Newbie looking for (future) help with 10 gallon tank (long)

[Mudbunny]

Hey there everybody. From reading previous posts in here, I can see
there is quite a good knowledge base available here that I would love
to pick through for advice.

A couple of monthw ago my wife bought a 10 gallon fishtank from our
local Big Al's (mumble-mumble). We put water, gravel, filter and a
pack of the bacteria starter in, let it sit a week (as advised by the
salesguy) and then got a couple fish. 2 Orange Platy's and two fancy
guppies. My wife wanted more and, after consulting with sales-dude, we
were advised to wait a week, and then we could add (at most) 4 more.
The next week, we got 4 more fancy guppies.

Every week, we were doing about a 20% water change. After about 3
weeks, the fancy guppies started dieing. Scooped them out and, after
checking the water and seeing that nitrite and nitrate were high (and
water a bit cloudy), went to the local PetSmart and asked some advice
on what water tretment to use. The saleslady recommended doing
nothing, and letting the tank cycle some more to develop the proper
bacteria to deal with the nitrite and to do weekly 10% water
changes/gravel vacuums. The cloudy was explained as being the bacteria
growing, and that it would clear up in about a week or so, and to wait
until that happened before we added fish.

No Problem.

A week later, the water is clear, so she added a couple more fish (4
bloodfin something or others) and a ramshorn snail. The water is
pretty clear, although the nitrite and nitrate are a bit high. I just
got a better kit, and am starting a log to see how often it goes up
and down. I have a couple of questions that I would like some help
with.

1. Is this too much fish for a 10 gallon? The fish-person said no, but
it seems like it will be pretty tight based upon the 1 inch/gallon.
Any growing fish and we are screwed.

2. We have some plastic plants in there that are getting pretty algae
coated. How should I clean these? Is removing them, rinsing them (no
soap) and putting them back the best idea? How about other fish to
add? (not now, 'cause I figure the tank is at its limit, but when some
fish die).

3. What are the recommended conditions for the fish/snail we currently
have? As of last night, I had pH 7.6, NH3 0, dgH 9, nitrite 0.5 and
nitrate 2.5. (I am unsure of Nitrite and nitrate, the others I am sure
of).

4. How can you tell if an orange platy is male or female and if one is
pregnant or not?? We have one that is about 50% bigger than the other
and has a swollen belly.

5. When feeding fish, is it recommended that you do it with or without
the filter running? (It is a the filter that comes with a TopFin 10
gallon starter tank)

6. I live in the north end of Hull, and the fishtank is next to a
window that faces west-northwest. How often should the lamp be on?
Whenever we are up? The tank never gets direct sunlight due to it's
positioning.

Thanks in advance,

Marcel

PS - Reply to the newsgroup, as my hotmail account is pretty swamped
with spam...

[blove]

here is a site that explains alot http://fins.actwin.com/mirror/begin.html
fancy guppies with all that breeding to make the colors more pretty, have
turned them into crap basically. they arnt hardy at all. feeder guppies on
the other hand are hardy and do well. your pretty much at your stocking
level, stickin to the rule 1"per gallon. most livebearers get 2 inches full
grown. just make sure to stick to your weekly water changes and you should
be ok. eventually when your tank is done cycling your ammonia should be
0ppm, nitrites 0ppm, and nitrates should be from 0-40 ppm. your weekly
waterchanges is what control the nitrate levels. you can tell sex of
livebearers by the anal fin shape, here is a site that shows differences
http://freshaquarium.about.com/library/graphics/femalelb.jpg
http://freshaquarium.about.com/library/graphics/malelb.jpg
you can leave the filter running when you feed them, the fish will get the
food, just be sure to feed them as much as they can eat in 3 to 5 minutes
once a day is fine. 8-12 hours a day with the light on is fine. too much
light and you might get an algae bloom in the water.

[NetMax]

"Mudbunny" > wrote in message
om...
> Hey there everybody. From reading previous posts in here, I can see
> there is quite a good knowledge base available here that I would love
> to pick through for advice.
>
> A couple of monthw ago my wife bought a 10 gallon fishtank from our
> local Big Al's (mumble-mumble).

mumble mumble?

> We put water, gravel, filter and a
> pack of the bacteria starter in, let it sit a week (as advised by the
> salesguy)

I'll never understand this advice. Add bacteria (which survive on ammona
and nitrites) but don't add an ammonia source (the fish) for a week.
Maybe I'm missing something.

and then got a couple fish. 2 Orange Platy's and two fancy
> guppies. My wife wanted more and, after consulting with sales-dude, we
> were advised to wait a week, and then we could add (at most) 4 more.
> The next week, we got 4 more fancy guppies.
>
> Every week, we were doing about a 20% water change. After about 3
> weeks, the fancy guppies started dieing. Scooped them out and, after
> checking the water and seeing that nitrite and nitrate were high (and
> water a bit cloudy), went to the local PetSmart and asked some advice
> on what water tretment to use. The saleslady recommended doing
> nothing, and letting the tank cycle some more to develop the proper
> bacteria to deal with the nitrite and to do weekly 10% water
> changes/gravel vacuums. The cloudy was explained as being the bacteria
> growing, and that it would clear up in about a week or so, and to wait
> until that happened before we added fish.
>
> No Problem.
>
> A week later, the water is clear, so she added a couple more fish (4
> bloodfin something or others) and a ramshorn snail. The water is
> pretty clear, although the nitrite and nitrate are a bit high. I just
> got a better kit, and am starting a log to see how often it goes up
> and down. I have a couple of questions that I would like some help
> with.
>
> 1. Is this too much fish for a 10 gallon? The fish-person said no, but
> it seems like it will be pretty tight based upon the 1 inch/gallon.
> Any growing fish and we are screwed.

