Help - sick goldfish

[Tristan]

Sounds like a bacterial infection. I would do a water change and start
it on some anti biotics.......better yet do what Dr. Solo suggests
and I am sure she will be aorund before to long.....A bit of salt may
help as well, but anti biotics are best bet. YOu can get them at most
any LFS.

What ever yu do do not pay any attentio to Carol Gulley aka Zebulon as
she is known to give out harmfull info and it could do your fish more
harm than good......YOu coulkd also go sign on to koishack.com and get
a proper answer really quick as they always have folks in the know
online...registration only takes a minute to access koishack.


On 5 Feb 2007 15:52:55 -0800, "Jeannie" > wrote:

<<>>Hi, my daughter has an 11-year-old orange-and-white goldfish (feeder
<<>>type, not koi) who seems to be on his last...fins. He has been
<<>>sleeping tail-up between regular activity periods, and now she says
<<>>his whole rear end is red. He has no fungus or rot symptoms, and has
<<>>had a couple of episodes of a 'lump' on one side of his body/tail area
<<>>which we assumed was constipation, but she has seen him poop as
<<>>recently as yesterday and the lump seems to be smaller.
<<>>
<<>>What might be causing of the redness?
<<>>
<<>>Thanks
<<>>Jeannie



-------
I forgot more about ponds and koi than I'll ever know!

[Jeannie]

Hi, my daughter has an 11-year-old orange-and-white goldfish (feeder
type, not koi) who seems to be on his last...fins. He has been
sleeping tail-up between regular activity periods, and now she says
his whole rear end is red. He has no fungus or rot symptoms, and has
had a couple of episodes of a 'lump' on one side of his body/tail area
which we assumed was constipation, but she has seen him poop as
recently as yesterday and the lump seems to be smaller.

What might be causing of the redness?

Thanks
Jeannie

[Jeannie]

On Feb 5, 3:51 pm, Tristan > wrote:
> Sounds like a bacterial infection. I would do a water change and start
> it on some anti biotics.......better yet do what Dr. Solo suggests
> and I am sure she will be aorund before to long.....A bit of salt may
> help as well, but anti biotics are best bet. YOu can get them at most
> any LFS.
>
> What ever yu do do not pay any attentio to Carol Gulley aka Zebulon as
> she is known to give out harmfull info and it could do your fish more
> harm than good......YOu coulkd also go sign on to koishack.com and get
> a proper answer really quick as they always have folks in the know
> online...registration only takes a minute to access koishack.

Thanks...in the meantime I've also found information on
weloveteaching.com about koi, which I think are related enough to
goldfish to help.

You mention salt...is that table salt or epsom salts? How much for a
5 gallon tank?

We are starting with a water change (although it has not been that
long since the last one...we have done it once a month for years and
the fish has been fine).

Jeannie

[Gill Passman]

Jeannie wrote:
> On Feb 5, 3:51 pm, Tristan > wrote:
>
>>Sounds like a bacterial infection. I would do a water change and start
>>it on some anti biotics.......better yet do what Dr. Solo suggests
>>and I am sure she will be aorund before to long.....A bit of salt may
>>help as well, but anti biotics are best bet. YOu can get them at most
>>any LFS.
>>
>>What ever yu do do not pay any attentio to Carol Gulley aka Zebulon as
>>she is known to give out harmfull info and it could do your fish more
>>harm than good......YOu coulkd also go sign on to koishack.com and get
>>a proper answer really quick as they always have folks in the know
>>online...registration only takes a minute to access koishack.
>
>
> Thanks...in the meantime I've also found information on
> weloveteaching.com about koi, which I think are related enough to
> goldfish to help.
>
> You mention salt...is that table salt or epsom salts? How much for a
> 5 gallon tank?
>
> We are starting with a water change (although it has not been that
> long since the last one...we have done it once a month for years and
> the fish has been fine).
>
> Jeannie
>

Hi Jeannie,

weloveteaching.com is Dr Solo's site....so if she doesn't answer you
here then do as Tristan says and follow the advice you find there...

In addition can you tell us what size the tank is? Is it filtered? Do
you change water frequently and if yes what is your routine for doing
this? Are there any live plants in the tank?

Obviously you need to treat the immediate symptoms of your daughters
fish but IME clean water is the key so start doing 10% water changes
each day....make sure you treat the water with an appropriate
conditioner to neutralise chlorine/chloramines/heavy metals and get it
to room temperature so you don't shock the fish with the cold water we
get out our taps at this time of year (well in certain areas
anyhow)....before you start the changes take a sample of the water....if
you don't have test kits take it to your LFS and get them to test for
ammonia/nitrites/nitrates/pH.....

After 11 years it could be old tank syndrome that is hurting the
fish....therefore you need to treat the symptoms but also the
cause....so gently start changing the water so you don't shock the
fish....like I said 10% daily and vaccuum any gravel you have in there
at the same time to remove any crud that has built up over the
years.....but I am guessing as I don't know right now what you have done
in terms of tank maintenance so let us know....

Hope your goldie gets well soon

Gill

[Tristan]

That would be table salt, "NON" iodized or regular old aquarium salt.I
am sure on welove teaching site there is bound to be a salt ratio. I
do hope that fish is not in a 5 gal tank, except perhaps for a dip or
QT......

