Discus

[bassett]

I,ve managed to acquire a pair of Discus,,, [ about 21/2 inches across]
and while there is nothing unusually about that,, In Oz there few and far
apart..They also command high prices, and I was wondering if there is any
short cuts,,,

I,ve kept Angles for years, without any loses, So I do know bits and pieces
about the hobby,,, I,ve read a few forums, and frankly they just about wrap
the things up in cotton
wool,, Bare bottomed tanks, no plants, Plants in Pots, Half water changes
every day,
they go on about Ph, high // low. whatever..
Only feed this or that, never feed flakes,, and it goes on and on.. It,s a
wonder they
take them out of the plastic bags.. There only Bloody fish for Christ sake..

Anyway Ive set-up a 3 foot, something like 75 litres, with UGF [wrong]
gravel [wrong] it will be heavily planted [wrong] there will only be a small
algae sucker [wrong] and a few
neon tetra's [wrong, they go feral] If the tetra's die, something's wrong.

We don't have chemical water, It comes of the roof, and when the mud settles
its
pretty clean , I never bother to cycle the water , just bung it in, run the
UGF for a couple of days and then throw the fish in.

My question is do I treat these Discus things , the same as I treat the
angles, A bit of a vacuum once a week, water changes when theirs water to
spare, I feed pellets, Flakes,
Brine shrimp, [probably all wrong , is it any wonder they won't die]

We work a bit different in OZ,, Murphy Law,, Dictates if its going to
happen, It will.
So there's not much point in trying to stop it..
Thanks,
bassett

[Eric]

I also have a discus tank that doesn't match the profile of the tank you
describe people are expecting. I think what they're describing is the
setup that is needed if one wants to breed them and raise the fry.

I've had a lot of luck with the following setup:
- 60g tank (same footprint as a 55g, but taller)
- planted with a variety of high-temperature, low-ph plants
- flourite gravel
- 150 watts of flourescent lighting
- 82 degrees
- excellent filtration (a pair of Eheim canisters and a fluidized bed)
- high-pressure CO2 system
- lots of driftwood

I currently have in this tank:
- 3 smallish blue diamond discus (about 2.5")
- 2 pigeon blood (about 3.5")
- 12 cardinal tetras
- 1 pleco
- a lot of corydoras (not sure how many - they bred in this tank - It
looks like about a dozen and a half now.)

I do 25% water changes weekly using RO water. This tank has been
populated with these fish for abour six months now. It was up with just
the corys for about three months before the other fish were added.

Everyone in the tank is very happy, and aside from a cory that got
caught between the wall and the CO2 diffuser, I've had no losses.

I feed a wide variety of food on a rotating schedule; everything from
beta flakes (the discus LOVE beta food) and floating cichlid foods, to
frozen krill and beef heart. I drop in algae wafers for the pleco and
corys.

It's working for me so far. YMMV.
Eric


bassett wrote:
> I,ve managed to acquire a pair of Discus,,, [ about 21/2 inches across]
> and while there is nothing unusually about that,, In Oz there few and far
> apart..They also command high prices, and I was wondering if there is any
> short cuts,,,
>
> I,ve kept Angles for years, without any loses, So I do know bits and pieces
> about the hobby,,, I,ve read a few forums, and frankly they just about wrap
> the things up in cotton
> wool,, Bare bottomed tanks, no plants, Plants in Pots, Half water changes
> every day,
> they go on about Ph, high // low. whatever..
> Only feed this or that, never feed flakes,, and it goes on and on.. It,s a
> wonder they
> take them out of the plastic bags.. There only Bloody fish for Christ sake..
>
> Anyway Ive set-up a 3 foot, something like 75 litres, with UGF [wrong]
> gravel [wrong] it will be heavily planted [wrong] there will only be a small
> algae sucker [wrong] and a few
> neon tetra's [wrong, they go feral] If the tetra's die, something's wrong.
>
> We don't have chemical water, It comes of the roof, and when the mud settles
> its
> pretty clean , I never bother to cycle the water , just bung it in, run the
> UGF for a couple of days and then throw the fish in.
>
> My question is do I treat these Discus things , the same as I treat the
> angles, A bit of a vacuum once a week, water changes when theirs water to
> spare, I feed pellets, Flakes,
> Brine shrimp, [probably all wrong , is it any wonder they won't die]
>
> We work a bit different in OZ,, Murphy Law,, Dictates if its going to
> happen, It will.
> So there's not much point in trying to stop it..
> Thanks,
> bassett
>

[Iain Miller]

