Lights on Aquarium DYI Project

[houseslave]

I'm setting up a 55 gallon tank that is 48" long. I'm making a canopy for
the tank. My options are regular T12 bulbs and fixtures that use the newer
T8 lights. The T8 lights are smaller in diameter but put out 27% more light
and save energy. My questions are:

Are the newer T8 lights the way to go? I was at Homedepot and the selection
for T8 bulbs was not too good.

Also, am I better off using 36" fixtures instead of 48" fixtures? My
thinking is that the 36" bulbs are easier to handle and that the 48" bulbs
will force me to make a canopy that is slightly larger then the tank which
make look not so good.... In all scenarios I want to remove the ballasts
from the fixture and mount the end caps on my top.

I'm thinking of using (6) 36" bulbs in my design. Is this too much light?
If I use the T8 bulbs I can probably use just (4) 36" bulbs because they put
out more light then the T12 bulbs?

[NetMax]

"houseslave" > wrote in message
et...
> I'm setting up a 55 gallon tank that is 48" long. I'm making a canopy
for
> the tank. My options are regular T12 bulbs and fixtures that use the
newer
> T8 lights. The T8 lights are smaller in diameter but put out 27% more
light
> and save energy. My questions are:
>
> Are the newer T8 lights the way to go? I was at Homedepot and the
selection
> for T8 bulbs was not too good.
>
> Also, am I better off using 36" fixtures instead of 48" fixtures? My
> thinking is that the 36" bulbs are easier to handle and that the 48"
bulbs
> will force me to make a canopy that is slightly larger then the tank
which
> make look not so good.... In all scenarios I want to remove the
ballasts
> from the fixture and mount the end caps on my top.
>
> I'm thinking of using (6) 36" bulbs in my design. Is this too much
light?
> If I use the T8 bulbs I can probably use just (4) 36" bulbs because
they put
> out more light then the T12 bulbs?

If you want to use lots of cheaper generic lights, change them every 6-8
months as recommended, and you want to keep your costs low, then the 4
T12s would be the way to go. I've never had trouble fitting 48" bulbs,
but my smallest 48" tank is actually 49" :o)

Why is a 48" T8 more powerful than a 48" T12? Do you have a link? The
36" bulbs will never be as cheap or popular, but check your local
availability and costs. What wattage are the 36" T8s? Six on a 55g (ie:
6x30=180W) is considerable, but not excessive, especially with CO2. I
have a 60g running 160W right now (no CO2). If your 36" T8s are 40W,
then 240W/55g is *cough* bright (4.4wpg) so CO2 will be a necessity.

Another option is the sealed T8s, as this gets rid of the attenuation
caused by the glass cover. If I was going to the expense of T8s, I'd try
to go the extra bit to get sealed fixtures and waterseal the canopy
interior.

Or wait till the T5s get 48" long ;~)
NetMax

[houseslave]

> If you want to use lots of cheaper generic lights, change them every 6-8
> months as recommended, and you want to keep your costs low, then the 4
> T12s would be the way to go. I've never had trouble fitting 48" bulbs,
> but my smallest 48" tank is actually 49" :o)

I guess I can get them to fit but the canopy will be a bit wider then the
tank. I'm not sure if this would look good or not. It might be fine.

>
> Why is a 48" T8 more powerful than a 48" T12?

T8 bulbs and ballasts are engineered to give out more lumens with the same
amount of watts. I believe the standard T12 was rated at 2200 lumens while
the T8 was rated at 2750. This was for a 48" bulb. So watts mean nothing
it's all about the lumens. I came across a link about overdriving
flourecent lights. Apparently this technique has been around for a while.
In a nut shell you take an electronic ballast the is made for 4 lights and
use it for 2 lights. The bulb life is diminished but you can almost double
the output. Here is the link:
http://forums.gardenweb.com/forums/load/aquarium/msg120039204469.html

Here is another link on bulbs: http://www.thekrib.com/Lights/t8.html

> 36" bulbs will never be as cheap or popular, but check your local
> availability and costs. What wattage are the 36" T8s?

30 watts but they are really more like 40 watts when compared to a T12 in
the same size.


Six on a 55g (ie:
> 6x30=180W) is considerable, but not excessive, especially with CO2. I
> have a 60g running 160W right now (no CO2). If your 36" T8s are 40W,
> then 240W/55g is *cough* bright (4.4wpg) so CO2 will be a necessity.
>
> Another option is the sealed T8s, as this gets rid of the attenuation
> caused by the glass cover. If I was going to the expense of T8s, I'd try
> to go the extra bit to get sealed fixtures and waterseal the canopy
> interior.