The triple sulfa capsules works pretty good as its a broad spectrum
antibiotic.....and covers gram positive as well as gram negative
problems



On 5 Feb 2007 16:14:51 -0800, "Jeannie" > wrote:

<<>>On Feb 5, 3:51 pm, Tristan > wrote:
<<>>> Sounds like a bacterial infection. I would do a water change and start
<<>>> it on some anti biotics.......better yet do what Dr. Solo suggests
<<>>> and I am sure she will be aorund before to long.....A bit of salt may
<<>>> help as well, but anti biotics are best bet. YOu can get them at most
<<>>> any LFS.
<<>>>
<<>>> What ever yu do do not pay any attentio to Carol Gulley aka Zebulon as
<<>>> she is known to give out harmfull info and it could do your fish more
<<>>> harm than good......YOu coulkd also go sign on to koishack.com and get
<<>>> a proper answer really quick as they always have folks in the know
<<>>> online...registration only takes a minute to access koishack.
<<>>
<<>>Thanks...in the meantime I've also found information on
<<>>weloveteaching.com about koi, which I think are related enough to
<<>>goldfish to help.
<<>>
<<>>You mention salt...is that table salt or epsom salts? How much for a
<<>>5 gallon tank?
<<>>
<<>>We are starting with a water change (although it has not been that
<<>>long since the last one...we have done it once a month for years and
<<>>the fish has been fine).
<<>>
<<>>Jeannie



-------
I forgot more about ponds and koi than I'll ever know!

[Tristan]

If you go anti-biotic route go for the sulfas (sulfanomides) or oxy
tetracycline or any that is gram-negative effective, Gram negative
infections is most common type in fish, so any antibiotic for gram
negative would be fine.

Just doing a bit of checking and it sounds more liek the fish has what
is called aeromonas, or hemoorrhagic septicema where the skin gets red
lesions and infected around fin bases and in internal organs wicvh
can show up as a red anal area. Its usually caused by rich oprganic
water....A gold fish is a dirty fish as compared to other fish, so its
not impossible that organics have built up and a once a month water
change is no longer sufficient......Recovery is usually good if water
parameters are good and anti biotics are administered.

Lots of luck




On 5 Feb 2007 16:14:51 -0800, "Jeannie" > wrote:

<<>>On Feb 5, 3:51 pm, Tristan > wrote:
<<>>> Sounds like a bacterial infection. I would do a water change and start
<<>>> it on some anti biotics.......better yet do what Dr. Solo suggests
<<>>> and I am sure she will be aorund before to long.....A bit of salt may
<<>>> help as well, but anti biotics are best bet. YOu can get them at most
<<>>> any LFS.
<<>>>
<<>>> What ever yu do do not pay any attentio to Carol Gulley aka Zebulon as
<<>>> she is known to give out harmfull info and it could do your fish more
<<>>> harm than good......YOu coulkd also go sign on to koishack.com and get
<<>>> a proper answer really quick as they always have folks in the know
<<>>> online...registration only takes a minute to access koishack.
<<>>
<<>>Thanks...in the meantime I've also found information on
<<>>weloveteaching.com about koi, which I think are related enough to
<<>>goldfish to help.
<<>>
<<>>You mention salt...is that table salt or epsom salts? How much for a
<<>>5 gallon tank?
<<>>
<<>>We are starting with a water change (although it has not been that
<<>>long since the last one...we have done it once a month for years and
<<>>the fish has been fine).
<<>>
<<>>Jeannie



-------
I forgot more about ponds and koi than I'll ever know!

[Zebulon]

Roy "Tristan" Hauer > wrote in message
...
>> What ever yu do do not pay any attentio to Carol Gulley aka Zebulon as
> she is known to give out harmfull info and it could do your fish more
> harm than good......YOu coulkd also go sign on to koishack.com and get
> a proper answer really quick as they always have folks in the know
> online...registration only takes a minute to access koishack.
================
You really need to get over your obsession with "Carol" before you have a
complete psychotic episode again. Slandering people doesn't make you the
hero you want people to see you as. You look like a fool. Please call the
VA hospital and get back into treatment before you hurt yourself or someone
else.

Remember what Gill said: "I hope that noone demeans themselves to troll
this thread.....that would
make them the lowest of the low IMO....."

You manage to troll every thread and demean yourself in people's eyes.
--
ZB....
Frugal ponding since 1995.
rec.ponder since late 1996.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[Zebulon]

"Gill Passman" > wrote in message
...
>> On Feb 5, 3:51 pm, Tristan > wrote:
>>
>>>What ever yu do do not pay any attentio to Carol Gulley aka Zebulon as
>>>she is known to give out harmfull info and it could do your fish more
>>>harm than good......
==============
I haven't seen one person come back here since 1996 claiming "Carol" gave
out information that harmed their fish. I'm sure you noticed your friend
Tristan slanders me every chance he gets. It looks like all these NGs will
have to be moderated to stop the verbal abuse and constant trolling of
posters.
--
ZB....
Frugal ponding since 1995.
rec.ponder since late 1996.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[Zebulon]

"Jeannie" > wrote in message
ups.com...
> Hi, my daughter has an 11-year-old orange-and-white goldfish (feeder
> type, not koi) who seems to be on his last...fins. He has been
> sleeping tail-up between regular activity periods, and now she says
> his whole rear end is red. He has no fungus or rot symptoms, and has
> had a couple of episodes of a 'lump' on one side of his body/tail area
> which we assumed was constipation, but she has seen him poop as
> recently as yesterday and the lump seems to be smaller.
>
> What might be causing of the redness?
==================================
I had one like this to die and when I opened it up it was packed with eggs.
Evidently since it was unable to spawn and didn't reabsorb the eggs they
reached a size to cause a fatal condition. I'm not saying that's what your
fish is suffering from but the symptoms are the same as you describe them.
You can check www.koivet.com , a site run by a licensed veterinarian. Also
Google goldfish+diseases.
--
ZB....
Frugal ponding since 1995.
rec.ponder since late 1996.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[Dave Doe]

In article >,
says...
>
> "Gill Passman" > wrote in message
> ...
> >> On Feb 5, 3:51 pm, Tristan > wrote:
> >>
> >>>What ever yu do do not pay any attentio to Carol Gulley aka Zebulon as
> >>>she is known to give out harmfull info and it could do your fish more
> >>>harm than good......
> ==============
> I haven't seen one person come back here since 1996 claiming "Carol" gave
> out information that harmed their fish. I'm sure you noticed your friend
> Tristan slanders me every chance he gets. It looks like all these NGs will
> have to be moderated to stop the verbal abuse and constant trolling of
> posters.