"Eric" > wrote in message
...
> I also have a discus tank that doesn't match the profile of the tank you
> describe people are expecting. I think what they're describing is the
> setup that is needed if one wants to breed them and raise the fry.
>
> I've had a lot of luck with the following setup:
> - 60g tank (same footprint as a 55g, but taller)
> - planted with a variety of high-temperature, low-ph plants
> - flourite gravel
> - 150 watts of flourescent lighting
> - 82 degrees
> - excellent filtration (a pair of Eheim canisters and a fluidized bed)
> - high-pressure CO2 system
> - lots of driftwood
>
> I currently have in this tank:
> - 3 smallish blue diamond discus (about 2.5")
> - 2 pigeon blood (about 3.5")
> - 12 cardinal tetras
> - 1 pleco
> - a lot of corydoras (not sure how many - they bred in this tank - It
> looks like about a dozen and a half now.)
>
> I do 25% water changes weekly using RO water. This tank has been
> populated with these fish for abour six months now. It was up with just
> the corys for about three months before the other fish were added.
>
> Everyone in the tank is very happy, and aside from a cory that got
> caught between the wall and the CO2 diffuser, I've had no losses.
>
> I feed a wide variety of food on a rotating schedule; everything from
> beta flakes (the discus LOVE beta food) and floating cichlid foods, to
> frozen krill and beef heart. I drop in algae wafers for the pleco and
> corys.
>
> It's working for me so far. YMMV.

I've got a 90USG tank which I setup for Discus with a sand substrate,
heavily planted, 2 Eheims, pressurised CO2 on a Ph meter etc - pretty
similar except that I use water filtered through Peat which I prepare
outside the tank. Water has always been pretty stable with low Nitrates etc
& I do between 25 & 50% water changes every week to ten days. I also have a
Nitrate filter running and a UV filter that I use from time to time. I have
a load of Tetras in there with a few Corys, Ottos & some SAEs (and false
SAEs). Plants grow great and I've had very few losses from all my other
fish. The Discus have been an unmitigated disaster however. I've lost nine
out of ten that I've bought since January and they were all good quality and
quite expensive fish.

I never had ten fish in the tank, the most was 6 but there have been 10 in
total because of replacements. I've had 3 or 4 that just stopped eating and
died within 48 hours and I lost 4 when I treated the tank with Sterazin
which I was advised to do by my LFS when it looked like one fish might have
some kind of internal parasite. Ironically, it survived the Sterazin but
became very emaciated because it stopped eating. We struggled on for about 3
months after that - it started eating again and put on a fair amount of
weight - and then just died.

So I've got one fish left which was one of the original four that I bought.
It was very badly affected by the Sterazin and I expected it to die but she
is a trooper and survives to this day and is gowing and eating well. I feed
with Frozen bloodworms and Tetra Prima granules with a few other things from
time to time.

as the man said YMMV!

Iain

(who is not buying any more Discus for the time being)

[Haywire]

"bassett" > wrote in
:

> I,ve managed to acquire a pair of Discus,,, [ about 21/2 inches
> across]
> and while there is nothing unusually about that,, In Oz there few and
> far
> apart..They also command high prices, and I was wondering if there
> is any short cuts,,,
>
> I,ve kept Angles for years, without any loses, So I do know bits and
> pieces about the hobby,,, I,ve read a few forums, and frankly they
> just about wrap the things up in cotton
> wool,, Bare bottomed tanks, no plants, Plants in Pots, Half water
> changes every day,
> they go on about Ph, high // low. whatever..
> Only feed this or that, never feed flakes,, and it goes on and on..
> It,s a wonder they
> take them out of the plastic bags.. There only Bloody fish for Christ
> sake..
>
> Anyway Ive set-up a 3 foot, something like 75 litres, with UGF
> [wrong] gravel [wrong] it will be heavily planted [wrong] there will
> only be a small algae sucker [wrong] and a few
> neon tetra's [wrong, they go feral] If the tetra's die, something's
> wrong.
>
> We don't have chemical water, It comes of the roof, and when the mud
> settles its
> pretty clean , I never bother to cycle the water , just bung it in,
> run the UGF for a couple of days and then throw the fish in.
>
> My question is do I treat these Discus things , the same as I treat
> the
> angles, A bit of a vacuum once a week, water changes when theirs
> water to spare, I feed pellets, Flakes,
> Brine shrimp, [probably all wrong , is it any wonder they won't die]
>
> We work a bit different in OZ,, Murphy Law,, Dictates if its going to
> happen, It will.
> So there's not much point in trying to stop it..
> Thanks,
> bassett
>
>
>
>
>
>

hmm, gonna go about it the heavy handed way, Ok, match the food they have
been raised on, then transition them to what you are used to using.

Anything else well that's up to your fish, if they have good genes they
should be tough as nails. I raised a few discus with african cichlids so
they aren't as fragile the cotton ball measures that some sites say, then
there's the two blues, and a yellow I got recently from The Madd Hattar,
The yellow was paranoid afraid of it's shadow until about 4 days in, now
he's the king of the tank.

YMMV is definately applicable.

