Help!!! IMMEDIATE milky water

[Jason in Oakland]

Hi,

I'm a complete novice, but have read extensively about starting a new
tank, but...I've come across a problem where all my Internet searching
has been inconclusive.

I got a new tank, a 12g Neo Cube, and a bag of this reddish "Fluorite"
gravel. The gravel was FILTHY. The first rinses gave off water almost
like crude oil--black and murky. I rinsed it for about an hour, and
when it was only giving off a slight brownish color while rinsing (I
guessed it was particulate matter that would eventually settle), I
dumped it into my tank, seated my plants, and added water. The water
was completely cloudy. I should add I added some pH adjuster to the
water, at the amount suggested for a new tank. Did not check the pH.
Ran the filter overnight, and in the morning (about 10 hrs later), it
was still very cloudy (only a tiny bit better).

I then took all the gravel out and rinsed it in small batches with a
fine-knit colander. It took forever, but the gravel should have been
utterly immaculate at this point. I then added the newly-cleaned
gravel back into the tank, added my plants, and added water. MILKY
AGAIN. I want to make it clear this can not be a bacterial bloom or
ammonia cycling--it was IMMEDIATE and there were no fish in it.

I checked the pH of my again-milky water and it was around 8-8.5. (My
tap water is around 9) I used the pH buffer, quite a bit of it, to
bring it down to about 7.5. Still milky. The milkiness is more
"misty", where you can see the currents from the pump--there's a tiny
bit of an oily sheen on the surface, but very little. There are some
small bubbles on the plants, but the water doesn't seem to have any
bubbles in it, and after 10 hrs, any bubbles should have left, right?

The water was about 80F going in, and has a heater & thermometer. The
water seemed to be clear coming out of the faucet.

Am I just being impatient? I want the water to be in perfect condition
before I put my first fish in (about 5 golden barbs), hopefully in a
week.

Any advice, even the "don't worry about it!", would help this newbie!

Jason

[Sue]

Some murkyness is normal when starting a new tank. A few days with the
filter running should see an improvement. If you get a film on the surface
it can be rmoved by laying on a piece of kitchen towel.

Please read http://www.thetropicaltank.co.uk/beginner.htm and follow the
links on cycling. You shouldn't add 5 golden barbs at once, as first fish .
In fact five golden barbs are about as many fish,or as much fish mass, as
your tank could support until very mature.
Ask at your local fish shop about what pH their tanks run at and how they
modify it if they do. Some fish will be ok in your water. Any fish will be
better in a stable environment than one that fluctuates.
80 degrees is a bit high for many fish 75-78 would be better.

Patience is a virtue ;o)
Sue

[Eric Schreiber]

(Jason in Oakland) wrote:

>I got a new tank, a 12g Neo Cube, and a bag of this reddish "Fluorite"
>gravel. The gravel was FILTHY.

Flourite is a very dirty gravel, which comes from it being clay rather
than crushed stone. Generally, it's best to give it one or two
thorough rinsings, then put it in the tank. Continued fussing with it
just grinds the pieces together to make yet more dust.

After you put the flourite in the tank, set a plate on it, and pour
your water carefully onto the plate. This won't stop the water
clouding, but will reduce it.

It takes a couple of days for flourite dust to settle out completely.
You may need to change your filter media several times during the
process.

Rest assured, it is worth it in the long run. Flourite is an excellent
gravel to use in a planted aquarium.

>I then took all the gravel out and rinsed it in small batches with a
>fine-knit colander. It took forever, but the gravel should have been
>utterly immaculate at this point.

Flourite never gets immaculate. You simply cannot rinse it 100% clean.

>I should add I added some pH adjuster to the water, at the
>amount suggested for a new tank. Did not check the pH.

In general, unless you're trying to reach a very specific pH for a
certain species of fish, you shouldn't add chemicals to modify your
pH. Do yourself a favor and do several water changes to get the pH
chemicals out of the tank before you add fish.

>Am I just being impatient? I want the water to be in perfect condition
>before I put my first fish in (about 5 golden barbs), hopefully in a
>week.

Yes, pretty much you're just impatient, which is a feeling every one
of us here can understand. I waited a couple of weeks with my first
tank while I did fishless cycling... I thought I'd go mad from the
waiting :)


--
www.ericschreiber.com

[[email protected]]

I totally understand what u are thinking
The scum that is along the side was the worse for me
As I put flora base on bottom and fluorite on top
(Pretty much blew my budget) in my 90gal planted
Took about a week to settle out (might have been less if
I would have left it alone)
Check out your iron level now, with new plants. if
your levels need more iron add tablets into substrate,
(Algae get nutrients from the water column)
I fed plant with liquid frets at start got lots of algae
good luck
if you want pics i can email i have ,start,scummy,clear,and
1 month after adding co2(highly recommended but lowers ph)
les

[alex crouvier]

Fluorite does kick up a lot of dust
I dumped half a bag of Fluorite into my 15 gallon tank and it took
abt 1.5 days for the filter to clear up the water. Even then, it still looks
murky but then I could at least see the back of the tank.
I changed 50% of the water, let the filter does the rest.
Another day, it clears considerably.
After abt 3 days, the tank now looks crystal clear.