It would help if you didn't reply to Tristan and just Bozo binned him
(as I and hopefully many others have).

Why let yourself be baited?

--
Duncan

[Tristan]

Just look at your own records.......I make one single post and CArol
manages to make an additional 6 posts without saying a ****ing thing,
as well as drag in Ed Alston and a few others to make a single post
into a post contianining at least 10+ additional posts and all without
say8ing a worthwhile thng. You all belong in the bozo
bin..........Please do me the honors........So who really trashes and
trolls the groups.....Its not Jabbers or Tristan its Ed Alstonand
CArol Gulley and whatever dreges they can drag in along with them in
their jihad...too ****ing losers from the git go.Carol Gulley and Ed
Alston...


-------
I forgot more about ponds and koi than I'll ever know!

[Zebulon]

"Dave Doe" > wrote in message
. nz...
> In article >,
> says...
>>
>> "Gill Passman" > wrote in message
>> ...
>> >> On Feb 5, 3:51 pm, Tristan > wrote:
>> >>
>> >>>What ever yu do do not pay any attentio to Carol Gulley aka Zebulon as
>> >>>she is known to give out harmfull info and it could do your fish more
>> >>>harm than good......
>> ==============
>> I haven't seen one person come back here since 1996 claiming "Carol" gave
>> out information that harmed their fish. I'm sure you noticed your friend
>> Tristan slanders me every chance he gets. It looks like all these NGs
>> will
>> have to be moderated to stop the verbal abuse and constant trolling of
>> posters.
>
> It would help if you didn't reply to Tristan and just Bozo binned him
> (as I and hopefully many others have).
>
> Why let yourself be baited?
===========================
I guess you're right. Most people, after reading a few of his rants, will
do the old bozo bin number. :-)
--
ZB....
Frugal ponding since 1995.
rec.ponder since late 1996.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[Gill Passman]

Zëbulon wrote:
>
> "Gill Passman" > wrote in message
> ...
>
>>> On Feb 5, 3:51 pm, Tristan > wrote:
>>>
>>>> What ever yu do do not pay any attentio to Carol Gulley aka Zebulon as
>>>> she is known to give out harmfull info and it could do your fish more
>>>> harm than good......
>
> ==============
> I haven't seen one person come back here since 1996 claiming "Carol"
> gave out information that harmed their fish. I'm sure you noticed your
> friend Tristan slanders me every chance he gets. It looks like all
> these NGs will have to be moderated to stop the verbal abuse and
> constant trolling of posters.

I must register my objection to your use of editing in this post....you
make it appear that it was me that passed the comment regarding the
information that you give....furthermore your response attempts to
reinforce this.....This I believe is a classic troll ploy to discredit a
poster......

As for whether Tristan is "my friend" or not this has absolutely nothing
with the discussion of the OPs sick goldfish and how best to treat
it.....and is totally irrelevant......In fact the majority of posts made
against this thread by myself and Tristan where aimed at helping the
person with the sick fish....and in my book that is not trolling....

I do not believe that the comments that you have made to me in this
thread and others elsewhere have any place on a Usenet group under a
post made by someone obviously needing help about their fish.....if you
wish to take issue with me for whatever reason the appropriate forum for
this is personal email....and you have my address....as does Ed.....feel
free to mail me with your gripes....I may or may not choose to respond -
but keep it off the fish groups....

Gill

[Jeannie]

Many thanks to all for your comments and help. An update, now that I
have actually seen the fish...the redness is actually a largish lump
is just forward of the pectoral fin and only on the bottom; looks more
like a large hernia than anything else, and definitely not a skin-
disease type of thing. It's a bit smaller this morning since a 1/2
water change last evening, and the fish is perky and interested in the
(very little bit of) food we gave him.

"Benji" (we actually don't know the sex) is a 11-year-old feeder
goldfish, about 5 inches long, so a 5-gallon tank should be fine, no?
(No room for anything bigger anyway.) We have changed the water once
a month using our (very pure mountain) tap water that we have let sit
open for 2 days, stirring occasionally. We always keep a large carboy-
type jug of water sitting for fish change water and drinking water for
our two snakes.

The tank is not filtered, never in direct sun, and has no plants in
it. We have done a complete water change and tank/gravel scrub
monthly for years (putting the fish in a bucket of the "old" tank
water plus some new water), plus partial changes every so often when
too much food is accidentally fed. The fresh water is always the same
temperature as the tank--learned that lesson the hard way in my callow
yout'.

I will stop and get some antibiotics and salt today, and we will do
partial water changes weekly from now on...hopefully that will do the
trick. I have no idea what to do if the lump is eggs...yikes. Can
one massage them out?

Jeannie

P.S. I will say here that I am disappointed to see that this group is
like most other Usenet newsgroups--certain folks are so intent on
insulting each other that they waste time and bandwidth on off-topic
mud-throwing posts. Guess you can't get away from that anywhere!

[Zebulon]

"Gill Passman" > wrote in message
...
> Zëbulon wrote:
>>
>> "Gill Passman" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>
>>>> On Feb 5, 3:51 pm, Tristan > wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> What ever yu do do not pay any attentio to Carol Gulley aka Zebulon as
>>>>> she is known to give out harmfull info and it could do your fish more
>>>>> harm than good......
>>
>> ==============
>> I haven't seen one person come back here since 1996 claiming "Carol" gave
>> out information that harmed their fish. I'm sure you noticed your friend
>> Tristan slanders me every chance he gets. It looks like all these NGs
>> will have to be moderated to stop the verbal abuse and constant trolling
>> of posters.
---------------
> I must register my objection to your use of editing in this post....you
> make it appear that it was me that passed the comment regarding the
> information that you give....furthermore your response attempts to
> reinforce this.....This I believe is a classic troll ploy to discredit a
> poster......