[bassett]

Thanks for the input people,,
It would seem that the only people that are having trouble, are those that
are using fancy do-dads, In fact some of you are talking another language,
What's a high pressure CO2 system, is that a fancy name for an air stone,
????? and R.O. water..

I don,t want to be rude,, but when you consider the conditions in the wild,
that these fish
live , breed, and thrive in, Some people treat there fish like Hybrid
flowers in a hot house.. No wonder they die...

I had a look at "Simply Discus" forum , thinking that it would give me all
the answers
that I thought I needed,, All I learned about was bare tanks, and
hypochondriac's
who medicate fish for no reason.. Don,t people realize that one tenth of a
gram of chemicals are impossible to remove from water

But apart from some verations in feeding, I think I,ll treat my new fish ,
just as I treat the Angles..
Thanks again,, bassett


>> I also have a discus tank that doesn't match the profile of the tank you
> describe people are expecting. I think what they're describing is the
> setup that is needed if one wants to breed them and raise the fry.
>
> I've had a lot of luck with the following setup:
> - 60g tank (same footprint as a 55g, but taller)
> - planted with a variety of high-temperature, low-ph plants
> - flourite gravel
> - 150 watts of flourescent lighting
> - 82 degrees
> - excellent filtration (a pair of Eheim canisters and a fluidized bed)
> - high-pressure CO2 system
> - lots of driftwood
>
> I currently have in this tank:
> - 3 smallish blue diamond discus (about 2.5")
> - 2 pigeon blood (about 3.5")
> - 12 cardinal tetras
> - 1 pleco
> - a lot of corydoras (not sure how many - they bred in this tank - It
> looks like about a dozen and a half now.)
>
> I do 25% water changes weekly using RO water. This tank has been
> populated with these fish for abour six months now. It was up with just
> the corys for about three months before the other fish were added.
>
> Everyone in the tank is very happy, and aside from a cory that got
> caught between the wall and the CO2 diffuser, I've had no losses.
>
> I feed a wide variety of food on a rotating schedule; everything from
> beta flakes (the discus LOVE beta food) and floating cichlid foods, to
> frozen krill and beef heart. I drop in algae wafers for the pleco and
> corys.
>
> It's working for me so far. YMMV.

I've got a 90USG tank which I setup for Discus with a sand substrate,
heavily planted, 2 Eheims, pressurised CO2 on a Ph meter etc - pretty
similar except that I use water filtered through Peat which I prepare
outside the tank. Water has always been pretty stable with low Nitrates etc
& I do between 25 & 50% water changes every week to ten days. I also have a
Nitrate filter running and a UV filter that I use from time to time. I have
a load of Tetras in there with a few Corys, Ottos & some SAEs (and false
SAEs). Plants grow great and I've had very few losses from all my other
fish. The Discus have been an unmitigated disaster however. I've lost nine
out of ten that I've bought since January and they were all good quality and
quite expensive fish.

I never had ten fish in the tank, the most was 6 but there have been 10 in
total because of replacements. I've had 3 or 4 that just stopped eating and
died within 48 hours and I lost 4 when I treated the tank with Sterazin
which I was advised to do by my LFS when it looked like one fish might have
some kind of internal parasite. Ironically, it survived the Sterazin but
became very emaciated because it stopped eating. We struggled on for about 3
months after that - it started eating again and put on a fair amount of
weight - and then just died.

So I've got one fish left which was one of the original four that I bought.
It was very badly affected by the Sterazin and I expected it to die but she
is a trooper and survives to this day and is gowing and eating well. I feed
with Frozen bloodworms and Tetra Prima granules with a few other things from
time to time.

as the man said YMMV!

Iain

(who is not buying any more Discus for the time being)

[David Lloyd]

"bassett" > wrote in message >...

*snip*

> Anyway Ive set-up a 3 foot, something like 75 litres, with UGF [wrong]

*snip*

> it will be heavily planted [wrong]

That might not be ideal, as the plant roots will clog up the UGF
fairly quickly, leaving you with less filtration when portions of the
UGF no longer suck water through it.

[The Madd Hatter]

Most folks who treat their discus like that are trying to force growth out
of them. you can do that to most fish if you were so inclined, but I've
found that they don't really even need to be in soft water, unless you're
trying to breed them. I kept some for a while in the same type of waters as
my africans. I know Haywire does the same. you might find that a lot of the
people who are doing all that stuff are 1: retired w/a lot of time on their
hands, or 2: line breeding for specific traits, and or 3: growing out fry to
sell (like you said, they do command high prices!)

BTW, if you want to use a UGF in a planted tank, I would put a piece of egg
crate over the filter plate, and then lay a piece of nylon door screen mesh
over that, to prevent the roots from going though.. This will also collect
the mulm in an area thats more easily cleaned and where the plants can get
benefit from it.

