Betta question

[kraut]

Am new to bettas and was wondering how big of a tank is needed for 1
betta??

I would like to get 2 and was wondering if I could have 2 in one tank
and if so how big a tank??

TIA

[Victor Martinez]

kraut wrote:
> Am new to bettas and was wondering how big of a tank is needed for 1
> betta??

The smallest tank you should have is 5 gallons, with proper filtration.

> I would like to get 2 and was wondering if I could have 2 in one tank
> and if so how big a tank??

Unless it's a male and a female, you cannot keep them in the same tank.
They will fight until one of them is dead.

--
Victor M. Martinez
Owned and operated by the Fantastic Seven (TM)
Send your spam here:
Email me here:

[Monicaiscool]

Am new to bettas and was wondering how big of a tank is needed for 1
betta??

I would like to get 2 and was wondering if I could have 2 in one tank
and if so how big a tank??

TIA

Beta's for the most part can be kept in pretty small tanks, they don't need filteration or air pumped in to the tank because they can breath air from the surface unlike most fish, they have special tanks at any local store, wal-mart, petsmart, ect.

Betas shouldn't be kept in a tank together unless there is a divider.
If you decide to get the divider, i would get a male and female or two females, because males could become over stressed.
This is a link showing this kind of tank, and the other is just standard beta tanks




http://www.petsmart.com/global/product_detail.jsp?PRODUCT%3C%3Eprd_id=84552444177 8287&FOLDER%3C%3Efolder_id=2534374302037042&ASSORTMENT%3C%3East_id=2534374302023693&bmUID=1153375312646&itemNo=12&Nao=12&In=Fish&N=2037042&Ne=2


http://www.petsmart.com/global/search/search_results.jsp?In=Fish&N=2037042&Ne=2

[Sunny]

"kraut" > wrote in message
...
> Am new to bettas and was wondering how big of a tank is needed for 1
> betta??
>
> I would like to get 2 and was wondering if I could have 2 in one tank
> and if so how big a tank??

I have kept Bettas in 7 Litre tanks (2 Gal) for the last 4 years.
No filter or heater (mild climate in Qld Australia)
Water needs to be treated and 70% - 80% changed weekly, to help keep them
healthy.
Each male needs to be in its own tank, although 2-3 females may be OK
together once they sort out who is in charge :-)
Some plastic plants in the tank help them rest near the surface as well.
Browse through these :
http://freshaquarium.about.com/cs/anabantids2/p/betta.htm
http://betta.allbio.org/
http://www.bellaonline.com/articles/art17376.asp
http://aquamaniacs.net/forum/portal.php

[Dick]

On Wed, 19 Jul 2006 21:04:07 -0500, Victor Martinez >
wrote:

>kraut wrote:
>> Am new to bettas and was wondering how big of a tank is needed for 1
>> betta??
>
>The smallest tank you should have is 5 gallons, with proper filtration.
>
I have seen single male Betas in small bowls, no filtration.

>> I would like to get 2 and was wondering if I could have 2 in one tank
>> and if so how big a tank??
>
>Unless it's a male and a female, you cannot keep them in the same tank.
>They will fight until one of them is dead.

You can put them in the same tank if you put a clear divider between.
They will put on beautiful displays.

Betas are sometimes put singularly into community tanks. It has been
a long times since I tried. As I recall they sometimes would nip
fins.

dick

[Köi-Lö]

"Victor Martinez" > wrote in message
...
>
> Unless it's a male and a female, you cannot keep them in the same tank.
> They will fight until one of them is dead.
=========================
This is not a good idea. I know this from experience. Unless the female is
ready to breed the male may constantly attack and harass her until she
dies - that is unless the tank is quite large and she can avoid him.
Bettas do very well in 1g tanks or jars.
--
KL....
Aquariums since 1952.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[Tynk]

Dick wrote:

> >
> I have seen single male Betas in small bowls, no filtration.
>
>
> Betas are sometimes put singularly into community tanks. It has been
> a long times since I tried. As I recall they sometimes would nip
> fins.
>
> dick

FYI....that would be Betta. (it's pornounced "bet-uh", not "bait-uh"
and is the usual reason for the misspelling)

Bettas can only survive in a small, unheated and unfiltered bowl.
However, they will thrive in a heated tank.
1g is the absolute minimum tank they should be housed in.
Keeping them in community tanks is often fine, and I do recommend it.
However, as with every single Betta, each has a different personality
and that needs to be considered.
Tank mates are usually the ones doing the nipping and the Betta ends of
shredded if put in with the wrong type.
Fish that are very small, such as live bearer fry or Neons when very
tiny (fully grown Neons are usually fine) make for good snacks.
Bettas are carnivores, so anything it can fit into it's mouth will be.
In regard to housing a male in with females, again that depends on tank
size, as well as each individual personality of each fish. Sex plays no
part in aggression here. A female can shred up a male just as good, so
only experienced Betta keepers should house females and a male in one
tank.
These fish are aware of what goes on outside their tank, so they
quickly become tame to their owners.
Stay away from freeze dried foods, as they will cause constipation.
They need a good staple food and another "meat' type food, such as
frozen bloodworms or brine shrimp.
They should be fed twice a day, in small amounts.
Their water should be kept clean and heated to 78-80*f.

[[-=LÈGIÖN=-]]

This message has been recycled. HMMmmm.....

On 7/20/2006 6:17 PM, Tynk wrote:
> Dick wrote:
>
>
>> I have seen single male Betas in small bowls, no filtration.
>>
>>
>> Betas are sometimes put singularly into community tanks. It has been
>> a long times since I tried. As I recall they sometimes would nip
>> fins.
>>
>> dick
>>
>
> FYI....that would be Betta. (it's pornounced "bet-uh", not "bait-uh"
> and is the usual reason for the misspelling)
>
> Bettas can only survive in a small, unheated and unfiltered bowl.
> However, they will thrive in a heated tank.
> 1g is the absolute minimum tank they should be housed in.
> Keeping them in community tanks is often fine, and I do recommend it.
> However, as with every single Betta, each has a different personality
> and that needs to be considered.
> Tank mates are usually the ones doing the nipping and the Betta ends of
> shredded if put in with the wrong type.
> Fish that are very small, such as live bearer fry or Neons when very
> tiny (fully grown Neons are usually fine) make for good snacks.
> Bettas are carnivores, so anything it can fit into it's mouth will be.
> In regard to housing a male in with females, again that depends on tank
> size, as well as each individual personality of each fish. Sex plays no
> part in aggression here. A female can shred up a male just as good, so
> only experienced Betta keepers should house females and a male in one
> tank.
> These fish are aware of what goes on outside their tank, so they
> quickly become tame to their owners.
> Stay away from freeze dried foods, as they will cause constipation.
> They need a good staple food and another "meat' type food, such as
> frozen bloodworms or brine shrimp.
> They should be fed twice a day, in small amounts.
> Their water should be kept clean and heated to 78-80*f.
>
>
Makes me wonder who's recycling messages. Could our favourite fag boi
Roy Hauer be back from the methadone clinic?

[[-=LÈGIÖN=-]]

On 7/20/2006 10:31 AM, Köi-Lö wrote:
>
> "Victor Martinez" > wrote in message
> ...
>>
>> Unless it's a male and a female, you cannot keep them in the same
>> tank. They will fight until one of them is dead.
> =========================
> This is not a good idea. I know this from experience. Unless the
> female is ready to breed the male may constantly attack and harass her
> until she dies - that is unless the tank is quite large and she can
> avoid him. Bettas do very well in 1g tanks or jars.
I managed to learn in two months what it took you ten years.
You can fold your hand any time now.

Now go stand in the corner of the bathroom and pretend to be the roll of
toilet paper.

[Victor Martinez]

Dick wrote:
> I have seen single male Betas in small bowls, no filtration.

That doesn't mean it's the best for the fish.

--
Victor M. Martinez
Owned and operated by the Fantastic Seven (TM)
Send your spam here:
Email me here:

[Tynk]

[-=LÈGIÖN=-] wrote:
> This message has been recycled. HMMmmm.....
>
> On 7/20/2006 6:17 PM, Tynk wrote:
> > Dick wrote:
> >
> >
> >> I have seen single male Betas in small bowls, no filtration.
> >>
> >>
> >> Betas are sometimes put singularly into community tanks. It has been
> >> a long times since I tried. As I recall they sometimes would nip
> >> fins.
> >>
> >> dick
> >>
> >
> > FYI....that would be Betta. (it's pornounced "bet-uh", not "bait-uh"
> > and is the usual reason for the misspelling)
> >
> > Bettas can only survive in a small, unheated and unfiltered bowl.
> > However, they will thrive in a heated tank.
> > 1g is the absolute minimum tank they should be housed in.
> > Keeping them in community tanks is often fine, and I do recommend it.
> > However, as with every single Betta, each has a different personality
> > and that needs to be considered.
> > Tank mates are usually the ones doing the nipping and the Betta ends of
> > shredded if put in with the wrong type.
> > Fish that are very small, such as live bearer fry or Neons when very
> > tiny (fully grown Neons are usually fine) make for good snacks.
> > Bettas are carnivores, so anything it can fit into it's mouth will be.
> > In regard to housing a male in with females, again that depends on tank
> > size, as well as each individual personality of each fish. Sex plays no
> > part in aggression here. A female can shred up a male just as good, so
> > only experienced Betta keepers should house females and a male in one
> > tank.
> > These fish are aware of what goes on outside their tank, so they
> > quickly become tame to their owners.
> > Stay away from freeze dried foods, as they will cause constipation.
> > They need a good staple food and another "meat' type food, such as
> > frozen bloodworms or brine shrimp.
> > They should be fed twice a day, in small amounts.
> > Their water should be kept clean and heated to 78-80*f.
> >
> >
> Makes me wonder who's recycling messages. Could our favourite fag boi
> Roy Hauer be back from the methadone clinic?
>
>
Recycled?
What are you talking about?
Both the replies I have done in the past few days have also showed up
with a date *after* I posted them. Is this what you are talking about.
I do find it odd that I message I sent like on the 18th says I did it
on the 20th.
Let's see when this one pops up. It's Friday, the 21st.
And no, I am most certainly not sombody by the name of Roy.
I am quite female.
So save your silly comments about this Roy person and explain what you
mean by my post being recycled.

[Victor Martinez]

Tynk wrote:
> So save your silly comments about this Roy person and explain what you
> mean by my post being recycled.

Please don't feed the trolls.

