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18 months and NO tank maintenance!
Folks:
FWIW, just went through a separation and divorce and left the home w/o the 55g FOWLR DSB (life sucks sometimes-no not about the divorce either). Got the tank back after 18 months and it was a major mess: NEVER a water change, NEVER a cleaning NO maintenance... and the ex said feeding of the fish was intermittent took 3 hours to clean the tank at the new location! YET... virtually everything SURVIVED! 1-Hippo, 1-yellow tang, Brittle Star, Carpet Anemone, 2 Chromis and most ;) of the turbos... So (believe me I'm not trying to start a war here), and I do know that hobbies range from dabbling to extreme serious investments of time and money BUT... Do we 'overmanage' or 'over analyze' aquariums? G (REMORA skimmer, Ehiem 2227, Fluval 404, coralife 15W UV, JBJ 220W PC and 2 power heads) |
well i think you lucked out i croaked fish by doing too much of a water change and cleaning the filter at the same time.... the fish guy said in so many words "you knucklehead, you got rid of the good bacteria" only change 1/2 the water, and dont do the filter at the same time live and learn -- whodat ------------------------------------------------------------------------ whodat's Profile: http://www.homeplot.com/member.php?userid=35 View this thread: http://www.homeplot.com/showthread.php?t=58191 |
"g" wrote in message . ..
So (believe me I'm not trying to start a war here), and I do know that hobbies range from dabbling to extreme serious investments of time and money BUT... Do we 'overmanage' or 'over analyze' aquariums? Fish only tanks are little different story from reef tanks. Try doing the same with a real *reef tank* and you will get the answer. |
Well, if feeding wasn't overdone, it is indeed possible to keep the
livestock alive in those conditions. I'm assuming your ex continued to top off the tank to avoid evaporation, and cleaned the skimmer occasionally in that 18 month period. I bet water parameters are interesting, and the bulbs need replacing, as well as pumps needing so real cleaning. Marc g wrote: Folks: FWIW, just went through a separation and divorce and left the home w/o the 55g FOWLR DSB (life sucks sometimes-no not about the divorce either). Got the tank back after 18 months and it was a major mess: NEVER a water change, NEVER a cleaning NO maintenance... and the ex said feeding of the fish was intermittent took 3 hours to clean the tank at the new location! YET... virtually everything SURVIVED! 1-Hippo, 1-yellow tang, Brittle Star, Carpet Anemone, 2 Chromis and most ;) of the turbos... So (believe me I'm not trying to start a war here), and I do know that hobbies range from dabbling to extreme serious investments of time and money BUT... Do we 'overmanage' or 'over analyze' aquariums? G (REMORA skimmer, Ehiem 2227, Fluval 404, coralife 15W UV, JBJ 220W PC and 2 power heads) -- Personal Page: http://www.sparklingfloorservice.com/oanda/index.html Business Page: http://www.sparklingfloorservice.com Marine Hobbyist: http://www.melevsreef.com |
I should elaborate...
she did top off water (with tap) Nothing else done The tank glass was brown.(all sides, could barely see the inside) Amazing what they (fish) can take... But then again: mother nature surprises us in many ways :) G PS love your website! "Marc Levenson" wrote in message t... Well, if feeding wasn't overdone, it is indeed possible to keep the livestock alive in those conditions. I'm assuming your ex continued to top off the tank to avoid evaporation, and cleaned the skimmer occasionally in that 18 month period. I bet water parameters are interesting, and the bulbs need replacing, as well as pumps needing so real cleaning. Marc g wrote: Folks: FWIW, just went through a separation and divorce and left the home w/o the 55g FOWLR DSB (life sucks sometimes-no not about the divorce either). Got the tank back after 18 months and it was a major mess: NEVER a water change, NEVER a cleaning NO maintenance... and the ex said feeding of the fish was intermittent took 3 hours to clean the tank at the new location! YET... virtually everything SURVIVED! 1-Hippo, 1-yellow tang, Brittle Star, Carpet Anemone, 2 Chromis and most ;) of the turbos... So (believe me I'm not trying to start a war here), and I do know that hobbies range from dabbling to extreme serious investments of time and money BUT... Do we 'overmanage' or 'over analyze' aquariums? G (REMORA skimmer, Ehiem 2227, Fluval 404, coralife 15W UV, JBJ 220W PC and 2 power heads) -- Personal Page: http://www.sparklingfloorservice.com/oanda/index.html Business Page: http://www.sparklingfloorservice.com Marine Hobbyist: http://www.melevsreef.com |
Thank you G. :)
Marc g wrote: G PS love your website! -- Personal Page: http://www.sparklingfloorservice.com/oanda/index.html Business Page: http://www.sparklingfloorservice.com Marine Hobbyist: http://www.melevsreef.com |
Hello, this is my first time here...