My $0.02

"bassett" > wrote in message
...
> Thanks for the input people,,
> It would seem that the only people that are having trouble, are those
that
> are using fancy do-dads, In fact some of you are talking another
language,
> What's a high pressure CO2 system, is that a fancy name for an air stone,
> ????? and R.O. water..
>
> I don,t want to be rude,, but when you consider the conditions in the
wild,
> that these fish
> live , breed, and thrive in, Some people treat there fish like Hybrid
> flowers in a hot house.. No wonder they die...
>
> I had a look at "Simply Discus" forum , thinking that it would give me
all
> the answers
> that I thought I needed,, All I learned about was bare tanks, and
> hypochondriac's
> who medicate fish for no reason.. Don,t people realize that one tenth of a
> gram of chemicals are impossible to remove from water
>
> But apart from some verations in feeding, I think I,ll treat my new fish
,
> just as I treat the Angles..
> Thanks again,, bassett
>
>
> >> I also have a discus tank that doesn't match the profile of the tank
you
> > describe people are expecting. I think what they're describing is the
> > setup that is needed if one wants to breed them and raise the fry.
> >
> > I've had a lot of luck with the following setup:
> > - 60g tank (same footprint as a 55g, but taller)
> > - planted with a variety of high-temperature, low-ph plants
> > - flourite gravel
> > - 150 watts of flourescent lighting
> > - 82 degrees
> > - excellent filtration (a pair of Eheim canisters and a fluidized bed)
> > - high-pressure CO2 system
> > - lots of driftwood
> >
> > I currently have in this tank:
> > - 3 smallish blue diamond discus (about 2.5")
> > - 2 pigeon blood (about 3.5")
> > - 12 cardinal tetras
> > - 1 pleco
> > - a lot of corydoras (not sure how many - they bred in this tank - It
> > looks like about a dozen and a half now.)
> >
> > I do 25% water changes weekly using RO water. This tank has been
> > populated with these fish for abour six months now. It was up with just
> > the corys for about three months before the other fish were added.
> >
> > Everyone in the tank is very happy, and aside from a cory that got
> > caught between the wall and the CO2 diffuser, I've had no losses.
> >
> > I feed a wide variety of food on a rotating schedule; everything from
> > beta flakes (the discus LOVE beta food) and floating cichlid foods, to
> > frozen krill and beef heart. I drop in algae wafers for the pleco and
> > corys.
> >
> > It's working for me so far. YMMV.
>
> I've got a 90USG tank which I setup for Discus with a sand substrate,
> heavily planted, 2 Eheims, pressurised CO2 on a Ph meter etc - pretty
> similar except that I use water filtered through Peat which I prepare
> outside the tank. Water has always been pretty stable with low Nitrates
etc
> & I do between 25 & 50% water changes every week to ten days. I also have
a
> Nitrate filter running and a UV filter that I use from time to time. I
have
> a load of Tetras in there with a few Corys, Ottos & some SAEs (and false
> SAEs). Plants grow great and I've had very few losses from all my other
> fish. The Discus have been an unmitigated disaster however. I've lost nine
> out of ten that I've bought since January and they were all good quality
and
> quite expensive fish.
>
> I never had ten fish in the tank, the most was 6 but there have been 10 in
> total because of replacements. I've had 3 or 4 that just stopped eating
and
> died within 48 hours and I lost 4 when I treated the tank with Sterazin
> which I was advised to do by my LFS when it looked like one fish might
have
> some kind of internal parasite. Ironically, it survived the Sterazin but
> became very emaciated because it stopped eating. We struggled on for about
3
> months after that - it started eating again and put on a fair amount of
> weight - and then just died.
>
> So I've got one fish left which was one of the original four that I
bought.
> It was very badly affected by the Sterazin and I expected it to die but
she
> is a trooper and survives to this day and is gowing and eating well. I
feed
> with Frozen bloodworms and Tetra Prima granules with a few other things
from
> time to time.
>
> as the man said YMMV!
>
> Iain
>
> (who is not buying any more Discus for the time being)
>
> .
>
>

[Eric]

See comments inline.

bassett wrote:
> Thanks for the input people,,
> It would seem that the only people that are having trouble, are those that
> are using fancy do-dads, In fact some of you are talking another language,
> What's a high pressure CO2 system, is that a fancy name for an air stone,
> ????? and R.O. water..

CO2 is for the plants, and has no (or little) effect on the fish. (It
helps the plants to grow faster, lowering nutrients in the tank, which
helps to keep algae from building up. I also like the plants.)

R.O. is Reverse Osmosis. It's a way of removing minerals from water.
Where I live, we have very hard water. Discus in the wild live in very
soft water. The R.O. unit helps to make my water more like what the
discus are used to. Filtering your water through peat is another
(slower, low-tech) way to accomplish the same thing. (I already had the
R.O. unit for my sal****er tank.)