--
Victor M. Martinez
Owned and operated by the Fantastic Seven (TM)
Send your spam here:
Email me here:

[Tynk]

Victor Martinez wrote:
> Tynk wrote:
> > So save your silly comments about this Roy person and explain what you
> > mean by my post being recycled.
>
> Please don't feed the trolls.
>
>
Thanks for letting me know that person was a troll, Victor.
I've not been posting here for a while because of all the creeps that
invaded.
I did wonder why the 2 other posts I had made earlier in the week had a
date on them that was later then when I posted them.
And what is this recyling posts that "it" spoke of?

[Köi-Lö]

"Tynk" > wrote in message
oups.com...

Köi-Lö wrote:
> "Victor Martinez" > wrote in message
> ...
> >
> > Unless it's a male and a female, you cannot keep them in the same tank.
> > They will fight until one of them is dead.
> =========================
> This is not a good idea. I know this from experience. Unless the female
> is
> ready to breed the male may constantly attack and harass her until she
> dies - that is unless the tank is quite large and she can avoid him.
> Bettas do very well in 1g tanks or jars.
> --
> KL....
> Aquariums since 1952.
> My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
> http://tinyurl.com/9do58
> ~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

I'm guessing you don't have much experience housing a male inwith
females.

I'm guessing you are quite WRONG. Perhaps your males were not as aggressive
as mine were.

Rarely have I ever had a male go after a female until he killed her.

He doesn't KILL her - the stress and infections from torn fins kill her.

Of course in something small, such as a 1g or 2g or even a 3g
sure...there will be problems.

There will even be problems in a 10g tank. A planted 30Long would be much
better for the female as she can get away from his harassment. Unless your
males are not very aggressive.

However, it's not always the male doing it. It's not always about a
breeding thing either.

No one said it was ALWAYS about a breeding thing now did they? :-)

It's about territory and aggression in each individual Betta.

Exactly!

As usual, each Betta is different. As long as you have a large enough
tank (and we're not talking that it must be enormous, just no smaller
than a 10g with like 3 females to one male, but a larger tank is always
better) and their indifivual personalites allow it, they can be
perfectly fine.

This has all been said here before I believe.

I've been keeping Bettas for 28 yrs and housing a male with females is
common place.

Of course it is *IF* the tank is large enough and the females can avoid the
males harassment.

I also bred them for 19 of those yrs and I've only had 4 (one recently)
that couldn't be housed with females.

9 out of 10 of those I had couldn't be trusted with females in anything less
than a 30L planted tank. You seem to have unusually unaggressive males.

I will say I have had more females not allow a male in the tank. I
currently have a batch of females with 2 of them that shred up any male
they see.

I can't comment since I never put a male in the tanks that housed my
females.

One of those ladies would kill if she had the chance. She's that
aggressive with males but peachy with the other females, as long as
they know their place in their hierarchy.
To say the do "well in jars"....not really. They simply survive.
They should be kept in heated tanks and let thrive.

I agree, if someone has the money and space for all those tanks... they
should go for it. The rest of us will continue to use bowls and large
jars. This too has been discussed here before.

Unless you have a heated fish room, a room temp bowl isn't going to be
at 78-80*f (their proper temp).
Flucuating temps (unheated bowls or tanks) is hard on any fish. When it
comes to Bettas they are more prone to fin infections because of this.
--
KL....
Aquariums since 1952.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[Köi-Lö]

"Victor Martinez" > wrote in message
...
> Dick wrote:
>> I have seen single male Betas in small bowls, no filtration.
>
> That doesn't mean it's the best for the fish.
=====================
If you're really concerned about what is BEST for the fish then we need to
leave them in their NATURAL environment. No fishtank can come close to
that.
--
KL....
Aquariums since 1952.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[Victor Martinez]

Köi-Lö wrote:
> If you're really concerned about what is BEST for the fish then we need
> to leave them in their NATURAL environment. No fishtank can come close
> to that.

Again, you are wrong. Many fish species in the wild have shorter life
spans than in captivity.
Besides, we are not arguing over the morality of keeping fish, but on
how best to keep them. A larger tank will always be better.

--
Victor M. Martinez
Owned and operated by the Fantastic Seven (TM)
Send your spam here:
Email me here:

[Marco Schwarz]

Hi..

> That doesn't mean it's the best for the fish.

100% ACK..!
HTH..
--
cu
Marco

[Köi-Lö]

"Victor Martinez" > wrote in message
...
> Köi-Lö wrote:
>> If you're really concerned about what is BEST for the fish then we need
>> to leave them in their NATURAL environment. No fishtank can come close
>> to that.
>
> Again, you are wrong. Many fish species in the wild have shorter life
> spans than in captivity.

You're entitled to your opinion. No fish is going to have a better QUALITY
of life in the limited space of a fishtank than they achieve in their
natural habitat where they evolved. A LONG life is not necessarily a
"happy" or healthy life.

> Besides, we are not arguing over the morality of keeping fish, but on how
> best to keep them. A larger tank will always be better.

This I agree with. But nothing can be better than a fish's or animal's
natural habitat for the general welfare of the animal/fish/bird and it's
quality of life. A prime example are the cageless zoos and the reasons for
them.
--
KL.......
Aquariums since 1952.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[Köi-Lö]

"[-=LÈGIÖN=-]" > wrote in message
...
>
> I kept a pair in my 55 gal when I started the hobby back up again this
> spring, after 20 years of being awol... they were my first pair of
> bettas and I had no problems at all. They had lots of swimming room,
> plenty of plants to duck and hide.

They would probably also do well in a well planted 30Long tank as well.
But people who try to put a pair in a small tank can be sorely disappointed.

But they were my best fish ever, with their personalities and
> easy going demeanor.

They definitely have their own personalities. :-)

--
KL....
Frugal ponding since 1995.
Aquariums since 1952.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[Victor Martinez]

Köi-Lö wrote:
> You're entitled to your opinion.

Idem.

> No fish is going to have a better
> QUALITY of life in the limited space of a fishtank than they achieve in
> their natural habitat where they evolved. A LONG life is not
> necessarily a "happy" or healthy life.

Let's take a simple and common example, shall we? Cardinal tetras. In
the wild they have to forrage for food, escape predators, and then
suffocate in the dry season when their habitat dries up. In my little
tank they have no predators, get food twice a day and they have a life
expentance of several years. :)

> This I agree with. But nothing can be better than a fish's or animal's
> natural habitat for the general welfare of the animal/fish/bird and it's
> quality of life. A prime example are the cageless zoos and the reasons
> for them.

I think it's dangerous to make a generalization like that across species
as different as fish and mammals. For many species, living in the wild
is a daily struggle for survival.
In general, I am against imprisonment of higher species for our amusement.

--
Victor M. Martinez
Owned and operated by the Fantastic Seven (TM)
Send your spam here:
Email me here:

[Dick]

On Fri, 21 Jul 2006 14:13:07 -0500, Victor Martinez >
wrote:

>Köi-Lö wrote:
>> You're entitled to your opinion.
>
>Idem.
>
> > No fish is going to have a better
>> QUALITY of life in the limited space of a fishtank than they achieve in
>> their natural habitat where they evolved. A LONG life is not
>> necessarily a "happy" or healthy life.
>
>Let's take a simple and common example, shall we? Cardinal tetras. In
>the wild they have to forrage for food, escape predators, and then
>suffocate in the dry season when their habitat dries up. In my little
>tank they have no predators, get food twice a day and they have a life
>expentance of several years. :)
>
>> This I agree with. But nothing can be better than a fish's or animal's
>> natural habitat for the general welfare of the animal/fish/bird and it's
>> quality of life. A prime example are the cageless zoos and the reasons
>> for them.
>
>I think it's dangerous to make a generalization like that across species
>as different as fish and mammals. For many species, living in the wild
>is a daily struggle for survival.
>In general, I am against imprisonment of higher species for our amusement.

The world would be better off without terrorists. How things might be
better is an endless list. What we each do is make the best of our
own situation.

If I only have a 1 gallon tank, then I do my best to not over crowd
it. However, if my life quality is improved by having the fish, I
find it relaxing in a hectic world, then the fish is doing something
important.

Animal rights must always be second to human needs. It is the way of
the world. I have been told my 10 gallon tank is too small for my 2
SAEs and 1 Clown Loach. I can find no difference in color nor
activity between them and those I have in a 75 gallon tank.

Do you have telepathy with your fish?

I feel sorry for my dogs when they rush the fence to chase rabbits. I
think they would be happier to run in the fields. There is a trade
off, fun for longevity.

Of course, it doesn't matter, I won't risk my happiness on the chance
they will be happier outside the fence. They seem happy with my
choice.

dick

[Dick]

On 20 Jul 2006 16:17:49 -0700, "Tynk" > wrote:

>
>Dick wrote:
>
>> >
>> I have seen single male Betas in small bowls, no filtration.
>>
>>
>> Betas are sometimes put singularly into community tanks. It has been
>> a long times since I tried. As I recall they sometimes would nip
>> fins.
>>
>> dick
>
>FYI....that would be Betta. (it's pornounced "bet-uh", not "bait-uh"
>and is the usual reason for the misspelling)
>
Google points out the spelling error, but still listed sites. Pleco
is not a correct spelling either, but is used. I saved one whole
stroke.

A rose by any other name smells as sweet.

dick
>Bettas can only survive in a small, unheated and unfiltered bowl.
>However, they will thrive in a heated tank.
>1g is the absolute minimum tank they should be housed in.
>Keeping them in community tanks is often fine, and I do recommend it.
>However, as with every single Betta, each has a different personality
>and that needs to be considered.
>Tank mates are usually the ones doing the nipping and the Betta ends of
>shredded if put in with the wrong type.
>Fish that are very small, such as live bearer fry or Neons when very
>tiny (fully grown Neons are usually fine) make for good snacks.
>Bettas are carnivores, so anything it can fit into it's mouth will be.
>In regard to housing a male in with females, again that depends on tank
>size, as well as each individual personality of each fish. Sex plays no
>part in aggression here. A female can shred up a male just as good, so
>only experienced Betta keepers should house females and a male in one
>tank.
>These fish are aware of what goes on outside their tank, so they
>quickly become tame to their owners.
>Stay away from freeze dried foods, as they will cause constipation.
>They need a good staple food and another "meat' type food, such as
>frozen bloodworms or brine shrimp.
>They should be fed twice a day, in small amounts.
>Their water should be kept clean and heated to 78-80*f.

