

[Mr. Gardener]

On Sat, 25 Feb 2006 19:46:08 +0000 (UTC),
(Richard Sexton) wrote:

>In article >,
>~Roy~ > wrote:
>>The Dr. Innes book is a pretty good book to have. I do not know the
>>last edition of it they put out or if its even still available, but it
>>had just about everyhting youy needed to know in it. But processes
>>and equipment listed in the old editions are sure out of
>>date......but neat to look through just the same.
>
>And what have you got against coal gas heaters, mastic and
>rotary piston pumps? :-)

Piston pumps. Now those were for the Real Aquarium Pros. The next big
step up from the Silent Giant.

-- Mr Gardener

[Mr. Gardener]

On Sat, 25 Feb 2006 21:12:47 GMT, (~Roy~) wrote:

>Well I have nothing against them, but I have to be very thankfull for
>living on the grid and the advent of electric heaters, and the
>invention of silicone...just those two items revolutionized the
>aquarium world. I often wonder what an old timer such a Innes and
>others would think or how they would view todays equipment etc.

I'd like to think Innes would be cool with what we're doing today. He
was into techie stuff - piston pumps were cutting edge to him - he
described several technical devices he sort of designed that were
probably copied by thousands. Like his brine shrimp hatchery made of,
was it glass or plastic, had to have been glass, and was shaped like
an upside down pyramid.

-- Mr Gardener

[Steve]

~Roy~ wrote:
> The Dr. Innes book is a pretty good book to have. I do not know the
> last edition of it they put out or if its even still available, but it
> had just about everyhting youy needed to know in it. But processes
> and equipment listed in the old editions are sure out of
> date......but neat to look through just the same.
>

The copy I have was published in the 1960s by T.F.H. and printed in Hong
Kong. There's a foreword from W.T. Innes dated Feb 18, 1966 blessing the
re-issue of the book: "The first edition of my book 'Exotic Aquarium
Fishes' naturally gave me a very exciting experience, but as all
copyrights must, this one finally expired; but with additions of his
own, Dr. Herbert Axelrod is reprinting it herewith".

This may have been the last printing of the book, but it's of an early
edition and there were apparently later editions predating the T.F.H.
printing. It's a great book, but partly due to W.T. Innes I was long
ignorant of bilogical filtration and the aquarium cycle.

Steve

[Steve]

Steve wrote:
> ~Roy~ wrote:
>
>> The Dr. Innes book is a pretty good book to have. I do not know the
>> last edition of it they put out or if its even still available, but it
>> had just about everyhting youy needed to know in it. But processes
>> and equipment listed in the old editions are sure out of
>> date......but neat to look through just the same.
>>
>
> The copy I have was published in the 1960s by T.F.H. and printed in Hong
> Kong. There's a foreword from W.T. Innes dated Feb 18, 1966 blessing the
> re-issue of the book: "The first edition of my book 'Exotic Aquarium
> Fishes' naturally gave me a very exciting experience, but as all
> copyrights must, this one finally expired; but with additions of his
> own, Dr. Herbert Axelrod is reprinting it herewith".
>
> This may have been the last printing of the book, but it's of an early
> edition and there were apparently later editions predating the T.F.H.
> printing. It's a great book, but partly due to W.T. Innes I was long
> ignorant of bilogical filtration and the aquarium cycle.
>
> Steve

Following up on own posting :) . Those guys Innes and Axelrod sure were
influential on the hobby, weren't they? They had the neon and cardinal
tetras named after them, two of the most beautiful aquarium fish.
Steve

[jtill]

Scientific names are Latin derived, right? Latin spawned Spanish,
Spanish words are mostly pronounced two letters at a time till the end
then if there is three letters left you pronounce those three. There
are a few exceptions to this but not many. The emphasis is generally on
the second, fourth, sixth (and so on) pair. Corydoras would be
pronounced co RY do RAS. ae NE us, pa LE at US. This is close.
Joe
Baytown

[Mr. Gardener]

On Sat, 25 Feb 2006 18:04:14 -0500, Steve > wrote:

