Bubbletip Anemone's health

[nacree]

I have recently put in a BTA in my tank (like a week ago) and he is not
looking so hot. Like a small part of his body (~1/8) is curled up
really small, the rest of him looks fine with his tentacles spread out.
That part that is shrunk I was afraid was the melting look that I have
heard about when they are about to die. I was about to remove him from
the tank, but he is firmly attached to a rock, so I thought maybe he is
all right. I have heard that when they die, they can really put a hurt
on your tank if you don't get to them right away. Anyway, the rest of
the anemone looks fine, with his tentacles spread out, just that one
part of him. Water params look fine. Lights are 4x65w Coralife PCs,
and 1 NOF. I thought maybe it was the lights and I was going to move
that rock to the top, but he is on a big rock that is a base piece of
my rock work. Anybody else seen this before?

Thanks!

[KurtG]

nacree wrote:
> I have recently put in a BTA in my tank (like a week ago) and he is not
> looking so hot. Like a small part of his body (~1/8) is curled up
> really small,

Mine can stretch out far from it's foot, so I'm trying to think what the
"small part of his body" would mean. I'd say he's doing fine. I'd
just leave him alone, and keep monitoring.

They also occasionally cycle especially after a good meal, where they
look just dreadful. Don't worry until it's foot actually lets go and it
slumps to the ground in a heap. Otherwise, it's fine and just part of
it's usual activity.

I've had two that died on me, but they didn't do much to my tank. I
wouldn't worry much.

One thing you didn't mention was current. They need a gentle bathing of
current, but not too strong either. Their tentacles should gently sway
in the current.

You may want to pick up a clown fish if you don't have one. They'll
clean and fan the anemone, and are a delight to watch.

--Kurt

[Bill Marsh]

Yeah I had mine for about 6 mo. and he shribbled up and a couple of days
later "Wella" I had two. Imagine that.
Leave it be for awhile and I feed mine a peice of shrimp every couple of
days. Bill
"nacree" > wrote in message
ups.com...
>I have recently put in a BTA in my tank (like a week ago) and he is not
> looking so hot. Like a small part of his body (~1/8) is curled up
> really small, the rest of him looks fine with his tentacles spread out.
> That part that is shrunk I was afraid was the melting look that I have
> heard about when they are about to die. I was about to remove him from
> the tank, but he is firmly attached to a rock, so I thought maybe he is
> all right. I have heard that when they die, they can really put a hurt
> on your tank if you don't get to them right away. Anyway, the rest of
> the anemone looks fine, with his tentacles spread out, just that one
> part of him. Water params look fine. Lights are 4x65w Coralife PCs,
> and 1 NOF. I thought maybe it was the lights and I was going to move
> that rock to the top, but he is on a big rock that is a base piece of
> my rock work. Anybody else seen this before?
>
> Thanks!
>

[KurtG]

Bill Marsh wrote:
> I feed mine a peice of shrimp every couple of
> days.

I thought they just need a meal every month if not longer. Besides, the
clowns tend to feed them as well, so I don't bother with the bubble tip
at all. And, I definitely don't feed them when under stress such as
water changes, movement, etc.

I've only had mine for 2 months, so I can't claim any big success, but
every few days sounds wildly like too much food.

But, I've certainly been wrong before. Just mean to start the
conversation.

--Kurt

[George Patterson]

KurtG wrote:

> I thought they just need a meal every month if not longer. Besides, the
> clowns tend to feed them as well, so I don't bother with the bubble tip
> at all. And, I definitely don't feed them when under stress such as
> water changes, movement, etc.

Long ago, I had an Atlantic anemone. If it wasn't hungry, it would toss the food
aside and I would take the food out of the tank. If a bubble-tip behaves the
same way, it wouldn't hurt anything to try to feed it more often.

George Patterson
Forgive your enemies. But always remember who they are.

[Pszemol]

"George Patterson" > wrote in message news:k5Whh.4912$od6.4362@trnddc04...
> Long ago, I had an Atlantic anemone. If it wasn't hungry, it would toss the food
> aside and I would take the food out of the tank. If a bubble-tip behaves the
> same way, it wouldn't hurt anything to try to feed it more often.

It behaves the same way.
And it is much better to feed it more often, like every other day,
with small portions, than to give it a big chunk of meat it cannot
penetrate with its digestive juices once a month...
Try to thaw some frozen brine shrimp or mysids and squirt
some of this "soup" with a turkey baster towards the anemone.
Whatever is left it will be picked up by fish gladly and cleaning crew.