What are you talking about? Edit it how? I replied to YOU. I told YOU not
one person has accused me of harming their fish. The troll is the one
constantly slandering and harassing me (and his other victims) from one
group to another.

> As for whether Tristan is "my friend" or not this has absolutely nothing
> with the discussion of the OPs sick goldfish and how best to treat
> it.....and is totally irrelevant......In fact the majority of posts made
> against this thread by myself and Tristan where aimed at helping the
> person with the sick fish....and in my book that is not trolling....

No one said giving advice was trolling. The constant personal attacks are
TROLLING.

> I do not believe that the comments that you have made to me in this thread
> and others elsewhere have any place on a Usenet group under a post made by
> someone obviously needing help about their fish.....if you wish to take
> issue with me for whatever reason the appropriate forum for this is
> personal email....and you have my address....as does Ed.....feel free to
> mail me with your gripes....I may or may not choose to respond - but keep
> it off the fish groups....

Keep WHAT off the fish groups? I can't stop Tristan's constant personal
attacks any more than I can stop the other trolls........
--
ZB....
Frugal ponding since 1995.
rec.ponder since late 1996.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[Tristan]

I hate to be the berarer of bad news but read on:

On 6 Feb 2007 13:44:56 -0800, "Jeannie" > wrote:

<<>>Many thanks to all for your comments and help. An update, now that I
<<>>have actually seen the fish...the redness is actually a largish lump
<<>>is just forward of the pectoral fin and only on the bottom; looks more
<<>>like a large hernia than anything else, and definitely not a skin-
<<>>disease type of thing. It's a bit smaller this morning since a 1/2
<<>>water change last evening, and the fish is perky and interested in the
<<>>(very little bit of) food we gave him.

This is good. Perhaps see if you can buy a small container of
medicated food.
<<>>
<<>>"Benji" (we actually don't know the sex) is a 11-year-old feeder
<<>>goldfish, about 5 inches long, so a 5-gallon tank should be fine, no?
<<>>(No room for anything bigger anyway.) We have changed the water once
<<>>a month using our (very pure mountain) tap water that we have let sit
<<>>open for 2 days, stirring occasionally. We always keep a large carboy-
<<>>type jug of water sitting for fish change water and drinking water for
<<>>our two snakes.
NO. 5 gal is much to small for a gold fish espeically one that is 5"
long....I have a feeling yur main problem is from organic rich water,
and an internal bacterial infection.
<<>>
<<>>The tank is not filtered, never in direct sun, and has no plants in
<<>>it. We have done a complete water change and tank/gravel scrub
<<>>monthly for years (putting the fish in a bucket of the "old" tank
<<>>water plus some new water), plus partial changes every so often when
<<>>too much food is accidentally fed. The fresh water is always the same
<<>>temperature as the tank--learned that lesson the hard way in my callow
<<>>yout'.
<<>>

Water really need sot be filtered with a goldie as they are heavy
contributors to organic loads and messy eaters. Invest in a filter
please! And see what you can do in regards togetting it a bigger tank.
HOw about an outdoor water device usch as a half barrel water garden,
Even at that a half barrel which is typically a water featuyre of one
half a whiskey or wine barrel and approx 20 gal is still small for a
goldie, but its a heck of a lot better thana 5 gal unfiltered tank.
Add a few live plants to pull out nitrogen and other junk. Don't now
your zone, but its possible that half barrel will be suitbale for all
year round use for a bit, as goldies like cooler water and live under
ice without any problems if properly kept. In the meantime look for a
larger home or find a new home for it.

<<>>I will stop and get some antibiotics and salt today, and we will do
<<>>partial water changes weekly from now on...hopefully that will do the
<<>>trick. I have no idea what to do if the lump is eggs...yikes. Can
<<>>one massage them out?

Yes, you can, if that is a problem but if you do not know what your
doing you can make things worse. It can still be an internal infection
that causes a swollen up area as such or it could be a tumor or
growth, (not uncommon at all) or egg impaction.
<<>>
<<>>Jeannie
<<>>
<<>>P.S. I will say here that I am disappointed to see that this group is
<<>>like most other Usenet newsgroups--certain folks are so intent on
<<>>insulting each other that they waste time and bandwidth on off-topic
<<>>mud-throwing posts. Guess you can't get away from that anywhere!
<<>>
<<>>
Lets just say some folks deserve what they get thrown at them....and
leave it at that.



-------
I forgot more about ponds and koi than I'll ever know!

[Tristan]

You really are a dumbass are you not CArol? DUH, even double DUH!

