Also having algae problems - new tank

[Dieter Kedrowitsch]

It seems I am one of a couple people having this problem lately. My
tank is about a month old. Not done cycling yet (chem is 78 deg,
1.025 spec grav, pH 8.2, Nitrates 15ppm, ammonia .25 ppm, nitrites
..25ppm phosphates 0). 75 AGA w CBR overflow, 10 gal sump, mag 9.5
return pump, Berlin Turbo skimmer, lighting = 2x 175 mh 5500K, 2x 40w
T12 6500K. I have a 4" (200lb) DSB of Southdown with 20lbs of
slightly courser aragonite "live sand" from my LFS to help prevent
sand storms until the Southdown sand ages. Have not done water change
yet, waiting for ammonia and nitrites to drop to 0. Adding about 2
gal/day due to evaporation (heavily air conditioned apartment with 2
powerful fans keeping lights cool blowing dry air over water surface.
I like the room @66 deg). I do not have an RO/DI unit because I don't
have any room to store water near the sink. I have well water that
appears to be very clean and tests 0 phosphates with a "Doc Wellfish"
phosphate test. Not sure about silicates as I don't have a TDS meter
yet and don't know of any other way to test for them.

I can't tell what kind of algae it is. It's reddish-brown in color
and will cover everything if not cleaned every day. Water circulation
does not seem to help very much. It starts as a brown dot then grows
into a tiny brown fuzzy stalk that eventually gets a bubble at the tip
(O2?). Some pieces eventually come free and float around and collect
on the surface where it is skimmed off by the overflow box. I have
also noticed when I clean the glass I get a clearish slimy "skin" that
seems to be covering the glass. It is starting to cover my single
piece of live rock and is getting on the power heads and glass. I
have 3 yellow tail blue damsels that will pick at it very little if I
don't feed them every day as I'm trying to feed very little until the
cycle _finally_ finishes. I was told that blue legged hermits and
"turbo" snails should gobble it up on the substrate and my live rock
piece, but until the ammonia and nitrite drops, I am afraid to add
anything more to my bioload and I don't want to needlessly kill
anything.

Can anyone identify this algae? My guess is diatoms because it's not
really "red" like the description of red algae. But this is my first
SW tank so I don't know what I'm looking at yet. :) Any help would be
greatly appreciated!!

Thanks!

Dieter Kedrowitsch

[CapFusion]

Does it look like this -
http://saltaquarium.about.com/cs/aboutjanitors/a/aa043099_2.htm

- Bring your well water to your LFS for test.
- Get TDS meter.
- Depending on your Well Water result from your LFS. You may need to get a
RO/DI or to purchase filter water from vending machine or similar.
- Stop feeding your tank.
- Keep Protien Skimmer running to remove anything that it can skim out.
- Keep on checking your water parameter until it show undetectable of A/N/N.
- Do not add any live critter unless they are hitchhiker. Can not help those
critter that hitchhiker. This is an good example to human that hitchhike.
You will never know where you end up.

Use pure water to do water changes to dilute and cycle the water faster to
remove unwant nutrient / waste / debris and other unwanted stuff. You can do
without water changes but take abit loonger.

CapFusion,...