> I don,t want to be rude,, but when you consider the conditions in the wild,
> that these fish
> live , breed, and thrive in, Some people treat there fish like Hybrid
> flowers in a hot house.. No wonder they die...

My fish, as stated previously, aren't dieing.

> I had a look at "Simply Discus" forum , thinking that it would give me all
> the answers
> that I thought I needed,, All I learned about was bare tanks, and
> hypochondriac's
> who medicate fish for no reason.. Don,t people realize that one tenth of
> gram of chemicals are impossible to remove from water

I am fairly opposed to medicating fish, having had little luck with it.
I find it more productive to keep the water close to what the fish
encounter in the wild.

Quite true, about the chemicals. Although most will break down
naturally in time.

> But apart from some verations in feeding, I think I,ll treat my new fish ,
> just as I treat the Angles..

If your angels are happy, then your discus will very likely be happy
too. They're from roughly the same environment, eat the same foods, etc.

Eric

[TZ]

sure, if you don't have any problem adding "bird poop" to your aquariums.
I don;t know about where you live, but I have lots of birds who like to
perch on my rooftop, and make poops all over my roof. Then when it
rains, this all gets washed off. If I was collecting this water, I would
also
be collecting whatever fecal matter was on the roof. no thanks.

TZ


"bassett" > wrote in message
...
> We don't have chemical water, It comes of the roof, and when the mud
settles
> its pretty clean , I never bother to cycle the water

[luminos]

"bassett" > wrote in message
...
> Thanks for the input people,,
> It would seem that the only people that are having trouble, are those
that
> are using fancy do-dads, In fact some of you are talking another
language,
> What's a high pressure CO2 system, is that a fancy name for an air stone,
> ????? and R.O. water..
>
> I don,t want to be rude,, but when you consider the conditions in the
wild,
> that these fish
> live , breed, and thrive in, Some people treat there fish like Hybrid
> flowers in a hot house.. No wonder they die...
>

They are.

[bassett]

Thanks Eric,,, My questions are answered,,,


Eric > wrote in message
> See comments inline.
>
> bassett wrote:
> > Thanks for the input people,,
> > It would seem that the only people that are having trouble, are those
that
> > are using fancy do-dads, In fact some of you are talking another
language,
> > What's a high pressure CO2 system, is that a fancy name for an air
stone,
> > ????? and R.O. water..
>
> CO2 is for the plants, and has no (or little) effect on the fish. (It
> helps the plants to grow faster, lowering nutrients in the tank, which
> helps to keep algae from building up. I also like the plants.)
>
> R.O. is Reverse Osmosis. It's a way of removing minerals from water.
> Where I live, we have very hard water. Discus in the wild live in very
> soft water. The R.O. unit helps to make my water more like what the
> discus are used to. Filtering your water through peat is another
> (slower, low-tech) way to accomplish the same thing. (I already had the
> R.O. unit for my sal****er tank.)
>
> > I don,t want to be rude,, but when you consider the conditions in the
wild,
> > that these fish
> > live , breed, and thrive in, Some people treat there fish like Hybrid
> > flowers in a hot house.. No wonder they die...
>
> My fish, as stated previously, aren't dieing.
>
> > I had a look at "Simply Discus" forum , thinking that it would give me
all
> > the answers
> > that I thought I needed,, All I learned about was bare tanks, and
> > hypochondriac's
> > who medicate fish for no reason.. Don,t people realize that one tenth of
> > gram of chemicals are impossible to remove from water
>
> I am fairly opposed to medicating fish, having had little luck with it.
> I find it more productive to keep the water close to what the fish
> encounter in the wild.
>
> Quite true, about the chemicals. Although most will break down
> naturally in time.
>
> > But apart from some verations in feeding, I think I,ll treat my new
fish ,
> > just as I treat the Angles..
>
> If your angels are happy, then your discus will very likely be happy
> too. They're from roughly the same environment, eat the same foods, etc.
>
> Eric
>

[luminos]

Let me be a little less succinct....these fish (Discus) are not in the wild
in your tank. Your tank is noxious in comparison. Your comparison to
orchids or other exotic flowers is apt.

You are going to fail with these fish, among the most challenging to keep
over a period of time, if you do not devote yourself to understanding them.


"luminos" > wrote in message
...
>
> "bassett" > wrote in message
> ...
> > Thanks for the input people,,
> > It would seem that the only people that are having trouble, are those
> that
> > are using fancy do-dads, In fact some of you are talking another
> language,
> > What's a high pressure CO2 system, is that a fancy name for an air
stone,
> > ????? and R.O. water..
> >
> > I don,t want to be rude,, but when you consider the conditions in the
> wild,
> > that these fish
> > live , breed, and thrive in, Some people treat there fish like Hybrid
> > flowers in a hot house.. No wonder they die...
> >
>
> They are.
>
>

[bassett]

It's called ****, not Poo, Poo is a nasty smell, not a solid substance,
Anyway,,Our water supply comes off the roof, we don,t have Chemical
impregnated water, loaded with Chlorine and god know,s what else. So our
insides are not scoured clean, and our teeth don,t rot..