You lost me here. My original design was to use a glass cover on the tank
and then bascially build a box with lights in it with a cover, piano hinge,
etc. and then paint the inside with a paint which retards moisture, mold,
etc. What would I gain by mounting a fixture that is sealed inside my box?
Are you saying not to use the glass cover on the tank? I could do this
since my cover will be well vented and moisture proof,

>
> Or wait till the T5s get 48" long ;~)
> NetMax
>
>

[NetMax]

"houseslave" > wrote in message
et...
>
> > If you want to use lots of cheaper generic lights, change them every
6-8
> > months as recommended, and you want to keep your costs low, then the
4
> > T12s would be the way to go. I've never had trouble fitting 48"
bulbs,
> > but my smallest 48" tank is actually 49" :o)
>
> I guess I can get them to fit but the canopy will be a bit wider then
the
> tank. I'm not sure if this would look good or not. It might be fine.
>
> >
> > Why is a 48" T8 more powerful than a 48" T12?
>
> T8 bulbs and ballasts are engineered to give out more lumens with the
same
> amount of watts. I believe the standard T12 was rated at 2200 lumens
while
> the T8 was rated at 2750. This was for a 48" bulb. So watts mean
nothing
> it's all about the lumens. I came across a link about overdriving
> flourecent lights. Apparently this technique has been around for a
while.
> In a nut shell you take an electronic ballast the is made for 4 lights
and
> use it for 2 lights. The bulb life is diminished but you can almost
double
> the output. Here is the link:
> http://forums.gardenweb.com/forums/load/aquarium/msg120039204469.html
>
> Here is another link on bulbs: http://www.thekrib.com/Lights/t8.html
>
> > 36" bulbs will never be as cheap or popular, but check your local
> > availability and costs. What wattage are the 36" T8s?
>
> 30 watts but they are really more like 40 watts when compared to a T12
in
> the same size.
>
>
> Six on a 55g (ie:
> > 6x30=180W) is considerable, but not excessive, especially with CO2.
I
> > have a 60g running 160W right now (no CO2). If your 36" T8s are 40W,
> > then 240W/55g is *cough* bright (4.4wpg) so CO2 will be a necessity.
> >
> > Another option is the sealed T8s, as this gets rid of the attenuation
> > caused by the glass cover. If I was going to the expense of T8s, I'd
try
> > to go the extra bit to get sealed fixtures and waterseal the canopy
> > interior.
>
> You lost me here. My original design was to use a glass cover on the
tank
> and then bascially build a box with lights in it with a cover, piano
hinge,
> etc. and then paint the inside with a paint which retards moisture,
mold,
> etc. What would I gain by mounting a fixture that is sealed inside my
box?
> Are you saying not to use the glass cover on the tank? I could do this
> since my cover will be well vented and moisture proof,

It might be easier to see what I mean. Visit an LFS which carries Dutch
Aquarium Systems (DAS) aquariums, or Hagen Waterhomes (10g and larger).
They use no glass cover. The light canopy is the tank cover. Hagen &
DAS have different ways of handling the ballast & starter (DAS has it
externally, and Hagen integrates in into the hood), but both used sealed
T8 bulbs. You slide two gasketed sleeves over each bulb, install the
bulbs in their fixture, and then the sleeves are screwed into the
fixture, creating a reasonably water-tight seal around the connections.
Seems to be a very intelligent method to get the maximum light, and as
the hood is quite open, the light is much more uniform across the entire
surface.

http://www.hagen.com/canada/english/aquatic/product.cfm?CAT=1&SUBCAT=105&PROD_ID=01035400011001
If the link does not work (even after fixing the word-wrap), enter A-3540
in the product search on the Hagen web site. It's not a great picture,
but they show the canopy flipped over, so you can see the two flourescent
lamps. The one you can see (in the front) has the fitting around the end
of the bulb.

NetMax

> >
> > Or wait till the T5s get 48" long ;~)
> > NetMax
> >
> >
>
>

[Toni]

"NetMax" > wrote in message
. ..
>
> Or wait till the T5s get 48" long ;~)


They already are- I just ordered an 8 bulb t-5 fixture for my reef tank.
If I am very happy with it I may try one on my planted freshwater.


--
Toni
http://www.cearbhaill.com/discus.htm

[houseslave]

Thanks for the links. HD sells a beautiful fixture that accomodates (4) T8
bulbs for 119.00. It looks like it would fit my aquarium with no fuss and
is enclosed. The only draw back that I see if that you would have to slide
the fixture back off the aquarium or lift it off to get inside. This might
be a major hassle. Is there something I'm missing?

What do you think of overriding the bulbs?

Thanks

[NetMax]

"houseslave" > wrote in message
et...
> Thanks for the links. HD sells a beautiful fixture that accomodates
(4) T8
> bulbs for 119.00. It looks like it would fit my aquarium with no fuss
and
> is enclosed. The only draw back that I see if that you would have to
slide
> the fixture back off the aquarium or lift it off to get inside. This
might
> be a major hassle. Is there something I'm missing?

I can't comment without seeing the design. A lot depends on your talents
as a carpenter. I've build canopies with hinged doors, then the canopy
can hinge upwards, and with sections which come off.

A nice thing about T8s is that you can leave a gap between bulbs. At
work, our 48" T8s slide in a track. When I want to work in the tank, I
push the bulbs to the back. When I'm done, I just pull them forwards
again. This lets you position the bulbs lower, closer to the water, but
these are all sealed bulbs (no glass cover, no worry about water spashing
on the connectors).

> What do you think of overriding the bulbs?

No experience there. sorry.