"Dieter Kedrowitsch" > wrote in message
om...
> It seems I am one of a couple people having this problem lately. My
> tank is about a month old. Not done cycling yet (chem is 78 deg,
> 1.025 spec grav, pH 8.2, Nitrates 15ppm, ammonia .25 ppm, nitrites
> .25ppm phosphates 0). 75 AGA w CBR overflow, 10 gal sump, mag 9.5
> return pump, Berlin Turbo skimmer, lighting = 2x 175 mh 5500K, 2x 40w
> T12 6500K. I have a 4" (200lb) DSB of Southdown with 20lbs of
> slightly courser aragonite "live sand" from my LFS to help prevent
> sand storms until the Southdown sand ages. Have not done water change
> yet, waiting for ammonia and nitrites to drop to 0. Adding about 2
> gal/day due to evaporation (heavily air conditioned apartment with 2
> powerful fans keeping lights cool blowing dry air over water surface.
> I like the room @66 deg). I do not have an RO/DI unit because I don't
> have any room to store water near the sink. I have well water that
> appears to be very clean and tests 0 phosphates with a "Doc Wellfish"
> phosphate test. Not sure about silicates as I don't have a TDS meter
> yet and don't know of any other way to test for them.
>
> I can't tell what kind of algae it is. It's reddish-brown in color
> and will cover everything if not cleaned every day. Water circulation
> does not seem to help very much. It starts as a brown dot then grows
> into a tiny brown fuzzy stalk that eventually gets a bubble at the tip
> (O2?). Some pieces eventually come free and float around and collect
> on the surface where it is skimmed off by the overflow box. I have
> also noticed when I clean the glass I get a clearish slimy "skin" that
> seems to be covering the glass. It is starting to cover my single
> piece of live rock and is getting on the power heads and glass. I
> have 3 yellow tail blue damsels that will pick at it very little if I
> don't feed them every day as I'm trying to feed very little until the
> cycle _finally_ finishes. I was told that blue legged hermits and
> "turbo" snails should gobble it up on the substrate and my live rock
> piece, but until the ammonia and nitrite drops, I am afraid to add
> anything more to my bioload and I don't want to needlessly kill
> anything.
>
> Can anyone identify this algae? My guess is diatoms because it's not
> really "red" like the description of red algae. But this is my first
> SW tank so I don't know what I'm looking at yet. :) Any help would be
> greatly appreciated!!
>
> Thanks!
>
> Dieter Kedrowitsch

[AAAAAAAAAAAAAlias]

"Dieter Kedrowitsch" > wrote in message >
really "red" like the description of red algae. But this is my first
> SW tank so I don't know what I'm looking at yet. :) Any help would be
> greatly appreciated!!

Hook up a UV sterilizer. You're going to want one sooner or later. :)

[Richard Reynolds]

> Hook up a UV sterilizer. You're going to want one sooner or later. :)

or not they do little for parasites and kill much wanted plankton!

--
Richard Reynolds

[Marc Levenson]

Sounds like Cyano to me.

http://melevsreef.com/id/cyano.html

Keep siphoning out any that you can see and reach with airline tubing to reduce
the amount of it in your tank. It is normal in a cycling tank, but can be a
real nuisance. Keep your skimmer running, and if you can, improve circulation
with another powerhead or by changing the direction of flow with your current
powerheads.

Marc


Dieter Kedrowitsch wrote:

> It seems I am one of a couple people having this problem lately. My
> tank is about a month old. Not done cycling yet (chem is 78 deg,
> 1.025 spec grav, pH 8.2, Nitrates 15ppm, ammonia .25 ppm, nitrites
> .25ppm phosphates 0). 75 AGA w CBR overflow, 10 gal sump, mag 9.5
> return pump, Berlin Turbo skimmer, lighting = 2x 175 mh 5500K, 2x 40w
> T12 6500K. I have a 4" (200lb) DSB of Southdown with 20lbs of
> slightly courser aragonite "live sand" from my LFS to help prevent
> sand storms until the Southdown sand ages. Have not done water change
> yet, waiting for ammonia and nitrites to drop to 0. Adding about 2
> gal/day due to evaporation (heavily air conditioned apartment with 2
> powerful fans keeping lights cool blowing dry air over water surface.
> I like the room @66 deg). I do not have an RO/DI unit because I don't
> have any room to store water near the sink. I have well water that
> appears to be very clean and tests 0 phosphates with a "Doc Wellfish"
> phosphate test. Not sure about silicates as I don't have a TDS meter
> yet and don't know of any other way to test for them.
>
> I can't tell what kind of algae it is. It's reddish-brown in color
> and will cover everything if not cleaned every day. Water circulation
> does not seem to help very much. It starts as a brown dot then grows
> into a tiny brown fuzzy stalk that eventually gets a bubble at the tip
> (O2?). Some pieces eventually come free and float around and collect
> on the surface where it is skimmed off by the overflow box. I have
> also noticed when I clean the glass I get a clearish slimy "skin" that
> seems to be covering the glass. It is starting to cover my single
> piece of live rock and is getting on the power heads and glass. I
> have 3 yellow tail blue damsels that will pick at it very little if I
> don't feed them every day as I'm trying to feed very little until the
> cycle _finally_ finishes. I was told that blue legged hermits and
> "turbo" snails should gobble it up on the substrate and my live rock
> piece, but until the ammonia and nitrite drops, I am afraid to add
> anything more to my bioload and I don't want to needlessly kill
> anything.
>
> Can anyone identify this algae? My guess is diatoms because it's not
> really "red" like the description of red algae. But this is my first
> SW tank so I don't know what I'm looking at yet. :) Any help would be
> greatly appreciated!!
>
> Thanks!
>
> Dieter Kedrowitsch

