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bettas in plastic cups
If Pizza is your favourite food but you wouldn't want to eat it every
day...fish are the same, give them a varied diet the same way as you would yourself Humans have become accustomed to variety, not out of need, but out of want. I live in a city where there are ethnic restaurants all over. I can eat at probably 100 different restaurants of at least 10 different ethnicities within a 10 km radius. I've also visited other cities and towns, where the primary food was burger and fries. I'm used to variety, but evidently, there are people in towns and small cities where they are used to their (in my opinion limited) variety. Have you ever seen a fish sick of flake food? Usually when it is, it's because it's gotten ill. But it's not because it's depressed over a lack of choice. tim |
bettas in plastic cups
Isn't it a bit cruel to keep a girlfriend in a 1 gall tank? LOL
Gill It's fine...I've never heard her complain :) We've worked out a series of tapping noises she makes on the glass when she's hungry and I have to feed her. Just kidding folks! She's in a tank no smaller than 10 gallons, of course. tim |
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NetMax wrote:
"Koi-lo" wrote in message .com... "Gill Passman" wrote in message ... Koi-lo wrote: "NetMax" wrote in message om... I'm not saying that this is a widely applied corporate policy, but saying stores legally have to sell something is not true, at least to the best of my understanding in Canada. ====================== Here in the USA you can be sure a lawsuit would soon commence...... :-( This rule also applies in the UK...I believe it has something to do with the sale of livestock rather than any other law...my local stores will totally NOT sell fish unless they can be as sure as possible that these pets will be properly cared for....no lawsuit in the UK would win against a retailer refusing to sell anything alive to an unsuitable home $$ In the USA you'd have to have PROOF the home was unsuitable. People here sue for the least little thing. One woman got rich suing McDonald's because SHE spilt hot coffee on her own crotch! Surely you heard about that one. How do the stores in your country make sure the home is suitable for all the pets they sell? Today, I have seen in the press that our largest supermarket chain has refused to sell a certain brand of chocolate to someone as it went against their quality principles....maybe it's time that there was some legislation in the US protecting livestock (and chocolate - being flippant) being sold into unsuitable hands.... $$ I wish there was - there isn't. People who are seldom home buy cats to live in virtual isolation. They buy huge dogs to languish in tiny efficiency apartments. They buy expensive birds and hang their cages by open windows or above air conditioning vents. They buy a bag of koi for 100 gallon unfiltered preformed ponds..... Honestly, I think if you cannot provide a proper home for a pet you should not be buying it....I don't discriminate against a mammal, bird or fish in this....if you can't provide a proper home it is cruel...part of pet owning is responsibility for the creature you are giving a home to....I don't care what it is, I don't care how much money someone has...if they buy it they need to provide the care for it and if they can't afford to house it suitably they shouldn't be buying it in the first place...end of story... $$ There is no way to know how they will care for it once they leave the pet store or breeders facilities. That's probably the reason we don't have such laws here. If I might be so brash, that sounds like a cop-out. I never had trouble establishing the conditions the fish were going into. I wasn't a nazi grilling them. I'd just conversationally inquire about the tank-mates, foods given, number of fish, size of tank. Almost 100% of them seemed very eager to discuss their hobby with someone who cared and showed knowledge. Most people taking the fish into an abusive application were unaware of it, and we informed them regarding growth rates and eventual size (usually keeping Arowanas, Oscars, Koi, Pacus and TinFoil barbs out of 5 to 10g tanks). The odd one would still tell me the truth, but simply didn't care or it was a cultural thing. Only once did someone outright lie, and it was quite obvious. Your attitude sounds like the same cop-out used in the US regarding gun control (or lack of), so maybe it's a cultural 'freedom' thing. Almost seems like the freedom being protected, is to take the easy way out. The places I go refuse to sell a tank and fish on the same day...when you actually go to get your first you get questioned to determine your level of knowledge and then advise is given as appropriate - same everywhere I've been. When I bought my two current bettas (at a place where I wasn't known) I got questioned quite closely on the planned accommodation - I guess he was worried I might put