>Steve wrote:
>> ~Roy~ wrote:
>>
>>> The Dr. Innes book is a pretty good book to have. I do not know the
>>> last edition of it they put out or if its even still available, but it
>>> had just about everyhting youy needed to know in it. But processes
>>> and equipment listed in the old editions are sure out of
>>> date......but neat to look through just the same.
>>>
>>
>> The copy I have was published in the 1960s by T.F.H. and printed in Hong
>> Kong. There's a foreword from W.T. Innes dated Feb 18, 1966 blessing the
>> re-issue of the book: "The first edition of my book 'Exotic Aquarium
>> Fishes' naturally gave me a very exciting experience, but as all
>> copyrights must, this one finally expired; but with additions of his
>> own, Dr. Herbert Axelrod is reprinting it herewith".
>>
>> This may have been the last printing of the book, but it's of an early
>> edition and there were apparently later editions predating the T.F.H.
>> printing. It's a great book, but partly due to W.T. Innes I was long
>> ignorant of bilogical filtration and the aquarium cycle.
>>
>> Steve
>
>Following up on own posting :) . Those guys Innes and Axelrod sure were
>influential on the hobby, weren't they? They had the neon and cardinal
>tetras named after them, two of the most beautiful aquarium fish.
>Steve

Yes. Pioneers in the tradition of making a laughing stock out of
Linneus's scientific naming scheme. They weren't the first, I recall a
Reverend Guppy back there somewhere. Or was that Reverend Buddle, of
Buddleia fame? (Terrestrial Butterfly Bush) I thought science had put
a stop to that kind of naming. So how did KoiLo get a fish named after
her?

-- Mr Gardener

[Gill Passman]

Mr. Gardener wrote:
> On Sat, 25 Feb 2006 18:04:14 -0500, Steve > wrote:
>
>
>>Steve wrote:
>>
>>>~Roy~ wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>The Dr. Innes book is a pretty good book to have. I do not know the
>>>>last edition of it they put out or if its even still available, but it
>>>>had just about everyhting youy needed to know in it. But processes
>>>>and equipment listed in the old editions are sure out of
>>>>date......but neat to look through just the same.
>>>>
>>>
>>>The copy I have was published in the 1960s by T.F.H. and printed in Hong
>>>Kong. There's a foreword from W.T. Innes dated Feb 18, 1966 blessing the
>>>re-issue of the book: "The first edition of my book 'Exotic Aquarium
>>>Fishes' naturally gave me a very exciting experience, but as all
>>>copyrights must, this one finally expired; but with additions of his
>>>own, Dr. Herbert Axelrod is reprinting it herewith".
>>>
>>>This may have been the last printing of the book, but it's of an early
>>>edition and there were apparently later editions predating the T.F.H.
>>>printing. It's a great book, but partly due to W.T. Innes I was long
>>>ignorant of bilogical filtration and the aquarium cycle.
>>>
>>>Steve
>>
>>Following up on own posting :) . Those guys Innes and Axelrod sure were
>>influential on the hobby, weren't they? They had the neon and cardinal
>>tetras named after them, two of the most beautiful aquarium fish.
>>Steve
>
>
> Yes. Pioneers in the tradition of making a laughing stock out of
> Linneus's scientific naming scheme. They weren't the first, I recall a
> Reverend Guppy back there somewhere. Or was that Reverend Buddle, of
> Buddleia fame? (Terrestrial Butterfly Bush) I thought science had put
> a stop to that kind of naming. So how did KoiLo get a fish named after
> her?
>
> -- Mr Gardener

Yeah, but Buddleia are incredibly pretty irrespective of their
attraction to butterflies...I've never seen a picture of you yet - are
you pretty enough to attract these great insects??? (LOL - tongue in
cheek)...or are you the invasive weed that these things
become....questions, questions....I wish my brain would shut off (I am
just kidding you of course)

Now, why the Mr Gardener???? The only time I've come across this name,
with the exception of a rather obnoxious manager when I did my teenage
supermarket pocket money job, was Pride and Prejudice....he was the good
guy - do I detect aspirations here...or maybe you just love your garden
as I do....just wish I could defeat the dog's attempts on
destruction....also wish I had had more imagination when I signed up to
ngs...

