New Tank Still Struggling??
 

Frank wrote:
Altum wrote,
I guess what I'm trying to ask whether you ALWAYS advocate changing only 25% of the water.......

I "ALWAYS" advocate changing *20%* - for those that only do small (20%
or less) weekly water changes.

Are my regular 50% water changes harming..........

Key word here is "regular". TDS in your tap water isn't going to
suddenly change from week to week. Highly unlikely DOCs could build up
quick enough within a week to change TDS unless you have a large
fish/goldfish tank filtered with a canister filter. No, weekly 50% wate
changes - your fish should be doing great! It's the people that only
do 10 or 20% water changes every week or two and says their tank looks
and test great. These are the people that kill their fish due to
osmotic pressure shock ;-) ............ Frank

Cool. Thanks. I just wanted to be sure I wasn't causing any
inadvertent long-term harm with my big water changes. I've never had a
conductivity meter to play with so I don't have any appreciation of how
fast TDS changes or doesn't change in tanks. I usually keep my tanks
moderately stocked with small fish - no oscars here. :-)

--
Put the word aquaria in the subject to reply.
Did you read the FAQ? http://faq.thekrib.com

New Tank Still Struggling??
 

Gill wrote,
I still see losses and this is with comparable water hardness/pH.....

There is a difference in hardness and TDS (total dissolved solids). It
may be the DOCs that push the % difference between your tank and the
pet shops tanks, and the fish die from a osmotic pressure change of
more than 25%.

it might be from other issues I don't know for sure.......

Pointed that out in my reply to Mr. Gardener... ......... Frank

New Tank Still Struggling??
 

On 24 Mar 2006 22:23:18 -0800, "Frank"
wrote:

else, from stress shock... If they are acclimated right and go through
a quarantine preventive treatment for 3 weeks, losses drop from 20 and
25% down to less than 5% - been their, done that! ........... Frank

Yeah - me been there done that too - I managed a Petco back in the
1960s, when Petco was just beginning their plans to launch some
freestanding stores. At the time, Petco was just the company that
leased space in discount department stores and were known only as "The
Pet Department." So much we didn't know about fish and water back
then.

-- Mister Gardener

New Tank Still Struggling??
 

On 24 Mar 2006 21:32:59 -0800, "Frank"
wrote:

Altum wrote,
I guess what I'm trying to ask whether you ALWAYS advocate changing only 25% of the water.......

I "ALWAYS" advocate changing *20%* - for those that only do small (20%
or less) weekly water changes.

I'm impressed by your precision. I really don't know where the 20% or
30% line exists in any of my tanks. I couldn't easily tell the
difference between 20% and 25% - I just eyeball and go for roughly a
quarter or a third and call it good.

-- Mister Gardener

New Tank Still Struggling??
 

Mr. Gardener wrote,
I'm impressed by your precision.......

I measure the hight of the tank, divide by 5, and stick one of those
digitial thermometers there - precision every time! ;-)
.............. Frank

New Tank Still Struggling??
 

Bottom posted.
Koi-Lo wrote:
"Nikki" wrote in message
...
koi
as you are getting them used to your water, do you put water from
your tank into their bag?

No Kikki, what I do is slowly pour them into a clear gallon container
that's shaped like a plastic milk jug and discard the bag. I
carefully pour most of the water they were in down the drain, leaving
their backs covered. I then add about 1/4 to 1/3 cup of water from
the Q-tank into the container about every 15 to 20 minutes or so. I
also have an air bubbler running for them in the container. But it
works without the bubbler just as well. I keep adding more and more
water until they're in about 80% Q-tank water - then gently move them
to the Q-tank. This can take several hours but it's well worth the
effort and time.

that's what I do, but I'm sure not long enough, but I have not lost
fish from it yet, then again me an the fish store are probably using
the same water she is only five min from me, anyway how long do you
wait before putting them in your tank?

