Pond sealer & dead plants

[PatC]

A few months ago we applied a 'pond sealer' as our concrete based pond had
sprung a leak.
Since then all has been fine with the fish & no leaking. They have even
spawned & we have young goldfish (fanatails & shebunkins) thriving in a
seperate area.
All the plants that we had previously were vigorous & needed constant
cutting back but have now died.
I went to a bit of expense & got new ones - same thing happened.
I could see no warning on the can & we followed directions to the letter re
changing the water etc., before re-introducing the fish again.
Is there anything we can do as we live in a hot climate & the fish need
protection from the heat. We do have shadecloth over the pond but would also
like some plants to survive.
Anyone got any ideas please?

Ta Pat

[[email protected]]

maybe somebody in rec.ponds would know the answer to this. but post it over here too
to make sure Pat gets the answer. Ingrid

"PatC" > wrote:

>A few months ago we applied a 'pond sealer' as our concrete based pond had
>sprung a leak.
>Since then all has been fine with the fish & no leaking. They have even
>spawned & we have young goldfish (fanatails & shebunkins) thriving in a
>seperate area.
>All the plants that we had previously were vigorous & needed constant
>cutting back but have now died.
>I went to a bit of expense & got new ones - same thing happened.
>I could see no warning on the can & we followed directions to the letter re
>changing the water etc., before re-introducing the fish again.
>Is there anything we can do as we live in a hot climate & the fish need
>protection from the heat. We do have shadecloth over the pond but would also
>like some plants to survive.
>Anyone got any ideas please?
>
>Ta Pat
>
>



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
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Solve the problem, dont waste energy finding who's to blame
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I receive no compensation for running the Puregold list or Puregold website.
I do not run nor receive any money from the ads at the old Puregold site.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Zone 5 next to Lake Michigan

[Tristan]

Oh I am saure Carol aka Zebulon will respond, and of course as usual
will have the totally wrong answer. But then someone will reposnd with
correct answer and then she can go into action and ad lib her
rendition.


On Sun, 07 Jan 2007 10:58:54 GMT, wrote:

<<>>maybe somebody in rec.ponds would know the answer to this. but post it over here too
<<>>to make sure Pat gets the answer. Ingrid
<<>>
<<>>"PatC" > wrote:
<<>>
<<>>>A few months ago we applied a 'pond sealer' as our concrete based pond had
<<>>>sprung a leak.
<<>>>Since then all has been fine with the fish & no leaking. They have even
<<>>>spawned & we have young goldfish (fanatails & shebunkins) thriving in a
<<>>>seperate area.
<<>>>All the plants that we had previously were vigorous & needed constant
<<>>>cutting back but have now died.
<<>>>I went to a bit of expense & got new ones - same thing happened.
<<>>>I could see no warning on the can & we followed directions to the letter re
<<>>>changing the water etc., before re-introducing the fish again.
<<>>>Is there anything we can do as we live in a hot climate & the fish need
<<>>>protection from the heat. We do have shadecloth over the pond but would also
<<>>>like some plants to survive.
<<>>>Anyone got any ideas please?
<<>>>
<<>>>Ta Pat
<<>>>
<<>>>
<<>>
<<>>
<<>>
<<>>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
<<>>List Manager: Puregold Goldfish List at
<<>>http://weloveteaching.com/puregold/
<<>>sign up: http://groups.google.com/groups/dir?hl=en&q=puregold&qt_s=Group+lookup
<<>>www.drsolo.com
<<>>Solve the problem, dont waste energy finding who's to blame
<<>>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
<<>>I receive no compensation for running the Puregold list or Puregold website.
<<>>I do not run nor receive any money from the ads at the old Puregold site.
<<>>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
<<>>Zone 5 next to Lake Michigan



-------
I forgot more about ponds and koi than I'll ever know!

[~ janj]

On Sun, 07 Jan 2007 10:58:54 GMT, wrote:

>maybe somebody in rec.ponds would know the answer to this. but post it over here too
>to make sure Pat gets the answer. Ingrid
>
>"PatC" > wrote:
>
>>A few months ago we applied a 'pond sealer' as our concrete based pond had
>>sprung a leak.
>>Since then all has been fine with the fish & no leaking. They have even
>>spawned & we have young goldfish (fanatails & shebunkins) thriving in a
>>seperate area.
>>All the plants that we had previously were vigorous & needed constant
>>cutting back but have now died.
>>I went to a bit of expense & got new ones - same thing happened.
>>I could see no warning on the can & we followed directions to the letter re
>>changing the water etc., before re-introducing the fish again.
>>Is there anything we can do as we live in a hot climate & the fish need
>>protection from the heat. We do have shadecloth over the pond but would also
>>like some plants to survive.
>>Anyone got any ideas please?
>>
>>Ta Pat

What I need to know is what are the water parameters, especially KH & pH?
What kind of media were the plants planted in, how fertilized, with what,
how often? What kinds of plants. ~ jan

[[email protected]]

wrote:
> >A few months ago we applied a 'pond sealer' as our concrete based pond had
> >sprung a leak.
> >Since then all has been fine with the fish & no leaking. They have even
> >spawned & we have young goldfish (fanatails & shebunkins) thriving in a
> >seperate area.
> >All the plants that we had previously were vigorous & needed constant
> >cutting back but have now died.