"Jason in Oakland" > wrote in message
om...
> Hi,
>
> I'm a complete novice, but have read extensively about starting a new
> tank, but...I've come across a problem where all my Internet searching
> has been inconclusive.
>
> I got a new tank, a 12g Neo Cube, and a bag of this reddish "Fluorite"
> gravel. The gravel was FILTHY. The first rinses gave off water almost
> like crude oil--black and murky. I rinsed it for about an hour, and
> when it was only giving off a slight brownish color while rinsing (I
> guessed it was particulate matter that would eventually settle), I
> dumped it into my tank, seated my plants, and added water. The water
> was completely cloudy. I should add I added some pH adjuster to the
> water, at the amount suggested for a new tank. Did not check the pH.
> Ran the filter overnight, and in the morning (about 10 hrs later), it
> was still very cloudy (only a tiny bit better).
>
> I then took all the gravel out and rinsed it in small batches with a
> fine-knit colander. It took forever, but the gravel should have been
> utterly immaculate at this point. I then added the newly-cleaned
> gravel back into the tank, added my plants, and added water. MILKY
> AGAIN. I want to make it clear this can not be a bacterial bloom or
> ammonia cycling--it was IMMEDIATE and there were no fish in it.
>
> I checked the pH of my again-milky water and it was around 8-8.5. (My
> tap water is around 9) I used the pH buffer, quite a bit of it, to
> bring it down to about 7.5. Still milky. The milkiness is more
> "misty", where you can see the currents from the pump--there's a tiny
> bit of an oily sheen on the surface, but very little. There are some
> small bubbles on the plants, but the water doesn't seem to have any
> bubbles in it, and after 10 hrs, any bubbles should have left, right?
>
> The water was about 80F going in, and has a heater & thermometer. The
> water seemed to be clear coming out of the faucet.
>
> Am I just being impatient? I want the water to be in perfect condition
> before I put my first fish in (about 5 golden barbs), hopefully in a
> week.
>
> Any advice, even the "don't worry about it!", would help this newbie!
>
> Jason

[NetMax]

<snip>
> "Jason in Oakland" > wrote in message
> om...
> > Hi,
> >
> > I'm a complete novice, but have read extensively about starting a new
> > tank, but...I've come across a problem where all my Internet
searching
> > has been inconclusive.
> >
> > I got a new tank, a 12g Neo Cube, and
<snip>
> > I checked the pH of my again-milky water and it was around 8-8.5. (My
> > tap water is around 9) I used the pH buffer, quite a bit of it, to
> > bring it down to about 7.5.
<snip>
> > I want the water to be in perfect condition
> > before I put my first fish in (about 5 golden barbs), hopefully in a
> > week.
> >
> > Any advice, even the "don't worry about it!", would help this newbie!
> >
> > Jason

Notwithstanding your cloudy water problem (yeah, flourite does that, and
an established *slimy* filter cleans it out), your water is around 9pH ?
If your water is soft (low gH & kH) then your municipality has probably
boosted it, so it's not a big deal to lower the pH back down to where it
should be (look into CO2, mopani driftwood, peat, live plants etc),
however if your water is hard (high gH & kH), then you are setting
yourself up for a battle of sorts. There are fish which will be fine in
hard alkaline water (and golden barbs are not it). You just might want
to research this a bit further before you sink a lot of money into pH
buffers.

NetMax

[Jason in Oakland]

Thank you all who responded, by posts or private emails...your advice
was excellent.

I took out most of the water, which had the phosphate-based pH
adjuster in it (kept some to neutralize chloramine--it's the only
product in my arsenal that can), refilled with water, and used a
sulfuric-acid based pH Down adjuster to adjust the pH to just under 7
(I'm going to put in golden barbs, and apparently they like pH 6-7). I
then used NovAqua and TransClear, to condition the water and floc out
the larger cloudy particles. My water, after about a day and a half,
is MUCH clearer, but I'll just be patient for the last bit of
fluorite-silt to settle out and make way for a crystal-clear tank.

I'll likely put in a couple of my golden barbs this weekend, and
carefully monitor ammonia/NO2 while it cycles, doing water exchanges
as necessary.

Thanks again, everyone!