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Lighting choices ?
Hello,
I am setting up a 180 tank with plans to do soft corals - mushrooms, leathers, etc., maybe xenia. The tank size is 72"x24"x24". I am tring to pick the right lighting system and am considering the following - Coralife Aqualight Pro - 3 MH 175watt and 4 PC atinics or Outer Orbit - 3 MH175 watt and 4 PC 96W atinics or Maristar with 2 or 3 175w MHI and 4 39w T-5 Any comments? recommendations? suggestions are welcome and appreciated. H |
Lighting choices ?
I have a 180 g and went with the coralife Pro. Fans are a little noisey but
I don't know what to compare them with. Other then that I think they are great, Mine are the 250 watt MH. But other then that its identical. Bill "hhhh" wrote in message . .. Hello, I am setting up a 180 tank with plans to do soft corals - mushrooms, leathers, etc., maybe xenia. The tank size is 72"x24"x24". I am tring to pick the right lighting system and am considering the following - Coralife Aqualight Pro - 3 MH 175watt and 4 PC atinics or Outer Orbit - 3 MH175 watt and 4 PC 96W atinics or Maristar with 2 or 3 175w MHI and 4 39w T-5 Any comments? recommendations? suggestions are welcome and appreciated. H |
Lighting choices ?
Have you done the math for the watts per gallon?
Wayne Sallee Wayne's Pets hhhh wrote on 7/29/2006 11:32 PM: Hello, I am setting up a 180 tank with plans to do soft corals - mushrooms, leathers, etc., maybe xenia. The tank size is 72"x24"x24". I am tring to pick the right lighting system and am considering the following - Coralife Aqualight Pro - 3 MH 175watt and 4 PC atinics or Outer Orbit - 3 MH175 watt and 4 PC 96W atinics or Maristar with 2 or 3 175w MHI and 4 39w T-5 Any comments? recommendations? suggestions are welcome and appreciated. H |
Lighting choices ?
Wayne,
As I see it, it should be about 4 watts per gallon I am not sure what you are asking? "Wayne Sallee" wrote in message ... Have you done the math for the watts per gallon? Wayne Sallee Wayne's Pets hhhh wrote on 7/29/2006 11:32 PM: Hello, I am setting up a 180 tank with plans to do soft corals - mushrooms, leathers, etc., maybe xenia. The tank size is 72"x24"x24". I am tring to pick the right lighting system and am considering the following - Coralife Aqualight Pro - 3 MH 175watt and 4 PC atinics or Outer Orbit - 3 MH175 watt and 4 PC 96W atinics or Maristar with 2 or 3 175w MHI and 4 39w T-5 Any comments? recommendations? suggestions are welcome and appreciated. H |
Lighting choices ?
Wayne Sallee wrote:
So many people purchase lights without figuring out the watts per gallon. 4 watts per gallon will be fine for the soft corals that you want to keep. Is this what some of the vendors call "medium light"? George Patterson Coffee is only a way of stealing time that should by rights belong to your slightly older self. |
Lighting choices ?
I've never heard of a vendor calling a lighting system as
"medium light", it would depend on what aquarium it was put on. I guess you are referring to light requirement ratings for corals. If so, then yea it would be. I get so many customers buying a coral ask "should I put this coral at the top, or down low", and I just want to scream "If you would just buy good lighting, you would not have to ask such silly questions!". But I just ask "how many watts of light do you have?", and they usually don't even know. Wayne Sallee Wayne's Pets George Patterson wrote on 8/3/2006 11:55 AM: Wayne Sallee wrote: So many people purchase lights without figuring out the watts per gallon. 4 watts per gallon will be fine for the soft corals that you want to keep. Is this what some of the vendors call "medium light"? George Patterson Coffee is only a way of stealing time that should by rights belong to your slightly older self. |
Lighting choices ?
Wayne Sallee wrote:
So many people purchase lights without figuring out the watts per gallon. I've been thinking about this, and it doesn't seem right. Different types of lighting have different efficiency characteristics. The usual standard for measurement of light is lumens. Spectrum is, of course, also important in this field, but I think that lumens would be the most important figure for measuring intensity. Watts per gallon would only work when comparing two fixtures of the same type; for example, two fluorescent fixtures. George Patterson Coffee is only a way of stealing time that should by rights belong to your slightly older self. |
Lighting choices ?
