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Help with inherited reef tank
In article
, Charles Henderson wrote: Thank, everyone, for your suggestions. I have a better idea now of what I need to do. I'll get some Live Sand in there right away, then see what the PH does after that. I'll start bringing up the salinity with once-a-week 10 percent water changes. I'll get some Nori for the Coral Beauty. And since we are building a reef tank here, I'll get some fully-cured Live Rock, a little at a time. But I'll wait on that till after I know for sure whether this tank is past the ammonia/nitrite spike. Thanks again, boys and girls! I'll be back with more questions, no doubt! Cheers, --Charlie Henderson So, what are your suggestions for getting the water chemistry right? Bring the PH up first? How best to do that? Add the aragonite *first*, as a buffer? There's a kalkwasser generator in the cabinet that's yet to be brought online... I'll be doing more-frequent-than-usual water changes for a time, maybe 10 percent a week for the next few weeks, and I'll gradually raise the salinity to 1.021 that way. But first, I await your wisdom. My humble thanks, --Charlie Henderson |
Help with inherited reef tank
Charlie,
I think everyone else pretty much answered your questions - just to reiterate a couple things... (below): We're aiming for a reef tank, so I'd like to see some coraline algae in there, if only to give the Coral Beauty something to nibble on. He hasn't been eating much (if any) of the flake or frozen I've been feeding. Okay, coraline algae is a different ballgame. When ppl say *add algae* - I think of macro algaes, usually Caulerpas. These you wouldn't want in your display. Coraline is a solid encrusting algae (what gives LR it's "purple" color), and no fish that I am aware of, will eat it. Try some live or frozen brine or frozen mysis for the C. Beauty - see if it will eat that. Will kalkwasser lower alkalinity and raise PH? Kalkwasser is a naturally balanced additive, and will raise both calcium and alk. It also has an extremely high pH, and will raise that as well. That high, eh? For some reason I thought I was aiming for 1.021. Thanks for pointing that out. A good article: http://www.animalnetwork.com/fish2/a.../1/default.asp In summary, 1.025 is the closest to the natural salinity of the reef where most of our critters come from. Can I just remove some tank water, say a gallon, add a bit of salt and mix well, then return it to the tank? Via the sump, perhaps? A little bit per day...? You could ... what most ppl do to raise salinity is simply use sal****er as topoff water (for evap), instead of fresh water. Another method is to simply use a higher strength salinity water for you water changes. After you wait out any potential cycle, and do a couple water changes to bring your parameters in check, you might want to think about beefing up your cleaner crew considerably - a bunch of different snails, maybe a brittle or serpent star, etc. Should I put in some live sand first? If you're going to be adding LS to the tank, I would do this before you do anything else. HTH!! Teri http://www.reefsanctuary.com |
Help with inherited reef tank
In article ,
Teri G wrote: (snip) Okay, coraline algae is a different ballgame. When ppl say *add algae* - I think of macro algaes, usually Caulerpas. These you wouldn't want in your display. Coraline is a solid encrusting algae (what gives LR it's "purple" color), and no fish that I am aware of, will eat it. Well, you're just full of useful information! Thank you for once again correcting my misconceptions! ;-) Coral Angels do eat algae off rocks, though, right? That's what they're pecking at? I was hoping to get *whatever* it is they like to eat by adding some live rock, but it seems I should wait till the water chemistry is corrected before doing that. MY LFS guy has given me some sage advice, too: concentrate on PH, alkalinity, calcium and salinity first of all. He, along with some others here said I should get some live sand in there right away, so I did that yesterday! Aragonite, anyway. I'll get some sand from one of nature's reefs to seed that with soon, but it's effect on water chemistry should be there now. The Coral Beauty was very unhappy with the disturbance. I kept the silty cloud down to a minimum by pouring the sand down through a length of PVC pipe, but of course the tank clouded up for an hour or so anyway. He was swimming frantically till lights out, hours after it had cleared. I'm really starting to worry about him... Everyone else in the tank seems okay; no obvious signs of stress. Try some live or frozen brine or frozen mysis for the C. Beauty - see if it will eat that. He won't take flake, frozen brine or mysis, and I've tried two different formulations of frozen mixtures, supposedly good for Pygmy Angels, etc... He won't take any of them. He seems interested in food, comes out quickly when the food kits the water and the Damsels go nuts, even tastes some of what's there, but quickly spits it out and then just swims around kind of agitated. Will kalkwasser lower alkalinity and raise PH? Kalkwasser is a naturally balanced additive, and will raise both calcium and alk. It also has an extremely high pH, and will raise that as well. I plan to bring all water parameters into compliance before using the kalk reactor. That high, eh? For some reason I thought I was aiming for 1.021. Thanks for pointing that out. A good article: http://www.animalnetwork.com/fish2/a.../1/default.asp In summary, 1.025 is the closest to the natural salinity of the reef where most of our critters come from. Thanks again, Teri. You've been very helpful! --Charlie Henderson |
