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Oscar with dropsy
Hi all. My oscar has had dropsy for a month now. It looks bloated like a
fancy goldfish. I have treated it with anti-bacterial medication and it is still eating and looking ok. How will it fare in the end? TIA. -- cheers |
Oscar with dropsy
"perrin" wrote in message
... Hi all. My oscar has had dropsy for a month now. It looks bloated like a fancy goldfish. I have treated it with anti-bacterial medication and it is still eating and looking ok. How will it fare in the end? TIA. -- cheers If he is still eating, then anti-bacterial food would be the most effective. The odds are against him though. -- www.NetMax.tk |
Oscar with dropsy
|| Hi all. My oscar has had dropsy for a month now. It looks bloated
|| like a fancy goldfish. I have treated it with anti-bacterial || medication and it is still eating and looking ok. How will it fare || in the end? || || TIA. || || -- || cheers 1, Dropsy is a result of poor water conditions, mostly overfed, under maintained, and even incorrect housing of said fish, ie, big fish, small tank. 2, Dropsy is usually, fatal, irreversable, and usually, near impossible to repair. 3, If caught early, medicated food, is said to be the only fix, as it's an internal problem, not an external problem. Anti-bac, fungal, etc, won't help at all, because the problem exists inside the fish, and the only way to get medications to the fish is if the fish eats the medicine, which you can now see, is why it's so hard to fix dropsy. you can't just feed them a pill, the medicated food is best, and they usually don't like to eat if they are sick.. 4, they usually don't make it.. -- RedForeman ©® future fabricator and creator of a ratbike streetfighter!!! ========================== 2003 TRX450ES 1992 TRX-350 XX (For Sale) '98 Tacoma Ext Cab 4X4 Lifted.... ========================== ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸¸,ø¤° `°¤ø,¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø is that better?? |
Oscar with dropsy
"RedForeman ©®" wrote in message ...
1, Dropsy is a result of poor water conditions, mostly overfed, under maintained, and even incorrect housing of said fish, ie, big fish, small tank. 2, Dropsy is usually, fatal, irreversable, and usually, near impossible to repair. 3, If caught early, medicated food, is said to be the only fix, as it's an internal problem, not an external problem. Anti-bac, fungal, etc, won't help at all, because the problem exists inside the fish, and the only way to get medications to the fish is if the fish eats the medicine, which you can now see, is why it's so hard to fix dropsy. you can't just feed them a pill, the medicated food is best, and they usually don't like to eat if they are sick.. 4, they usually don't make it.. RedForeman and Netmax are both correct, but I'm going to take it a step further: The term "dropsy" as used in aquaria can refer to any number of internal ailments that cause swelling of internal organs, and it's not a reference to a specific disease and therefore has no specific cure -- except, of course, prevention. The bad news is that I have never seen an aquarium fish that has gotten this ill survive long. Once a disease has manifested this far, causing the extreme swelling of internal organs, there's nothing that can be done. Since the Oscar in question is still acting normally and eating, I'm glad that he's feeling no apparent discomfort. But I don't give him long. --Mark |
Oscar with dropsy
"Mark Stone" wrote in message
om... "RedForeman ©®" wrote in message ... 1, Dropsy is a result of poor water conditions, mostly overfed, under maintained, and even incorrect housing of said fish, ie, big fish, small tank. 2, Dropsy is usually, fatal, irreversable, and usually, near impossible to repair. 3, If caught early, medicated food, is said to be the only fix, as it's an internal problem, not an external problem. Anti-bac, fungal, etc, won't help at all, because the problem exists inside the fish, and the only way to get medications to the fish is if the fish eats the medicine, which you can now see, is why it's so hard to fix dropsy. you can't just feed them a pill, the medicated food is best, and they usually don't like to eat if they are sick.. 4, they usually don't make it.. RedForeman and Netmax are both correct, but I'm going to take it a step further: The term "dropsy" as used in aquaria can refer to any number of internal ailments that cause swelling of internal organs, and it's not a reference