--
Personal Page: http://www.sparklingfloorservice.com/oanda/index.html
Business Page: http://www.sparklingfloorservice.com
Marine Hobbyist: http://www.melevsreef.com

[Simon O'Keeffe]

A UV sterilizer is a waste of money and many would say bad for the reef.
Also I'd not test the well water with a TDS meter. I'd just use some
very nice nitrate tests and phosphate tests.
It will probably contain large amounts of calcium but this is good.
A TDS meter will also pick up good things like calcium so it;s not
really an indication of the usability of your well water.
Simon

AAAAAAAAAAAAAlias wrote:

>"Dieter Kedrowitsch" > wrote in message >
>really "red" like the description of red algae. But this is my first
>
>
>>SW tank so I don't know what I'm looking at yet. :) Any help would be
>>greatly appreciated!!
>>
>>
>
>Hook up a UV sterilizer. You're going to want one sooner or later. :)
>
>
>
>

[skozzy]

I would guess you are using all your lights too, cut back big time on your
lighting for now untill the cycle is complete, maybe only have it on when
your at home, this can help a bit if the algae uses light to grow, if your
live rock has corals attached then expect a fair bit of die off in the early
stages, this will also add to problems with water quality too, be expecting
lots of ups and downs with all sorts of breakouts for a few months.

Clean what you can of it. I prefer not to use fish to start off the cycling
and use ammonia instead, plus add some bacteria to your filters, something
like the brand cycle or if your LFS sell live bacteria cultures.

The fastest I have done with a mate in getting a tank running from scratch
is to not use live rock at the start, but setup the pumps and filter, then
share filter media and add bacteria or cycle and put in several drops of
ammonia untill the max test kit limit is reached, around a week the ammonia
levels will drop, another few days the levels will be gone (my experiance).
Keep swapping filter media with a mate every few days, you don't need a lot.

Once the ammonia and nitrites are low to none then add your rock(s), and if
your filter has settled and you can't wait then add a little fish or two.

Feeding is another problem for you at this stage, attract a fish with one or
two flakes, if it comes for it and eats it then add a few flakes per fish
when ever your at the tank, this way you won't have excess food in the tank
and your phosphates should stay low. I had major phosphate problems cause I
was being too kind to the fish.

If you run down the same path I did on your first startup, you will end up
with a tank full of dead stuff, a bad smell, high phosphates, and a major
headache of cleaning it all up and starting a 2nd time.



"Dieter Kedrowitsch" > wrote in message
om...
> It seems I am one of a couple people having this problem lately. My
> tank is about a month old. Not done cycling yet (chem is 78 deg,
> 1.025 spec grav, pH 8.2, Nitrates 15ppm, ammonia .25 ppm, nitrites
> .25ppm phosphates 0). 75 AGA w CBR overflow, 10 gal sump, mag 9.5
> return pump, Berlin Turbo skimmer, lighting = 2x 175 mh 5500K, 2x 40w
> T12 6500K. I have a 4" (200lb) DSB of Southdown with 20lbs of
> slightly courser aragonite "live sand" from my LFS to help prevent
> sand storms until the Southdown sand ages. Have not done water change
> yet, waiting for ammonia and nitrites to drop to 0. Adding about 2
> gal/day due to evaporation (heavily air conditioned apartment with 2
> powerful fans keeping lights cool blowing dry air over water surface.
> I like the room @66 deg). I do not have an RO/DI unit because I don't
> have any room to store water near the sink. I have well water that
> appears to be very clean and tests 0 phosphates with a "Doc Wellfish"
> phosphate test. Not sure about silicates as I don't have a TDS meter
> yet and don't know of any other way to test for them.
>
> I can't tell what kind of algae it is. It's reddish-brown in color
> and will cover everything if not cleaned every day. Water circulation
> does not seem to help very much. It starts as a brown dot then grows
> into a tiny brown fuzzy stalk that eventually gets a bubble at the tip
> (O2?). Some pieces eventually come free and float around and collect
> on the surface where it is skimmed off by the overflow box. I have
> also noticed when I clean the glass I get a clearish slimy "skin" that
> seems to be covering the glass. It is starting to cover my single
> piece of live rock and is getting on the power heads and glass. I
> have 3 yellow tail blue damsels that will pick at it very little if I
> don't feed them every day as I'm trying to feed very little until the
> cycle _finally_ finishes. I was told that blue legged hermits and
> "turbo" snails should gobble it up on the substrate and my live rock
> piece, but until the ammonia and nitrite drops, I am afraid to add
> anything more to my bioload and I don't want to needlessly kill
> anything.
>
> Can anyone identify this algae? My guess is diatoms because it's not
> really "red" like the description of red algae. But this is my first
> SW tank so I don't know what I'm looking at yet. :) Any help would be
> greatly appreciated!!
>
> Thanks!
>
> Dieter Kedrowitsch