Not a pond person but I keep planted aquaria and am constantly dosing
them with one nutrient or another. Do you suppose that the leaky pond
obtained some nutrients from the surrounding soil, and that
water-topping-off to compensate for leaks also added elements that the
plants liked? If so, water tests for macronutrients and addition of
lacking nutrients might help - don't forget the trace elements.
d.

[Zebulon]

> wrote in message
...
> maybe somebody in rec.ponds would know the answer to this. but post it
> over here too
> to make sure Pat gets the answer. Ingrid
>
> "PatC" > wrote:
>
>>A few months ago we applied a 'pond sealer' as our concrete based pond had
>>sprung a leak.
>>Since then all has been fine with the fish & no leaking. They have even
>>spawned & we have young goldfish (fanatails & shebunkins) thriving in a
>>seperate area.
>>All the plants that we had previously were vigorous & needed constant
>>cutting back but have now died.

Are you sure they're dead and not dormant? Are the roots rotten and foul
smelling? I found most pond plants do better in either baskets or pots with
drain holes around the bottom.

>>I went to a bit of expense & got new ones - same thing happened.

Why not take one back where you bought it and have them look at it. Are
these water lilies? There's a root-crown rot some are prone to. The
disease would probably spread to any new ones you added.

>>I could see no warning on the can & we followed directions to the letter
>>re
>>changing the water etc., before re-introducing the fish again.
>>Is there anything we can do as we live in a hot climate & the fish need
>>protection from the heat.

What kind of plants were these? I found pond plants tolorant of a wide
range of water conditions over the past 12 years.

We do have shadecloth over the pond but would also
>>like some plants to survive.
>>Anyone got any ideas please?
>>
>>Ta Pat
--
ZB....
Frugal ponding since 1995.
rec.ponder since late 1996.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[Zebulon]

> wrote in message
ups.com...
> Not a pond person but I keep planted aquaria and am constantly dosing
> them with one nutrient or another. Do you suppose that the leaky pond
> obtained some nutrients from the surrounding soil, and that
> water-topping-off to compensate for leaks also added elements that the
> plants liked? If so, water tests for macronutrients and addition of
> lacking nutrients might help - don't forget the trace elements.
> d.
==========================
Another ponder here suggested 1 tbs. Potassium per 1000g of pond water.
I've been adding that every month over the summer. It's the only fertilizer
I use for everything but the water lilies. I use Jobe's Rose Spikes for
them. They thrive and bloom like crazy until fall. :-)

Although I tried every suggestion regarding fertilizers I heard about, I
never did get my Lotus to bloom. I think it finally died last summer as it
turned brown before the fall chill.
--
ZB....
Frugal ponding since 1995.
rec.ponder since late 1996.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[~ janj]

submitted that Pat wrote:
>> >A few months ago we applied a 'pond sealer' as our concrete based pond had
>> >sprung a leak.
>> >Since then all has been fine with the fish & no leaking. They have even
>> >spawned & we have young goldfish (fanatails & shebunkins) thriving in a
>> >seperate area.
>> >All the plants that we had previously were vigorous & needed constant
>> >cutting back but have now died.
>
>Not a pond person but I keep planted aquaria and am constantly dosing
>them with one nutrient or another. Do you suppose that the leaky pond
>obtained some nutrients from the surrounding soil, and that
>water-topping-off to compensate for leaks also added elements that the
>plants liked? If so, water tests for macronutrients and addition of
>lacking nutrients might help - don't forget the trace elements.
>d.

Good catch D. I didn't even think about why it might have all worked in the
old pond and now isn't in the new. It all comes down to water parameters.
Hopefully Pat has some test kits. ~ jan

[Tristan]

Yea right carol add stuiff bewfore you really do any tests to know
whats is lacking if anyhting at all., your a dumbass plain and
simple....or is it Angela Nogales now?

