gravel vs sand ? 1/4" gravel max?

[erik w]

One website that seems to be fine for purchasing fish on the Internet is
www.aquariumfish.net . How ever this site recommends that a MAX of 1/4"
of gravel be used. I don't think I would agree with this but I was
wondering if anyone else had any experience in the comparison. I
actually use black sand. It is the first time I have used sand and it
seems to be working well. One advantage I see is that the waste sits on
top of the sand and is easily removed. The way I was to told to clean
the sand is to stir the sand and the waste will be cleaned be the
filter. I have 40 lbs of black sand which ends up being about 3/4" of
sand. Another question of mine is if the sand is actually better than
gravel.

Well I am trying something new, mostly because I hated the color of the
gravel I had (green, black, yellow). At the time I had to make due
because the place was out of blue and they did not have enough any one
color. The sand is much prettier.

Erik

[Marco Schwarz]

Hi..

> I actually use black sand.

Is this a natural sand? I've river sand in each of my tanks.

> It is the first time I have used sand and it seems
> to be working well.

It does. If this were a loach-less tank it might be
beneficial to add some Malaysian Livebearing Trumpet Snails
(Melanoides tubercutata).

> One advantage I see is that the waste sits on top
> of the sand

But no real advantage using river sand. ;-)

> The way I was to told to clean the sand is to stir
> the sand and the waste will be cleaned be the filter.

Depends on fish mates and fish load I think, the waste may
also be removed by water changes.

> I have 40 lbs of black sand which ends up being
> about 3/4" of sand.

A planted tank may have 2-4" sand, but don't know at all if
yours is a planted tank, how big that tank is, if your
floor might be able to take that additional load..
--
cu
Marco

[Amateur Cichlids]

"erik w" > wrote in message
news:wlJRf.126473$4l5.54301@dukeread05...
> One website that seems to be fine for purchasing fish on the Internet is
> www.aquariumfish.net . How ever this site recommends that a MAX of 1/4" of
> gravel be used. I don't think I would agree with this but I was wondering
> if anyone else had any experience in the comparison. I actually use black
> sand. It is the first time I have used sand and it seems to be working
> well. One advantage I see is that the waste sits on top of the sand and is
> easily removed. The way I was to told to clean the sand is to stir the
> sand and the waste will be cleaned be the filter. I have 40 lbs of black
> sand which ends up being about 3/4" of sand. Another question of mine is
> if the sand is actually better than gravel.
>
> Well I am trying something new, mostly because I hated the color of the
> gravel I had (green, black, yellow). At the time I had to make due because
> the place was out of blue and they did not have enough any one color. The
> sand is much prettier.
>
> Erik

The use of gravel vs sand is non-consequential in many cichlid tanks. In
tanks with Mbuna from Lake Malawi, gravel is find, sand is fine, and many
just go with a bare bottom tank. Gravel tends to be easier to clean with a
gravel vac, as it doesn't get sucked up when siphoning. Sand can clog a
python if you use one to clean your tank. Sand is hard to find in darker
colors which tend to make many cichlids feel more at ease. Both sand and
gravel, if too deep will end up as beds for anerobic bacteria which give off
waste products toxic to your fish. Using 1/4" of gravel allows it to be
easily cleaned and gives no threat of bad bacteria growing. The same can be
said with a thinner layer of sand.
Deeper sand beds can be used in tanks with fish that sift sand. The sand
is moved around so much, the toxic gases can't collect. If you were keeping
something like Tanganyikan featherfins, you'd rather have the sand than
gravel, as the fish will use it to build nesting sites.
So, it all really depends on personal preferences and on what type of
fish you're keeping.
Tim
http://www.fishaholics.org

[erik w]

Marco Schwarz wrote:
> Hi..
>
>
>>I actually use black sand.
>
>
> Is this a natural sand? I've river sand in each of my tanks.
>
>
>>It is the first time I have used sand and it seems
>>to be working well.
>
>
> It does. If this were a loach-less tank it might be
> beneficial to add some Malaysian Livebearing Trumpet Snails
> (Melanoides tubercutata).
>
>
>>One advantage I see is that the waste sits on top
>>of the sand
>
>
> But no real advantage using river sand. ;-)
>
>
>>The way I was to told to clean the sand is to stir
>>the sand and the waste will be cleaned be the filter.
>
>
> Depends on fish mates and fish load I think, the waste may
> also be removed by water changes.
>
>
>>I have 40 lbs of black sand which ends up being
>>about 3/4" of sand.
>
>
> A planted tank may have 2-4" sand, but don't know at all if
> yours is a planted tank, how big that tank is, if your
> floor might be able to take that additional load..

My tank is a 75 ga. It has no plants now. I would like to have some live
plants but not many. I will need rock for my fish. My plan is to have
African chichlids, mbuna or peacocks (Note: not both). The idea of rock
brings up another question and that is where is a good, cheap place to
get rock. Pet stores seem to charge 20 $ for a single large piece of
slate.The pet store prices keep the same pattern for all rock. Everyone
I know that have rock get it in what I think of as bad locations, sucks
as drainage ditches. Maybe I should start a new subject on where to
aquire rock.