to a specific disease and therefore has no specific cure -- except, of course, prevention. The bad news is that I have never seen an aquarium fish that has gotten this ill survive long. Once a disease has manifested this far, causing the extreme swelling of internal organs, there's nothing that can be done. Since the Oscar in question is still acting normally and eating, I'm glad that he's feeling no apparent discomfort. But I don't give him long. --Mark Not to quibble with my esteemed and learned colleagues ;~), but Dropsy symptoms are also documented to occur under ideal conditions. There is some randomness to dropsy, which is as Mark points out, a general umbrella term. For example, there is a type of fish tuberculosis which falls under Dropsy. A large amount of the disease organism can be present long before any symptoms appear, so a healthy fish can be a time bomb for years (and unlike human tuberculosis, fish tuberculosis does not respond to antibiotics). My own experience supports the randomness of Dropsy, mortality occurring to one out of several hundred under identical conditions, though Cyprinidae (esp. danios & goldfish) and Anabantidae (esp. Bettas & Gouramis) seem more likely to get it, and when cichlids get it, they tend to be older. Probably more info than most ppl wanted to know though ;~). -- www.NetMax.tk (who really hates fish diseases) |
Oscar with dropsy
|| Not to quibble with my esteemed and learned colleagues ;~), but
|| Dropsy symptoms are also documented to occur under ideal conditions. || There is some randomness to dropsy, which is as Mark points out, a || general umbrella term. For example, there is a type of fish || tuberculosis which falls under Dropsy. A large amount of the || disease organism can be present long before any symptoms appear, so || a healthy fish can be a time bomb for years (and unlike human || tuberculosis, fish tuberculosis does not respond to antibiotics). || || My own experience supports the randomness of Dropsy, mortality || occurring to one out of several hundred under identical conditions, || though Cyprinidae (esp. danios & goldfish) and Anabantidae (esp. || Bettas & Gouramis) seem more likely to get it, and when cichlids get || it, they tend to be older. Probably more info than most ppl wanted || to know though ;~). -- || www.NetMax.tk (who really hates fish diseases) I'm always glad you 'add your $.02 worth', because I always seem to convert it to about a buck or two!!! I'm also glad you said that, because the times I've had it, was from a breeder, swore his fish were healthy, but yet, 2 batches, 2 seperate batches, different parents, etc, all came down with it... tank had been up and running for quite some time... and even had eggs a couple of times, but stress seemed to be their demise... -- RedForeman ©® future fabricator and creator of a ratbike streetfighter!!! ========================== 2003 TRX450ES 1992 TRX-350 XX (For Sale) '98 Tacoma Ext Cab 4X4 Lifted.... ========================== ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸¸,ø¤° `°¤ø,¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø is that better?? |
Oscar with dropsy
How long will it take before they go? Are they suffering - oscar looks
normal behaviour-wise to me. PS to NetMax: it's a juvenile, about 4 inches. -- cheers "RedForeman ©®" wrote in message ... : || Not to quibble with my esteemed and learned colleagues ;~), but : || Dropsy symptoms are also documented to occur under ideal conditions. : || There is some randomness to dropsy, which is as Mark points out, a : || general umbrella term. For example, there is a type of fish : || tuberculosis which falls under Dropsy. A large amount of the : || disease organism can be present long before any symptoms appear, so : || a healthy fish can be a time bomb for years (and unlike human : || tuberculosis, fish tuberculosis does not respond to antibiotics). : || : || My own experience supports the randomness of Dropsy, mortality : || occurring to one out of several hundred under identical conditions, : || though Cyprinidae (esp. danios & goldfish) and Anabantidae (esp. : || Bettas & Gouramis) seem more likely to get it, and when cichlids get : || it, they tend to be older. Probably more info than most ppl wanted : || to know though ;~). -- : || www.NetMax.tk (who really hates fish diseases) : : I'm always glad you 'add your $.02 worth', because I always seem to convert : it to about a buck or two!!! : : I'm also glad you said that, because the times I've had it, was from a : breeder, swore his fish were healthy, but yet, 2 batches, 2 seperate : batches, different parents, etc, all came down with it... tank had been up : and running for quite some time... and even had eggs a couple of times, but : stress seemed to be their demise... : : -- : RedForeman ©® future fabricator and creator of a ratbike : streetfighter!!! ========================== : 2003 TRX450ES : 1992 TRX-350 XX (For Sale) : '98 Tacoma Ext Cab 4X4 Lifted.... : ========================== : ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸¸,ø¤° `°¤ø,¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø : : : is that better?? : : |