Any of the Guppies survive, or is it just the Plays and the Bloodfins
left? Cycling with fish would be best done with 4 Bloodfins. Platys and
Guppies would already labour in Hull's soft river water (Hull PQ?), so
the extra NH3/4 and NO2 would be a stressor on them.

> 2. We have some plastic plants in there that are getting pretty algae
> coated. How should I clean these? Is removing them, rinsing them (no
> soap) and putting them back the best idea? How about other fish to
> add? (not now, 'cause I figure the tank is at its limit, but when some
> fish die).

Up to you regarding the plants, it's not critical.

> 3. What are the recommended conditions for the fish/snail we currently
> have? As of last night, I had pH 7.6, NH3 0, dgH 9, nitrite 0.5 and
> nitrate 2.5. (I am unsure of Nitrite and nitrate, the others I am sure
> of).

Livebearers like that pH but with harder water. Your characins like the
sof****er but a lower pH. Nobody like your NO2, but it's not at
dangerous levels. I haven't known snails to be too particular,
preferring softer water, but with some hardness. You really should not
have any NO2 if your tank is cycled.

> 4. How can you tell if an orange platy is male or female and if one is
> pregnant or not?? We have one that is about 50% bigger than the other
> and has a swollen belly.

The middle fin underneath (gonopodium) is fan shaped on the female (and
all juveniles).

> 5. When feeding fish, is it recommended that you do it with or without
> the filter running? (It is a the filter that comes with a TopFin 10
> gallon starter tank)

Without, if the filter is taking in a significant amount of food. Does
the Topfin use a vertical pouch and no bio-wheel. Careful about changing
that filter, as your good nitrifying bacteria are in the sponge. Clean
it lightly, using tank water in a pail. Keep the old cartridge behind
any new installed cartridge so the bacteria cross-seeds the new cartridge
for a few weeks.

> 6. I live in the north end of Hull, and the fishtank is next to a
> window that faces west-northwest. How often should the lamp be on?
> Whenever we are up? The tank never gets direct sunlight due to it's
> positioning.

Without real plants, it does not matter. Indirect light is enough for
the fish to live with. The light is really for you, so having it on when
you are home is fine. I have a few customers from Hull PQ, and
considering the drive, you must not have very good pet shops in Hull. If
you are going to the Big Als in the west, then there is a SuperPet
between the Future Shop and the Holiday Inn (at least you get 2 places to
shop at for one drive). For the east end Al's, there is only the
PetSmart next door, but you always have us in the newsgroup to help ya
:o)

NetMax

> Thanks in advance,
>
> Marcel
>
> PS - Reply to the newsgroup, as my hotmail account is pretty swamped
> with spam...

[trance]

hi
i will try to help as much as i can

when i change my water i add a cotioner to remove the chlorine and
also use a mixture of hot and cold so the tempure is very close to the
water already in the tank.if the tank is taking a long time to cycle
you can buy additives to speed this up

1it sounds like the right amount of fish,most of what you have will
only grow to about 2 inches
2 if you want to clean the plastic weed of the filter material,i won't
use tap water because you will be removing some of the bactria that
cycles the water ,instead use the water taken from the tank when
change it.

3 most of the fish you have need a range of 7.0 to 7.4 pH,but that
should come down as the tank matures

4 if a platy is pregnant you will notice her belly swelling and most
often will see a gravid spot which is a black spot behind her anal fin
Platys usually take 30 days to birth and will square off within a day
or two of the "big day" (her belly will get a squared look to the
bottom of it, kind of similar to old style bathtubs), another sign
although not as reliable, the males in the tank will start to chase
her more then what they normally do and she will hide and likely stop
eating right before.
as for sexing them,Males are smaller and have a gonopodium (smaller
fins near the anal area)

5 i leave my fliter running all the time except when cleaning it

6 as for the light i switch mine on in the morning and leave it ob
till i go to bed around 9 or 10 pm

hope that helps,if you want any more information myt e-mail is

regards trance
On 17 Mar 2004 11:03:25 -0800, (Mudbunny) wrote:

