Yeas of creep and crud killing my fish - suggestions?

[zygote002]

Hi all.

I'm a very caring GF owner over the years I have made sure I have a
good ph, and excellent water quality. To my dismay - I have still
periodically lost my fish - all the same creep and crud. In the
past I have tried salt, heat, hospital buckets - injectable amacasin.
Now its back. It presented first with my black moors as a slightly
blue/white hue to them - and their eyes went white (on the inside not
opaque cornea). Then as time went on they became slightly bloated and
then filially died. In the rest of the GF (mostly ryukin) they
present small red spots, bent fins, slight blue/white hue to their
very fin tips. It's never fuzzy.

I'll be taking a skin scraping to a friend who is a microbiologist but
I could use some practical knowledge - what the hell is the stuff!?

Bacterial? Fungal? Protozoan? Parasitic? I've been calling
SanFranciso - the nearest big city and STILL YET haven't found a fish
vet.

Setup:
60 gallon fish tank - no gravel
2 eclipse filters
0 nitrates
0 nitrites
0 ammonia
ph 7.2
temp 71 degrees - constant

8 hours of light a day.

Food: split peas, gf food (soaked)

[Charles]

No idea what the problem is, but I believe UCDavis has a good vet
program, you might give them a call for a referral if nothing else.



On Tue, 30 Sep 2003 21:59:47 -0700, zygote002 >
wrote:

>Hi all.
>
>I'm a very caring GF owner over the years I have made sure I have a
>good ph, and excellent water quality. To my dismay - I have still
>periodically lost my fish - all the same creep and crud. In the
>past I have tried salt, heat, hospital buckets - injectable amacasin.
>Now its back. It presented first with my black moors as a slightly
>blue/white hue to them - and their eyes went white (on the inside not
>opaque cornea). Then as time went on they became slightly bloated and
>then filially died. In the rest of the GF (mostly ryukin) they
>present small red spots, bent fins, slight blue/white hue to their
>very fin tips. It's never fuzzy.
>
>I'll be taking a skin scraping to a friend who is a microbiologist but
>I could use some practical knowledge - what the hell is the stuff!?
>
>Bacterial? Fungal? Protozoan? Parasitic? I've been calling
>SanFranciso - the nearest big city and STILL YET haven't found a fish
>vet.
>
>Setup:
>60 gallon fish tank - no gravel
>2 eclipse filters
>0 nitrates
>0 nitrites
>0 ammonia
>ph 7.2
>temp 71 degrees - constant
>
>8 hours of light a day.
>
>Food: split peas, gf food (soaked)

--

- Charles
-
-does not play well with others

[Geezer From The Freezer]

zygote002 wrote:
>
> Setup:
> 60 gallon fish tank - no gravel
> 2 eclipse filters
> 0 nitrates
> 0 nitrites
> 0 ammonia
> ph 7.2

something is wrong as nitrates being 0 is suspect! Nitrates are never 0.
Everything else looks ok. Also what is "Creep and Crud"?

[Mel]

Costia which is a protozoan flagellate can cause an off white film to cover
the body and small red spots. Have you seen the fish flashing or rubbing on
anything?
Chiliodonella also causes a grey/blueish film on the body and flashing,
rubbing.
Might be worth getting a broad spectrum parasite med which covers both to
see if that works.
Mel.

"zygote002" > wrote in message
...
> Hi all.
>
> I'm a very caring GF owner over the years I have made sure I have a
> good ph, and excellent water quality. To my dismay - I have still
> periodically lost my fish - all the same creep and crud. In the
> past I have tried salt, heat, hospital buckets - injectable amacasin.
> Now its back. It presented first with my black moors as a slightly
> blue/white hue to them - and their eyes went white (on the inside not
> opaque cornea). Then as time went on they became slightly bloated and
> then filially died. In the rest of the GF (mostly ryukin) they
> present small red spots, bent fins, slight blue/white hue to their
> very fin tips. It's never fuzzy.
>
> I'll be taking a skin scraping to a friend who is a microbiologist but
> I could use some practical knowledge - what the hell is the stuff!?
>
> Bacterial? Fungal? Protozoan? Parasitic? I've been calling
> SanFranciso - the nearest big city and STILL YET haven't found a fish
> vet.
>
> Setup:
> 60 gallon fish tank - no gravel
> 2 eclipse filters
> 0 nitrates
> 0 nitrites
> 0 ammonia
> ph 7.2
> temp 71 degrees - constant
>
> 8 hours of light a day.
>
> Food: split peas, gf food (soaked)
>

[zygote002]

On Wed, 01 Oct 2003 10:21:08 +0100, Geezer From The Freezer
> wrote:

>
>
>zygote002 wrote:
>>
>> Setup:
>> 60 gallon fish tank - no gravel
>> 2 eclipse filters
>> 0 nitrates
>> 0 nitrites
>> 0 ammonia
>> ph 7.2
>
>something is wrong as nitrates being 0 is suspect! Nitrates are never 0.
>Everything else looks ok. Also what is "Creep and Crud"?

No - I designed the tank so It drains to the oudstide plants while
getting .4 gallons an hour pumped into it. Keeps the water pristine

Creep and crud is just slang for unknown - disease.

[zygote002]

On Wed, 1 Oct 2003 14:43:01 +0100, "Mel" > wrote:

>Costia which is a protozoan flagellate can cause an off white film to cover
>the body and small red spots. Have you seen the fish flashing or rubbing on
>anything?
>Chiliodonella also causes a grey/blueish film on the body and flashing,
>rubbing.
>Might be worth getting a broad spectrum parasite med which covers both to
>see if that works.
>Mel.
>

Flashing - yep. Thanks for the lead :) I wonder if upping the temp
would help?

