comments on Julidochromis marlieri, thanks

[NetMax]

Having given up on finding any Eretmodus, I decided to try my hand at
some Julies. Of my five choices : J. regani, marlieri, ornatus,
transcriptus and dickfeldi, I went with seven juvenile marlieri (2" with
tail) into a 40g with stones almost to the water line. I've read
somewhat inconsistent reports on the different Julies, but the marlieri
seem to be the most rare (in my neighbourhood) and relatively peaceful
for their size (being the largest of the Julies along with the regani).
My girlfriend has regani, but I presume there is a risk of hybridization
so they will be kept separated from the marlieri. I expect that the
seven I have will pair off, with some risk of life to the remaining
Julies (there is nothing else in the tank with them).

Is there a reasonable possibility of more than one pair co-existing in
the same tank?

Would dither help, but what effect would it have on their spawning
success?

Also any anecdotal information on the marlieri would be appreciated.

TIA
NetMax

[Amateur]

<mid-posted>
"NetMax" > wrote in message
. ..
<snip>
>My girlfriend has regani, but I presume there is a risk of hybridization
> so they will be kept separated from the marlieri.

There is a location in the wild where J. regani and J. marlieri are both found.
This is one of the reasons for two different species and not just color
variations of the same species. This of course doesn't mean that hybridization
won't occur in the tank. ;-)

<snip>
> I expect that the
> seven I have will pair off, with some risk of life to the remaining
> Julies (there is nothing else in the tank with them).
>
> Is there a reasonable possibility of more than one pair co-existing in
> the same tank?

Not likely. A pair of Julies is very intolerant of any other julies in view. A
pair of Chalinochromis would make suitable tank mates and also act as a sort of
dither for one another. If you do end up with a pair, they can be housed in a 20
gallon tank, freeing up that 40 for other things. I had more success in pairing
off my julies when I separated them. Originally I had 6 in a 55. When I put 3 in
a 29, leaving 3 in the 55, they finally paired off. Leaving one ousted julie in
each tank. Both pairs have spawned and the other two are sharing space in a
different 29.

<snip>
>
> Would dither help, but what effect would it have on their spawning
> success?

I've read that dither fish helps to enforce the pair bond. I've also had Pam
Chin tell me this is bulsch. All though pairs may form, it's important for each
member to have it's own space. A nice set up would be a 20 gallon tank with a
piec of slate on one side. One side of the slate raised about 3cm. This provides
a nice cave for the female to lay her eggs and also a nice spot for juveniles to
hang out. On top of the slate, a small rock pile so the female has her own cave
to hang out in. On the other side of the tank, a separate rock pile for the male
to retreat to, should the need arise. Also a place for larger juveniles to seek
refuge.

> TIA
> NetMax
>
Good Luck,
Amateur

[Mephistopheles]

"NetMax" > wrote in
:

> Having given up on finding any Eretmodus, I decided to try my
> hand at some Julies. Of my five choices : J. regani, marlieri,
> ornatus, transcriptus and dickfeldi, I went with seven juvenile
> marlieri (2" with tail) into a 40g with stones almost to the
> water line. I've read somewhat inconsistent reports on the
> different Julies, but the marlieri seem to be the most rare (in
> my neighbourhood) and relatively peaceful for their size (being
> the largest of the Julies along with the regani). My girlfriend
> has regani, but I presume there is a risk of hybridization so
> they will be kept separated from the marlieri. I expect that
> the seven I have will pair off, with some risk of life to the
> remaining Julies (there is nothing else in the tank with them).
>
> Is there a reasonable possibility of more than one pair
> co-existing in the same tank?
>
> Would dither help, but what effect would it have on their
> spawning success?
>
> Also any anecdotal information on the marlieri would be
> appreciated.
>

Marlieri have struck me as being among the more aggressive, though
also the most beautiful, Julidichromis. In any event, I currently
have four transcriptus in a 55 gallon. One of these is the
offspring of the sole pair in the tank. There is also a
continuously breeding pair of brichardi, two eretmodus, two
leleupi, and three other miscellaneous fish. All seem to get along
swimmingly. No hint of aggression among the Julidichromis. I
think the fact that the brichardi are the kings of the tank helps
temper any aggression among the Julidichromis. I also was careful
to divide my rock wall into two segments, so there is a natural
division of territory. I think this would probably be key to
getting multiple pairs of Julidichromis to coexist. I also agree
that adding dithers or other cichlids would probably help. I would
expect things to get pretty nasty if the only fish in there are the
Julidichromis.

Regards,
Meph

> TIA
> NetMax
>
>
>
>

[Wally]

I am breeeding the marlieri by the boat loads in bare bottom 55's.
When they pair off, I catch them and move them to a 20 long until they
fill the tank with babies and aren't spawning. I just move the pair
and the breeding setup to a new tank and set it all up just like it
was. Some pairs have huge spawns and some have smaller more frequent
spawns. I probably have 250 fry 1" plus that will be sold in the
spring. They are not aggressive in my opinion, just give them plenty
of caves and rocks.