Oscar with dropsy
I suppose 4" is a teenager ;~), but it's much younger than I've seen
Oscars get it. Mark probably has more experience on this, and on how long they take to die. It depends on so many factors. If the internal organs are ok, and they continue eating, then it might go on for a long time (weeks, months). Without eating, they would probably starve in the 6 to 8 week range. When an organ completely fails then it is quick. Generally I find that the smaller the fish, the quicker it dies from dropsy (or most any diseases). If it were me, as soon as I determine there is no chance for recovery, I put them in a fishbag with a bit of clove oil in the water (ratio of 2ml per gallon). IIRC Mark also has an article on euthanasia on his site which covered more options. The clove oil is what has worked best for me so far. It's difficult to define 'suffering' as their nervous system and emotional capacity are not comparable. While they continue to eat & behave normally, you can assume that the disease is not incapacitating them, but beyond that....? -- www.NetMax.tk "perrin" wrote in message ... How long will it take before they go? Are they suffering - oscar looks normal behaviour-wise to me. PS to NetMax: it's a juvenile, about 4 inches. snip |
Oscar with dropsy
|| How long will it take before they go? Are they suffering - oscar || looks normal behaviour-wise to me. If it's still eating, get some medicated Tetra flakes, and maybe you caught it in time, or you've got something that resembles Dropsy... Sorry couldn't help more.. -- RedForeman ©® future fabricator and creator of a ratbike streetfighter!!! ========================== 2003 TRX450ES 1992 TRX-350 XX (For Sale) '98 Tacoma Ext Cab 4X4 Lifted.... ========================== ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸¸,ø¤° `°¤ø,¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø is that better?? |
Oscar with dropsy
"NetMax" wrote in message ...
I suppose 4" is a teenager ;~), but it's much younger than I've seen Oscars get it. Mark probably has more experience on this, and on how long they take to die. It depends on so many factors. If the internal organs are ok, and they continue eating, then it might go on for a long time (weeks, months). Without eating, they would probably starve in the 6 to 8 week range. When an organ completely fails then it is quick. Generally I find that the smaller the fish, the quicker it dies from dropsy (or most any diseases). If it were me, as soon as I determine there is no chance for recovery, I put them in a fishbag with a bit of clove oil in the water (ratio of 2ml per gallon). IIRC Mark also has an article on euthanasia on his site which covered more options. The clove oil is what has worked best for me so far. It's difficult to define 'suffering' as their nervous system and emotional capacity are not comparable. While they continue to eat & behave normally, you can assume that the disease is not incapacitating them, but beyond that....? -- www.NetMax.tk Because Dropsy (the swelling of internal organs) can be caused by anything, it's impossible to say how long this poor fish will last. One thing, though, is that "suffering" is easier to "diagnose" in an Oscar because they respond in very predictable ways to stress. If an Oscar is eating and swimming around in the tank, then it's pretty certain that he's comfortable; at the slightest sign of pain or stress (or fear), he's lost his color, stopped eating, and glued himself to the gravel at the bottom of the tank. Such is Oscar nature. But I'd like to ask a question. I think it's unusual that an Oscar has developed Dropsy and yet continues to eat and act normally. I wonder if he's been mis-diagnosed and perhaps the swelling is being caused by something else? Anybody have any thoughts on this possibility? --Mark |
Oscar with dropsy