two males in the same tank....I have known people to be refused fish and they still go back to the same place - they go away and take the advice they have been given to ensure that the best provision is made for their pets. One place I go refuses to sell Clown Loaches to anyone with less than a 30 gall tank - please let's not go get into a Clown Loach tank size discussion :-) . Sure anyone can lie but in reality very few people do. Cat and Dog Rescue Homes in the UK not only interrogate you as to how you are going to care for your pet, some will actually insist on a home visit to make sure that you have adequate care provisions and refuse to allow you a dog or a cat if you don't. With almost every animal that I buy/acquire I have been asked about how I'm going to care for it....as I think I've already said, Livestock/pets are heavily regulated here and there are a lot of prosecutions for people not providing adequate care for their pets.... Gill |
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$$ I wish there was - there isn't. People who are seldom home buy cats to live in virtual isolation. They buy huge dogs to languish in tiny efficiency apartments. They buy expensive birds and hang their cages by open windows or above air conditioning vents. They buy a bag of koi for 100 gallon unfiltered preformed ponds..... I'm not certain if it's illegal or not but the cat shelter I adopted from (in the U.S.) only adopts to those they see fit. They regularly refuse people who don't meet certain requirements. (I.e. renters must supply landlord's contact information to verify that cats are accepted, etc) I was there when an angry customer came in yelling about how her S.O. was refused a kitten days before because she only wanted to adopt one. The policy is kittens are only to be adopted in pairs if in a home that has no other cats. (It's believed they feel more secure in pairs) The person was sent away and the kittens, which are easily adoptable, were sold to someone else who would take both. They also rigorously check references, ask about your previous cat-caring experience and provide a contract for you upon adoption stating that you will not declaw or allow your cat to live outdoors. Obviously they're a lot more stringent then some other cat shelters but still I didn't get the impression they were breaking the law by refusing to sell a particular animal. I'll have to check in on that. I'm curious now. |
bettas in plastic cups
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"NetMax" wrote in message .. . "Koi-lo" wrote in message .com... $$ There is no way to know how they will care for it once they leave the pet store or breeders facilities. That's probably the reason we don't have such laws here. ============ If I might be so brash, that sounds like a cop-out. # What shop keeper would have the resources to check out the homes of the customers? If someone come in and said they have a 120 g tank how could it be proven without going out to their home? They may have a 5g and nothing more. A busy pet shop here may have hundreds of people going through the doors each day. Our local PetsMart is a zoo some days. How would they check everyone out? They sell hundreds of fish each day. I would think they'd go bankrupt paying for such a thing, don't you? Most of the stores selling fish here are chains, not privately owned. I never had trouble establishing the conditions the fish were going into. I wasn't a nazi grilling them. I'd just conversationally inquire about the tank-mates, foods given, number of fish, size of tank. # You must be talking about a privately owned store. Where I live most are large chains that hire clueless teens or retired people. They're busy as heck and don't have the time to chat with the customers even if they wanted to. No store in the USA is going to pay the cost of special training for their minimum wage employees who come and go faster than the stock. Some offer a bit of advice as they bag your fish. Most are as I said are 100% clueless. :-( Almost 100% of them seemed very eager to discuss their hobby with someone who cared and showed knowledge. # I agree if the employee had the knowledge and the time that many fish-buyers would show eager interest. But many don't! You must be aware of who the stores in the USA hire?!?!?! Usually anyone who applies for the position is hired. These are seldom people with knowledge about the proper care of fish. Most people taking the fish into an abusive application were unaware of it, and we informed them regarding growth rates and eventual size (usually keeping Arowanas, Oscars, Koi, Pacus and TinFoil barbs out of 5 to 10g tanks). The odd one would still tell me the truth, but simply didn't care or it was a cultural thing. Only once did someone outright lie, and it was quite obvious. Your attitude sounds like the same cop-out # Cop-out? I don't own these huge chains we have here nor do I have stock in any of them. :-) I have nothing to say as to how they're