On Sun, 7 Jan 2007 12:58:45 -0600, Zëbulon >
wrote:

<<>>
> wrote in message
ups.com...
<<>>> Not a pond person but I keep planted aquaria and am constantly dosing
<<>>> them with one nutrient or another. Do you suppose that the leaky pond
<<>>> obtained some nutrients from the surrounding soil, and that
<<>>> water-topping-off to compensate for leaks also added elements that the
<<>>> plants liked? If so, water tests for macronutrients and addition of
<<>>> lacking nutrients might help - don't forget the trace elements.
<<>>> d.
<<>>==========================
<<>>Another ponder here suggested 1 tbs. Potassium per 1000g of pond water.
<<>>I've been adding that every month over the summer. It's the only fertilizer
<<>>I use for everything but the water lilies. I use Jobe's Rose Spikes for
<<>>them. They thrive and bloom like crazy until fall. :-)
<<>>
<<>>Although I tried every suggestion regarding fertilizers I heard about, I
<<>>never did get my Lotus to bloom. I think it finally died last summer as it
<<>>turned brown before the fall chill.



-------
I forgot more about ponds and koi than I'll ever know!

[Tristan]

On Sun, 7 Jan 2007 12:44:22 -0600, Zëbulon >
wrote:

<<>>
> wrote in message
...
<<>>> maybe somebody in rec.ponds would know the answer to this. but post it
<<>>> over here too
<<>>> to make sure Pat gets the answer. Ingrid
<<>>>
<<>>> "PatC" > wrote:
<<>>>
<<>>>>A few months ago we applied a 'pond sealer' as our concrete based pond had
<<>>>>sprung a leak.
<<>>>>Since then all has been fine with the fish & no leaking. They have even
<<>>>>spawned & we have young goldfish (fanatails & shebunkins) thriving in a
<<>>>>seperate area.
<<>>>>All the plants that we had previously were vigorous & needed constant
<<>>>>cutting back but have now died.
<<>>
<<>>Are you sure they're dead and not dormant? Are the roots rotten and foul
<<>>smelling? I found most pond plants do better in either baskets or pots with
<<>>drain holes around the bottom.
Yea, oprobbaly dormant like yur brain CArol. Probably stinks like your
attictude also.
<<>>
<<>>>>I went to a bit of expense & got new ones - same thing happened.
<<>>
<<>>Why not take one back where you bought it and have them look at it. Are
<<>>these water lilies? There's a root-crown rot some are prone to. The
<<>>disease would probably spread to any new ones you added.

Why are you assuming anything carol. Thats one big problem of yours,
you assume to freaking much
<<>>
<<>>>>I could see no warning on the can & we followed directions to the letter
<<>>>>re
<<>>>>changing the water etc., before re-introducing the fish again.
<<>>>>Is there anything we can do as we live in a hot climate & the fish need
<<>>>>protection from the heat.
<<>>
<<>>What kind of plants were these? I found pond plants tolorant of a wide
<<>>range of water conditions over the past 12 years.
Well you already assume they are lilys.why ask the question at this
point CArol?
<<>>
<<>>We do have shadecloth over the pond but would also
<<>>>>like some plants to survive.
<<>>>>Anyone got any ideas please?

Yes, one good suggestion. Do not pay CArol aka Zebulon or Andrea
Nogales any attention., She is a vile and vulgar old loon that craves
attention and does not have a clue what she is even talking about. She
adlibs most of what she posts.


<<>>>>
<<>>>>Ta Pat



-------
I forgot more about ponds and koi than I'll ever know!

[Zebulon]

"~ janj" > wrote in message
...
>>Not a pond person but I keep planted aquaria and am constantly dosing
>>them with one nutrient or another. Do you suppose that the leaky pond
>>obtained some nutrients from the surrounding soil, and that
>>water-topping-off to compensate for leaks also added elements that the
>>plants liked? If so, water tests for macronutrients and addition of
>>lacking nutrients might help - don't forget the trace elements.
>>d.
>
> Good catch D. I didn't even think about why it might have all worked in
> the
> old pond and now isn't in the new. It all comes down to water parameters.
> Hopefully Pat has some test kits. ~ jan
=====================
If the water was that drastically different I would think the fish would
have also reacted badly yet the OP says they're fine. I have to acclimate
every fish I buy here or they die from what was called PH shock not too long
ago. Plants don't just drop over dead, especially the new ones that would
not have been as badly effected by such a drastic difference. Plants
starved for nutrients fade away.........
--
ZB....
Frugal ponding since 1995.
rec.ponder since late 1996.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[[email protected]]

Zëbulon wrote:
> If the water was that drastically different I would think the fish would
> have also reacted badly yet the OP says they're fine. I have to acclimate
> every fish I buy here or they die from what was called PH shock.
Nutrients <> pH.
d.

[~ janj]

On Sun, 7 Jan 2007 14:28:10 -0600, Zëbulon > wrote:

>=====================
>If the water was that drastically different I would think the fish would
>have also reacted badly yet the OP says they're fine. I have to acclimate
>every fish I buy here or they die from what was called PH shock not too long
>ago. Plants don't just drop over dead, especially the new ones that would
>not have been as badly effected by such a drastic difference. Plants
>starved for nutrients fade away.........