Take care
Gill

[Mr. Gardener]

On Sun, 26 Feb 2006 00:37:10 +0000, Gill Passman
> wrote:

>Mr. Gardener wrote:
>> On Sat, 25 Feb 2006 18:04:14 -0500, Steve > wrote:
>>
>>
>>>Steve wrote:
>>>
>>>>~Roy~ wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>The Dr. Innes book is a pretty good book to have. I do not know the
>>>>>last edition of it they put out or if its even still available, but it
>>>>>had just about everyhting youy needed to know in it. But processes
>>>>>and equipment listed in the old editions are sure out of
>>>>>date......but neat to look through just the same.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>The copy I have was published in the 1960s by T.F.H. and printed in Hong
>>>>Kong. There's a foreword from W.T. Innes dated Feb 18, 1966 blessing the
>>>>re-issue of the book: "The first edition of my book 'Exotic Aquarium
>>>>Fishes' naturally gave me a very exciting experience, but as all
>>>>copyrights must, this one finally expired; but with additions of his
>>>>own, Dr. Herbert Axelrod is reprinting it herewith".
>>>>
>>>>This may have been the last printing of the book, but it's of an early
>>>>edition and there were apparently later editions predating the T.F.H.
>>>>printing. It's a great book, but partly due to W.T. Innes I was long
>>>>ignorant of bilogical filtration and the aquarium cycle.
>>>>
>>>>Steve
>>>
>>>Following up on own posting :) . Those guys Innes and Axelrod sure were
>>>influential on the hobby, weren't they? They had the neon and cardinal
>>>tetras named after them, two of the most beautiful aquarium fish.
>>>Steve
>>
>>
>> Yes. Pioneers in the tradition of making a laughing stock out of
>> Linneus's scientific naming scheme. They weren't the first, I recall a
>> Reverend Guppy back there somewhere. Or was that Reverend Buddle, of
>> Buddleia fame? (Terrestrial Butterfly Bush) I thought science had put
>> a stop to that kind of naming. So how did KoiLo get a fish named after
>> her?
>>
>> -- Mr Gardener
>
>Yeah, but Buddleia are incredibly pretty irrespective of their
>attraction to butterflies...I've never seen a picture of you yet - are
>you pretty enough to attract these great insects??? (LOL - tongue in
>cheek)...or are you the invasive weed that these things
>become....questions, questions....I wish my brain would shut off (I am
>just kidding you of course)
>
>Now, why the Mr Gardener???? The only time I've come across this name,
>with the exception of a rather obnoxious manager when I did my teenage
>supermarket pocket money job, was Pride and Prejudice....he was the good
>guy - do I detect aspirations here...or maybe you just love your garden
>as I do....just wish I could defeat the dog's attempts on
>destruction....also wish I had had more imagination when I signed up to
>ngs...
>
>Take care
>Gill

Yes, I am quite familiar with what has happened to Buddle's bush, and
concerned that we are doing the same to countless species, on land, in
the air, and in the water. And (shudder) to our food supply. Feel free
to contact me via email, in fact, please do, as I think we will veer
far off topic if we continue this here.

-- Mr Gardener
---- Zone 5 - Maine Coast
----- Ooops! Wrong Newsgroup -
------- This is about fish, right? Excellent fertilizer.

[Marco Schwarz]

Hi..

> I wonder if he was the original O-C.

[original O-C]
Google makes me crazy..
--
cu
Marco

[Mr. Gardener]

On Sun, 26 Feb 2006 20:13:31 +0100, Marco Schwarz
> wrote:

>Hi..
>
>> I wonder if he was the original O-C.
>
>[original O-C]
>Google makes me crazy..

Obsessive-Compulsive. Not Orange County.