run, or by who, or how they hire they're employees. Are you suggesting we force these chains to hire and train people how to tell who is and isn't qualified to buy fish? To teach them about the hundreds of fish being sold in the USA? There are two problems with that. One is who PAYS for this training, especially when we all know these employees will soon be gone? The other is how many people are going to want such training when so few are interested in fish? Most are college kids who take these jobs here in the USA, not someone looking to make a long-term commitment to such a low-paying position. used in the US regarding gun control (or lack of), so maybe it's a cultural 'freedom' thing. # I'm sure it is. We have no right as Americans to dictate to a store keeper who he hires or what they're taught...... Almost seems like the freedom being protected, is to take the easy way out. -- www.NetMax.tk *stumbles off soapbox he didn't notice was there* # I'd still rather be HERE than any other country on earth. :-))) -- Koi-Lo.... frugal ponding since 1995... My Pond & Aquarium Pages: http://bellsouthpwp.net/s/h/shastadaisy ~~~ }((((o ~~~ }{{{{o ~~~ }(((((o |
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"Tynk" wrote in message ups.com... www.NetMax.tk *stumbles off soapbox he didn't notice was there* You get your butt right back up there my dear. = )~ It's quite easy to say there's nothing you can do about what the customer will house the critter they want to purchase in, but it doesn't take much time or effort to ask. ============ Brevity snip! This may not be allowed in the chain pet shops where fish are sold by the hundreds each day. They simply can't afford to hire and train enough employees (where the turnover is so rapid) to spend the extra time with the customers. We can't assume all the stores are individually owned. I'm not condoning what they do, I'm just explaining why it is the way it is in the chain stores. Maybe someone should fight for laws forcing the chains to train their employees before putting them out on the sales floor. -- Koi-Lo.... frugal ponding since 1995... My Pond & Aquarium Pages: http://bellsouthpwp.net/s/h/shastadaisy ~~~ }((((o ~~~ }{{{{o ~~~ }(((((o |
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"Gill Passman" wrote in message news:438d9168$0$20534I'm not saying that The places I go refuse to sell a tank and fish on the same day.. # At large chain pet stores? Here in TN they seldom ask you anything. The privately owned stores will often have the time to talk to each customer. ..when you actually go to get your first you get questioned to determine your level of knowledge and then advise is given as appropriate - same everywhere I've been. When I bought my two current bettas (at a place where I wasn't known) I got questioned quite closely on the planned accommodation - I guess he was worried I might put two males in the same tank.... # With bettas they will sometimes tell you this here as well. Most employees simply bag them up and hand them to you. I have known people to be refused fish and they still go back to the same place - they go away and take the advice they have been given to ensure that the best provision is made for their pets. One place I go refuses to sell Clown Loaches to anyone with less than a 30 gall tank - please let's not go get into a Clown Loach tank size discussion :-) . Sure anyone can lie but in reality very few people do. Cat and Dog Rescue Homes in the UK not only interrogate you as to how you are going to care for your pet, some will actually insist on a home visit to make sure that you have adequate care provisions and refuse to allow you a dog or a cat if you don't. # This should be the LAW in every country. The abuse and neglect of dogs here in the USA is sickening. With almost every animal that I buy/acquire I have been asked about how I'm going to care for it....as I think I've already said, Livestock/pets are heavily regulated here and there are a lot of prosecutions for people not providing adequate care for their pets.... # There is little regulation where I live but people are starting to be prosecuted for abusing pets and livestock. The UK has always been more progressive where animals are concerned than the US. -- Koi-Lo.... frugal ponding since 1995... My Pond & Aquarium Pages: http://bellsouthpwp.net/s/h/shastadaisy ~~~ }((((o ~~~ }{{{{o ~~~ }(((((o |