Going against my better judgment to reply to this, but fish can survive
high pH where plants will die. Plus I think saying something is "fine" is
pretty general, goldfish are tough. ~ jan

[Zebulon]

> wrote in message
oups.com...

Zëbulon wrote:
> If the water was that drastically different I would think the fish would
> have also reacted badly yet the OP says they're fine. I have to acclimate
> every fish I buy here or they die from what was called PH shock.
Nutrients <> pH.
d.
==================
PH,... TDS etc. Sure, the fish may sicken and die - but not pond type
plants. Lack of nutrients don't kill plants quickly. I've been growing and
selling pond plants for over 5 years now and never once saw them suddenly
die due to a total water change.
--
ZB....
Frugal ponding since 1995.
rec.ponder since late 1996.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[Tristan]

Really so much for what you automatically assume dumbass! There is
just too many unasnered parts to make any kind of real assessment
anyhow. Now go away.,

On Sun, 7 Jan 2007 14:28:10 -0600, Zëbulon >
wrote:

<<>>
<<>>"~ janj" > wrote in message
...
<<>>>>Not a pond person but I keep planted aquaria and am constantly dosing
<<>>>>them with one nutrient or another. Do you suppose that the leaky pond
<<>>>>obtained some nutrients from the surrounding soil, and that
<<>>>>water-topping-off to compensate for leaks also added elements that the
<<>>>>plants liked? If so, water tests for macronutrients and addition of
<<>>>>lacking nutrients might help - don't forget the trace elements.
<<>>>>d.
<<>>>
<<>>> Good catch D. I didn't even think about why it might have all worked in
<<>>> the
<<>>> old pond and now isn't in the new. It all comes down to water parameters.
<<>>> Hopefully Pat has some test kits. ~ jan
<<>>=====================
<<>>If the water was that drastically different I would think the fish would
<<>>have also reacted badly yet the OP says they're fine. I have to acclimate
<<>>every fish I buy here or they die from what was called PH shock not too long
<<>>ago. Plants don't just drop over dead, especially the new ones that would
<<>>not have been as badly effected by such a drastic difference. Plants
<<>>starved for nutrients fade away.........



-------
I forgot more about ponds and koi than I'll ever know!

[Tristan]

Is that so...still yet more babbling idiotic statements from a
babbling idiot named Carol aka Andrea Nogales

On Sun, 7 Jan 2007 15:01:41 -0600, Zëbulon >
wrote:

<<>>
> wrote in message
oups.com...
<<>>
<<>>Zëbulon wrote:
<<>>> If the water was that drastically different I would think the fish would
<<>>> have also reacted badly yet the OP says they're fine. I have to acclimate
<<>>> every fish I buy here or they die from what was called PH shock.
<<>>Nutrients <> pH.
<<>>d.
<<>>==================
<<>>PH,... TDS etc. Sure, the fish may sicken and die - but not pond type
<<>>plants. Lack of nutrients don't kill plants quickly. I've been growing and
<<>>selling pond plants for over 5 years now and never once saw them suddenly
<<>>die due to a total water change.



-------
I forgot more about ponds and koi than I'll ever know!

[Tristan]

Number on water parameters would be nice as would a list of so called
plants. Any other repely you get is gonna be a guess without having
all the facts. Any infoyou get from Zebulon alka CArol Gulley aka
Andrea NOgales would be bull**** anyhow and needs to be taken with
agrain of salt. She is notoriious for giving erroneous info anyhow.

On Sun, 07 Jan 2007 20:57:53 GMT, ~ janj > wrote:

<<>>On Sun, 7 Jan 2007 14:28:10 -0600, Zëbulon > wrote:
<<>>
<<>>>=====================
<<>>>If the water was that drastically different I would think the fish would
<<>>>have also reacted badly yet the OP says they're fine. I have to acclimate
<<>>>every fish I buy here or they die from what was called PH shock not too long
<<>>>ago. Plants don't just drop over dead, especially the new ones that would
<<>>>not have been as badly effected by such a drastic difference. Plants
<<>>>starved for nutrients fade away.........
<<>>
<<>>Going against my better judgment to reply to this, but fish can survive
<<>>high pH where plants will die. Plus I think saying something is "fine" is
<<>>pretty general, goldfish are tough. ~ jan



-------
I forgot more about ponds and koi than I'll ever know!

[[email protected]]

~ janj wrote:
> ... fish can survive
> high pH where plants will die. Plus I think saying something is "fine" is
> pretty general, goldfish are tough. ~ jan

Pretty good discussion so far. Ingrid has almost certainly thought of
this already, but the sealer may be somehow toxic to plants but ok with
fish. That would not necessarily show up in any of the usual water
tests. Another 100% water change would reduce this factor, because most
of the possible toxins may have leached by now.

OTH, perhaps catfish chow is the secret ingredient for growing pond
plants :o) .
d.

[Tristan]

No actually for one person its Wally Worlds cat food!