It depends on how long it takes me to get the water in the container
to about 80% or so of what's in the Q-tank. I am seldom exact about
anything but medications. ;-) It also depends on where I bought
them. That one store in Nashville has such soft acid water it can
take 4 or more hours to acclimate them, so I seldom buy fish there
anymore. The other two stores have water closer to what I have so it
takes no more than maybe 2 hours. Sometimes I forget to add more
water for 30 minutes so that adds time... to the fishes benefit.
But I don't get any "gaspers" anymore who turn up dead in anything
from hours to days.

just wondering?
have you ever spilled the bag with fish in it while trying to do it,
I hate those stupid bags,

No, since I remove them from the bag and put them in the container as
soon as I get home. Also, I don't putz around when I buy fish - I go
STRAIGHT HOME with them. As for such accidents.... yes, I just did
that recently with some of my own fish I was putting outside in a
780g pool. The water outside is a little different that what's in my
tanks so wanted to acclimate them for at least 20 to 30 minutes
(there was also a temperature difference) - and dropped the whole
bucket into the pool! AAARGGGHHH!!!! They hid in the plants for a
few days but where fine. :-))) My Shubunkins are pretty tough
customers. I did kill some perarlscales the time I got home late and
had no time to acclimate them. We had some place to go and I was
really pressed for time. Instead of putting them in a tub to
acclimate them with a bubbler until we got back - I just put them in
the Q-tank. BIG MISTAKE. Half were dead in less than a week. :*(

I got some little guppies for my sons tank he wants
something with his ADF, and as I was putting the water in the bag
from his tank, over it went, fish were all over my kitchen counter,
my six year old did not think it was funny, but my two older ones
"teenagers" of course were laughing so hard, I'm trying to get them
to help me catch them and they had to leave the room they were
laughing so hard,

LOL!!! That's teenagers for ya! :-D

anyway not the first time I
have done that to some innocent fish, they should put something at
the bottom of the bags so they sit up right when you take the band
off.

I remove the band and turn the bag upside-down holding the top shut
and let most of the water pour off down the drain (I have a drain
"strainer" thing to catch any fish I may drop). Be careful. Then
still holding the bag upside-down I put it gently into the
acclimation container. Then slowly release the top and the fish sort
of gently pour out into the container. I discard the bag and start
adding the water from the Q-tank. No more fish dying at the surface
gasping........

Koi-lo's description is the best acclimation description I have ever read
yet. One thing though - consider doing things a little differently if the
acclimation is to take place anywhere with an extreme temperature difference
(i.e. an unheated basement for example). The water temperature in the
tupperware (small but big enough) container I was using for acclimation for
an angelfish was way too cold (63 degrees fahrenheit) by the time I netted
the angelfish and put it in a 75 degrees fahrenheit tank. Whether the
angelfish died from that or something else is still debatable though, but I
have read that temperature shock can be devastating to fish. Good luck and
later!

New Tank Still Struggling??
 

"Daniel Morrow" wrote in message
...

Koi-lo's description is the best acclimation description I have ever read
yet. One thing though - consider doing things a little differently if the
acclimation is to take place anywhere with an extreme temperature
difference
(i.e. an unheated basement for example). The water temperature in the
tupperware (small but big enough) container I was using for acclimation
for
an angelfish was way too cold (63 degrees fahrenheit) by the time I netted
the angelfish and put it in a 75 degrees fahrenheit tank.

That is a big difference. Since my sunroom always has a tropical
temperature of 74 or above, I didn't worry about that. That is definitely a
consideration in cool rooms or unheated basements.

Whether the
angelfish died from that or something else is still debatable though, but
I
have read that temperature shock can be devastating to fish. Good luck and
later!