On Sun, 28 Dec 2003 03:54:02 GMT, Mephistopheles
> wrote:

>"NetMax" > wrote in
:
>
>> Having given up on finding any Eretmodus, I decided to try my
>> hand at some Julies. Of my five choices : J. regani, marlieri,
>> ornatus, transcriptus and dickfeldi, I went with seven juvenile
>> marlieri (2" with tail) into a 40g with stones almost to the
>> water line. I've read somewhat inconsistent reports on the
>> different Julies, but the marlieri seem to be the most rare (in
>> my neighbourhood) and relatively peaceful for their size (being
>> the largest of the Julies along with the regani). My girlfriend
>> has regani, but I presume there is a risk of hybridization so
>> they will be kept separated from the marlieri. I expect that
>> the seven I have will pair off, with some risk of life to the
>> remaining Julies (there is nothing else in the tank with them).
>>
>> Is there a reasonable possibility of more than one pair
>> co-existing in the same tank?
>>
>> Would dither help, but what effect would it have on their
>> spawning success?
>>
>> Also any anecdotal information on the marlieri would be
>> appreciated.
>>
>
>Marlieri have struck me as being among the more aggressive, though
>also the most beautiful, Julidichromis. In any event, I currently
>have four transcriptus in a 55 gallon. One of these is the
>offspring of the sole pair in the tank. There is also a
>continuously breeding pair of brichardi, two eretmodus, two
>leleupi, and three other miscellaneous fish. All seem to get along
>swimmingly. No hint of aggression among the Julidichromis. I
>think the fact that the brichardi are the kings of the tank helps
>temper any aggression among the Julidichromis. I also was careful
>to divide my rock wall into two segments, so there is a natural
>division of territory. I think this would probably be key to
>getting multiple pairs of Julidichromis to coexist. I also agree
>that adding dithers or other cichlids would probably help. I would
>expect things to get pretty nasty if the only fish in there are the
>Julidichromis.
>
>Regards,
>Meph
>
>> TIA
>> NetMax
>>
>>
>>
>>

[NetMax]

"Wally" > wrote in message
...
>
> I am breeeding the marlieri by the boat loads in bare bottom 55's.
> When they pair off, I catch them and move them to a 20 long until they
> fill the tank with babies and aren't spawning. I just move the pair
> and the breeding setup to a new tank and set it all up just like it
> was. Some pairs have huge spawns and some have smaller more frequent
> spawns. I probably have 250 fry 1" plus that will be sold in the
> spring. They are not aggressive in my opinion, just give them plenty
> of caves and rocks.


To Amateur & Mephistopheles, thanks for your always highly valued
feedback.

To Wally, how do you have your tanks aquascaped? Does the 55 have
minimal rockwork (so catching pairs is easy?) What is your rockwork
set-up in the 20? It certainly sounds like you have a productive recipe
going. I'm not too keen on flooding more tanks to go into a production
mode for now. I'm just gauging my chances with a community in the 40g,
and I'll be being ready to move fish out as neccesary.

For now, I have a 66g Guppy tank where I would put any Julies who got
voted out of the 40g. Worse case, they decimate my Guppy population, and
best case is they would get rid of my snail problem in that tank ;~)
When that doesn't work, I'll start dusting off old 20g tanks.

The 40g has a lot of rockwork (about 16" high covering all the back),
with a tall narrow cave in the middle forming a territorial division of
sorts. FWIW, the Julies have begun spreading out, so there is some
possibility of accomodating more than one pair (perhaps a very slim
possibility), but then I enjoy the experimentation.

They all get along well for now, but I expect their social graces will go
downhill as they get older ;~)

NetMax

<snip>

[The Madd Hatter]

I didn't catch the original post, but I have kept marleri's before. I had 4
unsexed juveniles in my 100 Gallon w/ brichardis and assorted mbuna and
utaka. I had them in there for about 1.5 years. They grew from 3/4" range to
around 3" in that time. I had a huge network of cave covering the back from
end to end and almost to the top in the back corners. I found the juli's to
be an extremely reclusive bunch throughout that time. The mbuna (various
psuedo's and labidochromines) were as active as could be, and I had 1
species of aulonocara and a species of protelmas (sp?) that were also out in
the open alot. The julie seemedto stick to the caves forthe most part,
probably due to the rambunctious tanks mates. I don't know if they ever
bred, because I also had some very efficient syno's in the tank.