I'm trying to imagine Toni's octo 48" in T5s. Neat :o) I'm not sure how
practical it would be for a planted freshwater, due to the limitations in
spectrum availability and the operating cost of replacements, but it will
come.

NetMax

> Thanks
>
>

[Toni]

"NetMax" > wrote in message
...
>
> I'm trying to imagine Toni's octo 48" in T5s. Neat :o) I'm not sure how
> practical it would be for a planted freshwater, due to the limitations in
> spectrum availability and the operating cost of replacements, but it will
> come.
>


Bulbs are supposed to outlast the PC's I'm using now. They offer two
different 6700ºK brand bulbs with one reportedly more yellow than the other-
I'm getting plenty of each color available to play with the combinations.
Will document all photographically!


--
Toni
http://www.cearbhaill.com/discus.htm

[luminos]

Do Yourself It?????

[houseslave]

My mistake. Anyway, I bought a 48" x 15" x 3" light fixture from HD last
night. Here is a link of the fixture in a T12 version:
http://www.acehardware.com/product/index.jsp?productId=1340679
It holds (4) 48" 32 watt T8 bulbs. I screwed (from the inside) a board to
cover the metal top and edged it out with wood. The lights are enclosed
with a plastic lens. It came out great the cost is under 80.00 plus bulbs
which are about 7.00 each. I got the idea from Netmax. I'll post some
pictures of the final design soon. When I want to get into the tank I
simply slide the fixture away. I also framed out the inside of the tank to
lift the fixture enough to get over the filter tubes, etc.

I wanted to know if I should keep the plastic lens up against the opening of
the tank or is it better to have some venting. I can easily vent the tank
by taking off some of the frame that lifts the fixtures. Instead of having
it run along all 4 sides of the tank I can simply leave the frame on each
end of the tank. I worried that the lens will get all gross and then drip
every time I slide it to get into the tank?

Thank

"luminos" > wrote in message
...
> Do Yourself It?????
>
>

[RedForeman ©®]

My only complaint about T12 fixtures is that they get REAL hot... T8s don't
get NEAR as hot...

--
RedForeman ©®




"houseslave" > wrote in message
. net...
> My mistake. Anyway, I bought a 48" x 15" x 3" light fixture from HD last
> night. Here is a link of the fixture in a T12 version:
> http://www.acehardware.com/product/index.jsp?productId=1340679
> It holds (4) 48" 32 watt T8 bulbs. I screwed (from the inside) a board to
> cover the metal top and edged it out with wood. The lights are enclosed
> with a plastic lens. It came out great the cost is under 80.00 plus bulbs
> which are about 7.00 each. I got the idea from Netmax. I'll post some
> pictures of the final design soon. When I want to get into the tank I
> simply slide the fixture away. I also framed out the inside of the tank
to
> lift the fixture enough to get over the filter tubes, etc.
>
> I wanted to know if I should keep the plastic lens up against the opening
of
> the tank or is it better to have some venting. I can easily vent the tank
> by taking off some of the frame that lifts the fixtures. Instead of
having
> it run along all 4 sides of the tank I can simply leave the frame on each
> end of the tank. I worried that the lens will get all gross and then drip
> every time I slide it to get into the tank?
>
> Thank
>
> "luminos" > wrote in message
> ...
> > Do Yourself It?????
> >
> >
>
>

[NetMax]

"houseslave" > wrote in message
. net...
> My mistake. Anyway, I bought a 48" x 15" x 3" light fixture from HD
last
> night. Here is a link of the fixture in a T12 version:
> http://www.acehardware.com/product/index.jsp?productId=1340679
> It holds (4) 48" 32 watt T8 bulbs. I screwed (from the inside) a board
to
> cover the metal top and edged it out with wood. The lights are
enclosed
> with a plastic lens. It came out great the cost is under 80.00 plus
bulbs
> which are about 7.00 each. I got the idea from Netmax. I'll post some
> pictures of the final design soon. When I want to get into the tank I
> simply slide the fixture away. I also framed out the inside of the
tank to
> lift the fixture enough to get over the filter tubes, etc.
>
> I wanted to know if I should keep the plastic lens up against the
opening of
> the tank or is it better to have some venting. I can easily vent the
tank
> by taking off some of the frame that lifts the fixtures. Instead of
having
> it run along all 4 sides of the tank I can simply leave the frame on
each
> end of the tank. I worried that the lens will get all gross and then
drip
> every time I slide it to get into the tank?
>
> Thank

Regarding venting, it's hard to say without looking at it. No
ventilation will sometimes result in most of the condensation occurring
when you turn off the lights at night. This causes the metalwork to cool
down, and the humidity condenses and then drips into the tank.

Poor ventilation can cause this condensation to occur all day long (by
keeping the metalwork slightly cooler).

Higher ventilation will clear the condensation problem, but at the
expense of your rate of evaporation if you are not using a glass cover.

So it's not black & white. Generally, assume you will get some
condensation, so some possibilities are : use plastic materials as much
as possible, seal metal edges, minimize the replenishment of the humidity
level (ie: glass cover), etc. You will probably need to experiment a
bit.

NetMax