But, When it rains, the water runs of the roof , through a fine mesh
screen, and into the tank,,
This does three things, 1/ it gives us fertilizer for the Tomato's. 2/ We
get a fresh water supply, 3/ The frogs that live in the tank are happy..

As for where I live,, I live about an hours drive from the coast in
Northern New South Wales, Australia.. In the Hills, Zero pollution, Blue
Sky's, Green Grass, No traffic, No noise,
I can sit on the back veranda, watch the sunsets, while the Cows munch away,
making milk. And the Parrots fly round all day long, and sometimes crap on
the roof.
bassett



TZ > wrote in message
> sure, if you don't have any problem adding "bird poop" to your aquariums.
> I don;t know about where you live, but I have lots of birds who like to
> perch on my rooftop, and make poops all over my roof. Then when it
> rains, this all gets washed off. If I was collecting this water, I would
> also
> be collecting whatever fecal matter was on the roof. no thanks.
>
> TZ
>
>
> "bassett" > wrote in message
> ...
> > We don't have chemical water, It comes of the roof, and when the mud
> settles
> > its pretty clean , I never bother to cycle the water
>
>
>

[Melanie Boxall]

LOL, yes we use clean country rainwater too, and there's nothing fecal in
it, because we have cats:) (NO BIRDS!)

--

Melanie
MSN messenger (and all spam to....)
"The word transvestite is so second millennium. By the end of the third
millennium, men in makeup will be everywhere, and you'll be dead."
Eddie Izzard


"bassett" > wrote in message
...
> It's called ****, not Poo, Poo is a nasty smell, not a solid substance,
> Anyway,,Our water supply comes off the roof, we don,t have Chemical
> impregnated water, loaded with Chlorine and god know,s what else. So our
> insides are not scoured clean, and our teeth don,t rot..
>
> But, When it rains, the water runs of the roof , through a fine mesh
> screen, and into the tank,,
> This does three things, 1/ it gives us fertilizer for the Tomato's. 2/ We
> get a fresh water supply, 3/ The frogs that live in the tank are happy..
>
> As for where I live,, I live about an hours drive from the coast in
> Northern New South Wales, Australia.. In the Hills, Zero pollution, Blue
> Sky's, Green Grass, No traffic, No noise,
> I can sit on the back veranda, watch the sunsets, while the Cows munch
away,
> making milk. And the Parrots fly round all day long, and sometimes crap on
> the roof.
> bassett
>
>
>
> TZ > wrote in message
> > sure, if you don't have any problem adding "bird poop" to your
aquariums.
> > I don;t know about where you live, but I have lots of birds who like to
> > perch on my rooftop, and make poops all over my roof. Then when it
> > rains, this all gets washed off. If I was collecting this water, I
would
> > also
> > be collecting whatever fecal matter was on the roof. no thanks.
> >
> > TZ
> >
> >
> > "bassett" > wrote in message
> > ...
> > > We don't have chemical water, It comes of the roof, and when the mud
> > settles
> > > its pretty clean , I never bother to cycle the water
> >
> >
> >
>
>

[Haywire]

a few things should be brough to you attention.

1. Wild types are for the most part quite sensitive to water conditions,
when you consider that they are in giant stable watersheds they have no
need to be adaptable, they have fine tuned internal systems that don't
accomodate a lot of change. Certain wild types have baffled some very
experienced breeders that I know.

2. The fancy colours we see in the stores and websites from breeders are
the result of years, probably over a century, of selective breeding, line
breeding, and probably deliberate inbreeding.

3. there's a difference between keeping a discus alive, and getting one to
breed, ultimately people on simply discus try to get them to breed. As I
said earlier I'm keeping them in hard water but mine are juveniles, I'll be
getting a RO unit shortly as they are starting to get a bit bigger.

4. When you have 30 discus juveniles in a tank fed 4 times a day you will
understand the charm of a bare bottom tank, and water changes 2 to 3 times
a week.

