NetMax wrote:
"Liz" wrote in message
oups.com...

NetMax,

I like your thinking. Here are some random thoughts:


Now there's a scary thought, someone who likes my thinking ;~).


You mention the Eclipse tanks that have everything in the hood (in and
under is more accurate as the filter is just under the hood, not
actually a part of it). I have a 6g of these and I have to say, the
fact that the hood as a unit doesn't have a hinge at the back so that I
can open it up and get at the water (there's a trap door for the filter
which also works well for feeding) is a royal pain! If I want to do a
water change or need to trim a plant or something, I have to get my
husband to come and hold the hood. (There's a power cord coming out of
it, and a clever little cable router, which keeps me from taking the
hood entirely off and putting it elsewhere. Likely I'll pull the hood
power wire out of the cable organizer eventually so I can do things
without my husband holding the hood for me!)


This Italian tank I mentioned had a plastic hinge along the back and the
entire canopy lifted backwards and was held in place with a rod (just
like the hood of a car, when they stopped using springs). I don't know
if I could do the same thing, as there are portions which could not be
angled, but I'm very conscious of obstructions to working on my tank. I
like to build large full length structures for my tanks and even a
crossbrace is a nuisance. I'm currently building a removable stainless
steel crossbrace for my 120g.


In other words, I think things should be designed such that one person
can do things without needing four hands! And I think it's important
to be able to get the lid off - whether it's for adding/removing a
fish, moving decorations around, or whatever.


Agreed. I'm independant the same way. Something wrong if it takes more
than 2 hands to do it.


I also agree with what's been said about price - you're gonna be
hitting the high-end market - at least initially. A lot of goodies get
left at the store by those who can afford the necessaries, but not the
conveniences. Unless the hood (or system, I don't know that it all has
to be in/under the hood) is modular (as was already suggested) so that
folks could get the part(s) they wanted and not pay for what they don't
want / can't afford, the price is gonna be pretty high.


I don't have a profit motive right now. If I could cover my costs, I
would be very happy. Of course if the income from other projects dries
up, that will change everything, but I don't see this as generating much
profit, so if I get poor, I'll be doing something else in my retirement
years anyways.


I recently answered a survey and made comments to a group of college
students who, for an engineering project, were trying to automate
absolutely everything that could be automated around a tank. (I don't
think they're gonna go for my idea of having the system automatically
monitor (accurately, not those visual color indicators) ammonia,
nitrite and nitrate - cuz I think the system would have to include a
GC/LC/MS (or something) for that. g)

Here's a link to the thread:
http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums...ad.php?t=60324

(I'm ParadoxLiz over there.)


I'm NetMax there, at least if I stop lurking ;~). Actually I have to
limit where I post or I will really need a life (probably too late
anyways). It's actually a quite regular occurance, that an engineering
class gets assigned a project like automating some aspect of aquaria
(convenient fixed environment to play with), but the designs are all
rooted in engineering capabilities instead of animal husbandry.

For example, they would find a way to detect NH levels rather than build
a system which would make NH detection superfulous, such as a a thin
layer of water above the lights acting as an algae scrubber. It would be
very difficult to ever have NH in a system which had an order of
magnitude more NH processing power than your bioload could generate.
Root cause analysis would result in a solution to prevent the problem
while the engineers were interfacing the NH detection circuitry to a
sending unit to do something ;~).


I like the concept - automate all the work - let machines do it and
when they run into a problem they can't fix, let them call you. But
there are a lot of people who like to get under the hood (home auto
mechanics analogy seems appropriate, or people who build their own
computers from scratch rather than buying it already put together) and
do everything themselves - modular might get them to buy some stuff
anyway. I also wonder if a system like this wouldn't actually turn the
users off toward fishies over time - kinda like having someone else
feed, water, walk, pick up after the dog - what's left after that?
You've got no time and emotion invested in your little fishies, so why
would you care about them - you may as well go down to the Chinese
place and watch their fishies for a while... g


While I would not argue this point, it's the magnitude which is affected,
and the way your efforts get re-directed. I watch my 66g as much as
always, but lights, feeders and much of the maintenance is automated. I
find that my energy gets redirected, admitedly sometimes to non-aquaria,
but also to wanting to learn more about some aspect, or making further
improvements. If I compare this to my other hobby (motorcycles), there
was a feeling that the true nature of the sport was being ruined by
fairings, stereo systems, heated seats and handlegrips, tent trailers,
floorboards, cruise control, volume control, self-adjusting shock
absorbers and electric starters (no more kickstarter). The sport is
still alive, albeit somewhat changed, and consumers have the option as to
what level of convenience and comfort they want to dial in when they make
their purchase.

When I worked in the trade, I'd approach prospective customers who would
be gawking at the tanks, and ask if they needed help. Frequently I was
told, that they would love to have a tank, "but they are too much work".
Aquariums will never be effortless (no matter what we automate), but I
think we have a good way to go before a better balance is achieved.


Anywho, I think there's a market, I'm not sure how big it is, I'd like
something that does all the tedious stuff for me (but that would have
to include testing the water, which I find the biggest pain (last night
I was on Fisher Scientific's web site pricing multi-channel pipetters
and looking for one that would measure milliliters instead of
microliters... g)). I also think there are some concerns, issues,
whatever you call thems that should be carefully considered.


The requirement to test a water parameter is directly related to that
water parameter changing or being expected to change. It's quite
possible to effortlessly manage a home aquarium for many years without
having to do any water tests. Do you have a situation where the water
parameters must be monitored?


FWIW,

Liz


Thanks for the feedback!
I agree I am an expert at nothing but have intrest in many things that
is why my projects are always hobby based and get more responce than
sone college undergrad whow should now what gets no responce but people
whow have degrease respond to me althugh I don't always know what they
are talking about