I'm glad you brought that up Daniel. It's important people don't allow
their fish to chill while being acclimated. :-)
--
Koi-Lo.... frugal ponding since 1995...
Aquariums since 1952
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
*Note: There are two Koi-Lo's on the Aquaria Groups.*
~~~ }((((o ~~~ }{{{{o ~~~ }(((((o

New Tank Still Struggling??
 

On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 21:24:24 -0600, "Koi-Lo"
wrote:


"Daniel Morrow" wrote in message
...

Koi-lo's description is the best acclimation description I have ever read
yet. One thing though - consider doing things a little differently if the
acclimation is to take place anywhere with an extreme temperature
difference
(i.e. an unheated basement for example). The water temperature in the
tupperware (small but big enough) container I was using for acclimation
for
an angelfish was way too cold (63 degrees fahrenheit) by the time I netted
the angelfish and put it in a 75 degrees fahrenheit tank.

That is a big difference. Since my sunroom always has a tropical
temperature of 74 or above, I didn't worry about that. That is definitely a
consideration in cool rooms or unheated basements.

Whether the
angelfish died from that or something else is still debatable though, but
I
have read that temperature shock can be devastating to fish. Good luck and
later!

I'm glad you brought that up Daniel. It's important people don't allow
their fish to chill while being acclimated. :-)

I can't imagine keeping fish in a cold basement, mostly because I
can't imagine my electric bill for running aquarium heaters in a cold
basement. Sitting my acclimating container directly on the strip light
or tank top has seemed to keep the temperature up, but I have also,
when the living room was significantly cooler, 60 degrees, done the
acclimation in the warm kitchen, walking the water from the
destination tank one cup at a time to the kitchen acclimation
container. And I got some exercise that I otherwise wouldn't have, so
I will live longer than if I had not carried all that water one cup at
a time back and forth . . .and when I am 112 years old in a nursing
home and a reporter asks me what my secret for a long life is I will
say "Fish".

-- Mister Gardener

New Tank Still Struggling??
 

"Mr. Gardener" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 21:24:24 -0600, "Koi-Lo"
wrote:
I'm glad you brought that up Daniel. It's important people don't allow
their fish to chill while being acclimated. :-)
========
I can't imagine keeping fish in a cold basement, mostly because I
can't imagine my electric bill for running aquarium heaters in a cold
basement.

I wish I still had a basement.

Sitting my acclimating container directly on the strip light
or tank top has seemed to keep the temperature up, but I have also,
when the living room was significantly cooler, 60 degrees,

At 60F my husband would freeze to death. He's a heat lover so our whole
house is around 75F - good for tropical fish. On a clear sunny winter day
it'll go up to 80F in here, warmer in the sunroom.

done the
acclimation in the warm kitchen, walking the water from the
destination tank one cup at a time to the kitchen acclimation
container. And I got some exercise that I otherwise wouldn't have, so
I will live longer than if I had not carried all that water one cup at
a time back and forth . . .and when I am 112 years old in a nursing
home and a reporter asks me what my secret for a long life is I will
say "Fish".

There ya go! :-)))
--
Koi-Lo.... frugal ponding since 1995...
Aquariums since 1952
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~ }((((o ~~~ }{{{{o ~~~ }(((((o

New Tank Still Struggling??
 

"Koi-Lo" wrote in message
...

"Mr. Gardener" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 21:24:24 -0600, "Koi-Lo"
wrote:
I'm glad you brought that up Daniel. It's important people don't allow
their fish to chill while being acclimated. :-)
========
I can't imagine keeping fish in a cold basement, mostly because I
can't imagine my electric bill for running aquarium heaters in a cold
basement.

I wish I still had a basement.

Sitting my acclimating container directly on the strip light
or tank top has seemed to keep the temperature up, but I have also,
when the living room was significantly cooler, 60 degrees,

At 60F my husband would freeze to death. He's a heat lover so our whole
house is around 75F - good for tropical fish. On a clear sunny winter day
it'll go up to 80F in here, warmer in the sunroom.

done the
acclimation in the warm kitchen, walking the water from the
destination tank one cup at a time to the kitchen acclimation
container. And I got some exercise that I otherwise wouldn't have, so
I will live longer than if I had not carried all that water one cup at
a time back and forth . . .and when I am 112 years old in a nursing
home and a reporter asks me what my secret for a long life is I will
say "Fish".

There ya go! :-)))
--
Koi-Lo.... frugal ponding since 1995...
Aquariums since 1952
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~ }((((o ~~~ }{{{{o ~~~ }(((((o


You know thats funny, I keep my heat on 80 easy, sometimes higher.... but if
i dont have a heater in my betta tank which is not a lot of water like the
bigger tanks it drops down to 72-75 quickly. I have one tank in my living
room close to a heater (forced air) and now that tank will stay steady 78,
but i dont like depending on that to much.
Nik