[Köi-Lö]

"Victor Martinez" > wrote in message
...
> Köi-Lö wrote:
>> You're entitled to your opinion.
>
> Idem.
>
> > No fish is going to have a better
>> QUALITY of life in the limited space of a fishtank than they achieve in
>> their natural habitat where they evolved. A LONG life is not necessarily
>> a "happy" or healthy life.
>
> Let's take a simple and common example, shall we? Cardinal tetras. In the
> wild they have to forrage for food, escape predators, and then suffocate
> in the dry season when their habitat dries up. In my little tank they have
> no predators, get food twice a day and they have a life expentance of
> several years. :)

Several years of WHAT though? Boredom? Again, think of the cageless zoo.
The animals that paced themselves into insanity in the zoos also lived much
longer than their wild brethren, but there was little quality to that extra
time.

>> This I agree with. But nothing can be better than a fish's or animal's
>> natural habitat for the general welfare of the animal/fish/bird and it's
>> quality of life. A prime example are the cageless zoos and the reasons
>> for them.

> I think it's dangerous to make a generalization like that across species
> as different as fish and mammals. For many species, living in the wild is
> a daily struggle for survival.

That they are well suited to........ If they were not, they would have gone
extinct.

> In general, I am against imprisonment of higher species for our amusement.

I am as well. I'm also very much against keeping birds in those small cages
most people buy and against lizards and snakes kept in tanks. I've seen
rabbits kept in tiny cages where they had hardly any room to lay down. I've
seen dogs kept in fenced pens so small that were wall to wall feces. And as
for fish. The death rate of those sold in pet shops is astronomical. Most
are dead within a few weeks due to ignorance and other reasons...... hardly
an improvement over nature.
--
KL....
Aquariums since 1952.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[Köi-Lö]

"Dick" > wrote in message
...
> I feel sorry for my dogs when they rush the fence to chase rabbits. I
> think they would be happier to run in the fields. There is a trade
> off, fun for longevity.
>
> Of course, it doesn't matter, I won't risk my happiness on the chance
> they will be happier outside the fence. They seem happy with my
> choice.
=================
Where cruelty and lack of quality of life come in is where dogs are kept in
such small pens they are living in their own feces. Some have little or no
shade. There were several recent cases where I live of dogs not even being
given water in this heat and humidity. One pup died before the woman (a
neighbor) could get help for the pup. The owner casually tossed it into the
garbage can.......
--
KL....
Aquariums since 1952.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[Victor Martinez]

Köi-Lö wrote:
> Several years of WHAT though? Boredom?

I seriously doubt fish have enough brains to get bored. :)

> Again, think of the cageless
> zoo. The animals that paced themselves into insanity in the zoos also
> lived much longer than their wild brethren, but there was little quality
> to that extra time.

We're talking fish, not mammals.

> That they are well suited to........ If they were not, they would have
> gone extinct.

Who says they aren't in process of being extinct?

--
Victor M. Martinez
Owned and operated by the Fantastic Seven (TM)
Send your spam here:
Email me here:

[Nikki]

> They definitely have their own personalities. :-)


Which is a big part of if a male/female can be put together. Most times
people say you can only put a male by him self, and some males that is true,
but not most of them, mind seem to do better in a community.
Tynk I think has hers in a 75g, Ed I think had his in a 55g, I have a pair
in a 30 long, with out no problem.
I have a male & female betta in with gourami's, and they get along great,
most people say you cant do that.
Its just a matter of how that betta male or female gets along with the other
fish. Like tynk I have had several females give a males a run for their
money. My female never hides from my male, they swim around together I am
yet to see him try and nip her, now on occasion she will nip him but I think
she just wants him to know his place. I see it wrote on here all the time,
bettas have to be alone, they have to be in bowls, all kind of things that
are not true, and its a shame because it adds to all the miss information
out there about them.
Nik

[Köi-Lö]

"Victor Martinez" > wrote in message
...
> Köi-Lö wrote:
>> Several years of WHAT though? Boredom?
>
> I seriously doubt fish have enough brains to get bored. :)

But we can't know that. I've seen fish swim mindlessly up and down the
corner of a tank - just like the pacing animals in the old zoos.

>> Again, think of the cageless zoo. The animals that paced themselves into
>> insanity in the zoos also lived much longer than their wild brethren, but
>> there was little quality to that extra time.
>
> We're talking fish, not mammals.

Fish have brains. They're not houseplants. ;-) See above. I had one
betta that was clearly going stir-bugs in a 2g display tank. He'd swim
aimlessly back and forth from one end of the tank to the other, about 2"
above the gravel... over and over and over,...back and forth.... little
difference between that and the caged bird that sways back and forth by the
hour. Or the big cat that paces endlessly from one end of it's cage to the
other.

>> That they are well suited to........ If they were not, they would have
>> gone extinct.
>
> Who says they aren't in process of being extinct?

Who says *we're* not in the process of going extinct? ;-)
--
KL....
Aquariums since 1952.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[Köi-Lö]

"Nikki" > wrote in message
...
>> They definitely have their own personalities. :-)
>
>
> Which is a big part of if a male/female can be put together. Most times
> people say you can only put a male by him self, and some males that is
> true, but not most of them, mind seem to do better in a community.
> Tynk I think has hers in a 75g, Ed I think had his in a 55g, I have a pair
> in a 30 long, with out no problem.

These are BIGGER tanks and if planted and the bettas are not very
aggressive, it should be ok. I just don't think people should be encouraged
to even try it if they have a tank smaller than a 30L. Also as someone
already mentioned - they will eat anything small enough to get into their
mouths. That can be anything from a small neon tetra to a baby platy or
guppy.

> I have a male & female betta in with gourami's, and they get along great,
> most people say you cant do that.
> Its just a matter of how that betta male or female gets along with the
> other fish. Like tynk I have had several females give a males a run for
> their money. My female never hides from my male, they swim around
> together I am yet to see him try and nip her,

The males I had would rapidly chase away any female not interested in their
ever present bubble nests. After losing females to infections in shredded
fins I kept them all separate unless pairing them off to breed.

now on occasion she will nip him but I think
> she just wants him to know his place. I see it wrote on here all the time,
> bettas have to be alone, they have to be in bowls, all kind of things that
> are not true,

You can't say it's not true since you don't know the temperaments of the
fish the person posting has, or how large their tanks are, or if the tanks
are planted or not. So what may be true of a 30L planted tank with a few
mellow bettas will not apply to someone with a 10g tank with one or no
plants.

and its a shame because it adds to all the miss information
> out there about them.

See above. It's not misinformation where really aggressive bettas are
concerned and smaller tanks with few or no hiding places. Don't assume
everyone has a 30L or larger planted tank.
--
KL....
Aquariums since 1952.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö>

[Köi-Lö]

"[-=LÈGIÖN=-]" > wrote in message
...

> Ding Ding Ding Ding Ding..

DARN! I thought you were the ice cream man!!!!! :-))

> Time Out....Time Out....
> Now go to your corners.
> Whew..
--
KL....
Aquariums since 1952.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[Nikki]

What does your male think of her? Is there a big size difference between
them? you still have your male dont you. I have put a lot of bettas in the
tank with no quarantine, been fine so far. I did not know walmart kept their
females in bowls, petsmart puts their in tanks, but petco keep them in bowls
also.
she sounds pretty,
Nik


> I just picked up a really nice light-turqouise female betta this pm.
> She's about 1.25 inches and seems to being enjoying the new home from
> the cramped little plastic bowl she was in at the Walmart store.
>
> No quarantine took place...just slow acclimating her to the new water
> and hope for the best. Not showing any signs of stress, finnage all
> out on point, checking the 'hood out. Eating sun-dried shrimp as I
> type this. Hoping for the best.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
>

[[-=LÈGIÖN=-]]

Nikki wrote:
> What does your male think of her? Is there a big size difference between
> them? you still have your male dont you. I have put a lot of bettas in the
> tank with no quarantine, been fine so far. I did not know walmart kept their
> females in bowls, petsmart puts their in tanks, but petco keep them in bowls
> also.
> she sounds pretty,
> Nik
>
>
>
>> I just picked up a really nice light-turqouise female betta this pm.
>> She's about 1.25 inches and seems to being enjoying the new home from
>> the cramped little plastic bowl she was in at the Walmart store.
>>
>> No quarantine took place...just slow acclimating her to the new water
>> and hope for the best. Not showing any signs of stress, finnage all
>> out on point, checking the 'hood out. Eating sun-dried shrimp as I
>> type this. Hoping for the best.
>>
Hi Nikki..!..

I lost the male about a month ago. It developed a pine cone affect
where his scales jutted outward and he lost his color. He died in
quaratine. My guess was something intestinal.

So for now she's by herself. Once my platy babes are mature enough to
determine sex, I have a new neighbor that would like some. She wants to
start the hobby again (after coming over and seeing my tank all full of
life. =)

At present, the largest fish my 55 is a bala shark...he's growing like a
weed ..just under 4 inches. Doesn't bother a sole. So the babies
wonder all about the tank, from top to bottom, with no fear save man.
They're all under half an inch now.

If female bettas can be content living among their own sex, I'd be
content with just the females. Has anyone kept only female bettas for
long periods of time?