On 7 Jan 2007 14:00:39 -0800, wrote:

<<>>
<<>>~ janj wrote:
<<>>> ... fish can survive
<<>>> high pH where plants will die. Plus I think saying something is "fine" is
<<>>> pretty general, goldfish are tough. ~ jan
<<>>
<<>>Pretty good discussion so far. Ingrid has almost certainly thought of
<<>>this already, but the sealer may be somehow toxic to plants but ok with
<<>>fish. That would not necessarily show up in any of the usual water
<<>>tests. Another 100% water change would reduce this factor, because most
<<>>of the possible toxins may have leached by now.
<<>>
<<>>OTH, perhaps catfish chow is the secret ingredient for growing pond
<<>>plants :o) .
<<>>d.



-------
I forgot more about ponds and koi than I'll ever know!

[[email protected]]

Tristan wrote:
> No actually for one person its Wally Worlds cat food!
>
Whoops, I'll have to pay more attention when lurking. That new RPM
group will be fun, eh?
d.

[Tristan]

On 7 Jan 2007 15:09:26 -0800, wrote:

<<>>
<<>>Tristan wrote:
<<>>> No actually for one person its Wally Worlds cat food!
<<>>>
<<>>Whoops, I'll have to pay more attention when lurking. That new RPM
<<>>group will be fun, eh?
<<>>d.

Thats an understatment.





-------
I forgot more about ponds and koi than I'll ever know!

[Dave Doe]

In article >,
says...
>
> Yes, one good suggestion. Do not pay CArol aka Zebulon or Andrea
> Nogales any attention., She is a vile and vulgar old loon that craves
> attention and does not have a clue what she is even talking about. She
> adlibs most of what she posts.

pot kettle black - and yer in the bozo bin now, don't need to read your
chit.

--
Duncan

[Tristan]

Shows you just how stupid you really are dude! I bet your a relative
of the Gulleys or maybe their daughter-in-law!

On Mon, 8 Jan 2007 13:50:21 +1300, Dave Doe > wrote:

<<>>In article >,
says...
<<>>>
<<>>> Yes, one good suggestion. Do not pay CArol aka Zebulon or Andrea
<<>>> Nogales any attention., She is a vile and vulgar old loon that craves
<<>>> attention and does not have a clue what she is even talking about. She
<<>>> adlibs most of what she posts.
<<>>
<<>>pot kettle black - and yer in the bozo bin now, don't need to read your
<<>>chit.



-------
I forgot more about ponds and koi than I'll ever know!

[Zebulon]

"~ janj" > wrote in message
...
> On Sun, 7 Jan 2007 14:28:10 -0600, Zëbulon > wrote:
>
>>=====================
>>If the water was that drastically different I would think the fish would
>>have also reacted badly yet the OP says they're fine. I have to acclimate
>>every fish I buy here or they die from what was called PH shock not too
>>long
>>ago. Plants don't just drop over dead, especially the new ones that would
>>not have been as badly effected by such a drastic difference. Plants
>>starved for nutrients fade away.........
>
> Going against my better judgment to reply to this, but fish can survive
> high pH where plants will die. Plus I think saying something is "fine" is
> pretty general, goldfish are tough. ~ jan
==================
And in my experience pond plants are not so easy to kill. I assume *you're*
talking about plants that need acidic to neutral water? Please clarify.

The fish will die from *drastic PH/TDS for fish change* before the plants
will, at least the ones I raise which have been most of the common ones for
this area including cat tails, Pickerel weed, water lilies, variegated
Japanese water grass, Sweeet flag, sterile Purple Loostrife, water iris etc.
All thrive inwater with a PH over 8.. Our water ranges from 7.4 to 8.5,
sometimes higher.

*THIS IS MY EXPERIENCE* with pond plants here in Middle TN since 1995. Your
experience my be different.
--
ZB....
Frugal ponding since 1995.
rec.ponder since late 1996.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[Zebulon]

> wrote in message
ups.com...
>
> ~ janj wrote:
>> ... fish can survive
>> high pH where plants will die. Plus I think saying something is "fine" is
>> pretty general, goldfish are tough. ~ jan
>
> Pretty good discussion so far. Ingrid has almost certainly thought of
> this already, but the sealer may be somehow toxic to plants but ok with
> fish. That would not necessarily show up in any of the usual water
> tests. Another 100% water change would reduce this factor, because most
> of the possible toxins may have leached by now.
>
> OTH, perhaps catfish chow is the secret ingredient for growing pond
> plants :o) .
> d.
======================
It sure grows nice koi and goldfish. :-) See below.
--
ZB....
Frugal ponding since 1995.
rec.ponder since late 1996.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[Zebulon]

> wrote in message
oups.com...
>
> Tristan wrote:
>> No actually for one person its Wally Worlds cat food!
>>
> Whoops, I'll have to pay more attention when lurking. That new RPM
> group will be fun, eh?
> d.
=========================
It sure looks that way........ :-)
--
ZB....
Frugal ponding since 1995.
rec.ponder since late 1996.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[~ janj]

>And in my experience pond plants are not so easy to kill. I assume *you're*
>talking about plants that need acidic to neutral water? Please clarify.