On Tue, 6 Feb 2007 16:00:29 -0600, Zëbulon >
wrote:

<<>>
<<>>"Gill Passman" > wrote in message
...
<<>>> Zëbulon wrote:
<<>>>>
<<>>>> "Gill Passman" > wrote in message
<<>>>> ...
<<>>>>
<<>>>>>> On Feb 5, 3:51 pm, Tristan > wrote:
<<>>>>>>
<<>>>>>>> What ever yu do do not pay any attentio to Carol Gulley aka Zebulon as
<<>>>>>>> she is known to give out harmfull info and it could do your fish more
<<>>>>>>> harm than good......
<<>>>>
<<>>>> ==============
<<>>>> I haven't seen one person come back here since 1996 claiming "Carol" gave
<<>>>> out information that harmed their fish. I'm sure you noticed your friend
<<>>>> Tristan slanders me every chance he gets. It looks like all these NGs
<<>>>> will have to be moderated to stop the verbal abuse and constant trolling
<<>>>> of posters.
<<>>---------------
<<>>> I must register my objection to your use of editing in this post....you
<<>>> make it appear that it was me that passed the comment regarding the
<<>>> information that you give....furthermore your response attempts to
<<>>> reinforce this.....This I believe is a classic troll ploy to discredit a
<<>>> poster......
<<>>
<<>>What are you talking about? Edit it how? I replied to YOU. I told YOU not
<<>>one person has accused me of harming their fish. The troll is the one
<<>>constantly slandering and harassing me (and his other victims) from one
<<>>group to another.
<<>>
<<>>> As for whether Tristan is "my friend" or not this has absolutely nothing
<<>>> with the discussion of the OPs sick goldfish and how best to treat
<<>>> it.....and is totally irrelevant......In fact the majority of posts made
<<>>> against this thread by myself and Tristan where aimed at helping the
<<>>> person with the sick fish....and in my book that is not trolling....
<<>>
<<>>No one said giving advice was trolling. The constant personal attacks are
<<>>TROLLING.
<<>>
<<>>> I do not believe that the comments that you have made to me in this thread
<<>>> and others elsewhere have any place on a Usenet group under a post made by
<<>>> someone obviously needing help about their fish.....if you wish to take
<<>>> issue with me for whatever reason the appropriate forum for this is
<<>>> personal email....and you have my address....as does Ed.....feel free to
<<>>> mail me with your gripes....I may or may not choose to respond - but keep
<<>>> it off the fish groups....
<<>>
<<>>Keep WHAT off the fish groups? I can't stop Tristan's constant personal
<<>>attacks any more than I can stop the other trolls........



-------
I forgot more about ponds and koi than I'll ever know!

[Zebulon]

"Jeannie" > wrote in message
oups.com...

<brevity snip>

> "Benji" (we actually don't know the sex) is a 11-year-old feeder
> goldfish, about 5 inches long, so a 5-gallon tank should be fine, no?

That's much too small for a 5" goldfish. A fish that size needs at least a
10 to 20g tank.

> The tank is not filtered, never in direct sun, and has no plants in
> it. We have done a complete water change and tank/gravel scrub
> monthly for years (putting the fish in a bucket of the "old" tank
> water plus some new water), plus partial changes every so often when
> too much food is accidentally fed. The fresh water is always the same
> temperature as the tank--learned that lesson the hard way in my callow
> yout'.

Please Google goldfish+care. They need good filtration/aeration and
nitrogen+cycle. There is no need to clean the whole tank monthly.

> I will stop and get some antibiotics and salt today, and we will do
> partial water changes weekly from now on...hopefully that will do the
> trick. I have no idea what to do if the lump is eggs...yikes. Can
> one massage them out?

I heard it can be done but that's chancy as it's easy to rupture the sack
they're in. Your fish may be beyond help. Please don't replace it with
another GF. Your tank is too small. Get a few male guppies or a betta.
Even they would do better with filtration.

> P.S. I will say here that I am disappointed to see that this group is
> like most other Usenet newsgroups--certain folks are so intent on
> insulting each other that they waste time and bandwidth on off-topic
> mud-throwing posts. Guess you can't get away from that anywhere!

I agree. That's why people are migrating to Forums or moderated groups.
Too many of us get sucked up into the nastiness.
--
ZB....
Frugal ponding since 1995.
rec.ponder since late 1996.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[Tristan]

On Tue, 6 Feb 2007 16:07:07 -0600, Zëbulon >
wrote:

<<>>
<<>>"Jeannie" > wrote in message
oups.com...
<<>>
<<>><brevity snip>
<<>>
<<>>> "Benji" (we actually don't know the sex) is a 11-year-old feeder
<<>>> goldfish, about 5 inches long, so a 5-gallon tank should be fine, no?
<<>>
<<>>That's much too small for a 5" goldfish. A fish that size needs at least a
<<>>10 to 20g tank.
<<>>

They are too small for keepig gold fish in properly carol ....yet more
erroneous info getting put out there carol?


<<>>> The tank is not filtered, never in direct sun, and has no plants in
<<>>> it. We have done a complete water change and tank/gravel scrub
<<>>> monthly for years (putting the fish in a bucket of the "old" tank
<<>>> water plus some new water), plus partial changes every so often when
<<>>> too much food is accidentally fed. The fresh water is always the same
<<>>> temperature as the tank--learned that lesson the hard way in my callow
<<>>> yout'.
<<>>
<<>>Please Google goldfish+care. They need good filtration/aeration and
<<>>nitrogen+cycle. There is no need to clean the whole tank monthly.
<<>>
<<>>> I will stop and get some antibiotics and salt today, and we will do
<<>>> partial water changes weekly from now on...hopefully that will do the
<<>>> trick. I have no idea what to do if the lump is eggs...yikes. Can
<<>>> one massage them out?
<<>>
<<>>I heard it can be done but that's chancy as it's easy to rupture the sack
<<>>they're in. Your fish may be beyond help. Please don't replace it with
<<>>another GF. Your tank is too small. Get a few male guppies or a betta.
<<>>Even they would do better with filtration.

I have also heard CArol is a scatter brain and dumbass above reproach
when it comes to aggreeing or dissagreeing with her and her statements
and views......
<<>>
<<>>> P.S. I will say here that I am disappointed to see that this group is
<<>>> like most other Usenet newsgroups--certain folks are so intent on
<<>>> insulting each other that they waste time and bandwidth on off-topic
<<>>> mud-throwing posts. Guess you can't get away from that anywhere!
<<>>
<<>>I agree. That's why people are migrating to Forums or moderated groups.
<<>>Too many of us get sucked up into the nastiness.

