Hagen Fluval 204

[Jake]

i am setting up a 29 gl tropical community planted tank. i've decided to go
with the fluval 204, after deciding against the emperor 280 because of
surface agitation.

can any of you out there that have one of these give me some opinions? or
some little tricks to make it (or canisters in general) more efficient (e.g.
vasseline around the seals i think i read somewhere). just about all of the
reviews i read on these are really good.. with a couple not so favorible
ones too.

id appreciate negative feedback also.

thanks
jake

[Flash Wilson]

On Tue, 16 Sep 2003 22:16:46 -0500, Jake > wrote:
>can any of you out there that have one of these give me some opinions? or
>some little tricks to make it (or canisters in general) more efficient (e.g.
>vasseline around the seals i think i read somewhere). just about all of the
>reviews i read on these are really good.. with a couple not so favorible
>ones too.

I have a 204, no idea what age or model as it was a gift from someone
who bought it a while back. I was given it in March 03. It's possible
there's a newer version.

Generally does the job pretty well - the fish have all been fine
and the nitrite/ammonia level is 0 which is what you want from a
filter, no?

However that as a given there are a few drawbacks.

Plant matter tends to clog at the end of the hose into the filter,
so you have to pull it off the aqua-stop attachment and use a hook
to clean it out, or the water slows to a trickle. I have a moderately
planted tank and need to do this every week or two as a minimum.
And unless you can be bothered to fully remove the hoses and drain
them, then to get the syphon going again, you will do as I do and
leave them in, and try to get your thumb over the hose fast as you
remove it. You will need to cover yourself in a small towel :)

That issue caused me a lot of concern until someone on this forum
was able to help me realise why the water was running so slowly,
and I started cleaning the inlet as a matter of course.

I find it very hard to get started unless you've pumped and pumped
and *pumped* the primer, usually I give up after I've tried hard
and had to get a bloke to do it for me (isn't that pathetic? but
I don't think they should make a filter which a normal person can't
start reliably!)

Otherwise it's ok; spares are easy to find, it's easy enough to
clean etc...

I wouldn't buy it again, I don't know if all filters are as fiddly
as the 204, but I'd like to try something else!

--
Flash Wilson
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
About me: http://www.gorge.org
About Leyton, East London: http://leyton.info

[NetMax]

"Flash Wilson" > wrote in message
...
> On Tue, 16 Sep 2003 22:16:46 -0500, Jake > wrote:
> >can any of you out there that have one of these give me some opinions?
or
> >some little tricks to make it (or canisters in general) more efficient
(e.g.
> >vasseline around the seals i think i read somewhere). just about all
of the
> >reviews i read on these are really good.. with a couple not so
favorible
> >ones too.

Vaseline is petroleum based, which dissolves rubber. Water usually works
fine as a lubricant. Use plumber's grease if you really needed something
better.

Possible reasons for getting a mix of reviews are i) design changes are
done without renaming the model or series, ii) product defects and iii)
operator error. I used to manage a product support dept (not aquaria
related), and these were the main causes (plus incorrect application
which is not as applicable to aquarium filters). AFAIK, there aren't any
really bad filters on the market anymore. Search the more recent google
archive posts to look for trends or cautions. If it's a new model,
someone complains and everyone agrees, that's a red flag, but I don't see
that ever happening with modern canisters anymore. Opinions tends to be
more widely dispersed now.

The 104 and 204 share the same diameter hoses, while the 304 & 404 use a
larger size. If you were ever planning on upgrading to a larger tank,
running a 304 throttled back might be a better idea. However, at full
power it would whirlpool your 29g ;~)

> I have a 204, no idea what age or model as it was a gift from someone
> who bought it a while back. I was given it in March 03. It's possible
> there's a newer version.

I think they changed the color of the handles on the last X04 design
change.