5. These are opinions, YMMV means your mileage may may vary. Good luck.

"bassett" > wrote in
:

> Thanks for the input people,,
> It would seem that the only people that are having trouble, are those
> that
> are using fancy do-dads, In fact some of you are talking another
> language, What's a high pressure CO2 system, is that a fancy name for
> an air stone, ????? and R.O. water..
>
> I don,t want to be rude,, but when you consider the conditions in the
> wild, that these fish
> live , breed, and thrive in, Some people treat there fish like
> Hybrid flowers in a hot house.. No wonder they die...
>
> I had a look at "Simply Discus" forum , thinking that it would give
> me all
> the answers
> that I thought I needed,, All I learned about was bare tanks, and
> hypochondriac's
> who medicate fish for no reason.. Don,t people realize that one tenth
> of a gram of chemicals are impossible to remove from water
>
> But apart from some verations in feeding, I think I,ll treat my new
> fish ,
> just as I treat the Angles..
> Thanks again,, bassett
>
>
>>> I also have a discus tank that doesn't match the profile of the tank
>>> you
>> describe people are expecting. I think what they're describing is
>> the setup that is needed if one wants to breed them and raise the
>> fry.
>>
>> I've had a lot of luck with the following setup:
>> - 60g tank (same footprint as a 55g, but taller)
>> - planted with a variety of high-temperature, low-ph plants
>> - flourite gravel
>> - 150 watts of flourescent lighting
>> - 82 degrees
>> - excellent filtration (a pair of Eheim canisters and a fluidized
>> bed) - high-pressure CO2 system
>> - lots of driftwood
>>
>> I currently have in this tank:
>> - 3 smallish blue diamond discus (about 2.5")
>> - 2 pigeon blood (about 3.5")
>> - 12 cardinal tetras
>> - 1 pleco
>> - a lot of corydoras (not sure how many - they bred in this tank - It
>> looks like about a dozen and a half now.)
>>
>> I do 25% water changes weekly using RO water. This tank has been
>> populated with these fish for abour six months now. It was up with
>> just the corys for about three months before the other fish were
>> added.
>>
>> Everyone in the tank is very happy, and aside from a cory that got
>> caught between the wall and the CO2 diffuser, I've had no losses.
>>
>> I feed a wide variety of food on a rotating schedule; everything from
>> beta flakes (the discus LOVE beta food) and floating cichlid foods,
>> to frozen krill and beef heart. I drop in algae wafers for the pleco
>> and corys.
>>
>> It's working for me so far. YMMV.
>
> I've got a 90USG tank which I setup for Discus with a sand substrate,
> heavily planted, 2 Eheims, pressurised CO2 on a Ph meter etc - pretty
> similar except that I use water filtered through Peat which I prepare
> outside the tank. Water has always been pretty stable with low
> Nitrates etc & I do between 25 & 50% water changes every week to ten
> days. I also have a Nitrate filter running and a UV filter that I use
> from time to time. I have a load of Tetras in there with a few Corys,
> Ottos & some SAEs (and false SAEs). Plants grow great and I've had
> very few losses from all my other fish. The Discus have been an
> unmitigated disaster however. I've lost nine out of ten that I've
> bought since January and they were all good quality and quite
> expensive fish.
>
> I never had ten fish in the tank, the most was 6 but there have been
> 10 in total because of replacements. I've had 3 or 4 that just
> stopped eating and died within 48 hours and I lost 4 when I treated
> the tank with Sterazin which I was advised to do by my LFS when it
> looked like one fish might have some kind of internal parasite.
> Ironically, it survived the Sterazin but became very emaciated because
> it stopped eating. We struggled on for about 3 months after that - it
> started eating again and put on a fair amount of weight - and then
> just died.
>
> So I've got one fish left which was one of the original four that I
> bought. It was very badly affected by the Sterazin and I expected it
> to die but she is a trooper and survives to this day and is gowing and
> eating well. I feed with Frozen bloodworms and Tetra Prima granules
> with a few other things from time to time.
>
> as the man said YMMV!
>
> Iain
>
> (who is not buying any more Discus for the time being)
>
> .
>
>

[Haywire]

hmm, I've never seen a neon stuck in my discus' mouth before :)

Eric > wrote in
:

>
> If your angels are happy, then your discus will very likely be happy
> too. They're from roughly the same environment, eat the same foods,
> etc.
>
> Eric
>

[bassett]

Thanks for your comments,, At the moment I,m only interested in having
something attractive in the Lounge room.. No I don,t need another wife..

Many years ago, I was right into the fishy thing and had a tank room with
30 odd tanks,
however now I,m not interested in breeding fish, as the work involved no
where near
justifies the outlay, or the returns for that matter..

Also the area in Australia where I now live has diverse weather
conditions, extremely hot in summer, with heavy frosts in winter, So I,m
limited where I can have tanks..
Also as we only have a tank supply for water, Excessive water usage is out
of the question.