[Dieter Kedrowitsch]

Hey Marc, thanks for that. Great site BTW, your 55 simply rocks. I
plan to build a sump just like that very soon. The 10 gal is way too
small.

Anyway abt the algae, every picture I see shows it to look dark
red/maroon. Mine is very brown and maybe _slightly_ redish. And the
pictures on the internet and your site look like slime where mine
looks like little stalks growing on the sand grains....and it's more
of a brown fuzzy algae on the live rock. It's also covering the macro
algae and if I don't keep wiping it off I'm afraid it will eventually
kill it.

I will add another powerhead or two this weekend.

I just ran a nitrate test on my well water and I read about 20ppm
right out of the sink. :( Great. I also tested for phosphates but
luckily that was 0. I guess I need to get a new RO/DI kit as soon as
I have the money. I just moved when I set this tank up a month ago so
I'm trying to recover before I spend any more. Maybe by the end of
the month I can order one. Any brand suggestions? Marine Depot sells
a bunch of different ones and they all seem to be about the same thing
for around the same price.

My A/N/N is about .5/.25/15. The Ammonia and Nitrite never seemed to
climb past 1ppm during the cycle while I read it could spike many
times higher then that. The nitrate started out at 20ppm but now I
know it came that way out of the well. I'm guessing the algae is the
cause of the .05ppm drop. The bioload is 3 yellow tail blue damsels
and one piece of 7lb live rock w/a bunch of brown/yellow-ish button
polyps and a single feather duster(I think). The polyps and feather
duster look great so I wonder if my cycle is over and the test kit is
wrong. The nitrite kit claims is for fresh/sal****er and the ammonia
kit doesn't say. Perhaps I should get a better kit specifically for
marine purposes...


Marc Levenson > wrote in message >...
> Sounds like Cyano to me.
>
> http://melevsreef.com/id/cyano.html
>
> Keep siphoning out any that you can see and reach with airline tubing to reduce
> the amount of it in your tank. It is normal in a cycling tank, but can be a
> real nuisance. Keep your skimmer running, and if you can, improve circulation
> with another powerhead or by changing the direction of flow with your current
> powerheads.
>
> Marc

[CapFusion]

"Simon O'Keeffe" > wrote in message
...
> A UV sterilizer is a waste of money and many would say bad for the reef.
> Also I'd not test the well water with a TDS meter. I'd just use some
> very nice nitrate tests and phosphate tests.
> It will probably contain large amounts of calcium but this is good.
> A TDS meter will also pick up good things like calcium so it;s not
> really an indication of the usability of your well water.
> Simon


Simon and the rest of the gang with GOOD well water. This can be debatable.
The reason for the TDS to detect from source [well / municipal / whatever
going into your house] is to remove any possibilities. When I say remove, I
mean remove the bad AND the good stuff. That is the reason to suggest TDS.
TDS does not know anything from bad or good ion +- charges beside the
neutral. The point or the main idea is to get as PURE as POSSIBLE water to
YOU. Then you can do whatever you want with it. You then know what or
suppose to be in your water before you put into your tank. Either way, TDS
is one of the basic tool in SW / Reef tank beside chemical / med / dosing
trace element.