The point of my long winded story is, that I believe with enough rockwork, I
don't think aggression will be a big issue w/ these fish, even as adults.
Tank size will ofcourse be a factor, but I've seen 6 or so kept in a 35
gallon long term w/o issues. If you stay w/ a species only tank then they
will even come out and play. Judging by the shape and coloration of this
family of fish I would infer that they prefer tight areas w/ a lot of small
crevices. I must admit that I haven't brushed up my reading on them and I
kept them over 2 years ago, but cichlids do seem to have body shapes
precisely specialized for their niche.
"NetMax" > wrote in message
. ..
>
> "Wally" > wrote in message
> ...
> >
> > I am breeeding the marlieri by the boat loads in bare bottom 55's.
> > When they pair off, I catch them and move them to a 20 long until they
> > fill the tank with babies and aren't spawning. I just move the pair
> > and the breeding setup to a new tank and set it all up just like it
> > was. Some pairs have huge spawns and some have smaller more frequent
> > spawns. I probably have 250 fry 1" plus that will be sold in the
> > spring. They are not aggressive in my opinion, just give them plenty
> > of caves and rocks.
>
>
> To Amateur & Mephistopheles, thanks for your always highly valued
> feedback.
>
> To Wally, how do you have your tanks aquascaped? Does the 55 have
> minimal rockwork (so catching pairs is easy?) What is your rockwork
> set-up in the 20? It certainly sounds like you have a productive recipe
> going. I'm not too keen on flooding more tanks to go into a production
> mode for now. I'm just gauging my chances with a community in the 40g,
> and I'll be being ready to move fish out as neccesary.
>
> For now, I have a 66g Guppy tank where I would put any Julies who got
> voted out of the 40g. Worse case, they decimate my Guppy population, and
> best case is they would get rid of my snail problem in that tank ;~)
> When that doesn't work, I'll start dusting off old 20g tanks.
>
> The 40g has a lot of rockwork (about 16" high covering all the back),
> with a tall narrow cave in the middle forming a territorial division of
> sorts. FWIW, the Julies have begun spreading out, so there is some
> possibility of accomodating more than one pair (perhaps a very slim
> possibility), but then I enjoy the experimentation.
>
> They all get along well for now, but I expect their social graces will go
> downhill as they get older ;~)
>
> NetMax
>
> <snip>
>
>

[Wally]

The 55 is set up with a 4" flower pot with a hole knocked in the side
and a piece of holy rock in front of it on each end. Some misc rock
for the other nonbreeding adults in the center. I have a piece of thin
plexiglass that I slide in the tank to block off the pair when I am
ready to move them. I move the pair and their breeding set up to the
20 and most times they have new fry in 2 weeks. I have a pair in my
110 now that I can't catch, when the net hits the water they mix with
the others and I can't figure out who is who. I am trying to coax them
into breeding in a corner so I can then catch them. I have 21 tanks
running with about 1000 gallons total water. Got about 20 leleupi in
my 100 and 30 cylindricus in the 110 just waiting for pairs to form.
Got rid of all by big fish except the f1 Burundi fronts that live in
the 200. The little fish are just as fun and not near as messy. You
ought to try the bristle nose plecos too, they breed pretty easy and
are real cool to watch. I never have to clean any glass and the small
ones are safe to keep with the egg layers and help keep all the food
the fry don't eat cleaned up.





On Tue, 30 Dec 2003 10:59:13 -0500, "NetMax"
> wrote:

>
>"Wally" > wrote in message
...
>>
>> I am breeeding the marlieri by the boat loads in bare bottom 55's.
>> When they pair off, I catch them and move them to a 20 long until they
>> fill the tank with babies and aren't spawning. I just move the pair
>> and the breeding setup to a new tank and set it all up just like it
>> was. Some pairs have huge spawns and some have smaller more frequent
>> spawns. I probably have 250 fry 1" plus that will be sold in the
>> spring. They are not aggressive in my opinion, just give them plenty
>> of caves and rocks.
>
>
>To Amateur & Mephistopheles, thanks for your always highly valued
>feedback.
>
>To Wally, how do you have your tanks aquascaped? Does the 55 have
>minimal rockwork (so catching pairs is easy?) What is your rockwork
>set-up in the 20? It certainly sounds like you have a productive recipe
>going. I'm not too keen on flooding more tanks to go into a production
>mode for now. I'm just gauging my chances with a community in the 40g,
>and I'll be being ready to move fish out as neccesary.
>
>For now, I have a 66g Guppy tank where I would put any Julies who got
>voted out of the 40g. Worse case, they decimate my Guppy population, and
>best case is they would get rid of my snail problem in that tank ;~)
>When that doesn't work, I'll start dusting off old 20g tanks.
>
>The 40g has a lot of rockwork (about 16" high covering all the back),
>with a tall narrow cave in the middle forming a territorial division of
>sorts. FWIW, the Julies have begun spreading out, so there is some
>possibility of accomodating more than one pair (perhaps a very slim
>possibility), but then I enjoy the experimentation.
>
>They all get along well for now, but I expect their social graces will go
>downhill as they get older ;~)
>
>NetMax
>
><snip>
>