>Hey there everybody. From reading previous posts in here, I can see
>there is quite a good knowledge base available here that I would love
>to pick through for advice.
>
>A couple of monthw ago my wife bought a 10 gallon fishtank from our
>local Big Al's (mumble-mumble). We put water, gravel, filter and a
>pack of the bacteria starter in, let it sit a week (as advised by the
>salesguy) and then got a couple fish. 2 Orange Platy's and two fancy
>guppies. My wife wanted more and, after consulting with sales-dude, we
>were advised to wait a week, and then we could add (at most) 4 more.
>The next week, we got 4 more fancy guppies.
>
>Every week, we were doing about a 20% water change. After about 3
>weeks, the fancy guppies started dieing. Scooped them out and, after
>checking the water and seeing that nitrite and nitrate were high (and
>water a bit cloudy), went to the local PetSmart and asked some advice
>on what water tretment to use. The saleslady recommended doing
>nothing, and letting the tank cycle some more to develop the proper
>bacteria to deal with the nitrite and to do weekly 10% water
>changes/gravel vacuums. The cloudy was explained as being the bacteria
>growing, and that it would clear up in about a week or so, and to wait
>until that happened before we added fish.
>
>No Problem.
>
>A week later, the water is clear, so she added a couple more fish (4
>bloodfin something or others) and a ramshorn snail. The water is
>pretty clear, although the nitrite and nitrate are a bit high. I just
>got a better kit, and am starting a log to see how often it goes up
>and down. I have a couple of questions that I would like some help
>with.
>
>1. Is this too much fish for a 10 gallon? The fish-person said no, but
>it seems like it will be pretty tight based upon the 1 inch/gallon.
>Any growing fish and we are screwed.
>
>2. We have some plastic plants in there that are getting pretty algae
>coated. How should I clean these? Is removing them, rinsing them (no
>soap) and putting them back the best idea? How about other fish to
>add? (not now, 'cause I figure the tank is at its limit, but when some
>fish die).
>
>3. What are the recommended conditions for the fish/snail we currently
>have? As of last night, I had pH 7.6, NH3 0, dgH 9, nitrite 0.5 and
>nitrate 2.5. (I am unsure of Nitrite and nitrate, the others I am sure
>of).
>
>4. How can you tell if an orange platy is male or female and if one is
>pregnant or not?? We have one that is about 50% bigger than the other
>and has a swollen belly.
>
>5. When feeding fish, is it recommended that you do it with or without
>the filter running? (It is a the filter that comes with a TopFin 10
>gallon starter tank)
>
>6. I live in the north end of Hull, and the fishtank is next to a
>window that faces west-northwest. How often should the lamp be on?
>Whenever we are up? The tank never gets direct sunlight due to it's
>positioning.
>
>Thanks in advance,
>
>Marcel
>
>PS - Reply to the newsgroup, as my hotmail account is pretty swamped
>with spam...

[Mudbunny]

"NetMax" > wrote in message >...
> "Mudbunny" > wrote in message
> om...
> > Hey there everybody. From reading previous posts in here, I can see
> > there is quite a good knowledge base available here that I would love
> > to pick through for advice.
> >
> > A couple of monthw ago my wife bought a 10 gallon fishtank from our
> > local Big Al's (mumble-mumble).
>
> mumble mumble?

I don't remember what comes after Big Al's, so therefore the mumble
mumble. <g>

> Any of the Guppies survive, or is it just the Plays and the Bloodfins
> left? Cycling with fish would be best done with 4 Bloodfins. Platys and
> Guppies would already labour in Hull's soft river water (Hull PQ?), so
> the extra NH3/4 and NO2 would be a stressor on them.

All the guppies are dead. Now we have 2 platys, 4 bloodfins and a
snail. Yup, I am in Hull Quebec. I have a Brita filter on my tap. I
currently use tap water (not filtered) and then add some dechlorinator
and let it sit overnight when I do my water changes. Should I filter
it through the Brita??

> > 3. What are the recommended conditions for the fish/snail we currently
> > have? As of last night, I had pH 7.6, NH3 0, dgH 9, nitrite 0.5 and
> > nitrate 2.5. (I am unsure of Nitrite and nitrate, the others I am sure
> > of).
>
> Livebearers like that pH but with harder water. Your characins like the
> sof****er but a lower pH. Nobody like your NO2, but it's not at
> dangerous levels. I haven't known snails to be too particular,
> preferring softer water, but with some hardness. You really should not
> have any NO2 if your tank is cycled.

How would I harden the water a little bit then. I am going to be
measuring the levels every night for the next little while so I can
get a sense of where it is in the cycle and if I should expect any
more fish deaths..

> > 5. When feeding fish, is it recommended that you do it with or without
> > the filter running? (It is a the filter that comes with a TopFin 10
> > gallon starter tank)
>
> Without, if the filter is taking in a significant amount of food. Does
> the Topfin use a vertical pouch and no bio-wheel. Careful about changing
> that filter, as your good nitrifying bacteria are in the sponge. Clean
> it lightly, using tank water in a pail. Keep the old cartridge behind
> any new installed cartridge so the bacteria cross-seeds the new cartridge
> for a few weeks.

Yup. The topfin has a vertical pouch. What I am doing is removing the
outer pouch and carbon, and keeping the plastic support. I rinse it
off and then put a new pouch and carbon on the old support.