Once a while you can give it a larger pieces, like whole krill
or a piece of bigger prawns from the grocery store...
Make sure you do not feed it with only muscle tissue - as all
carnivoures, anemone will benefit from the whole prey animals: heads,
guts, digestive tract with digested plants matter - all the good stuff :-)

[KurtG]

George Patterson wrote:
> Long ago, I had an Atlantic anemone. If it wasn't hungry, it would toss
> the food aside and I would take the food out of the tank. If a
> bubble-tip behaves the same way, it wouldn't hurt anything to try to
> feed it more often.

My Ritteri is the only one that doesn't respond immediately to food.
But, it's usually rosy pink and 6" across. I can tell when it starts to
get hungry because it will start closing up at the slightest provocation
including the clown fish that claimed it. I usually give it at least
another week and then feed it (if it's where it belongs). In 2 months
I've had it, I've fed it once and it's showing no signs of hunger.

The rest react immediately to food. You could call it greedy, but they
literally curl up and pull it in. If their bodies are extended, they'll
shrink down to create a larger cavity to ingest the food. They close
up and then cycle through. All look almost necrotic in a day or two,
and then open up again in about 24 hrs after that.

Although food is essential, it also appears to be toxic. I'd be very
careful about overfeeding and error on the side of underfeeding.

Perhaps I'm extrapolating from working with Orchids, but neglect is part
of the equation. Patterns are very bad, and food (water/fertilizer)
needs to be fed as randomly as possible. Even some randomness in the
lighting is good (cloudy days). My Orchids frequently bloom after such
a period of neglect.

I would have to think that an anemone in the wild would go for months
without food during seasonal shifts in the current and water temps. Or,
just plain bad luck. If they live a 100 years in the wild, then that
can't be all bad.

--Kurt

PS- I'll probably eat crow in about a week when my anemonies croak. :-)

[George Patterson]

KurtG wrote:

> Perhaps I'm extrapolating from working with Orchids, but neglect is part
> of the equation.

I've kept both fish and orchids for long periods. I wouldn't go overboard
drawing similarities there. You can't give an orchid food and expect it to avoid
eating it if it's not hungry. You *can* do this with animals.

George Patterson
Forgive your enemies. But always remember who they are.

[Pszemol]

"KurtG" > wrote in message ...
> Although food is essential, it also appears to be toxic. I'd be very
> careful about overfeeding and error on the side of underfeeding.

??? Where do you get "the food is toxic" thing from?

[KurtG]

Pszemol wrote:
> "KurtG" > wrote in message
> ...
>> Although food is essential, it also appears to be toxic. I'd be very
>> careful about overfeeding and error on the side of underfeeding.
>
> ??? Where do you get "the food is toxic" thing from?

Overeating is always bad. Doesn't matter which animal it is (even
humans). It results in all sorts of inflammation and chronic illnesses
that are best avoided. I just can't imagine that anemone in the wild
would gather food that efficiently.

Nothing like a newbie that is overreaching (me), but I have to admit a
recoiled in horror when I read that people feed their anemones every few
days. All mine are doing great on a much sparser diet. (Even the
bubble anemone is back in great shape. It just needed a few days of
light and better water quality). But, 2 months don't make me a expert.
:-)

--Kurt

[KurtG]

George Patterson wrote:
> KurtG wrote:
>
>> Perhaps I'm extrapolating from working with Orchids, but neglect is
>> part of the equation.
>
> I've kept both fish and orchids for long periods. I wouldn't go
> overboard drawing similarities there. You can't give an orchid food and
> expect it to avoid eating it if it's not hungry. You *can* do this with
> animals.
>
> George Patterson
> Forgive your enemies. But always remember who they are.


touché

[Pszemol]

"KurtG" > wrote in message ...
>> ??? Where do you get "the food is toxic" thing from?
>
> Overeating is always bad. Doesn't matter which animal it is (even
> humans). It results in all sorts of inflammation and chronic illnesses
> that are best avoided. I just can't imagine that anemone in the wild
> would gather food that efficiently.

It can get great amounts of food on the reef...
Water is FULL of planktonic animals, especially at night time.

> Nothing like a newbie that is overreaching (me), but I have to admit a
> recoiled in horror when I read that people feed their anemones every few
> days. All mine are doing great on a much sparser diet. (Even the
> bubble anemone is back in great shape. It just needed a few days of
> light and better water quality). But, 2 months don't make me a expert.
> :-)

These animals live hundreds of years in nature...
They die very, very slowly in our tanks if not properly taken care of.
Two months of observation is simply too short period to draw ANY conclusions.
Similar slow death issue applies to many marine animals: sea cucumbers,
urchins, sea stars and some corals. They simply deteriorate too slowly for
an aquarist to know what is the cause of death.

[KurtG]

Pszemol wrote:
>
> These animals live hundreds of years in nature...
> They die very, very slowly in our tanks if not properly taken care of.
> Two months of observation is simply too short period to draw ANY
> conclusions.
> Similar slow death issue applies to many marine animals: sea cucumbers,
> urchins, sea stars and some corals. They simply deteriorate too slowly for
> an aquarist to know what is the cause of death.