A great majority of plants will die with pH over 9, where goldfish will
thrive. The poster didn't say what kinds of plants, nor how quickly they
died. It could very well be, as you surmised from the beginning, that the
problem is simply winter. We don't know if Pat doesn't tell us. ~ jan

[Zebulon]

"~ janj" > wrote in message
...
> >And in my experience pond plants are not so easy to kill. I assume
> >*you're*
>>talking about plants that need acidic to neutral water? Please clarify.
>
> A great majority of plants will die with pH over 9, where goldfish will
> thrive. The poster didn't say what kinds of plants, nor how quickly they
> died. It could very well be, as you surmised from the beginning, that the
> problem is simply winter. We don't know if Pat doesn't tell us. ~ jan
=====================
Let's hope she does. :-)
--
ZB....
Frugal ponding since 1995.
rec.ponder since late 1996.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[Rusty]

Is that so...still yet more babbling idiotic statements from a
babbling idiot named Tristan aka Roy Hauer



"Tristan" > wrote in message
...
>
>
> Is that so...still yet more babbling idiotic statements from a
> babbling idiot named Carol aka Andrea Nogales
>
> On Sun, 7 Jan 2007 15:01:41 -0600, Zëbulon >
> wrote:
>
> <<>>
> > wrote in message
> oups.com...
> <<>>
> <<>>Zëbulon wrote:
> <<>>> If the water was that drastically different I would think the fish
would
> <<>>> have also reacted badly yet the OP says they're fine. I have to
acclimate
> <<>>> every fish I buy here or they die from what was called PH shock.
> <<>>Nutrients <> pH.
> <<>>d.
> <<>>==================
> <<>>PH,... TDS etc. Sure, the fish may sicken and die - but not pond type
> <<>>plants. Lack of nutrients don't kill plants quickly. I've been
growing and
> <<>>selling pond plants for over 5 years now and never once saw them
suddenly
> <<>>die due to a total water change.
>
>
>
> -------
> I forgot more about ponds and koi than I'll ever know!

[Rusty]

Oh I am saure Tristan aka Roy Hauer will respond, and of course as usual
will have the totally wrong answer. But then someone will reposnd with
correct answer and then he can go into action and ad lib his
rendition.

"Tristan" > wrote in message
...
>
>
> Oh I am saure Carol aka Zebulon will respond, and of course as usual
> will have the totally wrong answer. But then someone will reposnd with
> correct answer and then she can go into action and ad lib her
> rendition.
>
>
> On Sun, 07 Jan 2007 10:58:54 GMT, wrote:
>
> <<>>maybe somebody in rec.ponds would know the answer to this. but post
it over here too
> <<>>to make sure Pat gets the answer. Ingrid
> <<>>
> <<>>"PatC" > wrote:
> <<>>
> <<>>>A few months ago we applied a 'pond sealer' as our concrete based
pond had
> <<>>>sprung a leak.
> <<>>>Since then all has been fine with the fish & no leaking. They have
even
> <<>>>spawned & we have young goldfish (fanatails & shebunkins) thriving in
a
> <<>>>seperate area.
> <<>>>All the plants that we had previously were vigorous & needed constant
> <<>>>cutting back but have now died.
> <<>>>I went to a bit of expense & got new ones - same thing happened.
> <<>>>I could see no warning on the can & we followed directions to the
letter re
> <<>>>changing the water etc., before re-introducing the fish again.
> <<>>>Is there anything we can do as we live in a hot climate & the fish
need
> <<>>>protection from the heat. We do have shadecloth over the pond but
would also
> <<>>>like some plants to survive.
> <<>>>Anyone got any ideas please?
> <<>>>
> <<>>>Ta Pat
> <<>>>
> <<>>>
> <<>>
> <<>>
> <<>>
> <<>>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> <<>>List Manager: Puregold Goldfish List at
> <<>>http://weloveteaching.com/puregold/
> <<>>sign up:
http://groups.google.com/groups/dir?hl=en&q=puregold&qt_s=Group+lookup
> <<>>www.drsolo.com
> <<>>Solve the problem, dont waste energy finding who's to blame
> <<>>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> <<>>I receive no compensation for running the Puregold list or Puregold
website.
> <<>>I do not run nor receive any money from the ads at the old Puregold
site.
> <<>>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> <<>>Zone 5 next to Lake Michigan
>
>
>
> -------
> I forgot more about ponds and koi than I'll ever know!