What you experienced is not rare to me. I designed a filter that does just what many think is luck. Believe me, once you are able to neutralize nitrates and stabilize another compound (kept secret) you barely have need for maintenance. Yes, all that maintenance is unnecessary and was designed for you to buy stuff that stabilizes one thing but breaks the balance of a second, a third, and so on. Is a vicious cycle I was able to break in my aquarium. I had been running my aquarium with 7+ species with not even one water change. It works perfect and as soon as I patent the system, I will be sharing it! Imagine you were God and someone told you to change 25% of the ocean's water every 4 days. lol No, nature has its one solutions! jrs "g" wrote in message . .. Folks: FWIW, just went through a separation and divorce and left the home w/o the 55g FOWLR DSB (life sucks sometimes-no not about the divorce either). Got the tank back after 18 months and it was a major mess: NEVER a water change, NEVER a cleaning NO maintenance... and the ex said feeding of the fish was intermittent took 3 hours to clean the tank at the new location! YET... virtually everything SURVIVED! 1-Hippo, 1-yellow tang, Brittle Star, Carpet Anemone, 2 Chromis and most ;) of the turbos... So (believe me I'm not trying to start a war here), and I do know that hobbies range from dabbling to extreme serious investments of time and money BUT... Do we 'overmanage' or 'over analyze' aquariums? G (REMORA skimmer, Ehiem 2227, Fluval 404, coralife 15W UV, JBJ 220W PC and 2 power heads) |
"Jaime R-S" wrote in message ...
Hello, this is my first time here... What you experienced is not rare to me. I designed a filter that does just what many think is luck. Believe me, once you are able to neutralize nitrates and stabilize another compound (kept secret) you barely have need for maintenance. Yes, all that maintenance is unnecessary and was designed for you to buy stuff that stabilizes one thing but breaks the balance of a second, a third, and so on. Is a vicious cycle I was able to break in my aquarium. I had been running my aquarium with 7+ species with not even one water change. It works perfect and as soon as I patent the system, I will be sharing it! Imagine you were God and someone told you to change 25% of the ocean's water every 4 days. lol No, nature has its one solutions! You will not get a patent on something which Nature has been doing for milions of years. Patent is only for new inventions ;-) Also, you have only one fish tank with 7 species? For how long ? What kind of "species" ? Please tell me more about your tank :-) BTW - it is very hard to even compare fish concentration levels in the ocean to these in an average fish tank... do you agree ? |
Jaime R-S wrote:
Imagine you were God and someone told you to change 25% of the ocean's water every 4 days. lol I'd say, "no problem." Lessee here, we can have the sun evaporate some water, have the wind carry the vapor somewhere else, a little temperature change here to get rain, let things percolate on down to the rivers. Those will wind up at the sea, if those pesky little humans let 'em (wish I'd never invented them). George Patterson Drink is the curse of the land. It makes you quarrel with your neighbor. It makes you shoot at your landlord. And it makes you miss him. |
Do you really think I am going to tell you?