Summing up the general idea:
Get PUREST water, if possible. [Build a foundation]
Then add what you think you need to the water. [Add whatever you want on
that foundation]

Regarding AAAAAAAAAAAAAlias must be from FW.

CapFusion,....

[CapFusion]

"Dieter Kedrowitsch" > wrote in message
om...
> I just ran a nitrate test on my well water and I read about 20ppm
> right out of the sink. :( Great. I also tested for phosphates but
> luckily that was 0. I guess I need to get a new RO/DI kit as soon as
> I have the money. I just moved when I set this tank up a month ago so
> I'm trying to recover before I spend any more. Maybe by the end of
> the month I can order one. Any brand suggestions? Marine Depot sells
> a bunch of different ones and they all seem to be about the same thing
> for around the same price.
>

20ppm nitrate will feed your algae. You can order one from Marc or lookup in
EBay for a real cheapo kind.


> My A/N/N is about .5/.25/15. The Ammonia and Nitrite never seemed to
> climb past 1ppm during the cycle while I read it could spike many
> times higher then that. The nitrate started out at 20ppm but now I
> know it came that way out of the well. I'm guessing the algae is the
> cause of the .05ppm drop. The bioload is 3 yellow tail blue damsels
> and one piece of 7lb live rock w/a bunch of brown/yellow-ish button
> polyps and a single feather duster(I think). The polyps and feather
> duster look great so I wonder if my cycle is over and the test kit is
> wrong. The nitrite kit claims is for fresh/sal****er and the ammonia
> kit doesn't say. Perhaps I should get a better kit specifically for
> marine purposes...

You will need to wait for your imbalance water to settle down. Have your LFS
to test for verification if your kit on par with them.

CapFusion,...

[Marc Levenson]

If you have any ammonia and nitrite testing above 0, the tank is still cycling. Time will
resolve that one, and strange algaes do come and go during the cycle.

I offer a 100gpd 5-stage unit on my site.
http://www.melevsreef.com/ro_di.html

Marc


Dieter Kedrowitsch wrote:

> Hey Marc, thanks for that. Great site BTW, your 55 simply rocks. I
> plan to build a sump just like that very soon. The 10 gal is way too
> small.
>
> Anyway abt the algae, every picture I see shows it to look dark
> red/maroon. Mine is very brown and maybe _slightly_ redish. And the
> pictures on the internet and your site look like slime where mine
> looks like little stalks growing on the sand grains....and it's more
> of a brown fuzzy algae on the live rock. It's also covering the macro
> algae and if I don't keep wiping it off I'm afraid it will eventually
> kill it.
>
> I will add another powerhead or two this weekend.
>
> I just ran a nitrate test on my well water and I read about 20ppm
> right out of the sink. :( Great. I also tested for phosphates but
> luckily that was 0. I guess I need to get a new RO/DI kit as soon as
> I have the money. I just moved when I set this tank up a month ago so
> I'm trying to recover before I spend any more. Maybe by the end of
> the month I can order one. Any brand suggestions? Marine Depot sells
> a bunch of different ones and they all seem to be about the same thing
> for around the same price.
>
> My A/N/N is about .5/.25/15. The Ammonia and Nitrite never seemed to
> climb past 1ppm during the cycle while I read it could spike many
> times higher then that. The nitrate started out at 20ppm but now I
> know it came that way out of the well. I'm guessing the algae is the
> cause of the .05ppm drop. The bioload is 3 yellow tail blue damsels
> and one piece of 7lb live rock w/a bunch of brown/yellow-ish button
> polyps and a single feather duster(I think). The polyps and feather
> duster look great so I wonder if my cycle is over and the test kit is
> wrong. The nitrite kit claims is for fresh/sal****er and the ammonia
> kit doesn't say. Perhaps I should get a better kit specifically for
> marine purposes...
>
> Marc Levenson > wrote in message >...
> > Sounds like Cyano to me.
> >
> > http://melevsreef.com/id/cyano.html
> >
> > Keep siphoning out any that you can see and reach with airline tubing to reduce
> > the amount of it in your tank. It is normal in a cycling tank, but can be a
> > real nuisance. Keep your skimmer running, and if you can, improve circulation
> > with another powerhead or by changing the direction of flow with your current
> > powerheads.
> >
> > Marc

--
Personal Page: http://www.sparklingfloorservice.com/oanda/index.html
Business Page: http://www.sparklingfloorservice.com
Marine Hobbyist: http://www.melevsreef.com

[Dieter Kedrowitsch]

Marc, your RO/DI units look great and seem to be by far the best buy
for the money compared to other places I've been looking at. You will
be hearing from me in a week or two…I want to buy one. 