Only CArol would know as she is the majopr caus eof most of the
aquaria and orther groups on usenets problems.....its all about CArol
and only CArol



-------
I forgot more about ponds and koi than I'll ever know!

[Gill Passman]

Jeannie wrote:
> Many thanks to all for your comments and help. An update, now that I
> have actually seen the fish...the redness is actually a largish lump
> is just forward of the pectoral fin and only on the bottom; looks more
> like a large hernia than anything else, and definitely not a skin-
> disease type of thing. It's a bit smaller this morning since a 1/2
> water change last evening, and the fish is perky and interested in the
> (very little bit of) food we gave him.
>

Hi Jeannie,

There have been quite a few posts about lumps on goldfish recently on
another group that I frequent....can I suggest you go and read through
some of the threads there and see if it gives you the answer. The group
is a google group called The Freshwater Aquarium - read the thread on
"Fish Surgery" - don't get alarmed by the title....it has a lot of good
info on a similar problem.....IIRC there is another one as well so you
might need to do some browsing....

Link to TFA is:-

http://groups.google.com/group/The-Freshwater-Aquarium

Gill

[Gill Passman]

Zëbulon wrote:
>
You know exactly what I meant and there are no riddles here at
all....and I was quite clear....if YOU have an issue with me then mail
me and keep it off of the groups.....I'm not interested in the issues
that you have with Tristan/Roy or whoever and nor is anyone else on this
group....If you can't honour this request then DO NOT reply to this
either on Usenet or by personal email....

Gill

[Tristan]

Then why the hell do you, CArol Gulley nott follow that advice your
self you bozo lunatic? Won;t aasnwer that will you, so let me.YOU
crave any and all attention thats why and its the main reason you do
what you do. Evidently your daddy must have either 1: Abused you or 2:
ignored you so either way you just crave any and all attention you can
set your fat ass on and claim as your own.. Your a hipocrite and
slandering bitch in additon to being an attention whore who is badly
in need of a life and a husband that may perhaps pay some attention
to you, then again I guess If I was married to someone such as you,
I would probably stay as far away as humanely possible
myself......Your a bitter old bitch carol, with a chip on her shoulder
that would sink a battleship. Just how many foks "do you get al;ong
with".....and Ed Alston does not count since he is a lunatic as well!

Your rerally a pathetic individual who lies about foks and then goes
on believeing those lies you make up......pitfull excuse for a human
being....



On Tue, 6 Feb 2007 10:16:25 -0600, Zëbulon >
wrote:

<<>>
<<>>"Dave Doe" > wrote in message
. nz...
<<>>> In article >,
<<>>> says...
<<>>>>
<<>>>> "Gill Passman" > wrote in message
<<>>>> ...
<<>>>> >> On Feb 5, 3:51 pm, Tristan > wrote:
<<>>>> >>
<<>>>> >>>What ever yu do do not pay any attentio to Carol Gulley aka Zebulon as
<<>>>> >>>she is known to give out harmfull info and it could do your fish more
<<>>>> >>>harm than good......
<<>>>> ==============
<<>>>> I haven't seen one person come back here since 1996 claiming "Carol" gave
<<>>>> out information that harmed their fish. I'm sure you noticed your friend
<<>>>> Tristan slanders me every chance he gets. It looks like all these NGs
<<>>>> will
<<>>>> have to be moderated to stop the verbal abuse and constant trolling of
<<>>>> posters.
<<>>>
<<>>> It would help if you didn't reply to Tristan and just Bozo binned him
<<>>> (as I and hopefully many others have).
<<>>>
<<>>> Why let yourself be baited?
<<>>===========================
<<>>I guess you're right. Most people, after reading a few of his rants, will
<<>>do the old bozo bin number. :-)



-------
I forgot more about ponds and koi than I'll ever know!

[Zebulon]

"Gill Passman" > wrote in message
...
> Zëbulon wrote:
>>
> You know exactly what I meant and there are no riddles here at all....and
> I was quite clear....if YOU have an issue with me then mail me and keep it
> off of the groups....

Allow me to repeat, and there is no reason to HIDE the fact - that NO ONE
has ever accused me of harming their fish in the past 11 years that I've
been on these groups. I see no reason to post that information by email
since you address *me* here in Public. I have no reason to hide that fact
in e-mail since he constantly accuses me......

..I'm not interested in the issues
> that you have with Tristan/Roy or whoever and nor is anyone else on this
> group....

I'm sure you're not, nor should you be.

If you can't honour this request then DO NOT reply to this
> either on Usenet or by personal email....

That goes two ways. You posted these messages here instead of to my e-mail.
--
ZB....
Frugal ponding since 1995.
rec.ponder since late 1996.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[Tristan]

YOUR STIL WITHOUT A CLUE CAROL!

TRIPLE DUH!

On Tue, 6 Feb 2007 17:05:31 -0600, Zëbulon >
wrote:

<<>>
<<>>"Gill Passman" > wrote in message
...
<<>>> Zëbulon wrote:
<<>>>>
<<>>> You know exactly what I meant and there are no riddles here at all....and
<<>>> I was quite clear....if YOU have an issue with me then mail me and keep it
<<>>> off of the groups....
<<>>
<<>>Allow me to repeat, and there is no reason to HIDE the fact - that NO ONE
<<>>has ever accused me of harming their fish in the past 11 years that I've
<<>>been on these groups. I see no reason to post that information by email
<<>>since you address *me* here in Public. I have no reason to hide that fact
<<>>in e-mail since he constantly accuses me......
<<>>
<<>>.I'm not interested in the issues
<<>>> that you have with Tristan/Roy or whoever and nor is anyone else on this
<<>>> group....
<<>>
<<>>I'm sure you're not, nor should you be.
<<>>
<<>>If you can't honour this request then DO NOT reply to this
<<>>> either on Usenet or by personal email....
<<>>
<<>>That goes two ways. You posted these messages here instead of to my e-mail.