[Rusty]

Yea right tristan add stuiff bewfore you really do any tests to know
whats is lacking if anyhting at all., your a dumbass plain and
simple....or is it Angela Nogales now?

"Tristan" > wrote in message
...
>
>
> Yea right carol add stuiff bewfore you really do any tests to know
> whats is lacking if anyhting at all., your a dumbass plain and
> simple....or is it Angela Nogales now?
>
> On Sun, 7 Jan 2007 12:58:45 -0600, Zëbulon >
> wrote:
>
> <<>>
> > wrote in message
> ups.com...
> <<>>> Not a pond person but I keep planted aquaria and am constantly
dosing
> <<>>> them with one nutrient or another. Do you suppose that the leaky
pond
> <<>>> obtained some nutrients from the surrounding soil, and that
> <<>>> water-topping-off to compensate for leaks also added elements that
the
> <<>>> plants liked? If so, water tests for macronutrients and addition of
> <<>>> lacking nutrients might help - don't forget the trace elements.
> <<>>> d.
> <<>>==========================
> <<>>Another ponder here suggested 1 tbs. Potassium per 1000g of pond
water.
> <<>>I've been adding that every month over the summer. It's the only
fertilizer
> <<>>I use for everything but the water lilies. I use Jobe's Rose Spikes
for
> <<>>them. They thrive and bloom like crazy until fall. :-)
> <<>>
> <<>>Although I tried every suggestion regarding fertilizers I heard about,
I
> <<>>never did get my Lotus to bloom. I think it finally died last summer
as it
> <<>>turned brown before the fall chill.
>
>
>
> -------
> I forgot more about ponds and koi than I'll ever know!

[Rusty]

Is that so...still yet more babbling idiotic statements from a
babbling idiot named TRistan aka Andrea Nogales

"Tristan" > wrote in message
...
>
>
> Is that so...still yet more babbling idiotic statements from a
> babbling idiot named Carol aka Andrea Nogales
>
> On Sun, 7 Jan 2007 15:01:41 -0600, Zëbulon >
> wrote:
>
> <<>>
> > wrote in message
> oups.com...
> <<>>
> <<>>Zëbulon wrote:
> <<>>> If the water was that drastically different I would think the fish
would
> <<>>> have also reacted badly yet the OP says they're fine. I have to
acclimate
> <<>>> every fish I buy here or they die from what was called PH shock.
> <<>>Nutrients <> pH.
> <<>>d.
> <<>>==================
> <<>>PH,... TDS etc. Sure, the fish may sicken and die - but not pond type
> <<>>plants. Lack of nutrients don't kill plants quickly. I've been
growing and
> <<>>selling pond plants for over 5 years now and never once saw them
suddenly
> <<>>die due to a total water change.
>
>
>
> -------
> I forgot more about ponds and koi than I'll ever know!

[Rusty]

Number on water parameters would be nice as would a list of so called
plants. Any other repely you get is gonna be a guess without having
all the facts. Any infoyou get from Tristan alka Roy Hauer aka
Andrea NOgales would be bull**** anyhow and needs to be taken with
agrain of salt. He is notoriious for giving erroneous info anyhow.

"Tristan" > wrote in message
...
>
>
> Number on water parameters would be nice as would a list of so called
> plants. Any other repely you get is gonna be a guess without having
> all the facts. Any infoyou get from Zebulon alka CArol Gulley aka
> Andrea NOgales would be bull**** anyhow and needs to be taken with
> agrain of salt. She is notoriious for giving erroneous info anyhow.
>
> On Sun, 07 Jan 2007 20:57:53 GMT, ~ janj > wrote:
>
> <<>>On Sun, 7 Jan 2007 14:28:10 -0600, Zëbulon >
wrote:
> <<>>
> <<>>>=====================
> <<>>>If the water was that drastically different I would think the fish
would
> <<>>>have also reacted badly yet the OP says they're fine. I have to
acclimate
> <<>>>every fish I buy here or they die from what was called PH shock not
too long
> <<>>>ago. Plants don't just drop over dead, especially the new ones that
would
> <<>>>not have been as badly effected by such a drastic difference. Plants
> <<>>>starved for nutrients fade away.........
> <<>>
> <<>>Going against my better judgment to reply to this, but fish can
survive
> <<>>high pH where plants will die. Plus I think saying something is "fine"
is
> <<>>pretty general, goldfish are tough. ~ jan
>
>
>
> -------
> I forgot more about ponds and koi than I'll ever know!