-- Mr Gardener

[Richard Sexton]

In article >,
Mr. Gardener > wrote:
>On Sat, 25 Feb 2006 13:58:47 -0500, "NetMax"
> wrote:
>
>>If you want to talk about old books (Innes 1966 & reprint 1971) does
>>anyone else have the 1969 Axelrod/Schultz Handbook of Tropical Aquarium
>>Fishes? Dr.Schultz was curator of fishes at the Smithsonian Institute.
>>Unless it's a breeding question (then I go to a 1967 Axelrod/Shaw), the
>>69 Handbook is the first thing I reach for. Over 700 pages and I haven't
>>seen the cover since the early 70s (this one got hole-punched into a
>>binder, but most of my fish books just get their spines replaced with
>>duct tape ;~).
>
>I have the 66 Innes, but I bought it to replace a much older edition.
>It's around here somewhere, the cover is gone and so are the first
>several pages. It had a bright yellow cover, not glossy like the 66.
>It was given to me by my first supervisor during my introduction to
>the pet store trade - his name was Mr Loiselle. A stern fellow who was
>quickly losing his hair. Small world. Truthfully, I have no idea of
>his first name, superiors were Mister back in those days. One of these
>days I'll get around to doing a background check on Paul L, just in
>case.

The Yellow ones are published by Metaframe, the white ones are
TFH editions which I don't think are as good. Herb added stuff
that was just disatracting. You met Paul Loiselle? Way cool.


--
Need Mercedes parts ? - http://parts.mbz.org
Richard Sexton | Mercedes stuff: http://mbz.org
1970 280SE, 72 280SE | Home page: http://rs79.vrx.net
633CSi 250SE/C 300SD | http://aquaria.net http://killi.net

[Richard Sexton]

In article >,
~Roy~ > wrote:
>Well I have nothing against them, but I have to be very thankfull for
>living on the grid and the advent of electric heaters, and the
>invention of silicone...just those two items revolutionized the
>aquarium world. I often wonder what an old timer such a Innes and
>others would think or how they would view todays equipment etc.

Trivia question: who pioneered the use of silicone thereby
inventing the all glass aquarium?


--
Need Mercedes parts ? - http://parts.mbz.org
Richard Sexton | Mercedes stuff: http://mbz.org
1970 280SE, 72 280SE | Home page: http://rs79.vrx.net
633CSi 250SE/C 300SD | http://aquaria.net http://killi.net

[Richard Sexton]

In article >,
NetMax > wrote:
>I can't remember what was before electric heaters in their glass tubes,
>and I only vaguely remember slate bottom tanks,

You haven't been to enough garage sales. I have a couple of them
here.

--
Need Mercedes parts ? - http://parts.mbz.org
Richard Sexton | Mercedes stuff: http://mbz.org
1970 280SE, 72 280SE | Home page: http://rs79.vrx.net
633CSi 250SE/C 300SD | http://aquaria.net http://killi.net

[Richard Sexton]

In article >,
Steve > wrote:
>Following up on own posting :) . Those guys Innes and Axelrod sure were
>influential on the hobby, weren't they? They had the neon and cardinal
>tetras named after them, two of the most beautiful aquarium fish.

Yeah, but people LIKE Innes. Axelron claimed to have dicovered the
cardinal tetra and visions of waist high water in steamy tropical
jungles are evoked. Reality is he found them in a petshop in
New Jersey and rushed the scientific description of the species
in his own magazine, ****ing off the scientific world because it
was somehat lacking in throoughness.

On the other hand he gave a lot of money to the University of Guelph
up here for ichthyology. I talked to him by phone once, what a prick.

I've heard stories about him that would make Hunter Thompson
squeemish.

I've never heard anyone say anything bad about Innes. He was the
literal Gentleman and a scholar.


--
Need Mercedes parts ? - http://parts.mbz.org
Richard Sexton | Mercedes stuff: http://mbz.org
1970 280SE, 72 280SE | Home page: http://rs79.vrx.net
633CSi 250SE/C 300SD | http://aquaria.net http://killi.net

[Richard Sexton]