|| Because Dropsy (the swelling of internal organs) can be caused by || anything, it's impossible to say how long this poor fish will last. || One thing, though, is that "suffering" is easier to "diagnose" in an || Oscar because they respond in very predictable ways to stress. If an || Oscar is eating and swimming around in the tank, then it's pretty || certain that he's comfortable; at the slightest sign of pain or || stress (or fear), he's lost his color, stopped eating, and glued || himself to || the gravel at the bottom of the tank. Such is Oscar nature. || || But I'd like to ask a question. I think it's unusual that an Oscar || has || developed Dropsy and yet continues to eat and act normally. I wonder || if he's been mis-diagnosed and perhaps the swelling is being caused || by || something else? Anybody have any thoughts on this possibility? --Mark I agree, that's weird... Every dropsy case I've had, (4 times, all with German Rams), they've done the same routine, 'look' funny, stop eating, lose colors, swell up, never eat, 5-7 days later, belly up... What could be as closely 'looking' to dropsy, but not be it? Columnaris? I suck at diseases, but I excel at screwing up german rams.... -- RedForeman ©® future fabricator and creator of a ratbike streetfighter!!! ========================== 2003 TRX450ES 1992 TRX-350 XX (For Sale) '98 Tacoma Ext Cab 4X4 Lifted.... ========================== ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸¸,ø¤° `°¤ø,¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø is that better?? |
Oscar with dropsy
"Mark Stone" wrote in message
om... "NetMax" wrote in message ... I suppose 4" is a teenager ;~), but it's much younger than I've seen Oscars get it. Mark probably has more experience on this, and on how long they take to die. It depends on so many factors. If the internal organs are ok, and they continue eating, then it might go on for a long time (weeks, months). Without eating, they would probably starve in the 6 to 8 week range. When an organ completely fails then it is quick. Generally I find that the smaller the fish, the quicker it dies from dropsy (or most any diseases). If it were me, as soon as I determine there is no chance for recovery, I put them in a fishbag with a bit of clove oil in the water (ratio of 2ml per gallon). IIRC Mark also has an article on euthanasia on his site which covered more options. The clove oil is what has worked best for me so far. It's difficult to define 'suffering' as their nervous system and emotional capacity are not comparable. While they continue to eat & behave normally, you can assume that the disease is not incapacitating them, but beyond that....? -- www.NetMax.tk Because Dropsy (the swelling of internal organs) can be caused by anything, it's impossible to say how long this poor fish will last. One thing, though, is that "suffering" is easier to "diagnose" in an Oscar because they respond in very predictable ways to stress. If an Oscar is eating and swimming around in the tank, then it's pretty certain that he's comfortable; at the slightest sign of pain or stress (or fear), he's lost his color, stopped eating, and glued himself to the gravel at the bottom of the tank. Such is Oscar nature. But I'd like to ask a question. I think it's unusual that an Oscar has developed Dropsy and yet continues to eat and act normally. I wonder if he's been mis-diagnosed and perhaps the swelling is being caused by something else? Anybody have any thoughts on this possibility? --Mark Interesting point, the OP perrin said it "looks bloated like a fancy goldfish". I wonder how it is doing now. Oscars bloat from eating too many feeders in one go, constipation, or consuming a lot of dry pellets which expand when wet. I can see the Oscar being unaffected in some cases of dropsy though. As long as the motor functions are not affected, it might be oblivious to it. The expansion in the skin tissue might be an example, but it would catch on eventually (I think). -- www.NetMax.tk |
Oscar with dropsy
"RedForeman ©®" wrote in message ...
I agree, that's weird... Every dropsy case I've had, (4 times, all with German Rams), they've done the same routine, 'look' funny, stop eating, lose colors, swell up, never eat, 5-7 days later, belly up... What could be as closely 'looking' to dropsy, but not be it? Columnaris? I suck at diseases, but I excel at screwing up german rams.... You know, with Oscars (and Pacu) a misdiagnosed case of Dropsy may just be a growth spurt . . . :-) --Mark |
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