-------
I forgot more about ponds and koi than I'll ever know!

[Gill Passman]

Zëbulon wrote:
>
> "Gill Passman" > wrote in message
> ...
>
>> Zëbulon wrote:
>>
>>>
>> You know exactly what I meant and there are no riddles here at
>> all....and I was quite clear....if YOU have an issue with me then mail
>> me and keep it off of the groups....
>
>
> Allow me to repeat, and there is no reason to HIDE the fact - that NO
> ONE has ever accused me of harming their fish in the past 11 years that
> I've been on these groups. I see no reason to post that information by
> email since you address *me* here in Public. I have no reason to hide
> that fact in e-mail since he constantly accuses me......
>
> .I'm not interested in the issues
>
>> that you have with Tristan/Roy or whoever and nor is anyone else on
>> this group....
>
>
> I'm sure you're not, nor should you be.
>
> If you can't honour this request then DO NOT reply to this
>
>> either on Usenet or by personal email....
>
>
> That goes two ways. You posted these messages here instead of to my
> e-mail.


OK...get this totally straight in your head....anyone tries to stitch me
up and ruin my reputation in public I WILL POST IN PUBLIC

Maybe you cannot remember the exact post that you made that has made me
so cross....would you care for me to refresh your memory....here goes....

"Gill Passman" > wrote in message
...

>> On Feb 5, 3:51 pm, Tristan > wrote:
>>
>>> What ever yu do do not pay any attentio to Carol Gulley aka Zebulon as
>>> she is known to give out harmfull info and it could do your fish more
>>> harm than good......

==============
I haven't seen one person come back here since 1996 claiming "Carol"
gave out information that harmed their fish. I'm sure you noticed your
friend Tristan slanders me every chance he gets. It looks like all
these NGs will have to be moderated to stop the verbal abuse and
constant trolling of posters.
--
ZB....
Frugal ponding since 1995.
rec.ponder since late 1996.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>


Now you addressed your reply to me and left the "Gill Passman" wrote and
then quoted Tristan with absolutely no reference to anything that I had
written.....the whole intent of your quote and response was to imply
that I HAD WRITTEN the quoted text.....

Now I am walking away from this....unless you continue with the
defamation of my character at which point I will fight you in my defense
but without the insults that you appear to expect....or dole out with
great abundance to others....and yes they probably are as much to
blame.....and I will not hesitate to tell them just the same (but
usually away from a group that involves talking about fish and in private)

As I said before if you have an issue with me then you email me
direct....if you go out to get me on Usenet I will respond in kind on
Usenet....

Gill

[Tristan]

Your really getting dumber and dumber with every post you make CArol.
VBetter givce it a rest while your still able to at least hold face on
usenet...afterall virtually all the usenet is laughing at you.

Carol...you are dumber than most.......and deserve to be in a class
all your own as far as dumbness goes.......Maybe a note to Websters
with a new word to denote total absurdity and dumbness could be called
a Carol Gulley or just a Carol or maybe a Gulley.......now if you will
excuse me I have to go take an Alston.







On Tue, 6 Feb 2007 18:46:09 -0600, Zëbulon >
wrote:

<<>>
<<>>"Gill Passman" > wrote in message
...
<<>>> Zëbulon wrote:
<<>>>>
<<>>>> "Gill Passman" > wrote in message
<<>>>> ...
<<>>>>
<<>>>>> Zëbulon wrote:
<<>>>>>
<<>>>>>>
<<>>>>> You know exactly what I meant and there are no riddles here at
<<>>>>> all....and I was quite clear....if YOU have an issue with me then mail
<<>>>>> me and keep it off of the groups....
<<>>>>
<<>>>>
<<>>>> Allow me to repeat, and there is no reason to HIDE the fact - that NO ONE
<<>>>> has ever accused me of harming their fish in the past 11 years that I've
<<>>>> been on these groups. I see no reason to post that information by email
<<>>>> since you address *me* here in Public. I have no reason to hide that
<<>>>> fact in e-mail since he constantly accuses me......
<<>>>>
<<>>>> .I'm not interested in the issues
<<>>>>
<<>>>>> that you have with Tristan/Roy or whoever and nor is anyone else on this
<<>>>>> group....
<<>>>>
<<>>>>
<<>>>> I'm sure you're not, nor should you be.
<<>>>>
<<>>>> If you can't honour this request then DO NOT reply to this
<<>>>>
<<>>>>> either on Usenet or by personal email....
<<>>>>
<<>>>>
<<>>>> That goes two ways. You posted these messages here instead of to my
<<>>>> e-mail.
<<>>>
<<>>>
<<>>> OK...get this totally straight in your head....anyone tries to stitch me
<<>>> up and ruin my reputation in public I WILL POST IN PUBLIC
<<>>
<<>>Who's trying to ruin your reputation? I wasn't the one who attacked and
<<>>degraded you in rec.ponds - Roy Tristan Hauer was! Do not accuse me of
<<>>harming your reputation.
<<>>
<<>>> Maybe you cannot remember the exact post that you made that has made me so
<<>>> cross....would you care for me to refresh your memory....here goes....
<<>>
<<>>> "Gill Passman" > wrote in message
<<>>> ...
<<>>>
<<>>> >> On Feb 5, 3:51 pm, Tristan > wrote:
<<>>> >>
<<>>> >>> What ever yu do do not pay any attentio to Carol Gulley aka Zebulon as
<<>>> >>> she is known to give out harmfull info and it could do your fish more
<<>>> >>> harm than good......
<<>>>
<<>>> ==============
<<>>> I haven't seen one person come back here since 1996 claiming "Carol" gave
<<>>> out information that harmed their fish. I'm sure you noticed your friend
<<>>> Tristan slanders me every chance he gets. It looks like all these NGs
<<>>> will have to be moderated to stop the verbal abuse and constant trolling
<<>>> of posters.
<<>>> --
<<>>> ZB....
<<>>> Frugal ponding since 1995.
<<>>> rec.ponder since late 1996.
<<>>> My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
<<>>> http://tinyurl.com/9do58
<<>>> ~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>
<<>>>
<<>>>
<<>>> Now you addressed your reply to me and left the "Gill Passman" wrote and
<<>>> then quoted Tristan with absolutely no reference to anything that I had
<<>>> written.....the whole intent of your quote and response was to imply that
<<>>> I HAD WRITTEN the quoted text.....
<<>>
<<>>No it wasn't. Read it again - *TRISTAN'S HEADER* is above HIS text.
<<>>
<<>>
<<>>> Now I am walking away from this....unless you continue with the defamation
<<>>> of my character
<<>>
<<>>Are you for real. Read it again - *TRISTAN'S HEADER* is above HIS text.
<<>>No one would confuse this message!
<<>>
<<>>at which point I will fight you in my defense
<<>>> but without the insults that you appear to expect....or dole out with
<<>>> great abundance to others....and yes they probably are as much to
<<>>> blame.....and I will not hesitate to tell them just the same (but usually
<<>>> away from a group that involves talking about fish and in private)
<<>>
<<>>I think you need to reread that message: *TRISTAN'S HEADER* is above HIS
<<>>own text. No one would confuse this message!
<<>>
<<>>> As I said before if you have an issue with me then you email me
<<>>> direct....if you go out to get me on Usenet I will respond in kind on
<<>>> Usenet....
<<>>
<<>>What makes you think I have an issue with you? READ IT AGAIN!!!!!!!!!