In article >,
Gill Passman > wrote:
>> Yes. Pioneers in the tradition of making a laughing stock out of
>> Linneus's scientific naming scheme. They weren't the first, I recall a
>> Reverend Guppy back there somewhere. Or was that Reverend Buddle, of
>> Buddleia fame? (Terrestrial Butterfly Bush) I thought science had put
>> a stop to that kind of naming. So how did KoiLo get a fish named after
>> her?
>>
>> -- Mr Gardener
>
>Yeah, but Buddleia are incredibly pretty irrespective of their
>attraction to butterflies...I've never seen a picture of you yet - are
>you pretty enough to attract these great insects??? (LOL - tongue in
>cheek)...or are you the invasive weed that these things
>become....questions, questions....I wish my brain would shut off (I am
>just kidding you of course)
>
>Now, why the Mr Gardener???? The only time I've come across this name,
>with the exception of a rather obnoxious manager when I did my teenage
>supermarket pocket money job, was Pride and Prejudice....he was the good
>guy - do I detect aspirations here...or maybe you just love your garden
>as I do....just wish I could defeat the dog's attempts on
>destruction....also wish I had had more imagination when I signed up to
>ngs...


You mean he's not the guy Aphyosemion gardneri is named after?


--
Need Mercedes parts ? - http://parts.mbz.org
Richard Sexton | Mercedes stuff: http://mbz.org
1970 280SE, 72 280SE | Home page: http://rs79.vrx.net
633CSi 250SE/C 300SD | http://aquaria.net http://killi.net

[Mr. Gardener]

On Mon, 27 Feb 2006 16:30:05 +0000 (UTC),
(Richard Sexton) wrote:

>In article >,
>Mr. Gardener > wrote:
>>On Sat, 25 Feb 2006 13:58:47 -0500, "NetMax"
> wrote:
>>
>>>If you want to talk about old books (Innes 1966 & reprint 1971) does
>>>anyone else have the 1969 Axelrod/Schultz Handbook of Tropical Aquarium
>>>Fishes? Dr.Schultz was curator of fishes at the Smithsonian Institute.
>>>Unless it's a breeding question (then I go to a 1967 Axelrod/Shaw), the
>>>69 Handbook is the first thing I reach for. Over 700 pages and I haven't
>>>seen the cover since the early 70s (this one got hole-punched into a
>>>binder, but most of my fish books just get their spines replaced with
>>>duct tape ;~).
>>
>>I have the 66 Innes, but I bought it to replace a much older edition.
>>It's around here somewhere, the cover is gone and so are the first
>>several pages. It had a bright yellow cover, not glossy like the 66.
>>It was given to me by my first supervisor during my introduction to
>>the pet store trade - his name was Mr Loiselle. A stern fellow who was
>>quickly losing his hair. Small world. Truthfully, I have no idea of
>>his first name, superiors were Mister back in those days. One of these
>>days I'll get around to doing a background check on Paul L, just in
>>case.
>
>The Yellow ones are published by Metaframe, the white ones are
>TFH editions which I don't think are as good. Herb added stuff
>that was just disatracting. You met Paul Loiselle? Way cool.

Yeah, I think it's the same guy. Got fired by him too. Jobs were easy
come, easy go in the booming economy of the sixties.

-- Mr Gardener

[Mr. Gardener]

On Mon, 27 Feb 2006 16:40:12 +0000 (UTC),
(Richard Sexton) wrote:

>In article >,
>NetMax > wrote:
>>I can't remember what was before electric heaters in their glass tubes,
>>and I only vaguely remember slate bottom tanks,
>
>You haven't been to enough garage sales. I have a couple of them
>here.

I think I've given away all of my slate bottom stainless framed tanks
to kids for their gerbils and science projects. When new frameless
tanks were going for less than a dollar a gallon, I never got
motivated to recaulk the old ones. I'm about to list with Freecycle in
my area for unwanted tanks. Who knows, maybe I'll find a genuine iron
framed wonder. That would be like an antique.

-- Mr Gardener

[Richard Sexton]

In article >,
Mr. Gardener > wrote:
>I think I've given away all of my slate bottom stainless framed tanks
>to kids for their gerbils and science projects. When new frameless
>tanks were going for less than a dollar a gallon, I never got
>motivated to recaulk the old ones. I'm about to list with Freecycle in
>my area for unwanted tanks. Who knows, maybe I'll find a genuine iron
>framed wonder. That would be like an antique.

I had one asa kid, just angle iron wihtblack pint and white
spider web effects on it. The reallycool ones are the only
Victorian ironones. Very very expensive, like $1200 for
a 2 gal tank, last time I saw one in the 70s.