Okay, I deserved that. but, I'll stick to what works for me.

[Pszemol]

"KurtG" > wrote in message news:4O_hh.786$_X.354@bigfe9...
> Pszemol wrote:
>>
>> These animals live hundreds of years in nature...
>> They die very, very slowly in our tanks if not properly taken care of.
>> Two months of observation is simply too short period to draw ANY
>> conclusions.
>> Similar slow death issue applies to many marine animals: sea cucumbers,
>> urchins, sea stars and some corals. They simply deteriorate too slowly for
>> an aquarist to know what is the cause of death.
>
> Okay, I deserved that. but, I'll stick to what works for me.

Of course - your tank, you have the say what to do with it...

You will know for sure you take good care of your bubble tip anemone
if you notice it is growing, and after 6-8 months it will double in size.
If you do not see it growing than you know you do something really wrong
because it is very fast-growing animal.

[KurtG]

Pszemol wrote:
> You will know for sure you take good care of your bubble tip anemone
> if you notice it is growing, and after 6-8 months it will double in size.
> If you do not see it growing than you know you do something really wrong
> because it is very fast-growing animal.

My notes were almost prophetic. I got home yesterday, and looked at my
shriveled up bubble tip anemone, groaned, and fed it. :-)

Sorry, for getting carried away. Owning a tank is good character building.

My other ones look great. It's hard to tell if they are growing because
they change size/shape every day, but I'd say they are. The bubble tip
has grown considerably, so hopefully, I just need to work through this
period.

--Kurt

[Pszemol]

"KurtG" > wrote in message ...
> My notes were almost prophetic. I got home yesterday, and looked at my
> shriveled up bubble tip anemone, groaned, and fed it. :-)

I am not sure if you are supposed to feed it when it is deflated...
I feed mine when it is fully inflated.

> Sorry, for getting carried away. Owning a tank is good character building.

Hey, these animals go cyclic through inflating/deflating stages - so
do not be alarmed if you see it completely deflated for a day or even two.
Larger anemones take considerable time to fully inflate from zero.

When it feeds it basically dissolves food inside its "belly" with digestive
enzymes and uses what it needs - than everything else: undigested
parts of the food items together with anemone own waste (poop)
gets out when the anemone deflates itself - this nasty water gets
out from the interior of the anemone and makes your skimmer crazy :-)
Then anemone inflates itself with "fresh" water, waits for new food
and process repeats...

> My other ones look great. It's hard to tell if they are growing because
> they change size/shape every day, but I'd say they are. The bubble tip
> has grown considerably, so hopefully, I just need to work through this
> period.

You can compare size when anemone is fully expanded...
You can notice how far does it reach now and how far will it
reach with its oral disk in two months. Mine was small, like 2-3in
in diameter when fully expanded two years ago - now it is more
than a foot diameter when fully expanded... Impressive how fast
can it grow if well fed.

[nacree]

Thank you all for the great info. But, I have an update... Not really
sure yet, but it looks like the anemone is actually splitting. I fed
it a piece of a minnow and it looked like the small deflated side was
actually branching off from the main trunk. That would be cool if it
is. So far in my new tank, I have had a starfish (really small, dime
size) split and a cleaner shrimp has molted like twice in a week or
twos time, and the cleaner shrimp has real nice colors and seems happy.
Not sure if the molting a lot thing is good or not but Im guessing it
probably is.

Anyway thanks again.

[Pszemol]

"nacree" > wrote in message ups.com...
> Thank you all for the great info. But, I have an update... Not really
> sure yet, but it looks like the anemone is actually splitting. I fed
> it a piece of a minnow and it looked like the small deflated side was
> actually branching off from the main trunk. That would be cool if it is.

yes, it would be cool :-)

> So far in my new tank, I have had a starfish (really small, dime
> size) split and a cleaner shrimp has molted like twice in a week or
> twos time, and the cleaner shrimp has real nice colors and seems happy.
> Not sure if the molting a lot thing is good or not but Im guessing it
> probably is.

I had a pair of "skunk cleaner shrimp" (Lysmata amboinensis)
and they were mating in my tank regularly (hemaphrodities).
Each of them molted regularly once every two weeks synchronously
to each other, so when one was molting, the second was acting as
a male and fertilize its mate, then after about a week situation
reversed and the shrimp carrying eggs from a week ago acted
as a male to the shrimp which molted and received fertilization
from her/his friend... Ocean creatures are weird :-)
I do not know what kind of cleaner shrimp you have and how good
or bad it is molting so frequently - if I had to guess it is generally
not good unless they are small, not adult yet and growing very fast...