No lumens is not as good as you think it is. Lumens is the
measure of visible light as your eyes see it. And your eyes see the yellow spectrum better than any other spectrum. There's a lot of different qualities of light to look at. Naturally one can't put cheesy incandescent lights over their tank, and say they have enough watts per gallon, but watts per gallon of quality lighting is really the best way that is easily figured for judging how much light you have. Wayne Sallee Wayne's Pets George Patterson wrote on 8/3/2006 10:49 PM: Wayne Sallee wrote: So many people purchase lights without figuring out the watts per gallon. I've been thinking about this, and it doesn't seem right. Different types of lighting have different efficiency characteristics. The usual standard for measurement of light is lumens. Spectrum is, of course, also important in this field, but I think that lumens would be the most important figure for measuring intensity. Watts per gallon would only work when comparing two fixtures of the same type; for example, two fluorescent fixtures. George Patterson Coffee is only a way of stealing time that should by rights belong to your slightly older self. |
Lighting choices ?
George Patterson wrote:
Wayne Sallee wrote: So many people purchase lights without figuring out the watts per gallon. I've been thinking about this, and it doesn't seem right. Different types of lighting have different efficiency characteristics. The usual standard for measurement of light is lumens. Spectrum is, of course, also important in this field, but I think that lumens would be the most important figure for measuring intensity. Watts per gallon would only work when comparing two fixtures of the same type; for example, two fluorescent fixtures. George Patterson Coffee is only a way of stealing time that should by rights belong to your slightly older self. George, You are correct. Watts per gallon are just about meaningless, since it does not cover the depth of the tank, nor the light source. But with no other info it can give you some information. With lights another important thing is the reflector. This is why a 4 bulb 54 watt T5 setup will put out as much or more light than a 4 bulb 110 watt VHO light setup. The single bulb reflectors for t5 bulbs are much better than what is normally used on t12 vho bulbs. It is also why a 250 watt HQI metal halide can produce more usuable light than a 400 watt single ended bulb. On Lumens. To use they don't mean much since red light as many lumens ase blue light and the red does not contribute to photosynthisis. For a good measurment you need to find out the PAR of the lights. Which is very hard to find. You will find that there are some hobbiest that are publishing PAR data for some light, but most of them are on Metal Halide light. To be honest any time I see somebody use the watts per gallon measure ment I cringe. 250 watts over a 65 gallon hex tank is a lot less usuable light than 250 watts over a normal 65 gallon 4 foot tank since everything is closer to the lights on the 4 foot 65 gallon tank than the 65 gallon hex. Kim Gross www.jensalt.com |
Lighting choices ?
kim gross wrote:
To be honest any time I see somebody use the watts per gallon measure ment I cringe. 250 watts over a 65 gallon hex tank is a lot less usuable light than 250 watts over a normal 65 gallon 4 foot tank since everything is closer to the lights on the 4 foot 65 gallon tank than the 65 gallon hex. Good info. Is there a place I can find more info on what to use? I can, of course, provide measurements for my tank. George Patterson Coffee is only a way of stealing time that should by rights belong to your slightly older self. |
Lighting choices ?
George Patterson wrote:
kim gross wrote: To be honest any time I see somebody use the watts per gallon measure ment I cringe. 250 watts over a 65 gallon hex tank is a lot less usuable light than 250 watts over a normal 65 gallon 4 foot tank since everything is closer to the lights on the 4 foot 65 gallon tank than the 65 gallon hex. Good info. Is there a place I can find more info on what to use? I can, of course, provide measurements for my tank. George Patterson Coffee is only a way of stealing time that should by rights belong to your slightly older self. Actually there is not a good place to find more info. you can find Par info on metal halide bulbs at http://www.reeflightinginfo.arvixe.com/ But we don't have lots of par readings inside of tanks to compair nor do we have the par requirements of the different corals. Kim |
Lighting choices ?
kim gross wrote on 8/11/2006 7:41 PM:
To be honest any time I see somebody use the watts per gallon measure ment I cringe. 250 watts over a 65 gallon hex tank is a lot less usuable light than 250 watts over a normal 65 gallon 4 foot tank since everything is closer to the lights on the 4 foot 65 gallon tank than the 65 gallon hex. Kim Gross www.jensalt.com Everything is closer???? You need to rethink that one. In the winter here in the US, we are closer to the sun than in the summer, but does that make crops grow faster? Wayne Sallee Wayne's Pets |
Lighting choices ?