>
> > 6. I live in the north end of Hull, and the fishtank is next to a
> > window that faces west-northwest. How often should the lamp be on?
> > Whenever we are up? The tank never gets direct sunlight due to it's
> > positioning.
>
> Without real plants, it does not matter. Indirect light is enough for
> the fish to live with. The light is really for you, so having it on when
> you are home is fine. I have a few customers from Hull PQ, and
> considering the drive, you must not have very good pet shops in Hull. If
> you are going to the Big Als in the west, then there is a SuperPet
> between the Future Shop and the Holiday Inn (at least you get 2 places to
> shop at for one drive). For the east end Al's, there is only the
> PetSmart next door, but you always have us in the newsgroup to help ya
> :o)

When we go, we end up going to the Big Als in the east End, on Innes
Rd. The PetsMart is just next door. As for petshops in Hull, there is
one in Les Galleries de Hull, but I doubt that they know much about
fish or anything<g>

Marcel

[TYNK 7]

>Subject: Newbie looking for (future) help with 10 gallon tank (long)
>From: (Mudbunny)
>Date: 3/17/2004 1:03 PM Central Standard Time
>Message-id: >
>
>Hey there everybody. From reading previous posts in here, I can see
>there is quite a good knowledge base available here that I would love
>to pick through for advice.
>
>A couple of monthw ago my wife bought a 10 gallon fishtank from our
>local Big Al's (mumble-mumble). We put water, gravel, filter and a
>pack of the bacteria starter in, let it sit a week (as advised by the
>salesguy) and then got a couple fish. 2 Orange Platy's and two fancy
>guppies. My wife wanted more and, after consulting with sales-dude, we
>were advised to wait a week, and then we could add (at most) 4 more.
>The next week, we got 4 more fancy guppies.
>

What type of "bacteria starter" did you use?
Also, why were you told to wait a week without fish?
If you used Bio Spira..you could add the fish right away.
If you used a product such as Stress Zyme or Cycle..you wasted your money and
are now cycling WITH fish.


>Every week, we were doing about a 20% water change. After about 3
>weeks, the fancy guppies started dieing. Scooped them out and, after
>checking the water and seeing that nitrite and nitrate were high (and
>water a bit cloudy),

Most likey because your tank is cycling now (must have not used Bio Spira)
Cycling a tank with fish can be so stressful on a fish that it dies.

went to the local PetSmart and asked some advice

That right there could be dangerous. = )~
I'd advise coming here first...always!


>on what water tretment to use. The saleslady recommended doing
>nothing, and letting the tank cycle some more to develop the proper
>bacteria to deal with the nitrite and to do weekly 10% water
>changes/gravel vacuums.

The first part she told you was right, the part about vacuuming weekly during
the cycle process was not. You shouldn't vacuum a brand new tank for about a
month. Of course if you've over fed then vacuum it up and don't over feed.

The cloudy was explained as being the bacteria
>growing, and that it would clear up in about a week or so,

Can take up to a few weeks.


and to wait
>until that happened before we added fish.
>
>No Problem.
>
>A week later, the water is clear, so she added a couple more fish (4
>bloodfin something or others) and a ramshorn snail.

You were over stocked in the first place and then added 4 more fish and 2
sails.
Being a newbie, you did not know this and are getting advice from PetsMart.
Naughty naughty (but you are innocent only once) = )~

The water is
>pretty clear, although the nitrite and nitrate are a bit high. I just
>got a better kit, and am starting a log to see how often it goes up
>and down. I have a couple of questions that I would like some help
>with.
>
>1. Is this too much fish for a 10 gallon?

Yes. For a 10g tank..yes. For a newly set up tank..VERY much yes.


>The fish-person said no,
Wrong.

but
>it seems like it will be pretty tight based upon the 1 inch/gallon.

That is an old "rule" that really doesn't apply to this hobby anymore.
It only applies to thin bodied, inch long fish.
Not many of those in the hobby. Maybe a wild Guppy (not the fancy).
Take for instance your Platies. They can reach 3" long, and about 2 1/2"
tall..and have a think body...this means that becuase if it's total mass...it
takes up more room that a thin bodied, 3" long fish.
You don't see many fully grown Platies out there, but some stores carry them
too (one of the local shops I visit has many).

>Any growing fish and we are screwed.

Consider yourself past tense. = )~

>
>2. We have some plastic plants in there that are getting pretty algae
>coated. How should I clean these? Is removing them, rinsing them (no
>soap) and putting them back the best idea?
Well, seeing that you're already over stocked, I wouldn't suggest adding any
type of algae eater...*especially* not a Pleco, as they can reach 12+ inches
long.

How about other fish to
>add? (not now, 'cause I figure the tank is at its limit, but when some
>fish die).
>
>3. What are the recommended conditions for the fish/snail we currently
>have? As of last night, I had pH 7.6, NH3 0, dgH 9, nitrite 0.5 and
>nitrate 2.5. (I am unsure of Nitrite and nitrate, the others I am sure
>of).
>
>4. How can you tell if an orange platy is male or female and if one is
>pregnant or not?? We have one that is about 50% bigger than the other
>and has a swollen belly.