Thanks for the reply.

erik

[NetMax]

"erik w" > wrote in message
news:LlmSf.127318$4l5.78959@dukeread05...
> Marco Schwarz wrote:
>> Hi..
>>
>>
>>>I actually use black sand.
>>
>>
>> Is this a natural sand? I've river sand in each of my tanks.
>>
>>
>>>It is the first time I have used sand and it seems
>>>to be working well.
>>
>>
>> It does. If this were a loach-less tank it might be
>> beneficial to add some Malaysian Livebearing Trumpet Snails
>> (Melanoides tubercutata).
>>>One advantage I see is that the waste sits on top
>>>of the sand
>>
>>
>> But no real advantage using river sand. ;-)
>>
>>
>>>The way I was to told to clean the sand is to stir
>>>the sand and the waste will be cleaned be the filter.
>>
>>
>> Depends on fish mates and fish load I think, the waste may
>> also be removed by water changes.
>>
>>
>>>I have 40 lbs of black sand which ends up being
>>>about 3/4" of sand.
>>
>>
>> A planted tank may have 2-4" sand, but don't know at all if
>> yours is a planted tank, how big that tank is, if your
>> floor might be able to take that additional load..
>
> My tank is a 75 ga. It has no plants now. I would like to have some live
> plants but not many. I will need rock for my fish. My plan is to have
> African chichlids, mbuna or peacocks (Note: not both). The idea of rock
> brings up another question and that is where is a good, cheap place to
> get rock. Pet stores seem to charge 20 $ for a single large piece of
> slate.The pet store prices keep the same pattern for all rock. Everyone I
> know that have rock get it in what I think of as bad locations, sucks as
> drainage ditches. Maybe I should start a new subject on where to aquire
> rock.
>
> Thanks for the reply.
>
> erik

About rocks, search and test criteria:
http://www.2cah.com/netmax/basics/rocks/rocks.shtml

I usually find the best rocks driving around, or where there are
construction projects underway. Your local aquarium society should have
good contacts for local sources. Quarries too, although not free, they are
still much cheaper than a pet shop. hth
--
www.NetMax.tk

[erik w]

NetMax wrote:
> "erik w" > wrote in message
> news:LlmSf.127318$4l5.78959@dukeread05...
>
>>Marco Schwarz wrote:
>>
>>>Hi..
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>I actually use black sand.
>>>
>>>
>>>Is this a natural sand? I've river sand in each of my tanks.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>It is the first time I have used sand and it seems
>>>>to be working well.
>>>
>>>
>>>It does. If this were a loach-less tank it might be
>>>beneficial to add some Malaysian Livebearing Trumpet Snails
>>>(Melanoides tubercutata).
>>>
>>>>One advantage I see is that the waste sits on top
>>>>of the sand
>>>
>>>
>>>But no real advantage using river sand. ;-)
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>The way I was to told to clean the sand is to stir
>>>>the sand and the waste will be cleaned be the filter.
>>>
>>>
>>>Depends on fish mates and fish load I think, the waste may
>>>also be removed by water changes.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>I have 40 lbs of black sand which ends up being
>>>>about 3/4" of sand.
>>>
>>>
>>>A planted tank may have 2-4" sand, but don't know at all if
>>>yours is a planted tank, how big that tank is, if your
>>>floor might be able to take that additional load..
>>
>>My tank is a 75 ga. It has no plants now. I would like to have some live
>>plants but not many. I will need rock for my fish. My plan is to have
>>African chichlids, mbuna or peacocks (Note: not both). The idea of rock
>>brings up another question and that is where is a good, cheap place to
>>get rock. Pet stores seem to charge 20 $ for a single large piece of
>>slate.The pet store prices keep the same pattern for all rock. Everyone I
>>know that have rock get it in what I think of as bad locations, sucks as
>>drainage ditches. Maybe I should start a new subject on where to aquire
>>rock.
>>
>>Thanks for the reply.
>>
>>erik
>
>
> About rocks, search and test criteria:
> http://www.2cah.com/netmax/basics/rocks/rocks.shtml
>
> I usually find the best rocks driving around, or where there are
> construction projects underway. Your local aquarium society should have
> good contacts for local sources. Quarries too, although not free, they are
> still much cheaper than a pet shop. hth


Thanks and great web page. I wish I had that type of job although I
probably don't have the patience.