Wayne Sallee wrote:
kim gross wrote on 8/11/2006 7:41 PM: To be honest any time I see somebody use the watts per gallon measure ment I cringe. 250 watts over a 65 gallon hex tank is a lot less usuable light than 250 watts over a normal 65 gallon 4 foot tank since everything is closer to the lights on the 4 foot 65 gallon tank than the 65 gallon hex. Kim Gross www.jensalt.com Everything is closer???? You need to rethink that one. In the winter here in the US, we are closer to the sun than in the summer, but does that make crops grow faster? Wayne Sallee Wayne's Pets Wayne, Yes is a 16 inch tall tank the average distance from the light bulb is much closer than than a 20 inch tall tank. The difference in distance is very important, with the earth the difference in distance is very very small, do the math. When it comes to our aquariums the distance from the bulb effects the amount of usuable light lot, in the wild the distance from the sun is basicly the same so the distance does not matter. With the sun other items that will attenuate the light effect the light output more than just the distance, with our aquariums the distance from the bulbs is very very important, sometimes more so than other attenuating items. Kim |
Lighting choices ?
All-Glass, Perfecto, and Oceanic Brand 65 gallon aquariums
are 36 inches long rather than 48, And none of those manufactures make a 65 gall on hex. If a 65 gallon tank was 48 inches long, then the with would be 12.5 inches. I'll use your 48 inches in the following example, and use a 60 gallon hex. A 60 gallon hex has a length of 27 inches. If you put 250 watts over 27 inches, you would have 9.26 watts of light per inch. If you put 250 watts over 48 inches, you would have 5.21 watts of light per inch. A 60 gallon hex has a depth of 29 inches A 65 gallon tank has a depth of 25 inches Not much difference in the depth, but a lot of differences in watts of light per inch of length. If I were lighting a 60 gallon hex tank, I would light it with a single 400 watt MH bulb. This would be the same as lighting a 120 gallon tank with two 400 watt MH bulbs. Wayne Sallee Wayne's Pets kim gross wrote on 8/12/2006 7:36 PM: Wayne Sallee wrote: kim gross wrote on 8/11/2006 7:41 PM: To be honest any time I see somebody use the watts per gallon measure ment I cringe. 250 watts over a 65 gallon hex tank is a lot less usuable light than 250 watts over a normal 65 gallon 4 foot tank since everything is closer to the lights on the 4 foot 65 gallon tank than the 65 gallon hex. Kim Gross www.jensalt.com Everything is closer???? You need to rethink that one. In the winter here in the US, we are closer to the sun than in the summer, but does that make crops grow faster? Wayne Sallee Wayne's Pets Wayne, Yes is a 16 inch tall tank the average distance from the light bulb is much closer than than a 20 inch tall tank. The difference in distance is very important, with the earth the difference in distance is very very small, do the math. When it comes to our aquariums the distance from the bulb effects the amount of usuable light lot, in the wild the distance from the sun is basicly the same so the distance does not matter. With the sun other items that will attenuate the light effect the light output more than just the distance, with our aquariums the distance from the bulbs is very very important, sometimes more so than other attenuating items. Kim |
Lighting choices ?
Whatt is watts per inch. How did you make up something like that.