-------
I forgot more about ponds and koi than I'll ever know!

[Zebulon]

"Gill Passman" > wrote in message
...
> Zëbulon wrote:
>>
>> "Gill Passman" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>
>>> Zëbulon wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>> You know exactly what I meant and there are no riddles here at
>>> all....and I was quite clear....if YOU have an issue with me then mail
>>> me and keep it off of the groups....
>>
>>
>> Allow me to repeat, and there is no reason to HIDE the fact - that NO ONE
>> has ever accused me of harming their fish in the past 11 years that I've
>> been on these groups. I see no reason to post that information by email
>> since you address *me* here in Public. I have no reason to hide that
>> fact in e-mail since he constantly accuses me......
>>
>> .I'm not interested in the issues
>>
>>> that you have with Tristan/Roy or whoever and nor is anyone else on this
>>> group....
>>
>>
>> I'm sure you're not, nor should you be.
>>
>> If you can't honour this request then DO NOT reply to this
>>
>>> either on Usenet or by personal email....
>>
>>
>> That goes two ways. You posted these messages here instead of to my
>> e-mail.
>
>
> OK...get this totally straight in your head....anyone tries to stitch me
> up and ruin my reputation in public I WILL POST IN PUBLIC

Who's trying to ruin your reputation? I wasn't the one who attacked and
degraded you in rec.ponds - Roy Tristan Hauer was! Do not accuse me of
harming your reputation.

> Maybe you cannot remember the exact post that you made that has made me so
> cross....would you care for me to refresh your memory....here goes....

> "Gill Passman" > wrote in message
> ...
>
> >> On Feb 5, 3:51 pm, Tristan > wrote:
> >>
> >>> What ever yu do do not pay any attentio to Carol Gulley aka Zebulon as
> >>> she is known to give out harmfull info and it could do your fish more
> >>> harm than good......
>
> ==============
> I haven't seen one person come back here since 1996 claiming "Carol" gave
> out information that harmed their fish. I'm sure you noticed your friend
> Tristan slanders me every chance he gets. It looks like all these NGs
> will have to be moderated to stop the verbal abuse and constant trolling
> of posters.
> --
> ZB....
> Frugal ponding since 1995.
> rec.ponder since late 1996.
> My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
> http://tinyurl.com/9do58
> ~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>
>
>
> Now you addressed your reply to me and left the "Gill Passman" wrote and
> then quoted Tristan with absolutely no reference to anything that I had
> written.....the whole intent of your quote and response was to imply that
> I HAD WRITTEN the quoted text.....

No it wasn't. Read it again - *TRISTAN'S HEADER* is above HIS text.


> Now I am walking away from this....unless you continue with the defamation
> of my character

Are you for real. Read it again - *TRISTAN'S HEADER* is above HIS text.
No one would confuse this message!

at which point I will fight you in my defense
> but without the insults that you appear to expect....or dole out with
> great abundance to others....and yes they probably are as much to
> blame.....and I will not hesitate to tell them just the same (but usually
> away from a group that involves talking about fish and in private)

I think you need to reread that message: *TRISTAN'S HEADER* is above HIS
own text. No one would confuse this message!

> As I said before if you have an issue with me then you email me
> direct....if you go out to get me on Usenet I will respond in kind on
> Usenet....

What makes you think I have an issue with you? READ IT AGAIN!!!!!!!!!
--
ZB....
Frugal ponding since 1995.
rec.ponder since late 1996.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }<((((*> ~~~ }<{{{{(ö> ~~~~ }<((((({*>

[Tristan]

On Tue, 6 Feb 2007 16:07:07 -0600, Zëbulon >
wrote:

snip

Hey Carol
All that you are you owe to your parents. Why don't you send them a
penny and square the account?

Your still a dumbass!



-------
I forgot more about ponds and koi than I'll ever know!