--



[-=LÈGIÖN=-]
...For We Are Many -

Trailer For Sale or Rent

































































--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

[Köi-Lö]

"Nikki" > wrote in message
. ..
> What does your male think of her? Is there a big size difference between
> them? you still have your male dont you. I have put a lot of bettas in the
> tank with no quarantine, been fine so far. I did not know walmart kept
> their females in bowls, petsmart puts their in tanks, but petco keep them
> in bowls also.
> she sounds pretty,
> Nik
===============
The Wal*Mart stores here keep them in the plastic shipping "bowls" or cups
with tops. There is a hole in the top for feeding and air exchange. The
boy working there told me they are no longer allowed to feed the fish. I
suppose they allow those not sold to starve to death. The Plecos were like
skeletons......
--
KL....
Aquariums since 1952.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[Köi-Lö]

""[-=LÈGIÖN=-]"" > wrote in message
.. .
> If female bettas can be content living among their own sex, I'd be content
> with just the females. Has anyone kept only female bettas for long
> periods of time?
====================
Yes, and they got along ok. A nip here and there but otherwise they lived
in relative peace.
--
KL....
Aquariums since 1952.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[Nikki]

""[-=LÈGIÖN=-]"" > wrote in message
.. .
> Nikki wrote:
>> What does your male think of her? Is there a big size difference between
>> them? you still have your male dont you. I have put a lot of bettas in
>> the tank with no quarantine, been fine so far. I did not know walmart
>> kept their females in bowls, petsmart puts their in tanks, but petco keep
>> them in bowls also.
>> she sounds pretty,
>> Nik
>>
>>
>>
>>> I just picked up a really nice light-turqouise female betta this pm.
>>> She's about 1.25 inches and seems to being enjoying the new home from
>>> the cramped little plastic bowl she was in at the Walmart store.
>>>
>>> No quarantine took place...just slow acclimating her to the new water
>>> and hope for the best. Not showing any signs of stress, finnage all
>>> out on point, checking the 'hood out. Eating sun-dried shrimp as I
>>> type this. Hoping for the best.
>>>
> Hi Nikki..!..
>
> I lost the male about a month ago. It developed a pine cone affect where
> his scales jutted outward and he lost his color. He died in quaratine.
> My guess was something intestinal.
> So for now she's by herself. Once my platy babes are mature enough to
> determine sex, I have a new neighbor that would like some. She wants to
> start the hobby again (after coming over and seeing my tank all full of
> life. =)
> At present, the largest fish my 55 is a bala shark...he's growing like a
> weed ..just under 4 inches. Doesn't bother a sole. So the babies wonder
> all about the tank, from top to bottom, with no fear save man. They're all
> under half an inch now.
>
> If female bettas can be content living among their own sex, I'd be content
> with just the females. Has anyone kept only female bettas for long
> periods of time?
>
>
> [-=LÈGIÖN=-]
> ...For We Are Many -
>
> Trailer For Sale or Rent
>
I have kept females by them self and they been fine. I had one of my females
in with some gouramis and loaches for quite some time, a couple of weeks ago
I added a male and they seem fine together. I also have a ten gl divided
three ways with Plexiglas with a male in one part, a female in another and a
betta fry who is about half way grown in the other part.
sorry about your male, I had the same thing happen to my female.
I am thinking about setting up a all shark tank, think that will be neat, I
have a RTS who don't seem to like no fish at all, I read the other day that
RTS are minnows (sp?) I did not know that.
What color is your platy that had babies, I have a set of sunset and a set
of micky mouse, i found a baby from the sunset in the tank one day and you
can tell what it is because its orange, but the following week i seen a lot
of babies, i dipped them out and they are not that same color so i am
thinking they are from the blue platy, but they have no color yet they dont
look much different then the fancy guppy fry right now. What did your babies
look like the first week?
Nik

[Nikki]

"Köi-Lö" <$##$$@$##$$.#$$> wrote in message
...
>
> "Nikki" > wrote in message
> . ..
>> What does your male think of her? Is there a big size difference between
>> them? you still have your male dont you. I have put a lot of bettas in
>> the tank with no quarantine, been fine so far. I did not know walmart
>> kept their females in bowls, petsmart puts their in tanks, but petco keep
>> them in bowls also.
>> she sounds pretty,
>> Nik
> ===============
> The Wal*Mart stores here keep them in the plastic shipping "bowls" or cups
> with tops. There is a hole in the top for feeding and air exchange. The
> boy working there told me they are no longer allowed to feed the fish. I
> suppose they allow those not sold to starve to death. The Plecos were
> like skeletons......
> --
> KL....
> Aquariums since 1952.
> My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
> http://tinyurl.com/9do58
> ~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>
>
They don't feed them? humm, I don't know what to say, other then no wonder
they die so often when people bring them home.
The best set up I found was petsmart because they were in a filtered tank,
however they did not look to good to me so who knows maybe they are better
separate at the stores, unlike other fish female bettas go though a process
of figuring out who is boss and that can take a good week, I guess them
going though that twice, once at the store then again when someone gets them
home...is not good for them.
Nik

[Köi-Lö]

"Nikki" > wrote in message
...
>
> "Köi-Lö" <$##$$@$##$$.#$$> wrote in message
>> The Wal*Mart stores here keep them in the plastic shipping "bowls" or
>> cups with tops. There is a hole in the top for feeding and air exchange.
>> The boy working there told me they are no longer allowed to feed the
>> fish. I suppose they allow those not sold to starve to death. The
>> Plecos were like skeletons......
>> ~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>
>>
> They don't feed them? humm, I don't know what to say, other then no wonder
> they die so often when people bring them home.

That's what the young man said that works in that dept. He's forbidden to
feed them and they keep the thing locked so no one else can feed them
either. There's a board of some kind with an actual lock on it that must be
unlocked so they can see the fish or remove the dead ones. Judging by some
of the skeletons I saw and fuzzy corpses I don' think they remove many of
the dead ones. :-( I avoid the pet section when I go there now. It gets
me too upset.......

> The best set up I found was petsmart because they were in a filtered tank,
> however they did not look to good to me so who knows maybe they are better
> separate at the stores, unlike other fish female bettas go though a
> process of figuring out who is boss and that can take a good week, I guess
> them going though that twice, once at the store then again when someone
> gets them home...is not good for them.

I agree. The poor little critters suffer a lot of stress between their
breeder and their final home.
--
KL....
Aquariums since 1952.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[Tynk]

[-=LÈGIÖN=-] wrote:
> Thanks for hanging around the aquaria groups. It will be noisy here
> from time to time, relative to the aquaria/pond/garden wars with
> certain posters as targets, including myself.
>
>
> Your postings are valuable us all.
>

Thanks.
I have to do what I can to save the poor Bettas living in cold jars!
Sheesh.
Some folks just want to argue.
I just like telling the facts.

[Tynk]

Köi-Lö wrote:

>
> > Besides, we are not arguing over the morality of keeping fish, but on how
> > best to keep them. A larger tank will always be better.
>
> This I agree with. But nothing can be better than a fish's or animal's
> natural habitat for the general welfare of the animal/fish/bird and it's
> quality of life. A prime example are the cageless zoos and the reasons for

Ok....but you just said in another post that Bettas are fine bowls or
jars.
They aren't.

[Tynk]

Victor Martinez wrote:

>
> Let's take a simple and common example, shall we? Cardinal tetras. In
> the wild they have to forrage for food, escape predators, and then
> suffocate in the dry season when their habitat dries up. In my little
> tank they have no predators, get food twice a day and they have a life
> expentance of several years. :)

> I think it's dangerous to make a generalization like that across species
> as different as fish and mammals. For many species, living in the wild
> is a daily struggle for survival.
> In general, I am against imprisonment of higher species for our amusement.

Oh Victor....GREAT example. Cardinals (neons too)!
In the wild, they are considred "annual" fish. This is because they
only live about a year, IF they don't get eaten or die of disease.
However, in a tank they live for many years.
Can't even compare.

[Tynk]

Koi Lo wrote:

>
> See above. It's not misinformation where really aggressive bettas are
> concerned and smaller tanks with few or no hiding places. Don't assume
> everyone has a 30L or larger planted tank.
> --

Being that this has been explained over and over and over....
That the tank needs to be large enough, well planted and that each
individual personality allows it, no one is talking about a small, bare
tank.
No one needs to assume it it has to be the size tank YOU used either.
Seems to me you're getting overly aggressive males.
If you have had a large enough tank and this many probs, I'd look into
finding new stock.
You also said in one of your posts about the male building his
nests....
If a male is in a filtered, heated tank and with 3 or more females
(proper size and dechor of course) there shouldn't be any spawning
behavior going on anyway.
You also run into trouble trying to house only one female and one male
per tank.
They have to form a hierarchy which can't be done properly with only a
pair.
Occasionly you will find a couple of placid Bettas and they're fine.
But to say the male will always shred a female, stress her, or kill
her, whatever it is you're saying today (this does change per post) and
that they shouldn't ever be housed together is simply wrong. It just
is.
I bet the entire problem you have experienced is not enough females and
a tank that was too small.
Besides....if you had overly aggressive males (rare with Splendens) you
should have never tried to house them together.

[Tynk]

[-=LÈGIÖN=-] wrote:

>
> If female bettas can be content living among their own sex, I'd be
> content with just the females. Has anyone kept only female bettas for
> long periods of time?

Absolutely.
Currently my 75g has only females.
After their initial bickering over the hierarchy, all is fine.
On occasion you may get 2 dominant females that neither will submit,
and one of them will need to find a new home.
This is all common when it comes to Bettas though.
When you have fish that need to push their weight around to find their
place, sometimes it can get nippy, or even a chunk of fin missing is
still normal.
Constant biting, no. Not normal and one is overly aggressive or just
can't stand that individual fish. They too have likes and dislikes.
I've specialized in these fish for 28 yrs and when it comes to them,
yes, I'd say I was an expert.
Once you really start to see their hierarchy, their body language,
etc....they make for quite interesting little fish.
I keep a rainbow of females in the 75g, and usually a resident male.
However, I have quite a bruiser of a female when it comes to the boys
and cannot house one in there now.
She's not even the alpha (the big boss) either. Just does not tolerate
a male at all.
Hey....what's a 30 liter in US gallons anyway?
Somebody tell me because I do not know the conversion.

[Tynk]

Köi-Lö wrote:

> Yes, and they got along ok. A nip here and there but otherwise they lived
> in relative peace.

You forgot the part about it depending on the individual personality of
each fish.
There are females from time to time that cannot be housed with certain
females, or some that can't be housed with any female.
This needs to be said *each* time.
It doesn't matter if you said it a month ago, or 20 minutes ago.
All Bettas are different and that needs to be said each time. You
should always have a back plan as well if it doesn't turn out the way
you want it to.
It's also so much easier when the females are spawn siblings.
Males things so much easier, as their hierarchy was figured out long
ago when they were babies.

[Tynk]

Tynk wrote:

> It's also so much easier when the females are spawn siblings.
> Males things so much easier, as their hierarchy was figured out long
> ago when they were babies.

That should have been *makes* things so much easier. = )~

[Köi-Lö]

"Tynk" > wrote in message
ups.com...

Köi-Lö wrote:

>
> > Besides, we are not arguing over the morality of keeping fish, but on
> > how
> > best to keep them. A larger tank will always be better.
>
> This I agree with. But nothing can be better than a fish's or animal's
> natural habitat for the general welfare of the animal/fish/bird and it's
> quality of life. A prime example are the cageless zoos and the reasons
> for
====================================
Ok....but you just said in another post that Bettas are fine bowls or
jars.
They aren't.

Wild bettas? Or are you talking about the unnaturally long finned bettas I
keep? You know the ones,... the ones that wouldn't last a day in a rice
patty.
--
KL....
Frugal ponding since 1995.
Aquariums since 1952.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[Köi-Lö]

"Tynk" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> Koi Lo wrote:
>
>>
>> See above. It's not misinformation where really aggressive bettas are
>> concerned and smaller tanks with few or no hiding places. Don't assume
>> everyone has a 30L or larger planted tank.
>> --
>
> Being that this has been explained over and over and over....
> That the tank needs to be large enough, well planted and that each
> individual personality allows it, no one is talking about a small, bare
> tank.