lol OK, sit down and relax! this coastal marine biologist has news for you... jrs "Pszemol" wrote in message ... "Jaime R-S" wrote in message ... Hello, this is my first time here... What you experienced is not rare to me. I designed a filter that does just what many think is luck. Believe me, once you are able to neutralize nitrates and stabilize another compound (kept secret) you barely have need for maintenance. Yes, all that maintenance is unnecessary and was designed for you to buy stuff that stabilizes one thing but breaks the balance of a second, a third, and so on. Is a vicious cycle I was able to break in my aquarium. I had been running my aquarium with 7+ species with not even one water change. It works perfect and as soon as I patent the system, I will be sharing it! Imagine you were God and someone told you to change 25% of the ocean's water every 4 days. lol No, nature has its one solutions! You will not get a patent on something which Nature has been doing for milions of years. Patent is only for new inventions ;-) Also, you have only one fish tank with 7 species? For how long ? What kind of "species" ? Please tell me more about your tank :-) BTW - it is very hard to even compare fish concentration levels in the ocean to these in an average fish tank... do you agree ? |
lol
"George Patterson" wrote in message news:RYH0f.456$ar6.93@trndny01... Jaime R-S wrote: Imagine you were God and someone told you to change 25% of the ocean's water every 4 days. lol I'd say, "no problem." Lessee here, we can have the sun evaporate some water, have the wind carry the vapor somewhere else, a little temperature change here to get rain, let things percolate on down to the rivers. Those will wind up at the sea, if those pesky little humans let 'em (wish I'd never invented them). George Patterson Drink is the curse of the land. It makes you quarrel with your neighbor. It makes you shoot at your landlord. And it makes you miss him. |
"Jaime R-S" wrote in message ...
Do you really think I am going to tell you? lol OK, sit down and relax! this coastal marine biologist has news for you... I can understand you make a secret out of the maintenance or the "patent" filter, but you can at least say how long and what fish do you keep succesfully in this tank... I just want to get an idea how big is the tank, how well your fish are growing (no growth stunned?) and how long you have it. Do not want to steal your secrets about the filter :-) Of course I try to believe in what you say is not a joke... |
Many questions which I can't answer yet
I mentioned 7 species, never how many individuals of each species. The tank is not big but, since is a prototype I can only compare it to similar tanks running on conventional maintenance. I am not saying the size. Now, and I can only ask for your trust, there is many people like me trying to develop a "MAINTENANCE FREE" SALT WATER AQUARIUM. It can be done and so far is working. On due time, the idea is going to come out and yes, it can be patented like a light bulb was patented eventhough there was a sun in nature. The idea was taken from nature same as my idea which is very clever and, why not, simple... jrs "Pszemol" wrote in message ... "Jaime R-S" wrote in message ... Do you really think I am going to tell you? lol OK, sit down and relax! this coastal marine biologist has news for you... I can understand you make a secret out of the maintenance or the "patent" filter, but you can at least say how long and what fish do you keep succesfully in this tank... I just want to get an idea how big is the tank, how well your fish are growing (no growth stunned?) and how long you have it. Do not want to steal your secrets about the filter :-) Of course I try to believe in what you say is not a joke... |
You are very wrong thinking that Sun and a light bulb work
in simillar fashion :-) This example tells me something important about you... but I am going to keep it for myself :-) Tell me one thing - what was the reason for you to post here your message about "some tank", "somewhere out there", with "some fish" running without water change for "some time" ? :-)) That kind of info is worthless. My tank is also running without a water change for "some time" and I do not even have a special secret filter worth patenting :-)) Also, I have only 4 species of fish, but I am not telling how many individuals of each species :-)) Experienced aquarist would easily guess that most species need to be kept in signles in an average tank but there are exeptions :-) I think it will be something about 2 weeks now without even single water change!!! :-))) How impressive! So - summing up, you are telling here NOTHING worth considering because it is quite normal for any tank to work without water change for "some time" with "some fish" in it... :-) Good luck for you in the patent office! :-)))) |
"Wayne Sallee" wrote in message ink.net...
Yea this "new idea to be pattened" is not worth anything that I can see. I say so what. I have a 120 gallon salt water tank that has not had a water change since the day it was set up about 4 years ago, and no maintenance either. But so what That's no feat. Maybe you will want to share some details about your tank ? Do you have fish in there ? What kind ? How big they grow ? |
hehe it's just a tank with live rock, live sand, a pair of
clarkys, and a convict worm goby. A mag 5 haning in there to move the water, and some cheap lights over it. I set it up to hold anything that I no longer wanted in my reef tank, with the idea that it could be added back to the reef, if I decided to later. I feed the tank once in a blue moon when ever I feal like it. Wayne Sallee Pszemol wrote: "Wayne Sallee" wrote in message ink.net... Yea this "new idea to be pattened" is not worth anything that I can see. I say so what. I have a 120 gallon salt water tank that has not had a water change since the day it was set up about 4 years ago, and no maintenance either. But so what That's no feat. Maybe you will want to share some details about your tank ? Do you have fish in there ? What kind ? How big they grow ? |
You know what?