Help with inherited reef tank
On Tue, 16 Dec 2003 14:47:20 -0500, Teri G
wrote: Okay, coraline algae is a different ballgame. When ppl say *add algae* - I think of macro algaes, usually Caulerpas. These you wouldn't want in your display. Coraline is a solid encrusting algae (what gives LR it's "purple" color), and no fish that I am aware of, will eat it. Are you saying you don't want any Caulerpas in your display tank? Is that the norm for a reef tank? I'm new at this but I kind of like some Caulerpas in the tank. You have to stay on top of it or it get to be to much but I like the color it adds and it hasn't been that big of a deal yet anyway. Do most reef tanks have no Caulerpas? Ct Midnite http://www.geocities.com/ctmidnite53/fish.html |
Help with inherited reef tank
"Ct Midnite" mreef2.10.muffin@spamgourmet.(nospam)com wrote in message ... On Tue, 16 Dec 2003 14:47:20 -0500, Teri G wrote: Okay, coraline algae is a different ballgame. When ppl say *add algae* - I think of macro algaes, usually Caulerpas. These you wouldn't want in your display. Coraline is a solid encrusting algae (what gives LR it's "purple" color), and no fish that I am aware of, will eat it. Are you saying you don't want any Caulerpas in your display tank? Is that the norm for a reef tank? I'm new at this but I kind of like some Caulerpas in the tank. You have to stay on top of it or it get to be to much but I like the color it adds and it hasn't been that big of a deal yet anyway. Do most reef tanks have no Caulerpas? Ct Midnite http://www.geocities.com/ctmidnite53/fish.html it's really hard, if not impossible, to get rid of it once it's established. if you miss trimming it for a while, it can go asexual and die all at once, dumping a large amount of biological waste into your tank in a short period of time. |
Help with inherited reef tank
it's really hard, if not impossible, to get rid of it once it's
established. if you miss trimming it for a while, it can go asexual and die all at once, dumping a large amount of biological waste into your tank in a short period of time. I do not mind having some Caulerpas.... or any type. CapFusion,... |
Help with inherited reef tank
Charlie,
Charles Henderson wrote: Well, you're just full of useful information! Thank you for once again correcting my misconceptions! ;-) Not a problem, and I hope you don't see it as trying to "correct" you. Just trying to help, and share what bit of experience I've gleaned over the many years of doing this. Coral Angels do eat algae off rocks, though, right? That's what they're pecking at? I haven't kept a dwarf angel for many yeara (beware that most dwarfs will *nip* at corals) - but I do believe that CB's are primarily algae eaters in the wild. This doesn't necesarily mean that they will eat macro algaes like Caulerpa and other display algaes. They may tend to graze more off of the hair algaes. Dried nori (available in most oriental markets as well as large grocery stores) is usually a good choice for algae eaters. Have you tried live brine? Never met a healthy fish who wouldn't go crazy for it. Or, see if you can get your hands on some Cyclop-eeze. On other note - CB's imported from the Phillipines don't always have a great survival record. Capture & transport practices are not always up to *snuff*. I was hoping to get *whatever* it is they like to eat by adding some live rock, but it seems I should wait till the water chemistry is corrected before doing that. MY LFS guy has given me some sage advice, too: concentrate on PH, alkalinity, calcium and salinity first of all. This is good advice, but truthfully, you're going to need to get the fish eating *something* soon. It likely will not survive off of organisms on the LR. As far as your water chemistry, it isn't bad, and you honestly don't need to be overly concerned about ca/alk until you anticipate keeping corals. He, along with some others here said I should get some live sand in there right away, so I did that yesterday! Aragonite, anyway. I'll get some sand from one of nature's reefs to seed that with soon, but it's effect on water chemistry should be there now. Well ... I haven't followed this complete conversation to a T, but are you referring to the possible *buffering* capabilities of aragonite? If so, this has been pretty much disproven. In order for aragonite to "buffer' the water, it would need to semi-dissolve. In order to do this, your pH would have to be so low that pretty much nothing in the tank would survive. This is how a calcium reactor works - CO2 gas is injected into the water, which drops the pH to 7.0 or below. This low pH water partially dissolves the aragonite media, thus making a high ca/alk (but low pH) effluent. If you are instead referring to the denitrifying capabilities of