[zygote002]

On Wed, 01 Oct 2003 06:32:53 GMT, Charles >
wrote:

>No idea what the problem is, but I believe UCDavis has a good vet
>program, you might give them a call for a referral if nothing else.
>
>

I have a call into them. Hopefully my predicament will intice someones
curiosity :)

[Azul]

On Wed, 01 Oct 2003 14:56:47 -0700, zygote002 >
wrote:

>On Wed, 1 Oct 2003 14:43:01 +0100, "Mel" > wrote:
>
>>Costia which is a protozoan flagellate can cause an off white film to cover
>>the body and small red spots. Have you seen the fish flashing or rubbing on
>>anything?
>>Chiliodonella also causes a grey/blueish film on the body and flashing,
>>rubbing.
>>Might be worth getting a broad spectrum parasite med which covers both to
>>see if that works.
>>Mel.
>>
>
>Flashing - yep. Thanks for the lead :) I wonder if upping the temp
>would help?

It has been intimated that when faced with parasites, if you up the
temperature it will cause their life cycle to speed up. This can help
get rid of them faster.

At least I think that is what it is for. Ingrid??

Azul

[[email protected]]

white slime coat is parasite or water quality problem. you say you have a drip
system. what is the temp? temp drops can bring on ich. that will make seriously
white slime coat.
are you adding new fish to teh tank without doing quarantines?
it could be a parasite. I would suggest you add potassium permanganate to the tank
once a week with the overflow going. you are on your own well, correct? no city
water with chlorine, right?
Ingrid


zygote002 > wrote:

>Hi all.
>
>I'm a very caring GF owner over the years I have made sure I have a
>good ph, and excellent water quality. To my dismay - I have still
>periodically lost my fish - all the same creep and crud. In the
>past I have tried salt, heat, hospital buckets - injectable amacasin.
>Now its back. It presented first with my black moors as a slightly
>blue/white hue to them - and their eyes went white (on the inside not
>opaque cornea). Then as time went on they became slightly bloated and
>then filially died. In the rest of the GF (mostly ryukin) they
>present small red spots, bent fins, slight blue/white hue to their
>very fin tips. It's never fuzzy.
>
>I'll be taking a skin scraping to a friend who is a microbiologist but
>I could use some practical knowledge - what the hell is the stuff!?
>
>Bacterial? Fungal? Protozoan? Parasitic? I've been calling
>SanFranciso - the nearest big city and STILL YET haven't found a fish
>vet.
>
>Setup:
>60 gallon fish tank - no gravel
>2 eclipse filters
>0 nitrates
>0 nitrites
>0 ammonia
>ph 7.2
>temp 71 degrees - constant
>
>8 hours of light a day.
>
>Food: split peas, gf food (soaked)



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
List Manager: Puregold Goldfish List
http://puregold.aquaria.net/
www.drsolo.com
Solve the problem, dont waste energy finding who's to blame
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Unfortunately, I receive no money, gifts, discounts or other
compensation for all the damn work I do, nor for any of the
endorsements or recommendations I make.

[[email protected]]

yeah, run the temp up for ich using salt.
for gyros more likely to kill the fish.
Ingrid

Azul > wrote:

>It has been intimated that when faced with parasites, if you up the
>temperature it will cause their life cycle to speed up. This can help
>get rid of them faster.
>
>At least I think that is what it is for. Ingrid??
>
>Azul



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
List Manager: Puregold Goldfish List
http://puregold.aquaria.net/
www.drsolo.com
Solve the problem, dont waste energy finding who's to blame
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Unfortunately, I receive no money, gifts, discounts or other
compensation for all the damn work I do, nor for any of the
endorsements or recommendations I make.

[zygote002]

On Thu, 02 Oct 2003 03:23:10 GMT, wrote:

>white slime coat is parasite or water quality problem. you say you have a drip
>system. what is the temp? temp drops can bring on ich. that will make seriously
>white slime coat.
>are you adding new fish to teh tank without doing quarantines?
>it could be a parasite. I would suggest you add potassium permanganate to the tank
>once a week with the overflow going. you are on your own well, correct? no city
>water with chlorine, right?

The water is aged and warmed up to no lower than 68 degrees. Well
water :) No new fishes in about 14 years. Not ich - but I'll drop a
heater in the tank - im guessing 84 deg? I have some PP. Nasty
purple stuff. Looks like Im gonna get smurfed :P

Thanks all :)
>

[[email protected]]

be sure to http://users.megapathdsl.net/~solo/puregold/disease/disease.htm
make up the stock solution, dont ever add the crystals directly to the tank. if you
have no problems now, dont crank the heat up that far. more like 76-78. when you
see the slime coat thickening, then do a salt dip followed by the PP treatment.
Ingrid

zygote002 > wrote:

>On Thu, 02 Oct 2003 03:23:10 GMT, wrote:
>
>>white slime coat is parasite or water quality problem. you say you have a drip
>>system. what is the temp? temp drops can bring on ich. that will make seriously
>>white slime coat.
>>are you adding new fish to teh tank without doing quarantines?
>>it could be a parasite. I would suggest you add potassium permanganate to the tank
>>once a week with the overflow going. you are on your own well, correct? no city
>>water with chlorine, right?
>
>The water is aged and warmed up to no lower than 68 degrees. Well
>water :) No new fishes in about 14 years. Not ich - but I'll drop a
>heater in the tank - im guessing 84 deg? I have some PP. Nasty
>purple stuff. Looks like Im gonna get smurfed :P
>
>Thanks all :)
>>



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
List Manager: Puregold Goldfish List
http://puregold.aquaria.net/
www.drsolo.com
Solve the problem, dont waste energy finding who's to blame
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Unfortunately, I receive no money, gifts, discounts or other
compensation for all the damn work I do, nor for any of the
endorsements or recommendations I make.