[Rusty]

Really so much for what you automatically assume dumbass! There is
just too many unasnered parts to make any kind of real assessment
anyhow. Now go away.,

"Tristan" > wrote in message
...
>
>
> Really so much for what you automatically assume dumbass! There is
> just too many unasnered parts to make any kind of real assessment
> anyhow. Now go away.,
>
> On Sun, 7 Jan 2007 14:28:10 -0600, Zëbulon >
> wrote:
>
> <<>>
> <<>>"~ janj" > wrote in message
> ...
> <<>>>>Not a pond person but I keep planted aquaria and am constantly
dosing
> <<>>>>them with one nutrient or another. Do you suppose that the leaky
pond
> <<>>>>obtained some nutrients from the surrounding soil, and that
> <<>>>>water-topping-off to compensate for leaks also added elements that
the
> <<>>>>plants liked? If so, water tests for macronutrients and addition of
> <<>>>>lacking nutrients might help - don't forget the trace elements.
> <<>>>>d.
> <<>>>
> <<>>> Good catch D. I didn't even think about why it might have all worked
in
> <<>>> the
> <<>>> old pond and now isn't in the new. It all comes down to water
parameters.
> <<>>> Hopefully Pat has some test kits. ~ jan
> <<>>=====================
> <<>>If the water was that drastically different I would think the fish
would
> <<>>have also reacted badly yet the OP says they're fine. I have to
acclimate
> <<>>every fish I buy here or they die from what was called PH shock not
too long
> <<>>ago. Plants don't just drop over dead, especially the new ones that
would
> <<>>not have been as badly effected by such a drastic difference. Plants
> <<>>starved for nutrients fade away.........
>
>
>
> -------
> I forgot more about ponds and koi than I'll ever know!

[Rusty]

Shows you just how stupid you really are dude! I bet your a relative
of the Hauers or maybe their daughter-in-law!

"Tristan" > wrote in message
...
>
>
> Shows you just how stupid you really are dude! I bet your a relative
> of the Gulleys or maybe their daughter-in-law!
>
> On Mon, 8 Jan 2007 13:50:21 +1300, Dave Doe > wrote:
>
> <<>>In article >,
> says...
> <<>>>
> <<>>> Yes, one good suggestion. Do not pay CArol aka Zebulon or Andrea
> <<>>> Nogales any attention., She is a vile and vulgar old loon that
craves
> <<>>> attention and does not have a clue what she is even talking about.
She
> <<>>> adlibs most of what she posts.
> <<>>
> <<>>pot kettle black - and yer in the bozo bin now, don't need to read
your
> <<>>chit.
>
>
>
> -------
> I forgot more about ponds and koi than I'll ever know!

[PatC]

Hi
It's me again - the person who sent the original message.
I'm totally confused as to who is a geuine sender & who's not..
Anyway, for what it's worth, the water composition ie PH etc has NOT
changed.
Everything is the same as it was before I 'sealed' the pond..

Ta

Pat


"PatC" > wrote in message
...
> A few months ago we applied a 'pond sealer' as our concrete based pond had
> sprung a leak.
> Since then all has been fine with the fish & no leaking. They have even
> spawned & we have young goldfish (fanatails & shebunkins) thriving in a
> seperate area.
> All the plants that we had previously were vigorous & needed constant
> cutting back but have now died.
> I went to a bit of expense & got new ones - same thing happened.
> I could see no warning on the can & we followed directions to the letter
re
> changing the water etc., before re-introducing the fish again.
> Is there anything we can do as we live in a hot climate & the fish need
> protection from the heat. We do have shadecloth over the pond but would
also
> like some plants to survive.
> Anyone got any ideas please?
>
> Ta Pat
>
>
>

[PatC]

The plants were 'Water poppies' & 'Parrot feather fern' , also had a couple
of pots with 'Hair grass', sorry don't know their scientific names & could
be called by other names in other parts of the world ( I'm in OZ)


"PatC" > wrote in message
...
> Hi
> It's me again - the person who sent the original message.
> I'm totally confused as to who is a geuine sender & who's not..
> Anyway, for what it's worth, the water composition ie PH etc has NOT
> changed.
> Everything is the same as it was before I 'sealed' the pond..
>
> Ta
>
> Pat
>
>
> "PatC" > wrote in message
>
...
> > A few months ago we applied a 'pond sealer' as our concrete based pond
had
> > sprung a leak.
> > Since then all has been fine with the fish & no leaking. They have even
> > spawned & we have young goldfish (fanatails & shebunkins) thriving in a
> > seperate area.
> > All the plants that we had previously were vigorous & needed constant
> > cutting back but have now died.
> > I went to a bit of expense & got new ones - same thing happened.
> > I could see no warning on the can & we followed directions to the letter
> re
> > changing the water etc., before re-introducing the fish again.
> > Is there anything we can do as we live in a hot climate & the fish need
> > protection from the heat. We do have shadecloth over the pond but would
> also
> > like some plants to survive.
> > Anyone got any ideas please?
> >
> > Ta Pat
> >
> >
> >
>
>

[Zëbulon]

>wrote:

> Buxom freaky-cum-girl with wide weenie wringer and teeny-weeny
> happiness and a spare begs for paltry caped crusader for avid to drive
> it home. Mail me at >