And no one was talking about a well planted 30L or larger either.

> No one needs to assume it it has to be the size tank YOU used either.

Nor the size YOU use either.

> Seems to me you're getting overly aggressive males.

I buy and bought what's available where I live.

> If you have had a large enough tank and this many probs, I'd look into
> finding new stock.
> You also said in one of your posts about the male building his
> nests....

Most males had nests most of the time.

> If a male is in a filtered, heated tank and with 3 or more females
> (proper size and dechor of course) there shouldn't be any spawning
> behavior going on anyway.

I guess my males didn't read your website since they had nests most of the
time, usually on the edge of or amid the planted area.

> You also run into trouble trying to house only one female and one male
> per tank.
> They have to form a hierarchy which can't be done properly with only a
> pair.
> Occasionly you will find a couple of placid Bettas and they're fine.
> But to say the male will always shred a female, stress her, or kill
> her,

Which is a very good possibility in a smaller unplanted tank
unfortunately..........

whatever it is you're saying today (this does change per post) and
> that they shouldn't ever be housed together is simply wrong. It just
> is.

Saying TODAY? When did I ever say it was fine to put to bettas together in
a small unplanted tank? You better learn to check those *headers* before
making such erroneous statements about what people say here. I have always
been for keeping bettas separate or no more than one to a tank.

> I bet the entire problem you have experienced is not enough females and
> a tank that was too small.

I bet you're wrong.........

> Besides....if you had overly aggressive males (rare with Splendens) you
> should have never tried to house them together.

Check headers.......... see above.
Reading Headers:
http://tinyurl.com/amm9s

--
KL....
Aquariums since 1952.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[Köi-Lö]

"Tynk" > wrote in message
oups.com...

Köi-Lö wrote:

> Yes, and they got along ok. A nip here and there but otherwise they lived
> in relative peace.

You forgot the part about it depending on the individual personality of
each fish.
There are females from time to time that cannot be housed with certain
females, or some that can't be housed with any female.
This needs to be said *each* time.

Then say it if you have hours and hours to type the same info endlessly.
You forgot that I'm going by my own experience - not YOUR experience. I
never had a female that killed or shredded other females. I'm sorry that
you did. You should have bought less aggressive females (as you told me
about my males.) . Why do you insist I post YOUR experience instead of my
own?

It doesn't matter if you said it a month ago, or 20 minutes ago.
All Bettas are different and that needs to be said each time. You
should always have a back plan as well if it doesn't turn out the way
you want it to.

Then tell people to buy TWO tanks for the females in case they don't get
along.

It's also so much easier when the females are spawn siblings.
Males things so much easier, as their hierarchy was figured out long
ago when they were babies.
--
KL....
Aquariums since 1952.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[Nikki]

30 Liters = 7.925161570744453 Gallons
http://www.calculateme.com/Volume/Liters/ToGallons.htm

http://www.easysurf.cc/cnver2.htm#gl1

nik



"Tynk" > wrote in message
ups.com...

[-=LÈGIÖN=-] wrote:

>
> If female bettas can be content living among their own sex, I'd be
> content with just the females. Has anyone kept only female bettas for
> long periods of time?

Absolutely.
Currently my 75g has only females.
After their initial bickering over the hierarchy, all is fine.
On occasion you may get 2 dominant females that neither will submit,
and one of them will need to find a new home.
This is all common when it comes to Bettas though.
When you have fish that need to push their weight around to find their
place, sometimes it can get nippy, or even a chunk of fin missing is
still normal.
Constant biting, no. Not normal and one is overly aggressive or just
can't stand that individual fish. They too have likes and dislikes.
I've specialized in these fish for 28 yrs and when it comes to them,
yes, I'd say I was an expert.
Once you really start to see their hierarchy, their body language,
etc....they make for quite interesting little fish.
I keep a rainbow of females in the 75g, and usually a resident male.
However, I have quite a bruiser of a female when it comes to the boys
and cannot house one in there now.
She's not even the alpha (the big boss) either. Just does not tolerate
a male at all.
Hey....what's a 30 liter in US gallons anyway?
Somebody tell me because I do not know the conversion.

[Nikki]

"[-=LÈGIÖN=-]" > wrote in message
...
> On 22 Jul 2006 12:30:45 -0700, "Tynk" > wrote:
>
>>
>>[-=LÈGIÖN=-] wrote:
>>> Thanks for hanging around the aquaria groups. It will be noisy here
>>> from time to time, relative to the aquaria/pond/garden wars with
>>> certain posters as targets, including myself.
>>>
>>>
>>> Your postings are valuable us all.
>>>
>>
>>Thanks.
>>I have to do what I can to save the poor Bettas living in cold jars!
>>Sheesh.
>>Some folks just want to argue.
>>I just like telling the facts.
>
>
> Amen...I am seriously considering another 55 gal and just stock it
> with female bettas...I'm serious. Just females. If this is a
> problem...SOMEBODY STOP ME. PLEASE.
>
>
>

No not a problem, just some stuff you should know before you do it, but
beyond that they can make a very pretty & interesting tank.
first thing, unlike most other setups with other fish, these guys are going
to nip and fight for a few days some times longer until they establish who
is who in the tank, alpha ect, once they have that worked out things will
settle down, from time to time you will see them bicker but that's ok. Once
in a while you will have one who is just not going to get along, this will
happen if two females want to be alpha and neither will back down, then you
may have two remove one of them. To be honest, I find it to be one of the
neatest setups because the way they interact with one another. You will see
different colors come out in them, and different personalities. Just when
you have time do a search on a female betta tank, there is some good
information that will explain what they will go though in the first week and
why, and even that is neat to watch form.
Nik

[Tynk]

Köi-Lö wrote:


> ====================================
> Ok....but you just said in another post that Bettas are fine bowls or
> jars.
> They aren't.
>
> Wild bettas? Or are you talking about the unnaturally long finned bettas I
> keep? You know the ones,... the ones that wouldn't last a day in a rice
> patty.
> --

Nope. The entire conversation has been about domestic Bettas, not wild
ones.
You tossed in the native habitats when everyone else was talking about
pet shops types, and aquariums. Then you started talking about how
tanks can't compare to their native habitats, etc....FYI - Patty is a
ladies name, not a rice paddie.

[Tynk]

Nikki wrote:
> 30 Liters = 7.925161570744453 Gallons
> http://www.calculateme.com/Volume/Liters/ToGallons.htm

Well then, Koi-Lo shouldn't be housing 3 (or more, as you shouldn't
ever just have 2 females per tank) females and one male in that small
of a tank anyway.
Thank Nik, you're a peach.
P.S....you also know what you're doing. = )

[Tynk]

[-=LÈGIÖN=-] wrote:

> >
> >Thanks.
> >I have to do what I can to save the poor Bettas living in cold jars!
> >Sheesh.
> >Some folks just want to argue.
> >I just like telling the facts.
>
>
> Amen...I am seriously considering another 55 gal and just stock it
> with female bettas...I'm serious. Just females. If this is a
> problem...SOMEBODY STOP ME. PLEASE.


No way! I'm not stopping you, hehe.
You will have a very cool tank in deed.
The only hard part will be when you add them, do it all at once. That
way they are all on neutral territory. This can be done by buying stock
and keeping them in quarantine tanks, or other tanks until you get the
desired amount for the 55g.
You will have bickering at first, as they need to figure out their
hierarchy.
Once that's established you'll see all their every day type body
language. This is so interesting to me and I can't get enough of it,
lol.
You'll soon figure out what each posture or finflash means for the
situation. You'll soon learn who is the alpha..all the way down to the
omega (lowest in rank).
You'll see action when another female wants to take over that role and
the difference between that and just "testing" the alpha. Now when you
have 2 females that refuse to back down, one needs to go to another
home. This is on the rare side, but since you have other tanks already,
it shouldn't be a problem for you.
There are several fin variations available now, and every color of the
rainbow to choose from. Who ever says females are drab, ugly, colorless
fish are ignorant and needs to do some research, lol.

[Köi-Lö]

"[-=LÈGIÖN=-]" > wrote in message
...
> Amen...I am seriously considering another 55 gal and just stock it
> with female bettas...I'm serious. Just females. If this is a
> problem...SOMEBODY STOP ME. PLEASE.
======================
Why not breed your own? You can sell or trade the excess and will soon have
loads of females.
--
KL....
Aquariums since 1952.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[Köi-Lö]

"Tynk" > wrote in message
oups.com...

Köi-Lö wrote:


> ====================================
> Ok....but you just said in another post that Bettas are fine bowls or
> jars.
> They aren't.
>
> Wild bettas? Or are you talking about the unnaturally long finned bettas
> I
> keep? You know the ones,... the ones that wouldn't last a day in a rice
> patty.
> --
========================
Nope. The entire conversation has been about domestic Bettas, not wild
ones.

* As for the *domestic* bettas with the unnaturally long fins - yes, they
are better off in captivity. The conversation/thread in general was about
FISH other than domestic bettas.

You tossed in the native habitats when everyone else was talking about
pet shops types, and aquariums.

* Are you claiming now that we're not allowed to discuss "native habitats?"

Then you started talking about how
tanks can't compare to their native habitats, etc....

* They can't. I'm talking quality of life (think cageless zoos) and you're
talking length of life.

FYI - Patty is a
ladies name, not a rice paddie.