bassett


Haywire > wrote in message
> a few things should be brough to you attention.
>
> 1. Wild types are for the most part quite sensitive to water conditions,
> when you consider that they are in giant stable watersheds they have no
> need to be adaptable, they have fine tuned internal systems that don't
> accomodate a lot of change. Certain wild types have baffled some very
> experienced breeders that I know.
>
> 2. The fancy colours we see in the stores and websites from breeders are
> the result of years, probably over a century, of selective breeding, line
> breeding, and probably deliberate inbreeding.
>
> 3. there's a difference between keeping a discus alive, and getting one to
> breed, ultimately people on simply discus try to get them to breed. As I
> said earlier I'm keeping them in hard water but mine are juveniles, I'll
be
> getting a RO unit shortly as they are starting to get a bit bigger.
>
> 4. When you have 30 discus juveniles in a tank fed 4 times a day you will
> understand the charm of a bare bottom tank, and water changes 2 to 3 times
> a week.
>
> 5. These are opinions, YMMV means your mileage may may vary. Good luck.
>
> "bassett" > wrote in
> :
>
> > Thanks for the input people,,
> > It would seem that the only people that are having trouble, are those
> > that
> > are using fancy do-dads, In fact some of you are talking another
> > language, What's a high pressure CO2 system, is that a fancy name for
> > an air stone, ????? and R.O. water..
> >
> > I don,t want to be rude,, but when you consider the conditions in the
> > wild, that these fish
> > live , breed, and thrive in, Some people treat there fish like
> > Hybrid flowers in a hot house.. No wonder they die...
> >
> > I had a look at "Simply Discus" forum , thinking that it would give
> > me all
> > the answers
> > that I thought I needed,, All I learned about was bare tanks, and
> > hypochondriac's
> > who medicate fish for no reason.. Don,t people realize that one tenth
> > of a gram of chemicals are impossible to remove from water
> >
> > But apart from some verations in feeding, I think I,ll treat my new
> > fish ,
> > just as I treat the Angles..
> > Thanks again,, bassett
> >
> >
> >>> I also have a discus tank that doesn't match the profile of the tank
> >>> you
> >> describe people are expecting. I think what they're describing is
> >> the setup that is needed if one wants to breed them and raise the
> >> fry.
> >>
> >> I've had a lot of luck with the following setup:
> >> - 60g tank (same footprint as a 55g, but taller)
> >> - planted with a variety of high-temperature, low-ph plants
> >> - flourite gravel
> >> - 150 watts of flourescent lighting
> >> - 82 degrees
> >> - excellent filtration (a pair of Eheim canisters and a fluidized
> >> bed) - high-pressure CO2 system
> >> - lots of driftwood
> >>
> >> I currently have in this tank:
> >> - 3 smallish blue diamond discus (about 2.5")
> >> - 2 pigeon blood (about 3.5")
> >> - 12 cardinal tetras
> >> - 1 pleco
> >> - a lot of corydoras (not sure how many - they bred in this tank - It
> >> looks like about a dozen and a half now.)
> >>
> >> I do 25% water changes weekly using RO water. This tank has been
> >> populated with these fish for abour six months now. It was up with
> >> just the corys for about three months before the other fish were
> >> added.
> >>
> >> Everyone in the tank is very happy, and aside from a cory that got
> >> caught between the wall and the CO2 diffuser, I've had no losses.
> >>
> >> I feed a wide variety of food on a rotating schedule; everything from
> >> beta flakes (the discus LOVE beta food) and floating cichlid foods,
> >> to frozen krill and beef heart. I drop in algae wafers for the pleco
> >> and corys.
> >>
> >> It's working for me so far. YMMV.
> >
> > I've got a 90USG tank which I setup for Discus with a sand substrate,
> > heavily planted, 2 Eheims, pressurised CO2 on a Ph meter etc - pretty
> > similar except that I use water filtered through Peat which I prepare
> > outside the tank. Water has always been pretty stable with low
> > Nitrates etc & I do between 25 & 50% water changes every week to ten
> > days. I also have a Nitrate filter running and a UV filter that I use
> > from time to time. I have a load of Tetras in there with a few Corys,
> > Ottos & some SAEs (and false SAEs). Plants grow great and I've had
> > very few losses from all my other fish. The Discus have been an
> > unmitigated disaster however. I've lost nine out of ten that I've
> > bought since January and they were all good quality and quite
> > expensive fish.
> >
> > I never had ten fish in the tank, the most was 6 but there have been
> > 10 in total because of replacements. I've had 3 or 4 that just
> > stopped eating and died within 48 hours and I lost 4 when I treated
> > the tank with Sterazin which I was advised to do by my LFS when it
> > looked like one fish might have some kind of internal parasite.
> > Ironically, it survived the Sterazin but became very emaciated because
> > it stopped eating. We struggled on for about 3 months after that - it
> > started eating again and put on a fair amount of weight - and then
> > just died.
> >
> > So I've got one fish left which was one of the original four that I
> > bought. It was very badly affected by the Sterazin and I expected it
> > to die but she is a trooper and survives to this day and is gowing and
> > eating well. I feed with Frozen bloodworms and Tetra Prima granules
> > with a few other things from time to time.
> >
> > as the man said YMMV!
> >
> > Iain
> >
> > (who is not buying any more Discus for the time being)
> >
> > .
> >
> >
>