A male live bearer (which is what platies are) will have something that it
similar to a male human's penis. It's a modified fin under their belly that is
thin, and can move about...the male fish swims up to the female and turns it
towards the female's vent where he depostis sperm.
The female, if not prego will become prego and have birth to live fry (baby
fish) in like 28 days (almost a month is normal for live bearing fish). If
already prego, she can store the sperm and use it later. Yes..fish are odd..but
in a cool way. = )
A female live bearer can save sperm, and get about 3 batches of fry from one
mating.
She simply uses some, saves some and has babies, uses some more...etc ect.
This is why many folks are confused when they buy a female fish only and she
has 3 batches of fry without a male in her tank.

>
>5. When feeding fish, is it recommended that you do it with or without
>the filter running? (It is a the filter that comes with a TopFin 10
>gallon starter tank)

Do not turn the filter off.

>
>6. I live in the north end of Hull, and the fishtank is next to a
>window that faces west-northwest. How often should the lamp be on?
>Whenever we are up? The tank never gets direct sunlight due to it's
>positioning.

This is probably why with a new tank you already have algae growth.
This will be a battle if you leave the tank in direct sunlight.
Or, you can move the tank.
The only spot for my 75g is across from a large bay window, so I accept my
algae battle. Doesn't mean I like it, but it's my choice because that's where I
want the tank. However, I don't let the direct morning sun hit the tank, I keep
the curtains closed until the sun's up enough to miss the tank.

>
>Thanks in advance,
>
>Marcel
>
>PS - Reply to the newsgroup, as my hotmail account is pretty swamped
>with spam...

[NetMax]

"Mudbunny" > wrote in message
om...
> "NetMax" > wrote in message
>...
> > "Mudbunny" > wrote in message
> > om...
> > > Hey there everybody. From reading previous posts in here, I can see
> > > there is quite a good knowledge base available here that I would
love
> > > to pick through for advice.
> > >
> > > A couple of monthw ago my wife bought a 10 gallon fishtank from our
> > > local Big Al's (mumble-mumble).
> >
> > mumble mumble?
>
> I don't remember what comes after Big Al's, so therefore the mumble
> mumble. <g>

ahh, it's Aquarium Services.

> > Any of the Guppies survive, or is it just the Plays and the Bloodfins
> > left? Cycling with fish would be best done with 4 Bloodfins. Platys
and
> > Guppies would already labour in Hull's soft river water (Hull PQ?),
so
> > the extra NH3/4 and NO2 would be a stressor on them.
>
> All the guppies are dead. Now we have 2 platys, 4 bloodfins and a
> snail. Yup, I am in Hull Quebec. I have a Brita filter on my tap. I
> currently use tap water (not filtered) and then add some dechlorinator
> and let it sit overnight when I do my water changes. Should I filter
> it through the Brita??

Unfiltered dechlorinated tap should be fine. You can search the archives
on the effect of Brita filtration on aquarium water. I can't recall what
the findings were.

> > > 3. What are the recommended conditions for the fish/snail we
currently
> > > have? As of last night, I had pH 7.6, NH3 0, dgH 9, nitrite 0.5 and
> > > nitrate 2.5. (I am unsure of Nitrite and nitrate, the others I am
sure
> > > of).
> >
> > Livebearers like that pH but with harder water. Your characins like
the
> > sof****er but a lower pH. Nobody like your NO2, but it's not at
> > dangerous levels. I haven't known snails to be too particular,
> > preferring softer water, but with some hardness. You really should
not
> > have any NO2 if your tank is cycled.
>
> How would I harden the water a little bit then. I am going to be
> measuring the levels every night for the next little while so I can
> get a sense of where it is in the cycle and if I should expect any
> more fish deaths..

Aquarium salt is good for livebearers but can't go too far with
characins. You are probably on the same water as Ottawa, so marine salt
would be better as it adds calcium as well. A few pieces of crushed
coral would harden the water, or just use limestone to improve the
buffer.

> > > 5. When feeding fish, is it recommended that you do it with or
without
> > > the filter running? (It is a the filter that comes with a TopFin 10
> > > gallon starter tank)
> >
> > Without, if the filter is taking in a significant amount of food.
Does
> > the Topfin use a vertical pouch and no bio-wheel. Careful about
changing
> > that filter, as your good nitrifying bacteria are in the sponge.
Clean
> > it lightly, using tank water in a pail. Keep the old cartridge
behind
> > any new installed cartridge so the bacteria cross-seeds the new
cartridge
> > for a few weeks.
>
> Yup. The topfin has a vertical pouch. What I am doing is removing the
> outer pouch and carbon, and keeping the plastic support. I rinse it
> off and then put a new pouch and carbon on the old support.

I think the pouch holds much of the bacteria. I'd get buy a better
filter. In any case, you should not be messing with your filter while
the tank is cycling.