* Are you the spelling police now? Why don't you just killfile me instead
of constantly harassing and trolling me? What are you getting out of this?
It seems you feel only *YOUR* experiences should be posted here, no one
else's experiences count. Maybe you should start a moderated betta group
where only approved messages concerning bettas can appear.
--
KL....
Aquariums since 1952.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[Köi-Lö]

"[-=LÈGIÖN=-]" > wrote in message
...
> On 22 Jul 2006 12:49:48 -0700, "Tynk" > wrote:
>>I bet the entire problem you have experienced is not enough females and
>>a tank that was too small.
>>Besides....if you had overly aggressive males (rare with Splendens) you
>>should have never tried to house them together.
>
>
> POPCORN...!!!
> PEANUTS....!!!
> CRACKER JACKS...!!!
===============
She's just trolling me. No one else's experiences with bettas count but her
own. The "spelling police" message was the tip-off. Some wanna-be trolls
harass others like this in their quest to drive the other person off. Also
egotistical people (and know-it-alls) forbid anyone else's experiences to be
posted that don't agree with what *they* experienced. It infuriates them
for some reason. But that's Usenet for you.
--
KL....
Aquariums since 1952.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[Köi-Lö]

"[-=LÈGIÖN=-]" > wrote in message
...
>
> SOMEBODY STOP ME.........
> We just can't have enough tanks, can we.
===========================
At some point we almost all say ENOUGH ALREADY! I found a home for my
platys. They're going to a gal with a 30Long I gave her as a wedding gift
18 years ago. Yep,... she still keeps fish. :-) The 10g will go back
into storage. But then I have all those huge outdoor tanks.........
--
KL....
Aquariums since 1952.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[Köi-Lö]

"Tynk" > wrote in message
oups.com...
>
> Nikki wrote:
>> 30 Liters = 7.925161570744453 Gallons
>> http://www.calculateme.com/Volume/Liters/ToGallons.htm
>
> Well then, Koi-Lo shouldn't be housing 3

Koi-Lo didn't house 3 or more bettas to a 10g tank.

(or more, as you shouldn't
> ever just have 2 females per tank) females and one male in that small
> of a tank anyway.

Who said my 30 gallon long tanks only hold 10 gallons of water? That makes
no sense.

> Thank Nik, you're a peach.
> P.S....you also know what you're doing. = )

30 gallon tanks hold 30 GALLONS, not 10 gallons of water. ;-)

--
KL.......
Frugal ponding since 1995.
Aquariums since 1952.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[Köi-Lö]

"[-=LÈGIÖN=-]" > wrote in message
...
> My neighbor, down the road, were yappin' about fish over coffee this
> afternoon. I told him I wish I had known more about bettas when I got
> into the hobby in the '80s. Just like the cichilds, I'm absolutely
> sold on their personality.

Then you would enjoy raising them! Why not give it a shot?

And since I'm more into heartier (?) fish
> these days,

Let's see if she CORRECTS your spelling......... ;-)

as I understand it, the bettas are right up my alley. I
> don't want to get into keeping pedigree fish anymore..too much money
> and time...the summer drought killed my money tree as it is.
>
> I'm brainstorming a 55 gal with about 12 colored female bettas and the
> right planting....I'll sleep good tonight, you can bet.

Check the second-hand stores for cheap tanks. Look for adds in the local
papers in the closest larger town. The last place to find a good bargain
are the pet stores.
--
KL....
Aquariums since 1952.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[Köi-Lö]

"[-=LÈGIÖN=-]" > wrote in message
...
> Put a halloween mask on...march up to the fish isle witha hammer and
> bust the damn locks off.
>
> Then run like hell.
>
> Don't forget the insanity plea, just in case. Better yet, fake a
> seizure.
======================
It just amazes me they can get away with such cruelty. The boy told me it
was because people would open containers of food from the shelves and feed
the fish, fouling the water. I can see that as the reason for having those
locked boards across the top. But there should be and could be one
designated employee to feed them once a day or every other day.

This is one of those quality-of-life issues I was talking about above. What
chance do these fish have and WM buys them by the million. What's the
chance someone experienced will buy fish there - one in several hundred?
Remember what happened to those beautiful calico lionheads I weakened and
bought there? I knew better than to take a chance. Within days they
developed those contagious ulcers and had to be returned. I'd bet you 99%
of the fish sold to WW are dead in less than a month.
--
KL....
Aquariums since 1952.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[Köi-Lö]

"[-=LÈGIÖN=-]" > wrote in message
...
>>
> Yeh, about 2 months ago, my closest walmart had great tanks running
> with healthy fish of great numbers and variety of species.

This was surely because they accidentally hired someone knowledgeable who
CARED. Don't give credit to the store manager. But few employees stay in
these stores long. The turnover is great.

Then about
> a month later, the entire isle is in shambles...I wont say anymore.
> You can guess the rest.

Yep,... I've seen this same thing happen here. But as for healthy?!?!?!
There were always a few with fungus or a bacterial infection plus ick. We
have a mom & pop store that's just as bad. I try to avoid temptation and
not stop there........

> Shameful. I picked up the betta girl yesterday, and I'll be damned if
> I'm not considering picking up another tank and rescue the whole lot
> of bettas from them.=?

But that just encourages these stores to order more. Surely you have a Pet
Supermarket or PetsMart there.
--
KL....
Aquariums since 1952.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[Nikki]

"Köi-Lö" <$##$$@$##$$.#$$> wrote in message
...
>
> "Tynk" > wrote in message
> oups.com...
>>
>> Nikki wrote:
>>> 30 Liters = 7.925161570744453 Gallons
>>> http://www.calculateme.com/Volume/Liters/ToGallons.htm
>>
>> Well then, Koi-Lo shouldn't be housing 3
>
> Koi-Lo didn't house 3 or more bettas to a 10g tank.
>
> (or more, as you shouldn't
>> ever just have 2 females per tank) females and one male in that small
>> of a tank anyway.
>
> Who said my 30 gallon long tanks only hold 10 gallons of water? That
> makes no sense.
>
>> Thank Nik, you're a peach.
>> P.S....you also know what you're doing. = )
>
> 30 gallon tanks hold 30 GALLONS, not 10 gallons of water. ;-)
>
> --
> KL.......
> Frugal ponding since 1995.
> Aquariums since 1952.
> My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
> http://tinyurl.com/9do58
> ~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>
>
>
She was asking how many gl is 30 liters.
Nik

[[-=LÈGIÖN=-]]

[-=LÈGIÖN=-] wrote:
> My neighbor, down the road, were yappin' about fish over coffee this
> afternoon. I told him I wish I had known more about bettas when I got
> into the hobby in the '80s. Just like the cichilds, I'm absolutely
> sold on their personality. And since I'm more into heartier (?) fish
> these days, as I understand it, the bettas are right up my alley. I
> don't want to get into keeping pedigree fish anymore..too much money
> and time...the summer drought killed my money tree as it is.
>
> I'm brainstorming a 55 gal with about 12 colored female bettas and the
> right planting....I'll sleep good tonight, you can bet.
>
>
> On 22 Jul 2006 13:06:09 -0700, "Tynk" > wrote:
>
>
>> [-=LÈGIÖN=-] wrote:
>>
>>
>>> If female bettas can be content living among their own sex, I'd be
>>> content with just the females. Has anyone kept only female bettas for
>>> long periods of time?
>>>
>> Absolutely.
>> Currently my 75g has only females.
>> After their initial bickering over the hierarchy, all is fine.
>> On occasion you may get 2 dominant females that neither will submit,
>> and one of them will need to find a new home.
>> This is all common when it comes to Bettas though.
>> When you have fish that need to push their weight around to find their
>> place, sometimes it can get nippy, or even a chunk of fin missing is
>> still normal.
>> Constant biting, no. Not normal and one is overly aggressive or just
>> can't stand that individual fish. They too have likes and dislikes.
>> I've specialized in these fish for 28 yrs and when it comes to them,
>> yes, I'd say I was an expert.
>> Once you really start to see their hierarchy, their body language,
>> etc....they make for quite interesting little fish.
>> I keep a rainbow of females in the 75g, and usually a resident male.
>> However, I have quite a bruiser of a female when it comes to the boys
>> and cannot house one in there now.
>> She's not even the alpha (the big boss) either. Just does not tolerate
>> a male at all.
>> Hey....what's a 30 liter in US gallons anyway?
>> Somebody tell me because I do not know the conversion.
>>
From what I remember, a litre is alittle more than a quart. With that
angle, my guess would be around 10 gallons,...too lazy to get up and
grab one of the books...even lazier to google it.

[Köi-Lö]

"[-=LÈGIÖN=-]" > wrote in message
...
> Well, I had gobs of luck with platys...but I figured that was only cuz
> platys would mate over a clothes line.
>
>
> I'm seriously considering taking all my other fish and setting up a
> tank for the neighbor. She'll have the benefit of saving money and
> already acclimated to the same water supply.
=====================
And just having a 55g for bettas?
--
KL....
Frugal ponding since 1995.
Aquariums since 1952.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[Köi-Lö]

"[-=LÈGIÖN=-]" > wrote in message
...
> Coffee, anyone?
>
===============
Make mine light and sweet. ;-)
--
KL....
Frugal ponding since 1995.
Aquariums since 1952.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[Köi-Lö]

"[-=LÈGIÖN=-]" > wrote in message
...
> Its not a subject that's addressed as often as it should. For those
> that pick nat s#it out of pepper, the really precise type when dealing
> with medications and treating tanks for ailments, you can see how one
> could easily overdose a tank when treating for diseases.
==================
Can those who sell medications be taking that into account?
--
KL....
Aquariums since 1952.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[Köi-Lö]

"[-=LÈGIÖN=-]" > wrote in message
...
> On Sun, 23 Jul 2006 11:51:13 -0500, Köi-Lö <$##$$@$##$$.#$$> wrote:
>>Let's see if she CORRECTS your spelling......... ;-)
>
> I'm at an age where I'm too damn lazy to google or webster my spelling
> anymore. Hands crippled up make typing fun or frustrating, depending
> on the amount of coffee I've consumed.

There's a FREE spellchecker for OE. I think most other NRs come with them
now. I use one because of my typos mainly.

> I'm old enough to know what needs done, what's just fun, what's boring
> and by that time, It's a new day on the calendar.
>
> Lazy has its rewards. Few. But they are there.

LOL!!! I agree......
--
KL....
Aquariums since 1952.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[[-=LÈGIÖN=-]]

Köi-Lö wrote:
>
> "[-=LÈGIÖN=-]" > wrote in message
> ...
>> Well, I had gobs of luck with platys...but I figured that was only cuz
>> platys would mate over a clothes line.
>>
>>
>> I'm seriously considering taking all my other fish and setting up a
>> tank for the neighbor. She'll have the benefit of saving money and
>> already acclimated to the same water supply.
> =====================
> And just having a 55g for bettas?

Yes. along w/the cories...
I've got see what size tank she'll get (as I'm gonna keep pursuading
her) and I have another neighbor who picked up the fish bug. I like my
bala and clown loach. I've got to sit down and consider all the angles.

Of course, it would be easier just to pickup another 55. I think that's
gonna be the correct course of action. Not holding in a wait-state
while others' make their decisions. And I need another 55 to go in the
bedroom as it is.

Problem solved.

55 gallon.
Move two cories and the clown loach
10 betta females..plenty of plants..

Whoilla.