> Generally does the job pretty well - the fish have all been fine
> and the nitrite/ammonia level is 0 which is what you want from a
> filter, no?
>
> However that as a given there are a few drawbacks.
>
> Plant matter tends to clog at the end of the hose into the filter,
> so you have to pull it off the aqua-stop attachment and use a hook
> to clean it out, or the water slows to a trickle. I have a moderately
> planted tank and need to do this every week or two as a minimum.
> And unless you can be bothered to fully remove the hoses and drain
> them, then to get the syphon going again, you will do as I do and
> leave them in, and try to get your thumb over the hose fast as you
> remove it. You will need to cover yourself in a small towel :)

at the end of the hose _into_ the filter? Aren't you using the screen on
your intake? I find the screen clogs first on all my planted tanks
(which is normal for every model of powerfilter & canister). You must
have a lot of a certain size leaves (Hornwort, Sessiflora, Cabomba?).
Try using a shorter intake tube so the strainer sits higher up. Another
trick is to use a pre-filter or larger or nested strainers. Marineland
strainers are larger, as are the AquaClears which are stackable.

> That issue caused me a lot of concern until someone on this forum
> was able to help me realise why the water was running so slowly,
> and I started cleaning the inlet as a matter of course.
>
> I find it very hard to get started unless you've pumped and pumped
> and *pumped* the primer, usually I give up after I've tried hard
> and had to get a bloke to do it for me (isn't that pathetic? but
> I don't think they should make a filter which a normal person can't
> start reliably!)

If you have lots of air bubbles, just pumping the primer often does
nothing. I've had success in walking away and then returning after a few
minutes. A few times, the pump had primed itself and was running (?!
:o). Probably something about the time it takes for the air to make it's
way through the compartments. The best way to prime any canister,
regardless of model is to hold the return hose in a pail on the floor and
plug it in. You have gravity assisting the pump. Let it run a few
minutes to clear all the air pockets, and then turn it off and snap the
return pipe inside the aquarium. Once primed the first time, I find the
new Fluvals don't need re-priming if you bring the media box back either
completely filled with water (always works), or sometimes, leaving the
media box completely empty has worked for me.

Part of it, (technical note) is that these new canisters with integrated
shut-off valves, shut both intake & return hoses at the same time. With
my DIY systems, my return hose is drained, I install the media box empty
(all canister models) and then I open my intake first (pressurizing the
canister) and then I open the return (forcing the water to flow in the
correct direction, rapidly flooding the box and forcing air out). With
integrated valves, the air has 2 choices of direction to flow, with some
air sometimes getting caught inside.

> I wouldn't buy it again, I don't know if all filters are as fiddly
> as the 204, but I'd like to try something else!

It used to be that every filter you could buy, you would first have to
modify in some way before you could even put it into service ;~) With
the quality levels today, it's just getting to know the characteristics
of the model purchased, and every make & model has their 'eccentricies'
and preferences. You don't know it Flash, but we have never had it so
good :o).

NetMax

> --
> Flash Wilson
> -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
> About me: http://www.gorge.org
> About Leyton, East London: http://leyton.info

[Flash Wilson]

On Fri, 19 Sep 2003 23:11:19 GMT, Brian > wrote:
>> I've got hoses going into the "aqua-stop" and I really meant at the part
>> in the aqua-stop where the intake hose meets it. So I need to pull the
>> intake hose off it in order to clean out. This means I get wet!
>
>Don't you just take the hose assembly off the tank at the same time you
>clean the filter? About every second or third time I clean the filter, I
>have to completetly clean the hoses out. I just flip the Aqua-Stop, and
>take the filter and the hose assembly over to the sink. No soaking at
>all.

Nope - it's hard to get them in and out, the way the tank is situated
in the room and the way the holes are in my cabinet for the hoses to
come in. I do check them out - the water flows pretty fast through
them so there's no blockage or anything. The only awkward bit is getting
the down hose off the aquastop to clean that bit out, as I described!

>By the way, I love my Fluval 204. I've had it almost five years with no
>problems. The only pointer I'd give is to take care when latching the
>head unit back onto the canister after cleaning. It's not a bad O-ring,
>but the head needs to not only be latched, but also be seated properly.

Ok - thanks for that tip. :)

--
Flash Wilson
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
"Since working for Demon, or Thus, or whatever you call it,
I've been able to understand Rab C Nesbitt" - A Network Admin