> >
> > > 6. I live in the north end of Hull, and the fishtank is next to a
> > > window that faces west-northwest. How often should the lamp be on?
> > > Whenever we are up? The tank never gets direct sunlight due to it's
> > > positioning.
> >
> > Without real plants, it does not matter. Indirect light is enough
for
> > the fish to live with. The light is really for you, so having it on
when
> > you are home is fine. I have a few customers from Hull PQ, and
> > considering the drive, you must not have very good pet shops in Hull.
If
> > you are going to the Big Als in the west, then there is a SuperPet
> > between the Future Shop and the Holiday Inn (at least you get 2
places to
> > shop at for one drive). For the east end Al's, there is only the
> > PetSmart next door, but you always have us in the newsgroup to help
ya
> > :o)
>
> When we go, we end up going to the Big Als in the east End, on Innes
> Rd. The PetsMart is just next door. As for petshops in Hull, there is
> one in Les Galleries de Hull, but I doubt that they know much about
> fish or anything<g>

Ottawa is really not too bad for LFS considering the city's small
population. There are 2 at 200 tanks each, 4 at over 100 tanks each, and
2 at under 100 tanks, all together, at least 1000 aquariums, within 25
min. drive from each other. Makes for a very pleasant Sunday afternoon
drive :o)

NetMax

> Marcel

[Marcel Beaudoin]

"NetMax" > wrote in
:

>
> "Mudbunny" > wrote in message
> om...
>>
>> How would I harden the water a little bit then. I am going to be
>> measuring the levels every night for the next little while so I can
>> get a sense of where it is in the cycle and if I should expect any
>> more fish deaths..
>
> Aquarium salt is good for livebearers but can't go too far with
> characins. You are probably on the same water as Ottawa, so marine
> salt would be better as it adds calcium as well. A few pieces of
> crushed coral would harden the water, or just use limestone to improve
> the buffer.

OK. I will have to drop by the local PetsMart or Big Als this weekend to
see about getting some.

>> Yup. The topfin has a vertical pouch. What I am doing is removing the
>> outer pouch and carbon, and keeping the plastic support. I rinse it
>> off and then put a new pouch and carbon on the old support.
>
> I think the pouch holds much of the bacteria. I'd get buy a better
> filter. In any case, you should not be messing with your filter while
> the tank is cycling.

Huh. 'Cause the replacement instructions say that the bacteria is on the
plastic support. Either way, I think I will not touch it beyond the
weekly change that I have been doing until I am sure that my tank has
cycled and is in good shape. Then, if I feel like spending more money and
I see a problem, I will look into another/better filter.


Marcel

[Marcel Beaudoin]

(TYNK 7) wrote in
:

> What type of "bacteria starter" did you use?
> Also, why were you told to wait a week without fish?
> If you used Bio Spira..you could add the fish right away.
> If you used a product such as Stress Zyme or Cycle..you wasted your
> money and are now cycling WITH fish.

I used Stress-zyme, 'cause that is what we were told to use. Oh well, you
live and learn...
>
>> went to the local PetSmart and asked some advice
>
> That right there could be dangerous. = )~
> I'd advise coming here first...always!

I know that now...

>>on what water tretment to use. The saleslady recommended doing
>>nothing, and letting the tank cycle some more to develop the proper
>>bacteria to deal with the nitrite and to do weekly 10% water
>>changes/gravel vacuums.
>
> The first part she told you was right, the part about vacuuming weekly
> during the cycle process was not. You shouldn't vacuum a brand new
> tank for about a month. Of course if you've over fed then vacuum it up
> and don't over feed.

I am feeding less now and turning off the filter while I feed. I am also
not crumbling it up as much. It floats on top of the water and they go nuts
eating it and ripping it apart.

> and to wait
>>until that happened before we added fish.
>>
>>No Problem.
>>
>>A week later, the water is clear, so she added a couple more fish (4
>>bloodfin something or others) and a ramshorn snail.
>
> You were over stocked in the first place and then added 4 more fish
> and 2 sails.
> Being a newbie, you did not know this and are getting advice from
> PetsMart. Naughty naughty (but you are innocent only once) = )~

Oh well. Such is life. You live, you learn. WHen we move from ana partment
into a house, we will be getting a larger aquarium. Until then, they will
have to live in the 10 gallon.

>>2. We have some plastic plants in there that are getting pretty algae
>>coated. How should I clean these? Is removing them, rinsing them (no
>>soap) and putting them back the best idea?
> Well, seeing that you're already over stocked, I wouldn't suggest
> adding any type of algae eater...*especially* not a Pleco, as they can
> reach 12+ inches long.

Done. Or should I say, not done.<g>

Thanks for your help.

Marcel

[NetMax]

"Marcel Beaudoin" > wrote in message
. ..
> "NetMax" > wrote in
> :
>
> >
> > "Mudbunny" > wrote in message
> > om...
<snip>
>
> >> Yup. The topfin has a vertical pouch. What I am doing is removing
the
> >> outer pouch and carbon, and keeping the plastic support. I rinse it
> >> off and then put a new pouch and carbon on the old support.
> >
> > I think the pouch holds much of the bacteria. I'd get buy a better
> > filter. In any case, you should not be messing with your filter
while
> > the tank is cycling.
>
> Huh. 'Cause the replacement instructions say that the bacteria is on
the
> plastic support. Either way, I think I will not touch it beyond the
> weekly change that I have been doing until I am sure that my tank has
> cycled and is in good shape. Then, if I feel like spending more money
and
> I see a problem, I will look into another/better filter.
>
> Marcel

Really eh? I don't own any TopFin filters so I'll let someone else
comment on what their bacteria storage capacity looks like. I'd be very
sceptical, as filter media spreads out to cover several square feet for
bacteria to populate, and a non-porous plastic support would seem to only
add up to a few square inches. Doesn't seem comparable to me.