You ask too much. Methink you have to relax, I just read about something that happened to a person here and commented on it because is related to what I am working on. YOU WERE NEVER MY INTEREST, nor will be, lol. Is that too hard for you to understand? First, you post with a pseudonym, second you want to know more than what you can handle... Relax son, you can't handle much! jrs "Pszemol" wrote in message ... You are very wrong thinking that Sun and a light bulb work in simillar fashion :-) This example tells me something important about you... but I am going to keep it for myself :-) Tell me one thing - what was the reason for you to post here your message about "some tank", "somewhere out there", with "some fish" running without water change for "some time" ? :-)) That kind of info is worthless. My tank is also running without a water change for "some time" and I do not even have a special secret filter worth patenting :-)) Also, I have only 4 species of fish, but I am not telling how many individuals of each species :-)) Experienced aquarist would easily guess that most species need to be kept in signles in an average tank but there are exeptions :-) I think it will be something about 2 weeks now without even single water change!!! :-))) How impressive! So - summing up, you are telling here NOTHING worth considering because it is quite normal for any tank to work without water change for "some time" with "some fish" in it... :-) Good luck for you in the patent office! :-)))) |
lol
"Wayne Sallee" wrote in message ink.net... hehe it's just a tank with live rock, live sand, a pair of clarkys, and a convict worm goby. A mag 5 haning in there to move the water, and some cheap lights over it. I set it up to hold anything that I no longer wanted in my reef tank, with the idea that it could be added back to the reef, if I decided to later. I feed the tank once in a blue moon when ever I feal like it. Wayne Sallee Pszemol wrote: "Wayne Sallee" wrote in message ink.net... Yea this "new idea to be pattened" is not worth anything that I can see. I say so what. I have a 120 gallon salt water tank that has not had a water change since the day it was set up about 4 years ago, and no maintenance either. But so what That's no feat. Maybe you will want to share some details about your tank ? Do you have fish in there ? What kind ? How big they grow ? |
"Jaime R-S" wrote in message ...
You ask too much. Methink you have to relax, I just read about something that happened to a person here and commented on it because is related to what I am working on. YOU WERE NEVER MY INTEREST, nor will be, lol. Is that too hard for you to understand? Its a pity you do not get what a discussion forum or newsgroup is... Try to understand I wanted to open you eyes on the fact that your statements were worthless. You do with this gift whatever you want :-) First, you post with a pseudonym, What pseudonym ? This is my name... Is this a problem for you, son ? second you want to know more than what you can handle... Relax son, you can't handle much! Don't you worry about how much I can handle... The true problem is you have nothing to say :-) And this is why your emotional response is here... |
"Pszemol" wrote in
: "Jaime R-S" wrote in message ... You ask too much. Methink you have to relax, I just read about something that happened to a person here and commented on it because is related to what I am working on. YOU WERE NEVER MY INTEREST, nor will be, lol. Is that too hard for you to understand? Its a pity you do not get what a discussion forum or newsgroup is... Try to understand I wanted to open you eyes on the fact that your statements were worthless. You do with this gift whatever you want :-) First, you post with a pseudonym, What pseudonym ? This is my name... Is this a problem for you, son ? second you want to know more than what you can handle... Relax son, you can't handle much! Don't you worry about how much I can handle... The true problem is you have nothing to say :-) And this is why your emotional response is here... Pszemol, you're wasting your time on this troll. Repeat after me: plonk |
Good lord!