[URBANFLAGE]

"erik w" > wrote in message
news:WWGSf.127595$4l5.69272@dukeread05...
> NetMax wrote:
> > "erik w" > wrote in message
> > news:LlmSf.127318$4l5.78959@dukeread05...
> >
> >>Marco Schwarz wrote:
> >>
> >>>Hi..
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>I actually use black sand.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>Is this a natural sand? I've river sand in each of my tanks.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>It is the first time I have used sand and it seems
> >>>>to be working well.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>It does. If this were a loach-less tank it might be
> >>>beneficial to add some Malaysian Livebearing Trumpet Snails
> >>>(Melanoides tubercutata).
> >>>
> >>>>One advantage I see is that the waste sits on top
> >>>>of the sand
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>But no real advantage using river sand. ;-)
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>The way I was to told to clean the sand is to stir
> >>>>the sand and the waste will be cleaned be the filter.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>Depends on fish mates and fish load I think, the waste may
> >>>also be removed by water changes.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>I have 40 lbs of black sand which ends up being
> >>>>about 3/4" of sand.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>A planted tank may have 2-4" sand, but don't know at all if
> >>>yours is a planted tank, how big that tank is, if your
> >>>floor might be able to take that additional load..
> >>
> >>My tank is a 75 ga. It has no plants now. I would like to have some live
> >>plants but not many. I will need rock for my fish. My plan is to have
> >>African chichlids, mbuna or peacocks (Note: not both). The idea of rock
> >>brings up another question and that is where is a good, cheap place to
> >>get rock. Pet stores seem to charge 20 $ for a single large piece of
> >>slate.The pet store prices keep the same pattern for all rock. Everyone
I
> >>know that have rock get it in what I think of as bad locations, sucks as
> >>drainage ditches. Maybe I should start a new subject on where to aquire
> >>rock.
> >>
> >>Thanks for the reply.
> >>
> >>erik
> >
> >
> > About rocks, search and test criteria:
> > http://www.2cah.com/netmax/basics/rocks/rocks.shtml
> >
> > I usually find the best rocks driving around, or where there are
> > construction projects underway. Your local aquarium society should have
> > good contacts for local sources. Quarries too, although not free, they
are
> > still much cheaper than a pet shop. hth
>
>
> Thanks and great web page. I wish I had that type of job although I
> probably don't have the patience.
>

the price of rocks depend on your location. out west (California) there is
not much local slate. I always used slabs of granite and smaller rock I
found. another good source are stone masons. look up stone masons in the
phone book and ask if they will give you some scrap slate.

brad

[George B.]

My experience with sand in a 75 gallon peakcock tank is: The fish stir up
the sand and it gets sucked into the filters and the filters see it as dirt.
This requires more frequent cleaning than gravel or bare bottom tank. Also
some gets sucked into bucket when doing water changes and cleaning top.
I use a fluval 404 and a biowheel power filter. Try to keep the intakes far
enough from the bottom to reduce sand intake.
"Amateur Cichlids" > wrote in message
m...
>
> "erik w" > wrote in message
> news:wlJRf.126473$4l5.54301@dukeread05...
>> One website that seems to be fine for purchasing fish on the Internet is
>> www.aquariumfish.net . How ever this site recommends that a MAX of 1/4"
>> of gravel be used. I don't think I would agree with this but I was
>> wondering if anyone else had any experience in the comparison. I actually
>> use black sand. It is the first time I have used sand and it seems to be
>> working well. One advantage I see is that the waste sits on top of the
>> sand and is easily removed. The way I was to told to clean the sand is to
>> stir the sand and the waste will be cleaned be the filter. I have 40
>> lbs of black sand which ends up being about 3/4" of sand. Another
>> question of mine is if the sand is actually better than gravel.
>>
>> Well I am trying something new, mostly because I hated the color of the
>> gravel I had (green, black, yellow). At the time I had to make due
>> because the place was out of blue and they did not have enough any one
>> color. The sand is much prettier.
>>
>> Erik
>
> The use of gravel vs sand is non-consequential in many cichlid tanks.
> In tanks with Mbuna from Lake Malawi, gravel is find, sand is fine, and
> many just go with a bare bottom tank. Gravel tends to be easier to clean
> with a gravel vac, as it doesn't get sucked up when siphoning. Sand can
> clog a python if you use one to clean your tank. Sand is hard to find in
> darker colors which tend to make many cichlids feel more at ease. Both
> sand and gravel, if too deep will end up as beds for anerobic bacteria
> which give off waste products toxic to your fish. Using 1/4" of gravel
> allows it to be easily cleaned and gives no threat of bad bacteria
> growing. The same can be said with a thinner layer of sand.
> Deeper sand beds can be used in tanks with fish that sift sand. The
> sand is moved around so much, the toxic gases can't collect. If you were
> keeping something like Tanganyikan featherfins, you'd rather have the sand
> than gravel, as the fish will use it to build nesting sites.
> So, it all really depends on personal preferences and on what type of
> fish you're keeping.
> Tim
> http://www.fishaholics.org
>
>

[scottmilsson]

In tanks with Mbuna from Lake Malawi, alluvium is find, beach is fine, and many just go with a bald basal tank. Alluvium tends to be easier to apple-pie with a gravel vac, as it doesn't get sucked up if siphoning. Beach can clog a python if you use one to apple-pie your tank.