--
Need Mercedes parts ? - http://parts.mbz.org
Richard Sexton | Mercedes stuff: http://mbz.org
1970 280SE, 72 280SE | Home page: http://rs79.vrx.net
633CSi 250SE/C 300SD | http://aquaria.net http://killi.net

[NetMax]

"Richard Sexton" > wrote in message
...
> In article >,
> ~Roy~ > wrote:
>>Well I have nothing against them, but I have to be very thankfull for
>>living on the grid and the advent of electric heaters, and the
>>invention of silicone...just those two items revolutionized the
>>aquarium world. I often wonder what an old timer such a Innes and
>>others would think or how they would view todays equipment etc.
>
> Trivia question: who pioneered the use of silicone thereby
> inventing the all glass aquarium?
>
>
> --
> Need Mercedes parts ? - http://parts.mbz.org
> Richard Sexton | Mercedes stuff: http://mbz.org


J.Franklin Hyde 1903-1999
http://www.invent.org/hall_of_fame/83.html
--
www.NetMax.tk

[Marco Schwarz]

Hi..

> I can't remember what was before electric heaters in their
> glass tubes,

Heat resistant glass cylinders higher than the tank with a
plumbed bottom. These cylinders stood in the tank. Inside
enough space for a tiny paraffin (kerosene) lamp. These
lamps had a "stovepipe" to emit the smoke, a lid (reflector
shield) to keep the warmth inside the cylinder and a thin
glass tube to transport fresh air from outside the tank to
the bottom of the cylinder (near the small flame).

Several underfloor heating systems, too.

--
cu
Marco

[Mr. Gardener]

On Mon, 27 Feb 2006 21:22:06 +0100, Marco Schwarz
> wrote:

>Hi..
>
>> I can't remember what was before electric heaters in their
>> glass tubes,
>
>Heat resistant glass cylinders higher than the tank with a
>plumbed bottom. These cylinders stood in the tank. Inside
>enough space for a tiny paraffin (kerosene) lamp. These
>lamps had a "stovepipe" to emit the smoke, a lid (reflector
>shield) to keep the warmth inside the cylinder and a thin
>glass tube to transport fresh air from outside the tank to
>the bottom of the cylinder (near the small flame).
>
>Several underfloor heating systems, too.

Fascinating. There's a lot of fishkeeping history just waiting to be
published. Or re-published. I'm finding myself flipping to the history
column first thing when I pick up a new issure of FAMA. There's one
corner where FAMA has a leg up on TFH. At least for this reader.

-- Mr Gardener

[Tedd Jacobs]

"NetMax" wrote...
> "Richard Sexton" wrote...
[...]
>> Trivia question: who pioneered the use of silicone thereby
>> inventing the all glass aquarium?
[..]
>
> J.Franklin Hyde 1903-1999
> http://www.invent.org/hall_of_fame/83.html

ah, but who developed the first sustainable glass aquarium? (hint: this was
before silicone)

[Koi-Lo]

"Richard Sexton" > wrote in message
...
>>I have the 66 Innes, but I bought it to replace a much older edition.
=============
That's the one I have, (19th edition revised) copyrighted by the Metaframe
Corp. It was my bible for years.

Koi-Lo.......

[NetMax]

"Marco Schwarz" > wrote in message
...
> Hi..
>
>> I can't remember what was before electric heaters in their
>> glass tubes,
>
> Heat resistant glass cylinders higher than the tank with a
> plumbed bottom. These cylinders stood in the tank. Inside
> enough space for a tiny paraffin (kerosene) lamp. These
> lamps had a "stovepipe" to emit the smoke, a lid (reflector
> shield) to keep the warmth inside the cylinder and a thin
> glass tube to transport fresh air from outside the tank to
> the bottom of the cylinder (near the small flame).
>
> Several underfloor heating systems, too.
>
> --
> cu
> Marco

Yes, fascinating. Anyone else, and I might have thought this was
fiction. There was quite a lot more work involved to fish tanks in those
days.
--
www.NetMax.tk

[~Roy~]

Yep, kerosene hearers were used, along the lines of what they used ot
artificially incubate poultry eggs before the advent of the heating
elements commonly used today. I have an old kerosene heated incubator
(antique to say the least) but have never used it, its just a curio
for the most part now, since our 20+ year adventure into raising
poultry.