NetMax

[TYNK 7]

>Subject: Re: Newbie looking for (future) help with 10 gallon tank (long)
>From: Marcel Beaudoin
>Date: 3/18/2004 10:01 PM Central Standard Time
>Message-id: >
>
(TYNK 7) wrote in
:
>
>> What type of "bacteria starter" did you use?
>> Also, why were you told to wait a week without fish?
>> If you used Bio Spira..you could add the fish right away.
>> If you used a product such as Stress Zyme or Cycle..you wasted your
>> money and are now cycling WITH fish.
>
>I used Stress-zyme, 'cause that is what we were told to use. Oh well, you
>live and learn...
>>
>>> went to the local PetSmart and asked some advice
>>
>> That right there could be dangerous. = )~
>> I'd advise coming here first...always!
>
>I know that now...
>
>>>on what water tretment to use. The saleslady recommended doing
>>>nothing, and letting the tank cycle some more to develop the proper
>>>bacteria to deal with the nitrite and to do weekly 10% water
>>>changes/gravel vacuums.
>>
>> The first part she told you was right, the part about vacuuming weekly
>> during the cycle process was not. You shouldn't vacuum a brand new
>> tank for about a month. Of course if you've over fed then vacuum it up
>> and don't over feed.
>
>I am feeding less now and turning off the filter while I feed. I am also
>not crumbling it up as much. It floats on top of the water and they go nuts
>eating it and ripping it apart.
>
>> and to wait
>>>until that happened before we added fish.
>>>
>>>No Problem.
>>>
>>>A week later, the water is clear, so she added a couple more fish (4
>>>bloodfin something or others) and a ramshorn snail.
>>
>> You were over stocked in the first place and then added 4 more fish
>> and 2 sails.
>> Being a newbie, you did not know this and are getting advice from
>> PetsMart. Naughty naughty (but you are innocent only once) = )~
>
>Oh well. Such is life. You live, you learn. WHen we move from ana partment
>into a house, we will be getting a larger aquarium. Until then, they will
>have to live in the 10 gallon.
>
>>>2. We have some plastic plants in there that are getting pretty algae
>>>coated. How should I clean these? Is removing them, rinsing them (no
>>>soap) and putting them back the best idea?
>> Well, seeing that you're already over stocked, I wouldn't suggest
>> adding any type of algae eater...*especially* not a Pleco, as they can
>> reach 12+ inches long.
>
>Done. Or should I say, not done.<g>
>
>Thanks for your help.
>
>Marcel
>
>
>

Well, you're off on a good start now.
You have a wealth of knowledge here, and don't worry that any question may be
silly, or asked a million times....doesn't matter. Everyone starts someplace,
but sure is better to have somebody save ya from making the mistakes most
newbies do.
I've made them all and have learned from them. I just try to help save somebody
from the heartache if I can.
I am often a little too blunt, but that's just from so many years of trying to
be nice, and to explain things sweet as pie....which didn't work half the time.
Now, I tell it like it is. Sure I get some folks who think I'm a big
B*tch...but for the hundreds of people I help each month, it's all worth it. If
I can save one fish by being blunt, that makes me feel good inside.
It has nothing to do with me being right and them wrong...not at all. It's all
about the fish's well being.
There's too much bogus info out there in this hobby. Heck, many books have
outdated or down right wrong info in them. It's so hard for a newbie to this
hobby to get to the truth.
They go to PetsMart where their employees are refered to as Pet
Specialists.....and most of them don't know squat.
Just yesterday I was in PetsMart buying some fish meds (new Clown loaches have
Ich..a parasite), and their "specialist" was selling a lady a Comet for her 5g
tank. He knew very well what size tank she just purchased.
I mentioned that a Betta would be a much better choice for a small tank like
that, and she asked why...I told her because those fish can reach 12 or more,
etc...and she said..oh no...it's only a couple inches.
I explained that it will get this (held out my arms) big....and she then says
well I can always put it in with my husbands tropical fish in his 20g. I went
on about why you don't mix tropicals and cold water fishes and then she
says...well, it's only a fish.
The "specialist" went on to tell me that she wouldn't be able to put anything
else with a male Betta (he even called it a "beta", duh!). I explained to him
many different fish that can be kept with a male Betta...he simply argued and
refused to learn. How sad.

[Marcel Beaudoin]

(TYNK 7) wrote in
:
> Well, you're off on a good start now.

I just checked, and my nitrite level is 0. (yay!!) Does that mean I can
consider my tank to have been cycled and I can now start regular water
changes?? I figure I would wait a week or so and then do about 10-15%
water changes every week.

> You have a wealth of knowledge here, and don't worry that any question
> may be silly, or asked a million times....doesn't matter. Everyone
> starts someplace, but sure is better to have somebody save ya from
> making the mistakes most newbies do.