Actually over the past couple days I've noticed the cayno seems to be
getting slightly less, so that is a good sign. I have lots of bubbles
that build up in the sand around the edge of the tank that I can see
through the glass. Is this the bacteria starting to do it's thing?
I've never seen such a thing in my FW tanks.

I have also noticed that for once, my skimmer is _finally_ starting to
skim some nasty dark brown/green stuff out of the water. Normally it
would only occasionally skim off a light colored foam. I guess things
are starting to come together slowly. The skimmer doesn't like the
changing water level in my sump, but because my sump is only a 10 gal
tank and I fit the skimmer, skimmer "turbo" pump, mag 9.5 return pump,
802 powerhead used to keep the CPR overflow primed, and 200w heater I
don't have any room left to put a divider wall in the sump to keep the
water level constant on the inlet/skimmer side of the sump I just add
water every day to try to keep it within an inch or two of it's normal
level.

I am planning to build a sump very similar to the one you have under
your 55, only slightly deeper to take advantage of the deeper stand
holding my 75 gal. Actually I may start as early as next weekend as I
have a friend visiting who is very good with a table saw. 

Thanks again!


Marc Levenson > wrote in message >...
> If you have any ammonia and nitrite testing above 0, the tank is still cycling. Time will
> resolve that one, and strange algaes do come and go during the cycle.
>
> I offer a 100gpd 5-stage unit on my site.
> http://www.melevsreef.com/ro_di.html
>
> Marc

[Marc Levenson]

If you were to set up an auto-top off in your current sump, you could stabilize that water level
so your skimmer runs well consistently.

The small bubbles are nitrogen gas, which are good. They rise and pop and take nitrates right
out of your system. :)

Good luck on your new sump!

Marc


Dieter Kedrowitsch wrote:

> Marc, your RO/DI units look great and seem to be by far the best buy
> for the money compared to other places I've been looking at. You will
> be hearing from me in a week or two…I want to buy one. 
>
> Actually over the past couple days I've noticed the cayno seems to be
> getting slightly less, so that is a good sign. I have lots of bubbles
> that build up in the sand around the edge of the tank that I can see
> through the glass. Is this the bacteria starting to do it's thing?
> I've never seen such a thing in my FW tanks.
>
> I have also noticed that for once, my skimmer is _finally_ starting to
> skim some nasty dark brown/green stuff out of the water. Normally it
> would only occasionally skim off a light colored foam. I guess things
> are starting to come together slowly. The skimmer doesn't like the
> changing water level in my sump, but because my sump is only a 10 gal
> tank and I fit the skimmer, skimmer "turbo" pump, mag 9.5 return pump,
> 802 powerhead used to keep the CPR overflow primed, and 200w heater I
> don't have any room left to put a divider wall in the sump to keep the
> water level constant on the inlet/skimmer side of the sump I just add
> water every day to try to keep it within an inch or two of it's normal
> level.
>
> I am planning to build a sump very similar to the one you have under
> your 55, only slightly deeper to take advantage of the deeper stand
> holding my 75 gal. Actually I may start as early as next weekend as I
> have a friend visiting who is very good with a table saw. 
>
> Thanks again!
>
> Marc Levenson > wrote in message >...
> > If you have any ammonia and nitrite testing above 0, the tank is still cycling. Time will
> > resolve that one, and strange algaes do come and go during the cycle.
> >
> > I offer a 100gpd 5-stage unit on my site.
> > http://www.melevsreef.com/ro_di.html
> >
> > Marc

--
Personal Page: http://www.sparklingfloorservice.com/oanda/index.html
Business Page: http://www.sparklingfloorservice.com
Marine Hobbyist: http://www.melevsreef.com