I

--




[-=LÈGIÖN=-]
...For We Are Many -

Trailer For Sale or Rent

[Nikki]

"Köi-Lö" <$##$$@$##$$.#$$> wrote in message
...
>
> "[-=LÈGIÖN=-]" > wrote in message
> ...
>> Its not a subject that's addressed as often as it should. For those
>> that pick nat s#it out of pepper, the really precise type when dealing
>> with medications and treating tanks for ailments, you can see how one
>> could easily overdose a tank when treating for diseases.
> ==================
> Can those who sell medications be taking that into account?
> --
> KL....
> Aquariums since 1952.
> My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
> http://tinyurl.com/9do58
> ~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>
>
I dont think so, i think they expect you to know how many gl of water are in
your tank, other wise their could be a mistake, some people put nothing in
their tanks as far as rock ect, some people do so i think when they dose
it....it is for the amount they say.
Nik

[Köi-Lö]

"Nikki" > wrote in message
. ..
>
> "Köi-Lö" <$##$$@$##$$.#$$> wrote in message
> ...
>> Can those who sell medications be taking that into account?
>> --
>> KL....
>> Aquariums since 1952.
>> My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
>> http://tinyurl.com/9do58
>> ~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>
>>
> I dont think so, i think they expect you to know how many gl of water are
> in your tank, other wise their could be a mistake, some people put nothing
> in their tanks as far as rock ect, some people do so i think when they
> dose it....it is for the amount they say.
> Nik
================================
I've been dosing for the amount stated on the packages. I also have gravel
in all my tanks. Hummm.... I need to make an adjustment the next time I
medicate.
--
KL....
Frugal ponding since 1995.
Aquariums since 1952.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[[-=LÈGIÖN=-]]

Köi-Lö wrote:
>
> "Nikki" > wrote in message
> . ..
>>
>> "Köi-Lö" <$##$$@$##$$.#$$> wrote in message
>> ...
>>> Can those who sell medications be taking that into account?
>>> --
>>> KL....
>>> Aquariums since 1952.
>>> My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
>>> http://tinyurl.com/9do58
>>> ~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>
>>>
>> I dont think so, i think they expect you to know how many gl of water
>> are in your tank, other wise their could be a mistake, some people
>> put nothing in their tanks as far as rock ect, some people do so i
>> think when they dose it....it is for the amount they say.
>> Nik
> ================================
> I've been dosing for the amount stated on the packages. I also have
> gravel in all my tanks. Hummm.... I need to make an adjustment the
> next time I medicate.
Well, in the example I made with my tank, a bare 55 gal holds 47 gal.
I have an average of 3 inches of substrate (pea gravel and sand), not
leveled out. Some areas are 5 inches. It slopes from the back and
corners to about 2 inches in the front. I figured with the gravel and
driftwood, I've displaced close to 12 gallons. So I look at my tank as
holding around 35 gallons of water. I could narrow that down by taking
into account the plants and fish and could say ...ehh...34. That's all
the nat s#!t I'm gonna pick out, trust me.

--




[-=LÈGIÖN=-]
...For We Are Many -

Trailer For Sale or Rent

[[-=LÈGIÖN=-]]

Köi-Lö wrote:
>
> "[-=LÈGIÖN=-]" > wrote in message
> ...
>> Its not a subject that's addressed as often as it should. For those
>> that pick nat s#it out of pepper, the really precise type when dealing
>> with medications and treating tanks for ailments, you can see how one
>> could easily overdose a tank when treating for diseases.
> ==================
> Can those who sell medications be taking that into account?
Well, from a vendor's standpoint, labels dictating medical admissions
are addressed in ratios. This per that..this per so many gallons..this
per quarts...ppm....hell, I do good just to read the mercury on my
thermometer. !!!

--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

[Tynk]

Köi-Lö wrote:
> "Tynk" > wrote in message
> oups.com...
> >
> > Nikki wrote:
> >> 30 Liters = 7.925161570744453 Gallons
> >> http://www.calculateme.com/Volume/Liters/ToGallons.htm
> >
> > Well then, Koi-Lo shouldn't be housing 3
>
> Koi-Lo didn't house 3 or more bettas to a 10g tank.
>
> (or more, as you shouldn't
> > ever just have 2 females per tank) females and one male in that small
> > of a tank anyway.
>
> Who said my 30 gallon long tanks only hold 10 gallons of water? That makes
> no sense.
>


Ah..there's that twisting, and adding of words that were never said you
are well known for.
Here's my post....copied and pasted. I never once said a 30g tanks hold
3g's water, you nit. LOL
You said 30L which stands for 30 liter. If you were talking about a 30g
as in 30 gallons then you would have made yourself clear.
Everyone here uses G for gallons and L for liters.
If, when referring to a "long" tank, ther proper way to type that to
avoid confusion would be 30gL...meaning 30 gallon long. This has been
the common way of doing this since I was a little girl. Now don't
start with the it has to be my way or it's wrong crap.
Go whine some place else. This is just how it is. Same with the proper
care of Bettas. It has nothing to do with MY way. It's just the proper
way...I learned it just as anyone else can...unless they have a problem
doing this properly.

From: Tynk - view profile
Date: Sun, Jul 23 2006 10:37 am
Email: "Tynk" >
Groups: rec.aquaria.freshwater.misc
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Nikki wrote:
> 30 Liters = 7.925161570744453 Gallons
> http://www.calculateme.com/Volume/Liters/ToGallons.htm


Well then, Koi-Lo shouldn't be housing 3 (or more, as you shouldn't
ever just have 2 females per tank) females and one male in that small
of a tank anyway.
Thank Nik, you're a peach.
P.S....you also know what you're doing. = )

Now....Do I need to copy and paste your post where you typed 30L?
Maybe that means 30gL in your head, but anyone else would assume you
meant a 30 Liter...which would be 7.? something gallons.

[Tynk]

Köi-Lö wrote:

>
> Who said my 30 gallon long tanks only hold 10 gallons of water? That makes
> no sense.
>
> > Thank Nik, you're a peach.
> > P.S....you also know what you're doing. = )
>
> 30 gallon tanks hold 30 GALLONS, not 10 gallons of water. ;-)

Here ya go.
I copied and pasted what you said, so that you can't argue about it:

From: Köi-Lö - view profile
Date: Fri, Jul 21 2006 6:27 pm
Email: Köi-Lö <$##$$@$##$$.#$$>
Groups: rec.aquaria.freshwater.misc
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"Nikki" > wrote in message


...


>> They definitely have their own personalities. :-)

> Which is a big part of if a male/female can be put together. Most times
> people say you can only put a male by him self, and some males that is
> true, but not most of them, mind seem to do better in a community.
> Tynk I think has hers in a 75g, Ed I think had his in a 55g, I have a pair
> in a 30 long, with out no problem.



These are BIGGER tanks and if planted and the bettas are not very
aggressive, it should be ok. I just don't think people should be
encouraged
to even try it if they have a tank smaller than a 30L.


See above....you said 30L..meaning liters.

[Köi-Lö]

"Tynk" > wrote in message
oups.com...

Köi-Lö wrote:
> "Tynk" > wrote in message
> oups.com...
> >
> > Nikki wrote:
> >> 30 Liters = 7.925161570744453 Gallons
> >> http://www.calculateme.com/Volume/Liters/ToGallons.htm
> >
> > Well then, Koi-Lo shouldn't be housing 3
>
> Koi-Lo didn't house 3 or more bettas to a 10g tank.
>
> (or more, as you shouldn't
> > ever just have 2 females per tank) females and one male in that small
> > of a tank anyway.
>
> Who said my 30 gallon long tanks only hold 10 gallons of water? That
> makes
> no sense.
>
=======================
Ah..there's that twisting, and adding of words that were never said you
are well known for.

* Well know for by who? You? All I can go by is what you post. Where did
I ever claim I kept male and female bettas together in small tanks?

THIS is what you posted:
"Well then, Koi-Lo shouldn't be housing 3 (or more, as you shouldn't
ever just have 2 females per tank) females and one male in *that small
of a tank anyway."*

Memory lapse there Tynk, or a troll-trick just to disagree with anything and
everything I post?

> Here's my post....copied and pasted. I never once said a 30g tanks hold
3g's water, you nit. LOL

LOL, LOL.... here it is again.
"Well then, Koi-Lo shouldn't be housing 3 (or more, as you shouldn't
ever just have 2 females per tank) females and one male in *that small
of a tank anyway."*

> You said 30L which stands for 30 liter.

No Tynk, where I come from a 30L is a 30Long which I often write out. Know
what you're talking about before insulting someone.

> If you were talking about a 30g
as in 30 gallons then you would have made yourself clear.

I have made myself clear many times on this NG by writing out 30Long.

> Everyone here uses G for gallons and L for liters.

And everyone I know uses 30L to mean a 30 gallon LONG tank. I've used 30L
here many times as well and wrote out 30Long.

> If, when referring to a "long" tank, ther proper way to type that to
avoid confusion would be 30gL...meaning 30 gallon long. This has been
the common way of doing this since I was a little girl. Now don't
start with the it has to be my way or it's wrong crap.

Now don't you start to tell me what everyone does here, did here, will do
here, should do here and on and on and on just like a troll does...........
use your killfile.

> Go whine some place else.

LOL,... you need to whine somewhere else. The group was peaceful until YOU
came back and are now trying to dominate the group and what people post
here. You're the one constantly whining and sobbing and crying about
everything I post in the mistaken belief that if you troll me long enough
you'll chase me away. Why not post on the moderated group where no one will
disagree with you?

> This is just how it is. Same with the proper
care of Bettas. It has nothing to do with MY way. It's just the proper
way...

According to *YOU* and yet they live a long time other ways as well, which
you can't accept for some reason. It's either your way or you troll and
insult the person. You think your insulting disagreeable and obnoxious
aggressiveness will force people to agree with you.

> I learned it just as anyone else can...unless they have a problem
doing this properly.

You have the problem accepting that there are other ways to keep bettas than
*YOUR* way.
--
KL....
Aquariums since 1952.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[Köi-Lö]

"Tynk" > wrote in message
oups.com...