If you talk about a point light source, and you can remember any physics, the light decreases with the square of the distance. Ie 4 inchs from the light source is 1/4 of the light at 2 inchs. So if you have a tank that is 24 inches deep ( ie the all glass 60 gallon hex) and compair that to a 65 gallon rec tank from all glass at 18 inches deep. The light in the bottom of the aquarium directly under the bulbs is aprox 60 percent less light than the rec. tank. This is with the bulb mounted at the top of the tank. 60 percent is a big difference. The depth of the tank is very very important when talking about lighting and watts per gallon does not concider it at all. Take this example To get the same light intensity at the bottom of the tank does what wattage of lights do you need for a 20 long verses a 20 high? According to you it is the same, since if you put 100 watts over both tanks you get 5 watts per gallon, But on the 20 long the light intensity at the bottom of the tank will be much much higher than the 20 high. If you don't believe me on this setup both tanks and look at them for yourself. A 4 foot 120 needs brighter lights than a 6 foot 125 for the same light intensity at the bottom of the tank, even though they are basicly the same number of gallons. Or even better how about a 110 XH vers a 4 foot 120 or a 6 foot long 125 gallon tank. If you put a single 400 watt halide over each tank, which tank will be the brightest at the bottom. Accorrding to your numbers they will be pretty close to the same, while in actuality the large tank the 125 will be the brightest at the bottom. All-Glass, Perfecto, and Oceanic Brand 65 gallon aquariums are 36 inches long rather than 48, And none of those manufactures make a 65 gall on hex. If a 65 gallon tank was 48 inches long, then the with would be 12.5 inches. I'll use your 48 inches in the following example, and use a 60 gallon hex. A 60 gallon hex has a length of 27 inches. If you put 250 watts over 27 inches, you would have 9.26 watts of light per inch. If you put 250 watts over 48 inches, you would have 5.21 watts of light per inch. A 60 gallon hex has a depth of 29 inches A 65 gallon tank has a depth of 25 inches Not much difference in the depth, but a lot of differences in watts of light per inch of length. If I were lighting a 60 gallon hex tank, I would light it with a single 400 watt MH bulb. This would be the same as lighting a 120 gallon tank with two 400 watt MH bulbs. Wayne Sallee Wayne's Pets kim gross wrote on 8/12/2006 7:36 PM: Wayne Sallee wrote: kim gross wrote on 8/11/2006 7:41 PM: To be honest any time I see somebody use the watts per gallon measure ment I cringe. 250 watts over a 65 gallon hex tank is a lot less usuable light than 250 watts over a normal 65 gallon 4 foot tank since everything is closer to the lights on the 4 foot 65 gallon tank than the 65 gallon hex. Kim Gross www.jensalt.com Everything is closer???? You need to rethink that one. In the winter here in the US, we are closer to the sun than in the summer, but does that make crops grow faster? Wayne Sallee Wayne's Pets Wayne, Yes is a 16 inch tall tank the average distance from the light bulb is much closer than than a 20 inch tall tank. The difference in distance is very important, with the earth the difference in distance is very very small, do the math. When it comes to our aquariums the distance from the bulb effects the amount of usuable light lot, in the wild the distance from the sun is basicly the same so the distance does not matter. With the sun other items that will attenuate the light effect the light output more than just the distance, with our aquariums the distance from the bulbs is very very important, sometimes more so than other attenuating items. Kim |
Lighting choices ?
kim gross wrote on 8/13/2006 1:35 AM:
Whatt is watts per inch. How did you make up something like that. If you talk about a point light source, LOL you mean you were saying that you would rather put a 250 w single point light over a 48" 65 gallon tank rather than over a 65 gallon Hex tank??? LOL your insane ! Wayne Sallee Wayne's Pets |
Lighting choices ?
kim gross wrote on 8/12/2006 12:48 AM: George Patterson wrote: kim gross wrote: To be honest any time I see somebody use the watts per gallon measure ment I cringe. 250 watts over a 65 gallon hex tank is a lot less usuable light than 250 watts over a normal 65 gallon 4 foot tank since everything is closer to the lights on the 4 foot 65 gallon tank than the 65 gallon hex. Good info. Is there a place I can find more info on what to use? I can, of course, provide measurements for my tank. George Patterson Coffee is only a way of stealing time that should by rights belong to your slightly older self. Actually there is not a good place to find more info. Watts per gallon is not perfect, but when using the right bulbs it is the best thing going. I find it funny that Kim stated that it was a terrible way to go, but yet when George asked for a better way, Kim could not give one, but said "Actually there is not a good place to find more info" Wayne Sallee Wayne's Pets |
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