I commented on someone's experience and now I get insulted by two (if not the same) different persons I don't even know. Neither of both I was talking to. Well my friend, now that you addressed me, lol, let me tell you that the nitrites problem had been solved and my aquarium is running at 0.15mg/L of NO2 WITHOUT WATER CHANGE for more than a month. Other readings to be concerned are NH3 = 0.3 mg/L CaCO3 = 400 mg/L NO3 = 20 mg/L PH = 8.3 KH = 110 all at a 78 F/ 1.024 S.G. I had a little setback on nitrites but I figured out how to solve it. I already said this is a prototype and the size and other specs I keep to myself. But, I have to say that the aquarium had been checked by possible buyers and I already have my investment paid. Don't fool yourself, it is possible to have an inexpensive salt water aquarium without the extraordinary cost of today's maintenance. You guys are just ****ed because someone came up with an idea you CAN'T UNDERSTAND. Next time you go to buy salr or sal****er, lol, think of me... jrs "Mark Cooper" wrote in message .. . "Pszemol" wrote in : "Jaime R-S" wrote in message ... You ask too much. Methink you have to relax, I just read about something that happened to a person here and commented on it because is related to what I am working on. YOU WERE NEVER MY INTEREST, nor will be, lol. Is that too hard for you to understand? Its a pity you do not get what a discussion forum or newsgroup is... Try to understand I wanted to open you eyes on the fact that your statements were worthless. You do with this gift whatever you want :-) First, you post with a pseudonym, What pseudonym ? This is my name... Is this a problem for you, son ? second you want to know more than what you can handle... Relax son, you can't handle much! Don't you worry about how much I can handle... The true problem is you have nothing to say :-) And this is why your emotional response is here... Pszemol, you're wasting your time on this troll. Repeat after me: plonk |
"Jaime R-S" wrote in message ...
Good lord! I commented on someone's experience and now I get insulted by two (if not the same) different persons I don't even know. Neither of both I was talking to. Remember: you are writing to the whole newsgroup. Whole group of people reading you and have equal right to respond. This is the whole idea of a newsgroup. If you were ment to send a private message to a particular group member, send e-mail only to him, not to the whole newsgroup or dont be surprised that someone has a comment to your comment :-)) Well my friend, now that you addressed me, lol, let me tell you that the nitrites problem had been solved and my aquarium is running at 0.15mg/L of NO2 WITHOUT WATER CHANGE for more than a month. WOW... Whole month without a water change ? That is impressive! LOL :-))))) BTW - that is quite sad you still detect nitrites after a month... Other readings to be concerned are NH3 = 0.3 mg/L CaCO3 = 400 mg/L NO3 = 20 mg/L PH = 8.3 KH = 110 all at a 78 F/ 1.024 S.G. I had a little setback on nitrites but I figured out how to solve it. Yeah... wait for the cycle to end ? :-) I already said this is a prototype and the size and other specs I keep to myself. You said enough to make me laugh :-) But, I have to say that the aquarium had been checked by possible buyers and I already have my investment paid. :-))) Don't fool yourself, it is possible to have an inexpensive salt water aquarium without the extraordinary cost of today's maintenance. You guys are just ****ed because someone came up with an idea you CAN'T UNDERSTAND. Next time you go to buy salr or sal****er, lol, think of me... My friend, you do not understand the nitrogen cycle in a fish tank... You never need to change water because of ammonia or nitrites :-) These are neutralized with biological filtration, and there is something seriously wrong with your tank if ammonia and nitrites are still detectable after a month of cycling with live rock and sand... BTW - one month without water change is NOTHING SPECIAL OR UNUSUAL. It is even recomended that during fish tank cycling you do not change water for a month or two, to not disturb the cycle... But cycling with live rock is usually flat if you use live rock cured already... How do you feel re-inventing the wheel ? :-))) |
In a well setup tank the only reason to do a water change is to replace
trace elements, i usually go months without a water change nitrate/nitrite/ammonia are 0... Pszemol wrote: "Jaime R-S" wrote in message ... Good lord! I commented on someone's experience and now I get insulted by two (if not the same) different persons I don't even know. Neither of both I was talking to. Remember: you are writing to the whole newsgroup. Whole group of people reading you and have equal right to respond. This is the whole idea of a newsgroup. If you were ment to send a private message to a particular group member, send e-mail only to him, not to the whole newsgroup or dont be surprised that someone has a comment to your comment :-)) Well my friend, now that you addressed me, lol, let me tell you that the nitrites problem had been solved and my aquarium is running at 0.15mg/L of NO2 WITHOUT WATER CHANGE for more than a month. WOW... Whole month without a water change ? That is impressive! LOL :-))))) BTW - that is quite sad you still detect nitrites after a month... Other readings to be concerned are NH3 = 0.3 mg/L CaCO3 = 400 mg/L NO3 = 20 mg/L PH = 8.3 KH = 110 all at a 78 F/ 1.024 S.G. I had a little setback on nitrites but I figured out how to solve it. Yeah... wait for the cycle to end ? :-) I already said this is a prototype and the size and other specs I keep to myself. You said enough to make me laugh :-) But, I have to say that the aquarium had been checked by possible buyers and I already have my investment paid. :-))) Don't fool yourself, it is possible to have an inexpensive salt water aquarium without the extraordinary cost of today's maintenance. You guys are just ****ed because someone came up with an idea you CAN'T UNDERSTAND. Next time you go to buy salr or sal****er, lol, think of me... My friend, you do not understand the nitrogen cycle in a fish tank... You never need to change water because of ammonia or nitrites :-) These are neutralized with biological filtration, and there is something seriously wrong with your tank if ammonia and nitrites are still detectable after a month of cycling with live rock and sand... BTW - one month without water change is NOTHING SPECIAL OR UNUSUAL. It is even recomended that during fish tank cycling you do not change water for a month or two, to not disturb the cycle... But cycling with live rock is usually flat if you use live rock cured already... How do you feel re-inventing the wheel ? :-))) |
"Chris" wrote in message ...