a DSB, it will take several weeks (possibly months), for your sandbed to become truly *live*, and for it to truly become a denitrification factor. The Coral Beauty was very unhappy with the disturbance. I kept the silty cloud down to a minimum by pouring the sand down through a length of PVC pipe, but of course the tank clouded up for an hour or so anyway. He was swimming frantically till lights out, hours after it had cleared. I'm really starting to worry about him... Everyone else in the tank seems okay; no obvious signs of stress. I'd try to avoid changes/disturbances as much as possible for a bit of time. It sounds to me that the fish might be quite stressed - capture, shipping, introduction into a new tank, etc., may all have taken it's toll - and this may be why it is not eating. (snip) I plan to bring all water parameters into compliance before using the kalk reactor. Is it a kalkwasser (Nilsen) reactor, or a Calcium reactor? Neither is truly effective at *raising* levels, but both are wonderful for maintaining them. We use both - if you need any help, just yell. (snip) Thanks again, Teri. You've been very helpful! --Charlie Henderson Any time. Teri http://www.reefsanctuary.com |
Help with inherited reef tank
Ct Midnite wrote: On Tue, 16 Dec 2003 14:47:20 -0500, Teri G wrote: (snip) Are you saying you don't want any Caulerpas in your display tank? There are some macros that I would consider for a reef - Halimeda is very nice looking, but will deplete calcium levels. "Shaving brush" algae is nice looking, Chaetomorpha is okay, not invasive or rooting. Caulerpa, absolutely not (more below). Is that the norm for a reef tank? I'm new at this but I kind of like some Caulerpas in the tank. You have to stay on top of it or it get to be to much but I like the color it adds and it hasn't been that big of a deal yet anyway. I know several people (including myself) who have had horrible experiences with Caulerpa in the display. Given available nutrients, and sufficient lighting, many caulerpas can literally take over a tank in a couple weeks - even less time. It is almost impossible to eradicate once established, and, in many cases, grows much more quickly than it can be controlled. Caulerpas also have a tendency to release toxins, as well as all of the nutrients they have absorbed (nitrates, phosphates, etc.), back into the water column. We recenly had a war with some Caulerpa prolifera that was somehow (no clue how) introduced into our tank. It took hold on a piece of LR, and rooted itself deep into one my favorite sps's - an Anacropora sp. Within only a few days, it had literally grown totally through the coral. I had to remove the entire rock from the tank, and tear apart the coral into several dozen pieces to remove the Caulerpa. Nasty stuff. We have three different Tangs in the tank - none of which would touch the stuff. Do most reef tanks have no Caulerpas? Most that I know of do not have Caulerpa, but may have one or two other macros, as mentioned above. The problem with macro algaes is this -- either no fish will touch it, and it will quickly take over a tank, *or*, the fish will love it, and will have a quick and tasty $20.00 snack. :-) Teri http://www.reefsanctuary.com |
Help with inherited reef tank
The better option is to have your macro algae in a refugium, out of the display
tank. Marc Teri G wrote: Are you saying you don't want any Caulerpas in your display tank? There are some macros that I would consider for a reef - Halimeda is very nice looking, but will deplete calcium levels. "Shaving brush" algae is nice looking, Chaetomorpha is okay, not invasive or rooting. Caulerpa, absolutely not (more below). I know several people (including myself) who have had horrible experiences with Caulerpa in the display. Given available nutrients, and sufficient lighting, many caulerpas can literally take over a tank in a couple weeks - even less time. It is almost impossible to eradicate once established, and, in many cases, grows much more quickly than it can be controlled. Caulerpas also have a tendency to release toxins, as well as all of the nutrients they have absorbed (nitrates, phosphates, etc.), back into the water column. We recenly had a war with some Caulerpa prolifera that was somehow (no clue how) introduced into our tank. It took hold on a piece of LR, and rooted itself deep into one my favorite sps's - an Anacropora sp. Within only a few days, it had literally grown totally through the coral. I had to remove the entire rock from the tank, and tear apart the coral into several dozen pieces to remove the Caulerpa. Nasty stuff. We have three different Tangs in the tank - none of which would touch the stuff. Most that I know of do not have Caulerpa, but may have one or two other macros, as mentioned above. The problem with macro algaes is this -- either no fish will touch it, and it will quickly take over a tank, *or*, the fish will love it, and will have a quick and tasty $20.00 snack. :-) Teri http://www.reefsanctuary.com -- Personal Page: http://www.sparklingfloorservice.com/oanda/index.html Business Page: http://www.sparklingfloorservice.com Marine Hobbyist: http://www.melevsreef.com |
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