I guess with perserverence, you could probbaly get to know the old
style aquarium heaters, and probably know its in and outs to maintaian
decent required temps. They did it with poultry eggs and kero heaters,
so I would think it oculd also be 100% doable in fish keeping. I
wonder how many folks would be into keeping fish if things did not get
to the point they are today, in regards to the heaters, l ights,
filtration and store bought feeds? I bet gathering and keeping feed
alone was also another big chore.

On Mon, 27 Feb 2006 22:37:20 -0500, "NetMax"
> wrote:
>><>"Marco Schwarz" > wrote in message
...
>><>> Hi..
>><>>
>><>>> I can't remember what was before electric heaters in their
>><>>> glass tubes,
>><>>
>><>> Heat resistant glass cylinders higher than the tank with a
>><>> plumbed bottom. These cylinders stood in the tank. Inside
>><>> enough space for a tiny paraffin (kerosene) lamp. These
>><>> lamps had a "stovepipe" to emit the smoke, a lid (reflector
>><>> shield) to keep the warmth inside the cylinder and a thin
>><>> glass tube to transport fresh air from outside the tank to
>><>> the bottom of the cylinder (near the small flame).
>><>>
>><>> Several underfloor heating systems, too.
>><>>
>><>> --
>><>> cu
>><>> Marco
>><>
>><>Yes, fascinating. Anyone else, and I might have thought this was
>><>fiction. There was quite a lot more work involved to fish tanks in those
>><>days.

--
\\\|///
( @ @ )
-----------oOOo(_)oOOo---------------


oooO
---------( )----Oooo----------------
\ ( ( )
\_) ) /
(_/
The original frugal ponder ! Koi-ahoi mates....

[Richard Sexton]

In article >,
NetMax > wrote:
>"Richard Sexton" > wrote in message
...
>> In article >,
>> ~Roy~ > wrote:
>>>Well I have nothing against them, but I have to be very thankfull for
>>>living on the grid and the advent of electric heaters, and the
>>>invention of silicone...just those two items revolutionized the
>>>aquarium world. I often wonder what an old timer such a Innes and
>>>others would think or how they would view todays equipment etc.
>>
>> Trivia question: who pioneered the use of silicone thereby
>> inventing the all glass aquarium?
>>
>>
>> --
>> Need Mercedes parts ? - http://parts.mbz.org
>> Richard Sexton | Mercedes stuff: http://mbz.org
>
>
>J.Franklin Hyde 1903-1999
>http://www.invent.org/hall_of_fame/83.html

Nope, that's silica glass, the stuf that's very high temperature
tolerant as used in kiln windows and the corning "visions" glass
cookware.

Silicone sealant was first used by Robert P. L. Straugn in his
book "The salt water aquarium in the home" in the 1960s. The
bigest problem back then in the very young marine aquarium hobby
was the sal****er eventually coming in contact with the metal
frame in tanks.

He tried to build all glass tanks, and the closest he could get
was expoy but it didn't really work. Then he tried the then new
silicone sealer and it worked. The rest is history.

--
Need Mercedes parts ? - http://parts.mbz.org
Richard Sexton | Mercedes stuff: http://mbz.org
1970 280SE, 72 280SE | Home page: http://rs79.vrx.net
633CSi 250SE/C 300SD | http://aquaria.net http://killi.net

[Thomas Edward Stosterone]

On Mon, 27 Feb 2006 16:39:04 +0000 (UTC),
(Richard Sexton) wrote:

>In article >,
>~Roy~ > wrote:
>>Well I have nothing against them, but I have to be very thankfull for
>>living on the grid and the advent of electric heaters, and the
>>invention of silicone...just those two items revolutionized the
>>aquarium world. I often wonder what an old timer such a Innes and
>>others would think or how they would view todays equipment etc.
>
>Trivia question: who pioneered the use of silicone thereby
>inventing the all glass aquarium?

Pamela Anderson?