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"IDzine01" wrote in message ups.com... $$ I wish there was - there isn't. People who are seldom home buy cats to live in virtual isolation. They buy huge dogs to languish in tiny efficiency apartments. They buy expensive birds and hang their cages by open windows or above air conditioning vents. They buy a bag of koi for 100 gallon unfiltered preformed ponds..... I'm not certain if it's illegal or not but the cat shelter I adopted from (in the U.S.) only adopts to those they see fit. They regularly refuse people who don't meet certain requirements. (I.e. renters must supply landlord's contact information to verify that cats are accepted, etc) I was there when an angry customer came in yelling about how her S.O. was refused a kitten days before because she only wanted to adopt one. The policy is kittens are only to be adopted in pairs if in a home that has no other cats. (It's believed they feel more secure in pairs) The person was sent away and the kittens, which are easily adoptable, were sold to someone else who would take both. They also rigorously check references, ask about your previous cat-caring experience and provide a contract for you upon adoption stating that you will not declaw or allow your cat to live outdoors. Obviously they're a lot more stringent then some other cat shelters but still I didn't get the impression they were breaking the law by refusing to sell a particular animal. I'll have to check in on that. I'm curious now. =================================== If they're a PRIVATE concern they may be within their legal rights to give or not give the animals to anyone who comes in the door. The regular animals shelters here in TN don't even ask if you have the money to buy a bag of cat food. :-( -- Koi-Lo.... frugal ponding since 1995... My Pond & Aquarium Pages: http://bellsouthpwp.net/s/h/shastadaisy ~~~ }((((o ~~~ }{{{{o ~~~ }(((((o |
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Koi-lo wrote:
"Gill Passman" wrote in message news:438d9168$0$20534I'm not saying that The places I go refuse to sell a tank and fish on the same day.. # At large chain pet stores? Here in TN they seldom ask you anything. The privately owned stores will often have the time to talk to each customer. Yep, even Pets at Home (which I think is the same company as PetSmart) in the UK will refuse to sell a tank and fish on the same day...most of the shops around here where I live are part of a chain/franchise which is a member of an association called OATA - they are regularily checked not only by their own Head Office but also OATA I believe....if they sell without the appropriate advice they would pretty much soon be an ex-franchise (was in one store while they were being inspected - sometimes it is spot checks). The footfall through these places is quite large and I've had to wait almost an hour to get served some days...even when busy they will take the time to give customers advice. I now go during the week when they are quiet...Most of their staff are trained and qualified in various aspects of fish husbandry, disease etc. - even the lads/girls just doing it as a weekend job. A lot of them are also fish keepers... .when you actually go to get your first you get questioned to determine your level of knowledge and then advise is given as appropriate - same everywhere I've been. When I bought my two current bettas (at a place where I wasn't known) I got questioned quite closely on the planned accommodation - I guess he was worried I might put two males in the same tank.... # With bettas they will sometimes tell you this here as well. Most employees simply bag them up and hand them to you. I have known people to be refused fish and they still go back to the same place - they go away and take the advice they have been given to ensure that the best provision is made for their pets. One place I go refuses to sell Clown Loaches to anyone with less than a 30 gall tank - please let's not go get into a Clown Loach tank size discussion :-) . Sure anyone can lie but in reality very few people do. Cat and Dog Rescue Homes in the UK not only interrogate you as to how you are going to care for your pet, some will actually insist on a home visit to make sure that you have adequate care provisions and refuse to allow you a dog or a cat if you don't. # This should be the LAW in every country. The abuse and neglect of dogs here in the USA is sickening. With almost every animal that I buy/acquire I have been asked about how I'm going to care for it....as I think I've already said, Livestock/pets are heavily regulated here and there are a lot of prosecutions for people not providing adequate care for their pets.... # There is little regulation where I live but people are starting to be prosecuted for abusing pets and livestock. The UK has always been more progressive where animals are concerned than the US. The British in general are very active when it comes to animal welfare. It is because of this that we now have the regulations in place to ensure as far as is humanely possible that animals are treated well. Of course there are times when this does not happen....hence the prosecutions. I would say all of the animal welfare groups are charities employing volunteers but they are backed by legislation and the courts - all pet and fish shops have to be licenced by the local authority who take complaints seriously and have the power to act. Maybe it's time you all started shouting about it as well :-) Gill |
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