Köi-Lö wrote:

>
> Who said my 30 gallon long tanks only hold 10 gallons of water? That
> makes
> no sense.
>
> > Thank Nik, you're a peach.
> > P.S....you also know what you're doing. = )
>
> 30 gallon tanks hold 30 GALLONS, not 10 gallons of water. ;-)

Here ya go.
I copied and pasted what you said, so that you can't argue about it:
===============
This has already been covered including your immature nasty trollish insults
in the messages above. And because of your memory problems allow me to
repeat that I have always advocated keeping bettas ALONE. That's because in
MY EXPERIENCE they didn't do well with other fish for a variety of reasons
that have already been covered in the past. The females got along ok as I
already posted several times. The males *IN MY EXPERIENCE* were the problem
and that's why I keep them separate and in their own jars or bowls. Now if
you don't want me to post *MY EXPERIENCES* with bettas here you are out of
luck since this is an open forum for everyone. You may be happier to stay
in a moderated forum where you can tell the moderator who can and can't post
if their experience isn't like yours - you can't do that here.
--
KL....
Frugal ponding since 1995.
Aquariums since 1952.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[Tynk]

There's a very good reason you are not allowed to post on the group
that had to be formed because of your trol followers.
I am not a troll.
I was simply correcting false, or misleading statements.
And no, it's just you. I will correct anyone who states anything false
about Bettas.
Now before you go on again and again about how it's MY opinion and blah
blah blah, anything I say can be checked for fact. Go ahead. Stop
adivsing people like your experience with them is fact. You kept them
in tiny bowls on your wondow sill for goodness sake until you finanlly
ungraded to them a larger container after god knows how long of going
round and round with you. You even said that you were starting to think
it was better to house them in larger tanks.
So get over yourself with the "I'm trolling you" crap. If you don't
want to be corrected, don't say bullcrap. It's quite simple.
Now quit your whining!

[[-=LÈGIÖN=-]]

This should have read as follows...

> On 23 Jul 2006 08:48:32 -0700, "Tynk" > wrote:


>
>>> >
>>> >Thanks.
>>> >I have to do what I can to save the poor Bettas living in cold jars!
>>> >Sheesh.
>>> >Some folks just want to argue.
>>> >I just like telling the facts.
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sun, 23 Jul 2006 13:08:22 -0500, [-=LÈGIÖN=-] >
>>> wrote:
>>> Amen...I am seriously considering another 55 gal and just stock it
>>> with female bettas...I'm serious. Just females. If this is a
>>> problem...SOMEBODY STOP ME. PLEASE.
>>
>>
>> No way! I'm not stopping you, hehe.
>> You will have a very cool tank in deed.
>> The only hard part will be when you add them, do it all at once. That
>> way they are all on neutral territory. This can be done by buying stock
>> and keeping them in quarantine tanks, or other tanks until you get the
>> desired amount for the 55g.
>> You will have bickering at first, as they need to figure out their
>> hierarchy.
>> Once that's established you'll see all their every day type body
>> language. This is so interesting to me and I can't get enough of it,
>> lol.
>> You'll soon figure out what each posture or finflash means for the
>> situation. You'll soon learn who is the alpha..all the way down to the
>> omega (lowest in rank).
>> You'll see action when another female wants to take over that role and
>> the difference between that and just "testing" the alpha. Now when you
>> have 2 females that refuse to back down, one needs to go to another
>> home. This is on the rare side, but since you have other tanks already,
>> it shouldn't be a problem for you.
>> There are several fin variations available now, and every color of the
>> rainbow to choose from. Who ever says females are drab, ugly, colorless
>> fish are ignorant and needs to do some research, lol.
>
>
> I find the females far more attractive (just my taste)...I'm not
> really big on any fish with gobs and gobs of plummage as I like to
> call it.
>
> But I realize for the newcomer how one could be attracted to the male
> for its large display. It does make the buyer stop and pause.
>
> I am however a big fan of the female betta's profile. It just has
> the ideal outline (matter of taste). My experience with my first
> male betta started out with his plummage getting damaged and eaten up
> by his girlfriend. It grew back fine...wasn't a case of finrot..just
> a fish with jagged fins for about 3 weeks.
--




[-=\\LÈGIÖN//=-]
... For We Are Many -

























--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

[[-=LÈGIÖN=-]]

I remember coming home 45 minutes late one day, and my wife (then)
chewed my butt a good one. We had an appointment at the bank with a
loan officer. There were no cell phones then. I was stuck in traffic
that had backed up from a chemical tanker that had jack-knifed on the
highway. I didn't have an SUV to blunder around the fields around the
accident like you'd see on the commercials. It was a Chevy Caprice
Wagon. Yep, that was me, picking up the ladies in my station wagon.

Yep. Scored hundreds of dates in that old rust bucket, rattle-trap of a
car.

[Köi-Lö]

""[-=LÈGIÖN=-]"" > wrote in message
...
>I remember coming home 45 minutes late one day, and my wife (then) chewed
>my butt a good one. We had an appointment at the bank with a loan officer.
>There were no cell phones then.

I still don't have a cell-phone. :-( I should see about getting one.
Bummer getting caught in traffic.... that seldom happens here in the
boondocks.

I was stuck in traffic
> that had backed up from a chemical tanker that had jack-knifed on the
> highway. I didn't have an SUV to blunder around the fields around the
> accident like you'd see on the commercials. It was a Chevy Caprice Wagon.
> Yep, that was me, picking up the ladies in my station wagon.

Out on the highway? LOL!!!!

> Yep. Scored hundreds of dates in that old rust bucket, rattle-trap of a
> car.

A lift is a lift. Beats walking. ;-)
--
KL....
Aquariums since 1952.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[Köi-Lö]

"Tynk" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> There's a very good reason you are not allowed to post on the group
> that had to be formed because of your trol followers.

Troll followes like YOU? Your doing exactly what the trolls did! :-)
You're no different than they are/were.

> I am not a troll.

Then why are you acting like one?

> I was simply correcting false, or misleading statements.

In YOUR OPINION. You think only your experiences and opinions should be
allowed here. That's also trollish.

> And no, it's just you. I will correct anyone who states anything false
> about Bettas.

FALSE in your OPINION.

------- snip the same old rude trollish BS. I've had enough of you and
the trolls ---------

KL....
Aquariums since 1952.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[swarvegorilla]

Betta are individuals the same way old south american cichlids are.
thats how i see it anyway
kinda like adding a big oscar to your red devil tank
sure it usually works
but each time is different
and often it equals death
I try seperate my females from males in upturned clean soft drink bottles
this lets me see reactions (colour changes, fin raises and snapping) before
they can get at each other.
good way to see which of several chicks ya dude likes without risking deaths
and injurys
espec when some of me female deltas are worth a substantial amount of money!




"Tynk" > wrote in message
oups.com...

Köi-Lö wrote:

> Yes, and they got along ok. A nip here and there but otherwise they lived
> in relative peace.

You forgot the part about it depending on the individual personality of
each fish.
There are females from time to time that cannot be housed with certain
females, or some that can't be housed with any female.
This needs to be said *each* time.
It doesn't matter if you said it a month ago, or 20 minutes ago.
All Bettas are different and that needs to be said each time. You
should always have a back plan as well if it doesn't turn out the way
you want it to.
It's also so much easier when the females are spawn siblings.
Males things so much easier, as their hierarchy was figured out long
ago when they were babies.

[swarvegorilla]

"Tynk" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> Koi Lo wrote:
>
>>
>> See above. It's not misinformation where really aggressive bettas are
>> concerned and smaller tanks with few or no hiding places. Don't assume
>> everyone has a 30L or larger planted tank.
>> --
>
> Being that this has been explained over and over and over....
> That the tank needs to be large enough, well planted and that each
> individual personality allows it, no one is talking about a small, bare
> tank.
> No one needs to assume it it has to be the size tank YOU used either.
> Seems to me you're getting overly aggressive males.
> If you have had a large enough tank and this many probs, I'd look into
> finding new stock.
> You also said in one of your posts about the male building his
> nests....
> If a male is in a filtered, heated tank and with 3 or more females
> (proper size and dechor of course) there shouldn't be any spawning
> behavior going on anyway.
> You also run into trouble trying to house only one female and one male
> per tank.
> They have to form a hierarchy which can't be done properly with only a
> pair.
> Occasionly you will find a couple of placid Bettas and they're fine.
> But to say the male will always shred a female, stress her, or kill
> her, whatever it is you're saying today (this does change per post) and
> that they shouldn't ever be housed together is simply wrong. It just
> is.
> I bet the entire problem you have experienced is not enough females and
> a tank that was too small.
> Besides....if you had overly aggressive males (rare with Splendens) you
> should have never tried to house them together.
>


I have huge amounts of problems with males killing females or females
turning on males!!
Usually I have to watch and watch and try and try to get harmony!!
sometimes females need to be kept on, well pretty crap food.... while I
build up me male so he doesn't get smashed by her!!!
anyway after a while you sorta get to learn the stripes and body language.
Still tho, I watch any new meetings very carefully.
I still remember the first time I dropped an awesome delta male in with 15
females. I turned me back for a minute or so and when I looked back the
girls all had a mouthfull and were almost trying to pull him to itty bitty
pieces!!!
So yea from then on I watched closely and use dividers!!!
Oh the ease of breeding the mouthbrooders!!! may not have the sheer good
looks but wow hey! can keep a school together.
betta's
they are a lot more complicated than I ever imagined at first.
I used to think if one took up more than 10min of me time per week I was
doing something wrong.
Now I spend at least an hour mucking around with him.
thats the difference between having 100 and 1 tho, can afford to spoil the
*******!
Sure makes me sack of indian almond leaves last a lot longer!
mmmmmm mmmmmmm
voo-doo
www.plakatthai.com is the **** by the way! until they let the good Doctor
Axel rod outta jail I'm boycotting TFH
heh heh
anyone got an email for him?

[swarvegorilla]

"Sunny" > wrote in message
...
>
> "kraut" > wrote in message
> ...
>> Am new to bettas and was wondering how big of a tank is needed for 1
>> betta??
>>
>> I would like to get 2 and was wondering if I could have 2 in one tank
>> and if so how big a tank??
>
> I have kept Bettas in 7 Litre tanks (2 Gal) for the last 4 years.
> No filter or heater (mild climate in Qld Australia)
> Water needs to be treated and 70% - 80% changed weekly, to help keep them
> healthy.
> Each male needs to be in its own tank, although 2-3 females may be OK
> together once they sort out who is in charge :-)
> Some plastic plants in the tank help them rest near the surface as well.
> Browse through these :
> http://freshaquarium.about.com/cs/anabantids2/p/betta.htm
> http://betta.allbio.org/
> http://www.bellaonline.com/articles/art17376.asp
> http://aquamaniacs.net/forum/portal.php
>

Northern NSW here
at the moment unless ya cover the top and keep them in a bloody warm spot
indoors (like on the fridge or a bedroom)
they are a hell of a lot more likely to go down with some sort of disease.
dang it is cold
and for some reason this year wet!!