I will do my best. When my wife and I get a house and get a new, larger
tank, I will definately be getting more advice here. Until then, I will
be lurking, reading, and asking questions when I need to.

> I've made them all and have learned from them. I just try to help save
> somebody from the heartache if I can.
> I am often a little too blunt, but that's just from so many years of
> trying to be nice, and to explain things sweet as pie....which didn't
> work half the time. Now, I tell it like it is. Sure I get some folks
> who think I'm a big B*tch...but for the hundreds of people I help each
> month, it's all worth it. If I can save one fish by being blunt, that
> makes me feel good inside. It has nothing to do with me being right
> and them wrong...not at all. It's all about the fish's well being.
> There's too much bogus info out there in this hobby. Heck, many books
> have outdated or down right wrong info in them. It's so hard for a
> newbie to this hobby to get to the truth.

Nothing is wrong with blunt. I don't mind being called an idiot for
making a mistake. Or being told that it was a stupid decision. As long as
the reason why it was a bad choice is explained, and why this other
option is better. (Note, I am not saying that you, or anyone else in here
has...yet<grin>) Right now my tank has stabilised (I think). When the
fish in there do die (and they will, eventually) I know where to go to
get information on what is best to add in there. Ideally the next fish
will be an algae eater, but until then, I will have to rinse off my
plastic plants myself, or find some way to convince my snail to crawl up
them.


> They go to PetsMart where their employees are refered to as Pet
> Specialists.....and most of them don't know squat.

Yup. I was in yesterday to try to find some crushed coral (as recommended
by NetMax). I explained that I had a 10 gallon aquarium and needed a
small amount of coral. She offers me a 15 lb bag. I already know that
they are pretty clueless when it comes to dogs (unless you talk to one of
the company reps that comes in. I like Hill's people, they are nice and
smart) Now I know it is the same for fish.

Thanks

Marcel

[Robert Flory]

"Marcel Beaudoin" > wrote in message
. ..
>
> I will do my best. When my wife and I get a house and get a new, larger
> tank, I will definately be getting more advice here. Until then, I will
> be lurking, reading, and asking questions when I need to.
>
Touch base with us when you upsize you tank. If you do it right, using all
the old filter media, plants, gravel and etc you can all but bypass the
cycle. Also plants utilize ammonia directly. I saw a 130 gallon tank this
weekend that had 13 adult discus (talk about a fish load), mechanical
filtration and no bio filter, just big beautiful plants. It had been
stripped down three weeks earlier. One wouldn't know it from looking at it.


Between now and them when you find yourself with free time try searching at
http://fins.actwin.com/aquatic-plants/

and

http://www.kernsanalysis.com/fish/netmax.html they are working on an
update

the krib and fishgeeks are good places too.


Bob

[Marcel Beaudoin]

"Robert Flory" > wrote in
:

> Touch base with us when you upsize you tank. If you do it right,
> using all the old filter media, plants, gravel and etc you can all but
> bypass the cycle. Also plants utilize ammonia directly. I saw a 130
> gallon tank this weekend that had 13 adult discus (talk about a fish
> load), mechanical filtration and no bio filter, just big beautiful
> plants. It had been stripped down three weeks earlier. One wouldn't
> know it from looking at it.
>
>
> Between now and them when you find yourself with free time try
> searching at http://fins.actwin.com/aquatic-plants/
>
> and
>
> http://www.kernsanalysis.com/fish/netmax.html they are working on an
> update
>
> the krib and fishgeeks are good places too.
>

Thanks for the site suggestions. Before I add any live plants, I think I
will get familiar with the fishes first. In theory, the fish tank is my
wife's, but, in practice, I am the one who will be taking care of it...

Marcel

[Robert Flory]

I'd suggest adding some low lite plants right off. Makes for a healthier
more stable tank.

Gives the fish cover, everyone is happier.

bob


"Marcel Beaudoin" > wrote in message
. ..
> "Robert Flory" > wrote in
> :
>
> > Touch base with us when you upsize you tank. If you do it right,
> > using all the old filter media, plants, gravel and etc you can all but
> > bypass the cycle. Also plants utilize ammonia directly. I saw a 130
> > gallon tank this weekend that had 13 adult discus (talk about a fish
> > load), mechanical filtration and no bio filter, just big beautiful
> > plants. It had been stripped down three weeks earlier. One wouldn't
> > know it from looking at it.
> >
> >
> > Between now and them when you find yourself with free time try
> > searching at http://fins.actwin.com/aquatic-plants/
> >
> > and
> >
> > http://www.kernsanalysis.com/fish/netmax.html they are working on an
> > update
> >
> > the krib and fishgeeks are good places too.
> >
>
> Thanks for the site suggestions. Before I add any live plants, I think I
> will get familiar with the fishes first. In theory, the fish tank is my
> wife's, but, in practice, I am the one who will be taking care of it...
>
> Marcel

[PurityFailed]

>I'd suggest adding some low lite plants right off.

>bob

I haven't done any business yet with these guys, but they have some interesting
plant packages. Here's the address to a supposedly low-requirement set:

http://www.azgardens.com/habitats_easy.php

Jessica
(Oh please let the tank cycle...)