In a well setup tank the only reason to do a water change is to replace trace elements, i usually go months without a water change nitrate/nitrite/ammonia are 0... And this is a norm, nothing unusuall. Of course, all these are not actual 0, they are just not detectable with aquarium grade color drop tests. |
That is good to know
The only difference is that I am getting those numbers on an innexpensive system. The systems that I have seen that have the same diversity of fish, size and light cost 3X more. You see, is not that I am doing something new... Is that my system is doing the same thing for much less! BTW, is not just a month, the month started after the nitrogen cycle was established. Again, it is too much to tell but little motivation. Is my system going to fail in a few more weeks? probably! I already have plans and counterplans to overcome every single setback possible. My first maintenance only cost me $20! and will only be necessary every month. Is there going to be water changes? I hope not but if it comes to it, I already have an alternate plan. You see, I am not starting now with this. I had been working in different systems since my college years and after 10 years putting papers together, I came out with something that was supposed to be for a wetland's sewage treatment system. Well, just keep asking and commenting but keep the insults to yourselves Jaime "Chris" wrote in message ... In a well setup tank the only reason to do a water change is to replace trace elements, i usually go months without a water change nitrate/nitrite/ammonia are 0... Pszemol wrote: "Jaime R-S" wrote in message ... Good lord! I commented on someone's experience and now I get insulted by two (if not the same) different persons I don't even know. Neither of both I was talking to. Remember: you are writing to the whole newsgroup. Whole group of people reading you and have equal right to respond. This is the whole idea of a newsgroup. If you were ment to send a private message to a particular group member, send e-mail only to him, not to the whole newsgroup or dont be surprised that someone has a comment to your comment :-)) Well my friend, now that you addressed me, lol, let me tell you that the nitrites problem had been solved and my aquarium is running at 0.15mg/L of NO2 WITHOUT WATER CHANGE for more than a month. WOW... Whole month without a water change ? That is impressive! LOL :-))))) BTW - that is quite sad you still detect nitrites after a month... Other readings to be concerned are NH3 = 0.3 mg/L CaCO3 = 400 mg/L NO3 = 20 mg/L PH = 8.3 KH = 110 all at a 78 F/ 1.024 S.G. I had a little setback on nitrites but I figured out how to solve it. Yeah... wait for the cycle to end ? :-) I already said this is a prototype and the size and other specs I keep to myself. You said enough to make me laugh :-) But, I have to say that the aquarium had been checked by possible buyers and I already have my investment paid. :-))) Don't fool yourself, it is possible to have an inexpensive salt water aquarium without the extraordinary cost of today's maintenance. You guys are just ****ed because someone came up with an idea you CAN'T UNDERSTAND. Next time you go to buy salr or sal****er, lol, think of me... My friend, you do not understand the nitrogen cycle in a fish tank... You never need to change water because of ammonia or nitrites :-) These are neutralized with biological filtration, and there is something seriously wrong with your tank if ammonia and nitrites are still detectable after a month of cycling with live rock and sand... BTW - one month without water change is NOTHING SPECIAL OR UNUSUAL. It is even recomended that during fish tank cycling you do not change water for a month or two, to not disturb the cycle... But cycling with live rock is usually flat if you use live rock cured already... How do you feel re-inventing the wheel ? :-))) |
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"Wayne Sallee" wrote in message link.net...
LOL this is just tooo funny :-) For the long time I was sure he must be joking... Now, sadly, I discovered he was serious... |
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